Just don't move to Florida

Imagine living in a hell where it's always hot and humid, crowded, expensive, and Pork Pie DeSantis and his Jackie O wannabe wife are considered glamorous beacons of style and grace.

Don't forget the bugs.

BS article. Hostile political environment so they move back to… Kansas? Was Florida not antigay ENOUGH?

Florida has legitimate problems, particularly the rising cost of living - which was expected, due to the massive retiring baby boom population. The home insurance catastrophe was preventable but Floridians have chosen not to remedy it. And of course climate change affects everyone.

But absolutely NO ONE who has bothered to move to Florida would have done so with knowing what the political environment was like.

Shithole state.

Seems that they moved back because of this:

[quote]Florida has legitimate problems, particularly the rising cost of living - which was expected, due to the massive retiring baby boom population. The home insurance catastrophe was preventable but Floridians have chosen not to remedy it. And of course climate change affects everyone.

States that provide the most transplants to Fla.

Data from the U.S. Census shows which states sent us the most new Floridians in 2022:

New York: 91,201

California: 50,701

New Jersey: 47,000

Georgia: 39,990

Texas: 38,207

Pennsylvania: 35,384

Illinois: 35,262

Virginia: 32,932

Ohio: 27,257

It absolutely is true that the Insurance industry in FL is wreaking havoc on by the three State Economy and Personal finances. Most senior citizens who live there ( A LOT) are living on fixed incomes and can't afford the doubling or tripling of costs overnight. And it's not just lack of workers for trades that is a serious loss for homeowners there, but the politics, wages, and new laws are running out Professionals like Doctors, Teachers,and Lawyers who are fed up with Florida's regressive damaging practices.

They were moving there in 2022, R6. The article you posted is datelined five months ago recapping figures from the previous year.

They're leaving now according to the story datelined today.

You’re right OP, Detroit is better

[quote] But absolutely NO ONE who has bothered to move to Florida would have done so with knowing what the political environment was like.

In fairness, until as recent as 2018, it was a 50/50 state at least gubernatorially. It really took a fucking dive when desantis thought he could be the next trump.

As a Floridian, I would like to thank whoever wrote this article. Maybe it will stop the masses of northerners moving down here causing so much traffic congestion and a tight, overpriced housing market. Florida doesn’t have the infrastructure to handle the influx.

I visited once. Hated it. Had a better time in South Carolina!

Idealized shithole.

Much of it is, frankly, ugly and trashy.

And don’t get me started on the weather. Love when, every winter, Floridians like to mock us northerners for our cold.

I’d take that any day over living there in the summer with all that disgusting humidity, hiding out in air conditioning on your tiny lots.

And the people? The worst.

Florida south of Daytona is made up primarily of the worst the northeast has to offer. The lower forms of trash from Philly and Long Island is chock-a-block in the lower half of Florida.

Too many people moving in too quickly, plus climate change and the MAGA politics, I get. But this surprised me:

[quote] But she said the final straw was when she couldn’t find a surgeon to remove a 6-inch tumor from her liver that doctors warned could burst at any moment and lead to life-threatening sepsis. After being passed among doctors, she finally found one willing to remove the tumor. But when she called to schedule the surgery, her calls went unanswered and her messages weren’t returned. After months of trying and fearing for her life, she returned to Kansas to have the procedure done.

Don’t blame the northeast. Not our fault Florida attracts the worst from our states.

Where did I blame the northeast? I blame the trash that comes down from the northeast.

[quote] The reverse migration out of Florida isn’t just among newcomers, but also among longtime residents who said they can no longer afford to live there and are uncomfortable with the state’s increasingly conservative policies, which in recent years have included a crackdown on undocumented immigrants, a ban on transgender care for minors, state interventions in how race, slavery and sexuality are taught in schools, and a six-week ban on abortions.

Political migration is leading to even more radical political polarization.

Yes, we know as whole Florida is a bit whacky, but are there any redeeming places in Florida? What would be a good place to go that would provide an unexpectedly great experience?

[quote] In fairness, until as recent as 2018, it was a 50/50 state at least gubernatorially. It really took a fucking dive when desantis thought he could be the next trump.

He replaced two-term governor Rick Scott!

