Baby Boomers and Israel

They grew up in the afterglow of WWII when sympathy for a Jewish homeland was at its highest.

They can't wrap their head around how the world order has changed and how younger generations correctly no longer views Israelis as some poor, victimized people.

I think for many of them it is a Christian symbol and not a real place full of real people. I'm talking about non-jewish conservatives.

The Boomers must benefit in some way from Israel. Baby Boomers do absolutely nothing unless they benefit directly from it. Especially financially.

I’m not a Boomer, but the reason may have something to do with having lived through history. Things like peace deals being repeatedly turned down, regular suicide bombings on buses, unwillingness to recognize women’s or gay rights, celebration of 9/11. Arabs in general, but Palestinians in specific, have shown zero desire for co-existence unless Jews and Christians are subservient, exiled, or dead.

I don't get why these stupid 70 year old motherfuckers are still trying to dictate world policy?

Maybe because they vote. In larger numbers.

R6 and they are about to die. In larger numbers.

R4 is the right answer.

I'm a Millennial and I don't have an "erection" for Israel. I just strongly believe that if the world is big enough for 50 majority-Muslim countries, it should be big enough for a single Jewish state to exist as well. Especially when you consider how little space it takes up relative to other countries. If you get triggered by even that basic minimum, you just might be an antisemite.

YourMillennialFriend has entered the chat.

Israel is going to be in BIG trouble once the Baby Boomers are gone.

Because Boomers were probably the last cohort to receive decent public high school educations.

R81 perhaps. But that was negated by all of the lead poisoning that deformed your brain.

OP have you ever made a single post on this site that isn't whining about baby boomers, Israel or both at once?

R14. Its currently 2:25 PM in Moscow and just before 2:00 PM in Tehran. Trolls be busy, ayatollahs and mullahs expect KPI's to be met

R15 it's only trolling when precious baby boomers get their little fee-fees upset?

What about the other threads shitting all over young people?

Baby Boomers have been shitting on younger people for at least forty years now. Are they now SHOCKED when people turn around and don't like them?

Generational warfare posts of all sorts are certainly troll-suspicious. IRL it isn’t really a thing outside of lighthearted, different working style articles and kids these days jokes. Trolling 0/10.

No its trolling when in the space of 30 minutes someone start shitting themselves across multiple threads including and not limited to, "Let's be the Villages in Florida! and boomer STI rates" "Dying Baby Boomer food" "Lets be Baby Boomer hypocrits" "Baby Boomers and Israel" "Let's be Baby Boomers in the 2020s" and also whining about Israel in the Eurovison song contest thread. If someone not being paid for reaching that level of hysterical screeching on a Sunday they're quite clearly mentally ill.

Baby Boomers are the definition of they can dish it out but they can't take it.

Calling anyone who disagrees with current Israeli government policy an anti-Semite is a great way to lose credibility with reasonable people, r9. There's a HUGE difference between being an X religion majority country and a theocracy. It's never good when a government officially backs one religion over others. What happens to the citizens who don't fit into that specific box? Not every Israeli is Jewish and not every Jewish Israeli practices the same kind of Judaism.

Oooh someone learned the word boomer in troll class yesterday and is trying it out in sentences.

R21 Elderlez, why don't I r see you piping in when it's the millions of other threads where DL elders crap all over young people?

I’d say it varies considerably R20. Here’s the list. Look into and get back to us.

I have on occasion R22! I have lots of fabulous young employees and family. All this generational warfare nonsense is trolling.

Anyway also R20 such a weird argument given that Palestine actually has an official state religion and Israel doesn’t.

OK, time for a actual serious answer, even if the question may not have been asked in good faith

[quote]I’m not a Boomer, but the reason may have something to do with having lived through history. Things like peace deals being repeatedly turned down, regular suicide bombings on buses, unwillingness to recognize women’s or gay rights, celebration of 9/11. Arabs in general, but Palestinians in specific, have shown zero desire for co-existence unless Jews and Christians are subservient, exiled, or dead.

R4 is certainly correct here

[quote]I'm a Millennial and I don't have an "erection" for Israel. I just strongly believe that if the world is big enough for 50 majority-Muslim countries, it should be big enough for a single Jewish state to exist as well. Especially when you consider how little space it takes up relative to other countries. If you get triggered by even that basic minimum, you just might be an antisemite.

As is R9

[quote]Because Boomers were probably the last cohort to receive decent public high school educations.

And R12 too. And I will add to this, Boomer and the older Generation X are the last people old enough to have met Holocaust survivors in person.

