How popular was Joni Mitchell?

No she was kept in a vault and only ten people were able to listen to her a year, Rose.

Her sound was a lot folksier back then, so she had a much wider appeal. Just watch her Both Sides Now performance on a talk show, which was melodically a completely different song than the glorious retooled version in her mature years that the Love, Actually movie made famous.

The 1974 album “Court and Spark” brought her the mainstream success. “Help Me” was a Top Ten hit and the album has a very mellow 70s AM radio vibe that was perfect for the times. But she was already part of the 60s folk scene and 70s singer/songwriter scene. She was everywhere, dated everyone, was popping up on backing vocals. So it’s an interesting question, OP.

Then she released the third-person, non-confessional “The Hissing of Summer Lawns” in 1975 and everybody ran from it (initially) despite it being one of my favorites by her.

She was no Buffy Sainte-Marie, that Native American pow-wow powerhouse.

^^^ ***Defacto has entered the chat***

I saw in concert at Midsouth Coliseum in Memphis in the mid-'70s.

I was so close to the stage that I could see her smoking like a fiend when the stage lights were dimmed between songs.

Great concert.

I had front row seats to see her in 2000. It was great. Yeah, I’d rather have seen her in 1974 but still…

I thought her break-out hit was 1970's "Big Yellow Taxi" (They paved paradise And put up a parking lot)

but also "Woodstock" (I came upon a child of god who was walking along the road...), also in 1970.

Love her!

"Big Yellow Taxi" got a LOT of airplay.

That guy who analyzes songs (from Wings of Pegasus) did an episode on Big Yellow Taxi.

People tend to believe she's referring to her boyfriend when she says "A big yellow taxi took away my old man" but he points out that police cars in Toronto used to be yellow and maybe she means that when she was a little girl, the police came and took away her father.

Joni got pregnant when she was very young and gave the baby up for adoption (those were the days).

Anyway, she finally met up with the child and got to know her. Doing that sort of released her from having to prove herself by songwriting, to sort of work through the guilt or sadness or something like that. Strange tale that's stayed with me.

I don't think she ever had any other children.

Before the Morgellons got her, she was really something. Alas, now she's completely infected with brightly colored fibers.

Grew up in Canada. Canadian radio played her often in the 70s.

Can't speak for anywhere else.

She looks like an alien

Bette Midler did her better.

I'd say not terribly popular. Other artists seemed to speak of her so highly yet the general public didn't have much to say about her at all. She had a very high and whiney voice that never appealed to me. There was one big hit. It's the one others are talking about.. the Bi Yellow Cab or something. Meh. It was actually about Hawaii and the paving of Paradise, which for her was a place named Paradise Park.

She was way bigger than your idol Madonna and bigger than Beyoncé too yee haw

Joni did not grow up in Toronto. She was way out in the prairies.

She’s had 15 #1 billboard hot 100 singles

She was no Mimi Fariña, that’s for sure.

I tell you what, if I had a hammer I’d have ended that cunt.

She sold over 9 million albums. Blue sold over a million. Court and Spark was her most successful album.

I think she was always massively respected but was not a huge seller of singles. Even Both Sides Now got to be a hit because of Judy Collins (who did the same with a similar composer, Sondheim's Send in The Clowns). However, her albums always sold well and Court and Spark also had a couple of hit singles.

For r21

Meh, she’s no Judy Collins.

You turn me on, I’m a radio was her “look, I can write hits too” song.

As a songwriter, she had popularity comparable to Dylan’s.

She was extremely popular from about her third album. But then she did Playboy and that big ungroomed. muff between her legs turned off some folks, despite the 70's being ideal for puffy muffs, and her tits-flapjack-like things with cork-like nipples-didn't help matters. No one wanted to look at that, especially in the age of feminism.

[quote]How popular was Joni Mitchell?

Popular enough

She was like Sondheim, Her brilliance was financed even when the financial return wasn't guaranteed. She could have been a lot more commercial but she was more interested in taking chances.

Joni Mitchell fans bought her albums mostly. I never owned a single by her, but I bought a lot of her albums (I missed Clouds and For the Roses for reasons I can't explain). Same with Neil Young, CSNY, Judy Collins, Tom Rush, James Taylor, Carly Simon, etc. From around 1968, the only 45s I bought were "Hey, Jude," "Spirit in the Sky," "Harper Valley PTA," "Oh, Happy Day," and that's all I can think of. I bought the 45 of "Bette Davis Eyes," too. I think that was the last one.

