DL dog people, come forth--I need help/advice!

No, don't you dare put that pup on the porch for the night.

Op, what a beautiful pup! What is the weather like where you live? I think (as a dog person) I would keep him/her in 1) a laundry/bathroom, or b) an empty bedroom. I would worry if he were outside all night, and he'll probably cry and bark.

That said, he may still cry and bark in a separate room from you. I, not being a cat person, would bring him in the bed with me. But I'm a dog person, so there's that.

NO! Puppies are stupid. Put him somewhere safe for the night. Is the porch enclosed? You don't state if it is.

[quote]Pup would be 1000% safe as long as s/he stays inside the yard, inside the fence line.

NO!!!!!!!!!!!!

Oh no, R1 and R3, why not? As I said, I don’t know baby dogs very well at all.

R2, it's in the upper 70s now, will be in the mid-lower 70s overnight and into mid-morning tomorrow. High 81° with heavy rainshowers tomorrow afternoon.

He peed in the living room by the piano when I wasn't watching, then scooted across the room and pooped by the table where I keep the diffuser. Cleaned up both with no difficulty, but if you guys are saying I shouldn't put him on the porch, and I don't know enough about puppies to feel comfortable keeping him inside all night, what do you advise?

Thanks for all the input. I try not to name animals I'm not planning to keep, but s/he's such a Nori I can't help calling it that.

Is he a rescue pup?

Dollface thread.

Keep him. You know you can.

He peed in the living room by the piano when I wasn't watching

Everyone's a critic.

You're responsible for keeping that dog safe by all means necessary until you get him to the shelter in the morning, and that means you're inconvenienced for one night.

ONE.

That won't kill you.

You leave that dog unattended for a night in your yard and that dog will die.

Given its obviously not housebroken put newspaper or old towels down for the mess and lose sleep for a night to make sure it's unharmed.

Fucking use your common sense and take our collective advice here.

No laundry room?

Tell us what, OP. Give the dog your bed and YOU sleep on the porch.

Put him in a bathroom with a towel or two and a couple of newspaper sheets if you have them, OP. He should be absolutely fine for the night.

Find this puppy a home all by yourself in the next few days or may god have mercy on your soul. There are very few no-kill shelters that aren’t full to capacity and getting put to sleep is a gruesome process.

I can’t even continue writing this.

A therapist I had once said “Most people aren’t good enough for dogs”. If you can’t keep this little baby yourself, then find him a home - someone you know isn’t going to sell him for dogfighting- and send us happy pictures when you can.

If you have any not- good news, please don’t share it.

Bless you and your kindness OP. Thank you for taking care of that beautiful pup.

It's destiny, the pup showed up on your doorstep.

You should keep it!

Keep him!!!!! Fuck the livid cat. Cats are assholes.

Dog team.

OP, your story reminds me a bit of a favorite Dodo video where a young pup was put in a bag and thrown from a moving car. The humans meant to throw the dog over the bridge into a ravine, but the bag hit the guard rail and the dog survived. A woman found the dog and lured him back to her car with a piece of lasagna.

There are a lot of horrible, crappy people in the world doing horrible, crappy things. But they can be balanced out to some degree by good people picking up after the mess they make. In your story, OP, you get to be one of those good people.

Ring your lawyer first thing tomorrow and arrange for all your assets to be left to the pup when you die.

You never know when that day will come... and it could be SOON

I have no intention of taking ANY animal to any shelter that would even offload to a kill shelter. I've volunteered with various rescue groups for more than 25 years, and I know the heads of the 2-3 companion animal shelters in my city, so no worries on that end.

BUT

I have five cats (yes, all rescues) in the house, plus my old Dad, my oldest sister (who can be very judg-y about these things and I just don't have energy for a tiff tonight), and my middle sister visiting from out of state.

In any case I'm keeping Nori in tonight, and just put down two of my old Dad's giant bed protector pads for his business. I have a very early dental appointment tomorrow morning and will reassess afterwards. Early this year the 14-year old kid who does odd jobs around the house said he was hoping to adopt a puppy (he has a one year old cat he's had since it was two weeks old), and this pup may be a good fit since it's so chill with my cats. We'll see.

Probably won't be sleeping tonight.

Not great images, but here's how the front of the house is situated (thankfully we've finally purged the yard AND street of the fucking raccoons that plagued us for the last 20 years).

Thanks, guys.

Go around the neighborhood and see if you can get CCTV footage identifying the guys in the pickup truck. Then find out where they live and "necklace" them with a tire and some gasoline. Make sure you smirk while you do it.

[quote]R20 I have a very early dental appointment tomorrow morning and will reassess afterwards.

Cancel the appointment.

Precious Pup needs you more than your teeth need you.

R22, I've already re-scheduled twice--once because my old Dad had a health setback, and the other because my Squidge had a serious emergency vet visit.

It's been seven years since my last dental visit (it's hard as hell to find a dentist who takes my insurance), and dental health is whole-body health, and I'm getting too old to take silly risks with my health.

So no, not canceling again.

Well, okay : ( But you get RIGHT home to the little orphan afterwards! Precious little homeless babe - -

Don't you DARE leave that pupper out on the porch! The cats are always weird when a new pet is introduced, it's a territorial thing, they'll get over it. Give them some catnip and more scratching posts, so they can take their bile out on that.

vicious little cat creatures

Never fear, R25.

Nori, my visiting sister and I are sitting up, watching 1000 lb Sisters. Threw a couple old sheets on the sofa (which took forever bcz Nori kept jumping under the sheet while I was trying to spread it out); now Nori's on one side; 3 of the 5 cats on the opposite side.

Détente... pour une nuit.

Progress.....

I wish I could take him, OP. Alas, I am in Panama as we speak, and even when I go back to FL, I'll be coming back to Panama to stay in the fall.

But he is adorable.

Give him a name! Of course, once you do [italic]that,[/italic] he'll probably be yours for life. Now would that be such a bad thing...? Think about it.

Ooh how's Panama, senior lesbian?

We should probably start a thread dedicated to your move. All of us who wish we could leave our shithole country can live vicariously through you.

I'm getting too old to take silly risks with my health.…

Yet you haven’t been to a dentist in 7 years?

I call bullshit 0/10 on this entire thread. He’s playing y’all for suckers.

OP, PLEASE keep your cats inside.

OP: Do not attempt to bring all your cats and the new dog with you to the upcoming dental appointment. You will likely be distracted once in the chair, and unable to watch over them all.

The dental hygienist will also have trouble doing her job with so many animals in a small space.

Take my advice on this, PLEASE.

How is it going OP? We would love an update.

The poor little thing…

[quote]getting put to sleep is a gruesome process.

Pardon? I certainly don't want to see a puppy be needlessly euthanazed, but I stayed with my last dog when he was given The Needle and it wasn't a bit gruesome. He just went almost immediately unconscious, as if with a general anaesthetic, and died within a minute or so. Unless they do something different in US shelters?

Getting put to sleep should be a calming experience, as there’s two shots… the first being an opiate.

Those drugs are popular for a reason.

Good morning, R34! Thanks for asking...

Nori Black Lab, Squidge and I watched the entire Season 6 of 1000 Lb Sisters; thanks to those crazy Kentucky bitches we made it through the night.

He only used the big catch-all absorbent sheets twice; the other 5 times he went on the floor in random spots. So I had my head on a swivel every time he hopped down onto the floor. Thank God for Swiffers and enzymatic cleaner.

My visiting sister is all about the landscaping, so at daybreak she went out to start on the flowerbeds and shrubs, taking Nori with her.

R31, I dearly hope you never have to go through what I have the last decade, and will leave it at that.

Senior Lesbian, I appreciate your encouraging posts, and as ever, I wish you well.

OP maybe take him to your vet to be scanned for a chip before going to a shelter. The boys who threw him out might have stolen him for a thrill and his owners might be desperately looking for Nori.

Dogs love cat food because it is so rich, but too much can cause pancreatitis.

Dogface thread!!

Some if you judgmental cynics need to get a puppy & pray that it can heal you.

I am now completely invested in Nori and his progress. Hoping that whatever happens internally to me when I "foster" a dog happens here.

If Nori isn’t chipped and you decide to keep him, we found the puppy potty apartment to be helpful in house training.

Dogs are perfect.

Heads up--where's Nori!

That pup looks just like my recently-deceased dog. I never knew him as a puppy, alas, but the markings and coloring are the same.

Unfortunately, puppies, like babies, require their keepers to wake up multiple times per night. Ideally, the puppy should be crated in your bedroom overnight and you have to get up every few hours to take it outside. That's how they learn that outdoors is for doing its business.

This is why I never had a puppy.

Like r42, I am very invested in this story!

I'm already attached.

OP - As a cat and dog person, I have it's pretty remarkable you have kitty and Nori hanging out so closely within a matter of hours.