When I was a kid, maybe 9-10, a Holocaust survivor came from town to our little country school in backwater New Zealand in the early 70's to give a talk to us kids, usually a pretty rambunctious lot, we were dead silent as we listened to her stories of life in the concentration camp and showed us her number the Nazis had tatooed on her arm. We had some context because we had been studying WWII in Social Studies that year and there had recently been docos on TV about the Holocaust, so we were in awe to be actually talking to someone who'd lived through those horrors. Looking back it was pretty eerie to see and hear about all that first hand in that context and at that age but I'm damn glad our teachers had seen fit to get her in from town to talk to us. She looked OLD to me as a kid, but given she survived the camps as a teen she would have been in her early to mid 50's younger than I am now. I guess the camps aged her

None of these fuckwit munters protesting now will have had that formative experience I am guessing

R25 What about other genocides?

What exactly makes the Holocaust so much more sacred than Cambodia or Rwanda or Bosnia or any other number of ethnic atrocities which were much more recent?

[quote][R81] perhaps. But that was negated by all of the lead poisoning that deformed your brain.

R13? Did you drink an entire can of lead paint?

I guess you're still waiting to hear from R81.

R26. Nobody is trying to deny any of those genocides or supporting those that want a repeat performance.

Hamas want a new and improved Holocaust II, its in their constitution

[quote] I have on occasion [R22]!

But not like you defend the Boomers.

I guess the elder part of your name makes sense after all.

The Holocaust is unique from other genocide in that it was the outcome of centuries of international oppression of Jews. Germans had been trained for decades to blame their struggles on a tiny number in theyr population.

It represented dark aspects of Western society, such as the implications of genetic theory and industrialized economies. For example, the strong bureaucracy in the Netherlands created an easy path for the Nazis to track, deport, and kill Jews.

The scale was also out of line with other genocides. Not just in raw numbers, but the fact that two thirds of European Jews were killed . About 6 to 11 percent of Jewish children survived.

The other genocides are horrible. They often reflect passions of war that got out of control. They often reflect strategic ethnic cleansing to consolidate power.

But let’s be honest, r26. You are not interested in this discussion unless it results in diminishment of the Holocaust.

The Armenian genocide preceded the Holocaust, R30, and fit all of the perimeters that you mention.

There is a very obvious self-centeredness to Israelis. It's all about them.

I guess that's what happens when you go through life believing that you're "God's Chosen People?"

We know more history and are less subject to manipulation by social media.

R33 HA! You are now Generation FACEBOOK. You're nothing but tired politicized social media memes.

It’s interesting when people play-whataboutism and bring up examples from the 70s and 90s and ignore ongoing genocides in Syria, Burma and South Sudan happening now.

R29 as an X I say to you, whatever.

R35 You're the one playing whataboutism right now with that post.

The Middle East will be a shit show until they drop their religion. All it does is poison the minds of children so they turn into monsters later on.

A tradition of mental illness.

It’s meant to point out the inanity of R26’s post, by showing how idiotic and yet selective it is.

What’s different about the Holocaust? It was international in scope, organized on an industrial scale by a modern European state and targeted people who had no homeland to defend them or to flee to.

The primary reason (leaving aside antisemitism) that young people in America are paying attention to Gaza and ignoring Darfur is a kind of racism. Black Arabs killing other Black people who are not Arabs does not interest them because it’s too hard to understand the root causes of the violence pick a side. However, if you can label one side “white” and the other “brown,” progressive ideology tells everyone what side they need to be on, and a complex situation is reduced to good vs, evil and everyone can feel righteous solidarity for the brown victims while cheering in or excusing the crimes of the “resistance”

Plus fun costumes!

Progressive ideology has captured our educators and indoctrinated our youth. Boomers have not been as exposed to it..

Of course both sides are equally white (or not) with the exception of the Ethiopian Jews. It’s cosplaying to say one side is brown and the other isn’t.

Anyhow here’s an academic article about the kill rate the Nazis achieved and it even exceeds Rwanda.

Blah blah blah.

Somehow very white, very affluent Jewish people in 2024 are the most oppressed people of them all.

Oh I forgot. They're "God's chosen people," which the outspokenly religious ElderLez has a stake in.

The question should not be why Boomers are on Israel’s side. While stressed by security needs that arise from being a small state surrounded by people intent on killing its civilians, Israel is a multicultural democracy that shares our values of free elections, individual rights and the rule of law. It is also a military ally of the US.

The Islamic fundamentalists of Hamas are among the most violent and repressive regimes in the world, intolerant of non-Muslims, gay people and the idea that women have any rights. They literally glorify violence and celebrate the deaths of their own “martyrs.” The question should be why are young people supporting Hamas.

