THEATRE GOSSIP #589: The "Real Women Get Tony Nominations" Edition

Here's the previous thread.

[quote]I thought Helen J. Shen was fantastic in MHE. I was expecting a nomination.

I was glad that Helen Highwater wasn't nominated.

What a repugnant thread title, OP. You’ve already ruined this thread. Someone should start another.

[quote]You’ve already ruined this thread.

R3 has spoken, everyone!

Is this title a direct attack on Jinx Monsoon and Bianca Leigh?

It's MAGA-approved, R5. Like the new Kennedy Center.

Who is the OP of this thread? JK?

Y'all survived "THEATRE GOSSIP #482: Jerry Herman dragged his crippled ass to the Kennedy Center Honors and so can Liza", and you'll survive this thread title too.

Also, "Is this title a direct attack on Jinx Monsoon"? Hmmmmmmm.....

Is someone making fun of me?

Keep punching down, OP.

I thought Helen Shen was tres ordinaire in “Maybe Happy Ending.” Nasal voice and no stage presence. I’m not surprised she made little impression during what turned out to be a strong theater season,

"Redwood" closing on May 18th.

TIMBER!!

By the end of next week, I predict there will be at least 3 more closing announcements.

Encores' WONDERFUL TOWN is getting eviscerated by the chat rooms and critics.

Conga!

Back to Mia Farrow.. she was robbed of an Oscar nomination for Rosemary's Baby. She was extraordinary and the film would not have worked as well without her. She's in every scene. Some say Sinatra used his muscle to shut her out.

Which muscle?

What is the consensus of the word-of-mouth, R15?

[quote]I was glad that Helen Highwater wasn't nominated.

I'm upset that Magdalena Montezuma was snubbed for her star turn in "Buena Vista Social Club."

Word of mouth and critics seem to agree on Wonderful Town that the director completely misunderstands the material and the 3 leads, though talented, are all miscast.

Three leads in WONDERFUL TOWN? Besides Ruth and Eileen, who's the third one? The guy who falls in love with Eileen?

When I heard that Ruth is ENJOYING her Conga dance with the Brazilian sailors, I knew this production was very misguided.

Leave it to the expert...

I was lucky enough to see Donna Murphy in Wonderful Town and that was a terrific production. Even dull Greg Edelman was good and Murphy gave an unforgettable performance. She got every laugh and her battle with a pullout sofa was hilarious. Conga was pure joy and a great way to close out the first act. Ah, memories.

Conga closes out the first act, r24? That's news to me.

Saw the invited dress of Wonderful Town. (at least the first act!) It was dreadful. Yes, the director had no idea what to do, and his rethinking of the material was to put two ladies of color in the leads and add extra people to the solos and duets. And everyone but Anika Noni Rose was pushing SO HARD. I wanted to shoot the guy who opened the show as the tour guide and the woman who played Helen. Unfortunately, although she gave a very nice performance, Anika was completely miscast. Lear's choices for most of the seasons she was Artistic Director of was awful, other than the shows she directed herself.

[quote]Encores' WONDERFUL TOWN is getting eviscerated by the chat rooms and critics.

I've seen every Encores! production since the beginning, except for one that I missed by accident and another, THE LIFE, that I purposely missed because what I had heard about the production in pre-publicity made me think I would become very upset if I sat through it. And I didn't even consider getting a ticket for WONDERFUL TOWN because it sounded like it was going to be another misfire. It sure seems like I made the right choice in both of those cases.

THE LIFE was by far the worst Encores show (thank you, Billy Porter) but there have been a few other stinkers. IRMA LA DOUCE, 70 GIRLS 70, and DUBARRY WAS A LADY come to mind.

Any word on the Billy Porter “Cabaret”? Is this the same production that I saw Jake Shears in on the West End?

"Conga" from the 2003 Donna Murphy revival:

[quote]THE LIFE was by far the worst Encores show (thank you, Billy Porter) but there have been a few other stinkers. IRMA LA DOUCE, 70 GIRLS 70, and DUBARRY WAS A LADY come to mind.

I agree with you about IRMA and 70 GIRLS, but I remember DUBARRY being a fine production with a good cast.

Roz was better

[quote]Roz was better

That's the problem with a star vehicle that is so tailored to its original star.

[quote]Three leads in WONDERFUL TOWN? Besides Ruth and Eileen, who's the third one? The guy who falls in love with Eileen?

The third lead would be Bob Baker, the guy who falls in love with Ruth, not Eileen.

I think all of us Dataloungers in New York should meet outside the Nederlander at 6 and make a Tik Tok of all of us shouting TIM-BER!!!!!!!!!!

Of course, nothing will match the greatness of Cole Escola releasing a Tik Tok of Mary Todd Lincoln with the "sunset" megaphone singing "shoo fly pie" as the audience BOOOOOOOs. That deserves a Tony.

Of all the Lead Actor in a Musical nominees, I would give it to Jeremy Jordan. I don’t get the Just in Time love. Jonathan Groff is basically playing Jonathan Groff.

Which is precisely the point, r36.

Yes, but R36 is right — I don’t doubt that Groff sings up a storm and is very charming, that’s evident in the clip from the “Just in Time” number on the Colbert show.

But isn’t that a concert performance rather than an acting AND singing performance that one might give in a standard jukebox musical or musical bio?

If he’s that great then give him a special Tony, don’t say he’s giving one of the best performances in a musical where he’s playing himself, Jonathan Groff, explaining how he understands and identifies with Darin’s love of performing. That’s not acting. It’s a one man show, which is something else.

Wasn't Hugh basically playing himself in Boy From Oz?

I really want Nicole Scherzinger to win because I so enjoy learning all about her many feelings.

R39. A gay man? Yes.

I think Sunset is a lock for Best Direction of a Musical and I think they’ll want to give Sunset an acting win as well. I’m betting on Nicole. Audra has enough Tonys and this Gypsy production is a bomb.

Isn't Nicole just really playing herself?