Sylvia/R46 that’s what’s so nice about the puppy potty apartment; it’s a two room crate with separate bedroom and bathroom areas.

I could never bring myself to keep my pup in a crate. Tried one night, it was exhausting. She has slept in our bed ever since, to mutual benefit. 8 years and going!

EL, what a remarkable product. Unfortunately I'm a bit skint at the moment (>$1000 in vet bills and meds over the last five weeks), so the PTPA is out at present.

But I do have a large kennel I bought a while back to confine a juvenile cat with repeated growth plate fractures, and will set it up for him when I return from the dentist.

Thanks, R48. I'm a damn good pet diplomat in general, but honestly in this case it was more of Squidge being a chill cat and Nori being a chill puppy than it was about my diplomacy skills.

Nori is a good dog name, OP. Keep her. I know you are hooked already.

Or him, rather.

R52, agreed. Once you name them they are most often staying. Congrats OP. Nori looks to be a sweetheart.

If puppy is a Lab you're in luck. They have to be trained, and you have to really be consistent with that, but Labs are wonderful!! They re a popular breed for a reason. You actually lucked out. He could have been a pit bull. Ugh. But start potty training him right away. And IMO getting him crate trained is not a bad thing.

Thanks, everyone! I'm a bit punchy from the all-nighter, but it was worth it, I think. Made it to the dentist only four minutes late. As I was pulling out of my driveway, Nori was yipping and hopping around the front yard with my sister.

I do love a sweet lab....

Please post Nori pictures every now and then, OP. DL wants to see him grow up.

Nori should be the DL mascot!!

Puppies are so hard to live with... chewing, barking, destroying, misbehaving. But the cost/benefit ratio? They fill your heart and remind you that all the bullshit around us in our harsh and exploitive and corrupt world... isn't as important as a puppy tongue kissing your ear.

If you are skint, a few of us old whores would donate a few pence for vet visits.

awwww, I didn't see this thread until now. What a bunch of loves you all are!

PLEASE order or pick up a dewormer that covers hookworms, roundworms and tapeworms asap. like, immediately. also a flea treatment, I recommend at least Capstar for the fleas and any 7 way dewormer.

[quote] pooped by the table where I keep the diffuser.

OP, if you mean a diffuser for essential oils, these are toxic to cats and can kill them.

R58? Since we're talking about a very popular breed, A Black Labrador, known for it's intelligence, it's sweetness, and beloved by all, it is definitely not the kind of dog one would want for a mascot for DL.

A viper would an appropriate mascot for DL.

[quote] OP maybe take him to your vet to be scanned for a chip before going to a shelter. The boys who threw him out might have stolen him for a thrill and his owners might be desperately looking for Nori.

Post on Pawboost!

r64 = Wonk Eyed Willie aka Andy Cohen

Did any one get the plate on that car?

I suspect OP, as an animal rescue volunteer for so long is on top of all that, r62. I have a diffuser on my nightstand. Kitty goes nowhere near it.

I, for one, would like to contribute to the pile on manipulation for OP to adopt Nori. Squidge and Nori are chill kids. Although, I don't know how debilitated OP's father is, it's been demonstrated that seniors benefit from the presence of a pet dog. Nori could have health benefits for your dad just by virtue of hanging around and being sweet and affectionate. The research is out there.

Dammit DL, you're making me well up--and it ain't because of the right lower molar extraction that's just beginning to hurt like a bitch as the local wears off. Last night a few of you had me wondering if, after 61 years on this big blue marble, I was actually the coldhearted puppy-hating cat-loving demon cunt you thought I was. I know, I know, it's Datalounge--what did I expect?

An hour ago my sister headed out to score some puppy kibble and treats, and asked me to make sure Nori didn't try to follow her out of the yard. So I went out, picked the little fella up, and we sat down on the porch steps just enjoying the fine afternoon. Turns out, Nori is a huge nuzzler. I like nuzzle. We watched the mockingbirds do their mating song and dance around the giant Alaskan cedar trees, saw the honeybees and Monarch butterflies gather nectar from the celosia and blue Salvia, and graciously accepted the apology of Pippin the big grey tabby for his truly stank behavior of last night. Nori on my lap, Pip leaning on my right thigh, all was right in the world.

Don't forget to make time for the felines.

Take Nori to the vet, though. Just make sure the little pup doesn't have heartworms.

Two minds with but a single thought, rescue-chick/R61. I've a lifelong extreme, intracrable worm phobia, and always keep NexGard Combo, Bayer Tapeworm Dewormer, Capstar for Cats, and food grade diatomaceous earth on hand to stamp out worms and their vectors.

First thing tomorrow I'm picking up ALL the killers from my vet's office.

Never fear, R70; Squidge is warming my lap as I hunt and peck.

Get the little pup some chew toys, or he'll be after your shoes/furniture/whathaveyou.

You should not have any animals, OP. The life of “outside” animals is pure suffering. Please contact a respectable rescue to get your “pets” to people who will actually care for them. Your “question” reveals your profound misunderstanding of what it is to love and care for an animal. SMFH.

All life is suffering R75.

Let the Lord of the Black Land come forth! Let justice be done upon him!

How quaintly pseudo Zen, R76. That level of rationalization facilitated Auschwitz. Get your fat ass to your local animal shelter for a dose of reality. I hope to hell you have no animal lives entrusted to your “care.” Jaysus. Are you the love child of Marie Antoinette and Ayn Rand?

r79 MARY! 📿✊️

R80 EVA BRAUN!

[quote]If puppy is a Lab you're in luck. They have to be trained, and you have to really be consistent with that, but Labs are wonderful!! They re a popular breed for a reason. You actually lucked out.

So true, R55. THEEEEEE best dog I ever knew was mostly yellow Lab, crossed with Chow Chow (he had a black tongue but evinced none of the less savory Chow traits). Early one morning after one of our rare snows my mother saw a yellow dog lying on the bare grass in the vacant lot next door. Initially she thought he was dead, but when she went out to check, the dog weakly raised his head... then wagged his tail.

Mother immediately brought him chow and water, then left him to it. Then they began the old child's game, "1-2-3, REDLIGHT!" During that first 1/2 day each time she looked out the dog was 10 steps closer to our house. By the time I got home from work the dog was on the side of the house by the chimney. Mother had called to ask me to buy dog kibble and a few cans of wet food, so I knew this dog must be pretty dawned awesome; Mother was a soft touch with children, not dogs. When I got close to him I saw the leather collar on him was embedded in his skin.😢🤬

Within a week we all were in love with the yellow Lab we named Yogi. At that time I had an inside-only cat who'd jailbreak any time he had the chance. Lexie was epileptic, and Yogi immediately sensed something was different about that cat. Every time Lex escaped the house Yogi was on him IMMEDIATELY, chasing him down and dragging him back onto the porch. Every single time; it was extraordinary. Best babysitter ever.

One afternoon one of my Dad's friends showed up at the house. The man was an ordained minister, but Dad was the only one of us who liked him; he'd been beating his wife for decades before she finally left him. Dude pulled up in his Navigator, opened the door and stuck one leg out... Yogi SPRINTED across the yard, refusing to let that Man of God put one foot on our property. Each time he tried, Yogi growled and pushed him back, finally baring his canines to end the discussion. Man of God got back in his Navigator and sped off.

Y-Dog got extra treats and brushes that evening.

[quote]r75 The life of “outside” animals is pure suffering. Please contact a respectable rescue to get your “pets” to people who will actually care for them.

I inherent my neighbor’s outdoor cat, who was kept primarily as a ratter. She will sleep inside now, snuggled up on a bed, but come the dawn she’s looking out the window, hungry to return to Her Kingdom of Blood.

She’s a little Countess Bathory, bringing me mice, wood rats, salamanders, and garden snakes. I also saw her chewing on the stump of a dead squirrels neck, tho I don’t know if she’s the one who killed it.

It’s all rather disgusting, but murder and stalking her victims is her heartfelt [italic]passion.[/italic] She’s not suffering out there! She will stay inside if it’s cold or rainy but otherwise she tries to slip out the door every chance she gets, reveling in her reign of terror.

I have a Lab mix. The cats groom him.

This looks like a valuable pup, I’m surprised it was dumped

R75, ALL of my cats are inside cats, and I work very hard to keep it that way. But my old Dad is 97, blind, with mobility/balance issues. Of course the cats are aware, and use it to their advantage whenever I'm not around. Dad's caregiver takes him for a walk, cats dash out when she holds the door open for him. Physical therapists, nurses, case managers, visitors, neighbors--same thing.

I go into orbit every time, but not everyone understands 1) the importance of keeping the cats inside; and 2) how they can maneuver Dad to minimize the opportunities for cat-dashing.