The counter-argument that supporting the Palestinian people is not the same as supporting Hamas is nonsense in the context of this war. The best thing that can happen to Gazans is the destruction of Hamas.

Progressive ideology is a distorting lens, not an enlightening one.

[quote] It is also a military ally of the US.

They better be considering how many trillions in charity we give to them and not to our own poor !

I’m theologically Lutheran R43, and Lutherans are the largest Christian group amongst Palestinians. Palestinian Christians have been horribly mistreated under some Israeli governments. You have very simplistic views.

R46 Poor Christians.

R46 Elderlez: Do you believe Jews are God's chosen people?

The idea of “God’s chosen people” is not one I have ever heard any Jew raise. Most are not religious. Those who are regard the covenant with God as a burden, not a privilege.

Every religion has a similar concept—that its adherents are divinely inspired and favored by God or gods.

The only reason the phrase has any significance outside of Judaism is the fact that both Christianity and Islam believe they are the true followers of the God of Israel, so the concept bugs them.

R49 are you ElderLez?

I am not R49, but theologically I would agree, that chosen is in regards to accepting the burden of carrying the law. And as a Christian I’d add that this is also so that all peoples would be blessed by the gospel. And in that sense we are all God’s chosen people; all of us even the trolls.

And I’d also agree that all people think their beliefs are correct and it is antisemitism that makes this somehow not OK in Jews, but OK for everyone else.

The fact is that if you worship the God of the Jews as a Christian or Muslim, you inherently acknowledge the fact that the Jew’s were the people chosen to reveal this God to humanity. That’s in your own religious books and whether you believe in God or not, his origins are history.

That’s completely correct. Muslim beliefs recognize the Torah as scripture and gave the world the term“people of the book.”

I sometimes think that the ultimate source of antisemitism is a kind of resentment that the Jews are continuing their original relationship with the God that Christians and Muslims claim as their own, without adopting either Christian or Muslim elaborations. Enlightened people recognize that their are many paths to God, but most people are not enlightened, and allow their relationship to God to be sullied by petty emotions .

R52 such arrogance

^such ignorance

R54 why the fuck are you talking to me about these made-up sky fairies here like this shit is real?

Should we bring up the Boogey Man? The Tooth Fairy?

R57 whether you believe or not, the unwillingness of the Jewish people to convert en masse was certainly behind some of historic antisemitism. For instance, it definitely influenced Luther.

R57 get out of my face with your religious bullshit.

Whether you believe in God or not (and I do not) , God and people’s beliefs about God are important. I was addressing the sarcastic, ignorant references to “God’s chosen people” which someone is clearing invoking as justification for antisemitism.

[quote] Whether you believe in God or not (and I do not) , God and people’s beliefs about God are important.

No. They are not.

[quote]Calling anyone who disagrees with current Israeli government policy an anti-Semite is a great way to lose credibility with reasonable people

I am in firm opposition to the current Israeli leadership and despise Netanyahu and his Likud henchmen. I can't for the life of me understand why the Israeli people keep going back to drink from that poisoned well. He and his government are partially responsible imo for what happened on Oct 7th. The current ongoing destruction of nearly all of Gaza is a travesty that needs to end - they could bomb the entire area into oblivion and still not entirely obliterate Hamas, who have tentacles all over the ME.

That said, I am staunchly in support of the existence of Israel as a state and its peaceful co-existence with its neighbors. It is (at its best) a liberal democracy much like the US with similar values. They are not a theocracy - 20% of the population is Arab, they vote and participate as full citizens there.

I don't see a conflict with these views: you can be pro-Israel and anti-Likud and anti-war, as well as support formation of some kind of Palestinian state. It's not mutually exclusive.

Why does Grn Z have such a boner for terrorist Hamas.

The people organizing these protests—SJP and WOL—are opposed to the existence of Israel, and many of them are so vehement that they would kill any Zionist. They are explicitly pro-Hamas. Many who join them are simply opposed to Israel’s conduct of the war, but professing anti-Zionism is the price of admission, and they are willing to go all in because progressive ideology demands “solidarity” above all. Even some young Jews who value their progressive bona fides take the step from being anti-Netanyahu to declaring themselves anti-Zionist. Fighting the false narrative of white colonialism vs brown indigenous people is too exhausting even if you see through it. Easier to just conform or at least pay lip service.

Baby Boomers can't handle any criticism of themselves. What snowflakes.

Imagine being offended by being clumped into a group and told you are all alike based solely on your age.

I know, R66! How terrible. It's a shame Baby Boomers have been doing that to youths forever.