This was predicted to happen! The Greatest and Silent Generation of retirees was replaced by Baby Boomers! Florida used to elect people like Lawton Chiles, Bob Graham and Bill Nelson. It voted for Clinton in 96, would have gone for Gore in 00 if the election wasn’t botched and stolen, and voted for Obama twice. Then it became redder and redder and redder. Why? Baby boomer retirees. These are the people who elected George Pataki, Al D’Amato and Rudy Giuliani in New York; Tom Ridge and Rick Santorum in Pennsylvania. Massachusetts, probably the most Democratic state in the nation, had Republican governors from 1990 to 2006! All those voters retired and moved down to Florida.

The Northeast populated the southern strip, but the Midwest populated the rest of the state. They gradually took over and now with the GOP taking total control politically, the MAGAs are pouring in.

A few more decades and the whole thing will be under water. Hah.

It’s not about baby boomer retirees. Florida has always been full of retirees. It’s about where the retirees are coming from. More from the Midwest than from the Northeast. That’s what changed.

[quote] What would be a good place to go that would provide an unexpectedly great experience?

Forget it. The best you will find is relatively pleasant. Sarasota perhaps. Great? No.

It's amazing how fast Florida went from affordable to overpriced.

I have only been to the Sarasota area. It was pretty nice. Siesta Key was nice. Very relaxed. Englewood was nice. But that was 10 years ago.

[quote]I visited once. Hated it. Had a better time in South Carolina!

Tee-hee! Why thank you! I enjoyed you too.

R19, Tampa is having a renaissance of sorts, luxury hotels, exceptional food, and because there’s no beaches or Disney it doesnt draw the trashy crowds like Orlando. I work in Westchase, one of the more affluent neighborhoods that just got voted the best place to live in Florida.

I was scared because every other episode of the old Forensic Files took place in Tampa!

I grew up in South Florida near Ft. Lauderdale and couldn't wait to move out. The humidity, hurricane season, cockroach and flea infestations, bad drivers, etc...

If I had to live there again I'd move as close as I could to the Georgia state line.

Good thing the MAGAs moving in for ‘Freedom!”don’t believe in climate change.

Oh NO. Does this mean they’re coming back?

[quote] It’s about where the retirees are coming from. More from the Midwest than from the Northeast. That’s what changed.

Nope! Florida has always had two sets of retirees coming along the two Interstates, I95 which goes up to Maine which populated the East Coast with Northeasterners, and I75 which goes up to Michigan which populated the Gulf Coast with Midwesterners. It is baby boomers. For Pete’s sake, look at Trump! New York baby boomer, settled on the East Coast. It’s stereotypical.

The Northeast was simply heavily Republican in the 80s and 90s. Wisconsin had Democrats Herb Kohl and Russ Feingold in the Senate for nearly all the 90s and 00s. Illinois had Democratic Senators from 1984 to 2010, with the exception of one term Peter Fitzgerald. The Midwest voted Democratic because of UNIONS. The Northeast had a different political machine. That one seat was held by Republicans Jacob Javits to Al D’Amato from 1956 to 1998. The most prominent New York Democrat was Daniel Patrick Moynihan, a centrist who had served in Nixon’s administration.

I left years ago. Losing two houses to hurricanes was about all I could stand. Between the politics, weather and just too many dumb rednecks I just had to bail

Tasteful friends ...

[quote]Even home showings have become a politically sensitive issue. He recalled showing an elderly woman one property where there were Confederate flags at the gate and swastikas on the fish tank.

I had to be in Orlando for work recently and I couldn't wait to leave. Florida sucks.

Political self-sorting geographically isn’t unique to Florida. It’s happening everywhere. All the things one could say about conservative politics driving out liberals from Florida are true with liberal policies driving out conservatives and moderates from California, for example. A state’s political alignment also draws like-minded people. Florida is just going to become more of a red state.

People who move to Florida are annoying in the way that people moving to southern California used to be----they have to evangelize and essentially justify their move. Regardless of what the migration rates are like now, the future is likely to be different. The economics of climate change and mismanagement of water will make it more expensive and start pushing out people and start making it more difficult to attract newcomers. Rising costs started pushing people out of California somewhere in the 90s/00s. It took a while for costs to push people out. You can find pleasant suburbs anywhere, so their existence in a largely ugly sprawlburg like Tampa isn't much of an attraction.

