29 years ago today, Betty Buckley took over

Hi Betty at op.

Hi Patti at R1. Jealous ?

Who the hell do you think you are r2!!!!!!!!!!!

And eight is enough to fill her toilet with shit.

We went on impulse—there wasn’t much else, IIRC. I don’t think it’s a great show (live the original movie), but thought Buckley was extraordinary—she had the star presence necessary for the role, but also made Norma “real”—ridiculous, vulnerable, tragic.

Agree, r5 It was an excellent match of performer and role.

Betty seemed nonplussed by Rosie cutting open a vein, telling her she wanted Abby for a stepmom

It was a role that came very naturally to her, given she’s INSANE.

Stephen Sondheim was quoted as saying, “Better this than one of my shows.”

Sondheim often suggested to Lloyd Weber that Buckley would be perfect for a one-woman performance of Starlight Express.

Good summary overall, but Patti was only fired from the New York production, not London. She stayed on in London until her contract was up on March 9th, so that she’d have legal ground to sue ALW for breach of contract without having done the same.

Nobody has been better, start here at 4:05.

Bitch had great pipes.

Is it true she's Lesbyterian?

Humorless but she played the tragedy beautifully and no one has ever sung the score better.

47?! She looked 70

She worked with ALW twice before SB, SHe was in Cats and replaced Bernadette Peters in Song and Dance

she and Rosie do the Lez-Lez?

She strikes me as all wrong for Song & Dance. A girl from Britian trying to make it as ain NYC? That ain't Buckley.

I still love her singing here.

[quote]47?! She looked 70

SHUT UP CHRIS!

Patti LuPone was terrible in Sunset Boulevard. She didn't have the range to sing the top notes. No wonder Andrew replaced her. She also didn't look anything like a silent film actress.

No one is bitchier than Buckley

Elaine Page originated the role of Grizabella in London. Buckley followed a couple of years later, originating the role on Broadway.

[quote]Buckley followed a couple of years later, originating the role on Broadway.

I think the OP suggests that with the inclusion of '1982' and 'Tony Award'. I don't think readers were assuming the West End.

Pity Buckley has barely been back to Broadway since then

Saw both LuPone and Buckley in Sunset. Both ladies were excellent. ALW had his choice who played Norma and his first instinct to go with LuPone was a good one.

I saw Betty in SB on Broadway. She and the set were the only good things about that stinkeroo

Yep, r27.

I'm not a Bettyphile (humorless bitch is about right) but damn if she didn't sell the shit out of As If We Never Said Goodbye. Agree she sang it best on stage.

[quote]his first instinct to go with LuPone was a good one

His first instinct was to offer Angela Lansbury the role, but she didn't accept.

His second instinct was to offer the role to Shirley MacLaine, but she refused.

His third instinct was to offer it to Patti, and she accepted...then regretted it.

[quote]His second instinct was to offer the role to Shirley MacLaine, but she refused.With her limited vocal instrument?

Was MacLaine's vocal instrument more limited than Glenn Close's or Diahann Carroll's ?

Definitely more limited than Carroll's, r32. She had a recording career. All things(age) considered, her voice wasn't in too bad shape when she did Sunset.

Also, r32, I can't hear in my head Shirley singing a "Norma" song (whatever they would have been). Also Norma needs a bit of grandeur and that really isn't in Shirl's wheelhouse.

[quote]Is it true she's Lesbyterian?

Nope, not at all!

For years Betty was an OG cougar. She liked the mens and she liked them YOUNG.

I was invited to the initial workshop of Sunset at ALW's estate. I assume I was being offered the role but I must have declined.

All Meryl would have gotten out of it is fucked up knees from the stairs and a Tony she could tuck behind her Oscars.

[quote]R9 Stephen Sondheim was quoted as saying, “Better this than one of my shows.”

I think Mr. Sondheim liked performers who worshipped him (which were of course NOT hard to find!) Betty Buckley is unapologetically opinionated, and that must have rubbed him the wrong way.

I don’t know that there are Sondheim roles she’s obviously “right” for, though. Maybe Charlotte in A LITTLE NIGHT MUSIC?

