The Elite College Students Who Can’t Read Books

Zzzz

Go back to school Op.

Replies like r2 perplex me.

The elite colleges - if they want to stick to their pedagogy about extensive reading, must tell high schools they will NOT admit students who have not taken courses requiring extensive reading. Proven on the transcripts.

Or, I dunno, the elite college could evolve.

My Swiss university is changing rapidly this year to accommodate AI and Gen Z - digital natives. Some domains must change more than others but all must change because these kids are WIRED and don't have the attention spans of previous generations. The aren't stupid, though. Intelligence is at least somewhat hard-wired.

Really? Can't read a book? It sounds like an admissions problem to me. Isn't there a question on the application, "What books have you read?" If not, put one there. Problem solved.

I would be stoked to read this, but I’m an elite college student.

[quote]Anthony Grafton, a Princeton historian, said his students arrive on campus with a narrower vocabulary and less understanding of language than they used to have. There are always students who “read insightfully and easily and write beautifully,” he said, “but they are now more exceptions.”

These days, it's almost required that you take multiple AP exams to get into an elite college. In turn, I find it difficult to imagine that you could take high school AP courses, let alone take and get a 5 on an English AP exam, if you haven't read a fairly extensive reading list.

What this really says to me is that these people who've never read a book should never been admitted in the first place to any college, let alone an elite one.

Books are so wordy

Can’t they make the SATs about TikTok?

[quote]Books are so wordy

But also so decorative!

How do they get into any college except the ones desperate for money? What are they talking about Ivy league colleges? Like what was that one run by that very very stupid person put there by Penny Pritzker a billionairess who probably couldn't make a nickel herself at a lemonade stand if her life depended on it.

A friend's friend is a teacher at Syracuse U and says current students are incapable of critical thinking and she is as liberal as they come.

Syracuse is a party school so zzzzz no surprise. But I'm sure there is a range - from quite clever to quite dull.

Last week I explained to my students that they can and maybe should use AI to help them brainstorm oral presentation topics (business ethics). But they can NOT use AI as an "information source" for their presentations. Only information from published sources, by credible experts. In fact we have very specific new academic integrity rules about the use of AI. So they know the rule and accept the instruction but I KNOW they do not accept it in their bones. I guess 1/3 of them are going to ask AI to produce the contents. They are in a for a shock. We were told by deans to fail them and report it as plagiarism to the academic deans. I guess I am going to have to do the work of a HS teacher and ask them to show me their notes from their sources. Also we have forbidden power point hidden comments. They may only have paper note cards during their presentations, just like when we eldergays were in college.

I think I might show them how we did this in the Stone Age. Take notes on note cards. Arrange them and rearrange them, and rearrange them again, and then write a paper or plan a presentation. It actually worked efficiently.

They have very few strategies for all digital research. They don't know how to extract information with their own minds. Knowing what to extract, and what not to bother with. Their brain synapses are not lubricated to do this.

On the upside, they are very open minded and progressive for the most part. They are very kind and sensitive to each other and they are polite and respectful to professors. They are creative thinkers and they are optimistic. Some are gorgeous.

Ok - their first example in the article needs more context. In the kids' defense - I took LitHum first year at Columbia - everyone has to - it's a requirement, although you can take it 2nd year instead.

The first week is the Iliad and the second week is the Odyssey. You usually have quizzes in each class - twice a week - over the material so you can't NOT read it if you want to get a good grade.

The Iliad is around 550 pages and the Odyssey is around 600 pages. They're both very dense and long. You have 4 other classes and to read over 500 pages for one class is a LOT - then turn around and have to do it again the following week.

More importantly - you usually only have 2 days between the next class, so you have to read 275-300 pages in 2 days in order to pass the quiz coming your way the second class that week.

It's a shit way to start your college experience. EVERYBODY struggles with it and complains. It then gets better with smaller books throughout the semester - but it's a huge time suck.

Columbia already has a lot of reading and homework for each class - so it's not like you don't have a shit ton of work in other classes too. So yeah, I understand the feedback from the students in that section of the article.

It's an incredibly stressful way to start college - but it's been that way for 80 or 90 years at Columbia?

I retired from teaching 5th grade in January. I totally understand where that professor is coming from. The truth is, the current reading curriculum in California (Benchmark) is woefully lacking. In 5th grade students read a 2-page article several times, then an "extended" reading for 4-6 pages. There are no chapter books or novels studied in class. I stuck to older standards and always taught my students how to write a five-paragraph essay and other longer forms -only to have them come back at tell me they never wrote more than a paragraph or two, and never read a single novel, in middle school. Yes, the kids can read. But they only read fluff for entertainment. They are not taught how to read and discuss literature, unless they have old-fashioned teachers who are willing to throw out the curriculum and teach what they know is worthwhile. Another part of the problem is that we are no longer allowed to give reading homework. You can't send the book home and say, "Read chapters 4-6 tonight." Students' home time is supposed to be "respected" and school is not allowed to infringe on their social and athletic activities.