Florida is a cesspool

Once you get beyond the waterways and coastal areas, R36, the whole fucking state is ugly sprawlburg, nothing but miles and miles of tacky cheap housing and apartments/condos (that are not aging well, either), strip malls and fast food joints.

Tampa hardly has a monopoly on ugly in Florida.

On top of everything else bad there, I could never live near alligators. Never.

R39: The alligators would be the least of my worries.

Homeowners in Loxahatchee enjoy a lifestyle far from the busy and pricey Florida coast.

That's why resident Debbie Winters was shocked when she learned her homeowners insurance reached costs similar to what many see closer to the water.

"It's added over $1,000 a month to our mortgage alone, and it just keeps going [up]," Winters said.

In just two years, the premium on her home has jumped from $3,900 a year to over $14,000.

This article highlights why I like Hawaii so much. A much more accepting environment, and all members of Congress in the state's delegation are Democrats.

I got the biggest shock when I was in Daytona Beach recently. It’s always been a downheel beach town.

Apartment complexes sprouting like mushrooms. All new. A new luxury cinema, a new PF Changs.

These are for middle class Northerners who wanted to move down to Florida who have been priced out of the housing market.

My parents retired there, on the Gulf side. I enjoyed visiting them up to the pandemic. Decent restaurants and arts, nice weather. But it felt very nasty post pandemic, plus the palm trees all started dying from some invasive bacteria. I had to go down for a few extended visits as my dad was dying and we had to move my mom to another state. Between those bad memories and things like getting nearly killed by aggressive drivers, I have zero desire to see that state again.

R27

I would rethink the area around the Georgia state line.

Daytona is the armpit of the Universe.

I've been to Austin and New Orleans during godawful punishing heat and humidity, but Orlando was the only place where I got severe heat exhaustion and couldn't function for a day. I don't know how someone could live in that.

You mean each of you would eschew living at The Villages?

Aside from the political divide, several areas in S California, including Palm Springs, are very similar.

Might seem like a fun vacation vibe but try getting a doctor's appointment.

The only city in Florida I really like is St. Augustine. Far enough north to be above the "loud mouth trashy yankee line", history out the wazoo, nice people, manageable size, beautiful sceneray. Just love it.

No shit.

This is a prime example of typical Florida stupidity. The Wonderworks Kids Science Museum in Orlando. They couldn't be satisfied to build a beautiful normal building, so they built this travesty that is an eyesore on the landscape.

Beautiful St. Augustine, the oldest city in the USA.

Florida has sky-high insurance rates, and Texas has sky-high property taxes.

But, no state income taxes.

St Augustine looks right up my alley.

I currently live in Florida in a small town north of Fort Lauderdale on the coast. I’m able to walk to the beach at the end of the street and my apartment is in an old mid-century garden-style complex right on a canal off the Intracoastal Waterway. It’s the old Florida style that people think about: very charming, very casual, not at all slick and modern, and maybe a bit scruffy. When my friends visit from up north they are at first a bit skeptical but after a day or two they’re ready to move down. Most of everything is in strip malls, which I didn’t like at first, but I pick and choose and the newest ones are very well done and attract some cool businesses. The heat in the summer is really no worse then the rest of the east coast and I think people exaggerate it. Having a warm winter is life-changing: I’m in the ocean nearly every day and I can’t recall the last time I wore long pants. The politics are so in the background for me, I really don’t pay attention and it really doesn’t affect me. Being at the beach and being on the water (I’m a Boat Captain) are what’s most important up me and the rest I make the best of.

R57: Politics are so in the background, i.e., clueless or in denial. I wonder what will happen when the water rises---I have acolleahue who left Miami Beach for higher groud when that happened to her.

Dumbass R57. True we could flip Florida blue with a little work and some migration in but Florida is a low-wage cesspool and I'm afraid merer political change won't fix that.

I visited Florida a few times in the 1970s through 1990s as a kid and then young adult. Different destination, but it was pleasant and so were the people. The 3 times I visited since 2007 through 2020 I was taken aback oat how much it has changed, particularly the people. I doubt I will ever visit the state again.

Every single house in Florida is some variation - richer or poorer - of R41. Except for the Everglades, most of the state is subdivisions with faux Mediterranean houses and strip malls. And then there are the vast white trash enclaves.

