Las Vegas tourism is crashing

....

A few years ago, they removed refrigerators and microwaves from all hotel rooms. That, alone, makes me not want to go. Parking is no longer free at any hotel. You can’t even buy a bottle of water for under $5. These are things I have heard from others. I haven’t been there in 8 years.

All the comments saying it has nothing to do with Trump. Those people are delusional. US tourism is dead now and nobody will go there.

Believe me, I know what you're talking about.

[quote] Nevada voted Trump in 2024.

I hate Vegas, but we should probably point out that Clark County, where Vegas is located, voted for Kamala.

While the Democratic margin between 2020 - 2024 did shrink, the majority of people who voted aren't Dumpsters.

LV fucked around with Trumpy and found out.

All they need is a gal like Deborah Vance to bring the luster back to Sin City!

R2 You expect a hotel room to have a microwave in it??

I'm in SoCal and used to go around once a year. I haven't been since COVID and don't have any plans to go in the foreseeable future. The other thing killing Vegas is the proliferation of other ways to lose your money -- Indian casinos, online gambling. etc.

Uh-oh, New Orleans and Biloxi....

I was there last week. As the world flourished over the past decade, prices were jacked up year after year.

Now as the planes start landing with empty seats, panic will set in and I'm guessing a snowball impact quickly taking hold.

No one wants to be hassled at the border.

HAND OVER YOUR PHONE

Why?

I remember when you could go to Vegas and have a rather cheap vacation. They want you to spend your money gambling.

Now the prices are nuts. And all you get for the prices are a bunch of twinkling lights all over the place. No wonder, at the first hint of economic distress, people are abandoning Las Vegas

Sssshhhheeereeeittttt!!!

[QUOTE][R2] You expect a hotel room to have a microwave in it??

The thing that surprised me was that there are no coffee pots in hotel rooms. WTF? That's standard. I guess I wouldn't mind paying $10 for a Grande regular black coffee on vacation. But I won't stand in a line of three to four dozen people.

Trump doesn’t care, I’ll buy up all the failed properties and sell them to saudis

r2 why did they remove refrigerators from hotels?

R17 To make it more difficult for people to buy beverages and snacks somewhere cheaper than the hotel and keep them in their rooms.

So guests are less likely to consume food & drinks they might buy cheaper somewhere else and keep in their room. Without a refrigerator, the chances a guest caves and uses the wildly overpriced minibar are a lot higher.

The times they are changing. Young people don't gamble like their parents did, they don't shop like their parents did, and they don't go to movies like their parents did. You can gamble, shop and watch movies on your telephone. Remote working has also had an effect on how and where people eat

Macy's one of the most iconic names in American retail aims to shutter 150 underperforming locations. A planned first introduced in early 2024

In October of 2024 Walgreens pharmacy chain announced it was shutting 1200 locations.

Subway closed over 600 locations in 2024

The % drop in tourists is not that huge. Vegas retooled in the 90s (yeah, it hasn't been that cheap in a long time) to get more of the convention trade and attract more foreign tourists. They need to worry about losing the Asian market more than the European. the convention trade is probably one thing that will buffer drops in international tourism, as their facilities are among the largest in teh country and there are certain trade shows that can only be done there and in one or two other places because of tghe size.

Nobody goes there anymore. It's too crowded.

Maybe the $50 tables on a Tuesday morning has something to do with it.

I’ve never had any interest in Vegas.

But damn, for those who work there it sucks.

Agreed. I'm the most concerned about how this will impact the people who depend on the tourism economy for their livelihood.

Which has got to be a fair percentage.

Remember the "No tax on tips!" pledge? Ha, ha, Nelson Muntz, etc.

Somewhat like cruises, Vegas is a tacky shithole that appeals to low-brow, easily entertained rubes anyway.

It's likely due to Trump crashing the economy/kidnapping and renditioning foreigners AND Vegas overcharging for everything. Resort fees, parking, overpriced Sysco food, etc plus slot machines that vacuum up your cash instantly. And they're charging thousands a night for events (even in the shitty strip hotels like Excalibur)-F1 and other sports events. Like others said, Vegas used to be a cheap vacation. Reno/Tahoe is still relatively affordable though. Come spend your cash here and see some of our beautiful Sierra Nevada mountains and Lake Tahoe.

