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Cabaret (1972)

Cabaret is an enigma for me as it checks all the boxes for me and yet I can’t seem to really get into it.

Aspects I love: Liza Minnelli, a depressing musical, historical depiction of Weimar Germany, Art Deco, gay sex and romance.

And yet…I just can’t seem to love it. I saw it about 10 years ago and thought I just wasn’t in a mood to enjoy it, but I’m watching it again tonight on HBO Max and I still can’t get into it.

Anyway, I thought it was time for a new discussion about the film. The thread from 2021 didn’t get very far and it’s locked.

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by Anonymousreply 106April 2, 2024 1:05 PM

You say you love Liza Minelli but it is her manic energy which makes the film hard to watch

by Anonymousreply 1April 1, 2024 1:44 AM

There is so much to enjoy in that film.

by Anonymousreply 2April 1, 2024 1:47 AM

The movie should be best remembered for Liza Minelli's hairdo which she still adheres to 52 years later.

by Anonymousreply 3April 1, 2024 1:53 AM

I agree, OP. On paper I should love Cabaret and something about it has never worked for me, on screen or on stage.

by Anonymousreply 4April 1, 2024 1:53 AM

OP - I think the problem is watching the whole movie. It's long and drags in parts. I really only enjoy watching the stage numbers, a few key scenes and some snippets. If I had the time and talent I would make a 30 minute re-edited version. I would call it "Cabaret... In Shnippetsh".

by Anonymousreply 5April 1, 2024 1:58 AM


by Anonymousreply 6April 1, 2024 2:08 AM

How many other musicals made more than fifty years ago don't feel dated?

by Anonymousreply 7April 1, 2024 2:14 AM

R5 I also think the problem is that it’s more of a snapshot of a few days here and a few days there without telling an entire story.

by Anonymousreply 8April 1, 2024 2:14 AM

I agree it's too long. The first time I saw it, I gave up from Liza exhaustion; she was too much. On subsequent viewings, I came to the same conclusion as R5: It's better if viewed in snippets. The musical numbers are great stand-alones.

by Anonymousreply 9April 1, 2024 2:15 AM

[quote]I gave up from Liza exhaustion

Tell me about it.

by Anonymousreply 10April 1, 2024 2:29 AM

I prefer Isherwood's story.

Less singing, more depth.

by Anonymousreply 11April 1, 2024 2:47 AM

I love it! The set pieces are fantastic, and the acting is almost always superb. I love Lisa when she's on the stage, but she seems miscast in other segments. It's an elegant movie about an ugly time.

by Anonymousreply 12April 1, 2024 2:56 AM

I love it! The set pieces are fantastic, and the acting is almost always superb. I love Lisa when she's on the stage, but she seems miscast in other segments. It's an elegant movie about an ugly time.

by Anonymousreply 13April 1, 2024 2:56 AM

I like the stage show much more than the movie. Better story and all of the glorious songs!

by Anonymousreply 14April 1, 2024 2:59 AM

R3 - she has had other styles.

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by Anonymousreply 15April 1, 2024 3:04 AM

I thought Liza had less manic energy in "Cabaret" than in "The Sterile Cuckoo."

by Anonymousreply 16April 1, 2024 3:08 AM

Very entertaining movie.

by Anonymousreply 17April 1, 2024 3:14 AM

It was an incredible film -but it wasn't the Broadway musical. I missed the original songs and story.

by Anonymousreply 18April 1, 2024 3:17 AM

No one but Liza could have played Sally Bowles.

by Anonymousreply 19April 1, 2024 3:17 AM

If you enjoy Vincente Minnelli in heavy eye makeup singing and dancing in Greenwich Village in the 20s Cabaret is the movie for you.

by Anonymousreply 20April 1, 2024 3:21 AM

It’s astonishing how contemporary and fresh so much of it feels, largely due to Fosse’s employment of then very avant garde cinematography and editing decisions. Then again, many credit him with veritably creating the entire MTV music video model with this film (and also All That Jazz). I do miss the multitude of cut songs from the stage version, but it undoubtedly works in an arguably more dynamic and compelling way, even 50 years later. A masterpiece.

by Anonymousreply 21April 1, 2024 3:22 AM

I’m in the middle of watching it now. Recorded it off TCM via YouTube TV. I know I’ve seen it before, but I’m really not remembering much of it so far.

by Anonymousreply 22April 1, 2024 3:42 AM

Good movie until they finish "Tomorrow Belongs to Me". Then you can just turn the show off.

by Anonymousreply 23April 1, 2024 4:37 AM

Wasn't the main character supposed to be WH Auden?

by Anonymousreply 24April 1, 2024 4:59 AM

An audenary Brit in 1930s Berlin.

by Anonymousreply 25April 1, 2024 5:01 AM

[quote]I love Lisa when she's on the stage, but she seems miscast in other segments.

