Teaser for “Monsters” suggests incestuous Menendez Brothers

Is this a Ryan Murphy production? The trailer reeks of his twisted sexual fantasies.

The guys playing the brothers look nothing like the real Menendez brothers.

“The Lyle and Erik”? Bad title should be “The Erik and Lyle…”

Chloe is a ridiculous casting choice

Lily Rabe should have been cast to play Kitty. She would have had something in common with me.

Cute homocidal homos. Count me in.

So I'm guessing the boys playing the Menendez brothers had to suck Ryan Murphy's cock to get their parts.

How nifty

As a General Hospital viewer, I’m excited to see what will happen when the greater Netflix-couch potato audience gets a load of Nicholas Alexander Chavez. Could be like the last scene of Halloween III.

NAC loco in los ojos

Wasn’t there talk at the time suggesting that the father was sexually abusing both sons?

R10 missed the day his English teacher lectured on subtext.

Isn't Cooper Koch family?

I believe so, R12.

Yes, he's out, too

Everything is gay porn to Ryan Murphy.

Murphy also has an Aaron Hernandez show coming out next month

Odd I always wondered if the brothers were lovers as well. Sometimes in families with sexual abuse, the abused turn to each other or sexual abuse another child. But I also think people here are always - much like Ryan Murphy- looking for the gay angle. Why would Lyle and Erik get married in prison if they were lovers? No one has ever implied- even that blond cunt who was their lawyer-that there was anything sexual between them. Their father may have abused them, but they only turned to each other to kill their parents. I have always understood why they killed their father, and maybe if that was the only murder they would be free now. But killing their mother? She was a victim too on some level. Where is Kitty's story starring Donna Mills?

R17 Kitty was no fucking victim and you're only saying that because she's was a woman. The reality is she was a co-conspirator because the brothers always maintained that she not only knew what was going on with her husband she also participated in it. If they didn't get her too, she would have naturally defended her husband as she always did. If she didn't defend him she would have to answer all the uncomfortable questions. That's why the brothers got her too because she was complicit as well as a participant.

R18, just because the brothers said it doesn't make it so. They lied - about Kitty AND Jose

[quote] just because the brothers said it doesn't make it so. They lied - about Kitty AND Jose

Bullshit. Members of the group Menudo have finally come forward about the abuse they suffered from Jose Mendez. He and his wife were both child predators. Just because you choose to victim blame doesn't mean a victim isn't allowed to tell their truth. You're actually really deplorable R19. Go to hell.

^ lol, it was one guy who claimed Jose (not Kitty) abused him. And his story has lots of holes in it!

[quote] ^ lol, it was one guy who claimed Jose (not Kitty) abused him. And his story has lots of holes in it!

Even one child is one too many. I'm not sure if I should even further engage with a dipshit that uses 'lol' as a comback. If you even knew how difficult it is for an adult male to come forward about his childhood trauma you wouldn't be laughing at all. Or maybe you would since you're obviously like-minded with the pedos of the world. There are more holes in your idiotic posts R21. Like I said go to hell.

If you're gullible enough to believe the word of two sociopaths who killed their parents in cold blood then lied and made the parents look like the villains....

R6 Ryan Murphy doesn’t do the casting couch. He is respectable. I’m so tired of us bashing our own.

R23 Meanwhile, you've provided nothing but witless snark and continued defense of pedophilia. You've done nothing to provide any evidence to the contrary. You're the gullible one and quick sick to boot. Pedophile is the only words that can describe them. Jose was no better than Michael Jackson. They're both sitting in hell right now, reserving your seat right next to them.

R25, I'm not defending pedophiles. I'm defending people falsely accused of being pedophiles. You'll believe anything, including the crocodile tears of a couple of murderers

R24 That's what you think.

R26 Keep dancing with the devil you perverted dipshit. Once again, you've provided nothing. Meanwhile, the people who really knew him tell the truth.

Falsely accusing dead people who can't defend themselves based of the word of a couple sociopaths is evil. That you're so worked up by this screams "projection" - maybe you're the pervert

R29 Still provides nothing to the contrary. No, dear, you're definitely the pervert.

