THEATRE GOSSIP #584: The "Mamma Mia!, Here We Go Again" Edition

Here's the previous thread.

How about alternative casting like this for Sophie?

Still no word on the mystery production Roundabout is putting into Studio 54?

So Broadway will have Mamma Mia, Chess, and Ragtime next season?

Chess concert was interesting. Hard to focus on the plot after about 30 minutes and I didn't like Darren as Freddie Trumper. I think the current references to US politicians may frighten the anti-woke warriors who can't process complex or negative references to Trump. I can see some weirdos shouting at performances if that performances if that script is used.

The music was great, but the show dragged a bit.

Are Matt Doyle and Max Clayton still together? Asking for a friend.

R6, it was reported -- here, I think -- that they broke up some time ago.

R7. Thank you! I must have missed that. Maybe it got lost among the Gypsy or Follies threads that I fast forward through :)

The productions of CHESS that have been most successful to date were the concert productions that mostly or entirely eliminated the book, but some people don't seem to have learned from this. I don't see how the original score would work if the action of the show were updated to include Trump references, even if Tim Rice has done yet another round of revisions of the lyrics.

On another note, the fact that MAMMA MIA! is coming back to Broadway strikes me as very unsurprising news in the second Trump administration.

Lea Michele should just retire to Long Island at this point. I'm sure she thought that Funny Girl was going to revive her career, but crickets. Doing a revival of a C-list show is desperation. She might as well have done the Mamma Mia revival.

According to Instagram, they were together as late as October of 2024

Lea had a second child after Funny Girl and her first is still a toddler. Maybe she's prioritizing family over career?

That's what I'm doing, R12.

Gypsy is up on TDF.

R11-That must be a very wide open marriage.

Among other wide-openings

Have we discussed hunky Glenn Davis, who is featured in PURPOSE at the Hayes? In the opening scene, he is seated on a couch wearing very tight sweatpants that hug and proudly display his giant cock as he spreads his legs wide. Not since Jesse Williams showering at the same theater in TAKE ME OUT have a seen a comparable anaconda. He looks like he has a great body, too. Sadly he doesn't disrobe during the play.

I'd love to see more of him.

If you want to see how Everything's Coming up Roses should be done, today's Lucy Show, season two episode 19, it's sung by the woman who created the character.

It's too late to watch it on Catchy, but it's streaming on Tubi and many other places.

Is Grand Hotel worth reviving? (Frankly, I just want to see "We'll Take a Glass Together" on stage again.)

Just call it here we go again

Monotony

R20. Only if Tommy Tune directs and that ain't happening.

Grand Hotel was perfection during its first run, mainly because Tune directed it with so much class.

I fear that, if it gets another Bway run, we’ll endless threads a la Follies how the original could not be replaced

Are they still trying to make Chess happen?

The Michael Mayer/Danny Strong adaptation is a disaster. They make the same mistake as Trevor did by adding more book. It is terrible. The show only works when it's treated like a contemporary operetta. Make the music and stagecraft thrilling, and don't focus too closely on the story details. The lyrics are just a jumble of ridiculousness so that if you look at it too closely, it falls apart. People keep trying to make "sense" of Chess. Don't bother. There is none.

[quote]Are they still trying to make Chess happen?

Chess is like the musical Carrie. Every decade someone tries to make them happen, and it never works, because they're both terrible shows.

You all play chess. The rest of us are playing backgammon—

[quote]Chess is like the musical Carrie. Every decade someone tries to make them happen, and it never works, because they're both terrible shows.

But the huge difference is that CHESS has a consistently great score. Or at least, great music. Many of the lyrics, not so much.

[quote]Grand Hotel was perfection during its first run, mainly because Tune directed it with so much class.

I had a friend call it, "Merrily We Rattle The Cutlery.'

They're locking up audience phones in pouches over at "Othello".

***Why, do Denzel or Jake show their weenies?

Hamilton canceled 2026 Kennedy Center run.

No. So people don’t text anyone how horrible they are. Just saw the matinee and it is dreadful

Those of us in the mezz missed the sight of Genn's bulge, but we do get to see him in a beekeeper's gear.

Here's a link to go with R32's post:

Wasn't there a very well-reviewed Encores production of GRAND HOTEL a few (or maybe more than a few) years ago? Blanking on the director/choreographer's name....or any of the principals, for that matter.....

Ugh. The Greatest Showman is being turned into a Broadway musical. How horribly inevitable.

With or without Hugh?

Without U I'm nothing

I believe a stage musical of THE GREATEST SHOWMAN was announced as being in the works some years ago. I personally couldn't get past the opening number of the movie when I tried to watch it, but the movie was so popular that I'm surprised the stage version took this long.

[quote]Is Grand Hotel worth reviving?

No, no, NO!

Are people HIGH on dope? Grand Hotel is a TERRIBLE show!

It wasn't my fault

I saw Grand Hotel in previews and it was immediately apparent that Jane would get a nomination and Michael was going to win the Tony.

I've been hearing about Denzel's problems in Othello. What's up with Jake?

"Ghosts" is way too heavy-handed, even for Ibsen. And what's with the 2 false starts at the beginning? And the scripts. And the horror movie music.

But Billy Crudup steals the show.

r41's husband does not work in the area

Don't forget the Sondheim review, Old Friends is coming to town. I saw it in Los Angeles and it was a damned good evening. Lea Salonga's "Everything's Coming Up Roses" blew me away -It merits another production of Gypsy!

And, while I am the biggest Sondheim snob in the world, I welcome another round of Mamma Mia on Broadway. Times is hard, and MM is a wonderful escape. You can shut off your brain, tap your toes, and sing along (in your head) all night.

^^^ Oh-Dear-ing myself for the stupid "review" instead of REVUE. I plead drugs from this morning's root canal... But it's still a lame mistake.

Can I blame it on autocorrect? Maybe?

r47 - I agree that there is absolutely NOTHING wrong with some escapism on Broadway, especially when the music is as good as the best of ABBA. I, somehow, never saw Mama Mia on Broadway or on tour, but I've seen clips and what I found most disappointing was how... anemic those iconic ABBA songs sounded. Part of what made ABBA's seemingly endless stream of 70s hits so successful was how fantastically those albums were produced -- the arrangements, the engineering, the overall production. That's part of what made the ABBA: Voyage show in London so thrilling. They had a live 10 piece band, but they built upon that signature sound rather than making it sound so.. underpowered and characterless. Am I wrong? Do the video and audio recordings not resemble the in-theatre experience?

r45, you didn't think Billy Crudup was just too sunny and upbeat for Paster Manders? I thought he struggled playing against type but then, maybe you're right and his ease was helpful against all the sturm und drang.

How Matt Doyle put up with that raging narcissist, I will never know.

Does anyone find Max Clayton as sexy and irresistible as he does?

r51 By being one himself? He did, after all, describe himself as a leading man type.

Sandra Bernhard is a sad case.

From 1983 to 1995, I thought she would break through to stardom.

Oscar buzz for King of Comedy, Without You I’m Nothing, Roseanne, Madonna, and taking meetings to star in the aborted Funny Girl revival.

Now, she self produces CD-Roms of her comedy shows in low end clubs.

What happened?

[quote]While I am the biggest Sondheim snob in the world, I welcome another round of Mamma Mia on Broadway. Times is hard, and MM is a wonderful escape. You can shut off your brain, tap your toes, and sing along (in your head) all night.

MAMMA MIA! is a piece of shite. Yes, the songs are fun, but the "book" is incredibly stupid, witless, and humorless. When it comes to entertainment, there's a big difference between "mindless fun" and "so idiotic that it insults the audience's intelligence." Then again, I suppose one could say it's the perfect revival for Trumps' return to power, because I'm sure most of his pea-brained constituents love it.

I've always thought Bernhard was annoying as hell. The only work she seems to get is small roles in the Ryan Murphyverse.

Mamma Mia at post-pandemic prices? Good luck.

From the previous thread [quote] Characters in movies and plays often say and sing words that are too sophisticated for their characters.

The reason for the I Feel Pretty controversy was that the young Sondheim had told everyone within hearing that yes, what you say WAS true, but he was going to change that. He was going to write songs where the emphasis fell on the right syllable, where the rhymes were true and unfussy unless for a purpose, and where the subject, grammar and vocabulary were appropriate to the character. Hence his friend's wry review "It's alarming how charming I feel?" and Sondheim's sudden embarrassment hearing it back. He'd just missed it until it was underscored.

He rarely repeated the error.

r55 You're trying too hard

Sure, R58. Just admit that he wrote a shitty lyric. Even God make a mistake.... DJT.

Josh Rhodes did the ENCORES "Grand Hotel" and he did a decent job. Tying together all the bitching going on here, Rhodes also directed The Muny's epic CHESS a few years ago, and it was terrific. He knew what it was, and what it wasn't. Although, "One Night in Bangkok" never works in any production, anywhere. It was a money grab that doesn't belong.

Speaking of Sondheim lyrics, he told the story many times of coming up with a new introductory verse for "Some People" during previews for GYPSY, but Merman refused to sing it, saying the show was frozen. She allegedly also thought that the new lyric showed too much anger toward Rose's father, and Merman worried that the audience would dislike her character. Sondheim bitched about this for years. So how come he never added the new verse to any of the subsequent productions?

He described this in Finishing the Hat, but said he couldn’t find the lyric or remember it. He’s right that the transition from her big speech to the lower starting notes of Some People is awkward.

Roundabout announces much of its 2025-26 season.

It has been reported many times that it was Sheldon Harnick questioned "It's alarming how charming I feel," which apparently was enough to cause Sondheim to become embarrassed about that phrase -- and also I believe some others, including "I feel fizzy and funny and fine." But I agree that characters in musicals often say and sing words that are too sophisticated for their characters.

What are we to make of Many a light lad may kiss and fly, a kiss gone by is begone" or "Never have I chased the honeybee who carelessly cajoled me?" Does that sound like the words of a largely uneducated young woman living in Oklahoma in the early 1900s? And what about Nellie Forbush's "I'm bromidic and bright as a moon-happy night pouring light on the dew?" For that matter, what about Pseudolus's "the bong of the bell of the buoy in the bay, and the boat and the boy and the bride are away!"

Since we're talking about lyrics, I want to mention a joke one that falls flat for me:

"And with an assist from me to be who'll you'll be

Instead of dreary, who you were -- well, are

There's nothing that can stop you

From becoming pop-uler -- lar!"

R66, I don't think it's terribly witty, but I wouldn't say it falls flat. It's just a cute, quick little joke by the composer/lyricist.

From the same musical, R66, “…the things I’ve done you blame me for.”

If you admit you did them, it’s not really blaming, is it?

When I think of Noel Coward, Kelli O'Hara is not an actress who comes to mind.

Mind you, her role was originally played by Tallulah Bankhead in 1925.

I wouldn't even trust Rose Byrne with that material. The play needs a couple of character comics with great sophistication.

R68, those lyrics are even worse than you indicate, because the rest of the phrase is "I ask forgiveness for the things I've done you blame me for." Which is a mess because of the repetition of the word "for" and also because a word is missing, it should be "the things I've done that you blame me for."

Another lyric that bothers me for similar reasons: "What did I have I don't have now?" Really? It obviously should be "What did I have that I don't have now?" Surprising that Lerner thought he could get away with leaving out that necessary word because he didn't want to add an extra eighth note.

R69. I agree but who could possibly pull those roles off? Everyone that comes to mind is too old and younger actors are so dull.

How on earth did a chorus boy like Max Clayton end up standing by for Hugh Grant. Standbys usually have much more stature than that!

Fallen Angels is one of the Coward plays that's now in public domain, so if they want to do an adaptation or cutting to make it shorter, they can.

Several major Coward plays are now PD including Hay Fever, The Vortex, and Easy Virtue.

Private Lives goes PD in 2026, so look for lots of theatres to pick it back up again, especially given its small cast.

I think it's alarming how charming I feel is a pretty charming lyric, and it has always tickled by funnybone a little bit.

I wouldn’t go within 500 feet of that shite.

[quote]The play needs a couple of character comics with great sophistication.

You'll have to make do with Susannah York and Joan Collins, r69.

Correctly speaking The Wizard and I should be The Wizard and Me.

I thought you did it for I, Momma.