I still say Tom Francis is going to take Best Actor.

At this point, it's a toss-up between Jordan and Groff.

Why is Darren Criss suddenly out of contention??

I don’t think he is entirely, R46, but compared to the high emotion and big voices being delivered by Jordan and Groff, Criss’s disciplined, amusing and touching performance in a charming-but-wispy musical might not live in the memory as easily as what the other two actors are delivering.

Personally, I’m rooting for Jeremy Jordan, who is great in a unique musical. Despite the busy ensemble around him, his dignity, passion and fine vocals dominate the show.

They can take care of Criss by giving Maybe Happy Ending best musical.

I think colorblind casting is essential to the moment…however, it’s detrimental to cast people of color JUST because they are people of color and NOT because they are the right person for the role.

It ends up being a bad production when you miscast people just because you HAVE to and not because they are the best person for the role.

A good example is The Last Five Years. Adrienne Warren is very talented and was good casting for Cathy. The fact that she is black adds to the character and she brings that to the performance to winning results.

Anika Noni Rose as Ruth does…not.

R47, I like your analysis. How much do you think having just won last year will weigh against Groff? If anything, I think that may be what tips the win in Jordan’s favor — i.e., voters may view this as the perfect opportunity to reward Jordan, a seasoned performer who’s never won a Tony before, versus giving a second one to Groff (as great as he may be).

As for Criss, I think his best hope might be if MHE sweeps (including best musical) and he’s able to go along for the ride.

Thank you R30 - that Conga clip was so much fun - and on the money!

Get hep...

How do you feel about Broadway Rose? Or Broadway rows??

What does that refer to in Conga!?

r53:

What's your opinion of women's clothes

Major Bowes

Steinbeck's prose

How do you feel about Broadway roles?

Really?? Roles doesn't rhyme with the others.

I wondered if Broadway Rose was some gossip columnist from the 1930s.

If you had seen the show, R38, you might feel differently. JUST IN TIME is a weird hybrid where Groff is playing himself at the beginning and in certain moments thereafter, but he actually plays the role of Darin through much of the show, and aside from all the singing (and dancing), there are many book scenes where good acting is absolutely required. In fact, I would argue that excellent acting is required for those scenes, because so much of the show's book is quite awful.

[quote]Really??

That's what Google told me, r55. Take it up with them.

The Tonys are actually quite interesting this year because there's lot of good competition.

Of course, the voters could be very lazy and just vote for the obvious.

Google lies, on occasion.

[quote]How do you feel about Broadway Rose?

Broadway Danny Rose?

Whoever does win the Tony for Best Actor in a Musical, I can't imagine they'll win by a wide margin, considering how tough the competition is. But of course, the public is never told how many votes the winner won by.

Broadway Rose

Broadway Rose according to Wikipedia. Comden and Green probably meant the first one.

R62 beat me to it

Once again, Cole Escola does Bernadette Peters.

r62, thank you for uncovering the mystery.

Hard to imagine Comden & Green couldn't come up with a 4th rhyme for clothes, Bowes and prose. I guess back in the 1950s sophisticated Broadway audiences would still get that 1930s/40s reference.

The Tonys aren’t big on consecutive winners like the Emmys. There are rare exceptions for great talents like Laurie Metcalf and Judith Light. Groff is very well liked in the theater community and I won’t be surprised if he does a back to back win. On the other hand, I could see some people being annoyed with a second Groff win considering how great the competition is this year as well as the fact that not everybody was crazy about his Merrily win.

My favorite Cole video

There are fewer consecutive year Tony winners because it's rare for an actor, star or not, to be fortunate enough to get 2 truly great roles within a couple of years. I guess the same could be said for Oscars.

Emmys obviously are different because the consecutive year wins are usually for playing the same role in the same series.

Oscars are at the whim of a studio’s release schedule.

Cole for play and actor!

[quote]I could see some people being annoyed with a second Groff win considering how great the competition is this year as well as the fact that not everybody was crazy about his Merrily win.

I have never heard of anyone begrudging him that award.

Pee Pee Manor

Boring

I tend to agree with you, R50, that Groff’s Tony last season makes a win for him this time seem less likely. That and the fact that Jordan hasn’t won a Tony yet and helped make an unexpected hit out of “Gatsby” last season (though it’s still doing well without him) gives him an edge, I think.

But “Just in Time” looks to be a hit while “Floyd Collins” does not, so how might that factor in? I tend to think that too will favor Jordan. “Floyd Collins” is arty and demanding, and not commercial but Jordan gives it a heart and soul, while Groff would have the consolation of another hit for as long as as he wants to run in it. Jordan is showing he can topline a big musical, and Broadway may want to find one for him now.

But Criss, Durand and Francis are all good enough to have been shoo-ins in a weaker year, so it’s a real horse race.

What the hell is going on with the trashy audiences going to see Hell's Kitchen? I've heard stories of brawls, people bringing take out dinners in with them, singing along, talking and arguing during the show, and trashy audiences grabbing at actors as they leave the stage door. Where the fuck are the hired security guards? I wouldn't go the show now if they were giving tix out for free.

R76 = Patti LuPone

R76. What's the problem?

A quiet week ahead.

MONDAY -- Hugh Jackman promotes his Radio City Music Hall residency on Good Morning America and The View (it's close enough to Broadway to count); also, George Clooney on Late Night with Seth Meyers

TUESDAY -- Jonathan Groff and Gracie Lawrence on Late Night with Seth Meyers

R51 here's the same performance (sans costumes) for "press day" (2003).

Groff is utterly mediocre in Just in Time. A plump chorus boy singin & dancin—and nothing like Bobby Darin in the least.

Two years ago, Sean Hayes won the Tony for playing Oscar Levant, whom he was nothing like at all.

I think it’s brave of Groff to dance like that with his middle-aged spread. Apparently it’s in solidarity with Beanie.

Last night I saw the first “Conga” that was not a showstopper. So many misguided moments. It was not as bad as Billy Porter’s THE LIFE, though. That production will probably remain Encores’ worst ever.