And Nevada will have a budget shortfall when tourism craters (no income tax here), not to mention all of the unemployed people. We're about to go through some things. At least the pendulum may swing back and we'll get rid of Lombardo as Governor. Aaron Ford would make a great Governor.

Good! Las Vegas is a huge union town so obviously cement headed union workers voted for Trump.

I hope he crushes them!

[quote]A few years ago, they removed refrigerators and microwaves from all hotel rooms.

Why R2?

Las Vegas went for Harris.

Vegas might have gone for Harris, but not by enough, Trump picked up voters from 2020. The state was decided by something like 17,000 votes in 2020.

Go Trump, go broke!

R31 - so you're forced to buy everything somewhere else - can't microwave any food you brought in, can't make your own coffee so you have to buy $5-$8 coffee downstairs.

It's all the c-level execs who have put in $50 parking (locals HATE it and are coming to the strip less often), resort fees of $50-$75 per night on top of your room rate, and extremely over-priced restaurants.

Concert and show prices in Vegas have gone through the roof - many locals will just go to LA because ticket prices are half and it's still less expensive than going in Vegas.

We all know mini-bar prices are high - but there are some posts where a large water is $25. 'Candy' - meaning a Snickers is $16. AND - if you open the fridge or store something in it - a $65 personal storage fee.

Just like the food companies who kept raising prices so that a bag of Doritos is $8 - their greed not only pisses people off, it changes their spending habits. Once you lose your frequent customers and brand loyalty (or even going to Vegas instead of other gambling destinations), you're going to have a LONG hard road back.

Will the C-level execs feel the pinch? No - they will still get their millions and, if fired, they will get their parachute payments.

I want to see the excessive corporate greed punished - and if staying away and not buying items is the only way - so be it. Fuck them all - they really have 0 respect for their customers.

Vegas used to be cheap. Buffets, shows, hotel rooms, everything was reasonably priced cause Vegas knew what it was. Now there's all kinds of extra fees, the buffets are gone., etc.

Someone has to sit through a has-been celeb's third show of the day!

Maybe it's time for the casino mafia to take matters into their own hands. If you know what I mean. And I think you do.

That’s when it was last good, R37. Turning corporate ruined Vegas.

R36 - I feel attacked.

America as a whole needs to simply cease to exist

R31, try reading the thread.

I was in Vegas for work a couple of weeks ago. My plane going both ways was 1/3 empty when it always used to be full.

An Uber driver told me it was "the first good weekend in a while" — there was an AC/DC concert at the football stadium, some Grateful Dead thing at the Sphere and there were a couple of major medical conventions. But I had the sense that tourism being off was the new normal. And everyone who lived there commented on how expensive it now had gotten even for locals off the Strip.

They got used to the over-pricing in 2022-2023 when people started to come back after COVID. The COGS at restaurants did become more expensive for awhile - but they just kept the prices at that inflated rate.

Pushing 'what the market can bear' ideology only lasted for those coming back after being away for a few years. Now people are pissed and resentful.

Once you destroy good will among your patrons (particularly for those who used to come 5-6 times a year and are now going elsewhere), it takes a decade to come back - at least.

Worse yet - I always had a feeling of Vegas being more of a Boomer, Gen X town. Yes of course you always have the bachelor/bachelorette parties, and young people coming in for a boozy weekend.

But those aren't your main regulars and people throwing down a lot of cash. I honestly don't see Vegas as being more than a once or twice destination for those under 35 or 40 - they'd rather travel to more exotic places. And they DO NOT have the money to blow at casinos like older generations.

This is a ticking time bomb. As a gay man, I've never liked Vegas anyway. It's fine to walk through the casinos and see some stuff - but it's a lot of loud, obnoxious, drunk straight people - the types I would want to avoid on a night out.

They fucked up - and they won't course correct until it's too late. Watch.

I went there 4 years ago and I'll probably never go back. It's an absolute shithole and a total ripoff. Just very sleazy and rundown.

No job, no tips, problem solved.

When the tRump Recession™️ hits, most people won't pay thousands of dollars for concerts at the Sphere or Formula One racing. And they're building that new baseball stadium complex on the old Tropicana site-that will stop and there will be a blighted hole in the ground for a decade or more (like there was with the Fontainebleu). I'm glad I don't live there, Vegas is in for hard times.