You're wrong about that, R77. "And that's how we'll begin, the Wizard and I" is an inversion of "and that's how the Wizard and I will begin," and "when we are hand in hand, the Wizard and I" is an inversion of "when the Wizard and I are hand in hand,." And that applies to the other uses of that construction in the song.

Me, Claudius

Myself, Claudius

Speaking of WSS, here are Broadway's leading men singing "Something's Coming" with the help of three legendary women.

Colton Ryan was terrible there

Gavin Creel doing a " Mamma Mia" medley at Miscast.

R72-Hugh Grant?????

R85. Oops. Can you imagine Hugh Grant in The Music Man? He would have those poor kids in tears every night.

You "wouldn't EVEN trust Rose Byrne with that material," R69? Suddenly she's some kind of acting genius?

[quote]Here are Broadway's leading men singing "Something's Coming" with the help of three legendary women.

Well, not all of them were/are "Broadway's leading men." I don't think Richard Beymer qualifies in that category. And of course, it's not him singing in that movie, it's a guy named Jim Bryant.

Say what you will about Max Clayton but I saw his thighs up close when he slipped back into Moulin Rouge for a spell and I haven’t been the same since. Fetch me my fainting couch!

[quote]Wasn't there a very well-reviewed Encores production of GRAND HOTEL a few (or maybe more than a few) years ago? Blanking on the director/choreographer's name....or any of the principals, for that matter.....

It was fine but it just amplified what a genius Tommy Tune is for putting the magic in the original staging

[quote]While he received no screen credit, Jim Bryant states that Beymer was "a nice guy, and every time he did an interview he would mention my name." Bryant also sang for James Fox in the 1967 film musical "Thoroughly Modern Millie."

Sondheim told me in person that Darren Criss GLEE “Something’s Coming” would have been Bernstein”s favorite version … and his, too. Clock works twice a day.

Saw "Ghosts" tonight.

It's a great play, but is this a great production? Hmm...

It doesn't come even vaguely close to the brilliant Richard Eyre production that came to BAM in 2015 with Lesley Manville and Jack Lowden. In fact, I kept thinking about that production during this one.

Billy Crudup seemed over the top tonight and almost wrong for the part. And I have never thought that of him before tonight. The audience was laughing at inappropriate moments, and not in a good way. Not sure why that was happening, but it was, and it disrupted the intensity of the show as things go from bad to worse.

It should be noted that Crudup is the only one of the cast of five who isn't a Nepo Baby. I don't say this to be snarky, because I think Hamish Linklater and Lily Rabe are terrific actors, and the other two (Ella Beatty and Levon Hawke) don't embarrass themselves, but given the incredibly famous parentage of Beatty AND Hawke, it does give one pause.

I think I need a trigger warning for anything Darren Criss related.

Nobody beat Larry Kert's rendition in that montage.

Where was Issac Powell's cliip?

On Grindr

[quote]Sondheim told me in person that Darren Criss GLEE “Something’s Coming” would have been Bernstein”s favorite version … and his, too. Clock works twice a day.

BWAAAAH. If that's the case, Sondheim was an idiot. More likely a lie.

[quote]Well, not all of them were/are "Broadway's leading men."

Duh!

Beatty plays the maid as if a high school student wandered into the Mitzi Newhouse by accident.

Max Clayton gives fantastic blowjobs.

Max Clayton's thighs.

MARY!

[quote]Sondheim told me in person that Darren Criss GLEE “Something’s Coming” would have been Bernstein”s favorite version … and his, too. Clock works twice a day.

Very hard to believe Sondheim said that. And I THINK the expression you were going for is "Even a broken clock is correct twice a day," but I don't see how that has anything to do with this subject.

There's a good recent interview with Lane Bradbury; she's almost 87, very open and honest. She saw Audra McDonald a couple of weeks ago and said her "Rose's Turn" was "one of the most brilliant things I have ever seen. ... She is extraordinary, extraordinary, extraordinary." (She does criticize some aspects of the new production.) She sounds like a New Yorker, but her southern accent does break through a couple of times.

Not very well-spoken, at all.^

R105, she’s 87. Give her a break

No slack for her. If you can’t cast well, don’t be on a podcast.

‘The Seagull’ Theater Review:

Any rumblings about a U.S. transfer of The Seagull? It would be an impossible ticket with Cate, one assumes.

She’s done Chekhov in NY before, at City Center(?). It was quit good.

quite*

But, would she do well as a Sally or Phyllis?

I caught Maddie Corman's ACCIDENTALLY BRAVE on HBO yesterday. I'm mentioning it here because it started as an off Broadway one woman show. She's got quite a story to tell and, in the end, I admired her for sticking by her husband and keeping her family together after the child pornography charges. I doubt he'll ever work again and they lost a lot paying lawyers, etc but it hasn't seemed to hurt her career or many of her friendships. Worth watching.

This coming week ...

SHERRI -- Tank plugs Hell's Kitchen on Monday; Phylicia Rashad plugs Purpose on Wednesday

GOOD MORNING AMERICA/GMA3 -- Nicole Scherzinger sings "With One Look" and plugs Sunset Boulevard by herself Tuesday morning; she's joined by Tom Francis that afternoon; Bill Burr appears Thursday morning, supposedly to plug his stand-up special, but I imagine Glengarry Glen Ross will get plugged

KELLY CLARKSON -- the cast of Gypsy performs Wednesday

TAMRON HALL -- Michelle Williams plugs Death Becomes Her on Wednesday

JIMMY FALLON -- Bernadette Peters plugs Old Friends on Wednesday, and Nick Jonas & Adrienne Warren perform and plug The Last Five Years on Thursday

TODAY -- Joey Fatone plugs his last performances in & Juliet during the 10 a.m. Thursday hour

serious question, Will Gypsy still be running in June/July?

R115. They've announced the 'limited run' will end in August. I don't think it will close before then.

Love Maddie Corman! Is the HBO film still done as a one-woman performance?

Has Jane Alexander commented yet?

R117. Yes, it is but it was not filmed in front of an audience. R118. Jane was at the opening of Accidentally Brave when it premiered off Broadway.

Jane was intentionally brave to show up.

Over the years I've worked with Maddie (twice), Jace, and Jane (twice). They're all wonderful people and I include Jace in that.

I hope the current Gypsy gets filmed. Audra’s performance should be captured

In a butterfly net - and pinned on a board.

Ethel Merman, Angela Lansbury, Tyne Daly, Betty Buckley, Bernadette Peters and Patti LuPone’s versions were all not filmed. I find it hard to believe that Audra’s deserves to be.

Then again Imelda (who was doing an impression of Mama’s Family) was…so who knows these days!

It's so much more reasonable to film West End Shows than Broadway. The Broadway union rules make it near impossible. That's why Aladdin, Frozen, Hadestown, Kiss Me Kate and Anything Goes all filmed in London. It's reasonable.

I recently saw Redwood and it’s actually pretty good.

The music is completely forgettable pop but the whole thing sort of washed over me. Beautifully done sets and some incredible voices in the cast, including Idina’s of course.

Don’t expect anything and you’ll be surprised.

R114 - Thanks, Talk Show Troll! That's a busy week. I'm very curious about what will be performed from Gypsy. A performance on Kelly's show seems... odd... but, promo is promo.

I think this will be Bernie's first appearance on Fallon's Tonight Show, too! As annoying as Jimmy is, he's a genuine Broadway fan, so I imagine he'll know his stuff when interviewing her.

[quote]It's so much more reasonable to film West End Shows than Broadway. The Broadway union rules make it near impossible. That's why Aladdin, Frozen, Hadestown, Kiss Me Kate and Anything Goes all filmed in London. I

Thanks. I'm surprised that so many people don't understand this, I thought this was common knowledge.

I hope the show (and the TONYs) don’t feature Rose’s Turn. It wouldn’t make sense without the brilliant two hour build up that Audra gives it.

r129 - agreed. Though, Bernadette's Rose's Turn on the Tonys was incredible -- and she even performed an abbreviated version. I know LuPone has done it already, but Everything's Coming Up Roses really is the best choice.

[Quote] It's so much more reasonable to film West End Shows than Broadway. The Broadway union rules make it near impossible. That's why Aladdin, Frozen, Hadestown, Kiss Me Kate and Anything Goes all filmed in London.

True, but the Broadway stars tend to be better known. Also, the West Ends shows that have been filmed are sort of dull

Thank you, Kenneth Tynan.

[quote]I hope the show (and the TONYs) don’t feature Rose’s Turn.

I think they are going with " Little Lamb."

They've never done "Some People," have they?

You have to include Audra so Some People makes sense

r126 offers my current favorite pull quote: "Don't expect anything and you'll be surprised.."

[quote]It's so much more reasonable to film West End Shows than Broadway. The Broadway union rules make it near impossible. That's why Aladdin, Frozen, Hadestown, Kiss Me Kate and Anything Goes all filmed in London. I

Unions are more trouble than they're worth.

Without unions, Broadway would not exist.

R137 = Patti LuPone

The video version of THE KING AND I with Kelli O'Hara that was shot in London is excellent overall, but I agree that some of the others have something missing -- for example, ANYTHING GOES with Sutton Foster.

R44 Othello was a little disappointing, but Jake was great. When he started spinning lies, the audience was into it laughing and whispering. Same for Desdemona's dad. I could understand them the best overall. I could tell most people weren't familiar with the story or hadn't read the synopsis. I also thought Andrew Burnap's Cassio was relatable and he had the most interesting story b/c he's being used. The rest of the cast was fine but the volume seemed surprisingly low.

My main disappointment was the look of it. Not much going on visually besides gray columns and rising platform in the middle. I'm glad I saw it at a big discount, might check out a film version later.

The Portrait of Dorian Gray just released some cheap ticks way way in the back

r141, I loved the Kenneth Branagh directed OTHELLO film in which he also played Iago to Laurence Fishburne's Othello. Added bonus: the sexy young Nathaniel Parker as the studly Cassio.

And Branagh dared to set in the Italian Renaissance!

National Theatre At Home has a recording of an excellent production of Othello from 2013, directed by Nicholas Hytner, starring Adrian Lester as Othello, Rory Kinnear as Iago, and Jonathan Bailey as Cassio. I'm not often a fan of modernization, but setting the play at a Gulf War-esque army base works beautifully.

There is a more recent NT production of Othello from 2022, but I have not seen that one.

The main problem with Sutton's Anything Goes is the fact that it sucks.

But she taps! And taps. And….

Max Clayton and Matt Doyle could never have lasted. The competition between whose ego is bigger would end up having one kill the other. Doesn’t matter which, though I’d only slightly prefer Doyle. Clayton is just too too.

Too toothy? Tiresome? Toasted?

anyone see the invited dress of Glengarry Glen Ross? and what happened to the planned all female revival?

Wikipedia has Max and Matt still together.

What are the stories of them being insufferable?

Nearly all the West End shows that have been filmed are sort of lifeless.

[quote]anyone see the invited dress of Glengarry Glen Ross? and what happened to the planned all female revival?

This one?

Remember when David Mamet toed the Republican line that make teachers were potential pedophiles?

^make = male

[quote]I'm not often a fan of modernization, but setting the play at a Gulf War-esque army base works beautifully.

No, it doesn't, because SO MANY of the lines and references in the text make absolutely no sense in that context. Not to mention the Shakespearean language.

The all-female production of GLENGARRY was one of the most idiotic ideas in theater history, right up there with the 1776 that darkened Broadway courtesy of the Roundabout. And we all know how THAT turned out.

r150 During Covid Matt reinvented himself as a Twitch streamer, and ended up getting thousands in donations to build himself a very expensive gaming table PC (as in the computer is built into the desk)...and then stopped streaming and didn't return.

[quote]But she taps! And taps. And….

You go, girl!

R157, who's Matt?

r159 You're an idiot.

Coffee Mate is for closers, R152.

[quote]The all-female production of GLENGARRY was one of the most idiotic ideas in theater history, right up there with the 1776 that darkened Broadway courtesy of the Roundabout. And we all know how THAT turned out.

No, it's imaginative and creative. Al hail the genius of taking an all-male cast and making it all-female! It's groundbreaking. Certainly in line with modern sensibilities and so forward-looking. Crowds will flock to see something they have never seen before.

An all female cast for Glengarry doesn't seem inherently bad. Why not?

Because Mamet agreed, but refused to let them change a word of his script. Including pronouns.

I actually prefer that to rewriting the scipt to be specifically for women.

With the right director/actors, that could be interesting.