Sneaky indoor cats are harder to handle in open-concept living spaces. A few doors here and there make it easier.

Both of mine have gotten out but neither one goes far on their own. One sits right by the door. But if my partner or I go out they try to follow. And the dog lets us know if they get out. He has a special howling bark.

Yes, R62, I'm ACUTELY aware, am a serious student of oils and their effects, and never ever ever diffuse certain EOs or certain EO blends.

R83, that has not been my reality at all. I have seen far too many outside cats mauled by dogs, run over by cars, or suffering from chronic medical (untreated) problems to believe your premise. I have zero respect for people who keep “their” animals outside. If nothing else, look at the life expectancy data.

Squidge & Nori, friends:

Awwwwww. Adorable.

You’ve been blessed OP

This is my favourite thread ever.

[quote] How are you?

[quote] Blessed.

[quote]I also saw her chewing on the stump of a dead squirrels neck

Badass fr, R83. I just love project manager kitties.

Did you get Nori scanned for a chip yet OP? (Such a cute picture with Squidge)

No, Ma'am, ElderLez, not yet. Planning to take him to my vet to have him scanned tomorrow morning when I am there getting the dewormers. If they're not too busy and can take him as a walk-in I may go ahead and get him examined and get his shots.

[quote]How are you?

[quote]Blessed.

And HIGHLY favored!

Good luck tomorrow OP.

It didn't take them long to bond. That's great.

No don’t do that. If you’re concerned put it in its own room

I’d like to find people who abandon animals and have some alone time with them and a crowbar

R96 any asshole who'll dump a dog never would have bothered to get it chipped.

Maybe he was stolen

THANK YOU, EL/R99!

That clip at R90 is so freakin' adorable. Good luck to Nori whatever you decide to do, OP!

Nori looks well taken care of so there’s a real chance, as R104 says, that the dog was stolen.

Best to know that before cats, dogs and people get any more bonded. (As adorable as that bonding may be)

Absolutely r107. I didn't want to go there too deeply but it needed to be said. I've seen it happen. Even worse when kids are involved.

[quote]R89 I have seen far too many outside cats mauled by dogs, run over by cars, or suffering from chronic medical (untreated) problems to believe your premise. I have zero respect for people who keep “their” animals outside. If nothing else, look at the life expectancy data.

I agree it’s far better to keep cats indoors. Some go stir crazy, though - - ripping up window screens, etc., desperate to go out. For those you just have to hope for the best while they’re outside.

My regular cat is an indoor cat. The adoptee is only indoor/outdoor because that’s how she arrived… and that’s what she’s addicted to. Her personality was formed over the previous years in a different household.

Rationalization. You are justifying abominable behavior. Ever seen a feral/outdoor cat mauled by a dog? I have, way too many times. That includes a very young kitten. I will never get that sound/sight out of mind. Not sure how you sleep at night.

^^ cats die every day, dolores

I love cats and dogs, with a very slight preference for dogs.

Let us know if you decide to keep him, OP. I really hope that you can find a way to give him a home. He’s a complete doll.

I can't get enough of this thread. OMG Nori and Squidge at r90 😍!

For the life of me, why would anyone steal a dog only to dump it? People who steal animals are unforgivable. It almost happened to a very elderly neighbor who has mobility issues. He likes to sit on his porch with his sweet chihuahua rat terrier mix, Sky, who runs out to greet people when we walk by. A car pulled up one day and a woman got out, pretended to walk away but stopped to pet Sky. She immediately grabbed him and started going back to her car. Fortunately, the caretaker saw this from inside and came out screaming. Can you imagine stealing an elderly man's pet?! JFC.

That cat is giving little Nori some serious tongue action. I am impressed! And a little turned on...

R111, Unfortunately at a higher rate than sociopaths like you, Anastasia

You must absolutely keep Nori now.

You say you have 3 cats but the describe 5. I didn’t read anything else yet.

Spread papers on the bathroom floor with a bed and toys. Needs small place with no choices.

I can’t believe how many pet lovers tell me “they” couldn’t handle being with them at the vet when they were put down. I can’t believe “they” think that it all revolves around how “they” feel.

How’d you get rid of the raccoons?

Waccoons!

I hid the "outdoor animals are DOOMED" troll and the thread improved immensely!!

Hide yourself cunt. The thread has one psychopath too many.

This thread is so absolutely precious it makes me throw up in my mouth a little.

OP/R90 that video of Squidge and Nori! And the pics of Nori and Squidge sleeping on the couch. It's very clear that Nori the puppy is a gift to you and your whole family from God. He's already right at home and getting loved and licked to death and part of the family. It's meant to be. His entire body being one big wag is because of the Labrador in him.

I - and I'm sure many others on DL - will send you money if you need it for vets bills and food or whatever - open a Gofundme - I'll donate. Please just keep him. Don't even think about it. I get really upset about situations like these with those horrific subhuman people who dumped him on the street but little Nori has absolutely lucked out and somehow found you and your cats. It's just so nice to know there are good and decent people like you in the world.

I'm already emotionally invested in Nori so please keep us updated as much as you like in this thread.

But please keep him. You'll be glad that you did. Love to you and Nori and Squidge from Melbourne, Australia.

R125 I was the first to suggest that a foster fail might be the only option, but OP is worried about his elderly father. Until the puppy is trained, it's a fall risk for his Dad. If I'm reading this correctly, OP is a big softie who is perfect for Nori and Squidge, et al., but OP also seems to have some good common sense and I'm not too worried about Nori's welfare. I think Nori will end up in a good home.

HOWEVER, should OP decide to trust that Nori is gentle and trainable, I am so rooting for this.

OP how did you come up with the name Nori?

I was wondering the same thing myself, R127.

10/10

Elaborate scenario with PUPPIES.

[quote]Nori is a dried edible seaweed used in Japanese cuisine.

So are you going to wasabi the puppy OP?

In the UK it's the norm to let cats out in the day and evening and then keep them in at night, but there are no predators above them here except for foxes. Got to say all of my indoor/outdoor cats have been very healthy, content and lived long lives. Indoor cats tend to be lazy, bored and overweight.

In the suburbs of California, where there are coyotes aplenty, outside cats are called "lunch"...

Also, outside cats have a much higher chance of getting all the various viruses etc.

Keep that beautiful puppy, OP!

Also iirc OP said they were 61 years old. This cute little puppy may end up being 80 pounds. OP will you be able to handle that in five years? Ten or more years from now?

OP, the best thing you can do is be honest about your capabilities.

If you really can't commit to raising Nori, then put effort into finding the dog a new home.

If you can commit, spend some time on good training so the dog can succeed in its new home.

There's a chance that the two creeps who "dropped it off" stole that dog from someone they thoroughly dislike as part of a revenge scheme.

OP hopefully will come back and let us know how the vet visit/chip scanning went.

OP's sister needs to check all the local Nextdoor/Facebook groups, etc. for "MISSING PUPPY" posts.

[quote]R132 Got to say, all of my indoor/outdoor cats have been very healthy, content and lived long lives. Indoor cats tend to be lazy, bored, and overweight.

My precious indoor baby is [italic]BIG BONED ! !

Here’s some reality for the selfish cunts who refuse to accept the truth.

Hmmm... What happened to OP?

r141, Nori ate him

Maybe Nori made sushi of him and his kitties.

Too many responses to read. Are you going to keep him/her?

OP how did it go at the vet? Was there a chip?

At the risk of angering the PETA-nut, I’d point out that the source for that claim about “outdoor cats’ life expectancy is right up there with “people prescribed opiates don’t get addicted” and “everyone has to drink 64 ounces of water a day” scientific claims without actual sources that people just accept without questioning and repeat endlessly.

It would certainly be interesting to know the real difference between indoor only cats, indoor-outdoor cats, outdoor only cats and feral cats; all of which are different categories.

Outdoor cats are a huge problem for the wild songbird population.

They are and I believe that is the fundamental root of PETA’s animosity toward them, but a bell goes a long way in protecting the birds and is an easy thing to add.

Amazed by r135 & r136's presumptuous condescension.

I've had cats most of my life, and the last cat I had died of old age at 15 years old. I adopted her when she was about 3, she lived indoors for a year or so, and then transitioned to being an indoor/outdoor cat at around 4 1/2 or 5 when we moved to Sonoma County. She lived in 5 different homes during that time, all of them while she was indoor/outdoor.

I don't know how much longer a cat can live in as many different homes as she did, but she lived a long and fruitful life.

My best friend also has two cats (both from the same litter) she's had since kittenhood. They - also - have been indoor/outdoor cats their entire lives (with a short stint as indoor only cats while she lived in a studio situation for 2 years), and are about 13 years old. They are also doing fine, though are elderly and obviously nearing the end of their lives.

I'm simply relating my experience with cats I've owned and known and how they have lived longer lives despite being indoor/outdoor animals.