IMDb has this listed under “Monster”

Tut tut.

I guess he’s abandoned American Crime Story as his anthology title.

About Cooper

R24 “ Ryan Murphy doesn’t do the casting couch. He is respectable.”

How the hell would you know?

The parents were abusers, but the sons were odd how they went on a massive spending spree in the weeks after they killed their parents.

It’ll be 99% fiction like the first season of Feud.

[quote] The parents were abusers, but the sons were odd how they went on a massive spending spree in the weeks after they killed their parents.

Everyone processes trauma differently.

So did he only molest his sons because their have been no other victims to come forward; also why did they kill their mom?

Apparently some people "process trauma" by spending thousands on rolexes a few days after they murder their parents

r38 "because their* have been no other victims to come forward"

You haven't read

R40 Why did you post their picture rather than the actual Wikipedia page. I was going to read the page but now I will not, cunt.

r41 Teafake "I was going to read the page but now I will not"

Oh damn, I will not sleep tonight knowing this. You have really taught me a lesson. Will you read it if I beg?

I wonder if the URL was simply a paste error - ever think of that, dumbass? Do you have access to Google?

R38 R41 Should be embarrassed. "Nobody else has come forward?" You simply haven't been paying attention.

They were adults, not kids. They couldn’t have cared less. They went out after and were living it up.

E39 Yeah they rather took the piss with that.

R42 It was a joke cunt. And r43 I didn’t know. I don’t have media alerts on for the Menendez brother but now that I DO know 🤔. They still didn’t deserve to die so viciously. They led a life of wealth and childhood privilege most could only dream of.

Has Ricky Martin commented? And I don’t mean that with snark. I mean it legitimately.

R46 you are the joke, cunt. The only thing you do is open your mouth and let shit fall out. Fuck off.

r47

Some of yall are such bitches. Since when isn’t the thread part conversation. Fkin nasty cunts.

r50 "Since when isn’t the thread part conversation"

Since you at r41 said "Why did you post their picture rather than the actual Wikipedia page. I was going to read the page but now I will not, cunt. " when someone accidentally pasted in a URL incorrectly.

That's when, cunt.

R51 Touche. But your feenin ass. You aren’t going to get to fuck them in prison. That’s why you posted a link of their faces because you are obsessed with their looks.

r52 I'm trying to interpret your 5th-grade writing, but perhaps you didn't see this: " when someone ACCIDENTALLY pasted in a URL incorrectly..."

Carry on, Teafake - as usual, I hope things improve for you. I see that you are not sober, so maybe this won't take you into a spiral this weekend.

R53 I am completely sober right now you fucking sensitive Mary.

You be trippin and steady feenin, mafucker at r54

I've never bought the story of the father molesting them. It always seemed like a weak justification for murder.

However, I've always thought that they were probably fooling around together.

I thought neither. I thought they were MONSTERS.

I think the father did molest them - still doesn't explain the psychotic rage murders, and post-murder behaviour, though!

When will this ever happen?

Can't wait

Chavez and Koch are both excellent in this. I know Chavez has a big role in Ryan Murphy’s upcoming series “Grotesquerie” but hoping he’ll expand beyond RM’s world.

r51 Cool - looking forward to it

[quote]I'm guessing the boys playing the Menendez brothers had to suck Ryan Murphy's cock to get their parts.

The boys playing the Menendez brothers got to suck Ryan Murphy's cock to get their parts.

"Even one child is one too many"

Yes, but we can only do what we can do. We don't always get a chance to eliminate the other one.

r63 Those poor guys

Those who've seen it - is it wildly untrue? or seems fairly on point?

If they were truthful, then Lyle and Erik feared for their lives.

If they were lying, then Lyle and Erik murdered in cold blood.

In either case, the brothers wanted their inheritance without further ado.

I didn't care about it when it happened. I'm not sure I care enough now to invest the time. Yes, it was shocking that two brothers would shoot and kill their parents. But I must have been too distracted by stuff happening closer to home. It just seemed remote. And after Manson and the Zodiac Killer, etc. it just didn't register that much.

So two spoiled rich kids murder their parents and ever since all we've heard is variations on "they deserved it."