Seeing as how GLENGARRY is largely about toxic masculinity, I cannot imagine the point of doing it with an all-female cast.

[quote]Seeing as how GLENGARRY is largely about toxic masculinity, I cannot imagine the point of doing it with an all-female cast.

See R165

They are running a lot of Gypsy ads on the local NYC tv stations.

Our society always allows all female versions of male things but never all male of female things.

For example, there was an all female Jesus Christ Superstar, 1776, and The Odd Couple

But never an all male Steel Magnolias

Wasn't there even an all-male NUNSENSE?

Jean Smart starring in "Call Me Izzy" this summer at Studio 54.

"Cats" will have to find another litter box.

Queen of Versailles opening at the St James this fall.

More on the Jean Smart news

[Quote] Because Mamet agreed, but refused to let them change a word of his script. Including pronouns.

Then that’s Mamet’s fault. Anyone who thinks that only men in the workplace can be toxic hasn’t worked with many women

R167, I don't think R165 answers my question, and I guess you don't have an answer for it, either.

Let's be honest, the main reason for casting women in men's roles and casting POC in traditionally white roles is for the sake of diversity and to give opportunities to actors from groups that have been underrepresented in the past. But to me, the big difference is that POC actors have truly, and obviously, been way underrepresented until very recently, whereas I've never felt that way about women, with all the great female roles open to them.

[Quote] But never an all male Steel Magnolias

It would have to be an all-male gay cast

[Quote] Let's be honest, the main reason for casting women in men's roles and casting POC in traditionally white roles is for the sake of diversity and to give opportunities to actors from groups that have been underrepresented in the past.

It’s also to present the same old stuff in a new way so poteaudineces are intrigued enough to come see it again

[quote]Anyone who thinks that only men in the workplace can be toxic hasn’t worked with many women

That's not what I meant, and indeed, I've experienced several toxic women in the workplace -- always in positions of management, never among the workforce, as I recall. But I do think men in business tend to be toxic in a different way from women. Everything about the writing in GLENGARRY screams "testosterone," and I just don't think it would work with women in any of those roles.

[Quote] "Cats" will have to find another litter box.

Don’t think the drag CATS, which was amazing, would make sense to a general bway audience

R179, there's nothing very complicated about the concept. A simple, brief program note should suffice.

If anything, I think the big question is whether a show filled with characters (and actors) who are drag queens and trans would be accepted in today's climate. How quickly, and tragically, things have changed since that POS was re-elected as POTUS.

Steel Magnolias is pretty gay as written.

It’s a play about gay men—Southern queens. Played by women. It always was.

Uh-oh. Call Me Izzy is a one woman show. This will definitely cost you big bucks, but could be painful.

Patti LuPone has more testosterone than most of the NY theater actor population.

Combined, r184.

Diarrhea- here I go again!

Well, R184, I can't really argue with you there :-)

Who would we cast in the all-male Steel Magnolias?

Andrew Rannells, Cole Escola, Jim Parsons

Nathan for sure.

R190. Nathan is definitely a Ouiser. Cole for Truvy.

[quote] But never an all male Steel Magnolias

An all male Steel Magnolias is kinda like having an all white cast for The Wiz.

The Adrian Lester/Rory Kinnear Othello on National Theatre at Home is excellent, far and away the best production of Othello I've seen. I saw James Earl Jones and Christopher Plummer do it in Boston a million years ago -- they were fine, especially Plummer -- but this one is better. The updating made it seem much more immediate.

R192 I’m sorry but what’s the difference between that and an all female 1776, which played on Broadway just a few seasons ago? You would be more likely to find men in the south gossiping in a barbershop than you would find women making decisions about the future of our country in the 1700s

Were any of the founding fathers female?

No link, R172? You’re.worse than Hitler.

It’s not going to do well…

Were any of the founding fathers Black or Latino?

Reminds me of Woody Allen pitching a fit over nonwhite dancers being cast in the stage version of " Bullets over Broadway" because Broadway casts were segregated a hundred years ago. Ultimately, no one who loves theater gives a fuck. They just want good theater.

Last night‘s performance of We Had a World had to be stopped midway because the actress Jeanine Serralles suddenly slumped back on a couch, clearly ill. Joanna Gleason called out, “We need a doctor—really.” One medical professional rushed to the stage to help her. MTC had to cancel the show, and we could hear Jeanine saying “I’m so sorry” over and over. Hopefully she will be all right.

The first half of the play was quite enjoyable, by the way.

What’s the doctor going to do but call 911?

[quote]What’s the doctor going to do but call 911?

Who knows, r199?

CPR? Call for the stage manager to grab the defibrillator? Diagnose a heart attack and administer aspirin? There's a lot a doctor can do, even without a medical bag...

But....she recovered.

I just watched the Rory Kinnear Othello and liked it. I understood the dialogue more than the current Broadway version and noticed similarities in costuming and staging between the 2. Thanks Datalounge!

Now back to Follies chatter and Mamet murmuring.

I wouldn't mind the female Glengary with no changes to the script, it would seem sillier to see them try to be more masculine. But maybe that is too silly. There is a t least 1 play like this where it calls for women to play an all male cast and basically make fun of being men: Men on Boats. Haven't seen it but it seems popular regionally.

R202. Fucking dehydration can really mess you up. Glad she's ok.

[quote] I’m sorry but what’s the difference between that and an all female 1776

I agree with 75 percent of this comment.

Re-gendering a play is very different from re-gendering a musical. For the latter, it's not enough to just put the songs into singable keys. Vocal arrangements and harmonies often need to be rewritten. And still the songs will sound "off" because of where the various sections lie in the singer's vocal range. Solos are usually fine, but the group numbers seldom end up sounding "right" because of the difference in voices.

[quote]There is a t least 1 play like this where it calls for women to play an all male cast

The Club

I think Robert Harling forbids male casting in Steel Magnolias. You'll get denied rights if you suggest you're going that route and if you do go that route, they'll shut down the production.

Even though it's so obviously a camp play and the only way it's interesting is if you play it as such.

It's so eye rollingly bad.

Very well, the parody route it is. Who wants to invest in my production of "Aluminum Tulips"?

"Those aren't tulips you silly queen...they're MARIGOLDS!!!!"

R208 that’s what I’m saying…most of the time such productions are forbidden and the right holder’s step in.

But the leading player in Pippin can be a female and win the Tony.

The 1776 all female cast revival that ran on Broadway

The Glenda Jackson King Lear.

But you never see a male in a female role (not trans, that’s different)

[quote]But you never see a male in a female role

Edna Turnblad's a female, r211.

Danny La Rue played Dolly in Hello Dolly in London, Titus Burgess played the Witch in Into the Woods in Miami, Craig Revel Horwood played Miss Hannigan in Annie in the West End and UK tour, then there's panto in Britain...

So much for "never".

Uh, there's been quite a few all male Shakespeare productions.

Auntie Mame has been done with a man several times.

Women do have juicy great roles but there's still far more male roles than female ones.

My God, no one wants to see the same shows over and over again. Directors want to shake things up to give the shows new meaning. Changing gender is just one of those ways—sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn’t.

“Uh, there's been quite a few all male Shakespeare productions.”

Centuries’ worth, in fact.

The one man in the world who doesn’t understand CHICAGO

[quote]My God, no one wants to see the same shows over and over again.

Unless it's " Gypsy." It should be done every two years. Wait a minute....it is.

Weak tea comedy.

Mother

Do theaters panic when they find out that Maya Phillips is assigned to review their show?

[Quote] Unless it's " Gypsy." It should be done every two years. Wait a minute....it is.

Even Gypsy had to shake things up with a Black actress

I doubt F. Murray Abraham will be in the cast of The Queen of Versailles on Broadway this fall. He only had one number when I saw it in Boston in July and it wasn’t a solo number. I suspect one of the things they’re doing is beefing up his role. I can see them recasting it with somebody like Tony Shalhoub. And maybe Shalhoub, unlike Abraham, will not insist that he share the final bow with Chenoweth, denying her the single bow she deserved.

F. MURRAY is performing down the street, at the Irish Rep, as we speak.

[quote]Because Mamet agreed, but refused to let them change a word of his script. Including pronouns.

Well considering every other word is "fuck", how many words could they actually change?

Ooof. Is that guy on the spectrum, R217? He's such a... literalist.

It was a joke—I hope.

[quote]Who would we cast in the all-male Steel Magnolias?

All of the actors have to be named Mark, Rick, or Steve.

Queens were out and about at town hall tonight!

Jonathan Larson trunk songs? I have had sufficient.

There have been a lot of male Lady Bracknells.

Helloooooo!!!!

You guys are missing the point.

Hairspray was written as a man in drag

Charles Busch writes his own plays

I’m talking about a work of art where the estate later authorize males to play the female roles (my examples of the reverse being Pippin, 1776, King Lear ect)

What I’m saying is Glenda Jackson can be heralded for doing King Lear on Broadway, but if a man played Lady Macbeth it would be derided as either camp fest, disrespectful, misogynist or a joke!

You’re dancing on the head of pin there. Artistically, it IS the same thing.

Good to know Shakespeare’s Scottish play bombed its initial run at the Globe because of the boy playing Lady Macbeth.

Quite right, R235. Men had years of playing Shakespeare heroines before women got a go at it.

In fact, I can see the DL of the day when that change occurred: "All this new Woke piffle, where women have to play female roles, is detracting from the PLAYS! Don't directors know what ACTING is anymore?"

Or the worth of a boy with a hot ass?

Would a man be a better Sally or Phyllis?

Definitely a Phyllis, R238. Though you do have to consider it would answer the question of why Ben hadn't married Sally right up-front.

[quote]What I’m saying is Glenda Jackson can be heralded for doing King Lear on Broadway, but if a man played Lady Macbeth it would be derided as either camp fest, disrespectful, misogynist or a joke!

You may be right in reference to dramatic roles, but Mark Rylance got great reviews and had a hit when he played Olivia in TWELFTH NIGHT on Broadway in 2013, and I expect he would get the same reception now, despite all that's changed in the world even since then.

He won a Tony for she

R239. I remember Could I Leave You being sung by a man in Side by Side by Sondheim and it worked beautifully. I saw an understudy (I think his name was Jack Blackton) and he really nailed it.

The gender-swapped "Could I Leave You?" is also featured in the new Sondheim revue, [bold]Old Friends[/bold]. Unfortunately, when I saw it last month at the Ahmanson in L.A., Gavin Lee (who I normally like) camped the hell out of it. I much prefer David Kernan's rendition in [bold]Side by Side by Sondheim[/bold].

News flash: Audiences like to see famous people. Also, expensive tickets = profit.

The new grosses are in. Woof to Gypsy.

I believe the correct name, r245, is Audra Gypsy.

I almost never look at the grosses on Playbill, so can someone please explain to me what order the shows are listed in?

Usually it's alphabetical. This week, it's reverse alphabetical.

^^^^Thanks. Because of the way they alphabetize show titles that begin with "The," I don't think I would have gotten that on my own. Are you serious that it suddenly changed from alphabetical to reverse-alphabetical, and if so, any idea why?

[quote]r233 = Hairspray was written as a man in drag

No, it wasn't. Edna is a biological woman who gave birth to Tracy. Where in the script is she referred to as a man in drag?

Audra's $1.2M and average $124 ticket price is nothing to sneeze at! It's better than Sunset Blvd.

Edna in Hairspray was conceived as a man in drag, but written as a woman. The writing does wink at the concept though, with Edna's occasional lapses into a low male voice when threatening Velma. The writing is solid -the audience accepts Edna as a character/person, without regard to the sex of the actor portraying her. Could a man play Phyllis or Sally in Follies? The right man could. Would the Goldman estate ever allow it? Hell no.

[quote]The writing does wink at the concept though, with Edna's occasional lapses into a low male voice when threatening Velma.

Does Travolta do that, r252?

I remember that, not long after HAIRSPRAY opened on Broadway, Harvey Fierstein said that Edna might someday be played by a woman, in which case perhaps Motormouth Maybelle could be played by a man in drag. But I don't know if either of those two pieces of casting have yet happened in any production.

Of course, the role of Edna was conceived as a woman who is meant to played by a man in drag. As it was in the original John Waters movie, the stage musical, the movie version of the stage musical, and the TV version of the stage musical. Amazing that there's any confusion or argument over this point.

[quote]Amazing that there's any confusion or argument over this point.