Please don't let this turn into a catfight thread!

There are some real asshole drivers out there who aim for cats. Indoor cats I have had lived a minimum of 15 years. One lived to 22. As a child, very few of our outdoor cats lived to 10.

On the other hand, my sister had an outdoor cat live to 28. In the country. She was my niece's best friend into her mid 30s.

A bell is fine if the collar doesn't get stuck on something.

Pups love to chew so give him an old sock to keep him occupied.

Yak bones will keep him busy.

R117, I have five cats: one 2.5-year-old old brother pair, one girl (11 in September), one 3-legged cat, and one old male who only recently adopted us last winter when he decided the cold wasn't good for his old bones.

R154 That's it? What is happening with the pup? Was it microchipped? Update!!

EST?

I keep checking this thread for updates! I'm on Team Keep Nori! (unless he is microchipped and his original owners are located of course).

Looking forward to updates OP!

How is Nori? Is there something you don't want to tell us OP?

Are you feeling down because he was reunited with his family?

Please let us know. We all feel for you.

I hope OP isn't the previous owner of 2 Bengal rescue kittens...

Ha, R159, like my broke ass could afford ONE Bengal kitten, let alone two.

Hey, guys, sorry I haven't updated.

Nori is definitely a girl.

rescue-chick, I started Nori on the 7-way dewormer (chewable) this afternoon. I've never dewormed a dog before, so not sure of the process. Tomorrow I'll give her a dose of the liquid version of the 7-way.

I did kennel her last night, and after a few yelps she settled down and did really well. Just put her in again, about an hour ago, with a Pupperoni as treat. Will buy her some Greenies tomorrow on my way home from my NP appointment.

This afternoon I hung out with my old Dad in his den, with Nori on my shoulder like a baby being burped. After a bit she inched her way toward Dad, then plopped down beside him. 20 minutes later I was in the kitchen when Dad's caregiver started laughing and told me to "come and look at your girl!" I turned around and saw Nori lying asleep on the back of the sofa directly behind Dad's head. I'll have to ask her to text me the pic she took.

My visiting sister (our family's dog person) in less than10 minutes taught Nori to "Sit."

There's more, but my brain is fried and my mouth is giving me the blues--and fucking CVS is fucking me over by not filling the Norco and Mobic prescriptions my dentist sent them yesterday morning. Too much annoying shit to detail here tonight.

I appreciate your interest in sweet Nori--Goodnight!

Has all the elements of a great EST.

2/10

I am so glad to hear that Nori and Dad are bonding and I am so invested in this. Please keep updating us, OP.

Labrador puppies cost about $2000 each.

I think Nori is too young to have been microchipped. Only looks about 8 weeks old. Maybe the breeder abandoned her for having white markings. They like black labs to be pure black.

Ok, well, the chance of you keeping Nori at this point seems > 50%. She seems sweet and highly sociable. I'm really happy for you both. And it looks like some of the cats are coming around to the new reality.

Crazy and sad that such a perfect pup was tossed from a car like that. Some of us humans are just the worst.

I hope OP is feeling better and recovering from the oral surgery (and got ahold of his pain meds!)

OP such a sweet story- I do hope you keep Nori. Just a thought- would it be possible to train Nori to help you Dad? Labs to make good service dogs.

Any updates OP?

OP - please answer just two questions:

1. Was Nori microchipped?

2. If not, are you keeping Nori?

I wonder if OP got a time out?

I'm starting to think this is a very well done EST.

OP seems too sweet to do anything that would warrant a time out.

That's what I said @ R156.

How could it be an EST with all those pictures?

ICE came and disappeared both OP and Nori. Nori was flown down to El Salvador and is now in CECOT prison. Senators Padilla and Schiff are planning to fly down to San Salvador on Monday to see if they can get more information.

ESTs tend to stick around a little too much and overplay their hand. I think OP is likely for real and is, at the moment, either weekending or dealing with life stuff.

Christ, OP almost got a Go Fund Me!

I guess we gay folk are suckers for a good pet tale.

Was this really an EST?

Looks like it R179.

R90 I heard this song in my head when I saw that. The part where the little girl sings.

[quote]Christ, OP almost got a Go Fund Me!

With INTERNATIONAL donations too!

I'm intrigued by the way the father in this story is always called "my old Dad." What's up with that, I wonder?

He's in his 90s, r183.

OP is a quitter. It did have a lot of EST elements but OP didn't have the determination and creativity to keep it going.

Could this have been an incarnation of Greg?

R186, never! The home he posted seems very nice but very humble. If this were Greg he's have been in his estate in the Hamptons eye fucking Kevin Bacon.

I believe OP. There's nothing "elaborate" about this story. They are a cat household with 5 cats. (Ugh! Can you imagine the stink of the litter boxes?) and they took in a puppy that was literally thrown away. Now they need to decide whether or not to keep it. They are conflicted because their impulse is " OMG, it's adorable let's keep it! " yet they are also "OMG, can we really afford (for any number of reasons) to keep it?" Personally IMO a Higher Power was at work and gave them a gift. They should keep it. There's not nearly enough drama or plot complications for this to be an EST. If it is an EST, shame on him and us for such banal bullshit.

[quote]There's not nearly enough drama or plot complications for this to be an EST.

That's why this EST is so good R187. The balance is perfection. It's gold standard ESTing.

Yes maybe R186.

r186 here. I find it highly suspect that he got a bunch of attention then conveniently disappeared when we were all waiting to hear the results of the vet visit/chip scanning. A quick update with no real details and then...nothing.

It’s also possible that he didn’t keep the dog and didn’t want to face the condemnation of us harpies.

r191 that could be true. I'll bet there would be many people though that would understand that he was trying to do what was best for his situation.

Shall I schedule a Group Session?

The first sign of potential good dog ownership is knowing when it's not the right time for you to own a dog. No shame in that, that's ridiculous.

Well said, Rescue Chick! Hopefully he'll come back and tell us what happened.

I'm thinking Nori was chipped and returned to her owner, and OP and the cats are all very sad.

That would be the best ending, R196. I shall hope for that.

Nori is a boy!

In any case, OP left us with a good dog name,

Old Dad tripped over Nori and tragically, did not survive the fall. Little Nori went tearing out the front door in the commotion of it all and the 5 cats went after him. They still have not been found.

OP's sister stopped talking to him because she blamed him for introducing a puppy to the household in the first place. Now, OP is left catless, dogless, Old Dadless...and hopeless.

You CANNOT have his stuff. Because it all was lost in the fire.

OP, having lost everything he held dear in life and in a drunken, depressive stupor, passed out with a pot of chicken and rice simmering on the stove he had hoped to use to lure back his beloved animal companions. He was found clutching a bag of kibble and a discontinued Whiskerton's cat toy. It is believed he died peacefully in his sleep of smoke inhalation.

OP here. I did something this morning I knew you'd castigate me for doing, so I didn't tell you. Last Friday my sister made an appointment for Nori and me at the local shelter I contributed to founding with $$$ and longitudinal T/N/R data 12-13 years ago. An intake appointment.

I started filling out the form, but I kept noticing the frequency of "3-5 days" stated over and over. I said to the twink behind the desk "Hmm, what goes on here--this 3-5 days repeated throughout the form? When I helped start the shelter we made clear to the City Council it was to be No-Kill." Twink hemmed and hawed, then said, "Yeah, since Covid we've regularly run 125% or more over capacity, so unfortunately we've had to euthanize from time to time."

I said "thanks for your time, Sir." We ran a couple of errands and went home.

More later. A baby at my elder age is EXHAUSTING.

What’s EST? I’m assuming it’s not that weird therapy thing from the 1970s.

If you visualize a parking spot it will appear.

So no chip OP?

Op, no need to put Nori in a shelter. Meet us at any convenient rest stop and we’ll pick Nori up.

Nope, no chip, EL/R203.

I can train a kitten/cat in my sleep, but am out of my element with puppies. Nori is good as gold, but she's become quite mouthy--and she has shark-sharp teeth. Dad's physical therapist came today, and she's a strong dog person (in fact, she tells everyone she loves my cat, Minka, but nobody except us believes her because she doesn't like cats); the way Nori nipped at her ankles the PT asked Nori if she was part heeler.

The toileting is another thing; I've trained FERAL cats to use a litter box, but [italic]puppies?[/italic] Yeesh.

Oh, and it's hard as hell training MYSELF not to leave the cats' food (especially the wet food, omg) out where she can get to it--just made that mistake AGAIN a few minutes ago.

But her favorite place to be is right beside my old Dad's feet; if I haven't seen her in a bit I now know to go to his den, and likely she'll be there by him against the sofa, out of the family foot traffic.

r202 EST = Elaborate Scenario Troll

More:

[quote]Op, no need to put Nori in a shelter. Meet us at any convenient rest stop and we’ll pick Nori up.