Was Lyle really that much of a dick? Did the actual case try to sway it as if he was the aggressive one and Erik was just a whimpering idiot?

R70, Having read a book on this case, it does seem that Lyle was the protective-type big brother and that Erik was a weaker sort.

Jose comes off as very ambitious, but many people are. He had very high expectations for his sons and pushed them athletically and scholastically. The boys "failed" him.

I didn't believe the molestation stories until the Menudo revelations. Now the brothers' testimonies have credibility.

R68 oh ok

SO what's with the wig?

r73 "so"

Who's watching?

I will be soon

Didn't someone post here that there was a movement to get them a retrial?

Those guys have not aged well in real life.

R77, there is

Cooper shows his Koch in Swallowed.

This is good!! And I think the guy playing Eric is hot. But you're right in real life neither of them aged well, and Lyle is downright neanderthal in his facial bone structure.

I get them mixed up

Two greedy psychopathic grown men. They should have given them the injection and gotten it over with. They should have been put down years ago.

The point of this show is to get them released from prison by introducing a lot of noise as "evidence" that wasn't allowed during the trial or was discredited.

Was Eric really gay? Or was that part made up? Apparently he ended up marrying a woman, so more likely he was bi?

He "married" a woman in prison so he can't even have sex with her

The gay kiss was hot!

R86 But why marry her in the first place? That means he is at the very least bi. Or maybe those accounts of him hooking up with men were incorrect.

R83 The death penalty is barbaric. I don't care what they did, the death penalty should never be used.

[quote][R83] The death penalty is barbaric. I don't care what they did, the death penalty should never be used.

Obligatory not r83 - but...

I don't have a problem with someone being sentenced to death for their crimes.

The only problem I have with the death penalty is that it's application has been proven historically to be woefully biased against poor people (who can't afford high priced lawyers) and minorities. From police investigations to criminal trials and sentences, it hasn't been fairly applied.

Additionally, many people raise the issue of the relative cost due to all the appeals and the process associated with actually implementing the sentence. However, the problem is that we recognize the finality and the potential for error, so create a byzantine process which, in fact, does not improve the previously noted biased application.

In cases, such as some of these school shooters or others where guilt isn't really a question, why not. You could argue that even people like the Manson girls who were unrepentant for years during their incarcerations were finally "rehabilitated" and so killing them would be wrong. No one can know whether they were just old and tired or whether they actually came to true contrition. But, does it matter? They still brutally killed people - a bell you simply cannot unring.

Based on what I saw tonight, there is no way I would interpret this as sympathetic to the two brothers. In fact, this seemed to foreclose further discussion about the mitigating circumstances. And damn was the character Leslie Abramson, their lawyer, annoying. Was she really that bad in real life? Lyle was a real asshole. Volatile and stupid. A bully and a know it all. We they abused? I would have to say they probably were abused but I don't think it was sexual. Jose was also a bully. He was volatile, violent, threatening, etc. but I don't think he or Mom sexually abused the boys.

r91 I think the 'boys' suggested the mom just didn't help

Does Ryan Murphy have ADD or something? He always has multiple projects active at the same time and very obviously abandons them to focus on new ones leaving them to die a slow, painful, death.

r93 I wonder how much involvement he really has

I bet we know he wanted to be very involved in this one.

Are all episodes available now?

Love these actors

[Quote]I bet we know he wanted to be very involved in this one.

Lol. Nailed it.

R90, "Caught red-handed" in our system of jurisprudence is not synonymous with "unmitigated guilt."

I’ve only watched the first two episodes so far. The show is hot.

Did Eric and Lyle, or LA guys in general, really party around in speedos? Are the actors stuffing their speedos?

I was reading that Lyle testified to having sexually abused Eric and he apologized.

Lyle's Speedo was definitely stuffed. That bulge was cartoonishly big. It was a bit absurd. Lyle never struck me as the Speedo type to begin with.

R101, what the fuck are you talking about? The actor or the real person?

They were Spanish. They wear speedos.

Or Mexican or whatever.

[quote]what the fuck are you talking about? The actor or the real person?

I can't even.

Only 2 episodes out now?