More & more casinos are popping up all over the country. Gone are the days that you had to go to Vegas or Atlantic City to gamble.

[quote]A few years ago, they removed refrigerators and microwaves from all hotel rooms. That, alone, makes me not want to go. Parking is no longer free at any hotel. You can’t even buy a bottle of water for under $5. These are things I have heard from others.

What kind of trash friends are you listening to? I was in Las Vegas about 1 month ago. Nothing has change since my last visit 5 years before that. Hotels all had pay refrigerators stocked with stuff just like they always have, microwave? Who the fk cooks in their hotel room? Parking was still free as long as you stayed at the hotel. Bottle water is the same price you would pay in any city that size. I will say the strip was VERY crowded even for a Thursday.

You can get a mini fridge and microwave in most Vegas hotels (for a fee, of course). It's not like they've been banned.

No one wants to go to that gross ass town.

R48 is here to tell you that everything you're hearing - even from local Las Vegas residents - is all false because of his experience. No outrageous resort fees, drink costs, $30-$35 fast food meals, $25 cocktails, $25-$50 parking at hotels, $25-$50 min tables.

Nope - trust R48 instead.

One thing that blew my mind during a visit 2 -1/2 years ago is that a 16 oz bottle of water cost $2 than a pint draft beer at one of Caesar's food courts. But I guess it makes sense from the perspective of loosening up gamblers

And to think that all of this started because people thought they were paying too much for eggs.

I've never seen a microwave in a hotel room -- aside from "executive suites" styled hotels with a full if compact kitchen aimed at long-standing guests.

R54 - I traveled for business quite a lot for several years. About 2/3 of the hotels had microwaves - in a regular room. Same amount had small fridges (not mini-bars). It's a combo - you either have both or you don't have either.

Not fancy hotels - mid-upper Marriott and Hilton chains. I'm not talking 4 star hotels. And not 'suite' or Residence Inn hotels - those do have complete mini-kitchens, which I never use. Feels more like a family thing.

As a Canadian, it’s not really if any particular county voted Kamala or not. The reduction in Canadians travelling stems from all this 51st state bullshit and the tariffs. Canadians also aren’t going to blue states like California. And anecdotally, we’re hearing stories of Canadians being detained and sent back, and so people also don’t want the risk. I don’t know how much of a risk it actually is, but there’s a lot of ill will building because of these stories. MAGA will never believe it’s because of any of this or because of Dump, but it is. I don’t even want to do any cross-border day trips to shop.

They didn’t think that, R53. It was just a more palatable thing to say than “I hate democrats, people of color, and immigrants.”

R56 - Agreed. It's a lot more than tariffs. And I don't blame Canadians. Particularly going through immigration - even if you're detained for an hour - the stress and anxiety from that will fuck you up for a LONG time.

In fact, if I were Canadian and heard of a neighbor or friend traveling to the US, I'd ask what the fuck they were doing. I'd have to think many Canadians are feeling that pressure.

I feel like Canadians travel a LOT - for the size of their country, I meet a ton of them everywhere. I know it's expensive to fly within Canada, so maybe that has something to do with it.

It may be a boost to Canadian tourism if people stay home this summer - Canada has a lot to offer. Come winter, they can go to Mexico (so many already do) or the Caribbean.

I was there this time (April) in 2023 and it was packed, and I stayed midweek because it was cheaper.

The strip was a zoo mid-week during the afternoon. All the attractions I went to (The aquarium at Mandalay Bay, Tournament at Excalibur, the Ferris Wheel at the Linq, the Eiffel Tower at Paris, Absinthe at Ceasar's, Drag Brunch at Senor Frogs, etc.) all were packed. Only the Ice Bar was dead.

I think it is a mix of Trump and Caesar's and MGM killing the golden goose.

It used to be cheap food, liquor, and rooms in exchange for gambling. Now a LOT less people gamble in general, and nothing is cheap so why go?

R59 - I heard they had good years in 2022 and 2023, people returning after COVID, etc. And they could squeeze out those bucks because people wanted the Vegas experience again.

But you can only do that so many times before people feel like you think they're a chump.

I don't 'get' Vegas. It's good for 24-48 hrs max, then it's the same stuff over and over. Drunks, shady people, lots of tattoos, overpriced everything. I don't get the hype.