Well, r84, I walked out of both of them at intermission.

The previous Wonderful Town was great —Murphy was absolutely zany and fantastic. I was looking forward to this version. Oh well

I’m voting for Audra over Nicole. She’s the greatest Rose I’ve ever seen and that deserves recognition. Sure she has a ton of Tonys but what she does with this role is special.

Yes Nicole has a great voice and does tons of histrionics but it’s not a role that has a ton of emotional variety.

I love this hot theatre daddy, Matthew Hardy.

Who’s had him?

Here's some of Brooke Shields in WONDERFUL TOWN after she replaced Donna Murphy.

[quote]I’m voting for Audra over Nicole.

Are you a Tony voter? If so, what are your other choices.

What happened to Kathleen Marshall's career? She used to be a mainstay director/choreographer at Roundabout, Encores. and on Broadway. She directed and choreographed that Donna Murphy Wonderful Town you're all going on about. While she may never have been brilliant or innovative, she got the job done far better than Scott Ellis and Rob Ashford. At least she understood those old classic musicals.

Seeing those Roz clips reminds me that Ken Mandelbaum wrote that she received the best collective raves he'd ever seen for a Broadway musical performance.. I can believe it.

I’d like to take care of Criss, r48. With my mouth.

R93: Ew...

Thanks R80 that was even more fun up close.

Oh R89 interesting.....Brooke certainly made it look more choregraphed than spontaneous ....but still fun.

On this week's "Elsbeth," featuring DL fave Billy Magnussen as the murderer-of-the-week, there were a few fun Broadway references. Billy's character was a spoiled super-rich guy who's bored with everything and has a bizarre bucket list of things that he hopes will cure his ennui. His friend/sidekick mentions that he's already scored with a woman at the Oscars so he suggests trying another awards show, like the Tonys. Billy says that he HAS a Tony (as a producer, of course) and says he was up there on stage. His friend points out there were 30 other producers and he was not on stage but in the lobby. but Billy protests, "but on camera!"

Later on Elsbeth gets arrested, and her first reaction is, "But I have tickets for 'Oh, Mary!'"

R82-WHAT? Are you inferring Oscar Levant didn't sound like Jimmy Stewart when he spoke?

R91, I don't agree that Kathleen Marshall was any better than Ashford or Ellis. Her work on GREASE was particularly bad. Oh, and NICE WORK IF YOU CAN GET IT.

I’m pulling for an Audra win. If only to let Trumper Nicole learn a lesson about being a duplicitous cunt.

Besides, Nicole has two big songs. And while she belts the shit out of them, she isn’t acting. Audra is giving one of the finest performances I’ve ever seen. It’s revelatory.

Do we think that what's happened to Hugh Jackman's face in recent years is just the result of the natural aging process, or has he had some sort of awful wasting disease? To me, he doesn't just look old, he looks ill.

Her choreography can be workmanlike, but there have been other times when Kathleen Marshall delivered. In particular, I really liked her "Hernando's Hideaway" in the 2006 revival of The Pajama Game. Extra credit for Paula Leggett Chase's crazy stage crosses upstage of Harry Connick Jr. at the seven-minute mark.

I thought Marshall's "Too Darn Hot" was far better than the more recent version, and I loved her work on ANYTHING GOES too. Underrated.

Her choreography can be workmanlike, but there have been other times when Kathleen Marshall delivered.

Her choreography is one thing, her direction is another. And "Too Darn Hot" makes zero sense as a production number, regardless of who choreographs it.

Evita not selling in London and Zegler is being labeled box office poison.

Both leads out of Death Becomes Her this afternoon.

NEWSNATIONNOW IS TRUMPFOX!!!!!!!!!!

[quote]Both leads out of Death Becomes Her this afternoon.

Incredible. What is going on there?

R105 I'm afraid of what they'll do to EVITA.

Eva Perón is the villain of the piece (and in real life) whom Che tries to warn us about.

R107. Oh dear. If that's true then I do apologize for posting that link.

I have no idea if it is, R110. I'm just being DataLoungey today. Yard work time ....

I was hoping Evita would transfer to NYC (I was born way after 1980 and was too young even for the 2012 revival) so this would be my first chance to see it. But I think they need to replace Rachel unless she gets amazing review/Olivier award.

I saw Audra and I’m sorry but I disagree on it being the best performance. I saw a bootleg of Patti and, to me, for me, that was the performance to watch.

From Jesse Green's largely negative New York Times review of the Encores! WONDERFUL TOWN:

[quote]After a pushy “Urinetown,” a baffling “Love Life” and now this “Wonderful Town,” one cannot say that 2025 has been the standout Encores! season that 2024 was. It happens. But even without a high point of praise, we can hail the outgoing artistic director, Lear deBessonet, as she moves, after five years, to her new position as artistic director at Lincoln Center Theater. What she’s done in those five years has been, regardless of hits or misses, nothing short of rejuvenating, finding in the series’ peculiar mission some of the quirky spark and community spirit that gave rise to American musical theater in the first place.

"Regardless of hits or misses?" Really??!! What a strange summation.

URINETOWN was dome well enough but was unnecessarily revived. I didn’t find LOVE LIFE “baffling,” I was happy to hear and see it. WONDERFUL TOWN is tonight, and I’ve drastically lowered my expectations, the reviews make it seem like the poor conceptualization and direction are to blame.

It’ll be interesting to see if the new artistic director tales Encores! back to basics.

Flops that no one here even remembers?

My Encores wishlist: Over Here!, Goodtime Charley and DL Fave TPOS (aka They're Playing Our Song).

All the theater references and performers in Elspeth shouldn't come as a surprise. The showrunner iis Jon Tolins (BUYER AND CELLAR), who's a theater queen of the first order.

My Encores wishlist would include, off the top of my head: Seesaw, I Love My Wife and Hollywood/Ukraine.

If they were to do Seesaw, r118, would they do the original or the tour version?