Betty's performance at OP looked and sounded like she sung right out of getting out of bed.

Replacement Elaine Paige may not be a Broadway star name, but this is how the song should be sung

Betty did do Sondheim - Gypsy at the Pepper Mill Playhouse right after she finished her run in Sunset. Laurents reportedly trashed it.

[quote]r40 Betty did do Sondheim - Gypsy at the Pepper Mill Playhouse

I heard her Rose was very salty.

Rose's Turn

[quote] Betty's performance at OP looked and sounded like she sung right out of getting out of bed. Replacement Elaine Paige may not be a Broadway star name, but this is how the song should be sung.

Horseshit, Paige came to town and no one noticed.

And they even had to lower the damn banister for her.

Paige always seems like someone’s mom to me.

She has said that she wanted to have children, but "it's a wonderful life I have, so I'm very fulfilled in other ways".

Zzzzzzzzz

R40 Arthur Laurents disliked a production he wasn’t involved in? What a shocker.

If Sondheim had done a musical version of Eight is Enough, he still wouldn’t have cast her.

In many ways, the backstage dramas are more enjoyable than the show.

Sounds similar to Ethel Merman

Buckley loved Sondheim but he said said unkind things to her. One time he said that he didn't like how she arranged his songs when she sang them

What happened was Betty was cast as the Witch in Into the Woods during the first workshop. She left to do Song and Dance on Broadway to replace Bernadette and did not go to San Diego and was replaced by Ellen Foley. James Lapine fired Ellen from coming to Broadway and begged Betty to come back and do the role. During the next pre-Broadway workshop they famously feuded and she was fired and Sondheim asked Bernadette to save the show at the last minute.

Sondheim wasn’t a fan of hers ever since. Yes, he also hated her albums with Kenny and told her so.

[quote] Betty did do Sondheim - Gypsy at the Pepper Mill Playhouse

Well, Thelma Harper's Madame Rose in Gypsy at the Pepper Pot Playhouse had to be SEEN to be BELIEVED!

[quote]Well, Thelma Harper's Madame Rose in Gypsy at the Pepper Pot Playhouse had to be SEEN to be BELIEVED!

Yeah well her daughter Eunice's Baby June blew her off the stage.

Dominique Deveraux was a saloon singer.

[quote]One time he said that he didn't like how she arranged his songs when she sang them

You mean re-arranged, r52.

R56 oh yeah? Blanche Deveraux played the skin flute.

[quote]Sondheim wasn’t a fan of hers ever since. Yes, he also hated her albums with Kenny and told her so.

Didn't she give him her CD and basically corner him into an opinion, r53?

Who can forget how Betty "opened her throat" prior to performing?

49 years ago today Betty Buckley engaged in her first hardcore scissoring.

[quote]James Lapine fired Ellen from coming to Broadway and begged Betty to come back and do the role. During the next pre-Broadway workshop they famously feuded and she was fired and Sondheim asked Bernadette to save the show at the last minute.

I doubt casting Bernadette "saved the show" as it really isn't much of a role, especially in the original production which was overwhelmed by the fantastic performances of Joanna Gleason and Chip Zein. "The Last Midnight" is a dog of a song.

Bernadette “saved the show” in that at least they weren’t forced to hire Bonnie Franklin to open it.

Well, r63, there is that.

R62 that’s not true. In the Sondheim book by Craig Zadan he wrote that the producers noted that 25% of advanced ticket sales were due to Bernadette and people excited to see her next show.

Just because it was Sondheim didn’t mean it was going to be a hit show. See Merrily We Roll Along and Pacific Overtures.

Also Joanna was lauded, but Bernadette wasn’t overwhelmed by Chip Zien’s performance that wasn’t even nominated for a Drama Desk or Tony.

SSS: Will we be hearing much Sondheim material at your upcoming concert at the Carlyle?