R100, "I was reading...."

What is your source? I can find nothing of the sort.

A cousin has stated that Erik told him when Erik was only 13 that the father was "massaging his, Erik's, genitals, and asked if his cousin's father did that."

The mother told others not to walk past the boys' bedrooms if the father was in one of them. The visitor had to go to the basement bathroom, instead.

The Menudo boy said Jose molested and raped him at age 13.

r107 That letter in the article is terrible - how sad.

R107, here

R107, the cousin wasn't necessarily telling the truth. You think their family members wouldn't lie to save them from the death penalty?

Lily Rabe should have been cast as Kitty. Her mother, Jill Clayburg, played Kitty in the 1994 TV movie.

[quote] Jill Clayburg

As in "Pittsburgh," don't forget the "H," dear r112.

Wow, 33 years behind bars - didn't realize it was that long ago

Couldn’t the father claim he was molesting growing up. You see what I’m getting at. They weren’t 14 or 15; they were damn near grown ass men. I believe they probably were abused. That’s not an excuse. There are no sins worst than pre-meditated murder without some type of mental illness or diminished capacity.

The father may have been molested and continuing a fucked up cycle. They are cold blooded murderers. Big difference.

R114. And they should stay there. Because they murdered that mama out of greed. They murdered their sick dad out of greed. Only God can see that heart to know if they are truly remorseful.

That Fucking House was a FreakOff

At the end of the day, it was all about $$$$ for them.

I feel yucky watching this. It's so over the top yet the actors playing the brothers are hot. Nine episodes though?

Did their dad actually diddle them?

Seriously R120?

It seems some don’t think he did, R121.

He claims his father was still molesting him as a young adult at 18...to make the murder look justified.

[quote]The Menendez brothers have been behind bars for 33 years. Is that long enough?

This is the problem with bringing their "story" back into the spotlight.

Idiots start asking ridiculous questions like whether 33 years for a brutal double murder is sufficient.

The answer is NO, it's not long enough.

Let's put it this way, Jose would only be 80 and could very well still be alive if he hadn't been, you know, murdered by his children. They haven't even served sentences equal to the years they deprived their victims of.

Scenes of hot actors playing Lyle and Erick having at it would be the only reason I would watch this crap.

Does Chloe Sevigny look like George Washington in this too?

I'd watch it just for that.

Why are you sympathetic to Jose, r124, when there is testimony that he was a child-rapist?

Am I in this show?

^^ you’re playing Lyle’s wig

R127, just because someone testified to it doesn't mean they were telling the truth.

Lyle got busted on the stand, he admitted he tried to pay an ex-girlfriend to claim that Jose made a pass at her. They made shit up to make him look like a "perv"

[quote]Why are you sympathetic to Jose, [R124], when there is testimony that he was a child-rapist?

I'm not sympathetic to anyone. I'm against murderers.

[quote]Did their dad actually diddle them?

We'll never really know for certain.

Even if they had been molested, they were two grown-ass men who could've moved out and lived on their own.

Erik's wife says how dare Ryan Murphy slander poor Erik!

r116 "Only God can see that heart to know if they are truly remorseful. "

Oh sweetie, do you also believe in the tooth fairy? easter bunny? Hilarious. "God" would have prevented the tragedy if she really existed.

Lots of frau for brains on this thread.

Vicki Lawrence as the juror who suffers a heart attack! What a surprise!

[quote] Falsely accusing dead people who can't defend themselves based of the word of a couple sociopaths is evil.

Hear! Hear!

R135 No sir. God gave us free will. If he intervened into personal bad decisions reality would collapse on itself.

R115, I think molesting your own kids is a million times worse than that killing his or her molester. In fact, I think it's justifiable homicide.

However, we don't know whether that happened to the Menendez Brothers. If it did? If their dad molested them? They should be released.

If he didn't? They are right where they should be.

What people don't get is that it is a fictional story, not a documentary. It's based on true events, but not everythibg told will be true. Some stuff will be embellished.

"If their dad molested them? They should be released."

Guess the mom was just collateral damage, huh?

Did the dad actually diddle them?

There's a photo floating around the internet that seems to corroborate that theory.