It's Liza with a Z, not Lisa with an S.

by Anonymousreply 26April 1, 2024 5:04 AM

[quote]R3 The movie should be best remembered for Liza Minelli's hairdo which she still adheres to 52 years later.

HER hairdo?

[italic]Fuck you!

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by Anonymousreply 27April 1, 2024 5:12 AM

Yeah but Liza has a widow's peak.

by Anonymousreply 28April 1, 2024 5:14 AM

Yesh, my father… he wash sho funny and schmart… the great Vinschente Minnelli… he shaid I schould have a, ya know, “look” for thish part in a Bob Fosshe film. He said two wordsh to me: “Louishe Brooksh”… and the resht ish hishtory..

by Anonymousreply 29April 1, 2024 5:18 AM

"Cabaret" is one of the finest movie musicals ever made.

by Anonymousreply 30April 1, 2024 5:18 AM

Liza was quite subdued as Sally Bowles.

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by Anonymousreply 31April 1, 2024 5:54 AM

R27, Ellie Snyder always reminded me of Louise Brooks.

by Anonymousreply 32April 1, 2024 6:27 AM

Some movies should be viewed as people once viewed opera (and still do, in some European cities). Watch Cabaret in a social setting, with friends, and don't hesitate to go to the kitchen, the bar, the bathroom, outside for a smoke, into the guest room for a quickie, whatever. Just don't force yourself to be glued to the screen, rather watch what grabs you. So many movies become enjoyable in this way. All the ones that drag on but are otherwise colorful and filled with great performances.

by Anonymousreply 33April 1, 2024 6:44 AM

R27, I think you mean MY hairdo, Lulu!

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by Anonymousreply 34April 1, 2024 6:51 AM

We're not supposed to LOVE anything during the Nazis, it's more about reveling in the characters' hedonism, their moments in the midst of the surrounding, impending holocaust. Fiddling while it burns, so to speak, and we observe with pathos, cannot help that, because we have the vantage point of history.

by Anonymousreply 35April 1, 2024 11:19 AM

Watching Liza have a manic, coke fueled breakdown is at the core of her performing style.

And Joel isn't gay.

by Anonymousreply 36April 1, 2024 12:42 PM

Michael York is bland. He makes the whole thing seem long and sleepy.

by Anonymousreply 37April 1, 2024 12:48 PM

I love the more iconic songs but thought it otherwise a little bit meh until i saw it on stage and loved it, even the lesspr songs. I agree it is the Liza effect that make it (for me) a movie i don’t wish to revisit (except for the chilling Tomorrow Belongs to Me scene, i watch often on you tube when i am feeling politically lethargic).

by Anonymousreply 38April 1, 2024 12:52 PM

I was young. I got a warm and fuzzy feeling and a hard-on when I heard this snippet of conversation:

Brian: Screw Maximilian!

Sally: I do.

Brian: So do I.

by Anonymousreply 39April 1, 2024 1:04 PM

"Tomorrow Belongs to Me" was dubbed by actor Mark Lambert, who originated the role of Henrik in A Little Night Music. He was married to Victoria Mallory, who played his stepmother, Anne. Victoria was also Young Heidi in the original cast of Follies!

by Anonymousreply 40April 1, 2024 7:03 PM

Sally Bowels

by Anonymousreply 41April 1, 2024 7:37 PM

This is and probably will always be my all-time-favorite movie (and I hate musicals, as a rule), so I'll thank you nit-pickers to leave it alone.

There. I said it.

by Anonymousreply 42April 1, 2024 8:05 PM

It is narratively anticlimactic. It immerses you but doesn’t hook you. What is the character’s challenge?

