Trump Received the Same Popular Vote in 2020 & 2024

OP, of the many, MANY aspects of this election that make zero sense, this is definitely one of the more confounding ones. Trump got around the same number of votes, but for reasons difficult to comprehend, he not only beat Harris in the popular vote, but by a lot. Biden had around 81 million votes in 2020, but Harris only managed 69 million this week.

The ONLY good news here is that Trump doesn't seem to have radicalized anyone else at this juncture, but turnout alone explains most of Harris's loss. To be clear, it was definitely NOT Democrats or lefties in general: they voted, and mostly reliably. It's independents who always decide each election – though the media and DL alike routinely forget this every four years – and we've whipsawed back & forth from Bush to Clinton to Bush to Obama to Trump to Biden and now back to Trump. It is ALWAYS independents / moderates who make this happen: dyed-in-the-wool Ds & Rs typically vote straight ticket.

Further, we know there was no one main reason, but the biggest one on whole was the economy. While it's both absurd & infuriating to "blame" Biden or Harris for inflation, which is entirely impossible for any individual person (or nation) to control, that's what happened: voters consistently cited the economy as their main concern, and #2 was immigration (albeit massively trumped up – pun definitely intended – to to point of absurdity).

My Arby’s Beef and Cheddar is $2 more. Democracy must die!

R1 Good reply, thanks.

R1 Many Democrats are claiming the election was rigged and keep talking about "the 20 million missing ballots." Some are claiming they sent in absentee ballots and when they track them, the website says they were either not received or not counted. They are demanding recounts and investigations. They think it's weird how quickly and easily Biden and Harris accepted the results. I personally think they want to show how much better they are than Trump and the insurrectionists but that is just my opinion. But they are also saying it's weird that Trump isn't gloating and rubbing it in everyone's faces as you'd expect from him. They think it's because there are investigations going on and he has to keep his mouth shut, but that may just be denial and wishful thinking.

Either way, both sides are talking about fixed elections. The Democrats say this election was rigged because of how few voters there were compared to the last election. The Republicans say it is just more proof that the 2020 election was rigged because they went overboard with manufacturing fake votes the last time. A mess all the way around. It will be interesting to see if anything comes out of these accusations or if they will fall on deaf ears.

The bullshit campaign 24/7 for the past year tired many voters out and they stayed home

Disgusting, white trash country. Can’t wait to leave.

There's over the 10% of the votes left to be counted. Both hers and his numbers will go up. And the margin between them will decrease, although he will still win the popular vote.

If something is dirty about the election, Musk would be someone to look at. It's strange it wasn't until late in Trump's campaign that he showed up everywhere.

[quote] There's over the 10% of the votes left to be counted. Both hers and his numbers will go up. And the margin between them will decrease, although he will still win the popular vote.

Yay! We’re only slightly less losers!

Well, when Trump is going around before the election saying he doesn't need anyone's vote it does seem suspicious. Investigations need to be done.

Trump has the sophistication of a three year old. If this or the assassination attempts were rigged, he’s going to blurt it out. That said, we need to be quiet unless we have real evidence.

R11 Or what?.... we might win the next election with pure lies?

From my view and a previous experience, R4 nails it.

Over 30 years ago, I had a job working for a non-profit. I was an assistant to a Director. One of her responsibilities was to administrate the bi-annual election for the organization's group of Governors.

Ever see the movie Election? If I had been a character in that movie, it would have been Matthew Broderick's assistant. (his character didn't have one, but if he did, it would have been me).

At my boss's direction, I rigged one of the elections. Long story, but I eventually came forward and became a whistleblower.

I know how to dispose of votes, and do it in a way so that it's not discovered. Unless the person who did it comes forward and admits it. Which is what I did.

It ended my career and I experience different forms of PTSD to this day. But I know how to recognize dots others might not see, and I connect them. I know because of my experience of looking from the other side.

Kamala's final tallies - though possible - are exceedingly, disgustingly, unbelievably implausible! It is driving me fucking insane!

