Does anyone else think Nikki Haley is ultimately going to beat Donald Trump for the GOP nomination?

There's no way Trump won't get the nomination. If he didn't, he would run third party, and destroy Republican's chances at the White House.

The second paragraph should read:

[quote]Lots of influential people are coalescing around her, including (1) most of the business establishment and (2) virtually all of the "anything but MAGA" wing of the GOP. [bold]This coalition is animated by the apparent[/bold] desire to block both Trump and DeSantis, who are two sides of the same soul-destroying coin, from the presidency.

Yes🤞🤞

No OP.

Unless Dump dies before the election (and we can all hope) - he will be the GOP nomination. The MAGA cult and the others who support Dump demand this. No. Matter. What.

If he dies then maybe but it's difficult to see Republican nominating a female.

Maybe. We can only hope.

I also hope she punches Vivek in the face at some point, too.

The conventional wisdom has shifted somewhat. The secret primary, as it is called, has shifted even more.

Still, it depends on some bigger shoe dropping early in the new year…sooner than later…otherwise it won’t matter. Republican primaries are winner take all, and the state party organizers are in for Trump all over the map.

Should he slip in Iowa or NH, and she gets him one-on-one…there’s a bet to be made. She is going for broke; just ask Vivek—she flayed him with just a couple of retorts.

I think there are too many big vested interests backing Trump for him to be torpedoed as the GOP candidate. But I think he'll lose to the Democrats again.

Agreed R7. And then all hell will break loose this time. Fuck knows what will happen.

Yes. I’ve predicted this from when she entered the race. Even when her numbers were humiliating. I hate her, of course, but I hope I’m correct that she’ll be the nominee and finally put a stake in Trump’s heart. She’s smart and not criminally insane.

The rethuglican party IS the MAGA party. They just play in different shades of awful. Nimrata is little better than Dump.

[quote]I think there are too many big vested interests backing Trump for him to be torpedoed as the GOP candidate.

I don't know. I think this is Clinton vs. Obama in 2006-07 all over again. Hillary was thought to have it in the tank. All of the "vested interests" were lined up behind her and no one thought they could be dislodged. As soon as Obama showed he was viable by winning Iowa, it put EVERYTHING in play.

Obviously these are very different candidates but the psychology at work amongst the GOP electorate is likely not that much different than it was for Democrats during that primary race.

[quote] I’ve predicted this from when she entered the race.

Oh bitch, please.

If you predicted this when she got in the race then please produce a link to your early prognostications.

Yes, that's what I thought. Nobody thought Nikki Haley stood a chance when she got in the race. Stop trying to swoop in and act like you got here first.

You can get right back in line behind me.

I think she's a complete opportunist with no real guiding principles. But, that being said, I think she's a pragmatist. I think she has already hinted that there would be no more pushes for stronger abortion laws in a Haley administration. would probably desert all the culture war issues, and I think she would love to take credit (as would any Republicans) for the improvements to the economy from Joe Biden's infrastructure bill that they all voted against. If we HAD to have a Republican president, she's marginally better than most of the other options- which is as tepid an endorsement as I'd be willing to make.

I hope so. She would definitely lose to Biden

I think she was principled when she got rid of the Confederate Flag from the South Carolina state capitol.

If she were to get the nomination, she would win the presidency. Now that Trump is beating Biden in the polls, it has reinvigorated the GOP to support him. However, even they have fatigue and have a backup choice. Haley is it. DeSantis has crashed and burned.

I honestly don’t see Biden getting a second term at this point. I hope I’m wrong but I’m getting the same feeling I got in 2016. If we have to have a Republican, Haley is the only one who isn’t totally crazy and not a con artist like Trump and Vivek. She speaks out of both sides of her mouth. She has to in order to win over the GOP. At the end of the day you can tell where she stands and what her priorities are. They’re not MAGA. She’s still a Republican but the best choice out of the lot of them. The first female president was always going to be a Republican.

I really wish Biden had kept his word and only ran for one term. The sad thing is I don’t see a viable alternative to him even if he did drop out. At least not one who could win.

If this country re-elects Trump its lost its mind.

Nikki Haley will win!

Her nomination could scramble American politics of the last 8 years, if not the last 40 or 40. She is a 100% traditional politician coming from a party that has celebrated ideology.