Oh, so you’re just out to teach us a lesson? How noble.

R68 Shouldn't you be? You're so fucking old. Shouldn't you be full of zen wisdom?

I'm guessing the Boomer troll has some mommy boomer issues they're playing out on Mother's Day.

R70 I'm going to guess R70 is a typical Gen X kissing Baby Boomer asshole. That's what they do best.

[quote] Whether you believe in God or not (and I do not) , God and people’s beliefs about God are important.

[quote]No. They are not.

R61 I'm agnostic so I dont got a dog in this fight..... but unfortunately R60 is right - people's beliefs about their God ARE important and pertinent to this discussion like it or not. Its the driver of Hamas and their ongoing atrocities including those against its own people. This whole conflict isnt about land, its about religion, in particular Islam, given that over 40% of Israelis are secular. That figure would be close to zero in Gaza/ Palestine, Islam is notoriously intolerant of apostates which include any non believers/ athiests as well as all other religions. Palestinians and their leadership believe they are on a holy mission from Allah to exterminate the Jews (hence "From the River to the Sea")

You may not be interested in religion, but unfortunately religion (Islam in particular) is interested in you

[quote]What exactly makes the Holocaust so much more sacred than Cambodia or Rwanda or Bosnia or any other number of ethnic atrocities which were much more recent?

The irony of questioning the world's greatest genocide using by reference its given name as it compares to other more recent atrocities...

R73 It actually wasn't anywhere near the world's greatest genocide. Nor was it the first. But do go on continuing with your endless quest for pity.

Great, now we got a Holocaust denier.

R75 nobody is denying the Holocaust. Learn some actual history though.

Oh, I know my Holocaust history, R76. Sounds like you don't. But do tell us again how you think Jews are whiners and 'on a quest for pity.'

R77 How telling that you believe genocide began and ended with the Holocaust. How typically selfish of you. It's all about you.

If you don't understand the unique nature and scope of the Holocaust, R78. I can't help you. Go back to spitting about Boomers, it seems more on your level.

Shut the fuck up, R79. You're not that special or unique in your suffering as you like to think that you are.

Yes, I know you mean Jews, R80. You hate Jews, Boomers and Jewish Boomers. We got it. We got it the first 100 times.

R81 Oh I'm antisemitic because I'm not kissing your fucking ass like you're probably used to everybody doing?

lol People kiss Jewish ass? Since when?

R83 I'm not here to entertain anybody's persecution complex and the chip on the shoulder they have over something that occurred nearly 100 years ago.

^like the Nakba?

OP is an odd bird. I just did a trolldar and they exclusively post and comment on "generation" bashing threads—literally nothing else. But the strangest part is they shit on Gen Z's, Millennials, Gen X, and Boomers equally. Which leads me to believe they are either 83, 11, or a sentient urinal cake.

OP —You asked why older people are sympathetic to Israel, likely knowing that people were (correctly) going to say that the Holocaust was something that people either directly experienced or knew people who had directly experienced, in contrast to today’s young people for whom it is indeed ancient history. Then you whine about people mentioning the Holocaust.

Are you also the same person who keeps sarcastically using the term “the Chosen People?”

Clearly, you just don’t like Jews, and you like to be reminded that you don’t like Jews. What a happy time to be you

If you also trolldar the "Holocaust was no big deal" poster in this thread (R84 and the rest), it's quite clear that they're another sock of OP, because they also only post Israel and generation bashing comments. They say "OK, Boomer" a lot. They think it's 2018.

Anyway, it's nearly 9 PM in both Qatar and Moscow right now, so they should be winding down for the day soon.

Do we think OP is a bot or an actual human being? Poor OP if actually a person? I can’t imagine a much more morally miserable existence than being a troll farm troll.

R88 Its almost the same time in Tehran too, only 30 minutes ahead of Qatar and Moscow. Pretty convenient for them as they can all co-ordinate. Does mean they would have to work in shifts to cover 24/7 though, doesnt look as if they're doing that currently. Maybe the Iranian regime doesnt have the budget to cover the overtime or penal payments?

Seems we were right. The troll has clocked out for the night.

R89 I actually think that would make for a hilarious workplace comedy series.

Comedy or thriller! The lives of troll farm trolls could be great entertainment fodder.

Wouldn’t it be funny if when the trolls clicked in tonight there were all sorts of the types of division posts they make, but aimed at them; Why do IRC trolls hate Iranian trolls? Why are PRC trolls so scared of stories about Tiannemen Square?

R91 it is. A sitcom centered around a troll farm A la the IT Group.

Why would anyone pay someone to troll Boomers? I think he’s just nuts.