I’ve got a brand new pair of rollerskates, and I know the first twat I’m fixing to clothesline in the rink.

Unpopular opinion: Judy Collins’ version of BSN is better.

This thread evokes so many questions. I think the last time she had regular airplay in even Canada was "free man in paris"

That drawing of the woman smelling the flowers on the “For the Roses” album is of Judy Collins, not Joni.

I wish I had a river. I’d put all of you bitches and a cinder block into a Hefty bag and toss you in.

I never considered any of her fans “average”.

She sure seemed impressed with herself.

With good reason, R37. She wrote amazing songs and is a very talented artist. Men with that much talent have been impressed with themselves for centuries.

[quote]Unpopular opinion: Judy Collins’ version of BSN is better.

In the first run, yes. But when Joni re-recorded it, it was great. That horn is thrilling. And the general bluesy, world weary style really fits the song.

A classic sound that was part of my childhood. she was great.

I consider Blue to be her masterpiece.

R39, Judy’s version is much better than that pompous, self-important redo.

Carey

Collins sounds like she’s singing at a high school graduation. There’s no feeling there, just move the song along.

R44 that's how she sang everything.

Why must everything be a contest?

I was always scared of her album cover “Hejira”. She looked like a witch.

Here's her best song.

I was listening to recordings of Both Sides sung at different points in her life the other day

[quote]I had front row seats to see her in 2000. It was great. Yeah, I’d rather have seen her in 1974 but still…

Why didn't you see her in the '70s?

Our school sang The Circle Game. The nuns liked that song. From the album Ladies of the Canyon

She obviously wasn’t that popular in the 70s, OP. She never once did Soul Train, made a disco record, or made a porno with Linda Lovelace. All of the big stars did at least one of these things if not all three…..I’m looking at you Liza.

My parents had several albums of hers, so I was always aware of her. As I got older I began to recognise what a special talent she has, with brutally honest lyrics, always trying new styles and not afraid to be uncommercial. She is unique.

How does she compare to Bob Dylan?

Old Red Pill Dylan:

Bob probably started the war of words when talking about Joni in a Rolling Stone interview, at least in a public sense. Who knows what could've went down in private. Bob said something to the effect that he hates seeing "chicks" perform 'cause they whore themselves'. The journalist said 'well what about someone like Joni Mitchell?' Bob laughed and said 'well, Joni's actually more like a man'. I'm paraphrasing cause I'm too lazy to go look it up to get the exact quote. I'm sure that didn't sit right with her."

Then she started calling him an inauthentic plagiarist.

Good times.

oh the quotes are from a reddit thread (Gossip question: Why Does Joni Hate Bob So Much?) that I'm not sure I can link ??

Out driving yesterday, out of my house for the first time in weeks, I was listening to a local independent radio station. The sun was out, the sun roof was open, and Carey came on. I’ve mostly been ambivalent about Joni Mitchell, but hearing that song in that moment lifted my spirits in a way that stunned me.

R50, I was born in 1971.

Plus, I never got into Joni until I was 22 despite people telling me for years that I should listen to her as I loved Joan Baez, Judy Collins, and Bonnie Raitt.

Raitt’s cover of “That Song About the Midway” is wonderful.

I was a young kid and was not that interested in mellow folk singer types but yes, she was very popular, and her songs were on the radio. She just wasn't a Hollywood type and was more like a Laurel Canyon type. Back then it seemed like there were artists you didn't see a lot but you heard a lot. Many recording artists today, they try to publicize the image as much as the music.

Though maybe technically better singers, I always found Joan Baez and Judy Collins a bit boring. I can’t sit through an entire album of either. I can listen to Joni Mitchell and Bonnie Raitt albums over and over.

I prefer the version of Carey on Miles of Aisles to the original of the Blue Album.

👏Excuse 👏me,👏 no👏 taste 👏people.👏

This is the woman who tried to rhyme “jewels” with “schools”.

R61 On the other hand, I can also sing, and you couldn't.

[quote]On the other hand, I can also sing, and you couldn't.

If airy fairy soprano turned Marlboro bass is your thing.

The point is, Joni could sing and write songs. She was a big star. Sondheim was a Broadway composer, not a big star, and not a singer-songwriter.

[quote]Sondheim was a Broadway composer, not a big star, and not a singer-songwriter.

Sondheim created the cultural catchphrase “Everything’s coming up roses.”

Joni's popularity diminished when she stopped making folk pop music. Pop music = popular fandom. She was niche from the mid 70s onward.

The world is big enough for both Mitchell and Sondheim and the heart is big enough to love them both.