R140 Well thankfully you do not make laws. Mendez Sr was likely molested himself and didn’t break the cycle because he is sick and selfish. They weren’t in any imminent danger. That is not justifiable homicide. Revenge is not justifiable homicide.

Judge for yourselves

It seems like the fictional portrayals always make him look more Hispanic than he really looked.

It's likely that most of Jose Menedez's DNA was mostly European.

Looks like he was wearing a wig even as a little boy in the pic at r145

Erik literally says here that he's not gay, so we know Ryan Murphy made that up.

Erik isn’t necessarily portrayed as gay in the series, though. He’s confused and unsure about his own sexuality as a result of being raped and called a “f*ggot” by his family all his life. The show reserves room for ambiguity around what really happened with his prison pal. As Dominick Dunne says, having sex in a prison shower doesn’t make you gay, it makes you popular.

R150 But didn't they say he was in a relationship with his friend Craig when he was a teenager?

R151 He says he fooled around with a gay guy in high school, who someone later identifies as Craig, although that’s ambiguous. They never show any romantic or sexual interactions between Erik and Craig, although there’s a scene where Kitty accuses them of “sucking each other’s cocks.” It also seemed to me that Erik was drawn toward guys who were sure of their sexuality (this HS friend, the prison friend) because he was looking for a model for how to act. For me, the takeaway about Erik’s sexuality is more that Jose fucked him up and left him seeking for an identity and a way to connect with anyone.

I thought different races aren't supposed to mingle in US prisons? And that you're not supposed to show any weakness. No hint of that in this series! Erik had no problem crying openly out in the yard and having his BBC buddy comfort him in front of all the other inmates.

After watching the whole thing and reflecting on it, I think those boys had a brutal childhood. I think both parents were probably emotionally and physically abusive. Their discipline model seemed very inconsistent. One minute the mother or father was telling them they were worthless and hated and WTF ever and the other they were given fancy cars and discussing plans for the future in posh colleges. I hate to say this but they lived among a society where probably a lot of their peers had similar upbringing. Parents who were alcoholics, fueled by cocaine rages, etc. Wealthy entitled, emotionally and physically abused, etc. to me they seemed like a typical wealthy LA family. Their mother seemed disconnected from them and didn't actually like being their mother, and their father's moral dictum was "Lie, cheat, steal, but don't get caught. Breaking in other people's houses was an embarrassment. Plus they got caught. Violent outbursts and threats were the currency of their environment. And they made a bargain. Unspoken, but still a bargain. They were going to put up with the hellish relationship they had with their parents, in order to maintain their lifestyle. When Dad claimed they were cut out of the will and he was through with them, that was the trigger. So they killed them. IMO they need to remain in jail. They are monsters.

And the Emmy goes to …Vicki Lawrence

R152 Yeah. I think he is bi, although mostly attracted to women.

r149 "literally"

R157 It's always possible he's bi. I believe he has had relationships with both. He's probably a Kinsey 1 or 2.

R149, Lindsey Graham says he's not gay

Erik released a statement condemning the series.

LEAVE OUR BOYS ALONE !

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't it quite rare for a father to sexually abuse his biological offspring? Then on top of that we're supposed to believe that their mother knew about it and didn't care. THEN we're supposed to believe that the sexual assault went on from the time they were young children until Erik was 18!? So is Daddy Menendez into prepubescent children or adults?? Because Lyle & Erik are trying to convince us that he's into both. I'm no pedo expert, but I'd assume if someone has a predilection for prepubescent children then an 18yo isn't gonna do it for them. And then there's the obvious fact that an 18yo who's allegedly being abused can simply MOVE OUT.

Sorry, just too many far-fetched scenarios in a row have to be believed in order to get us to where Lyle & Erik want us to go. I'm not buying what they're selling.

R159 I know. I don't quite believe Erik when he says he's not gay. He said it was because they thought he had to be gay since he was abused by his dad, but why then didn't they think Lyle was also gay? Because I think only Erik was asked about his sexuality, so his excuse makes no sense? My guess is there was some truth to those sexuality rumors. He just couldn't deal with it. I think he is most likely bi, and is in denial about his same sex feelings, like he has supressed them or something. It makes sense if he's bi, he can get his fullfillment by women, and won't have to "deal" with that side of himself, which he probably connects to the abuse. Another thing is the younger brother is more likely to be gay. It's scientifically proven.