In the Republican side, she might pull back Never Trumpers. But this would come at the price of losing evangelicals and MAGA as well as misogynists or racists. So it’s hard to see an active winning coalition.

From Democrats, she might pull away moderates if she can make the rest of her party tone it down. Biden is already losing support of young voters, POC, and leftists.

But for her to succeed requires a transformational candidacy, which her pragmatism and ideological flexibility make difficult. She is not going to energize anyone to a significant extent,

I still can’t see the Republicans putting away the Trump addiction. It’s unfortunate that there is not a good Biden alternative or that he’s not such a target for his age. Cory Booker without the closetty vibe, Mayor Pete without the wimpiness and racial problems, Amy Klobuchar without the whiny tone. Maybe Gretchen Whitmer.

Our alternative to Biden is Gavin Newsom. And don’t give me this shit about California being toxic to politicians.

Gretchen would be a strong candidate. So would Gavin Newsom. The problem is name recognition. 70% of the US electorate pay no attention to politics until they start seeing ads on TV, and then they go for the one whose name they recognize - or else they throw a dart at the ballot. My community keeps electing one of the very worst Republican members of the House of Representatives (minus the Freedom Caucus members, but she's right up there with them). She does NOTHING for our district, but people recognize her name and of course she has an enormous war chest, so she floods the airwaves with ads for 6 months every election year.

Absolutely not this time around, OP. However, I do think she will get the nomination in 2028 and be elected president. It'll be a change election, so she'll basically waltz into the White House without much effort. Newsom won't translate well in the Midwest, sealing his fate.

[quote] If she were to get the nomination, she would win the presidency.

Nope. The Trumptards will only vote for him. They will not support a woman, even if she were a blonde. Without the Trumpanzees no Repug has the numbers.

You have a very unsophisticated view of the political zeitgeist, R21.

r15 She took it down after severe pressure, then presented it as her own original idea, she's just the worst.

[quote]I really wish Biden had kept his word and only ran for one term.

r16 He never said he would only run for one term, why does this lie put out by the Bernie camp back in the summer of 2019 keep getting repeated? And we keep pointing out to you it's a lie, yet you insist on repeating it, almost five full years after it was dismissed as fake news. What exactly is wrong with you people, you're sometimes as bad as the QAnon freaks where facts are concerned.

No. She's had a very easy ride so far because there are a lot in the media who like her and could see themselves voting for her and Trump hasn't viewed her as a threat. But she will soon face much more scrutiny. Also whereas Trump has highly enthusiastic supporters her support will have to come from the 40% who don't support Trump and have so far not rushed to support her. Enthusiasm is crucial to win a primary and I don't see it being there for her regardless of the media push for her.

[quote] From Democrats, she might pull away moderates if she can make the rest of her party tone it down. Biden is already losing support of young voters, POC, and leftists.

NO ONE can make the MAGAts tone it down. Before them it was the Tea Party, it metastasized and led to the fracture of the traditional Republican party. Now losers like Gaetz, MTG and Boebert have their own constituencies, have cut their own deals for dark money and must be placated by the party. They are the power brokers in the Republican party. That's why all sane Republicans have been jumping ship for the last 10 years.

MAGA won't go for her in 2024 or 2028. Their shriveled souls want Orange Satan, who has promised them "Retribution!" and the suffering of liberals. That's the only policy MAGA is invested in and the only platform they will vote for, probably for the rest of their lives.

Additionally, R25 is correct. Berners who repeat this lie are morons.

r23 Zero counterarguments, just low-effort name calling with some elitist quip you farted out. Did a washerwoman teach you how to argue?

[QUOTE]Meanwhile, she is either already in second place (New Hampshire) or moving into second place (Iowa) in the early primary states. She doesn't have to win these states in order to shift the entire narrative.

Keep in mind Trump doesn't have a ground operation in Iowa and the governor endorsed DeSantis. I don't know about New Hampshire.

It's hilarious because r23 is also the OP.

[quote]I would be very happy if I was Nikki Haley right now.

Very sophisticated thinking, indeed.

r30 He didn't even bother with Iowa in 2016 and then went on to win the presidency, OP is full of shit.

Is OP defacto?

Nikki Haley is a POS moron who believes in nothing.