And have one of the dozens of I-10 serial killers catch us out? No, thank you, R204!🤭

potty training. put a jingle bell on your door. take her out every hour. jingle the bell dramatically every time you go out. ecstatic praise every time she potties. you have to take her every hour. when she eventually jingles the bell to go out, ecstatic praise and a treat.

She's FREAKING gorgeous OP/R205/R207. Thanks for coming back because we were freaking out as you can see by the direction of the most recent posts. When you first mentioned taking to Nori to a shelter I was worried about the "no kill" shelters being overrun and them having to euthanize the animals after a while. I wouldn't have left her there either. It's basically a death sentence.

So does this mean you have decided to keep Nori? I hope so. It's crazy stuff how she has just walked into your life and instantly become part of the family. Amazing how the cats have all accepted her so readily. That's why I felt it was meant to be.

I'm sure you know already but Labradors will eat anything like a rabid vacuum cleaner and they chew stuff when they're puppies and teething. It's going to take patience but if you can train a feral cat then you can train Nori.

Has there seriously been no-one who has listed Nori missing at the local vets or put lost notices up? Shame on those people who dumped her. I'm so glad she was lucky enough to find you and your cat and Dad family. I can tell she's going to end up ruling the joint! We all look forward to your updates. You should start an Instagram to put the pics on. I nominate Nori for DL mascot!

nipping is tough. she has to have enough things to chew on. get an antler horn. I do not recommend greenies for this. each time she nips, (gently yet firmly) take her snout and close it and say no nipping. and walk away. every single time.

One of my friends had a Labrador (Jessie) and he nipped her boobs several times when he was a puppy. :(

I don't think he should keep her. It's pretty obvious OP is a incing prisspot and [italic]not[/italic] a dog person.

All of you dog people know that Labs need a shitload of exercise, and if OP has no idea how to even housebreak a dog, he'll be useless for anything necessary to keep this dog in the future.

OP? Put the dog on FB Marketplace. Ask a nominal fee -- say, $50? Families are always looking for puppies, and hunters are always looking for bird dogs. Make sure you find her a good home, but absolutely [bold]do not keep her.[/bold] She needs a different kind of home altogether than you can provide for her.

He’s gorgeous, OP. Love his eyes.

Do NOT charge $50 for a labrador puppy- it'll end up being killed in a snuff movie.

Find the site where pedigree pups in your area are sold and then sell Nori for under the going rate (as you have no papers) but still for a decent amount that makera of gore films can't afford. If a pure bred is $2k, you charge $1k.

And make sure you vet the family very carefully.

[quote] One of my friends had a Labrador (Jessie) and he nipped her boobs several times when he was a puppy. :(

Potential mastectomy cost savings. Perhaps we should roll out this Labrador method nationwide.

OP do NOT listen to a word of R213 or R215. Both are spouting load of garbage.

Ah puppy teeth! Cavaliers are fond of chewing eyeglasses, no idea about labs, but keep everyone’s specs out of reach to be safe. I second Rescue-Chicks recommendation of deer antlers. They can result in cracked teeth, but since these teeth will be falling out soon that doesn’t matter. Cow ears and bully sticks are softer, but won’t last so long. In addition to ignoring Nori immediately after being bit, I’d add saying “ow” really loudly and getting a sad face (bonus points if you can rustle up some tears) before flouncing away.

If Nori is likely all or mostly a black lab and you can’t keep her, look up the closest Labrador Retriever rescue and contact them. The rescues are (mostly) great and will vet any potential adoptees carefully. They probably have wait lists for puppies.

An idea for keeping Nori from eating the cat food is to get one of those feeders where there’s a RFID link between the cats’ collar and the food being dispensed. I think you might have some DL support if you did a GFM for that and the puppy training potty apartment. And your neighbors who know the story about your situation might very well chip in.

Thanks, R209/rescue-chick! I actually have a ton of doorknob jingle bells we bought when Mom's dementia had her trying to roam.

Great idea!

[quote]Thanks for coming back because we were freaking out as you can see by the direction of the most recent posts. When you first mentioned taking to Nori to a shelter I was worried about the "no kill" shelters being overrun and them having to euthanize the animals after a while.

Thanks, Australian @R210/R125! Between last Friday and Monday night I was anxious (even more than my usual high baseline) and worried beyond belief. Scared, even. It wasn't until Nori and I returned home yesterday that the anxiety dissipated, and we all know why.

I hate my state for many reasons; one of the main reasons is our shit attitude toward animal overpopulation. We refuse to get our animals spayed and neutered (while also starving state and local rescues of program funds), then get homicidal when stray cats take up residence under our decks, spraying and yowling and breeding; and when stray dogs form packs and start terrorizing neighborhoods and interbreeding with coyotes.

For now, feed the cat on the counter. So sweet that Nori is calm and sweet with your father.

[QUOTE] For now, feed the cat on the counter.

He has FIVE cats and most of them are elderly and can't jump up on the counter.

OP if you give him away to a shelter and then to some random non-datalounger you will be the most hated person on Datalounge. More hated than Steven Miller.

Keep him! You deserve him.

OP l just drove across the country with a dog (such a good dog) that could be her sister. Who also is quite nippy but eventually growing out of it. I love the Nori story.

OP, if you really can't keep the pup, look at lab rescues near you.

Labs are one of the most sought after dog breeds* - unless you live in the middle of Nebraska or some very unpopulated area, I'm sure you would find a lab rescue willing to work with you.

But honestly, do it more sooner than later. Nori would probably benefit from a bit more structure and socialization, and the earlier Nori gets it, the better behaved and the more adoptable.

Please do not give the dog to a stranger or friend (unless you know them very well), or sell it on FB Marketplace. Neither of those venues guarantee a good outcome. A general all-breed shelter may end up being too stressful for the pup and also doesn't guarantee a good outcome.

*I know this because we are actually looking at getting a lab (probably an older one) but we know we need to wait a bit until certain circumstances of our life (working) change. The link is to a lab specific rescue we're working with and supporting. So before some of the posters here tell me how hateful and mean mean mean I am for suggesting anything that isn't OP keeping the dog.....I love dogs and want Nori to have the happiest home and if OP is that home, wonderful, but OP needs to take a very candid, close look at the life he can give Nori and make that decision.

Again, a breed specific rescue/org is usually the best option vs XYZ All Breed Humane Society, etc.

[quote]For now, feed the cat on the counter.

Oh, nononononononono, R222! I already have trouble keeping Squidge (age 2.5 yrs and obsessed with foraging even though he's never had to) and Alastair (~12 years old and obsessed with foraging though he's with me now and doesn't need to) OFF the counters and stove which they'll summit in a heartbeat. I've lost taboule, a local shop's famous fried chicken wings, shrimp fried rice, my homemade curried lentils, smoked ribs and brisket, random potato dishes, chicken shawarma, mustard greens, etc etc etc to those stinkers. And CORNBREAD, ffs. Cornbread, people!

Ah I guess I'm lucky wih my Bengal and void moggy adolescent- I've trained them well not to go on my main kitchen counter. I have a peripheral counter that I feed the void on - he eats faster than the Bengal because the Bengal has only his canines (he's 13).

And yes, he's a rescue Bengal.

OP's a very nice person. I truly hope things work out one way or the other.

Whatever happens, thank you for bringing little Nori into our lives.

For the love of Gawd, if this is not an EST, this person should have ZERO pets. SMFH

LizArd/R225, I just love your story, which reminds me of all the places my middle sister and I traveled with Chloe, her expen$ive Cockapoo, then later with her rescue Schnoodle, Bentley (a/k/a The Best Little Boy in All the World).

Gotta say though, with the exception of my giant Maine Coon, Nomi, who loooovvved car trips, dogs travel much better than cats.

Earlier today when I told her how mouthy Nori is (and how sharp her baby teeth are, Dad's physical therapist and life hacker extraordinaire gave me two suggestions: 1) take a silicone ice tray, fill each space with baby food (only ones containing no onions or garlic, of course), freeze, then give to Nori to gnaw on; 2) take two dishtowels or terry bath towels. Lay them flat. Place 1 dog biscuit in one end of towel; roll and knot. Put 1 biscuit in the opposite end; roll and knot. Repeat with 2nd dish towel, then tie both dishtowels together. Give to pup; let her gnaw and un-knot to her heart's content while giving her mouth something to do besides bite ankles and upper arms.

R228 - that's not two rescue Bengals with a fancy litterbox by any chance???

OP, this will be a hard blow, but you do need to assert some authority when training a dog. They're not like cats who respect quiet, gentle people. The dog does need to know who's boss, or she'll decide she is.

Indeed, R233, especially for working/sporting dogs like Labs. I'm thinking I'll need to invest in some obedience training classes.