I know a few people who have winter houses down there and stay for three maybe four months a year but I don’t think any would live there year round. The one guy I know who lives there full-time likes very attractive, younger Latin guys that like older, dumpy white guys with deep pockets, so he is has ulterior motives.

FloriDUH

I think hurricane insurance needs to be separated from regular homeowners insurance, like flood insurance is, and be made a federal program. That would bring companies back into the market and lower the price of regular homeowners insurance.

After sunrise condos are not affordable. Too much shoddy shit was put up with no regulation in the Sunshine Shit. Better to condemn the whole state, move everyone out, and let nature take its course.

Obligatory gif in every Florida post.

I would imagine a good hack is to have the highest deductible possible on your insurance, if you can afford it. It probably still is expensive.

@r57, there was a time when the whole state used to be charming and laid back like that. Even the interior had quaint little lake hamlets like Sebring and Winter Park where the air was pungent with the smell of orange blossoms , but like everything else... "They paved paradise and put up a parking lot"

I'm glad you found a little pocket of old Florida, but you're the exception to the new rule

Just don’t worry about that.

^ Woody Allen: "Don't go in there"

Diane Keaton: "Why?"

Woody Allen: "There's a bug as big as a Buick in there"

Companies were setting up shop in Florida because of cheap labor.

With the rising cost of living, that labor is getting more expensive all the time.

And it’s not a great labor pool.

[quote]Bugs the size of cannons

My mom and dad lived there for a few years while he was in the service. My mom hated it, in large part of the bugs -- "cockroaches the size of VW Beetles."

I visited a couple of times in college and, aside from Orlando and Miami, there was a laid-back, ramshackle charm to much of the state.

I went back just pre-Covid with a friend whose parents bought a winter condo there and wow, was it different. Didn't like it at all.

[quote]armadillo infestation in her home

[quote] But, no state income taxes.

Surely you don't fall for that fraud. There may be no state income tax, but there are plenty other taxes that Floridians pay that more than make up for it. A state government can not run on no taxes.

"Homeowners insurance rates in Florida rose 42% last year to an average of $6,000 annually, driven by hurricanes and climate change, and car insurance in Florida is more than 50% higher than the national average. While once seen as an affordable housing market, Florida is now among the more expensive states to buy a home in, with prices up 60% since 2020 to an average of $388,500."

[quote] You’re right OP, Detroit is better

This poster forgets that Detroit isn't a state.

DeSantis’s approval collapse in Florida is largely tied to the home insurance crisis. It’s so bad we may actually get a Democratic governor in two years. Of course if anybody can fuck it up, it’s the Florida Democrats.

The home insurance crisis was the result of a single judge, apparently, something line allowing third parties to file claims. This resulted in 80% insurance fraud coming out of Florida. A person will come to your door and offer a free roof inspection. Of course they find something wrong with it and file an insurance claim.

I'm old as dirt. I remember when Panama City's Front Beach Rd. was almost completely bare. You could drive for miles and the only thing you'd see was an occasional 2 story beach motel. That's when Florida was a paradise.

It's full of sorry up nawth trash now.

I am trying to watch dumb tv to relax so I've been watching this reality show called Floribama Shore on Netflix. One of the characters mentions Nelson Mandela and one of the white guys goes "is he some rapper?". I laughed so hard at that. The rest of the cast members (even the other white ones) laugh at him and shame him. Just made me laugh.

It's America's wang!

[quote] I think hurricane insurance needs to be separated from regular homeowners insurance, like flood insurance is, and be made a federal program.

Hurricanes are expected. I don’t see why the rest of the country should subsidize people who build homes on flat, coastal land in an area that gets regularly hit by tropical storms. Same for people who build in flood zones.

You want to live there? Pay the cost, including insurance.

[quote] Surely you don't fall for that fraud. There may be no state income tax, but there are plenty other taxes that Floridians pay that more than make up for it. A state government can not run on no taxes.

But a lot of those other taxes are regressive, which makes Florida attractive to rich people. Plus, in Florida, when you declare personal bankruptcy, you get to keep your house no matter how much it’s worth.

Anticipating litigation one day over whether or not Mar-A-Lago is a house.

R82? Do you feel the same way about California's landslides, wildfires, and earthquakes? Just curious.