There isn't, r254. I stand by this post being incorrect:

[quote][R233] = Hairspray was written as a man in drag

Lea Michele's hitting the road this early summer.

Englewood!

Watch your wigs!

FOLLIES stinks. Who cares about Phyllis or Sally? It's a bad show. Stop this already.

Look up the words fat chance, r259.

[quote]FOLLIES stinks. Who cares about Phyllis or Sally? It's a bad show. Stop this already.

SACRILEGE!!!

R259 is a BLASPHEMER!!!

[quote][R259] is a BLASPHEMER!!!

And an interloper.

R259 is a VULGARIAN!!!!

And, has bad taste.

Hell hath no fury than a geriatric showtune queen scorned.

You *don't* piss on FOLLIES. It's the one musical in the canon with...mystique.

Yea, that’s the ticket🤔

BOOP! and SMASH! both begin previews tonight.

Let the sniping begin! Finally, some new topics.

We need an All-Black Follies!! Whom would you cast?

Isn’t the one character in Steel Magnolias pregnant? She’s got diabetes and dies because she risked having a baby. How is a man supposed to do that?

r271, we might be able to have the casting director "go into the community" to find a male "Birthing Person" as they are known now in the Jolly ole UK.

Apparently all who give birth are not women. anymore

Fuck off, r272.

Is Gypsy getting an Original Cast Album?

Why wouldn't it, r274?

R223, the wonderful Peter Friedman did the early readings of “Queen of Versailles”, but he was deemed to be too likable. I doubt they’d replace F. Murray with Shaloub, who’s the most lovable performer ever.

Meanwhile, I know three people high up on the production team (all backstage), and they are scared SHITLESS about the show flying.

“Not sure this is the time to do a show about vulgar rich people with a mansion in Florida. A real estate mogul who’s a convicted felon, and a tacky, clueless wife who has nothing but contempt for ‘the little people’.”

And it’s still almost three hours long.

The best thing QUEEN OF VERSAILLES has going for it is Michael Arden as its director. I trust him to make something very interesting out of it. Even if the show isn't a hit, he'll make it provocative and engaging.

Unsurprisingly, the early BWW chatter on Smash and Boop! is rather dire.

THIS DAY IN BROADWAY HISTORY: In 1987, “Les Miserable” opened at the Broadway Theatre.

Interesting that STREETCAR wasn't given a "Critics' Pick" by Jesse. I've actually ready more critical reviews by him that were Ctitics' Picks. I guess the show doesn't need it since it's almost sold out at ridiculous prices.

R275. Exactly. Why wouldn't it? I'm asking because I haven't heard anything about a recording yet and it's been running for a few months now.

R280 and the fact that he gives it out too easily made it better to hold back (since no one can get a ticket).

He loved all of the performances, but he dinged the stylized production choices.

You talkin' about Slash and Poop! ?

[quote]Is Gypsy getting an Original Cast Album?

It already did. The ORIGINAL cast was recorded in 1959.

Audra was so young then.

I would have thought it would go without saying that Audra's GYPSY would absolutely, unquestionably, without fail get a cast recording, and I'm actually surprised the deal wasn't in place from the beginning. But seeing how there is STILL no word of such a recording, maybe it won't happen after all? Fine with me, because I certainly won't buy it, as I'm one of the naysayers who feel her voice is all wrong for the role.

You think a lot of odd things, don’t you?

R286, why is it "odd" for someone to think that GYPSY starring Audra McDonald would definitely get a cast recording, and that the deal might even have been set before the show opened?

Because it is a cheap rhetorical set up, for the last sentence: the tiresome trope that she shouldn’t be doing the show in the first place. That’s why.

The "tiresome trope" that Audra is wrong for the role vocally -- which is what I wrote -- is an opinion held by many people. And anyway, it has NOTHING to do with the fact that I would have thought a cast album was guaranteed specifically because of Audra's star status, regardless of how I or anyone else feel about her vocal performance.

YOU wrote it in the very same paragraph! YOU made it everything to do with that fact. Read your own damn writing.

Or, learn to write better.

[Quote] The "tiresome trope" that Audra is wrong for the role vocally -- which is what I wrote -- is an opinion held by many people.

Even the Baby June from the original cast says Audra is the best Rose she’s seen.

I’ll take her word for it.

R293, Lane Bradbury played DAINTY June. Get it right before you post.

Or maybe, R291, you should learn to read better.

Maybe one reason no one has ponied up to make a cast album of this GYPSY is that record producers have read criticism of Audra's vocal performance, and may be correct in their thought that people who will gladly pay big bucks to see Audra in the show won't necessarily pay for an audio recording.

Sure, R293. As if it's a statement of fact rather than an opinion.

Move along, toots. Strunk & White are waiting for you.

It'd actually be quite smart to hold off on the cast recording until Tony season, get a blast of publicity just as the votes are going in. Possibly even hold a release party and invite the voters and give a chance for some schmoozing without it looking like a blatant FYC event.

Does anyone even buy OBCs anymore? That said, this GYPSY cast is a revelation and should be preserved. I really wish it could filmed—Audra’s Rose is spectacular

[quote]It'd actually be quite smart to hold off on the cast recording until Tony season, get a blast of publicity just as the votes are going in. Possibly even hold a release party and invite the voters and give a chance for some schmoozing without it looking like a blatant FYC event.

Good idea, but if the deal for the album isn't even set yet, it's highly unlikely they would be able to get it out in time for the height of Tony season.

There's been a couple of photos of Audra and other cast members in the studio, so seems likely it's already been recorded

Wasn't Alexis Smith in Follies? Was she any good?

R301, no, the cast album of GYPSY has not yet been recorded. Maybe those photos of Audra and the cast in a studio were taken when they were recording promotional audio for radio spots, etc.

And you know that how?

How do I know that no cast album of GYPSY has yet been recorded? Because I know people who would absolutely know if it had already happened, aside from the fact that such things are usually announced via press release.

But if you'd like to believe that the cast album has already been recorded in secret, and no word of it has yet been publicized, be my guest.

The likelihood of a secret recording sessions seems greater than you having friends.

Not one, but THREE shows start previews this week and THIS is what we're arguing about?

Oh, excuse me ... FIVE shows.

First of all, r307, r308, this is DataLounge. Eldergays don't rush out to see first previews of anything.

Yet they are the eldergays who still buy OBCs, r299.

An understudy went on at the first SMASH preview. Kudos for 'the show must go on' and not canceling.

No, this is DataLounge, where anything remotely related to Sondheim is worshipped for countless posts until every little detail has been revealed. Wait a couple months and the same info is repeated as if it's new.

Sorry, R307, I think whether or not there will be a cast recording of Audra's GYPSY is a subject of more than moderate interest.

P.S. to R306: What kind of a person are you to respond to a post you disagree with by suggesting that the poster has no friends? As it happens, I think I have a reasonable number of friends, but NOT numbering you among them makes me very happy :-)

There's probably no album because projected sales would be about 115 copies.

Audra: gorgeous singer and fine actress. With completely the wrong voice for the role.

Gypsy isn't an operetta...it's a burlesque fable.

[quote]What kind of a person are you to respond to a post you disagree with by suggesting that the poster has no friends?

A DLer.

[quote] Wasn't Alexis Smith in Follies? Was she any good?

She stole that year’s Tony Award from a more deserving nominee.

[Quote] There's probably no album because projected sales would be about 115 copies.

Like every other OBC recording in recent memory

[Quote] Audra: gorgeous singer and fine actress. With completely the wrong voice for the role. Gypsy isn't an operetta...it's a burlesque fable.

Where’s the rule that says in a burlesque fable, you can’t use head voice ever

It’s right here on this thread!

Nowhere else on earth, but here.

Speaking of Gypsy, Audra is out tonite.

Well, considering Gypsy isn't selling that great, I guess a lot of people think maybe her casting wasn't such a hot idea.

Audra is excellent casting. It’s just that no one cares about yet another Gypsy

I wonder what David Ehrenstein thinks about this Black head-singing Gypsy?

R322, not much ‘cause his ass be dead

If she keeps missing -- however good or not her reasons for missing -- the show might not make it to Tony nominations.

[quote] An understudy went on at the first SMASH preview. Kudos for 'the show must go on' and not canceling.

Stro’s productions are always very well run. They’re not very good, but they’re very well run.

"Well, considering Gypsy isn't selling that great, I guess a lot of people think maybe her casting wasn't such a hot idea."

More likely the fact that this is the forty-seventh revival of Gypsy in the last ten years has something to do with it...

The previous Gypsy revival on Broadway was 16 years ago.

But, that revival was only 5 years after the previous and that was ridiculously close together.

The problem with Audra's Gypsy is that she's not a Mama Rose. Not in her wheelhouse at all. Audra is a terrific singer and actress...in the right roles. But Mama Rose requires someone who can really play those notes: ballsy, loud, brash, comedic, and a bit crazy. All at the same time.

And, the comedy part is important. You need an actress who can play the comedy because there's a lot of humor in the show and if you don't mine that humor, it's an overly grim story.

Audra isn't a comedienne.

[quote]If you want to see how Everything's Coming up Roses should be done, today's Lucy Show, season two episode 19, it's sung by the woman who created the character.

I was so afraid you were going to say that Lucy sing it.

Aw. Bernie on the Tonight Show. Her voice sounds much stronger than when I saw her in concert a few years ago. Makes me more excited to see Old Friends this spring.

They say GYPSY is the female, musical version of KING LEAR. Unfortunately Audra is playing it that way. And she'll probably get a Tony for it.

R327, I'm one of the people here who feel Audra is all wrong vocally for the role of Rose in GYPSY, and I stand by that, but I have to disagree with you about her acting. I think her acting performance in this production, as reconceived by George C. Wolfe et al., is excellent overall, in both the comic and dramatic scenes.

I do think there's one point in the show, "Rose's Turn," where she loses control because she suddenly starts playing Rose like Medea or (as per R330) like King Lear. But other than that, I would say her acting is solid for this new conception of the role and the show.

Medea or Madea?

I didn't find Audra remotely funny as Rose. For me, this is totally misguided and ill-conceived performance. "Rose's Turn" was cringe-worthy. And it has nothing to do with her race.

But, yes, she'll win that Tony again.

R333, I agree with you about "Rose's Turn," but Audra got lots of laughs at the performance I attended, and people don't laugh when something's not funny. So I have to disagree with you there.

I wasn't laughing. Sorry you missed me, r334.

Audiences laugh all of the time at things that aren't funny, much of it at inappropriate times in a drama. They are either uncomfortable or thought they attended a comedy.

R336, but if lines that are meant to be funny get laughs, as happens many times with Audra in GYPSY, then I think you should admit she's succeeding with the comedy.

Ashley Graham will be broadways next Roxie Hart! Wait. Who?

Chick with quite big tits.

Bernadette in that clip: Isn't she straining her voice badly? And her face is frighteningly frozen.

Some things don’t change.

[Quote] Stro’s productions are always very well run. They’re not very good, but they’re very well run.

I now avoid all Stro-directed shows. They’re ALWAYS bad and it’s the director’s fault

I found Audra’s Rose to be the most deeply felt I’ve ever seen. I a loved that she is able to make the character a more complex and nuanced one by not belting her way through it like a steamtrain,

I have never cried after a Rose’s Turn except now—you feel for her when the world she created begins to fall apart.

The big problem for most people is that we’re done with Gypsy. It’s supposed to be the “perfect” musical (the version with Bernadette proved to me it’s not)—but it’s also dates to a time and place that doesn’t speak to modern audiences. Musical Theatre has moved forward so we go to see the diva, not the show.

[Quote] "Rose's Turn" was cringe-worthy.

That’s such Bull Shit.

Audra built that character so expertly that Rose Turn was the catharsis we’d all been waiting does. It was brilliant.

I hope to high heaven that a cast recording of Audra's Gypsy IS released, because it is already becoming gloomily apparent that "Whether Audra had the right voice for Gypsy" is still going to be debated on Theatre Gossip Thread #300,000, many years after her death at 99.

If we don't get a cast recording that can prove anything it will be way worse--c.f. we don't have a good video recording of the original Follies, and look where that's landed us.

If the producers of Operation Mincemeat think they've got a shot at a Best Musical Tony, they are grossly mistaken. What a piece of overcooked shite.

R345, there is already sufficient promotional video/audio of Audra singing the role -- not to mention unauthorized recordings -- for posterity to make their own decision.