[Quote] Are you a Tony voter? If so, what are your other choices.

I’ve said too much already

I’d take one from r116 (Over Here) and one from r118 (Seesaw) and add the Mame that’s never really going to get a Broadway revival (or, alternatively, Jerry Herman’s Milk and Honey, which might suddenly feel timely?

I'd see MILK AND HONEY if they didn't cast Andrea Martin in the Molly Picon role.

M&H

Tommy Rall had such a great voice for a dancer.

I'm sure Adam and Amanda Green and the Bernstein kids were thrilled to read Jesse Green's pronouncement today that WONDERFUL TOWN is no longer producible.

Well, he did like the music, it was the book he thought was dated.

But you can't produce the show without the book.

And of course, the book is dated, specifically 1935.

Roz's first Oscar nom...

My Encores! wishlist: Mame, They're Playing Our Song, and Smile.

The Encores! mission: doing musicals poorly, and then somehow, the dire result is always the show's fault.

That would be pathetic if they did They’re Playing Our Song. It already had 1,082 performances on Broadway and that was about 1,000 too many.

I’d rather they did Sarava. With Tovah!

Milk and Honey would be good. Plus High Spirits and Fade Out, Fade In.

Milk and Honey is about Israel so…..

"Silk Stockings"---Cole Porter's last Broadway musical. Brooks Atkinson in the NY Times called it the best musical since "Guys and Dolls."

Carrie.

Bajour!

Julie Benko IS Sonia Walsk. No. Really. She is.

Over Here! is a forgotten gem. Megan Hilty and Jennifer Simard could play the DePaul sisters with Sutton Foster as Mitzi, the Nazi spy.

Simply Heavenly

City of Angels -- but I'd prefer a full revival.

Wonderful Town did not feel dated 20 years ago with the wonderful Donna Murphy production. It’s this crappy production—specifically its director, choreographer, and miscast actors—who failed the material.

A little early, R136, but no less welcome.

[quote]Megan Hilty and Jennifer Simard could play the DePaul sisters

Producers might want to cast performers who actually show up for performances.

Sounds like Jesse Green is saying they didn’t get the pauses right.

How about an all Jerry Herman season at Encores? His flops Mack & Mabel and Dear World both made fun Encores evenings. I’d vote for Mame (with Donna Murphy), Milk and Honey, and (pick one) The Grand Tour, Day in Hollywood (partial Herman score) or La Cage with its full orchestra.

Actually both Dear World and Mack & Mabel sucked at Encores. They put nails in the coffin of “These would make great Bway revivals!”

[quote] They put nails in the coffin of “These would make great Bway revivals!”

That was never what Encores was about. Chicago was a fluke success, repeated later with lesser successes like Finian’s Rainbow and Wonderful Town.

Knowing next to nothing about it beforehand, I loved "Dear World" at Encores. Strange show.

I was also very disappointed in the Encores' Mack & Mabel. I loved the show on Broadway. Well, actually in its LA tryout, I never saw it on Broadway.

Thank you, R147. Encores! began as a series of opportunities to hear Broadway scores unlikely to receive a full revival, and hear them with full orchestra and company. I've been to nine of them over the years -- BYE BYE BIRDIE (2004), FOLLIES (2007), APPLAUSE (2008), JUNO (2008), ANYONE CAN WHISTLE (2010), LITTLE ME (2014), 1776 (2016), THE GOLDEN APPLE (2017) and I MARRIED AN ANGEL (2019) -- and have always had a great time, even when the material wasn't much worth reviving (APPLAUSE) or the presentation was less than ideal (I MARRIED AN ANGEL).

Why they've done "revivals" like FIORELLO!, CALL ME MADAM and the present WONDERFUL TOWN beggars the imagination, when there are countless worthy titles that they haven't even ventured once. I for one wish that they'd include some shows that are otherwise unlikely to be heard on Broadway with their original orchestrations: SHE LOVES ME . . . ON THE 20TH CENTURY . . . A LITTLE NIGHT MUSIC . . . CANDIDE . . . etc., etc. (Imagine if they could persuade the Bernstein estate to let them do the full CANDIDE score as heard when it opened on Broadway.)

The thing about Encores is you need truly experienced directors in musical comedy (like Kathleen Marshall), who know the material, get the style, have done their research on the history of the show.

There's not enough time in 2 weeks of rehearsals to re-invent the show. No time with only 2 days of full tech to refine the choreography, sets, costumes, lights and sound, nor the performances. All the collaborators need to know what they're doing.

The talk around Mack and Mabel has always been “It’s his greatest score: It just needs a new production. Everyone will love it and it will become a huge hit.” Well, Encores gave it a shot—Herman had always refused Encores because he wanted a full Bway production. When no production was in sight, Encores was finally okayed. Well, it still stinks as a show.

As will all the Herman’s shows, the books just meander. Even Hello, Dolly!, which we see perennially because Bway divas want to play her, has such a dated book.

R153 Midler's Dolly was the first full Broadway production in decades and the first one without Carol Channing in nearly 50 years.

I think you're confusing Dolly with Gypsy.

Dear World

[quote]It’s his greatest score

Who has said that, r152?

I will never understand DL's undying love for the utterly mediocre "They're Playing Our Song."

Ben Jones sings "Kiss Her Now" from Dear World at 54 Below...

Beautiful!

Christ, was WONDERFUL TOWN terrible. The director was in way over his head and his approach was all wrong for the material. Misconceived and miscast from beginning to end. Well, beginning to middle — we walked out at intermission. There is no excuse for the complete lack of professionalism on that stage tonight. Major parts were fumbled by mediocre hack actors.

And there wasn’t a single looker in the male chorus. Now, I ask you!

[quote]Why they've done "revivals" like FIORELLO!, CALL ME MADAM and the present WONDERFUL TOWN beggars the imagination

It seems very clear that WONDERFUL TOWN was done again by Encores! specifically as a showcase for POC performers. That was their reason, I'm sure, whether or not any of us agree that it was a good reason.