I've always been wary of being around hordes of very drunk straight people - there are always guys (and women) looking for attention, looking for fights. I NEVER feel weird or threatened around thousands of drunk gays - ever.

Tell that bitch, Miriam Adelson. She gave so much money to Trump, he awarded her a Medal of Freedom during his first term. She gave him $100 million. My sympathies to Sand's employees, but I hope her Las Vegas business loses money. Lots of money. I don't blame Canadians for boycotting the U.S.

The traffic is horrendous. The rooms have doubled in prices. Always crowded. It’s just not a fun place anymore. I used to go every year. I haven’t been back in about five years. Don’t miss it at all.

R3 Anybody saying this has nothing to do with Trump is just being purposely obtuse. You can’t debate someone like that. They have an agenda in addition to just being liars.

That was always my experience too, R55. I don't know where these pearl-clutchers stayed that never had a fridge or microwave.

R53 People weren't thinking that inflated price on eggs were the biggest issue, but the MAGA echo chamber made it a top issue. And 4 months into the Trump term, eggs are still high. It's not from standard inflation, it's a combination of the bird flu impact, and also the gouging of egg prices by the egg companies.

Canadian business travelers, academics, are being warned about carrying sensitive information on their laptops, which are subject to search and seizure. Not for political texts but unrelated sensitive corporate secrets and research data.

R65 - it's price gouging only. Only 5% of the US hen egg-laying population were culled. Hens take 16 weeks to mature to egg-laying. 5% drop in production isn't enough to throw prices up 100-200% and we've had more than enough time to recover the 5% with new hens.

Canada had the bird flu as well - their eggs didn't go up.

Is that Read ID bullshir causing a drop in flying? I haven't gotten one and I loathe the DMV. It's a pointless cash grab and huge aggravation. So no flying in the near future for me.

I was there at the end of January. I couldn't get out of there fast enough

Everything is just so crowded nowadays. And I’m from New York.

[quote]I've never seen a microwave in a hotel room --

Every Holiday Inn Express I've ever stayed at had a refrigerator and a microwave. What the fuck are you talking about!

Oh well...

I was told that you can use your passport or passport card for real ID.

R55 and R64. It's just that I have never seen a refrigerator (non hotel-stocked minibar) or a microwave in any hotel room in years of traveling for business and pleasure. Nor did I have any idea it was a normal thing.

I might imagine finding them in long-term hotels and "suite" or Residence Inn style hotels with kitchen facilities, but I never encountered this anywhere in the US (or Europe.)

Normally I stayed in 4* and 3* places, but --excepting 4*+ and 5* places-- these were nothing special, middling Hiltons, Sheratons, Doubletree, Marriott, Ramada, Best Western , and independent hotels or motels, hardly full service luxury hotels. Minibar fridges were common, but a proper refrigerator of any size and microwave...never.)

I travelled in >40 states, though much more in the Eastern US than in the Western half. In any case, it's not that I doubt either of you, nor that my pearls in a terrible state, it's just that I had no idea about the refrigerator + microwave thing.

R74 - there may have been fridges in your room and you didn't notice it because it looked like a drawer - same with microwave high above on a shelf.

It's been a thing for 15 years?

[quote]I was told that you can use your passport or passport card for real ID.

Don't know about your passport card, but your actual passport will work just fine.

R51 thinks says listen to the guy who heard it from a friend who heard it from a friend instead of someone that was just there.

The smart bet is to listen to R48 who has actually been there RECENTLY.

LV has not changed more than any other city that size. I could find your "outrageous prices" in every major city from LA to NYC. In fact, room rates are still some of the lowest you can find for a comparable hotel in other big cities.

[quote] "outrageous resort fees, drink costs, $30-$35 fast food meals, $25 cocktails, $25-$50 parking at hotels, $25-$50 min tables. "

Yes, Dear, it's 2025 not 1985. And your friend is a nut because drinks are still FREE in most casinos as long as you are gambling at a table or machine.

Resort fees are a scam.

Those of you asking why anyone would need a microwave—most restaurants give you a serving that is equal to 2-3. I will take the rest and reheat it later. And we aren’t talking about “full sized refrigerators”. It is a mini fridge. I use them for water and drinks.