Ok, last question of the day: When kenneling for the night, should I cover it with a sheet like I have been doing (along a similar idea to the drop cloth-birdcage thing) to minimize Nori's anxiety about being alone in a confined space without me being right there with her, or should I leave it uncovered? My late Mother, an expert in early childhood development, always stressed the importance of teaching the child how to sit with a scary feeling and learn how to self-soothe, so she'd likely vote the "Uncovered" option.

I have a lab mix and two cats. Two litter boxes in the laundry room.

One night we were stranded in snow on the way home from the Laurentians and asked our downstairs neighbours to feed the beasts. We didn't dare ask the neighbour to take the dog out and expected a few puddles&presents on our return.

Naw. The big guy had been watching the cats and actually tried to do the litter box. He missed with both and the poor boy was acting all shamed when we arrived home. But he tried. Labs are the best dogs ever.

Yes he was given treats and love. Cats too for trying to teach him.

I love EVERYONE in your story, R235--dog, cats, neighbors, snow, you guys, the Laurentians....

Thoughts–Feed the cats in a room with a door and install a cat door too small for the puppy. Bonus if you can put the litter boxes there as well.

Potty training–Go outside immediately after waking, eating, and playing/excitement. Any time their metabolism speeds up, urine output goes up. If they poop in the house, pick it up and take it outside. Place it where you want them to go.

Try to find a puppy kindergarten. They'll get the necessary socializing and you'll get great info and moral support.

Exhaust their brain. YouTube puppy enrichment.

The first 6 months are really hard, but every effort you put in will repay in spades.

Thanks so much... AGAIN. Just when I thought I couldn't love DL more, 🎶Yooouuuuu send me, honest you do🎶

And now, goodnight. Off to kennel pup and get some sleep--gotta take my old Dad to the ER first thing in the morning for IV fluids and test for UTI.

I need a vacation, DL (though adopting a soon-to-be large dog means I won't be able to afford one, anyway)!

Thank goodness you are adopting her! I think if you started a Go Fund Me people here would love to help out.

Observe this thread — if Nori doesn't appear, she got sent to the glue factory/crematorium.

We had a mixed dog/cat household for years and used one of these. Nori could probably fit through the cat door section right now, but she'll be big soon enough.

When our lab pup was teething and gnawing, the best thing that worked was washcloths soaked in plain water, twisted into spirals and put in the freezer until frozen solid. She loved to gnaw-and-thaw.

OP, can you flip Nori belly up to show DL that he is a BOY!

He is a GIRL R243!

But OP refers to him as he in the first email. No?

First entry.

Ah OK just saw entry R160. Nori is a girl.

I don't know where you are, OP, but here's just one breed rescue group. You're in over your head.

Just do it.

Ah r228 no I don't live in Boston. I do kinda miss him, he made for fun threads to irriate him. I thought that I would throw in an amusing reference (and I did try to advise him on that thread).

They also make cat flaps and cat feeders that will only open up if the cat is wearing a special collar.

Those cat RFID feeders cost about $200 each. And OP has five cats.

They sell ones for multiple cats. I tried to link but DL wouldn’t let me.

Already did that last Friday, R243--and he's a girl.

I'm on a house-search mission to locate the bottle of Vetericyn Hot Spot Spray I bought for Minka and Alastair last year; Nori has a widening patch on her lower ventral side I don't want to get out of control.

About 90 mins ago I was way in the back of the house with Dad, and all of a sudden I heard this ear-splitting SQUEAL in the front of the house, followed by Dad's caregiver's deep voice "Oh, it's ok; Miss Shenanigan just HAD to see Nori." Caregiver's mid-20s daughter, a HUGE dog person, was running around behind Nori, just as happy as a toddler. When Nori picked up her white water bowl and started trotting around with it, Miss Shenanigan SCREAMED, "LOOK, Mommy, cutest thing EVER!!!!"

I'm finding it so interesting seeing people's reaction to this sweet little pup--they're all acting as *I* do when I see a cat or kitten. So I'm thinking young Nori is pretty special.

you can brew chamomile tea and mix with apple cider vinegar and if you have colloidal oatmeal, some of that for hot spots until you find your spray.

How does your dad feel about the dog? Does he like it when she's around him, or is he indifferent? Is Nori making his life a little brighter or not?

Great question, R254!

Dad is 90% blind (Retinitis pigmentosa), and Nori is black as the ace of spades, so he catches glimpses of her more than actually "seeing" her. But just this afternoon she grew tired of playing with stolen shoes and slippers, and crept up to Dad and put her forepaws and head on his lap, looked into his eyes with her huge eyes... and [italic]SIGHED,[/italic] deeply. Dad patted her on the head, and chuckled "What're you doin', buddy?"

She's out back with me now, helping me water the giant LSU fig tree. Next month we'll find out whether she likes figs--do dogs eat figs?

Oh, and like Minka-cat, Nori is a HUGE flirt; her behavior with the Amazon guy was shameless.

All dogs I know all flirting with the Amazon guys.

Well, a *good* girl must be mindful of her reputation, R256.

Thank you for this thread. With all the insanity going in the world some due to the orange monster, it's so nice to read about a sweet little puppy that was rescued by a DLer..

ALERT--CUTENESS OVERLOAD!

I REPEAT: CUTENESS OVERLOAD!!!

OP, did you contact animal control and the police to see if anyone reported a missing or stolen puppy?

OP, are you in Winston Salem?

OP, training advice: employ the mentality of 'nothing in life is free' when it comes to her resources. Place training works wonders. Make her work to earn the freedom to have more and more space, work can be doing business outside, sitting in her bed/cot/crate when she's not being played with or when the humans are busy. Sitting while you prepare her food, and lots of stimulating exercise (fetch inside for now. Once she's larger, taking that outside), those would be examples of 'working '. Reward the hell out of good behavior and be consistent in your corrections, repetition and routine are tools you'll benefit from. She's probably allowed everywhere right now, but before she grows you'll want certain behaviors ingrained and starting young is important.

Depending on her breed type, she may require more exercise or stimulating activities so she doesn't destroy things. You need to have a 'this X is mine, but I'm sharing it with the dog, be it toys, furniture, rooms to move around in/freedom, treats, etc. My two have different motivators. One is toy driven, the other is food driven, you'll figure out what she is most motivated by and use that.

I found bitter yuck to work, although only had one problematic chewer out of three dogs of my own, but when she is teething soft/chewy nylabones are lifesaver as are whimzees.

YOU should get her chipped (not sure if that was mentioned above.)

Whew, that's a big chew, R262. Great advice; I'll start on your list tomorrow morning.

I feel so out of my element. But I'm up for it... I think.

OP, I had to pay for a trainer as I didn't realize how difficult having two terriers a few yrs apart living happily together. Its really mostly common sense, I was guilty of forgetting the nature of Pack Animals, not understanding how I'd entitled one, and didn't have myself established as their leader. Most people who have problems with dogs behavior, mislabel the behavior as 'reactive' as opposed to it being entitlement. These dogs think they own their humans, have a lot of anxiety bc dogs do not make good leaders, but they dont respect and trust their humans, because they're entitled. As your dog works for things, it gives you more to 'take away' when they misbehave. Dogs dont 'love', thats a human emotion, they can trust, and we often read that as love. Eye contact can increase anxiety along with talking to them (something Im totally guilty of), but lots of dog owners think those things will calm their dogs. You'll build a vocabulary of commands, and if there's structure the dog will fall in line with its consistency. Also, babygates are very useful.

The trainer I had also recommended this book, as they worked with the guy at some point. I dont agree with everything he's espousing, but there are good ideas and a used copy is about 6.00, Cesar Millan's Short Guide to a Happy Dog.

And for laughs...

I disagree about dogs not being able to feel love. There is plenty of oxytocin in canine noggins.

But I absolutely agree that you need to make sure that your dog respects you and understands that you outrank him or her. My wife and I have very different pet parenting styles and the dog’s behavior very clearly demonstrates who he thinks he’s responsible for overseeing vs. not. The thing Nori did getting up on the back of the couch behind your old dad was a dominance behavior. It seems to have been a very sweet dominance behavior given your Dad’s state, but you shouldn’t let her do it to you. Ditto humping. Ditto walking through doors ahead of you. (That last one -oy)

Do not yell at Nori. Dogs see yelling as being out of control. Do not use the same word to mean different things. If “down” means lay down, it cannot also mean get down from. They can understand a lot of words, but not contextually.

As for eye contact, dogs view eye contact with someone they aren’t bonded to as hostile and a challenge. I’d never look a dog with any propensity to violence in the eye even if we were bonded. But if you’ve got a docile breed and you are bonded, eye contact will release oxytocin in your dog.