Betty Buckley: Probably not. He doesn't like my arrangements and he let me know that when I was in London, which was heartbreaking because it was one of the biggest, one of the most shocking moments of my life. I'd sent him a couple of my CDs because we recorded a lot of his songs and he came backstage and congratulated me and I could tell that he seemed kind of uncomfortable and I said, "Mr. Sondheim, I sent you my CDs and you never responded." He said, "Well I wouldn't have brought it up but since you did, I'll tell you: I don't like what you've done with my songs." And I was just heartbroken. It was shattering to me. And he had some theories as to why I had arranged them that way and I said, "I honestly have been only inspired and only, completely...." I had no words to tell him how much I love his work. I can't even put it into language, how meaningful it is to me and how important his work has been for me.

more at the link

r66 really humanizes La Buckley.

She was a big cokehead in the 70s/80s, which probably contributed to her assholery. But she's been very generous with fans, so I'll give her credit for that.

R49 I like the cut of your jib.

It easy to be very generous with your fans when you can count the number on 2 hands

[quote]Is it true she's Lesbyterian?

A London Sunset Blvd cast member once referred to her to me as Betty Both-ways.

What song of Sondheim’s did she butcher?

People complain about Betty's behavior yet Patti LuPone is out there.

Sondheim didn't like her?

Cunt recognized cunt!

[quote]r52 One time he said that he didn't like how she arranged his songs when she sang them

This is gorgeous. What the HELL else did that little bitch Sondheim want?!

r74

agreed and I love her version of old friends and merry me a little

MARRY me a little

we need an EDIT feature!!!!

That CD and her Carnegie Hall CD are both masterpieces. I play them all the time.

Now this is coming up in my feed - -

[quote]"Well I wouldn't have brought it up but since you did, I'll tell you: I don't like what you've done with my songs."

He's the ultimate Sonhemite. If your version doesn't sound exactly as the original, you're dismissed. His prerogative, since he wrote it but think how Dolly embraced Whitney's " I will Always Love You".

Love visiting this little parallel musical theatre universe where Betty Buckley should be teaching Sondheim about music

I saw Elaine Page as Norma in London. I thought she was a lot better than the material, but I was also 17 and not yet a Broadway queen or lady-in-waiting.

I too saw Elaine on the night before it closed. Alice was out(I think she wanted her understudy to be able to have her family see her in the role). It was my 1st broadway show and I was smitten

Dolly embraced the paychecks from Whitney's I Will Always Love You

Sondheim knew that Betty's covers were only going to bring him quarters and dimes, so no need to sugarcoat his opinions

[quote]r79 [Sondheim’s] the ultimate Sonhemite.

Speaking of his ruthless, vengeful bitchery, I had not heard this before:

Steve gave Babs “Children will glisten,” and I for one will never forgive him.

Garn Stephens - I remember her in that thankless role she took in the second season of 'Phyllis', playing Cloris Leachman's coworker. Try as she may, she just wasn't funny.

[quote]r86 Try as she may, she just wasn't funny.

She was probably still traumatized from Miss Sondheim FIRING her.

R82. Alice Ripley was out closing weekend so she could attend her brother's (?) wedding. It wasn't a Beanie/Lindsey thing. Her absence has been planned in advance and then the closing notice went up.

Betty is more or less the female counterpart to Mandy P. Kind of insufferable emoting and self importance.

LuPone’s Norma has grown on me. The cast album doesn’t really show her off that well. A recording of her final performance, though low quality, reveals how much she grew in the part, emotionally and vocally.

Buckley’s studio recordings for Sunset are excellent. Pity she didn’t get to do a full album.

I love this version of Unexpected Song but I’m guessing Sondheim didn’t. It’s the opening track of her Children Will Listen CD so it probably soured his opinion right from the start

Someone I knew once claimed Betty has attempted suicide several times and can't be left alone in certain situations or around weapons. No idea if that is true or hogwash. The person had connections to the entertainment world in NYC and Los Angeles. I have always liked Betty and hearing that made me think they had confused her with someone else, perhaps.

R91, Sondheim didn’t write that one.

R93, are we sure he wasn’t referring to Norma Desmond?