Roxy Hart: get off for murder

Eliza Doolittle: pass as a Lady

Gypsy Rose Lee: prove that she was talented all along

Sally Bowles: ?

by Anonymousreply 43April 1, 2024 8:11 PM

I never liked it either, OP. First saw it in 1972 with people who had seen the B’way show (loved it), and they couldn’t get into the film version. Tried to watch it again a few times since, still don’t like it.

by Anonymousreply 44April 1, 2024 8:15 PM

[quote]Tried to watch it again a few times since, still don’t like it.

I've always loved this movie, but now I'm going to have to reevaluate my opinion. Thank you, DL contrarians, for opening my eyes!

by Anonymousreply 45April 1, 2024 8:28 PM

r39 the line was originally “Fuck Max”. It was censored. Similar to Streisand’s line in The Owl and the Pussycat. Made a nonsense of both scenes v

by Anonymousreply 46April 1, 2024 8:33 PM

Emma Stone’s character in Poor Things has a very vaguely defined challenge but it IS a challenge. That is why the audience empathizes with her absurd character.

Sally Bowles has no central challenge, and Michael York’s character has no central challenge. Observe the rise of Naziism. Okay, I’m observing. Remember the Julie Harris play adaptation of Farewell to Berlin was called “I Am a Camera.”

by Anonymousreply 47April 1, 2024 8:38 PM

A dubious record Cabaret held for a very long time was “most Oscar nominations without winning Best Picture”. That record was surpassed by La La Land. A movie with the EXACT SAME PROBLEM. A male and female who are misfits in this strange world and don’t really fit in but there are no real stakes, nothing to hook you.

I said this on here when it lost the Oscar

La La Land would have won Best Picture if Emma Stone’s character found out she was pregnant the same day she received the offer that made her a star, and aborted Sebastian’s baby to achieve her dream.

NOW the movie has stakes.

by Anonymousreply 48April 1, 2024 8:47 PM

1972 The Godfather, Deliverance, Cabaret...movies people clamored to see.

by Anonymousreply 49April 1, 2024 8:50 PM

Thanks for your thoughts/observations on this film, OP. I totally agree with your assessment: this movie should have "worked" much better than it did.

My take, for what it's worth: The whole atmosphere felt like the 1970s, not the 1930s. I know they tried with the costumes, etc. but it still smacks of 1972; perhaps too many brilliant colors (?) I don't know, but I agree with you.

by Anonymousreply 50April 1, 2024 8:52 PM

The threesome dance mad it plain what was happening with the slutty three, The shocked reaction to "I do" and "So do I' just didn't fit from either of them.

As for Fosse's shocking finale, he steals from himself several years after in the "All That Jazz" Air Rotica scene's finale.

As he uses it here for he first time I'd include it my rewatch it except it's stuck on the tail of half an hour of Lisa and Michael's tedious end of relationship.

Thinking only of the movie characters and not their real life counterparts I wonder how long it would take Sally to realize Berlin's future had no place for such an American artistic soul as herself. Or perhaps successfully adapt to the New Order with the help of "that man" from UFA.

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by Anonymousreply 51April 1, 2024 8:58 PM

R50 the reason is cinematographer Geoffrey Unsworth

During the 1970s, gauzy cinematography came into vogue. Unsworth shot some if the gauziest films of the 1970s, including Murder on the Orient Express, Tess and Superman.

Another big cinematographer of the era, Vilmos Szigmond, also used the coat of Vaseline (McCabe and Mrs. Miller, The Deer Hunter, Close Encounters of Third Kind)

Don’t forget, this is the decade Mame was filmed.

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by Anonymousreply 52April 1, 2024 9:08 PM

R52 - Thanks for making coherent sense out of my gut-level rambling!

by Anonymousreply 53April 1, 2024 9:10 PM

I will also point out that much of the public’s perception of how the 1930s should look on film has been shaped by Douglas Slocombe’s work on Indiana Jones.

If you can see this film in a theater. It is absolutely stunning. It is bright and crisp. Slocombe was a veteran of Ealing black and white pictures, he knew how to photograph the scene to evoke the cinematography of that era.

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by Anonymousreply 54April 1, 2024 9:13 PM

Subsequent films about the era usually adhere to crisp cinematography

John Seale’s Oscar winning photography for The English Patient

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by Anonymousreply 55April 1, 2024 9:20 PM

[quote]1972 The Godfather, Deliverance, Cabaret...movies people clamored to see.

