How to respond to a Narcissist.

Have you ever noticed that on Reddit (and other online forums), everyone KNOWS a narcissist, but one IS a narcissist?

The math ain't mathin'.

Thank you, ChatGPT.

The statistics for what percentage of the population are narcissists aren't accurate and are too low. Narcissists do not seek help such as counseling. They do not see themselves as the problem or wrong therefore they do not need help. If a spouse or partner manages to get them into couples counseling they just learn more ways to manipulate and often times even fool the therapist while making the partner look crazy. Just like they fool law enforcement, judges, lawyers, doctors, etc.

I was one. It came from my parents, who were the same. I had a sort of breakdown while working at Microsoft in the 1980s. There was an intervention. I went into intense therapy. Am I cured? No, not really. It still comes out every so often. But I'm better, I recognize the triggers and when it is switching on and have things to deal with it. It is work every day.

Good for you r4, seriously. That's heavy lifting.

[quote] "I'm ending this conversation now."

That's how Alexis Morrell Carrington Colby Dexter Morrell handled her problematic conversations.

"Dominique, I'm afraid this conversation has come to an end!" ***slams down phone***

R4 what kind of therapy? Were you diagnosed with NPD?

My dad is an undiagnosed narcissist, as was his mom. Now that I've overcome much of my childhood issues (I wasn't narcissistic, I went the other direction as a trauma response), I'm finally able to see my dad without so much fear and anger and the beginnings of compassion for whatever terrible childhood he himself had gone through. He doesn't trigger me as much as he used to, but he's still very narcissistic

[quote] I was one.

You still are. And always will be.

NPD cannot be cured. It’s permanent brain damage.

Could someone give me an example of a narcissist in real life? I can’t think of any.

[quote] Could someone give me an example of a narcissist in real life? I can’t think of any.

Me neither.

[quote] Could someone give me an example of a narcissist in real life? I can’t think of any.

An absolute mystery.

[quote] Could someone give me an example of a narcissist in real life? I can’t think of any.

Who’s that girl?

OP, do you seek out drama?

[quote] Could someone give me an example of a narcissist in real life? I can’t think of any.

R9 Don't be fooled by the rocks that I got, I'm a big narcissist.

Sharon Stone is NOT a narcissist!

Haz, my love, can you think of any narcissists you've ever known?

OP is correct. Don't give them an inch, they'll take a mile. Don't explain. If they ask you to, say, no thanks. I don't need to do that.

They often end up with borderlines.

The MDS troll at r16 has been busy today. I guess his next stop is the “what’s for dinner?” thread.

There's a song about it!

The person on the left in this montage is trying to determine how to respond to a narcissist. And sadly failing.

Narcissists don't seek therapy because there's nothing wrong with them -- just ask them! The rest of the world is out of whack, but they (& they alone!) are just fine -- in fact, perfect!

R18. True! The way I figured out my dad was a narcissist was that I kept on dating BPDs unknowingly, which led me to figure out my mom had been BPD growing up, which led me to finally figure out that my dad was a narcissist through the BPD/NPD marriage bond, and finally that that narcissistic abuse was the thing I had been struggling with my whole life. I had had no idea

Give them a mirror?

Be completely uninterested in them. That'll drive the around the bend. No engagement. Gray rocking.

Yellow rocking causes fewer problems and feels more human imho

"Noted," OP

I think the problem with grey rocking is it triggers their shame which is at the root of their problem

It's too extreme

^If the grey rocking is just you being boring it can be effective. If you are just droning on in a boring voice about shopping for a new dishwasher here and there and the prices and features of the different models or not being able to decide what type of flowers to plant in your front yard thus not feeding their ego it can drive them away.

[quote] It's too extreme

🤣😆😂

Spoken like a true narcissist. They litter boards like this trying to garner sympathy and positive PR.

Grey rocking could not be more tame. It’s basically all but ignoring someone other than responding monosyllabically and unemotionally to questions. But they hate not having control so they despise it.

Meanwhile, they destroy people’s lives but ignoring them is “too extreme.”

Fuck off.

.....

R31 now that’s a huge narcissist. Bigger than Lady Gaga? No, but close.

R30... you think I'm a narcissist? lol

Want to continue that accusation?

Let's go, fuckhead. I spent 15 years in treatment for narcissistic abuse and complex trauma

Looks like too many here use the term without fully or even halfway understanding the exact definition of narcissism. Just be careful when you start diagnosing people. It's hurtful and when done without expertise it can be damaging. From what I read there are various personality disorders that look similar but aren't. Those other disorders may require different responses.

R30 hey what happened to you, shithead?

Remember how you tried to shame me for being a narcissist even though I had severe narcissistic abuse until I was 18 and had several bouts of depression and tried to commit suicide?

* lol ... YOU tried to shame me - A NARCISSIST ABUSE VICTIM, as a narcissist.

... I should proofread even when angry

Is anyone familiar with the category of

Community/Communal Narcissist?

The main forms of narcissism include:

grandiose (overt), characterized by arrogance and a need for admiration;

covert (vulnerable), marked by an inflated sense of self-importance masked by insecurity and victimhood;

communal, where the individual seeks validation through feigned selflessness and charitable acts.