I don’t think insurance covers earthquakes or landslides. Widespread wildfires in populated areas are a recent development, so the people who are affected didn’t necessarily know what they were getting into.

FL is causing havoc on my homeowners insurance in PA. My policy went up almost $200 this year. I was told it so they pay fo all the damage to homes in FL

I don’t put down anybody for their preferred living location.

People who want to live in, or get out of, Florida, California, have their reasons.

I’m just so deeply grateful that I was born in and will die in, an Upper Midwest Great Lakes climate that knows the ferocity and beauty of Winter.

I’m deeply bonded with Winter and would not want to live in the South.

Agreed, R87. Our winter was unprecedentedly mild this year and I really missed the snow and cold.

R30 Trump is technically a baby boomer - born less than a year after the end of WWII (@ eight months). But I still don't really think of him as a baby boomer. He wasn't even conceived in peacetime. The baby boomers were the kids who were born when the men returned from the war and started getting married and having kids. But technically I guess you're right, as to dates.

R87 Really? Good for you. I fucking hate winter. (I'm from the Northeast). I don't bond with it or anything else with it. I loved the mild winter we just had.

Florida is the turd dangling from America's ass that refuses to drop into the toilet.

The only thing dropping in Florida is frozen iguanas in trees.

My family had a place on Sanibel Island (off Ft. Myers) from the 60's when the bridge was built until the mid-90's when my Mom died. I sold it because it would have cost far more each year to keep than I could reasonably expect to use it. Back in 1994 the annual insurance bill was $3000 per annum and no doubt rose since then. The HOA was $600/mo then and since went to $1000 - just as well as it got flattened by Hurricane Ian 18 months ago.

Sanibel used to be sane, if fairly crowded. Most of the people there were, as noted above, snowbirds or transplants who come from New England and the mid-Atlantic states on mid-westerners from Ohio, Indiana, Michigan, Illinois, etc. and a few Canadians. They all left in April and it was empty in the summer. Now it's way too crowded year round and a near-constant construction zone. And one that'll get wiped out again the next time a storm heads up the Gulf coast of Florida.

[quote] Florida is the turd dangling from America's ass that refuses to drop into the toilet.

What does that make Texas?

AOL.news?

That's your trusted source?

It's getting worse because local officials are letting people rebuild in the same places that just got wiped out, and then allowing substandard reconstruction: they want the property taxes.

This is leading leading to a 25% increase in everyone's insurance rates in SW Florida because the next big storm will wash it all away again.

R95

The story originated with NBC news. AOL reprinted it.

The NY Post wants in on this action too.

Ready the Post article, it’s easy to see that all these people were disappointed because they failed to do their research beforehand. One of the people discovered after to moving to Florida that it’s very hot there. Incredible.

I’m a former Florida property owner who sold eight years ago because of the cost of insurance and property taxes. These are things, along with the other gripes, that a person who was considering moving there in the last few years could have easily learned about beforehand. These people got what they deserved for not doing due diligence. That’s their own fault.

I came to Casablanca because of the waters.

What waters? We’re in the desert.

I was misinformed.

Whatever you do, don't say," Gay." That's what's the most pressing issue in Fla. And consult the banned books list to see what you are not allowed to read. And, make sure your kids don't have social media.

^ Typical Republican, stick with the political hot button issues when you're too stupid to lead

[quote] What does that make Texas?

The impacted colon rapidly going septic.

The governor has very little power to fix the insurance crisis so he creates all these problems to distract. If he cannot resolve the insurance crisis he has no political future after his term ends. He would never get elected to the Senate.

He is term-limited. He cannot be re-elected. He has no political future in Florida.

^ He'll run for senate and dumb dumb Florida will elect him 🙄

^only if one of us moves up.

I am curious if Rick Scott would be in trouble given that he only won in 2018 by 10,000 votes.

I guess it may depend on the Hurricane season.

[quote] The governor has very little power to fix the insurance crisis so he creates all these problems to distract.

Maybe on something, but I highly doubt that he was the one who placed books with sexual content in school libraries so that he would have an issue to fix.

How in the world can they stop the rise of homeowners insurance premiums?

Imagine being an insurance company writing premiums in a state that gets devastated by hurricanes as often as Florida?