[quote]Another thing is the younger brother is more likely to be gay. It's scientifically proven.

No it's not. Gay men happen on all birth orders, and many gay men are an only child.

r162 "Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't it quite rare for a father to sexually abuse his biological offspring?

No, it isn't, sadly.

Yikes, R165. I tried Googling that before posting and didn't come up with much. I swear I'd heard or read one time though that SA happens much more often to stepchildren or foster children or others not biologically related to the abuser. It boggles the mind that anyone could do something like that to their own flesh & blood (not that doing it to someone unrelated isn't abhorrent as well).

Why did Erik defend Lyle? Didn't Lyle abuse him? This is some weird co-dependency shit, like he's still under his spell or something. Maybe it was good they were separated all these years. I feel like Lyle manipulated Erik a lot.

R164 You are wrong. Among brothers it's more likely the younger one is gay.

Then why are so many gay men the oldest brother or an only child? In my own experience that's most of the gay men I've known.

The resarch for "younger brothers are more likely to be gay" was done looking at homosexual unions only.

This is misleading in that the researchers were unable to measure ‘homosexuality’ or even homosexual behavior. Their outcome is entering an official homosexual union, which is NOT a perfect proxy for homosexuality by any stretch, and is likely to depend much more on cultural and social factors than is homosexual desires or even homosexual behavior.

R169 That's your experience, among a very small number of gay men. You can't really make a conclusion from that.

r171 read r170

So Lyle was the gay one all along, not Erik? How could Ryan Murphy get it so wrong?

R160 great link

Sad how poorly they aged

R173 He looks like Rod Blagojevich in that picture!

Come on, they're both probably having or have had consensual prison sex. They were attractive young men. I believe that Eric is atleast bisexual.

I wish there was video

R175 I actually think Erik was fairly atttactive when young. I'm sad he's now living a hetero life with a wife and kids.

R177 Yes. My guess is that Erik is most likely bisexual (Kinsey 1 or 2). Lyle... I thought he was straight until I read about his prison lover. Now I have no idea, I mean he's obviously at least bi.

Not much of a "hetero life" since he's in fucking jail and his wife and kids are just props

R181 Well, he didn't have to marry a woman, yet he did. He also adopted her children.

I'm two episodes in, and so far it's pretty slow moving.

All I've really learned so far is that these boys were pretty stupid. I mean, how dumb do you have to be to spend thousands and thousands of dollars right after your parents have been killed?

I also thought that Lyle playing Milli Vanilli at their parents' memorial was something Ryan Murphy made up, but no, that was true.

And, oh yeah, that Speed bulge was ridiculous.

I have seen it. It has the sad ring of truth . No question the boys were sexually and physically abused by their father . The mother was complicit . She knew it was happening and did nothing.

The boys were traumatized. I can see how they thought their parents were going to kill them. The boys threatened to expose the family.

Side note : after the first hung jury, Leslie A. The attorney spoke with a group of female jurors who voted not guilty.

One juror told her that the reason all the men voted guilty was because they didn’t like Leslie A. As a trial lawyer, I know how critical it is for the jury to like the lawyer .

She should have stepped aside .

Ari Graynor is tremendous as Leslie, especially in the scene with the juror that R184 mentions.

It makes me uncomfortable when people make excuses for them. Yes, what happened to them was awful, but they were old enough to move away.

I also find it hard to believe they genuinely thought their parents were going to murder them. That sounds like the kind of thing someone would make up after the event to add more justification.

They murdered because they wanted money and didn't want to wait for it.

R186 I was with you until the last sentence.

Nicholas Alexander Chavez is gonna be nekkid!

I dunno, I kind of agree with R186. And I’m not even completely sold on them being sexually abused. Maybe physically and/or emotionally. Regardless, part of their motivation had to have been the money. It’s true they could have moved away, but they both seemed kind of lazy and entitled, or maybe spoiled. Moving away would have meant leaving a lifestyle they’d become accustomed to.

