Eldergay with young people in your orbit. How much do you like them?

Of course we have -because we were like that at their age, too. Every generation believes it has discovered art/music/theatre/film/dance/whatever, and the Old Ones don't know or can't appreciate the brilliance of their discoveries. Give them a few years (or decades). You'll be amazed at how much smarter you become in their eyes... Seriously, it's a part of growing up. I remember a gaggle of seventh-grade girls going on and on about the brilliance of Aaron Carter. When I saw him on Broadway in Seussical and got an autograph to hang up in my classroom, my street cred went sky high! And the next year no one batted an eyelash at it. By the following year, no one knew who he was. If I could track down those first girls I'm sure they'd remember him -but I don't think any of them would proclaim him a genius, or a pivotal voice in the history of music.

In the immortal words of Adele Dazeem, just Let It Go. :)

My 21 year old nephew is convinced he’s the coolest thing ever because he goes to music festivals and does Special K with his girlfriend. My partner and I just roll our eyes thinking about the shit we did back in our dance party days.

My coworker’s a Gen Z, and he’s alright. Just weird to conceptualize he was born after 9/11.

I've been a college profs for 20 years. I really enjoy young adults. I try to pay attention to every one of them (I give no large lecture courses) and most of them return good energy to me. Most young people have energy to spare, and are optimistic and pleasant. They reliably surprise and delight me with their thoughts and opinions.

Another asset of young people in university is that some are very intelligent. Including more intelligent than I am. And intelligence + youth makes for a very fast mind. Besides just being great to see in action, these brainiacs maintain my hope.

Love you, r4.

I have numerous nieces, nephews, and grand-nieces and nephews, ages 11-40, all of whom are wonderful, considerate, and scared shitless about the future of democracy and climate change.

Recently retired from a long career in which my last role involved managing a large team of Millennials and Gen XYZ-ers, some of whom were lazy, self-entitled, and narcissistic. Some of them are apolitical, which pisses me off and no, I do not like them. I feel sorry for them. The other young-ins are fantastic.

Meanwhile, have had major medical issues that required treatments from very young interns and residents, who were fabulous. I get the sense that everyone is terrified by the future.

Frankly, I don't expect much for my final years, but I think it's better than inheriting a way overpopulated planet that's in rapid decline. While Boomer retirement has brought financial and medical anxiety, that pales in comparison to how much I worry about the younger generations' futures. Even the young assholes with whom I used to work will probably mature and do the right thing, But they have big challenges ahead.

Numeracy skills decline starting at 24.

Every semester at least a few college students sit for 1 hour essay tests and produce perfectly constructed compositions that are brilliantly reasoned. These are mostly French mother-tongue students in STEM. Your experience may vary in other lands, languages and domains.

One time I remarked to one student by way of flattery that he seemed to have tossed off his brilliant text effortlessly. He corrected me immediately. Said he had been intensely concentrating and his brain hurt.

Maybe the Adderall helps?

I have lots of nieces and nephews (and some grand-) plus younger employees, young ‘uns at church and offspring of friends and honestly I am mostly struck by how much nicer and more optimistic most of them are compared to my generation (X.) And most of them are hard working, despite all the tech distractions they have. It’s inspiring and honestly I don’t quite understand it.

I like young adults and consider that I'm lucky to have them among my friends and acquaintances. I had a great experience as a young man knowing many middle aged and older people who became friends or very good acquaintances, of many years. I always enjoyed their company, often more than my age peers. You very often form friends or acquaintances differently when there is a big age difference, but when there's mutual respect and interest it's rewarding.

I feel fortunate now to be at the aged end of that spectrum with younger and much younger adults among my friends and close acquaintances. Shared cultural reference points are overrated and boring. I can come to Datalounge if I wanted to chat about favorite shitty TV series of decades past, but nostalgia doesn't hold much interest for me.

I'm glad my orbit includes a good many people of significantly different age -- and other perspectives of background and interest and where they came from. How boring not to have regular contact with people older and younger, from different countries, with different interests and different things in their minds. If you're genuinely curious, I think it's a great thing, and rewarding to find connections between people who, on the surface, may not obviously have any.

Don’t get me started on my bitchy little cousin, Rommery!

Have you ever noticed how younger people never or hardly ever use your name when they greet you? You'll say, "Hi, Lisa," and they'll answer "Hello." And "How are you?" "Fine." (Never ask how you are.)