One might imagine that some insurance companies were using hurricane damage to justify price gouging. I’m not saying such a thing would ever happen, mind you, but one might argue that strong government oversight and regulation of the industry might be wise.

One might also imagine, if one were, say a COMMUNIST and not a freedom-loving patriot, that in times an acute crisis, relying on the free market alone is not the best solution for the people of a state. Perhaps some kind of public, state-owned underwriting of hurricane risk might ease the crisis.

They already have a government-controlled insurance company called Citizen's, AKA, the insurer of last resort.

^ Citizens was good insurance, when I got hit with two hurricanes they paid and fast

It's like people did their research on Tik Tok and Instagram and not, like...you know, ANYWHERE else at all before deciding to move there. People are absolutely insufferable.

Florida = the garbage people of the south.

Have fun sucking Ron DeSantis' mushroom dick, Floridians. :)

It used to be that California was the state where the fruitcakes were. Florida said, hold my beer!

Although I think California is still kind of the “hippy dippy crystals manifest” place. Florida is more the “rushed to emergency room because he put his erect penis in alligator’s mouth while wearing his klan robe” place.

At least they have Tacky O!

California and Florida have always been America’s two poles on it’s weirdness barometer

Florida had a population of five million people in 1960, seven million in 1970. There were lots of wide open spaces and greenery everywhere. We would vacation in Clearwater Beach every summer while I was growing up. It was very laid-back. We stayed in an old two story motel with a pool, and there was an air conditioner in each room! We didn't have air conditioning back home.

We'd visit the mermaid shows at Weeki Wachee, the glass-bottomed boats at Silver Springs, Fairyland in Tampa, the African animals at Busch Gardens, the sea lion and dolphin shows at the Aquatarium. We once went to Cypress Gardens and passed by when Mike Douglas hosted his show outdoors there. There was a Catskills tumbler who had the audience play Simon Says, and if they made a mistake, they had to jump into the pool with all of their clothes on. People dressed up then, so men in shirts and ties and women in dresses ended up in the pool. I couldn't believe people were doing that.

The motel room had a kitchenette, so we didn't have to go to many restaurants. Every morning we could walk across the street to the beach and we'd use the pool in the afternoons. It was an ideal two weeks every summer.

Don't move to Florida. You can buy those white boots online.

Maybe there won't be a Florida to go to............

Oh, please -- only one hurricane actually hit Florida last year, slightly north of the "Nature Coast," and it was only a Cat 3. Anyone who lives in FL knows that's not much of a hurricane and there's not a huge population in that area anyway.

The number of hurricanes they predict and the number that hit landfall are very disparate. Check for yourself if you're bored.

Thank you for your clarification, Gov. DeSantis.

Don’t trust the babysitters.

Rhonda smells of pudding and desperation, but somehow Florida manages

R120 It sounds nice - but can you tell me - why did you go to Florida in the summer? Where were you from?

[quote] We would vacation in Clearwater Beach every summer while I was growing up.

I think the narrative (see quote above) in R120 makes the answer to your question self-evident, R127. Think about it.

I'll answer it. I went to Florida because my parents took me there. I didn't know any different. I just know I had a great time and amazing memories. We lived in Cincinnati, Ohio. Lots of people in the Cincinnati area go to Florida on their summer vacations.

The funny thing about people who vociferously defend being in Florida is that they assume many of us have never been there. Often that's enough, even if the weather is nice (I've been there when nice and not-so-nice) to decide you'd rather be elsewhere.

[quote] The funny thing about people who vociferously defend being in Florida is that they assume many of us have never been there.

I used to live there, and while it wasn’t a good fit for me, I can acknowledge that for many it is a good fit and that many are quite happy to be there rather than somewhere else. The downsides to living in Florida in general aren’t anywhere near as bad as those faced in America’s large cities.

[quote]The downsides to living in Florida in general aren’t anywhere near as bad as those faced in America’s large cities.

The hurricanes in Denver are so bad, people can no longer get homeowners insurance.

Where are you supposed to live where natural disasters aren’t an increasing risk? The whole East Coast gets hurricanes. Maine has flooded. California is getting torrential rain or fires up north and in the desert. There are tornadoes in the Midwest, and now earthquakes in NYC.

You really can’t seriously compare the natural disaster risks of certain coastland with much of the US.