R13 Tell us more! What are you seeing in the election results that are raising red flags for you? I've heard of the musings on X but have been avoiding social media like the plague since election night to to avoid being further triggered.

[quote]administrate

Oh, dear.

You can check this out

Then this one...

Even I don't quite agree with some of these theories, but I'm glad people are coming up with them. I swear I am not a pusher of conspiracy theories (except maybe for one), but it feels like we living a seemingly supernatural event.

ATLANTA (AP) — An effort to access voting system software in several states and provide it to allies of former President Donald Trump as they sought to overturn the results of the 2020 election has raised “serious threats” ahead of next year’s presidential contest, according to a group of experts who urged federal agencies to investigate.

The letter sent by nearly two dozen computer scientists, election security experts and voter advocacy organizations asks for a federal probe and a risk assessment of voting machines used throughout the country, saying the software breaches have “urgent implications for the 2024 election and beyond.” The breaches affected voting equipment made by two companies that together count over 70 percent of the votes cast across the country, according to the letter.

Interesting. American Voting has been subject to repeated hacks since at least #BushVGore where hanging chads were just a distraction, the hack was in Valusia County. I was a leader in uncovering hacks in 2002 and 2004. When Bush hacked OH away from Kerry. No one cared. I stopped.

Maybe Kamala was never as popular as people thought and everyone just went to her rallies because they knew Beyonce, Meghan Thee Stallion, Cardi B, Katy Perry, Lady Gaga, Oprah, Usher, Lizzo, P!nk, etc., were going to be there.

Or maybe there is some validity to the articles posted in R18 and R19.

I went to Kamala's Greensboro rally, R20. It was PACKED! People were there to see her. When she came out it was so loud the little girl standing behind her covered her ears. Check out 6:15.

I'm old enough to remember the 2004 election. Around 9pm, and just like that, 5 states flipped over from Kerry to Bush within an hour.

Never sat right with me.

I think they got away with hacking 2004 and they hacked the machines in 2024 months ago. Set up to flip votes within a very brief time period.

A few audits of vote totals vs. handcounted ballots should give a clue if the discrepancies are real.

"If my candidate wins, it's a fair election. If my candidate loses, it's rigged." Biden and Harris have accepted their defeat, so I think their voters ought to do the same. For 4 years Trump supporters have been called dangerous conspiracy loons who are a threat to democracy for questioning the 2020 election results. And now Democrats are going to turn around and do the exact same thing. I trust the election process and know these people know how to do their job. No way could they have made any mistakes. The results are the results and all you can really do is get more people to show up in 2028.

[quote]For 4 years Trump supporters have been called dangerous conspiracy loons who are a threat to democracy for questioning the 2020 election results. And now Democrats are going to turn around and do the exact same thing.

Not remotely the same thing. This election has a small mountain of circumstantial evidence that looks funny. If smoking guns have been found they haven't been made public.

The feds and secretaries of state should do an audit of some swing state vote totals (with the weirdest numbers), if there are discrepancies they will show up immediately. If they don't most of us will just swallow hard and move on.

They're getting ready to tear the motherfucking United State of American into pieces and sell of the parts to the highest bidder. This could be the last real US election of our lifetimes. If there are lingering questions about voting discrepancies they should be investigated.

[quote]Many Democrats are claiming the election was rigged and keep talking about "the 20 million missing ballots." Some are claiming they sent in absentee ballots and when they track them, the website says they were either not received or not counted. They are demanding recounts and investigations. They think it's weird how quickly and easily Biden and Harris accepted the results.

And I think it's weird that these people don't realize they're mirroring exactly what Republicans did. I know we all hate the outcome, but democracy worked. There aren't any missing ballots, per the state-level officials in charge of them (in EVERY state). Further undermining faith in the electoral process does NOT help the Dems in any way.

No, it's not a "conspiracy" that absentee votes haven't all been counted. That's entirely normal. The difference is that last time it wasn't initially clear if Biden had truly flipped even Arizona, his least likely one that year. Absentee votes are fairly predictable, and none are likely to alter any outcomes (in the presidential race, at least).