At least she didn’t find Jesus. Looking at you, Bob Dylan.

Sondheim and Joni Mitchell both created somewhat unconventional songs that sometimes went all over the place. Compare Send in the Clowns and Big Yellow Taxi.

We don't really need to bring Sondheim into every thread about music.

...Or Broadway. Even though some of her songs have been in Broadway shows.

There was a pretty big divide in her heyday between AM and FM radio. Her hits were on AM but I don’t think she made a huge impact on that listener beyond those songs. She received more airplay on FM with deeper cuts from her albums, especially Blue. College FM played her incessantly.

Aside from Help Me and a few of her earlier songs that became unofficial anthems like Big Yellow Taxi, Joni was never a presence on the pop charts.

In the 70s FM radio was more about the deep album cuts and it's there that several of her albums, if not household name popular, developed a devoted fan base.

She was in some ways a "musician's musician." Very similar to Dylan and others in the field who were the explorers, breaking new ground.

[quote] Unpopular opinion: Judy Collins’ version of BSN is better.

I agree, R32.

One of my favorite songs.

She's beloved now because she's a victim and seen as a survivor.

Three good songs and that's it.

R75 wins for the dumbest person on the Internet today

[quote] Three good songs and that's it.

Eleven Grammys. Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. Kennedy Center Honoree. Many gold albums.

So many of You people are so bitter and petty. Urchin victims of consumer culture. I really feel sorry for you.

Judy Collins had interesting taste in songs and a beautiful sound, but dull, dull, dull.

Judy Collins was quite different in the beginning when she was doing pure folk. Her voice was deeper and stronger. It wasn’t until “In My Life” and “Wildflowers” that she started singing higher and became the Judy Collins everyone knows. I think BSN had a lot to do with it as it was such a hit.

Since folk (especially female folk) never interested me, I used to mix up Mitchell and Collins.

She’s no me!

All I remember about her growing up is my older sisters playing Circle Game on an endless loop and crying. They did that with Carly Simon's Julie Through the Glass too. 70s girls. There's no telling. Then when I grew up into my 20s I discovered her. I love her but only like about 15 songs she does.

She was too cultured and musically complex to be a pop artist. She could have done umpteen court and Sparks and raked in the dough but she followed her muse.

She adored what Janet Jackson did with Big Yellow Taxi BTW. She thought it was very inventive.

Spotify monthly listeners:

Joni Mitchell-- 2.1 million

Linda Ronstadt-- 3.4 million

Carole King-- 3.8 million

Barbra Streisand-- 4.2 million

Carly Simon-- 5.2 million

It looks like Carly's music has held up the best. It's the most relevant right now.

Another artist who is best appreciated by afar. Just an amazingly bitter, cynical and surprisingly envious artist. There is, however, no question as to her greatness as a songwriter.

The most accessible of her music is her earlier stuff, but while I like Big Yellow Taxi, Woodstock and Ladies of the Canyon well enough, they aren't my favorites of her work.

She had an unparalleled run of amazing albums from 1971's Blue to 1977's Don Juan's Reckless Daughter that were fantastic. My two favorites - 1975's Hissing of Summer Lawns and 1976's Hejira - were scorned when they were first released. If you're quoting sales numbers about art then you have missed the point entirely.

[quote] Just an amazingly bitter, cynical and surprisingly envious artist

She was bitter about a lack of recognition in the 90s, but that's subsided since she has, in fact, received a lot of appreciation from a younger generation.

She's been very blunt and frank, and she's often correct.

[quote]Just watch her Both Sides Now performance on a talk show

Little ol twelve year old me bought Judy Collins' version of Both Sides Now and HATED Joni's, which I heard her do on The Smothers Bros show. Judy ha the hit.

Judy Collins sounds like a bag of cats being poked with a stick. Hate her, hate her singing, hate her trash, basic bitch version of Both Sides Now.

^ JONI MITCHELL

R88 David Crosby said "Joni hates everybody" and that's not too far from the truth.

Joni doesn't kiss ass, that's for sure.

She called Dylan a fraud which is pretty funny.

Some artists mellow, some grow bitter in their dottage. Joni was always bitter but she grew more bitter and that is a genuine sadness.

OP, suggest you do just a tad of research on one of the greatest, if not the greatest singer songwriter of her generation. I mean, you really are not that clueless are you?

She and Judy Collins have been feuding for over 50 years.

Judy’s concerts show up on PBS.

Joni’s songs are for women who cry because they got a Joni Mitchell cd for Christmas rather than a necklace.