R187 I only say that because of the colossal spending spree after they'd murdered their parents. I mean, it's not like they tripped over and accidentally spilled money from their wallets onto the sidewalk. They consistently and consciously blew vast sums of money. I mean, in those circumstances, it's hard to say money had no bearing on their decision to murder, surely?

The excessive spending after the murders tells me they were also being defiant. Now they were "free" and had no controls or guardrails. They were unleashed. I don't think they believed their parents were going to kill them. Their incentive was the money. Getting cut out of the will. They were brought up in an abusive volatile environment and that's who they became. Especially Lyle. He was a version of his own father.

Indeed. And I preface this by saying there's no excuse for abuse (sexual or otherwise) but it was pretty clear that, because they'd been raised with wealth, they were lazy and entitled. They didn't seem to have much motivation to make anything of themselves, because they knew they'd get all the money they ever wanted once their parents died.

So either getting cut out of the will, or the idea that they might have to wait a long time for that money, meant they wanted a shortcut.

The teaser should have been a hint that Murphy would make the brothers incestuous.

well if Lyle did molest Erik, it was incest

R184 will believe anything. There's no evidence their parents were planning to murder them, in fact, they had made plans to play bridge with friends of theirs on the day when they were supposedly going to kill their kids

Kitty told her shrink that she thought her sons were sociopaths and that she was scared of them. They weren't scared of her, she was scared of them

They were planning on pleading not guilty, but when they learned that cops had their confessions to Dr. Oziel they decided to switch gears and invent the abuse shit and tried to claim their parents were going to kill them to make it look like self-defense

Listen to what they told Dr. Oziel. They told him they killed their dad because they resented him controlling their lives. They killed their mom because they thought they were putting her out of her misery (she tried to kill herself when she found out Jose was cheating on her. With grown women, not little boys)

They claimed their parents were going to shoot them on the boating expedition and then pretend they drowned out at sea. Because it's totally normal for not one but two people to drown in the ocean with bullets in them.

R196 I honestly don't know what to believe. They still insist to this day that they were abused. On the other hand there's the "abused not accused" angle.

As an aside, does the track they constantly play with the woman singing "hmmmm, hmmmmm" annoy anyone else?

R196 On the one hand you had all the people who testified they did not hear or see Jose being abusive to his sons. The only ones who said that he was abusive were Menendez family members. But it is possible he hid it well, most abusers do. On the other hand you have the fact that others have come forward about being abused/molested by Jose, like the Menudo member. His confession (if true) substantiates the Menendez brothers' claim.

So stupid to confess to the shrink. Idiots.

The environment they grew up in was ugly. I absolutely believe they were emotionally and physically but not sexually abused growing up and at the same time they were also showered with gifts and a lavish lifestyle. Jose and Kitty were horrible people. She admitted she didn't like being a mother and Jose was all about "Lie, Cheat, and steal, but don't get caught!" There was no moral center in that house. It was a huge void. The boat outing to find sharks, was not going to be the moment when Jose murdered his kids. There were other people on the fucking boat. The brothers liled to police. They killed to be free to spend all the money. It was money that drove them. And...they got caught.

I’m sure they are guilty as charged but since the Manson woman was paroled after those horrific murders might as well the brothers go, right? Fair is fair.

I’m obsessed with Cooper Koch. He’s openly gay and his penis scenes were real. No prosthetics!!

I read some people see the Netflix show as an aim to get them out of prison, but that seems unlikely to me. The show paints them in a poor light, especially Lyle - who is portrayed as a complete asshole - especially in the scene where he's asking multiple people to tell lies in court for him and his over confidence in walking free.

Agreed r205. The title is calling them what they are in this interpretation.

R204 Cooper is married, he's wearing a wedding ring. His husband is very lucky!

I have to say that episode 4 was riveting. One camera, focused on Kooper Coch for 50 minutes, no edits, as Erik recounts to Leslie Abramson being sexually abused.

Some truly impressive acting on Koch's part there.

It was episode 5 and it was 30 minutes.

Javier is so handsome in the video at R207.