Why did Trump say he did not need anyone's votes?

Eventually statisticians and political scientists will do a deep dive into some of the election results. What will be interesting is to see if there are large discrepancies between votes cast for president vs. other statewide races (such as Senator). For instance if 6,000,000 people in a state voted in the senate race, but only 5,000,000 in the presidential race, that would get my attention. It might be for simple reasons (such as the fact that some people found neither candidate appealing). But it's worth looking into. Election forensics should be a part of every election. I doubt that many people are tuned into the fact that Donald Trump's popular vote margin over Kamala Harris's is shrinking steadily with time (with the counting of west coast states mail-in ballots.). But people need that information when Republicans crow about Mandates.

It doesn't matter if they played dirty, they won and have control, nothing will happen, nothing has happened to trump except he's now president, the Democrats are finished, they have lost control now, nothing but bloodshed will work, bloodshed in the suburbs would be best, how many times will people get their noses rubbed in shit like dogs?

THIS!:

I have been a leader in hacking and counter hacking for 25 years. I'm well paid for it.

I continue to work professionally finding hackers, and fairly often DEVELOP AND INSTALL hacks designed to ferret out the misuse of systems. My customers have included numerous governments and F100 firms. I wrote risk assessments of smartgrid technologies for Obama, and IP e-protection for GE.

Here is what you are seeing. The Tabulation Systems at the County level were hacked far in advance of the election. The hack was probably written into the code even before the code was installed. It will have a WHEN function and IF/THEN functions to have the machine force balance to a...

given outcome within a specific window of time. You could test the machines 1000 times before election night, and the result will be correct. If you run it during the time window, the force balancing will be turned on and regardless of inputs you will get a programmed output.

It is very simple to prove this. Take the two most outlandish precinct results from any county and just hand-count the ballots. They won't match the tabulation outputs. From what I am seeing, you will find 8-11% avg. shifts from Dem to Rep. Be sure to check heavy Red areas, easier to cover up..a run up of the score. That was how it was done in Ohio vs. Kerry - GOP flips in already highly red areas. Now, why the Bomb-Threats? They were NOT to allow for hacker access. The programming was already in place, they were to break Chain of Custody and produce legal grounds to not trust a recount. Every place that GOT a bomb-threat is a place the courts will now have to consider the factual argument of whether the ballots COULD have been tampered with while the evacuations were going on. They weren't. But that is the argument the GOP will make to prevent recounts.

I used to appear on Lou Dobbs TV Show, back when he was at CNN and discuss hacking, including of voting machines. I helped get machines into researchers hands - every single one of them were shocked/horrified how simple hacking the machines was. But somehow, the public has refused to engage.

Now that a full blown #fascist takeover is underway, and they did it by hacking the tabulation machines as described, please engage. I will lend any expertise if asked, but be aware these people are sociopaths who will kill you, they have done so to others, so act accordingly.

(More at link...)

^^ THIS ^^

Cheating. Again. ..cheat. Lie. Steal.

Cheating

I am the LORD thy God

No other gods before me

No graven images or likenesses

Not take the LORD's name in vain

Remember the sabbath day

Honour thy father and thy mother

Thou shalt not kill

Thou shalt not commit adultery

Thou shalt not steal

Thou shalt not bear false witness

Thou shalt not covet

R16/ R17 There really isn't much to go by on those threads--just lots of people saying "this seems suspicious"

Pennsylvania Pollster explains what she witnessed

NOTHING can be done about it.

My registration vanished in the 2016 election (NYC). I wrote them wanting to get an answer, and they never responded. (voting at same address for 12 years.) I voted by provisional ballot instead.

I want to believe this shit is getting very very quietly investigated. God, I hope enough of an evidence trail is there to investigate.

2024 election results was mostly due to lies spread my Trump, who remained loyal to him, and the lack of enthusiasm to vote for Kamala Harris. By biggest concern when the Dems switched from Biden to Harris as the nominee was it was too late in the game and there would not be enough time in just 100 days to get her familiar with the voting public. If Biden was still robust I believe he would have won.