R72, Wellesley I assume.

Both Joni Mitchell and Judy Collins were associated with Crosby, Stills, Nash and Young as artists and lovers. I think that gave them more visibility during the early 70’s. Stills’s Suite: Judy Blue Eyes was about Collins and some of the funniest quotes about Mitchell came from Crosby. Nash might have been with both of them. Woodstock was a big hit for CSN&Y. They were hippie royalty of their time.

R87, I think of Don Juan’s Restless Daughter as Joni’s psilocybin album but gorgeous in places. The self-indulgence really kicked in with Mingus.

She's best friends with Chaka Kahn.

They smoke blunts together.

But even Mingus has several listenable FM style tracks.

[quote]But even Mingus has several listenable FM style tracks.

Indeed...

Indeed she was a talented painter as well, r38, having done most of her own album cover art, including the self-portrait at r39.

She lives in a box of paints, r104.

r102 for sure.

It is a bit more of a mixed bag so I didn't include it with the others in her amazing 70s run.

And I've liked other things she did since, though she got a little lost in the 80s (who didn't).

I remember an interview with her where she spend half of the time complaining about how many records ONJ sold and how much money ONJ has made. It was odd.

In a 1991 interview with Rolling Stone, she went on an anti Joan Baez tirade about how terrible Baez was to her and how threatened she’d seemed by Mitchell. Yet Joni still contributed backing vocals to a song on Baez’s 1975 “Diamonds and Rust” album.

I remember her talking in an interview in the 80s where she talked about how Suzanne Vega and Rickie Lee Jones had talked shit about her in the press. She said it was a "kill Mommy" syndrome, and she understood why they were frustrated with every interviewer comparing them to her.

I loved her reaction to the Rickie Lee Jones 1979 album cover:

“When did they take the picture of me?”

I remember an interview where she confessed to running a bus of nuns and blind children off onto a ravine simply for the thrills.

I'm going to have to sleep on that R111 before I decide if it's true or not.

[quote]I remember an interview where she confessed to running a bus of nuns and blind children off onto a ravine simply for the thrills.

She was in a contest with Bruce Willis to see who was the bigger badass.

Does she know how to apply a proper garotte? Oh that's right she got rid of her brat the easy way.

She once said the only female friends she had in the industry were Linda Ronstadt and Bonnie Raitt.

Has Linda sung Joni before?

Linda included "River" on her Christmas album, r116. I don't know if she sang any of Joni's other songs.

Thank you, r117.

R85 Not sure everyone of that generation listens to music mainly on Spotify.

R119, sadly, I don't think that generation really listens to any new music, even on the radio. I say that as one of them.

R120 These are two different points. But I do agree with you. I'm not quite of that generation, I'm in my mid 60s, but I do listen to new music. I don't know a lot of people my age who do. But I don't understand being stuck back at a certain point musically.

R121, we're in the same age group and I keep my radio station tuned in LA to KIIS or KPWR. When I listen to the oldies station like KRTH, and realize they're playing songs from the 90s, I'd rather go and listen to Post Malone or Sza. But I'd agree that Spotify is not a great measure of someone like Joni Mitchell's popularity mainly because even as an older artist, she doesn't get much airplay . When someone covers one of her songs, like Big Yellow Taxi, it will spike those sale and views on YT but she was an album artist. I also think much of her catalog is too esoteric for that kind of platform.

I stream WKWF radio from Key West. They play music from groups that are now in my wheelhouse - JoJo Effect, Club Des Belugas, Bebo Best etc. it’s significantly different music from my previous tastes, but we all keep evolving.

Shoni Mishshill

R98, you have a beef with Wellesley College?

I remember laughing as she bitched that one Olivia Newton John album sold more than her entire discography.

I saw her in Boston in 1972. If I recall it was sold out and the audience was enthralled throughout. I worked at the venue (the Music Hall) so my memory might be off a bit, it was a long time ago. BTW I met her that night, she was lovely to me, I don't know about anything her attitude or personality more recently than that. She was very popular then.

This ONJ thing is total bullshit. And yet someone keeps repeating it.

Well, ONJ beat Joni for Best pop vocalist so that may be where the story originated.

This thread pales next to the all time classic Datalounge thread for Joni.

The ONJ thing is ABSOLUTELY true. I saw the interview.

My first introduction to her music was via a Janet Jackson song of all things.

As mentioned above.

"The Lasht Time I Shaw Rishchard", "Woodshtock", "Court and Shpark", "Shishotowbell Lane", "Both Shidesh Now"....