I was clamoring to see What's up Doc, The Getaway, Lady Sings the Blues, The Heartbreak Kid and The Poseidon Adventure. Godfather too, Deliverance, sure. Not so much Cabaret. Oscar nominations does not equal excellence or enjoyment.

by Anonymousreply 56April 1, 2024 9:29 PM

R54 & R55 - While I agree with your premise, the films that defined the public's view of the 1930s was Paper Moon and The Pianist.

by Anonymousreply 57April 1, 2024 9:30 PM

"The whole atmosphere felt like the 1970s, not the 1930s." - Interesting point, r50. I can't really remember much of Cabaret, which I saw some years ago, but recently watched Just a Gigolo with David Bowie from 1978. I should say tried to watch, because it's fairly unwatchable.

The one thing that did strike me in Just a Gigolo, however, was the set and the clothes and the general physical material aspect, which did seem authentic to a degree, albeit a couple of degrees removed from the original. Which is exactly what it was for people in the 1970s - the 1930s were barely 40 years earlier, a much shorter period than the one which divides us from Cabaret and Just a Gigolo. The boarding house in Just a Gigolo is how I imagined the people making the film and in the film might have remembered their grandparents' living room. Some of the people in the movies were even around in the 1930s themselves, Dietrich, for example (who is sublime). Isherwood himself was still around when Cabaret was being made.

There was no colour film or photography in the 1930s, so we don't see that period "in colour", while people in the 1970s may even have had their own memories of the 1930s in the flesh so to speak.

I think the problem with Cabaret, however, what makes it not seem authentic is that it's at quite a remove from its original (early 1930s Berlin, Isherwood's books on early 1930s Berlin, the American musical, then the American film). Apparently Isherwood himself didn't like Cabaret the movie. I just watched a few clips, it seems to be trying too hard to capture what was in the process of becoming a mythologised interwar Berlin. The other problem is that it's based on a musical rather then on the books, and that limited the transition to film.

by Anonymousreply 58April 1, 2024 9:41 PM

[quote]Not so much Cabaret.

Well. that was you.

Cabaret was the 4th highest grossing film of 1972. (source IMDb)

by Anonymousreply 59April 1, 2024 9:44 PM

Oh please, there's a whole bunch of '30s films. Chinatown and The Sting, just to name a couple more.

by Anonymousreply 60April 1, 2024 9:45 PM

R60 - Chinatown DID NOT capture the feel of the '30s - totally ersatz; The Sting ABSOLUTELY HIT THE MARK. Don't ask me why . . .

by Anonymousreply 61April 1, 2024 9:50 PM

R60 Although depressing, Chinatown has a plot and you learn to care about the characters. The Sting is jolly good fun and can be rewatched again.

by Anonymousreply 62April 1, 2024 9:50 PM

[quote]The whole atmosphere felt like the 1970s, not the 1930s.

And "Singin' in the Rain" looks like 1952, not the 1920s. And is considered perhaps the greatest film musical of all time.

And "The Sound of Music" looks like 1965.

And all those "Old West" Westerns that look like the 1950s and 60s.

The films were being made for a mass audience with popular tastes. Concessions will be made.

by Anonymousreply 63April 1, 2024 9:53 PM

R63 doesn't, and never will, "get it".

by Anonymousreply 64April 1, 2024 10:13 PM

How do you people know what the atmosphere felt like the 1930s? You know from movies. Then you complain about those movies.

by Anonymousreply 65April 1, 2024 10:17 PM

[quote]the films that defined the public's view of the 1930s was Paper Moon and The Pianist.

How’s the meth addiction going?

by Anonymousreply 66April 1, 2024 10:18 PM

R64 You obviously know little about Hollywood cinema.

by Anonymousreply 67April 1, 2024 10:19 PM

[quote]While I agree with your premise, the films that defined the public's view of the 1930s was Paper Moon and The Pianist.

Oh c'mon...

by Anonymousreply 68April 1, 2024 10:21 PM

Marissa was so beautiful in this.

by Anonymousreply 69April 1, 2024 10:35 PM

I can't believe this fault-finding with a truly great movie musical. The sheer originality of it, the way the music was an organic element of the story instead of brushed on, how the Cabaret amplified decadence without exploiting it. "It gave decadence it's due". Do you realize how difficult that is? How crucial this is to this supposedly plotless movie and is the reason it ends with the Nazis INSIDE the Cabaret? Decadence has been corrupted, the show is truly over.