Dems need to stop with the conspiracy theories and discover why their candidate, along with Congress, was so soundly trounced by the opponent . People voted against the Biden administration. Period. And it was resounding. Maybe this will kick start Democrats to restoring sanity to their party and return more to the center where the people are and eschew the far left and identity politics. Introspection is needed at this time, but it looks like the same people who will look into the problem are the same ones who caused it. A purge is necessary.

So Elon was paying pollsters to collect voter registration across swing states.

Wonder if that has any connection to the PA registration purges.

R37 So an unknown group of people thought person who told them they were helping them register instead were not legitimate and never followed up to have the voters officially register. Sounds like a hell of a scam. But was this wide spread or not? Was it done in multiple counties and was the result just a handful of people not able to vote, was it dozens, hundreds, thousands?

Trump said in one of his last rallies, "We have a secret." I mean, being the infant that he is I can imagine it being impossible for him to not blurt out something regarding the rigging of his election. "We have a little secret." Come on. Something happened. There was a huge wave of Kamala passion and we won by millions less than Biden. NO.

BTW I checked twice online before I voted to be pretty-please certain that I was registered to vote. When I showed up at the polls, I was not registered. Sorry but this is all really fishy.

R44 I guess when Trump says the election was rigged, he means it was rigged by his minions in his favor, and he was shocked in 2020 when it still didn't work in his favor.

Right R45. And we are just going to roll over and allow all of this?

The US government still has the technology to dive into people's digital communications to a staggering degree.

Hoping we're in the investigation phase at this point. It's too important to just ignore.

R45 - US cybersecurity teams successfully blocked Russian attempts at infiltration in 2020, as I dimly recall.

I believe the republican cry of foul for 2020 was an effort to muddy the waters for 2024. If they kept that going then when they actually stole it the otherside would be accused easily.

[quote]Trump said in one of his last rallies, "We have a secret."

He also randomly tweeted "COVFEFE!" one night. The interesting part is you somehow missing that he's both a pathological liar AND increasingly prone to Biden-style verbal gaffes.

Are you idiots seriously going to spend, what, the next four fucking years hand-wringing over, "Gosh, if only we'd done THIS ONE THING right, Kamala would've won!" Horseshit. Yes, Harris could've won if she wasn't female, mixed-race, aligned with a president with numerous unpopular policies (the border, Gaza, etc.), blamed for the highest retail prices in 40 years, didn't laugh, didn't use "brat green," didn't pick Walz, had interjected with Biden far sooner than he wasn't fit to run for a second term, and didn't have the literal richest man in the world holding his thumb on the scale for Trump.

This definitely won't help, nor will it fix anything. There is ZERO singular answer for why Democratic turnout plummeted by 12 million votes. It's a combo of any or all of the above, and in this case playing the blame game yet again will only result in madness.

A Look at the 2024 Elections First we have to look at unadjusted exit polls for the election. This was extremely difficult to find. They were answering every question except who people voted for. Insanity. I finally found the answer on the site of a newspaper with the name Economist in it. It said:

The final unadjusted exit poll for the night showed that Kamala Harris is winning the election by 4 points.

What was the final result? Trump won by 2.6 points! That’s a 6.6 point anomaly between exit polls and results. Oh and by the way, a 2.6 point win is not a blowout or a landslide. Are you guys high? A landslide is the 1972 election where George McGovern lost by 24 points.

We already have a problem, assuming the exit polls are accurate. The national exit polls were off by 6.6 full points from the final tally. Statistically I would say that that’s extremely unlikely.

They’re not supposed to deviate more than a 2.5 point margin of error. Over 50 states, 1-2 states might be outside the 2.5 point MOE. Most results will be within the margin. For the national exit poll to be not only outside of the margin of error but by that much strains credulity.

I would like someone to give me a statistic for how likely a poll is to go off like that. I don’t believe that prior to 2000, any exit poll was off by that much.