And - despite what people say here, I don't think it's the same as when we were their age, since we didn't act like older people were our equals; we usually felt we had to act respectfully towards them. Now you get no sense of that.

A different observation for me, R11. Young people greet me by name and use my name noticeably more than their older peers.

I like young people as much as I like anyone, which is to say not at all.

Viciously face-slapping them keeps them in line

Hmm, have you ever thought the disrespect might be specific to just you R11?

One week in and am having retirement issues of some sort. Having difficulty sleeping for more than a few hours at a time. Am realizing a few things now. First, despite that I was once a respected research scientist, in the last 5-10 years or so, I was paid (a lot) to be "Lab Daddy". I think everyone knew it -- but me. A babysitter with a PhD. I don't miss my staff (OK, maybe one or two) but worry about all of them.

A nephew lived with me for two years when he was in college after I'd broken up with a long relationship, followed by a niece who lived with me for 3 years when she was in grad school. The three of us were like close friends. When she left, I was sort of lost. Then my nephew boomeranged back in with me. When he finally left again after seeing me get through cancer treatments, I was depressed for a year. My doctor said it was "classic empty nest syndrome" and put me on Prozac, which worked. I adopted 3 cats, which worked even better.

The cats have since passed and now I have a husband, but am feeling empty-nestish again since retiring. All of my friends are my age or older. I will likely miss having younger people (my team at work) in my orbit, despite that I did not necessarily like them, my niece and nephew excepted because they are awesome.

My team will probably miss me when they get a younger, energetic, and ambitious boss, who will expect them to actually show up to work, perform their jobs, and hold them accountable. Maybe the new boss will inspire and motivate them. Not bloody likely. Not my problem anymore. Yay for the Eldergay!

Awww R16!

I think NIH should get rid of mentored K awards and require 10% effort for a lab mommy or daddy on first R01s.

My husband has a bunch of nieces and nephews, and now they all have kids. One particular bunch we're very close with. They live in the Hudson Valley of NY. When we're too old to be on our own here in NYC, they've made it clear we can move up and they will take care of us. It's something I've seen them do with other family members. Big Irish clan.

So yeah, that group I love and am very close with. As someone who is from a very dysfunctional, narcissistic family, it's a comfort to me knowing this. Take a little of the edge off life.

I was the Uncle to my brother's 3 girls. I was included in all their family events and traveled with them numerous times. I am their second Dad. I owned a business and employed all three of them at times. Now they are grown with families of their own and I ended up selling my home and made additions to the oldest daughter's home and I have lived with them since my retirement in 2022. I really enjoy being part of their family.

R15 You seem like a charming person.

I am an EG and have a friend in his mid-twenties who is an old soul (he's also straight).

We went out for sushi at a place he likes and the bartender greeted him effusively, turned to me with a big smile and said "Are you his dad?" At least it wasn't grandfather!

Children, however, are not my thing and never have been. I hope all the "guncles" and lesbian aunts enjoy their time with the kids, but leave me out of it.

Op seems ancient

r17, @ElderLez, aka my fave DL person, from MA and now NJ(?), Lawng Island(?) haven't worked in academia since '93 and don't know what a "mentored K award" is. I recognize "R01" as probably an NIH grant...? I worked off of an "R5" grant in the 1980s (HIV/AIDS) at a public university until we lost it, leading to a long career with Big Greedy BioPharma.

There really does need to be an adult in the room/lab to ensure that valid experiments get done consistently. Some of the kids don't care about science or its impact on patients, but some do. Generalizations don't work. The loudest, most negative people end up bearing the emblem of their generation, unfortunately.

r17, Do you work in medical research or healthcare?

For OP, my partner and I prefer interactions with our own age group, but enjoy the company of younger people with major caveats, lol.

Nice to see you R23! Yes to all but New Jersey, but for the work questions I am adjacent.

K is Career, because C was already taken for construction.

Sorry to hear about your trouble sleeping. Are you going to take up a hobby? Part-time gig?

r23, hoping to move to a smaller city in Northern California where housing is cheaper and where we could have a yard for growing tomatoes and basil or whatever. And cats.

Or, maybe we'll buy a cheap condo and join the HOA board so that I can post stories about petty HOA dramas here. We could just go to the local farmer's market to get our tomatoes and basil or whatever, and not need to maintain a yard..