Taking home uneaten food from your restaurant meal is so American. Try that shit in Europe and you'll be spit upon.

I’m talking bout America, R 80. Not Europe. I would hope that Europe does not supersize their meals.

I had instances when vacationing where I had a large meal and couldn't finish it. I would ask for them to pack the remaining and I would put it in my hotel room fridge and heat it for dinner the next day. I spend a lot of money when I vacation. Being able to save on a meal or two adds up. This also works for having some basics from a local grocery in your fridge to have breakfast before embarking for your day out.

Worst thing in the hotels: sensors in the minibar and, worse, sensors under the items sitting on the dresser above the minibar. So you move an item, and bam, the incredibly jacked up price of a box of M&M’s ends up on your bill.

I still go to Vegas but that is the worst.

You need a microwave for popcorn. Also if you want to wax your legs.

Yes. I mostly use hotel microwaves for popcorn.

R80 ok but this thread is about Las Vegas you dumb cunt.

It kind of seems like a really trashy city with not a lot of good architecture

I've been in hotels where the mini-fridges have so many pre-set items, that you cannot store anything inside them, unless you move them, then BLAMMO you get charged for the moved items.

[quote] I spend a lot of money when I vacation.

Rentboys ain't cheap.

R83 wow, I had no idea about sensor minibars.

One time I stayed in Vegas, I opened the minibar fridge just to see what was in there. I didn't touch or move anything and there was a $20 charge on the folio. I complained and they removed the charge. I wonder how often they get away with people late to get to the airport, etc and they just pay the $20.

Lesson learned about minibars. Don't touch anything.

I've disputed the charge and had it reversed.

R91 In fact, don't even look at it.

It's comforting to know that it's all Biden's fault. He is responsible for the recession he created with his Bidenomics. And the economy and stock prices were overheated. All at the same time. Damn you Biden!

You think I'm skimming off the top OP??

There used to be a sort of nostalgic charm in the old casinos with the neon lights and the campy shows, but they keep destroying anything with a bit of history and built a bunch of interchangeable, bland properties that offer nothing special. At the same time, they started nickel and diming you for everything, and the crowds got worse. Spirit and Frontier Airlines bring in all the backwater hicks and then you have the trashy Inland Empire crowd. Mostly MAGA of course. It's a total shithole now.

R96 nails it.

Vegas also had great customer service, which is long gone (unless you're a high roller).

Microwaves were never standard in hotel rooms. Some had them but it wasn't a regular feature. Maybe that poster had a favorite hotel he frequented that used to have microwaves, but expecting any random hotel room to have a microwave isn't realistic.

For me a microwave is not a necessity , but a small fridge is.

And the awful coffee maker.

[quote]drinks are still FREE in most casinos as long as you are gambling at a table or machine

Tell us you haven't been to Vegas (except in your fevered imagination) in years without telling us you haven't been to Vegas in years.

Drinks are still free just as long as you been playing for more than 30 minutes or place a minimum bet.

Over the course of my life, I've ended up spending about a year in Vegas. It is tradeshow hell (and for about 4 months a year, hotter than Hell). What I can tell you, even with the inflated tradeshow prices, is that Vegas has gotten outrageously expensive. 30 years ago, I could take clients to a nice dinner and spend $200 for four people. The last (and it will be [italic]the[/italic] last) time, I took two clients to dinner the bill came to $1000 with tax and tip for three, and this was not at anyplace fancy.

Vegas has always been a boom-and-bust town. It is among the first places to show signs that a recession is coming, and it is showing them in spades (ha!) now. When people report that airline seats are vacant and tourist volume is down, it's already too late. The layoffs have begun. Construction starts are down. Vegas is bracing for another downturn.

Vegas isn't alone; Phoenix, another southwestern city among the first to show recessionary signs, is reporting a 7%-8% decline in real estate values (based on sales prices). Volume is also down. Makes sense; with the Trump chaos, now is not the time to buy or sell. Nevertheless, there are always people who must buy or sell, so a decline this large is frightening.

And then we have all of the states that border Canada reporting dramatic declines in visitors; we even had a thread on the hotel in Maine reporting that 75% of his bookings cancelled when Shitler opened his sewermouth and told Canada they are a weak and worthless country. Meanwhile, take a look at the replies on that Insta thread OP linked in which Canadian after Canadian reports that they're going elsewhere on vacation. And who can blame them?