The big NYC earthquake was a pipsqueak.

Many like me live in places where it’s highly unlikely we will ever have to flee our homes for extended periods as a storm bears down. Our storms, while getting more severe, are mostly just unpleasant and annoying, especially if you need to get dogs out.

Always been quite the shithole state.

I live in Michigan, and though our winters have been relatively mild lately, I am having problems tolerating the cold weather. A couple of friends of mine, both retired, go down to Florida in Mid January and stay until Mid February, staying in state park lodging around the state. I can see myself doing something like that when I retire, though I'd stay in hotels. Sort of a mini-snowbird deal.

Other states have warm weather, R136. You don't have to go to Valhalla.

USVI/Expensive, still being rebuilt post-hurricanes and not very gay

Puerto Rico/Cheap but crime is high and there's still a lot of infrastructure waiting to be repaired.

When I first retired, we did a round-South America cruise from January to March. Keep in mind, though, that the Falklands are always sort of miserable and it was really freezing when I "swam around Cape Horn." January is mid-winter in BA. It's not a seven day cruise with the disrespected wig-wearers going hammer and tongs by the hot tub with their disrespector but the per diem is way less than you'd expect in a hotel. Ours was 62 days and we saw the Amazon, the Panama Canal, some places in Brazil you'd never see otherwise, and Iguazu Falls and Machu Piccu.

R19, Pinellas County has St. Petersburg and several small towns to the north that are decidedly blue and forward thinking. St. Pete has the largest Gay Pride events with tens of thousands of people.

Little towns, like Safety Harbor, Gulfport (especially Gulfport), Tarpon Springs, and Dunedin, here I live, are gay friendly and progressive.

The first point in our 5 point mission statement in inclusivity, and the city means it. For example, our Gay Pride golf cart parade (it's a thing) has over 100 carts. Ironically, Dunedin is DeSantis' home town, but he knows better than to show his face here.

My husband and I love it here, and we love it's small town vibe where everyone says hello and many of us know each other. This is after 35 years living in Manhattan.

'here' = 'where'

Duh. January is summer in BA.

My bad.

I agree, R139. If I had the money, I'd happily live in Gulfport or Dunedin. After all, I did live in St. Pete for 15 years, a few blocks east of 4th St. N. and 38th Ave.

But when I decided to sell my renter-trashed place there, I moved inland. I remember all too well the streets in Gulfport getting a foot of water after a heavy thunderstorm. Once I rode my Harley to my godparents' home two blocks from the Casino hours after a strong rain, and I had to pull my bike up on someone's sidewalk just to keep my pipes out of the water. I had to walk the rest of the way to their place.

But not only is it beautiful and a well-known gay (and lesbian!) haven, I had a lesbian in San Francisco ask me if I lived near Gulfport -- that's how famous it is there. She told me, "Never leave Florida -- it is so expensive to live here, I'm 40 and I still have to have a roommate so I can pay my bills."

Just sayin'.

R129 I was wondering if maybe you lived in the South, and went to Florida in summer to go to someplace with ocean beaches. I only asked because I never knew people to go on vacation to Florida in the summer (It's supposed to be very hot). Not trying to say anything provoking.

Europeans go to Florida in summer, but they’re zany.

R142, that's why we ruled Gulfport out. It's fabulous but way too vulnerable.

Where we are is 35 feet up and 1 mile to the water. Storm surge is not a concern.

Again, I'm not putting anyone down for it, it was probably a great place to go. Just wondering where the poster came from to go there.

Should be signed R139 ^^

People from the Great Lakes states go to Florida for vacation, so do many people from New Your, New Jersey and Pennsylvania.

Drive down I-75 from Michigan and Ohio to Florida. You'll find many people in cars evidently heading toward a vacation. Pillows for the kids are everywhere.

Qanons on the beach.

They are going to Mousetown.

We moved to Tampa six years ago, and something unusual happened the past year or so, as though it’s hit a critical mass of sorts. As crowded and expensive as it’s gotten, there are also signs of wealth, culture and status abounding. Over the last two years, the entire second floor of International Plaza was gutted rearranged, and gained every luxury store you could find in NYC. The Westchase neighborhood I work in was voted #1 to live in Florida and has seen seismic shifts in valuation and income type of resident. These are the very same, savvy, informed, and “wealthy but quiet about it” demographic I worked with in NYC. There is a three month wait to get into Berns Steakhouse and it’s almost impossible to secure a table.