[quote]I found Audra’s Rose to be the most deeply felt I’ve ever seen. I a loved that she is able to make the character a more complex and nuanced one by not belting her way through it like a steamtrain,

Several previous Roses have NOT "belted their way through the score like a steam train." Most of them, in fact, did nothing of the kind. But also, none of them sang sections of songs that were obviously written to be belted in an operatic-sounding soprano voice, which is the issue with Audra's performance.

[Quote] But also, none of them sang sections of songs that were obviously written to be belted in an operatic-sounding soprano voice, which is the issue with Audra's performance.

And yet, the lyricist was excited for Audra to play the role. He fully understood that she could bring something to the role no one else has.

"The lyricist" also approved of Helena Bonham-Carter and Johnny Depp in SWEENEY TODD, so I would say that's an example of one of his frequent minority opinions.

R350, there are far more people making decisions in a movie than the lyricist. For a musical, the lyricist has more sway and say

[Quote] "The lyricist" also approved of Helena Bonham-Carter and Johnny Depp in SWEENEY TODD, so I would say that's an example of one of his frequent minority opinions.

I guess that settles it then: I’ll take the word of a random internet schmo over Sondheim’s

To be fair, does anyone think that SS in his mid-80s would tell Audra, "No, you're all wrong for Rose. Try something else." ?

[Quote] To be fair, does anyone think that SS in his mid-80s would tell Audra, "No, you're all wrong for Rose. Try something else." ?

To be fair, with no reports of senility, Sondheim knew exactly what he was saying?

All I want to know is why in hell did they put her in a blue dress for Rose’s Turn? Dreadful!!!

[quote]All I want to know is why in hell did they put her in a blue dress for Rose’s Turn? Dreadful!!!

It's an homage to me.

[quote][R350], there are far more people making decisions in a movie than the lyricist

Understood, but what I meant was, Sondheim was very vocal about loving the movie of SWEENEY TODD when it was completed. And I don't think he could have loved it if he didn't approve of the casting of Depp and Bonham-Carter, including their very limited talent as singers.

[quote]I guess that settles it then: I’ll take the word of a random internet schmo over Sondheim’s.

We're not discussing someone's "word" about the facts of his career, we're discussing an opinion. Have you never disagreed with any opinions voiced by a composer, lyricist, actor, director, designer, etc. about their own work?

Kill us now! Or please stop this crapfest.

We need a Jamie Lloyd directed version of Chorus Line next.

If not Mincemeat, what would you choose or expect for Best Musical, R346?

[quote]r350 = "The lyricist" also approved of Helena Bonham-Carter and Johnny Depp in SWEENEY TODD, so I would say that's an example of one of his frequent minority opinions.

What is your proof that that's a minority opinion, r361? The movie didn't do badly at the box office...which is the ultimate barometer.

^oops r350

Audra is out again tonight. I'm not sure I'd ever invest in a show she is carrying.

I wasn't talking about Sondheim's mental acuity, just his reluctance to offend a friend, r354.

[Quote] We're not discussing someone's "word" about the facts of his career, we're discussing an opinion. Have you never disagreed with any opinions voiced by a composer, lyricist, actor, director, designer, etc. about their own work?

Of course, but instead of just leaving it as your opinion you’re casting aspersions on Sondheim’s taste in general, desperate to show that your taste is better than his generally

r343 No...Musical theater hasn't moved forward.

Quite the contrary. Endless jukebox shows and stupid shows based on stupid movies isn't moving forward. It's just lazy.

And the lack of actual great songs is also indicative of a lack of "improvement".

Or, if musical theater does do something different, (Hamilton) then it gets sneered at thought that was largely out of racism.

[quote]Of course, but instead of just leaving it as your opinion you’re casting aspersions on Sondheim’s taste in general, desperate to show that your taste is better than his generally

No, I stated that Sondheim frequently voiced minority opinions on various subjects, and I stand by that statement. To me, it sometimes seemed that he liked to be contrarian in voicing his opinions, almost as an intellectual exercise. But I don't think that's the same as casting aspersions on his taste in general, and I would never be so arrogant as to claim that my taste is better than Stephen Sondheim's generally.

[quote]I wasn't talking about Sondheim's mental acuity, just his reluctance to offend a friend, [R354].

I completely understood what you meant, R365. It's amazing how some people here consistently read their own meaning into other people's posts, even when the intended meaning is clear and very different from their misinterpretation of it.

I'm not r346 but I'd love to see MAYBE HAPPY ENDING win the Best Musical Tony this season. It's honestly the only new Broadway musical I've seen in many years that I can honestly say I truly loved.

Though I haven't yet seen it I hear DEAD OUTLAW may win. Glad to see that off-beat and original fresh works like these 2 shows may beat out stupid stuff like DEATH BECOMES HER, BOOP! and SMASH.

I wonder if Darren Criss will be the front runner in the lead actor in a musical category? Who might be his biggest competition?

If Criss wins the Tony and if Maybe Happy Ending wins a Best Cast Album Grammy, he's 3/4 of the way to his EGOT.

Thanks to the Talk Show Troll, I recorded the Gypsy performance on yesterday's Kelly Clarkson Show. It was the very last segment of the show and clearly taped at the Majestic (you could hear an audience laugh). They did Together Wherever We Go, and it was fine ("funny and fine," if you will). Audra was playing it for laughs (and got them) but also seemed a little bit manic, which worked (for me) for Rose. Danny Burstein got the biggest laugh for not even attempting to "hit B-flat." I missed the pie plates, but thought, Oh, right, not the Robbins choreography. I love Gypsy, and if I was anywhere near New York I'd get a ticket.

Sidebar: Kelly Clarkson was out, and Willie Geist filled in for her. Is he aiming to be a daytime talk show host? I didn't watch any of the rest of the show so I can't say if he was any good.

R371-I think it will be between Criss and Jeremy Jordan.

[Quote] Quite the contrary. Endless jukebox shows and stupid shows based on stupid movies isn't moving forward. It's just lazy.

Like it or not, this shit is musical theatre today. It’s formulated for tourists who have a connection to singers, movies, and celebrities.

Yes. Gypsy is a great work of art but it doesn’t resonate with the people buying tickets, unless a big celebrity like Kim Kardashian were starring in it

[Quote] I wasn't talking about Sondheim's mental acuity, just his reluctance to offend a friend,

Or maybe, just maybe, it was really happy at the thought of today’s greatest musical theater actress starring in it…

Someone I know said he has an out-of-town friend who's planning to come with his child to NYC next month specifically to see Audra in GYPSY, but given her number of absences so far, my friend has advised him to have a backup show in mind.

"Broadway The American Musical" Full Documentary

R374 and the guy from Sunset Boulevard....

It's bullshit to suggest people aren't buying tickets to Gypsy because it's "old".

People aren't buying tickets to see this Gypsy because they're not enthused by this particular production. And, no, it doesn't mean you need Kim Kardashian in the role...she's not that popular anymore anyway. If they had announced "Jennifer Coolidge is Mama Rose!" it would sell out for months.

Even "Megan Mullally in Gypsy" would probably sell better than Audra.

And, that's not necessarily a diss on Audra but...she really isn't a big box office kind of star. REAL musical theater fans love her but to the general public...she's a bit eh. And, the dedicated musical theater fans are all a bit divided about this production (as evidenced by the endless discussions on DL about it).

Together...

Gypsy cancelled tonite due to illness in the company.

^ make that illnessES within the company. It's odd that 3 months after opening Rose, June and Louise only have one understudy each. That's unheard of in musicals today.

Gypsy has canceled a lot! Are they tied with Death Becomes Her?

It’s true that Audra isn’t a big star outside Broadway. White audiences also may not go to see a “Black” musical, which is how they may see Gypsy now. Tourists who aren’t the standard theatre aficionados have never heard of Gypsy,

That said, Audra is incredible, in a once-in-a-lifetime performance. I was just amazed at how she was able to create completely different motivations for the character than I’ve ever seen. Go see it!

I'm waiting for the Caitlyn Jenner revival of Gypsy at the new revamped Kennedy Center

[quote]Bernadette in that clip: Isn't she straining her voice badly? And her face is frighteningly frozen.

Y'all are relentless. Bernadette is nearly EIGHTY. Maybe I've just gotten acclimated to her over the years, but, yeah, she's had plenty of work done. There aren't many consistently working actresses in the business over the age of 70 who haven't. And, yeah, of course her voice is diminished compared to what it was in her 30s, 40s, 50s. But, I actually think it sounds fuller and stronger than it has in the last 5 or so years. Also, hats off to The Roots -- they absolutely nailed that Marvin Laird Broadway Baby sound. I imagine that performance made ol Marv smile from from the.... Heaviside Layer.

R385. White audiences also may not go to see a “Black” musical, which is how they may see Gypsy now.

Hmmmm.

Maybe black audiences are avoiding Gypsy because they see it as a 'white' musical.

Or maybe nobody wants to see Gypsy again.

[Quote] Maybe black audiences are avoiding Gypsy because they see it as a 'white' musical.

Possible but I don’t think black audiences make up enough mass to move a musical one way or other

I have ZERO issues with folks sharing their opinions on this revival of Gypsy and their theories on why business may be good, but not great. But, Lord, when you queens start posting your opinions and theories as declarative facts, it... gets tiring. (I know not ALL of you are doing that... but some of you are serial offenders!)

Caitlyn's a Mame, r386.

My theory is that all the Audra hate here is spawned by "Sunset Blvd" friends and family . Their only hope for the Tony for their star is make everyone believe Audra isn't right for the part and she can't sing it.

Audra is remarkable in the role, one of the finest musical theater performances in a long, long time.

R392. I actually saw Gypsy and am not related to Sunset Blvd and hate Nicole’s politics. However, I would vote for the Tony for Nicole.

To me it doesn’t even matter that Audra’s voice is not the traditional Rose voice.

Her performance to me was just odd. There was a weird accent and I found NOTHING in her performance that would lead me to believe that Herbie would love her.

Also, the dressing room scene was not as devastating as I’ve previously seen it.

It was a good night in the theatre. Nobody was BAD, but you can also not be wowed by the performance and that not mean you are racist, obsessed with whether or not her voice is good, or a Nicole super fan.

[quote]It's odd that 3 months after opening Rose, June and Louise only have one understudy each. That's unheard of in musicals today.

It would seem that, aside from the controversy over Audra's performance, the direction of the show, and other aspects of the production, there is a lot of ineptitude on the producing end of this GYPSY. Do they have any idea how much ill will they're creating by STILL canceling performances at this point? I think a lot of people were willing to give them the benefit of the doubt at the beginning of the run, for various reasons, but....now???

[quote] Do they have any idea how much ill will they're creating by STILL canceling performances at this point? I think a lot of people were willing to give them the benefit of the doubt at the beginning of the run, for various reasons, but....now???

Shows only get cancelled if something pretty catastrophic happens. I assume everyone is really sick. It will hit other shows soon enough

Audra will win the Tony. This is her greatest moment on the Bway stage.

[quote]Shows only get cancelled if something pretty catastrophic happens. I assume everyone is really sick. It will hit other shows soon enough

Why would you assume such a thing? Have you heard that there is another specific illness going around right now?

Jennifer Simard sat out last Sunday's matinee of DBH, yet was completely recovered for Broadway's Leading Ladies on Monday.

[quote]Shows only get cancelled if something pretty catastrophic happens. I assume everyone is really sick. It will hit other shows soon enough

[quote]Why would you assume such a thing? Have you heard that there is another specific illness going around right now?

r395 said they "assume[d that] everyone is really sick", which is a reasonable assumption to make if they had to cancel a performance over it. If you're questioning the inference that other shows will be affected soon, all I can say is that even pre-Covid, theaters were petri dishes. Illness rapidly sweeps through companies, and if a theater next to yours had an outbreak, you'd better believe everyone in yours was doubling up on precautions, staying in between shows etc, because nobody wants to be next.

r381 We did it better.

I wonder what Sondheim thought?

Caitlyn is a Mame the way Lucy was a Mame...

Together gave Angela a chance to do her high kicks!

It's too bad Bea Arthur never got a crack at Gypsy. She would have been great.

Not that Dorothy Loudon post-Annie wasn't a hypothetical draw, but I've always wondered if Ballroom was originally intended for Bea Arthur. It would have been her first project after Maude.

R400, that performance was so stunning, who give a fuck what Sondheim thought!