My partner definitely wants to volunteer at a Senior Center and drive people to and from their medical appointments. He's from Massachusetts and drives like he's from Massachusetts, so he'll need me to yell at him from the back seat.

The opportunities are endless.

Like em for 30 minutes at 31 want them to die in a grease fire.

I’m in my late 60s and I befriended a boy from the gym who is in his late 20s. I was looking forward to our friendship and very open.to him keeping me connected to what Gen Z’s are into. I quickly became disappointed in his view of the world.

This kid is promiscuous In a way that would’ve shocked me when I was 27. Already HIV +, he has constant hook ups with no regard for other STI‘s. He is so superficial in chasing the biggest dicks he can and it really makes me sad for him. He lectures me on how my generation has ruined the planet and society for him but isn’t even registered to vote. When I was 27 there was no prep, no post exposure meds, no doxycycline. I marched in parades, demonstrated with ACT UP and voted in every election.. I know I sound sanctimonious but did we go through all of that for this generation to turn out like this?

So your partner wants to traumatize older people???

I’m voting for the HOA board drama for the two of you. It’ll be much more entertaining than tales of garden infestations and the medical care in rural areas is never as good.

[quote}I know I sound sanctimonious but did we go through all of that for this generation to turn out like this?

That, R27, is exactly why "we [went] through all of that," so that then future generations would not have to do.

You looked out for yourself (obviously) and for your friends and acquaintances and your own generation, and I'm glad you did, but the secondary effect was to benefit people who came after you in birthdate.

If there is a job to be done for one generation for the benefit of those that follow, surely it's to have made something, somehow, a little better, a little easier so that they might advance a bit beyond where you left things.

Please don't tell me you're just a selfish bastard who wants heaps of thanks and adulation, who thinks subsequent generations should bow down to you as you no doubt did for the generation before you who also lived in difficult times and stood to lose a thing or two or have their life ruined for things which you took far more for granted - exactly as is right to do.

Yes, you do sound sanctimonious and a bit ridiculous.

My nephew Joel really worships me!

I have a new, young coworker.

A few of us went on a work trip, just a short, morning flight to get there.

At our destination (we were on a couple of different flights), she had to hug each person who was on a different flight from her. My thought: "Didn't we all just see each other yesterday?" When she circled around to me for a hug, I just gave her a pat on the back. I think she knew from my facial expression that I was not into being hugged for something like this.

Elder Lez is correct in her assessment—much more optimistic people! I love millennials and Gen Z and they love me. I have two nieces and a nephew who are millennials and one nephew who is Gen Z.

I’ve aged in reverse and I have managed to keep up with what the kids care about. I feel very positive about the future once these generations get involved in politics. The kids enjoy discussing politics with me whereas their parents are staunch conservative evangelicals (political discussions with their parents can get pretty heated, although the kids and I get along with the parents by avoiding certain subjects).

And, no, not everyone becomes more conservative with age. I haven’t. These kids sure haven’t. Thank goodness.

Dear OP bitch. I am an extremely energetic and youthful looking 78 year old. I can easily pass for 50, and 40 in mood lighting. I AM the young people in my own orbit and I like myself very much.

[quote] And, no, not everyone becomes more conservative with age. I haven’t. These kids sure haven’t.

If they're still kids, they're not old enough to turn "conservative with age," yet.

Hi OP! With love and all due respect.... please get the fuck over yourself.

You ought to be happy that your niece is eager to talk about Amy Winehouse with you. Perhaps she (wrongly) believes you can have a civil disagreement about a topic of common interest, like adults. Even though your album is older than her, it's not entirely clear to me why there isn't room for her to have her own opinion about the qualities of the actress in the biopic. Perhaps you feel that having accepted your *gift* of dance lessons, she now has an obligation to sit listening and nodding to your opinions in rapt silence. This makes the gift seem a little less than generous.

If I have done my maths correctly, she is 20, and an adult, and perhaps you need to treat HER with a little bit more respect.

[quote] When I was 27 there was no prep, no post exposure meds, no doxycycline. I marched in parades, demonstrated with ACT UP and voted in every election.. I know I sound sanctimonious but did we go through all of that for this generation to turn out like this?

Yes. You did all that activism so that your younger friend could have the medicine that keeps him alive. You also did it so we wouldn't get fired from his job, or driven out of his housing for being HIV+ and so he wouldn't get shunned for being promiscuous and gay. So.....you won.