But speaking of the replies on that thread, get a load of the idiots who try to blame Biden for Trump's collapse, saying that "everything doubled under Biden." Well, hardly. We had inflation that peaked at 9% for less than a year before slowing. R94 brilliantly summed it up. Within 6 months, we'll only wish that the economy was as good as it was under Biden even with the Covid inflation (which was, in reality, corporate price gouging; CEOs like the president of Tyson foods admitted it). To wit, has the price of anything (except gas, which I'm about to discuss) come down since inauguration day?

Trump knows double-digit inflation is coming. He tried to take credit for the decline in the price of gas, which is down because there is an excess of fuel due to the fact that trucking on the West coast has collapsed with no freight coming in from China, and that collapse is sweeping across the country in the coming weeks. It starts with the short haul truckers, then the long haulers, and then rail freight hits about the same time as the collapse hits the I-20/I-40 corridor. Add in the fact that few people are going to want to vacation with a recession on the horizon, and we'll see the price of gas lower than it has been since the depths of Trump's Covid collapse. And remember, when the price of oil falls below $80 bbl, it becomes economically infeasible to drill/frack. The price of Brent crude is now at ~$62 - $63 bbl. Trump can screech "drill baby drill" until his voice gives out and the oil companies won't open a single new well.

The sad part is that Trump chose the absolute worst time to start his trade war. He doesn't understand our retail economy. To be blunt, retailers' Christmas orders are overdue and no one is placing orders for anything. We can write Christmas 2025 off. If you haven't started your Christmas shopping, start now if you want to have any gifts to give. And the thing is, even if Trump reacts to the empty shelves we'll see in a few weeks, it will be too late to save Christmas. And just wait for the price gouging that we'll see when everything (except for gas) is in short supply. I guess you can fill up the tank and take the kids for a drive... oh wait, the price of autos is about to balloon by 30% or more, so no new car for you.

Hard times ahead, and you can blame the idiots who voted for Trump. May they get the lives they deserve.

R104 You spent a grand for four people and it wasn’t a fancy restaurant? Where did you guys eat, a Trump establishment? Shit even 4 people could eat at Ruth Chris for a grand.

You cunts got filthy drunk or something?

R96 is spot on with the type of crowds. I've only been 3 times and I would never say it was the most sophisticated bunch on the Strip, but the last time in 2021- whoa.

The smell of weed everywhere on the strip and it's like they sent out a bat signal in the tri-state area for the trashiest people - muffin tops, shitty tattoos, tank tops on obese men, shitty gold chains, and lower class families with feral children and teenagers.

It's not just Inland Empire - it's Arizona, NV, Bakersfield, San Bernardino and Riv counties, Ventura, South Central, etc.

4-6 people in one shitty room at Excalibur.

The latest scam is sensors that supposedly detect whether you’ve been smoking in your room and add $250 to the bill.

Given that everyone smells like smoke after walking through the casino, it’s ridiculous.

[quote]It kind of seems like a really trashy city with not a lot of good architecture

I don't think anyone ever argued that there was, where would you get that idea? It's always been a sort of Adult Disneyland with titty shows, drinking and gambling. All the hotels in the last 40 years have been caricatures of other architecture. The Luxor, Caesar Palace, NYC/NYC, Paris etc.

[quote]The latest scam is sensors that supposedly detect whether you’ve been smoking in your room and add $250 to the bill.

Given that most smokers break the rules and smoke in their rooms anyways and claim no one can tell is the reason they had to install them.

R109 - nah - it's weed. Seriously.

The funny part is LA used to be a smokers paradise. The idea that you would have a non-smoking section in a casino was laughed at as pre-woke California liberals. Now it's mostly smoke free as America has changed but many many other countries are die hard smokers like Japan or France. so when they come to LV it's a surprise for them.

Having a smoking section in a restaurant or a venue is akin to having a peeing section in a swimming pool.

They better loosen up those slots if they expect anyone to go there.

80% of the workforce there is undocumented Mexicans who are about to be deported.

Patently false, R114. Vegas is a union town (which is why they narrowly carried Harris in Vegas) and the unions don't let undocumented people work in union hotels. I'm sure there are undocumented people working in Vegas, but it's nowhere near 80% and no, the Hispanic workers are not about to be deported.