She ain't winning SHIT!

[quote] Our alternative to Biden is Gavin Newsom. And don’t give me this shit about California being toxic to politicians.

It’s not bullshit, it’s the truth. No one from California will get elected, and especially not Newsom who is beyond hated by voters. His MAGA ex will wet herself at the thought of airing out all his dirty laundry. He has way too much baggage and is an alcoholic.

Americans are over against 99% of the bonehead policies Newsom has put forward. That’s not going to fly in a General Election.

Americans are overwhelmingly against 99% of the bonehead policies Newsom has put forward. That’s not going to fly in a General Election.

First of all , if for some odd reason Trump doesn't become the nominee the Magats will raise hell and burn it all down. They will start the whole stop the steal all over again. So I doubt there will be another nominee besides Trump

Absolutely no way. Haley can't even poll better than DeSatan and DeSatan is only at 13%. Trump has a MASSIVE lead, well outside of the margin of error. The only way Trump doesn't get the nomination is if he dies or drops out.

And then imagine if he does die or drop out: who are his voters more likely to vote for? I think DeSatan - Haley is too 'moderate' for them as well as a woman and an ethnic minority.

I don’t know about Haley, but I don’t think Trump has a chance in hell of winning and I think it’s unlikely he will even get the nomination. In 2020 he had a good showing because many of the people who originally voted for him were unwilling to admit they had cut him too much slack and lots of people were pissed at the reactions against him and his supporters (especially the stuff about how people were dying of COVID because of him). Now he’s lost momentum and his childishness and his part in the divisiveness that has worsened has sunk in. Someone “safe” will probably win, so maybe Haley has a good shot but a democrat could, too. Biden could win, but his age is a big problem. And that also makes Trump’s age a bigger handicap for him. Trump’s Jewish connection could help him but it won’t be nearly enough. The voters who would vote against him based on that would never have voted for him anyway but some others will hold their nose and vote for him over a candidate who wasn’t strongly pro-Israel. But no way would that be enough.

People are exhausted and don’t want a new or unique candidate, not even one that would have been appealing four or eight years ago. So Biden has a chance. And people are tired of Hunter and Burisma as negatives. Those won’t hurt him that much.

A moderate, male democrat with a military background and a very strong immigration reform platform and a willingness to admit we need the functional equivalent of a wall would win. 100%, hands down. But not Pete because he blew it with the paternity leave (maybe a straight guy whose wife actually gave birth to twins and had a rough pregnancy could have gotten away with it, but he didn’t so you could argue that it’s homophobia) and allowing the perception of not doing enough to take hold and because he would be too Johnny come lately to a strong immigration stance. but I don’t think the Democratic Party will nominate someone with that stance. Not DeSantis because he’s gotten too much negative press already and he wore those white boots.

Ramaswamy has zero chance of being president because people are tired of negativity and being anti woke is ridiculous. Not valuing woke is fine, a positive. Actively against it is not what people want.

An independent dark horse is extremely unlikely. People are too burnt out and don’t want more conflict. But not completely impossible. The individual would have to be so above reproach that their existence is almost impossible.

If she wins the nomination, she will beat Biden.

I told you bitches a long time ago, and posted the same here, that I detected Haley's hellacious ambition to be the POTUS even before Trump appointed her UN Ambassador.

Hell, an astronaut then, and now, in orbit detects that, not that there is anything wrong with ambition.

I think she was lukewarm about the UN position. After Haley left it, I realized she took it to serve her goal- being UN Ambassador gave her access to Trump that allowed her to up-close, take his measure, so she had it in her arsenal when she needed it.

Yeah, I get it. The OP's question is about whether she can beat Trump for the nomination.

I agree that his supporters will go over Niagara Falls in their monkey barrel for him and that's all there is to it.

But, I've never underestimated Haley.

She's Eve Harrington to Trump's low-rent, wannabe, never-to-be-equal-to Margo Channing.

It’s the race for second place to see who will come closest and still loses to trump.

The primary election starts very soon. Then it will be the gop voters, a lot who are hardcore MAGA who will decide , not the big donors and policy folks in the gop would support someone other than trump.

Now if the debates between biden and trump begin and Donald loses control and takes a shit on stage. Or starts to speak in tongues.. Yes then he will lose support and the election.