Perhaps you might examine what are possible (and very natural) feelings of jealousy at him for being able to live this much freer kind of life in his twenties when I'm sure your twenties were very different. If he were doing a different physically risky thing, like motorbike riding, would you be this pissed off at him? Might be better to reframe this as just what progress looks like.

And as an elder Millennial who regularly votes, sorry but I agree with him about what the 60+ crowd have done to the planet, damn boomers are just gonna have to take your medicine.

Ooops, the above was for R27.

Well, as a Millennial college lecturer I've spent a lot of time with Gen Z over the last few years. I like them. I find them (or at least the fairly privileged selection of them I got to teach) on the whole to be smart, curious and hardworking. Even the privileged ones have to struggle quite hard nowadays to be able to afford college and cost of living : it's a lot more difficult for them than it was for me at their age, and the world they are graduating into has far bleaker prospects. I try to keep my classes relaxed and informal and to speak to them adult to adult, and the vast majority of them respond very well to it.

There are some differences too. This generation has been online all its life. That makes it super well-connected and informed in some ways, but not in others. It reads less (at least in book form) than my generation did during school + college, and my generation was probably a disappointment in that respect to the ones that came before it. Mental Health also seems much more noticeable now. More students have problems potentially serious enough to interfere with their studies, and college mental health resources are under extreme pressure. In class that can mean a timidity to speak and possibly get something wrong, with more or less severe anxiety disorders now quite common.

It's also, unsurprisingly given the times we are in, a very political generation. I make this last point with trepidation because I don't want to call all the trolls in hell down on this thread, but: at our university the students launched a BDS encampment and actually won! University authorities promised to divest, provide support for Palestinian academics, and other measures relating to student welfare besides. It was a landmark victory which is light-years more significant than anything I've achieved as an activist in my college years (and perhaps even since). Throughout the process the students were producing detailed proposals and positions for their negotiations with college, regularly interviewing and writing for national media and gaining huge publicity for their campaigns. While doing so, they had to put up with the most vicious and unpleasant abuse and stereotyping on social media, worse for those who came from abroad and even worse for the one young transwoman. They are still only 22-23 years old and yet so much better informed and better able to articulate a message than some of the journalists covering them. I was massively proud of them and I think even those who didn't share their political positions might be able to recognise how impressive they showed themselves to be.

Except for one I hate them all. That's the way it's supposed to be.

R4 sounds an absolute treasure, whose students lucked out in their choice of professor. Thank you for your perspective, r4, brightened my outlook.

R17 EL, I agree with you in principle (oh,oh what’s coming next?), but having sat though more NIH study sections than I care to remember, a new R01 applicant is generally expected to be independent of a mentor, particularly if it’s the one they trained with. If a new investigator’s R01 grant application is branching out into an area that’s relatively new to them, then having a senior collaborator in that field can help calm any reviewers who are worried about an applicant’s lack of expertise specifically in that new area. That said, we both know the system is quite broken, so what I’ve described may indeed not be what’s really best for science or scientists (of all ages).

R29 and you sound like an uneducated ignorant idiot.

I work with a lot of younger people and so have younger friends and a lot of nieces and nephews. I like being a bit of a mentor. They respect my modest achievements and motivation and genuinely seek advice about things, particularly creative things. Or family. I like being an uncle. I’m not partnered or married, I don’t have kids so a lot of people my own age are just boring. It’s good to have a mix of people in your life and I don’t discriminate against age, young or old. I’m not trying to be anything I’m not, I’m comfortable with my own age and experiences. But I’m interested in everybody. There’s going to be a major generational shake up in the next 4 - 6 years. Will be interesting to see what happens.

R32 Relatives are one thing. Have you ever worked with some of these people?

R40 totally agree with you on the science. I think the role of the lab mommy/daddy would be more in the how to manage your budget, how to deal with HR to get your post-doc onboarded on time, how to address a dispute between your grad student and post-doc, etc type areas. (All the grubby, miserable parts of being a PI where experience counts most)

The age of first R01 has been stuck unmoving at over 40 for over a decade. That isn’t good for science, because for most (not all) our most innovative thinking happens when we are younger than that.

[quote] Have you ever worked with some of these people?

Yes, and it turned out horribly!

Got a lot of likes on that one, huh?