.... other types include:

malignant (combining grandiose traits with sadism and antisocial behaviors),

antagonistic (aggressive, envious, and competitive),

and spiritual (claiming superiority through enlightenment).

[quote] Want to continue that accusation?

Yes. You’re a narcissist. It’s more obvious with each laughable Cluster B post.

Your belief that grey rocking is “ too extreme,” your “victimization” as a youth - narcs are always the victim - and your hilarious, unhinged, near-violent responses at the accusation leave zero doubt that you’re a first class fucking dangerous as fuck narc.

You have NPD and are a menace to society.

Stay away from actual human beings.

Never change, DL.

R39 you're literal human garbage. A true psycho.

Anyone can check my history here. You know that, right? Going back years?

The things I've said about my abuse and what treatments I've done to address it?

The therapists and therapies I've recommended to others?

R39 if anyone in this threat is Cluster-B or Dark Triad it's you.

Girls! Girls!

You're BOTH personality disordered.

My husband’s brother is a narcissist. He’s impossible to deal with and is now harassing my 75 year old father in law for money constantly. He gives him options like, “you can send me $50,000 for this hare-brained scheme or if you are too poor or unwilling to even do that, you can co-sign a $200k loan. Let me know by tomorrow.”

R43 but I'm not. Hot it? I was a child of extreme narcissistic abuse.

I went through 15 years of therapy for narcissistic abuse.

Then I was accused of being a narcissist.

Why is this hard for you?

Read through the thread again.

(*got it)

Fuck it. I suffered narcissistic abuse until I was 18 with a malignant narcissist dad. Extreme, extreme abuse.

I did over a decade of narcissistic abuse therapy- trauma talk therapy, parts therapy, somatic body therapy (multiple kinds) Neurofeedback, acupuncture, and so much more, and some fuckhead says no you're the narcissist when I say - based on years of experience - that yellow rock is better than the gray rock approach in dealing with narcissists because it triggers their unconscious repressed shame response ?

R43 no I'm not personally disordered.

Enjoy your likes

R41 = Gaslighting 101.

R49 how so, fuckhead.

R49 go through my posting history.

Yellow rocking is not better. You can’t just trust some mom blogger who claims family court judges read gray rocking communication as rigid and angry. It’s insane and another way to spend too much time and thought on the narc.

The gray rock method is about being as interesting to the narc as a gray rock. Don’t show emotion, engage in arguments, share good news (or any personal details at all), explain yourself, etc.

R49 hello

R52 you don't understand stand the difference

Yes, I do. I read the linked article. No contact is the best solution for most people. The only people who HAVE to maintain contact with a NPD are co-parents. A horrible situation. Everyone else is better having no contact, that includes family members. Continued contact increases the harm.

[quote] No contact is the best solution for most people. The only people who HAVE to maintain contact with a NPD are co-parents.

Correct. No contact is the only response unless there are young children involved.

Otherwise, there is no need to have any communication with these soulless sacks of evil. None.

r33 You have anger issues

[quote]Looks like too many here use the term without fully or even halfway understanding the exact definition of narcissism. Just be careful when you start diagnosing people. It's hurtful and when done without expertise it can be damaging.

If someone finds it "damaging" to be called a narcissist, then that person seriously needs to grow a thicker skin.

R57 how do you know?

Honestly.

How do you know anything about me at all?

Other than what I have told this thread about my childhood narcissism abuse.

r30 likes to WW herself

I worked for a narcissist. Responding in a flat tone, setting boundaries, in fact any rational response, was the best way to get her spinning like an enraged top. If you could provide rational answers to her rhetorical questions (e.g. "It's not finished yet? What have you been doing?") she practically imploded.

Paying them no attention at all is even more fun.

[quote] [R30] likes to WW herself

So, in addition to your countless deranged, poorly worded posts screaming about your victimhood, you’re now questioning the validity of other posters’ W&W that have more than you in posts critiquing you and your questionable mental state.

Because, what, that means they “win?”

No, you’re not Cluster B disordered at all. 🙄

r62 Please check my history - you've confused me with the looney that you're warring with.

This thread could seriously be a case study in severe mental illness.

[QUOTE]I think the problem with grey rocking is it triggers their shame which is at the root of their problem

I think one of the issues for people who have suffered long term abuse at the hand of a narcissistic parent is that they still try to humanize their abuser, even after a lot of therapy. It's tough pill to swallow that your flesh and blood, the person who gave you 50% of your genetic endowment, is a person whose only interest in you is how you reflect on them. That's the nice way of saying a POS. It's worth remembering that true narcs are mostly incapable of feeling empathy or love, like most of us can.

I just skimmed the yellow rocking article. A co-parenting dynamic is so vastly different than others because a 3rd, 4th, Nth party can get manipulated and hurt as retaliation against the sane parent. It's a situation that warrants a lot more caution.

In other cases, I say let it rip. So what if their shame is triggered? Good I say. They're more likely to avoid you. Their shame is not your problem.