Wait is Nicole's Norma considered good? I saw it last week and her singing is great and I can artistically justify the 'vision' of the show, but it's still all pretty medium...right? v

We're back, Eldergays!

Caitlyn's a Bruce to me.

R398. Simard is out quite a bit. If you follow understudies.org you'll notice she's been out at least once a week and there have been performances where understudies were on for both leads. But, as talented as she is, she's not a name performer so most audiences probably don't care.

There too busy beating down on Audra…

That is disappointing news about Simard, and quite surprising, I would say.

This should be fun

Evita is not written for a legit stage voice like Ziegler's. It's the same problem as Audra in Gypsy. Evita should be played by a belter.

Audra is brilliant in Gypsy. There are moments when she's the best Rose I've ever seen, but there are also moments where her soprano singing drags her down a bit. For the record, I've seen Patti, Bernadette, Betty, and Tyne, and of course, Imelda, Bette, and Roz.

Her Rose's Turn is the most coherent rendition I've ever seen or heard, for the first time for me nothing about the song feels abstract or obtuse, I followed every beat and took the journey with her seamlessly.

At the end of the day, she holds her own in the company of esteemed actresses to essay the role, even if her voice prevents her sailing to the top.

Audra played Eva at 16 years old!

She’s come a long way from Fresno.

Audra builds her character far better than I’ve ever seen for that role. Consequently, Rose’s Turn is shattering. Your heart just breaks for her.

I had absolutely no problem with her voice.

I love how Audra acts every word of each song. It’s difficult to describe to someone who hasn’t seen it. She sing-speaks some lines to emphasize the lyrics. This gives the show a major twist

[quote]I'd love to see MAYBE HAPPY ENDING win the Best Musical Tony this season. It's honestly the only new Broadway musical I've seen in many years that I can honestly say I truly loved.

I hope the MHE producers hire whoever did Avenue Q's Tony campaign. It deserves to win Best Musical. Beautiful, beautiful show.

In my mind, Audra is flat out the smartest actor working in musical theater. Even if you don’t like her voice, she brings a full character to life. Her Carrie Pepperidge showed how a vibrant girl turns into a bitter mother. Her Sharon showed a talented young artist who is afraid of her own talent, both needy and resentful of Callas. Her Sarah was 100% emotionally driven, unable to deal with a world trying to destroy her.

I have never seen an actor follow her up with deeper take on a character. That’s not for everyone, but it’s why she has six Tonys.

[quote]Evita is not written for a legit stage voice like Ziegler's. It's the same problem as Audra in Gypsy. Evita should be played by a belter.

Of course, Zegler did no belting in WEST SIDE STORY, but that doesn't mean she can't. I am guessing, and hoping, she also has a fine belt voice that we haven't heard yet, or she would not have been cast as Evita.

I’m more concerned about her suspenders voice. Will it hold up?

[quote]I love how Audra acts every word of each song. It’s difficult to describe to someone who hasn’t seen it. She sing-speaks some lines to emphasize the lyrics. T

See, I generally hate it when she does that, just as I felt when Julie Andrews did it so often. On the night I saw GYPSY, Audra basically stopped singing about half-way through "Rose's Turn," and spoke or shouted the rest of the number. This is NOT what was intended by the show's creators, or it would have been written that way. Of course, she got a huge ovation after the number regardless, but I thought it was the most out-of-control rendition I've ever seen and head.

Ok ^ she hates Julie & Audra.

Muriel—take her to the woodshed.

Fuck you, r424. IT'S FRIDAY!

Take her yourself. Wherever the fuck "the woodshed" is.

NO, I adore both Julie and Audra! I just don't like it when they overdo the speak-singing. To me, that's a technique that needs to be used very, very sparingly.

Hate is the fourth word in your post. You wrote, not anyone else.

[quote]r427 = Hate is the fourth word in your post.

Some people hate speak/singing...so?

Okay, yes, I do hate it when Julie or Audra or anyone else speak-sings too much, but of course that's not the same as hating the artists. (And of course it doesn't apply to songs that were written to be performed that way, like Higgins's songs in MY FAIR LADY.)

So why did Julie Andrews never play Mama Rose?

Because of R429

The producers should have let Hannah Waddingham take over for Audra at then end of her run.

That makes zero sense, r432.

The comments say she flubbed a line... what one?

Hannah is far too voluptuous to be Rose.

She's a Mazeppa.

R434, she repeats an earlier line after “still the princess, still the prize.” She then goes to the correct line about Buddy’s shoulder. The orchestra follows her. Surprisingly, not a great performance of the song.

Julie may be an English rose, but she's no Momma Rose.

Broadway Marquees To Dim Quarterly To Widen Scope Of Memorial Honorees; Solo Dimmings For Select Individuals Will Continue:

No, r437, but she *was* Eliza Doolittle when My Fair Lady opened on Broadway 69 years ago...tomorrow.

[quote]The producers should have let Hannah Waddingham take over for Audra at then end of her run.

Obviously THAT isn't happening, but, do you think Hannah would be a good Desiree? I know Hannah has impressive pipes and Desiree is a role that demands vocal restraint, but she has the right kind of glamour, presence and sense of humor, I think. I'd love to see a PROPER revival with a full set + large orchestra, but it would require a big star or star(s) in the cast to sell.

I was living in Sacramento when 16 year old Audra played Eva in Fresno. Everyone in the central valley heard about how sensational she was.

Well, r441...it *is* an opera.

r440

Didn't she play Desiree in London and was replaced by 30 year old Catherine Zeta Jones?

[quote]On the night I saw GYPSY, Audra basically stopped singing about half-way through "Rose's Turn," and spoke or shouted the rest of the number. This is NOT what was intended by the show's creators, or it would have been written that way. Of course, she got a huge ovation after the number regardless, but I thought it was the most out-of-control rendition I've ever seen and head.

I doesn't matter what YOU think the creators intended. They are long dead. If shows are going to survive for decades afterwards, the directors and actors will have to find a new way of presenting the material.

Is Shakespeare only to be done the way he intended it? No, there have been loads of innovating new ways to re-present the same material to the audience. The very fact that Audra got a "huge ovation" means it spoke to the audience. You're a curmudgeon stuck in the 1959.

I loved the way Audra talked to parts of the songs. She emphasized certain phrases that I had never contemplated before--all to build up the motivations for her character. She was spellbinding.

Watched The Crucible on National Theatre At Home. An interesting, if uneven, production. American/New England accents were all over the place (not in a good way). The singing was fantastic, especially the opening shape-note hymn, but then every time you heard humming or singing you knew something bad was coming. The rain effect was also great but to no real purpose (unless it represented the Flood washing away humanity’s sins). Some excellent acting, some… less so. The trial scene was gripping, though. I know I had to read the play in high school, but I’m pretty sure this was the first time I’d seen a production of it.

[quote]Jennifer Simard sat out last Sunday's matinee of DBH, yet was completely recovered for Broadway's Leading Ladies on Monday.

That's nothing. When Karen Olivo was in Moulin Rouge, I saw her perform (with full gusto) at the afternoon Gypsy Of The Year event, but when I went to see Moulin Rouge that same evening ( a mere 2+ hours after the GOTY performance ended) she was out due to illness. Now that's ballsy!

Waddingham is a Charlotte, not a Desiree.

How many shows can a performer miss each week/month before their pay is docked?

So is SMASH just "Some Like It Hot" redux? Sound and fury adding to nothing?

Because she's so not Mama Rose, R430.

R448, she played Desiree in London. Sondheim saw her and was moved to tears. She won an Olivier for the performance. But this is Datalounge, so you will still insist she was miscast.

Wrong, R436. Ebersole sings the lyrics exactly as written in that part of the song. The only flub is that she comes in a beat too early on the line "still the prize" itself. I do think this was one of the greatest performances of the song ever, and the audience ovation that night supported my opinion.

As I recall, only two of the cast members seriously screwed up in that FOLLIES concert: (1) Barbara Walsh, the wife of the concert's producer, who somehow managed to mess up some of her VERY few solo lines in "Waiting for the Girls Upstairs," and (2) some random, unknown chorus boy who completely missed one of his solo spoken lines in "Loveland," and I'm sure has never spoken to since by any of his Sondheimite friends :-)

I was at the Follies concert and honestly don’t remember Barbara Walsh messing up the song (I’m sure it happened)

I was personally grateful to see her. Her voice on the Falsetto’s songs and “Stop, Time” have always been favorites

[quote]You're a curmudgeon stuck in 1959.

Whether or not I'm a curmudgeon, I'm not stuck in 1959 just because I think much of Rose's role in GYPSY is meant to be belted in the alto range rather than sung in a soprano register. EVERYONE who has sung the role in every major production I know of, starting with Merman and up to and including Patti LuPone and Imelda Staunton, has belted the notes that were intended to be belted, because that's how those songs were written to fit the character. And it's false equivalency to attempt to compare new interpretations of Shakespeare with the decision to sing a Broadway belt role largely in the soprano range.

Yes, R454, Walsh sang some wrong lyrics in the first two lines of her solo part in that song. The lyrics are supposed to be "Waiting around for the boys downstairs, stalling as long as we dare," but she sang....something else. I was a big fan of hers back in the day, when she was in "Forbidden Broadway," "Falsettos" and "Big," but not in this FOLLIES concert. I could be wrong, but I don't believe she has performed much or at all in recent years, so maybe she was really nervous and/or rusty that night.

If you only know Hannah Waddingham through her recent tv work then it's understandable that you would think of her as a Charlotte. There's a pro shot of her Desiree and she's wonderful. Weren't they going to bring her over for the revival but Lansbury wanted a bigger name in the part?

Oh, I'm the poster who started the topic of Hannah in Night Music. I have very rarely made it to London and although I knew she had theatre roots, I was not familiar with her work outside of Ted Lasso. I had no idea she'd done Desiree in London. I still think seeing her do Desiree in a FULL, proper revival would be a treat.

[quote] It doesn't matter what YOU think the creators intended. They are long dead.

I haven’t been dead THAT long!

[quote]How many shows can a performer miss each week/month before their pay is docked?

When did the number of shows a performer has missed become the most fascinating top in the history of DL theater gossip threads?

r460 When the performer is black.

Is that so, r461?

Yea—pretty much on point.

[quote]When did the number of shows a performer has missed become the most fascinating top in the history of DL theater gossip threads?

I don't know, but I think you may be the most annoying BOTTOM in the history of DL theater gossip threads :-)

It wasn't until yesterday that I read, because someone posted it here, that Jennifer Simard misses frequently, and of course, that's also a topic worthy of discussion if true. But maybe not quite so big a deal as Audra calling out, because Simard is not at the same star level. I'm pretty sure that, if DL existed when the very white Bernadette was doing GYPSY and the equally white Donna Murphy was doing WONDERFUL TOWN (did it?), people here would have definitely discussed all of their absences as well.

[quote]I'm pretty sure that, if DL existed when the very white Bernadette was doing GYPSY and the equally white Donna Murphy was doing WONDERFUL TOWN (did it?), people here would have definitely discussed all of their absences as well.

Sigh. You haven't been around DL very long, have you?

I guess not, R465. At any rate, I was not here as far back as that WONDERFUL TOWN.

The Audra hate over absences is definitely reignited from her previous shows. She used to miss so much that people would wonder if this amazing performer actually existed after missing her in Carousel, Ragtime, Porgy and Bess, and concerts. She may be my favorite performer, but she is also on a short list of performers I expect may miss. Sucks when you are out of town.

[quote]Donna Murphy was dealing with major vocal issues during Wonderful Town so I think she can be forgiven there.

[quote]Murphy was being treated for vocal injury but the Weisslers would not let her go public about it for fear that it would impact the box office. Neither did they want to replace her because the reviews at both Encores and Broadway focused on her performance. The Weisslers came out okay, but Murphy paid.

I think one of the reasons Riedel jumped all over Bernadette's Gypsy absences was because she was out of The Goodbye Girl way too many times and everyone knew it. And the reason she missed so many performances was because she hated the show and they wouldn't let her out of her contract. It slightly tarnished her reputation. I don't think the Audra bashing started until Porgy and Bess.

Discussion on worst attendance records.

So if Audra wants to do Desiree (with Sondheim's blessing, she says). what do you think? I'm not sure she has the fragility that Johns and Dench brought to the role.. She always seems ...robust.

Has anyone here seen "Buena Vista Social Club"? Is it a contender?