R153, there's nothing "meandering" about the book of HELLO, DOLLY! What a weird comment.

hmmm

I'm not sure how I feel about this

[Quote] Who has said that, [R152]?

Herman himself said it many times. He felt M&M was his best score

[Quote] there's nothing "meandering" about the book of HELLO, DOLLY! What a weird comment.

It totally meanders with extraneous lines and scenes. The movie at least was able to tighten it up a bit

"I will never understand DL's undying love for the utterly mediocre "They're Playing Our Song.""

Robert Klein looked like he had Bell's Palsy while singing.

[quote]Robert Klein looked like he had Bell's Palsy while singing.

I once made a similar comment on DL (without specifically mentioning Bell's palsy) and was raked over the coals for it.

[quote]It totally meanders with extraneous lines and scenes. The movie at least was able to tighten it up a bit

R164, both of your statements about the book of HELLO, DOLLY! are false, and if anything, the movie expands rather than tightens the book of the stage musical.

You were right, R166. And it looks like he's doing it on purpose.

[quote]I once made a similar comment on DL (without specifically mentioning Bell's palsy) and was raked over the coals for it.

It was a kindler, gentler Datalounge, r166.

[Quote] both of your statements about the book of HELLO, DOLLY! are false, and if anything, the movie expands rather than tightens the book of the stage musical.

I’ve seen both and the movie certainly expands the scene but cuts out the extraneous parts of the play

[Quote] I’ve seen both

It’s a gay forum. That’s understood.

Saw Boop, loved Boop, and the Tony nominators practically ignored it. Death Becomes Her is a total shitshow and they heap praise on it. I hope DBH gets completely shut out.

[quote]I’ve seen both and the movie certainly expands the scene but cuts out the extraneous parts of the play

Since you've now stated this twice, can you give some examples of "extraneous" scenes in the book of the stage musical of HELLO, DOLLY! I would say the only scenes that could be thought of as extraneous are the scenes with Ernestina, and I think there's more of her in the movie than in the show.

[quote]Since you've now stated this twice, can you give some examples of "extraneous" scenes in the book of the stage musical of HELLO, DOLLY!

The songs.

CBS did a wonderful profile of Cole this morning. Never knew about their rough childhood. Makes me like them even more.

How many Coles are there?

[quote]Herman himself said it many times. He felt M&M was his best score

Plain or Peanut?

[quote] How many Coles are there?

Wells ya got ya Nat King Cole and Old King Cole and RC Cole and....

[quote] The talk around Mack and Mabel has always been “It’s his greatest score: It just needs a new production. Everyone will love it and it will become a huge hit.” Well, Encores gave it a shot

The shot Encores gave it was with two miscast leads with zero star quality (and Doug Sills looked fat and ancient). It got a shot, but not a fair one.

I would not rank MACK AND MABEL among the huge misfires at Encores! I thought it was a fine production, though certainly not one of their best.

[quote]The talk around Mack and Mabel has always been “It’s his greatest score: It just needs a new production.

Jerry and who else, r163?

"Tap Your Troubles Away" on the original cast album of "M&M" is sung by Lisa Kirk who also originated the role of Bianca in "Kiss Me Kate" and dubbed Roz Russell in "Gypsy".

Saint Aloysius!

While I'd agree that Doug Sills was a very disappointing Mack, I'm not sure I'd say he was miscast. He just didn't seem into it, like he knew it was a lousy production and wasn't giving anything.

I can't even remember who played Lottie. Was it Emily Skinner?

[quote]Lisa Kirk who also originated the role of Bianca in "Kiss Me Kate"

Lois Lane, r182.

[quote]Wells ya got ya Nat King Cole and Old King Cole and RC Cole and....

Natalie Cole, Tina Cole, Dennis Cole, Cole Porter, England Dan and John Ford Coley and ...

Beautiful, clean Cole.

I always thought in the original Mack & Mabel that Mary McCarty, who'd just made a big comeback in Follies, should have played Lottie. She was a perfect fit if they'd played her based on Marie Dressler. And she would have killed Tap Your Troubles Away. Lisa Kirk brought nothing but Lisa Kirk.

[quote]r188 = Lisa Kirk brought nothing but Lisa Kirk.

And Mary McCarty would have brought nothing but Mary McCarty. What's your point?

She was a shitty writer, too.

I enjoyed the Mack and Mabel at Encores, not great but better than a lot of them, and a thousand times better than the wreck playing there right now.

In the stage version of HD, Ernestina doesn't appear until the beginning of Act II and is there for comic relief during the Harmonia Gardens sequence. She has all of about ten lines.

r192 Would've been the perfect part for Beanie Feldstein.

Lilli Cooper played Lottie in Mack & Mabel at Encores. The biggest disappointment was Alexandra Socha as Mabel.

[Quote] Since you've now stated this twice, can you give some examples of "extraneous" scenes in the book of the stage musical of HELLO, DOLLY! I would say the only scenes that could be thought of as extraneous are the scenes with Ernestina, and I think there's more of her in the movie than in the show.

The scene when she’s talking to her dead first husband goes on a bit too long in the play. In the movie, it’s dispatched with two lines. Also, the scene with her playing with food in the play is unnecessary.

Beanie is Mame!

^^^^ Yes, by adding a totally unnecessary song for Babs: Love Is Only Love

[quote]^^^^ Yes, by adding a totally unnecessary song for Babs: Love Is Only Love

Which was cut from MAME. They added *two* songs for Ethel.

Douglas Sills was a fine Mack in the 2000 Reprise! L.A. "Mack & Mabel," opposite a well-cast Jane Krakowski (Kristin Chenoweth was announced for it first). Twenty years later in Encores! "Mack and Mabel," Sills was no longer in peak voice and did seem a bit tired.

Kristen would have been adorable. Yes, r199, good role for Jane.

Tailor-made for Datalounge:

People often leave Lavin out of the conversation but she was the only replacement casting for Rose in a Broadway production and played the tile for 5 months.