R265 (Tangent/Anectdote) Regarding eye contact, I should have been clearer. Repeatedly making eye contact without any verbal commands can attribute to heightened anxiety, especially when your dog is in a stressful situation. Humans will look one another in the eye as a comforting non-verbal gesture and people often do the same with dogs who don't understand what you want from them, without verbal praise or command. - This sticks out for me as awhile back I'd joined a FB group for problematic 'reactive dogs' (before I bought a clue and got a pro involved), but one idiotic girl was complaining about having to share an elevator with someone when her dog is 'reactive ' to other people, amd despite making repeated eye contact the dog wound up snapping at the other person in the elevator. This whole group were idiots with entitled dogs, but even more staggering were the BEYOND unrealistic expectations for these animals they'd rescued being their (humans) emotional support therapy dogs, right out of the gate, or kennel, as it were. No training, just traumatized animals feeding off their owners own emotional instability while struggling with their own issues.

That group reiterated just how stupid people have become when it comes to dealing with animals. The amount of BE that was often resorted to put me off and I checked out of that group.

R266 decades ago an old Russian couple in our building had a pit bull that would try to attack anyone else in the elevator. They’d get In the elevator and literally press their bodies into the dog to hold him against the wall while screaming at him as he tried kill anyone else in the confined space. Bonkers and terrifying. And yet we’ve had well trained and sweet pit bulls in the building as well. It’s definitely an owner issue. Sit is the easiest command to teach.

I mean, dahling, who the fuck cares about such a mud-colored coat?

Pass.

Nori's the best thing to happen to DL since... well, I don't know when.

A salve in these difficult times.

Hooray for Nori!

OP - I see from your thread that you need some help on training your puppy. Puppies are my specialty and I know just how to deal with them...

[QUOTE] Nori's the best thing to happen to DL since... well, I don't know when.

Probably since those wonderful threads about Kieran and his cat, Raleigh.

R265 I had no idea getting up on the sofa behind someone is dominance behavior. My puppy (a Shih Tzu) likes to crawl behind my shoulders while I am sitting up in bed. I've always found it sweet and a form of cuddling. Should I stop her from doing it?

Live cavaliers, shih tzus were bred to be companion dogs for royalty. A dog that is bred to cuddle is going to do some things that look like dominance behaviors for other reasons. Unless there are other behavior problems I don’t see a problem.

Our Shiba Inu used to do the back-of-the-sofa thing

R265 Our lab gets up on the sofa behind our heads, licks our ears, and sighs happily. She often does it when she is afraid, like hearing a loud noise outside or when my partner decides to play the electric guitar at a disturbing volume. She has a lot of personality, but she absolutely defers to her humans in the pack pecking order. "Come. Sit." she never disobeys.

In short... not all "rules" about dog caretaking is always true for all dogs.

If that works for you that’s great R275.

But the thing to know about dominance behavior is that most dogs don’t exhibit dominance to be aggressive. Most dogs exhibit something more akin to servant leadership. So to me, and I am not a dog trainer, your dog seems to be getting up because she thinks she needs to protect you in those instances. She might be less anxious (sighing and licking can both be indicative of anxiety) if you thanked her for her concern, expressed that everything was fine and gently repositioned her to be beside you/told her off and gave her a treat for for obeying.

R276 I showed your post to our pup. She wanted to remind you that she most often gets up behind us because she can look out the window, likes the smell of our hair, likes the warmth, and is ready for a good photo-op. She also wanted me to thank you for your.. concern and interest.

Thanks for answering, Elder Lez. I'm glad to hear that Shih Tzus are just cuddlers. I have another dog that exhibits that behavior and, just intuitively, I knew it was not the same as when she does it. I think he is doing it to show dominance, now that you have mentioned it. I have been correcting him, but the puppy does it and he literally stares at me in disbelief that I allow her to do it and not him.

R270 Too far, just too damn far!

OP, hunny I'm glad youre enjoying Nori, but right now I am just a little distracted because the fucking Gestapo is taking over our country?

🙄 r280

We need more Nori with the Gestapo at the door.

A lot of ESTrogen on this thread.

OP any Nori updates?

R272 Shih Tzus have a fascinating background historically speaking to synopsize:

"royal history revolves around their initial role as guard dogs for the Imperial Chinese court, though they later became beloved companion dogs. Bred to alert palace residents to visitors, their barks served as an early warning system. The breed's association with royalty led to strict rules prohibiting non-nobility from owning them, with severe penalties for those caught with Shih Tzus outside the palace. The monks started breeding them with Pugs and Pekingese dogs and as a result, Shih Tzu's were born. These dogs were then gifted to the royal emperors of China (The Byzantine Empire). They were kept as protection dogs near the royal family to sound an alarm when someone approached." Sleeve Dogs": They were small enough to be carried in the sleeves of robes. While they were closely associated with the royal court and even allowed into sacred areas of the Forbidden City like the Temple of Heavenly Purity, specific historical accounts detailing them as guards for concubines are scarce.

More Nori pics please, OP, as the world is going up in flames.

Yesterday Dad's wonderful physical therapist arrived with a GIANT Marshall's bag filled with puppy goodies--two leashes; tons of squeaky toys; treat hide-seek-and-learn toys; a rubber pad with many small suction cups on one side and random different depressed shapes on the other to be smeared with peanut butter for hours of licking fun; a covered silicone ice tray in which to pour beef or chicken broth (my own homemade, of course), or baby food to freeze and give as frozen treat that doubles as teething aid; and oh, so much more that I haven't even got to yet. Oh, and a seat belt for her travels! Nori's had so much fun with everything so far.

This afternoon (well, yesterday afternoon now) Dad had a barber's appointment. I was helping Dad up the front hall, onto the porch and down the steps toward the driveway. Sometimes he'll randomly get afraid to navigate the steps and it can be really difficult to coax him along. Nori stayed by Dad's side the whole way, like a wiggly puppy guide dog; when he finally reached the bottom step and headed for the driveway Dad was all asmile, heaping praise on Nori (while I'm like, "What am i--chopped kibble?").

More later....

Good morning, Nori! OP, can you rub her ear for me?

Ahhh I knew Nori would be a good dog for Dad! She is so stinkin' cute. Who is the kitty appropriating her cage?

Nori has such beautiful eyes. She is the Cleopatra of dogs.

Done, R288!

Lots of shades of Greg in your posts, OP. Your own homemade broth, your writing style, your anecdotes about seemingly every day events punctuated with little shots of Nori here and there, and your brief stretches of time when you don't post, then post again after a few posters cajole you to come out and play again.

I'm sure Greg was a full-time caretaker for a 90+ year old blind man, too.

r293 I'm pretty sure that Greg (OP) makes up these scenarios and DL is his "creative writing" blog where he concocts new personas, lives, etc.

You can tell he's quite intelligent; however, despite the intellect, his posts here are meant to generate what he's really in need of: attention.

You might want to consider the possibility that you have a well-formed and persistent delusional system that approaches fulfilling diagnostic criteria for psychosis, r294.

r295 pull up any of Greg's old posts and you will see that the writing style is spot-on.

It's not psychosis, it's simple comparison.

Nope, not Greg. OP has a level of enthusiasm and compassion, and he is EMOTIONAL. And while he mentions food, he is not OBSESSED with it. Greg would never abandon his love of food. Greg would not live in such humble surroundings, and I can't see Greg chasing after 5 cats. if he took in an abandoned puppy, he have the little fucker running around the dunes in the Hamptons. LOL!

Ha, R288, that is Pippin, whose travails I've chronicled here over the last 18 months or so.

Yesterday morning he decided if Nori can invade his space and take over "his" old kennel, he would return the favor and reclaim it for a bit.

[quote]Nori has such beautiful eyes. She is the Cleopatra of dogs.

Quite right, R290. The perfect word for them is "soulful."

Funny, R292! I'd never have thought of it before, but I do love to cook, and I love prunes, so....🥂

Eh, R296, I *wish* I had the time OR energy to create multiple random fully-realized personae on an online message board.

(But if I did have that time/energy, I would spend them on actual fun and interesting things I no longer get to do)

I like the tufts of fur in Pippin's ears. Cute cat.

You're funny, R302, and agree 100%.

Pip's tufts give him a bit of a David Janssen or Leif Erickson air.

OP, I fully expect for this to become the Adventures of Nori + Friends thread. Please and thank you.

Ok, I think it's official: Nori does NOT like Alastair, and the feeling is beyond mutual. Alastair hisses and spits in Nori's general direction almost every time they meet, and Nori's just over it, and throws derisive yap-barks Alastair's way that seem to be the puppy equivalent of Jessica Walter's Massive Eye Roll.

Then again, none of my other 4 cats likes Alastair, either, so there's that.

Is Nori loafing yet? She's being raised by five kitties, after all.