It coulda been…

Hannah Waddingham should star in a Mame revival. It would be just as successful as Audra's Gypsy.

Tee hee hee

[quote]The Audra hate over absences is definitely reignited from her previous shows. She used to miss so much that people would wonder if this amazing performer actually existed after missing her in Carousel, Ragtime, Porgy and Bess, and concerts. She may be my favorite performer, but she is also on a short list of performers I expect may miss. Sucks when you are out of town.

She managed to show up at every Tony Show.

Told this before here...Met Marian Seldes who played the wife in the original production of "Deathtrap". Legend had it she never missed a show. I met at the Broadway Cares Equity Fights AIDS Annual Flea Market at the celebrity table. We were right across the Music Box Theater where it opened. I asked, is it true you never missed a performance of "Deathtrap" and he reached across the table, grabbed both my hands and said "Why should have I missed?" She played the entire run, all 1793 plus 6 preview performances.

[quote]So is SMASH just "Some Like It Hot" redux? Sound and fury adding to nothing?

Well actually audiences are loving "SMASH" BIG difference.

Isn't Jordan Fisher going into Moulin Rouge now?

I saw Maybe Happy Ending last night. I thought it was very well done—a great treat. Both leads were fantastic (Helen Shen is a gem of new talent) and the scenic design was fantastic. A perfect example of a “new” musical carefully put together by top talent. I expect a lot of Tony nominations above and below the line.

To add: Darren Criss’s musical chops are displayed so much better live than anything you ever might have seen on Glee. He’s got real Broadway talent.

Next week's pretty paltry.

Monday -- A Riverdance performance on Good Morning America (Broadway adjacent; they're coming to Radio City Music Hall), then Rachel Zegler "talks and performs" on Jimmy Kimmel Live! (I don't know if she sings in the new Snow White, or if she'll do something from Evita)

Tuesday -- Shanice and T.J. Wilkins promote 44: The Obama Musical (L.A.) on Sherri, while Bill Burr's on The Tonight Show (he's plugging his standup special and Glengarry Glen Ross)

Thursday -- Joy Behar promotes My First Ex-Husband (off-Broadway) on Sherri, while Bill Burr's on The View

Friday -- Sadie Sink's on the 10 a.m. hour of Today to plug John Proctor is the Villain

I wonder why they've never done a revival of Deathtrap?

Is it because everybody knows the ending since the movie came out?

Because Madame Seldes has expired.

Speaking of Deathtrap, I prefer the movie ending, with Helga as the toast of Broadway. The onstage ending, with Helga and Porter the lawyer willing to kill one another to claim the play, is clever but feels like it's missing a button. I do like that it reveals that Porter's the obscene caller that upset Myra.

I admired "Maybe Happy Ending" more than I enjoyed. I wanted to be moved by it, but it stopped short. A lot of my friends LOVE it and find it moving, so I thought it was just me. I listened to the recording that dropped yesterday, and I got why I couldn't love it. The music has the same ideas and themes over and over and most of the songs have the identical rhythm and tempo, so it just got monotonous for me. The set was extraordinary, but way too much for a 2 character show. This was one where I thought "I can't wait for the 2 chairs, 2 actors version." Still, it is worth seeing.

Gee, I saw more than two characters. 🤷🏻‍♂️

There are currently these whodunnits playing in all the regional theaters, a new adaptation of Dial M for Murder (but with 1950s lesbians!) by Jeffrey Hatcher and at least a couple of Agatha Christie adaptations by Ken Ludwig, Death on the Nile and Murder on the Orient Express, and they sell out like crazy at those theaters that are otherwise scrambling to bring audiences in.

So why haven't these plays gotten to Broadway? They just scream out for all-star ensemble casts (even if they're faded TV stars) that tourists and even old theatre queens would absolutely flock to see. And an opportunity for lovely period sets and glamorous costumes...not a lot of black tee shirts and jeans against grainy projections. Familiar titles that audiences think they know even if they don't really remember the plots.

Is it just a weird snobbishness even if there's money to be made? Why aren't NY producers giving audiences what they really want to see?

Megan ‘3/4 of the time’ HIlty

And whatever happened to The Mousetrap that was finally going to reach Broadway after running 72 years in London (and still is)?

[quote]even if there's money to be made

Money isn't to be made with all-star ensemble casts and period sets and costumes, r488.

Regional theaters produce those whodunnits with limited funds and resources and without star casts and still sell them out.

There's money to be made. You just need some old sitcom stars who everyone loves and want to work again.

[quote]Stephen Schwartz, who wrote both music and lyrics to all the songs in Wicked, is about to become even more “Popular.” The veteran songwriter is set to receive the 2025 Johnny Mercer Award at the Songwriters Hall of Fame Induction and Awards Gala on Thursday, June 12, at the Marriott Marquis Hotel in New York City.

Has anyone ever gone on to bigger and better things after appearing in [bold]The Mousetrap[/bold] in London? I know Richard Attenborough was part of the original 1952 cast, but he was already fairly well-known at the time.

R457: Where might one find the pro shot of Hannah Waddingham in ALNM? Asking for a friend. (HW is decidedly NOT a Charlotte although she would have been a fantastic Petra in her younger days.)

[quote]Regional theaters produce those whodunnits with limited funds and resources and without star casts and still sell them out.

At Broadway prices, r492?

R493 looks like he’s Mike White’s gay dad.

Scanduloso!

R488, what regional theater audiences want and what people who live in NYC or come here to see theater want are not necessarily the same thing. And the fewer Ked Ludwig plays on Broadway, the better :-)

R482, Zegler sings at least one song in Snow White. “Waiting on a Wish” was released on Apple Music a few weeks ago. It’s written by Pasek and Paul and is just OK. Zegler sings it beautifully, though.

Someday I hope a spoof song titled “Sitting on my Face” can emerge.

SMASH matinee cancelled because of illness in the company.

[quote]I wonder why they've never done a revival of Deathtrap? Is it because everybody knows the ending since the movie came out?

I don't think that the movie was very successful. The original had a very long run on Broadway, so a lot of theatergoers knew the ending, but that was quite a long time ago. "Sleuth," an earlier play in a similar vein (also at the Music Box Theatre) was also very successful and also has never been revived.

Any word on the off Broadway “Jonathan Larson Project?”

Because, R25 Audra isn't the draw theater queens on DL would have her be.

She ain’t playin chess up there on stage.

Deathtrap's playwright Ira Levin hated the gay subplot of the film, and his estate has steadfastly refuses to allow any production that includes a kiss between the two men, any nudity, or anything that suggests the two have a sexual relationship. I imagine modern producers and directors feel like, while it was okay for all the gay subtext to remain subtext in the 80s, it wouldn't fly in the present century to not acknowledge the obvious gay relationship. So until the Levin estate changes its mind I doubt we'll see a Broadway revival.

They tried doing it Ira's way in a London revival with Simon Russell Beale and Jonathan Groff. Director Matthew Warchus erased any gay element and publicly stated "it was about two chaps plotting a crime".

Naturally, it bombed.

There's currently a national tour of "Clue."

I wonder if they change the ending every night, like they did in the movie version?

I hadn't realized the gay subplot wasn't in the play.

I love to pile on the dish, but I just listened to the "Snow White" soundtrack and the new Pasek and Paul songs are terrific -- squarely in the Alan Menken tradition. And the arrangement/orchestration of "Hi Ho" is pure joy. The film may bomb but it's a nifty soundtrack.

Motherfucker here I go again you motherfucker!

r492 thinks it's 1988. There are no more "sitcom stars" who do theater. And there is no more dinner theater with "sitcom stars." And there is basically no more summer stock. God, there's stupid people on this board.

[quote]r510 = The film may bomb but it's a nifty soundtrack.

Add it to the list with Lost Horizon, STAR!, Goodbye, Mr. Chips, etc.

I remember the two men kissing when I saw Deathtrap on Broadway. Or was it just wishful thinking since I saw hottie Robert Reed as Sidney.

No kiss on Broadway -it was added for the film. The original play has a lot of gay subtext, but there is nothing that explicitly shows the men are lovers. Back in the day the subtext went over a lot of heads in the audience (like it seems to have gone over the head of the author), but today everyone would assume the two men are sleeping together or have some kind of relationship. I think the kiss really should be in the stage version, as it's a moment that crystalizes the action and the audience now sees things differently. Not to mention that it colors their view of everything that follows...

What was Levin's problem anyway? Was he always homophobic? Did he "protest too much?"

Robyn Hurder out of SMASH tonite.

[quote] Gee, I saw more than two characters.

Too many drinkie-poos at intermission?

Will some tell this fool ^ there are more than two characters, including an owner, a hotel clerk, a ferryman, a son and a jazz vocalist. That does not include two other owners on video.

I think the point was only two characters that matter...

[quote]Stephen Schwartz, who wrote both music and lyrics to all the songs in Wicked, is about to become even more “Popular.” The veteran songwriter is set to receive the 2025 Johnny Mercer Award at the Songwriters Hall of Fame Induction and Awards Gala on Thursday, June 12, at the Marriott Marquis Hotel in New York City.

Good for him. Will he be attending with his wife or his boyfriend?

It's practically a saga...

^Wrong thread...oops

When did verve disappear from Broadway?

Verve like that is what got us into Viet Nam...

I seem to remember that during the London DEATHTRAP run, Simon Russell Beale made some unwanted advances to Groffsauce.

Simard is a gem. Should win the Tony.

I'd somehow never seen this. Were any of you in Times Square to witness it back in 2021? Must have been incredibly moving.

[quote]Simard is a gem. Should win the Tony.

She could end up being the Judy Holliday, r526.

r523 Verve? Broadway? No ... mostly jazz.

Whatever, r529.

r512, just a few faded sitcom stars that have done Broadway and would still sell tickets there:

Sean Hayes

Jean Smart

Debra Messing

Jason Alexander

Megan Mullally

David Hyde Pierce

Eric McCormack

Woody Harrelson

Annie Potts

Kelsey Grammer

Helen Hunt

Cynthia Nixon

Sarah Jessica Parker

Kim Cattrall

Edie Falco

Delta Burke

Judd Hirsch

Tony Danza

Danny De Vito

R531. Fuck you

[quote]No kiss on Broadway -it was added for the film. The original play has a lot of gay subtext, but there is nothing that explicitly shows the men are lovers.

You are spectacularly wrong about this. There was definitely a kiss between the two men in the Broadway show when I saw it, in the scene that takes place after the wife dies of a heart attack. There is nothing "subtextual" about the gay relationship between the two men in the play.

What do you gain by posting misinformation like this?

Jean Smart, r531...faded? Do you ever watch the Emmys?

NYTimes briefly mentioned this hour long effort with S. Sarandon and Chris Walken / I was unfamiliar with it.

I don't think I've ever seen Walken so likable. i really enjoyed this. A stream on youtube of adequate quality.

Who Am I This Time? is a 1982 American made-for-television comedy-drama film directed by Jonathan Demme and based on the 1961 short story of the same name by Kurt Vonnegut. It is the fourth episode of the first season of PBS' American Playhouse series which aired on February 2, 1982.

I hope Ira Levin wasn't a homophobe, since he comes across as a bit of a MARY! in William Goldman's The Season. It's when he's recalling how badly his Dr. Cook's Garden production went.

The Deathtrap script makes it clear they are lovers several times. Sidney even tells Clifford "I love you."

Go fuck yourself, R533. I have the play script in front of me and there is no kiss there. It would have been a major stage direction, and indicated by the author or the stage manager (who often writes the staging that appears in published plays). A quick visit to Wikipedia articles on the play and the film shows that they state the kiss was added for the film. Likewise, the IMDB mentions the addition of the kiss to the film. I don't post "misinformation." I fact-checked myself with multiple sources (the play script itself should be considered definitive) before posting. You appear to be relying on memory, which in your case hasn't served you well.

I played Kim MacAfee in an all male Bye Bye Birdie in the Village back in the 90s. Probably wouldn’t get away with it now but my husband insists it’s the best thing I’ve ever done.

I recently saw the female version of The Odd Couple. Funny that the women play Trivial Pursuit instead of poker. Ironically, it’s the two male characters who steal the show.

When I was in my all white high school, our director always talked about wanting to do The Wiz. Thankfully, it never happened.

Edna wasn’t played by a man in drag in the original movie. She was played by Divine. Divine wasn’t really a drag queen. Divine was her own thing. Did it really make sense to cast cis men in drag going forward?