The reason that Trump did as well as he did in Vegas was due, in large part, to his ridiculous and broken promise to not tax tips. The problem is that he wants to include Wall Street bonuses — the primary method of compensation on Wall Street and reaching into the billions of dollars annually — as tips. And not taxing tips would put a significant dent in tax revenue because there are millions of Americans whose income is primarily tips, and these folks mostly come from the working class. The one thing Republicans will balk at is working people not paying taxes — which is why we started taxing tips in 1982 under St. Ronnie of Raygun's war on the working class.

Yep, R114 is racist and oblivious. It's a BIG union town and the Hispanic that do word there are American citizens going back generations. LV is part of the South West where Native Americans, Mexican and Spanish were there long before the Mob started that town.

[quote]which is why we started taxing tips in 1982 under St. Ronnie of Raygun's war on the working class.

Tips have always been taxable. Where are you getting this from?

R96 agreed it’s sad. I was in Vegas for a work convention and I went to the neon museum for fun and man did it make me miss that old school campy glamour Vegas used to have. It made resorts world which is where I was staying look so sterile and lifeless.

The Neon Museum and the Pinball Machine Museum were the only interesting places in Vegas to me. Soulless, expensive and overcrowded otherwise. Worth seeing Vegas once for the sheer spectacle of it, but once is plenty.

We didn't enforce tip collection until Reagan signed the 1982 Tax Equity and Fiscal Responsibility Act in which large restaurants were required to report taxable tips for their employees, regardless of whether those tips had actually been received by servers, R117. So this portion of the working class gets stiffed twice: when "tips" are reported but not necessarily actually paid, and by oh-so-generous Americans who complain bitterly about tipping (despite knowing servers are dependent on tips, and at the Federal level as well as in many states, are paid the lower "tipped employee" minimum wage) and frequently don't or don't adequately tip.

R117 Trump wants to make tips/gratuities non-taxable. You know why. Because they want to include corporate bonuses as non-taxable. So if a CEO earns $2MM salary and his bonus is $8MM, he only has to pay taxes on the regular salary part. This is the type of shit they are trying to ram through.

r120 I was a tax auditor for the IRS in the '70s and we definitely went after people for unreported tips. And that was at the time when the "tokes aren't tips" controversy was big.

But is a bonus actually a tip?

I'm sure that the IRS did go after tax cheats, R122... but if the problem weren't large enough to capture the attention of the oligarchs/the Heritage Foundation/Reagan, they would have not gone to the effort of codifying collection and enforcement, at least not as big an effort as the 1982 Act was.

And it was a big deal; I knew a guy, a friend of my older brother, who waited tables part time to pay for college. He could work two nights a week (Friday and Saturday) and make enough to pay his tuition, rent and eat. When the Act took effect, he complained loudly that at the end of his pay periods he owed the restaurant money because they'd withheld the taxes on his tips which exceeded the ridiculously low "tipped employees" minimum wages (about $2 an hour IIRC). He worked for a few months and every two weeks repaid the restaurant the deficit between the hourly pay and withholdings, but was about to graduate so he quit telling his boss that he wasn't going to pay them to work for them any more.

The restaurant didn't care and didn't even try to convince him to stay. Reaganomics had taken hold and the decimation of the middle class had begun; there were four applicants for every job the restaurant advertised and they had their pick of servers "willing to pay them to work there" as my brother's friend put it. This is what Reagan [italic]actually[/italic] meant when he introduced trickle-down economics: all the benefits go to the wealthy, and the work and tax paying trickle down to the poor and middle classes.

The Vegas chiseling that got me involved a rental car. I filled it back up before returning and used a gas station away from the rental car return on the theory it would be cheaper. Even though the gauge was on full, they demanded a receipt from a gas station within a mile of the car return place and charged me for not having one. No one with a flight that day is going to be able to argue that.

We haven’t brought up how freaking hot it is. 116. It doesn’t even cool off at night. I lived there for a couple years and our air conditioning went 24 hours a day. I tried to do my running around in the morning. It’s just too damn hot. I would never live there again and so many scummy people.

Las Vegas climate used to be bone dry. Is it still that way, or does it now have some humidity?

r127, funny you should ask during the wettest week of the past 5 years.

When it is 120F, it is bleached bone dry.