Did anybody see Linda Lavin’s performance?

It's okay to have a dysfunctional relationship at the heart of your musical if your show addresses it in a reasonably emotional intelligent way. Mack and Mabel just papers it over with sentimental cliches.

r202...

You forgot Cheryl Cole, R186.

Alice Rose

And Cole Escola.

And Cole Slaw.

[Quote] Did anybody see Linda Lavin’s performance?

I saw her on some televised award show. I actually loved her performance. It was the first time I realized the songs in Gypsy had melodies. I was so used to the Merman barking on the OBC.

Actually Beanie would have been a great princess in Once Upon a Mattress

Beanie would make a great Cole Escola in Oh Mary

Is she a Mary or an Abe?

I think she's more of a Buddy.

[quote]The scene when she’s talking to her dead first husband goes on a bit too long in the play. In the movie, it’s dispatched with two lines.

If you're talking about the speech to her dead husband just prior to "Before the Parade Passes By," what you wrote is completely inaccurate, but thanks for trying. That speech is nearly identical in length in both the show and the movie.

[quote]Also, the scene with her playing with food in the play is unnecessary.

When played properly, as it was by Carol Channing, Ethel Merman, Bette Midler, Bernadette Peters, Donna Murphy, and others, that scene is a comic tour-de-force in the stage version of the show.

A video exists of Linda Lavin's complete performance in GYPSY. I thought she was wonderful in the role, despite Frank Rich's nasty pan of her performance.

The libretto of "Hello, Dolly" originated in an 1830s English one-act which became an Austrian farce which became a Thornton Wilder play which served as the basis for the musical. So it's a well traveled and resilient property, though certainly not an up to date one.

Beyond all the sneering about wokeness and DEI the fact is the culture has changed in fundamental ways that means certain shows and traditional ways of playing them run a considerable risk of giving the public the ick, as the kids say.

Agreed, R217, but I don't think that applies to HELLO, DOLLY! or even to WONDERFUL TOWN.

Maybe they're just too old fashioned and boring for youthful contemporary audiences. It happens.

I saw Lavin. She used an Irish brogue and stomped her feet a lot. Very little charm and, believe it or not, I preferred Tyne Daly's vocals. She also had zero chemistry with Jonathan Hadary. She was an angry, screechy Rose. And I say this as a fan.

How were her pauses?

[quote]How were her pauses?

Meno-

Beanie would be the perfect Gooch.

Give me a Gooch where you get a more dramatic transformation, r223.

"Why, Agnes, you *do* have a bust!"

[Quote] When played properly, as it was by Carol Channing, Ethel Merman, Bette Midler, Bernadette Peters, Donna Murphy, and others, that scene is a comic tour-de-force in the stage version of the show.

It’s slapstick crap that slows the plot. Yes, it can be funny, but it can also easily be cut to tighten the show

winning x 4

This new WONDERFUL TOWN is very far from wonderful, and I think now most of the cast knows it. There sure were a LOT of empty seats at Friday night's performance, and that number increased after the intermission.

Anika Noni Rose is totally miscast and misdirected. After this and her terrible performance (miscast, again) in UNCLE VANYA, it's imperative that she find something that suits her talents, and a director that gets them. She's so damn talented. I had hopes that CARMEN JONES would transfer to Broadway in 2018, but that obviously never happened. What a revival that was, and Rose killed it.

If that central miscasting were the only issue, the show might be worth seeing. But it's actually one of the show's more minor problems. It drags when it should zip, many of the performances are subpar, and a lot of the numbers just clunk about. It's readily apparent that the director does not understand this show. Nor does the choreographer. And damn, I now realize how brilliant Donna Murphy was when she did this two decades ago. I couldn't stop thinking about her performance as this leaden revival carried on.

The evening is not a total loss. That score is glorious, and the Encores! orchestra sounds great, and when the entire chorus stands still and sings together, magic threatens to occur.

[quote]I saw Lavin. She used an Irish brogue and stomped her feet a lot. Very little charm and, believe it or not, I preferred Tyne Daly's vocals.

At least Tyne didn't scat during "Rose's Turn."

R226 would cut Over The Rainbow from The Wizard of Oz.

Preston looks very porno in R227’s clip.

Was the Tony nominating committee unfair to Redwood?

Would Redwood have faired better if Ming Cho Lee were still alive?

Can those LED screens be repurposed elsewhere?

How did they ever raise $16M to do this show? Like, how long would it have had to run to recoup that? 18 mths - 2 years?

We mourn Redwood.

Said no one.

Yes, R226, that bit can easily be cut to tighten the show, but one could say the same about most or all of the songs in any musicals, plus I've never thought of HELLO, DOLLY! as overlong. You seem obsessed with the length of the show, which is weird, because there are so many others that really are overlong and could and should easily be cut.

Looks like Cole will exiting right after the Tonys.

R228: Anika Noni Rose was terrible as Maggie in “Cat on a Hot Tin Roof,” the worst production of that play I’ve seen in any medium.

Broadways new Roxie Hart is taking tonite off to attend the Met Gala. Such dedication.

It'll be interesting to see who plays Mary for the last eight weeks after Titus.

The Tony Committee will see a show months ago and then see these new ones that just get under the gun and are fresh and they win The Tony.

Back when they were a thing, how were show doctors paid? Was it just a flat rate or did they get any kind of royalty? And did they get credits?

Show doctors rarely if ever got credit (most didn't want credit) and the fees were usually a flat rate, no royalty.

One of the biggest problems with Broadway musicals today is there are no clever people - directors, writers or whatever - to call in when your show is in trouble. Is Stro going to call in Gattelli? Is Jerry Mitchell going to call in Stro? I don't think so.

r241 Thanks for the info!

I'd love to see Michael Urie as Mary Todd Lincoln.

Elliot Page and Laverne Cox would be amazing in Romeo & Juliet.

How so, r244?

I suspect r244 is striving for the coveted DL "Wit".

R243, I like that suggestion.