"You're not all that."

are they narcissistic?

or just a controlling asshole

A lot of that at OP is how I talk to unreasonable bosses. “Yes. Yes. Okay. I will.” Then just keep doing it my way.

Gray rock is a survival strategy where you avoid the predator if at all possible and try not to attract any attention to yourself if you must.

Yes R65, and another problem with grey rock method is that the abused party must deny their emotions and perform, which further disconnects them from their own feelings and desires. Coparenting with a narcissist is much different because the narcissist has so much leverage. Your children are hostages, there are tons of people to disparage you to, and no way to hide and stay off their radar.

Were narcissists so common in the 1800s or is this a modern phenomenon? 🤔

I'm curious why you're skeptical, r71. Why? I'd like for you to explain youself, please, if you can.

I suspect they were much worse back then, r71, because they were more easily encouraged by nonsensical biblical edicts like "Spare the rod and spoil the child." which fed their delusional hatred of their own children which gave them further license for unquestioned, unabated destruction of them if they didn't obey or comply with their weird/nebulous needs.

Their kid was a fuck up cuz the Bible told them so. And there was no getting around the Bible back then. So the meanest, most destructive parents were always believed to be good and biblical to destroy their children's wanton impulses. Whatever the narc, criminal parent thought "impulses" were back then. Maybe they starved the kid and it stole some food, so they felt righteous to beat Jesus Christ into the poor, hungry little beasts. Religious Zealots are often narcs, right?

And it doesn't stop. I've seen all types of religiously directed abuse by fringe crazy narc parents during my years in the metal health field.

Why was the shuttle in “Alien” called the Narcissus? Was it a narcissist?

Ok Op.

When relational aggression is used just say “it’s ok if you dislike me, I still like you” because they enjoy playing yo yo with people. That stops the nonsense, especially if you stop talking to them after that. A guy I’m friends with is in the army. He deals with them by banning the discussion of feelings. Only behavior is addressed, because narcs in the workplace often start with talking about their bully target’s feelings trying to say the person is crazy. The supervisor responding with only behavior, not feelings being permitted to be discussed is effective.

^^my army officer friend is a physical therapist and he is very emotionally intelligent. He made a video about behavior vs feelings in managing employees. He’s an insightful person

OP - I have probably met persons who were Narcissists without my knowing it. I am not a psychiatrist and in no position to diagnose someone. However your list is an excellent one for dealing with abusive bullies.

Does it really matter--the origin of their bullying behavior. It that's behavior impact on me and stopping it that matters.

Therapy Talk has become too mainstream and how there's a backlash against the armchair psychologist movement happening online. Did you guys know that the word "cope" is now seen as a negative thing and used to make fun of people who struggle with some aspects of life? Gen Z has changed the meaning of coping, and it is now seen as desperation or delusion. Another popular clapback on the internet is telling someone to "seek help," but the phrase is used in a sarcastic way, not a positive suggestion.

There's a certain segment of society that has always looked down on therapy, and people who struggle with mental health are seen as weak. There are so many people who need therapy but can't bring themselves to go because there's still a stigma even in these modern times, especially in Trump's current version of America. The MAGA backlash against liberalism also hurt the idea of seeking out professional help. A generation suffering in silence.

R78 — There’s a difference between coping and copium, wordplay with opium. For example

The Democrats are not coping with MAGA at all, but they are passing the copium at the DNC.

Seek help is a to deny what the speaker said. Whether true or not, you just stare and “You seek help” thereby implying the speaker is deluded.

In case of the latter, respond —You are avoiding the topic and haven’t answered x, y, and z. If he repeats, say “You aren’t qualified to make that statement.” Stay serious and it will rattle him.

[quote] Therapy Talk has become too mainstream and how there's a backlash against the armchair psychologist movement happening online. Did you guys know that the word "cope" is now seen as a negative thing and used to make fun of people who struggle with some aspects of life? Gen Z has changed the meaning of coping, and it is now seen as desperation or delusion. Another popular clapback on the internet is telling someone to "seek help," but the phrase is used in a sarcastic way, not a positive suggestion.

Perhaps get off the Internet and stop confusing it with the real world.

Thank you R79 for explaining the copium thing. I understand it's use better now.

[quote] Perhaps get off the Internet and stop confusing it with the real world.

Well, I'm sorry you feel that way, R80, but I don't confuse the internet with the real world. I'm currently online talking about popular therapy phrases that are used.... online. It's actually on topic. You're the one who seems confused. Seek help.

Don't.

Thank you for the PSA. People call everyon e and their cat toxic and a narcissist now. For me, e.g. Mike Israetel (or however you spell this guy) is a perfect example. Demonstrably bad at what he pretends to be good at, everything is always someone else's fault, tries to be engaging and charming, and 90 percent of what he ever says is either a platitude, a lie or manipulative. Plus: big words, often misused. If someone like that is your boss for example, you can just try to get the hell out of there tbh and if you are dealing with a liar at work, keep receipts about everything. (Confirmation emails sketching what you agreed in etc..) OPs advice is "just" for feeling a little better during the exchange but you are never going to fix a true narcissist so just .. get the hell out.