I had a great old cat, a big, white guy, and he loved people but hated other animals. Fighting, biting, scratching, hiding and stalking. Intelligent. Never caused any serious wounds. He lived to over 20 years old.

In his later years he was introduced to a little black female kitten who adored him. He was his mean old self at first but later accepted the kitten as long as he was boss and she followed orders. From there they ended up sleeping together.

But for nearly two decades he could have never allowed that closeness to anyone but a human.

Your Allister might be like him.

Oh, wow, R306, that's hilarious--a dog in the classic cat leg/foot tuck formation!

R307, I LOVE your story.

I go sappy for animal-animal and human-animal love stories.

OP, how old is Nori now?

Hey OP, what kind of shenanigans has Nori been up to?

Iron-ing…

on Melaswen!

It is INSANE how fast she is growing--I wanna grab her and say "STOP IT-- slow down, little Nori!"

She is DESTROYING my Dad's hand-hewn, 70-year old wood floors, but right now, I no care; there'll be time enough for refinishing when she's a skosh older.

The little white markings.😍 Is that Squidge with her?Thanks, OP, for bringing a little joy into gloomy day.

op r313

Omg, rescue-chick, THANK YOU! Will order in the next few minutes--my oldest sister's and my lower legs+feet will bless you forever.

I'm used to trimming cats' claws, but Nori's nails are solid black and no way would I risk traumatizing her by cutting into her quick. And her training isn't quite there for me to feel comfortable having the groomer do them just yet.

I have a call in to my Marine Iraqi War vet godbrother to lend an assist with Nori-training; he had a lovely black Lab for many years, so he certainly has the experience.

Yes, R314, that is bff Squidge. I think it's a bit disconcerting to him how quickly Nori has grown; the *slight* size advantage Nori had when she first arrived (though Squidge was longer) has EXPLODED. I have to watch their play much more carefully than I did three weeks ago, because Nori obviously doesn't know her own strength.

My middle sister (the dog person) for decades has snarked about how much I spend on cat food (I buy the absolute highest quality food I can, even though it means I have much less to spend on high-quality food for myself)... but I am FLOORED at how much dog stuff costs, especially training treats and safe chewy things (bully braids, chicken-wrapped pork chomps, beef knuckles, etc.), and how quickly she goes through them.

r316, get a dremel type trimmer and do a tiny bit per paw every single day. pure black claws terrify me too! plus, you can use the dremel on your toenails after you clip them rather than filing.

also, please don't ever be fooled into buying anything rawhide. once. she's a bit older, trained and calmed down you'll spend less. plus, admit it, IT'S FUN buying for a dog 😂

also also, maybe you already know this, but no grapes or raisins EVER. most other produce is fine but grapes will kill her.

As far as treats, my Molly is 6 years old but obviously has/had issues that need work. I got a bag of matchstick carrots for training treats until I knew exactly what she is allergic to (haha, turns out she's allergic to everything). frozen blueberries, fresh if you have a blueberry bush or they're on sale. get creative (but seriously, no grapes)

OP thank you for this update with pictures of Nori and Squidge. This made me very happy. It's so nice to look at these cuties.

I thought Nori was a black Lab.

Looks like there's a lot of pit bull coming out.

Take it out back and shoot it before it kills your other pets and elderly father.

r322 I saw pit bull in the very first pics posted.

lol, not a pit

Pit bulls are involved in more dog attacks than any other breed. In fact, the American Animal Hospital Association reports this breed was responsible for 22.5% of bites across all studies.

Pit bulls are both more likely to be involved in bite incidents and more likely to cause serious injury or death when a bite does occur.

^ 🙄

Nori doesn't look muscular enough to have much if any pit in her.

Black Lab puppy:

Black pit bull puppy:

Aww she’s so cute. All puppies are terrible destroyers. My parents had a phase Lhasa apso puppy years ago and I couldn’t believe what he was capable of doing.

Calm yer tits- she's a lab/pitt mix. Nori is still adorable. How is she with your Pops OP? Still shepherding him?

[quote]Hey OP, what kind of shenanigans has Nori been up to?

Hey, R311, Nori has spent three weeks watching in awe as Pip and Squidge perform their nightly cheer tumbling and floor exercises. Since before they were weaned they would run full-speed at each other, then at the second before collision leap six feet into the air, flipping the whole while. It's been many months since they did it, and I'd assumed with Pip's repeated growth-plate fractures (not 100% healed) and the several pounds of muscle he's put on since being neutered, and residual effects of Squidge's serious puncture wound to his forepaw last spring (now 100% healed)--that they'd never perform those feats again. But right around the time Nori arrived, they picked up where they'd left off a year ago. The leaps aren't *quite* as high as they'd been, but are super entertaining nonetheless.

Anyway, Nori loves to sit beside me and watch the floor show, her head switching back and forth like she's in the stands at Wimbledon. It it hilarious how she just knows she can never do what they're doing, so she's happy just watching.

rescue-chick/R318, Dad's physical therapist just last week told me the same thing when I asked her advice about trimming nails; she uses the Dremel because Whiskey, her Min-Pin's nails are jet-black, too.

Lordy, cat nail clippers are soooooo much cheaper.

R330, she HAS to usher him from his bedroom to his adjoining bathroom. How in the world he navigated that journey the previous 70 years, we have no idea.

BUT she's always mindful of my ironclad No Pets In Bathrooms rule, and stops right at the doorway.

she is a pitbull-lab. one of my fosters looked exactly the same. all lab personality tho.

Don't spend more than $20 r332

Wooooo-hoo, rescue-chick/R335!

Your rec saves me $$$$$$ and time obsessively reading reviews before decision.

Thank you kindly.

whatever one you decide, definitely get diamond tip, not the sandpaper circles, those are a pain

Are you taking Nori for walks? Leash training is so important and, as a bonus, walking a dog on sidewalks really cuts down on how often you have to trim their claws. Throughout my dog's life, we'd only have to trim his dewclaws because we walked so much.

My guy was a lab-pitbull -- if you want some idea of how Nori will look as a grownup.

Awww Sylvia, what a cute guy, looks like a happy fella- what's his name?

R339 Seamus, and he really was the best-natured dog I've ever known. We had to let him go on Jan 31; he was 14, but in the photo above he was around 7 or 8.

OP I would love it if you record the Pip and Squidge Nightly Floor Show and post it. Sounds highly entertaining.

R338/SylviaFowler, she took to the harness relatively quickly, but she HATES the leash, and actually runs from it when she sees it in my or my sister's hand.

I do want to start walking her so she has more exercise options than just running around our large fenced yard, but I'm a bit concerned she'd tug free and run off. Or is that not a valid fear?

r342 I use this!

That looks fantastic, rescue-chick/R343, especially since I have nerve damage in both hands (and joint damage in the rt hand) and my manual dexterity can be a day-to-day thing. Plus, summer's only just begun, but it is hotter than Hades where I am, with very high humidity, so slippery hands are a strong possibility.

You're a peach, girl--THANK YOU!

I do a double leash, one on her collar and one with the waist thing because I get so anxious of lose dogs and needing my hands. I only use the ruffwear brand because in over 15 years I have never had an item from 5them fail or wear out. I like it because winter and ice too.

Be sure to get a baby pool, if you haven't already, OP. So much fun to watch the discovery and play

unless it's my asshole dog. she doesn't swim, chase a ball or a stick. she sunbathes. that's it.

I am selling the chicken coop I got her because she can sunbath next to the pool that is only used by the raccoons just fine on her tree run. (if you do get a pool, be sure to put a mosquito dunk in it!)

Lay a board or something inside for chipmunks can climb out. Mine lasted maybe 2 days before I saw that.

Nori was such a good girl a little bit ago when I leashed her and walked her a short distance (1/3 mile). For the first 1/8 she REFUSED to walk, bu I wasn't quitting, so eventually she realized it and started walking... grudgingly, but she did it.

We'll go again this evening.

If she's scared of a leash it might be because she was hit with one by her evil former owner.

You know, R350, that exact suspicion has crossed my mind repeatedly over the last three weeks; her extreme fear doesn't make sense otherwise.

I hate bipeds.

r351, if she continues to be tough to get walking you can try a few things. I know I might be sounding like a ruffwear shill but they have 2 harnesses that I strongly recommend. They are the webmaster and the flagline. they have handles.

The webmaster was originally designed to lower search and rescue dogs from helicopters. they're indestructible (unless chewed), perfectly comfortable when lifted and I have never had a dog escape one (I mostly have used the webmaster).

I have had dogs who were TERRIFIED of walks. so, one hand grasps the handle and just start walking while the other hand entices with treats. Just keep walking, they have no choice but to walk when you have the handle. I also use them for reactive or medical dogs.

rescue-chick you are a wonderful resource.

just let me know when it crosses the line to obnoxious. it's my passion and I can't always tell- I promise not to be offended!

that's me at 354