Who wrote the new lyrics in Wonderful Town? Some of the cultural references had been changed, like bell hooks subbing for Aristotle in that last revival of The Skin of Our Teeth.

R243 that is a genius suggestion......only on DL could one find an insight like that.

Someone suggested that Adolph Green's daughter Amanda might have tinkered with the lyrics. There's a mention of Langston Hughes in "Conga" that wasn't there before.

I thought I read that Eisa Davis was listed in the Encores' program with script updates. Perhaps that also included lyrics.

[quote]Who wrote the new lyrics in Wonderful Town? Some of the cultural references had been changed, like bell hooks subbing for Aristotle in that last revival of The Skin of Our Teeth.

They'd better keep their grubby little mitts off of "Beebe's bathysphere!"

[quote]They'd better keep their grubby little mitts off of "Beebe's bathysphere!"

Not to mention...

Adam Lambert will be Judas to Cynthia Erivo's Jesus at the Hollywood Bowl JCS

Whoever did Adam’s makeup and styling is the real Judas

The Cruella look is *so* passé.

r254 Shouldn't he be Mary Magdalene?

One positive thing you can say for the new Encores Wonderful Town is that it’s brought all the DL Theatre Gossipers together. Everyone is united in absolutely loathing it, a rare occurrence.

R257. Hey! That's MY role!

Did someone say LOATHING?

Linda Lavin is John Kerry as Mama Rose!

"Purpose" by Branden Jacobs-Jenkins wins the Pulitzer Prize for Drama.

The other finalists were "Oh, Mary!" by Cole Escola and "The Ally" by Itamar Moses.

[quote]The other finalists were "Oh, Mary!"

Maybe next year they can expand the award to consider some other SNL skits.

Who the hell wants to see ANY woman play Jesus (or Judas, for that matter) in JESUS CHRIST SUPERSTAR? Stop the madness!!!!!

Idina should go do "Oh, Mary".

She could use a hit.

Do y'all think Oh Mary will get a London production?

A tour?

And, what does Cole Escola do next? He's not exactly an easy to cast type. Can he write himself another hit or does that lightening only strike once?

I could see Cole getting some kind of sketch comedy show on HBO.

As long as his hair gets lightened only once.

I think that short where Cole plays the woman who has to sell the haunted house hints that he’s more than just a one-trick pony. At one point he plays several different people who confront the realtor at the house and he’s very good.

I don’t know what Oh Mary is like, but in several other female roles he’s playing a female, not a man in drag doing a campy version of a woman.

[quote] A tour?

He’ll probably play S.F. (for the gay crowd adulation) and L.A. (for the industry access) and leave the rest of it to someone else.

Nathan Lane in Oh, Mary?

Never thought I'd see Cole Escola that close to a Pulitzer.

I very much doubt Nathan Lane would get anywhere near someone else's goulash. What about John Early? Jinkx Monsoon? Amy Sedaris?

Billy Porter IS Mary!

[quote]Would Redwood have faired better if Ming Cho Lee were still alive?

It wouldn't have even fared better.

[quote]You ruminate over A Chorus Line poster (non-vintage!) in yer toilet? Braggart!

[quote] Well, if you really want to go there, I have the silver vintage original OBC poster one in my bedroom.

Oh Ladies, I have the DVD signed by Miss Audrey Landers, so there.

You win, r275.

[quote]Never thought I'd see Cole Escola that close to a Pulitzer.

Oh, I don't know -- he might have a few vintage Lilly Pulitzer frocks in his extensive wardrobe.

Rose Hovick stuns at the Met

R278, I will say it’s best she’s looked in a long time.

[quote]One positive thing you can say for the new Encores Wonderful Town is that it’s brought all the DL Theatre Gossipers together. Everyone is united in absolutely loathing it, a rare occurrence.

and I have I tickets to see it tomorrow...will suffer through 2.5 hours because I paid alot for these tickets

Audra's dress is ghastly.

Did she spill spaghetti all down the front?

[quote] Did she spill spaghetti all down the front?

She did. She was hungry during the intermission and walked to the nearby Italian restaurant. She ordered spaghetti with tomato sauce. She was so entranced by the taste that she almost forgot the second act was starting. She ran (with the spaghetti) and almost tripped. She spilled it all over her dress.

She was upset but the show must go on!

Pasta pause

R278, I'm so glad you didn't call her mama Rose

That is a very judiciously placed mega-peplum on r278.

If you can't fix it, r285, feature it.

Pasta Rose.

Nicole and Tom at the Met Gala tonight. Nicole looks like a Hollywood bombshell and Tom is dreamy.

They have pasta at Chipotle?

Will Audra perform tomorrow?

I will say I was entranced by the color and overall look, I didn't even notice the spaghetti noodle front of her dress.

And I’m a Tony voter!

[quote]Audra's dress is ghastly.

R281 = Gloria Upson

R236,

I missed that production of CAT. Why was it so bad? Even with James Earl Jones as Big Daddy?

I will admit that after seeing the back-to-back performance bombs of UNCLE VANYA and WONDERFUL TOWN, I'm beginning to wonder if Rose actually has a very limited range. Your summation of her Maggie the Cat is only adding fuel to that fire.

THIS DAY IN BROADWAY HISTORY: In 1976, a revival of “The Pirates of Penzance” opened at the Uris Theatre.

Ragtime coming to Lincoln Center for 14 weeks from October to January.

Worst kept secret in the biz!

[QUOTE] They have pasta at Chipotle?

Yes, they do.

Groff sings " Beyond the Sea." Don't see anything of Darin, but he sounds good.

[quote]I will admit that after seeing the back-to-back performance bombs of UNCLE VANYA and WONDERFUL TOWN, I'm beginning to wonder if Rose actually has a very limited range. Y

I would say she does have quite a limited range, but there are still lots of roles she could play well if she could get herself cast in those rather than in roles she doesn't fit. I will say received a lot of praise for CARMEN JONES even though she was somewhat miscast in that part as well.

The new grosses are in.