I believe that much of a discrepancy between vote totals and exit polls automatically triggers a recount.

In 2000, 2004, 2016, and 2024, (very close in 2020), exit polls were wrong my more than 3%, always favoring the Republicans, who pulled off surprise victories those years. There has never been a slant towards Democrat in any year.

What does that tell you??

In Texas Senate Race, final polls had Collin Allred up by 2 points (which is margin of victory).

Ted Cruz won by 10 points! It wasn't even close!! (which is why they're not contesting).

They've been fucking with the machines for years, getting away with it because there has been no auditing, and perfecting their technique as they go along.

Before Voting machines in 2000, polls were practically never wrong, and when they were, it was always within 3% and even split between parties.

We were told in 2020 that the machines were secure. If you questioned that you were QAnon.

Gee....what happened?

One of two scenarios: The Dems Lied because we clearly won.

Or - They were wrong when claiming the machines were secure. But I've written this in other threads. Because of Covid, 2020 was like no other year ever!

We had far more mail-in voting in 2020 than ever before, outnumbering the voting machines. It why Trump was freaking out about Mail in Voting. It's why Louis DeJoy was made post master general - to destroy the (brand new!) mail sorting machines. (and, also, why you heard nothing this year).

We voted in enough droves to overcome the difference. If the machines had been properly audited (sort of but not really like they did in Arizona), they would have found that Biden had won by considerably more than 7 million, (which was projected).

The fear of people like me, who believed this has been going on all along and continued to shout about it, is that the longer they get away with it, the more they can perfect their system. At first, they absolutely needed the Electoral college, but eventually they could get thru and Infect the popular vote.

AND THEY DID!

But this is the thing! Evidence still exists this year, (or might), if machines are checked and recounts are sued for in various swing states, (like the Repubs did in Arizona in 2020).

But we have to demand it. Biden is still President for 2 1/2 months. He doesn't have to do nothing! The recounts in Arizona took place during his term. These can happen!

And unlike the ridiculous claims that Rudy Giuliani and that southern nut case Syndey Barrows were making, these claims are actually credible! - (they don't involve dead people from Venezuela).

We truly do have nothing to lose! and any money we spend will only go in Trump's pocket if we don't spend it.

Independents: just a boring way to say "lazy voters".

They're not undecided; they just mostly don't care and can't be bothered. You have to work hard to get some of them to vote. Get them excited or angry enough.

It's hard work.

What makes the least sense to me is how dem senators and reps won in swing states that Trump "swept". You're telling me millions and millions of people waited in line for hours to vote blue all the way down the ballot but leave the presidential ticket blank? This has never in the history of US elections happened in numbers this large. I looked it up.

Most states and counties have paper ballots so they can do a forensic audit to see whether or not the president choice was filled in or not.

Someone will never not convince me there was something fishing going on in 2020. All you have to do is look at the total vote numbers for the past 3 decades. All of sudden it jumps to a nearly 12 million increase. And now we are back on par with the trend that would have taken place between 2016 and 2020. Nah B. Something ain’t right in the buttermilk. I’m just thinking about everyone I know in different parts of the country. More people did not mail in votes that don’t regularly vote.

R60 If the dems cheated in 2020, why wouldn't they do it again in 2024 (a FAR more consequential election)?

Voter turnout was high in 20 because of Covid. People were:

1) Fed up

2) Looking for any excuse to get out of the house

R61 Because they couldn’t. Too many people actually voting, no global pandemic. But mainly my crazy ass thinks this is a very sinister and orchestrated plot WITH Trump’s involvement. Trump and Biden mad some type of pact. It made Trump more popular and now he returns to the White House with nearly absolute power. Eff Biden. I just don’t trust that dude.

R62 I know society. It doesn’t add up.

Also I didn’t say the Dems. I said Biden.

Bump

Why the sudden addition of Elon to the campaign?

Header has a typo in it:

"Trump Received the INSANE Popular Vote..."