Sally Bowles had no character arc? Like uh, she shoulda got pregnant and aborted the baby or something. Funny that, because SHE DID. She chose the pursuit of stardom over husband and home.

You critics do not deserve this movie and probably haven't even seen it.

by Anonymousreply 70April 1, 2024 10:36 PM

R12/13, how many times do we have to tell you?

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by Anonymousreply 71April 1, 2024 10:43 PM

The silliness of criticizing the film for: "the whole atmosphere felt like the 1970s, not the 1930s."

That is a long Hollywood and Broadway tradition. The object was not to faithfully recreate an era. Artistic license was made.

Cabaret was first and foremost a contemporary entertainment, not a historical documentary.

It was a film musical, based on a Broadway musical, that was based on a play, that was based on a novel. Whew!

This is what the 1966 Broadway musical looked like. It looked like...well...1966.

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by Anonymousreply 72April 1, 2024 10:59 PM

The play was also made into a film in 1955 with Julia Harris as Sally Bowles.

And guess what? It looked like 1955.

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by Anonymousreply 73April 1, 2024 11:04 PM

^ Julie Harris

by Anonymousreply 74April 1, 2024 11:06 PM

^ never understood her “beauty”

by Anonymousreply 75April 1, 2024 11:12 PM

Also it should be noted that Liza was horribly miscast.

Although we can't imagine the film without her, Isherwood describes the character this way:

"She had a surprisingly deep, husky voice. She sang badly, without any expression, her hands hanging down at her sides"

Does that sound like Liza?

The girl that Sally was based on was 19 years old and was described this way:

"In my mind's eye, I can see her now in some dingy bar standing on a platform and singing so inaudibly that I could not hear her from the back of the room where I was discreetly seated."

But that's not the kind of character that's going to lead a great big Broadway musical. Kander&Ebb and Joe Masteroff had other ideas. No wonder Isherwood hated the film.

by Anonymousreply 76April 1, 2024 11:22 PM

Yes, r76, that’s why there is the much lauded theory that a good Sally Bowles is a bad singing Sally Bowles and Liza was to “good” for the character. It is a difficult balance. My problem with Minelli was mostly the overacting.

by Anonymousreply 77April 1, 2024 11:44 PM

I think Natasha Richardson stroke the perfect balance in this

by Anonymousreply 78April 1, 2024 11:46 PM

If nothing else…the streams of light emanating from Liza’ green fingernails at the ending of “Maybe This Time” …

by Anonymousreply 79April 1, 2024 11:48 PM

Eddie Redmayne Returns to Broadway as Emcee in ‘Cabaret at the Kit Kat Club NYC’

"Right this way, your table's waiting!" The iconic Kit Kat Club reopens its infamous doors with a splash, featuring Eddie Redmayne and Gayle Rankin as the powerhouse duo, Emcee and Sally Bowles, in the immersive, brand-new production Cabaret at the Kit Kat Club NYC.

This production, which initially captivated audiences in London’s West End, stands out for its fresh take on the classic, directed for a second time by Rebecca Frecknall and designed by Tom Scutt. It's anticipated to be Broadway's must-see show of the year, with previews beginning April 1 and a grand opening gala on April 20.

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by Anonymousreply 80April 2, 2024 12:01 AM

It gave decadence *its* due.

Oh dearing myself.

by Anonymousreply 81April 2, 2024 12:06 AM

Cabaret was one of the first "gown up" movies I ever saw. I was 12 when it came out and I didn't (at the time...) know I was a gayling - though I do remember Michael York piquing my interest. I liked the movie so much that I performed "Wilkommen" when I auditioned for the 8th grade talent show.

by Anonymousreply 82April 2, 2024 12:27 AM

I made a small mistake at r58: there was colour film in the 1930s, although it was not always used. Gone with the Wind was made in the 1930s in colour, but it had the feel of the 1860s! Liza's own mother starred in another 1930s classic movie that was shot in colour.

by Anonymousreply 83April 2, 2024 12:28 AM

Are y’all forgetting about Sally’s abortion?

by Anonymousreply 84April 2, 2024 12:34 AM

[quote]Gone with the Wind was made in the 1930s in colour, but it had the feel of the 1860s!


It had the feel of late 1930s Hollywood.