I saw Just In Time over the weekend and had an absolute ball. Groff is having a blast and his joy is infectious. It’s ain’t Long Day’s Journey. It’s just fun and I can’t recommend it enough.

The logo for the new Ragtime is quite something.

Boop and Dead Outlaw might just limp to the Tonys. Real Women Have Curves will be out of here by Memorial Day.

Good Night and Good Luck hits 4M!

From those new grosses it looks like Just in Time is a smash hit.

Smash on the other hand, not so much. Or Real Women Have Curves and, erm, Floyd Collins.

Groff is going to win the Tony again. He’s minted.

R228: In Tennesee Williams’ “Cat on a Hot Tin Roof,” Big Daddy Pollitt is a poor Mississippi Delta sharecropper’s son at the turn of the century, who by sheer meanness, shrewdness and dirty dealing becomes a wealthy farmer and plantation owner by mid-century. When an all black cast was announced for a Broadway revival in 2008, there was grumbling about how impossible this would have been for a black family in the south at that time, and indeed, some pertinent dialogue rang false because of that, but as a lover of Williams plays, I was open-minded about the casting, and eager to see what they would do.

Debbie Allen directed and told the press she was proud of the fact that the cast would not be acting the poetic, incantatory dialogue in the usual way, but were aiming for a more realistic directness, or some such bullshit. This was the first clue that Allen didn’t know what she was doing, and fundamentally misunderstood the essence of the play. The beauty and rhythm of Williams words and lines, his poetic cadences, are crucial to any good production, as much as in Shakespeare, I think. Of course she may have had to work around the shortcomings of her cast, maybe especially the relatively inexperienced Terrence Howard.

These days, the part of Big Daddy is probably the hardest to cast, especially with a star name, because you really need a big, magnetic actor with vocal power. James Earl Jones was the ideal reason to do the revival, at least on paper. Sadly, he was terrible in the role. Supposedly he was already having trouble remembering lines, so maybe that sapped his usual confidence and bravado. He had plenty of both in “Fences” more than a decade earlier. But what we saw on stage was a diminished man, without energy, conviction or vocal power. Maybe that deflated the whole production, because it was inert, dead on arrival. As I recall it was only Terrence Howard as Brick, incredibly enough, who had any magnetism amd charisma onstage. He had no chemistry whatever with Anika Noni Rose’s Maggie, who just seemed like a bored, sulky debutante, lacking in resourcefulness and sex appeal. Watching her flailing in the part I realized for the first time how really good Elizabeth Taylor was in the movie. I remember nothing about Phylicia Rashad as Big Mama, so I guess she was lacking in pathos.

As a fan of the play, I thought it was a shambles, a dull misfire. Though I think the same production with a different cast won an Olivier for Best Revival when it moved to London. So go figure.

“Dead Outlaw” isn’t doing so wellconsidering the positive reviews and box office off-Broadway. Is it too early for the good reviews to have shown up in last week’s gross?

Let’s face it Groff is soon to be a back-to-back Tony winner a la Laurie Metcalf. Floyd Collins is a bomb.

R306: There is a strong disconnect between the critics and audiences’ opinions on this show. I keep hearing on the Reddit boards that it’s hard to understand the lyrics because the music is so loud. If it doesn’t win Best Musical and/or continues with these grosses, it will likely close.

R306: A lot of the tickets are probably comped or TDF.

“Floyd Collins” may be a bomb, but no one thinks it will win for Best Musical Revival anyway. So how does that effect voting for Jeremy Jordan, who’s reallly good and sings passionately? Surely a lot of Tony voters will give it a look despite the reviews? Isn’t it in Broadway’s best interest to anoint a potential new, attractive musical star?

[quote] Groff sings " Beyond the Sea." Don't see anything of Darin, but he sounds good.

He's not doing an imitation, he's doing a homage, Audiences are learning him discography and life.

[quote]“Dead Outlaw” isn’t doing so well considering the positive reviews and box office off-Broadway. Is it too early for the good reviews to have shown up in last week’s gross?

DO-DOA?

Boring, overpriced vehicle. If George Looney wasn’t it, it would’ve closed on page 3.

Now R311, if you actually saw it...

[QUOTE] Let’s face it Groff is soon to be a back-to-back Tony winner a la Laurie Metcalf.

Could Kara Young potentially become another back-to-back Tony winner? I don’t see that category as particularly strong this year. And Bianca Leigh should have been nominated for “Oh, Mary!”

Although they might want to finally reward Jessica Hecht who is on her third nomination.

Isn't Floyd Collins a limited run?

Stranger Things had a drastic drop off.

I don't think Groff will be a back to back. You're ruling out Criss, which is foolish.

Here's my marketing pitch - have Audra and Nicole switch roles for a week, then we can decide who gets the TONY.

Said it on the last thread and I'll say it again here - there hasn't been a Tonys with this much uncertainty in every category in forever. I wonder if it will spark higher ratings.

Weren't Dead Outlaw's, REal Women's and Stranger Things' box office strongly affected by comping for last week's openings?

Tourists, especially foreign tourists, don't want to spend a lot of hard-earned money on a musical called Dead Outlaw.

[quote]I wonder if it will spark higher ratings.

Bless your heart, r318.

A 2.9 rating instead of 2.8

R317, you think Nicole could handle Gypsy? The cow, maybe.

Neither Nicole or Audra are selling tickets. I would love to see an upset in that category and have Jasmine or Simard sneak in.

[quote]Let’s face it Groff is soon to be a back-to-back Tony winner a la Laurie Metcalf. Floyd Collins is a bomb.

Even if Jeremy Jordan doesn't get lots of votes, I think many people feel Darren Criss is formidable competition for Groff.

[quote] Could Kara Young potentially become another back-to-back Tony winner? I don’t see that category as particularly strong this year.

I think Jessica Hecht will win it. I thought she was especially great in Eureka Day, with a very tricky character. It's her third nomination and might be her time this year.

It’s Best Actress, not Best Ticket Seller.