This restaurant opened on top of a derelict “Holy Hog” barbecue joint and razed parking lot three months ago, and just won a Michelin award.

I must visit Florida twice a year. Usually Miami but sometimes Ft Lauderdale. I passionately detest, hate, and cannot tolerate Florida and its people. They disgust me. I hate the weather. It's like sweltering in the sauna from Hell. I hate the old bastard right-wing-nuts. They are proud about being for Trump. They speak loudly in public about how stupid everyone on the left is, then laugh about this hysterically and pat each other on the back. Fuck these Flori-duh-tards.

I lived in Tampa in the 70s. It was wonderful, Florida's best kept secret. So diverse and Gay friendly. I really miss the way Florida used to be ☹️

My mother just visited Naples a few weekends ago and couldn’t believe how fancy it was. She stayed with friends in a house she described as magnificent that had been designed and sold by two gays. She said the town felt very, very rich.

My mom’s been dead for 20 years but when she was alive, Naples was rich. She used to wonder how people could wear mink coats to church in Florida in February when it’s 78 degrees outside on a Sunday morning.

Naples has been popular with wealthy Midwesterners for decades. It's not exactly news or relevant to what is happeneing to normal people in Florida.

Naples is very Republican. I worked in financial services, and that’s where everyone in the industry retired. Aim higher.

I had an older lady friend who would brag about her brother and his wife who would winter in Naples at a home they owned. The wife was from a wealthy Boston banking family. My friend would brag about them transporting their BMW down by truck every year. I'd point out "what a stupid waste of money"

They sounded like insufferable assholes and the wife was a snob bitch of the first order. She looked down on my friend because she was a lowly teacher who only made $100K a year and point blank told her she was a "poor".

This is my favorite thread in quite some time!

I was not planning to retire to Florida, but I attended an industry event in Naples and was impressed. When I sold our company I moved there. Then discovered we enjoyed Marco Island even more, so the hub and I moved there. SWFL is its own animal. Our friends from Ft Lauderdale come here to visit just to escape the madness of the East Coast. By the way, the local news is hilarious.

R160: You can find snob appeal destinations anywhere. What's your point? You're well on your way to having beachfront property in much of Florida.

R148 In mid-summer, though?

It’s hideous.

My friend's mom used to talk about moving to Florida in the late '40s and working as a waitress in a restaurant where there was no air conditioning, just high ceilings and a lot of big windows with screens. Must have been sultry in those days.

R161 DL has a wide variety of users, some of whom might find parts of Florida acceptable. I had written it off totally, but after eight years I’m happy where I’m. That being said, I need to be tranquilized to head to Miami and the gene pool in points north of us is pretty shaky.

That mom was a sultry vixen!

Off topic but what's Gulfport, AL like? I saw some HGTV show filed there and it looked quite nice.

The defenses of Florida are so lame---upscale stores at a mall? Status seeking in SW Florida,? Avoiding Miami--which is way more interesting that most of the rest of the state. The point of the thread is that costs and consequences of a degraded environment are starting to take their toll, if not the retrograde political environment. This is roughly where California was in the 70s/80s.

R168 your post was OK until that last sentence: This is roughly where California was in the 70s/80s.

I totally disagree. You’re way off base re that point. California then was light years ahead of what Florida is now—and will remain so for…a very long time to come.

The reason I said I need to be tranquilized to go Miami is not because it isn’t a great place to visit, it’s because every time we go there I feel as though I’m going to be killed in a massive car wreck. It’s the only place I’ve ever seen a car on its roof next to a toll booth!😜

Oh, R170, I'm not in FLorida but I see crazy shit like that all the time. Try a box truck wedged on it's side between two booths.

The first time I went to Florida I rented a car and went on the Tamiami highway and within minutes saw a car crash with elderly people in a big Lincoln.

^ And a local attorney was already on site handing out business cards.

Morgan? Or Morgan&Morgan? Or the other Morgan?

The only thing I like about Florida is that the movie "Body Heat" is set there.

[quote]The only thing I like about Florida is that the movie "Body Heat" is set there.

Apparently it was actually chilly there when they filmed it. Winter 1980-81.