Betty seems very Instagram happy on her ranch near her mom. She still works in tv and film but I doubt we'll ever see her onstage again. I still think she would make a great Madam Armfeldt.

r92 Betty Lynn IS Norma Desmond!

Years ago, someone posted this story on DL. Someone responded, "Crazy attracts crazy."

She talks about Sondheim’s indifference to her here

I cannot believe a total sinker of a show like "Sunset Boulevard" seems to get produced over and over.

I've seen it a bunch of times and it remains a dopey, bloated turkey every time, no matter who plays Norma!

She just turned 77. How old is her mother ?

If the Hamptons Police haven't identified Betty's stalker yet, OP is one tipline away from having to confirm her whereabouts

I come to DL for posts like r100

R99. Betty's mom is 98. Bless her.

Sondheim sounds so strange about objecting to new arrangements of his songs.

It used to be that singers prided themselves on having their own take on a standard. Rosemary Clooney was furious when Judy Garland copied her uptempo arrangement for “Come Rain or Come Shine.” The different arrangement s reflect a performer’s personal response to the music, which goes beyond the composer’s.

The various arrangements also reflect changes in time. A song needn’t be locked in 1964 forever.

I think Betty changed rhythms and phrasings. That is what Sondheim didn't like.

Betty trying to martyr herself on an altar to Sondheim is kind of undignified. Y’know, sing ‘em if you got ‘em. It’s not like everything he ever did was perfect.

Well, I think that was mostly while he was still alive and she hoped he’d hire her.

She’ll do whatever she wants with his tunes, now.

Her unusual arrangement for “Meadowlark” is electric.

I think she asked the composer if there was one note in the song she could change, as the flow made better sense to her. He liked her idea.

I wonder which note that was.

Betty was ripped to shreds several times from Sondheim and one particularly brutal dressing down by Arthur Laurent’s after Papermill Gypsy.

Thats got to be rough to be torn so many new assholes

r108

any more details as to why?

I can't imagine that Sondheim would have liked performance

jazz hands!

That Papermill Gypsy was dreadful and had no business even thinking about moving to Broadway.

In r110, Betty looks like she's wearing an ensemble from Norma Desmond's wardrobe.

[quote]R108 Betty was ripped to shreds several times from Sondheim and one particularly brutal dressing down by Arthur Laurent’s after Papermill Gypsy.

Jeez… it’s not like she directed it. Or ignored those two old queens’ (nonexistent) notes!

I love little Betty Lynn! Though I also heard she was recast on BROTHERS AND SISTERS because she called someone on the set of the pilot a cunt.

(There must have been more than that, though?)

She used to finger bang Willie Aames

The Sondheim dressing down happened at the Donmar Warehouse. He saw Betty's show and came back stage. Betty asked what he thought of her work with his songs. He said I wouldn't have said anything but since you asked I really don't like what you are doing to my songs.

Laurents came backstage at Papermill and said if you think you are taking this to Broadway you are crazy.

I think Sondheim was pretty measured but Laurents was just a bitch.

r113

I love Betty but she doesn't exude warmth like the matriarch of the show needed(I loved Brothers and Sisters)

[quote]Though I also heard she was recast on BROTHERS AND SISTERS because she called someone on the set of the pilot a cunt.

Betty Lynn should be a DL LEGEND!

I wonder if they always wanted Sally Field and she suddenly became available?

[quote]Thats got to be rough to be torn so many new assholes

Please Betty could have eaten those two pansies for breakfast.

[quote]Laurents came backstage at Papermill and said if you think you are taking this to Broadway you are crazy.

Not because it wasn't good, it was because Laurents didn't direct it or have anything to do with it. Subtle he wasn't.

Re: “Brothers and Sisters”

Jonathan LaPaglia from the unaired pilot was replaced with Matthew Rhys. So Betty’s wasn’t the only head that rolled.

Why was Betty so bad in Gypsy? Anyone see it?

She sang the role the best it had been sung, but she was directed poorly and Arthur ripped her to shreds backstage after she invited him there

I have watched clips and she sings it great like r122 said

Let's not forget, Laurents hand-picked Linda Lavin to replace Tyne Daly because he thought she was great in her audition. So at least by 1990, when she auditioned, he was losing it.