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by Anonymousreply 85April 2, 2024 12:36 AM

It is almost universally thought that Fosse’s film treatment is a huge improvement over the stage musical.

by Anonymousreply 86April 2, 2024 12:37 AM

But it's just like the book, r85!

by Anonymousreply 87April 2, 2024 12:38 AM

R85, the description of your photo reads:

[quote](Original Caption) An American family of 1860. A composite group (individual photographs of the members of the family combined into a montage).

In other words, that isn't a family portrait.

by Anonymousreply 88April 2, 2024 12:41 AM

What a bunch of philistines. Please shut up and stop talking about Cabaret, probably one of the best and most culturally influential films ever made, let alone musical films. You people are nuts. You’re like the kind of idiots who buy purple ketchup. Just shut up.

by Anonymousreply 89April 2, 2024 1:06 AM

R70, a movie based on a Broadway musical is not “original”

by Anonymousreply 90April 2, 2024 1:10 AM

R90 = autism spectrum disorder

by Anonymousreply 91April 2, 2024 1:30 AM

Liza as Sally Bowles became such an iconic look.

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by Anonymousreply 92April 2, 2024 1:35 AM

[quote]probably one of the best and most culturally influential films ever made

The movie and Liza made a big big impact.

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by Anonymousreply 93April 2, 2024 1:36 AM

[quote] a movie based on a Broadway musical is not “original”

I would say it was original if you use the definition that it was created directly and personally by a particular artist, Bob Fosse. And it felt original if you had seen every movie musical up to that point.

by Anonymousreply 94April 2, 2024 2:09 AM

R76 - How did Isherwood feel about the film of I am a Camera? From memory Julie Harris sings in it but she is dubbed presumably because Julie Harris sang badly.

by Anonymousreply 95April 2, 2024 2:20 AM

I Saw Him in a Café in Berlin

Music by Ralph Maria Siegel English lyrics by Paul Dehn Sung by Liselotte Malkowsky [Sally (Julie Harris) sings the song in her club act]

by Anonymousreply 96April 2, 2024 2:21 AM

I just love this thread and especially all the detailed discussions of cinematography and era. Sometimes DL offers up a juicy reminder of why I come here

by Anonymousreply 97April 2, 2024 2:36 AM

[quote]R47 Sally Bowles has no central challenge

It was an ABORTION. An ABORTION, Michael.

There would be no way, Michael, no way you could ever forgive me. Not with this musical comedy thing that’s been going on for two thousand years.

by Anonymousreply 98April 2, 2024 2:41 AM

Another cinematographer who changed the perception of how the 30s looked was Gordon Willis

He had photographed the 40s in The Godfather, which very much had a 1970s look, but his 30s in Pennies from Heaven is radically different, evoking the warmth of depression-era Coca Cola advertisements

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by Anonymousreply 99April 2, 2024 3:05 AM

Like many other young gaylings in the audience, I was struck by the revelation between Brian and Maximilian. I also had a very... visceral reaction to actors Helmut Griem and Fritz Wepper (as well as Michael York). The film really was dazzling. It made Liza a total icon (gay and straight). But I still like the original stage version better.

by Anonymousreply 100April 2, 2024 3:08 AM

And the Purple Rose of Cairo, which simultaneously had to evoke a word which was colorful but also bleak

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by Anonymousreply 101April 2, 2024 3:10 AM

I first saw Cabaret as a teen in the early 90s. It was my introduction to Liza. Loved it, loved the score the cinematography, set design. Everything. Great movie.

by Anonymousreply 102April 2, 2024 3:11 AM

If you look at the German films from the late 20s and early 30s (Pandora's Box, The Blue Angel, M, Diary of a Lost Girl). it seems pretty clear that Fosse, Jurgen Kiebach, Charlotte Flemming, and Rolf Zehetbauer did their homework.

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by Anonymousreply 103April 2, 2024 4:25 AM

THANK you.

by Anonymousreply 104April 2, 2024 5:32 AM

Pandora's Box is a silent movie, underlining the rapid changes in technology in the 40 years between the 1930s and 1970s. I'm not sure trying to imitate German expressionism gives a more "authentic" feel to Cabaret.

by Anonymousreply 105April 2, 2024 12:39 PM

If you want a movie offering the real feel of the between wars Germany there is M.

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by Anonymousreply 106April 2, 2024 1:05 PM
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