R360- it IS the 50th anniversary….

R367- is Audra today’s greatest musical theater actress? She only has 1 Tony for lead actress in a musical. Sutton has 2 and has created more musical theater roles.

Are we certain Jasmine Amy Rogers isn’t going to win the Tony? She’s had to create a role from scratch in a brand new musical. What a competitive race. Besides Jasmine, Nicole, and Audra, we have Sutton, Idina, the Death Becomes Her women, the Smash women, and the Maybe Happy Ending girl (the darkhorse winner perhaps?)

Rachel Zegler can belt. Before West Side Story, she had a great video on YouTube of her singing “Don’t Forget Me” from Smash. Some people can sing legit and belt. Marin Mazzie was another.

R418- Acting EVERY WORD is exhausting to me. That’s not how real people act. Communication is rarely even about the words.

This show devastated me.

This isn’t the video I was referring to but you can hear her belt.

The Wizard and Zegler

[quote]is Audra today’s greatest musical theater actress? She only has 1 Tony for lead actress in a musical. Sutton has 2 and has created more musical theater roles.

Kristin Chenoweth has never won a Tony for lead actress, and if Sutton was on the same stage you wouldn't even SEE her beside Cheno in her prime--height difference notwithstanding.

I wish I could unSEE Sutton Foster. Proof that a performer can be skilled and enthusiastic, but thoroughly mediocre. I don’t think I have seen a Broadway performance as bad as her Marian, though her leading man certainly was in the running.

R544 How quickly we forget her Mrs Lovett where she introduced the seagull voice throughout the whole performance and not just By the Sea!

[quote]Edna wasn't played by a man in drag in the original movie. Divine wasn’t really a drag queen.

Oh, really? Then what the hell was he? Whatever word you use for it, he was a cis man dressed as and playing the role of a woman.

Where do you people come from?

R544, I largely agree with you about Sutton. I did think she was pretty great in MATTRESS, but not in any show until then. I've never understood how she became a star based on so many mediocre, far-from-special performances in so many shows. Also, she seems to have become a pig in that, for a while now, she's been accepting roles she's ALL WRONG for, of course including Marian in THE MUSIC MAN.

At the Actor's Fund performance of Deathtrap, which took place at midnight on Halloween, John Wood most certainly kissed Victor Garber, much to the delight of all of us in the audience.

Porter Milgrim is SUCH a DLer name.

Sutton was very good in the Encores Anyone Can Whistle and Once Upon a Mattress. Her performance in Music Man was acted okay but sung horribly. My ears are still burning from her wretched version of “My White Knight.” I thought that whole production was a misfire, but a lot of people sure seemed to love it.

God the new STREETCAR in Brooklyn is just wretchedly awful. "Patsy Ferran" is completely ridiculous in her oversized doll dresses, and the Stanley is dressed in red silk pajamas playing satan himself. Standards of taste have sunk so low that even this pitiful slop manages rave reviews and six-hundred dollar tickets. When will the endless parade of over-acted, over-directed, illiterate British productions finally end?

r520, I hope he brings both.

Why shouldn't Sutton try to stretch herself as an actress if the opportunities are there? I'd do the same thing if I were her.

I saw the original run of DEATHTRAP, while there was no PDA, it was not "subtext" that Sidney and Clifford were a gay couple who planned to off Sidney's wife, it was in the text.

I think the above poster who suggested an Agatha Christie play on Broadway with an a cast of names (probably B or C-list) had a good idea. Just not those Ken Ludwig abortions.

I find it interesting that Marian Seldes never missed a performance of Deathtrap.

Does anyone have that kind of track record anymore?

Even LuPone, who used to have a pristine reputation called out of The Roommate and caused them to cancel quite a few times.

Patti called out of The Roommate because she was furious with her producers, her co-star, her stage management team, the critics and the audience. Other than that, she had a grand time.

Today I learned that Marian Seldes was once married to Garson Kanin.

[quote]Today I learned that Marian Seldes was once married to Garson Kanin.

You thought they'd been married twice?

Marian had a long affair with Garson when he was still married to Ruth Gordon. When Ruth died (I believe she was a few years older than Garson), Marian and Garson finally got married.

[quote]At the Actor's Fund performance of Deathtrap, which took place at midnight on Halloween, John Wood most certainly kissed Victor Garber, much to the delight of all of us in the audience.

Thank you. And I remember that, when I saw the show towards the end of its run with Farley Granger in the lead, he definitely kissed whoever was playing Cliff then. Since I don't have access to the script, I'll have to take the word of the person above who keeps insisting the kiss isn't in the script, but maybe it was added for the Broadway production by the director? If that's what happened, I would assume it had to have been done with the approval of the playwright.

Sutton Foster is no Hollis Resnik...who I haven't seen on the boards in quite a while!

That's because she passed away!

R508 I've done that new CLUE in a regional production, and it doesn't have multiple endings like the film does, it has a new ending that blends them all together (sort of).

Seldes's talks about her friendship with Bette Davis:

Bette came to see me in lots of things. She was always supportive, even though she would tell me the play was bad or some of the actors were not very talented. I rarely agreed with her. She would tell me I had to fight for my career. I did not know how to fight for my career. How does anyone fight for a career? I just vowed to always work hard and well. To give my all. Bette felt this was insufficient.

I am not a Bette Davis. I am not a Geraldine Page or a Julie Harris or a Maureen Stapleton or a Colleen Dewhurst. I am not saying that they fight for their careers as Bette would like them to, but if I had their talents, I might feel I was being underused, but I was always grateful to be employed, used, appreciated. My name does not bring people into the theatre. Only I—on my two legs—bring ME to the theatre. If I had done as Bette suggested—just walk away and refuse to be cast in such small roles—I would not have had anyone calling me to return. I know that. I am not the dazzling talent of Bette Davis. I cannot bend the will or the rules. I am okay with that.

Is there a freewheeling patio murder, r563?

[quote]I've done that new CLUE in a regional production, and it doesn't have multiple endings like the film does, it has a new ending that blends them all together (sort of).

I'll bet you were outstanding as Mrs. White.

This was sweet. Also, well done on the gentle needling of Oprah, Gayle!

[quote]Oprah & Gayle's date night at Gypsy...

I clicked on your link R567 and when I saw Oprah speechifying to the cast I had to x out. Can't she just say nice show or well done? Does everything have to be a moment?

I mean, it *is* Oprah we're talking about ...

r539 Uh, Divine WAS very much a drag queen...aka, a cis male gay man who did drag for a living. He didn't identify as transgender or transvestite. He didn't live his private life in women's clothes.

[quote]Marian had a long affair with Garson when he was still married to Ruth Gordon. When Ruth died (I believe she was a few years older than Garson), Marian and Garson finally got married.

After years of plays and screenplays, Ruth Gordon wrote a novel, "Shady Lady," that was published in 1981. I was at the book launch party because I worked for the publishing house. Ruth and Garson Kanin were there, of course, and so was Marian Seldes, who was still appearing in "Deathtrap" at the time. I talked with Seldes about the play because I had recently worked on the movie version. She told me the cast was invited to a screening of the film and that she walked out because she "couldn't stand it." Ruth Gordon died in 1985, four years after the party. Kanin and Seldes were married in 1990.

What the hell is Oprah wearing in r567?

There was an old joke floating around re Marian Seldes:

Marian never missed a performance in Deathtrap. She never gave one either.

I always thought Marian was a very dull actress in the earlier performances I saw. I think it was Garson who told her to think outside the box, as it was only around that time that she started giving great off the wall performances that were truly brilliant. It was quite a change.

Weren't there rumors that Kanin was gay?

It wasn't until I saw Dyan Cannon's hyper-nervous performance in the film of Deathtrap that the role of the wife made sense to me. Marian's somnambulist take was the polar opposite.

Same performance she gave in Heaven Can Wait.

Deathtrap was a good gig for Marian. She died at the end of Act One then met friends for coffee or went shopping while the rest of the play was going on and went back to the theatre for the curtain call.

It is said that Shakespeare wrote the Ghost in Hamlet for himself. I wouldn't be surprised, because it's the ideal role.

You come on at the beginning, before the lead. You get to make up "old" and wear armour, you have heaps of good special effects so you make a big splash, and your parting quip is "REMEMBER ME". After that, everyone in the play keeps praising your looks while slighting those of the actor playing Claudius. The Players do a play about your death showing you as a noble victim and Claudius as Snidely Whiplash. You have most of the play off, then you make a brief entrance in the fourth Act, enabling you to remind the audience how much they loved you before the bows, yet have another beer before curtain call.

[quote] She told me the cast was invited to a screening of the film and that she walked out because she "couldn't stand it."

Oh, I bet she HATED all that screaming that Dyan Cannon did in the film. And I bet she hated that Dyan was blonde and had a perky body.

[quote]It wasn't until I saw Dyan Cannon's hyper-nervous performance in the film of Deathtrap that the role of the wife made sense to me. Marian's somnambulist take was the polar opposite.

I saw DEATHRAP on Broadway very late into the run, and by that point, Marian's take on the role was by no means "somnambulist." On the contrary, her performance was extremely broad and highly affected. Interesting to read that she played the part very differently early on, but presumably one way she was able to stay in the show for SO was that she kept trying new things acting-wise, so she wouldn't fall into the trap of becoming bored out of her mind and walking through the play.

Divine was definitely a man who did drag for a living. Here he is, out of costume. Or, is THIS the costume?

I can't believe people are complaining about Barbara Walsh in a bit part in the Follies concert.

You know who stank and dragged the proceedings down? Beth Leavel, delivering a deranged, manic Could I Leave You, maybe the worst ever. She should have traded songs with Alex Billings, who was at sea in the pure style Lucy & Jessie.

And Kate Baldwin was a snooze

R583, I disagree with you about Kate Baldwin in the FOLLIES concert, but must sadly agree about Beth Leavel :-(

Why can't you believe that people are complaining about Barbara Walsh in that FOLLIES? She had very few lyrics to memorize, even fewer for her solo lines, but she screwed up TWICE. (I think it was only me complaining, by the way, and I stand by that.)

Shame Patty didn't do more musicals.

[Quote] is Audra today’s greatest musical theater actress? She only has 1 Tony for lead actress in a musical.

She will get her second this year.

That said, Audra hasn’t played lead that often—Marie Christine, 110 in the Shade (for me, her greatest performance before this season’s Rose), Lady Day, and now Gypsy, Am I missing any?

Plus it’s silly to believe that one can only be a great musical theatre actress if playing leading roles. Being Black, Audra doesn’t have that many options.

It’s apples to oranges to compare the performance rate of someone in plays vs musicals.

Marian Seldes never had to sing 5 songs in her shows, so it’s easy to have a perfect attendance record.

Rachel Zegler’s soprano belt is similar to Lea Salonga’s. Did Salonga ever play Evita in Manila? I guess that would be a politically sensitive show to put on over there, though,

Why Manila? Has she not appeared all over?

So, an all-female cast will be replacing the current guys at the end of their run in Glengarry. Confirmed this morning on Deadline. No names being mentioned yet. Do we imagine Patti will be playing Rickie Roma, or is that too easy?

R900. You mean Patti who gave up her Equity membership yet continues to work on Broadway?

Christ, if Patti goes anywhere near that revival, they better make sure nobody else gets better notices!

-M. Farrow

I could see Elizabeth Marvel in the cast, or is she still frighteningly desiccated and unrecognizable?

[quote]Being Black, Audra doesn’t have that many options.

Are you being serious? She can have any role she wants.

Thanks, R595. The idea that Audra's role options are limited by her race is one of the craziest ever to be expressed on the DL. And that means a WHOLE LOT of crazy.

[quote] Are you being serious? She can have any role she wants.

I look forward to her Henry Higgins or Harold Hill

I recall several theatre gossipers, on earlier threads, arguing you couldn’t possible do Gypsy with a Black Rose. It’s on the record.

Here's the new thread.

R589, Salonga’s played a lot of roles in her native Manila (and Singapore ) that she wouldn’t necessarily be considered for elsewhere like Sandy in Grease, Grizabella in Cats, the title role in Cinderella, Lizzie in Baby and Eluza Doolittle in you-know-what. I would think Evita would have been a no-brainer but I guess there would be a certain reluctance to produce a show about a fascist dictator in that part of the world.

Closing this thread out. BAJOUR!