Did anyone see Buckley when she was touring with GYPSY in 2018-19 ? I had some friends who saw her in Boston - said her voice was spectacular, but she didn't play the character that well. I thought she was an odd choice, especially after following Midler and Peters.

I've always loved Buckley. I will qualify that with the only thing I ever saw her in was Eight is Enough when I was a kid. I was obssesed with her car and permanent, broken hearted voice. The Christmas Gift episode....I was sad for a week.

[quote]Why was Betty so bad in Gypsy? Anyone see it?

Betty doesn't do comedy, r121, so she was a...dark...Rose.

[quote]she was a...dark...Rose

Just you wait.

I'm waiting some Gypsy vids now... good god her "acting" in the songs

watching not waiting

[quote]Betty doesn't do comedy,

I think that's why she didn't click with audiences when she toured with 'Hello Dolly'.

It's funny that Betty doesn't "do" comedy.

I met her many years ago after a show. I made a joke which, in retrospect, wasn't the funniest (and no, I'm not going to post it here); however, she had no response. She was just kind of deadpan.

When I saw Betty in Gypsy I turned to my friend after the first scene and asked 'why is she channeling Margaret Dumont?'.

she does kind of have that dead inside persona

R134=Susan Richardson

These are *pipes*...

Poor Betty. Between that and Art Laurents eviscerating her Madame Rose, it must've been a blow to her ego.

She was always very kind to fans on Twitter.

I can so hear Abby in that song.

Buckley's studio Sondheim recordings were all new age-ish. Not the live Carnegie Hall versions which were more traditional.

R132 - she was trying to find the button to call security.

Didn't she basically get off the bus and immediately get cast?

Yes r141. She was cast her first day in NYC.

Pity she isn't in the movie. She really sang the heck out of that song.

Laurents didn't like that Buckley added the bit where her Momma Rose slapped the ever-living shit out of little Baby June. But you've got to admit, everyone has always wanted to see Rose do that.

Re: slapping

Bonnie Franklin really would have made the freakiest, greatest Mama Rose.

The thought of Bonnie Franklin singing "You'll Never Get Away from Me" is the stuff of nightmares.

She’d also work a lot of tapping into each of her songs, I bet.

At first it would seem novel. Then quickly grow annoying.

I Hate Letting My Child Be Managed by Some Big Shot Like Mr T. T. Granzinger Without Me Around, But I Love to Tap!

R143 - Mrs Patsy Ramsey

I betcha Bonnie Franklin would have been much better than Linda Lavin in the role in 1990.

Gypsy would have veered into full on horror if Bonnie had taken the role. There would have had to have been warnings placed in the programs for the elderly and veterans similar to when strobe lighting is used...

Bonnie was announced for Gypsy at the Bucks County Playhouse but Miss Joyce DeWitt played Rose instead.

Until Gary talked the Bucks County Playhouse out of it.

And, you know, for once, Gary might not have cost anybody anything.

R143 in what scene did that happen? Is this just a joke? Playing on Miss Collins slapping Chris Hartwigson?

You're blonde, r153, aren't you?

I wanted to see Linda Lavin play Rizzo.

Just watched her in Split circa 2017. She looked good

Calling her runt of a cheating husband on his [italic]bullshit:

They could have put Betty into Mary Poppins but then Mary would have looked like she wanted to eat the children through the whole show.

R154 asking if that's a joke is perfectly reasonable. It would be a crazy choice, but one that a new young director might make and Betty might go along with.

Also, it could easily be a joke playing on the famous slap from Carrie, or her other over the top characterizations.

So fuck you

Betty please!

R157 - that scene is hilarious as to how the pianist resumes playing straight after Betty leaves with Ian Holm.

I flew yesterday and watched M. Night Shyamalan's Split in honor of this thread.

Watch “The Happening” if you want to see Betty kill herself via smashing her head through windows.

r163 = Chris Hargensen

R163 I have it on blu-ray and VHS!