The same holds if it’s biden on the dirty end of this story. And at 80 nothing is impossible.

The gop only hope to stop trump other than trump shitting on stage it’s a Haley-Desantis ticket now before the primary voting starts.

Agree with previous posters - Haley nomination = Haley win. She will pull the never Trumpers and independents who fled from MAGA and ultimately Republicans will vote for the Republican in the presidential race when it comes down to it.

I felt we didn't have a Biden alternative and read and heard a bit recently about the deep Democratic bench. Looking at what's happened on the Republican side with the debates we've seen Haley pull through after the last few months. What would have happened on the Democratic side? Who knows who would have separated from the pack like Biden did in March 2020 and Obama in 2008?

Like those two I feel like it is happening now behind Haley. With Trumps legal woes and his declining mental state becoming much more obvious and talked about, I feel like it really is slipping for him.

I feel resigned knowing this Haley situation may come to pass but I can live with it. It would be a continued trend of a president that respects the rule of law and would be the nail in Trumps coffin. I worry about the Supreme Court but well that ship has sailed anyway. Can't Thomas drop dead? Anyway....

If we look at the alternative of stepping to the edge of no return with a Biden vs. Trump match again, I would gladly forgo that stress knowing the future of democracy would survive for now if Haley was the Republican nominee. I don't like it but I can live with it.

Hold me David.

Trump’s chance at the nomination isn’t that strong. I think people are underestimating the damage Trump did to himself AFTER the 2020 election and he lost that election. He definitely won’t win in 2024 and people know that and therefore he won’t get the nomination. One way or another he’ll be stopped. I think even Trump has the ability to recognize this and will simply run out the clock showboating until he feels the time is right to concede / not concede call it something else and talk about how he was the best president ever the this next president will just have to do.

Watch for an increasing number of attacks on Haley. She will be one marked woman now and until she is no longer seen as a threat to trump.

Ask desantis how that feels.

If Haley does get the nod the only thing that can stop her from being elected is abortion. And she is going to minimize and soft talk abortion as much as she can.

Haley beats Biden soundly.. With lots of help from the leftist progressives of course

Nope. tRump will be the GQP nominee. No matter how unpopular Biden is, he will beat tRump.

If Trump has to drop out for some reason se will be the one running against Biden.

I don't think there's any way she can beat Trump for the nomination, but I do think there's a small chance that Trump drops out for some reason and throws his support to her in exchange for a federal pardon. She would then beat Biden.

R49

I am not arguing since I mostly agree.

But what other than a significant Heath issue could see trump drop out? And if it is a significant physical or mental health issue a pardon will not be his major concern.

Trump wants to win. He badly wants to win. He has so much pay back to deal out. A stroke might not keep him from running.

R50- Trump is running for his life in this election. Being reelected is the only way he avoids prison and he knows this. Nothing short of death will stop him from running in this election.

[quote]I really wish Biden had kept his word and only ran for one term.

Please, enough of the bullshit.

Trump could drop out.

It would take a lot to convince him he would lose, but it could happen. That would be a big stick and a carrot would help, too. He’s unlikely to be swayed by JUST a carrot because he knows once he drops out he is largely over. But a consortium of billionaires stepping in and offering to fund a $100 billion presidential library on the moon with holograms of him and a spaceship shuttle or a Presidential Medal of Freedom with an induction ceremony at the White House where Biden has to hold his coat would help.

Nikki might even get nominated, but do you think Trump will acknowledge that? Do you think his crazy base will acknowledge that he lost? No. They will not and this alone will cause even more chaos. Anyone who dares beat Trump will have a very tough time fending of the crazed magats.

Of course, there is always the chance he goes back on his word once the medal is in his chest or the land rights on the moon are secured.

Putin chooses who the GOP nominee is and Trump is Putin's guy. Deal with it.

You people are insane. Trump supporters (assuming he drops out or dies) won't vote for Haley to get the nomination. There have even been polls asking this hypothetical question and DeSantis polls something like 20 pts ahead of Haley.

DONT GET RELAXED OVER MODERATES. After all, it was moderate George H W Bush who gave us Clarence Thomas. He threw a bone to the extreme Right, and we’ve suffered with it for 22 years.

R50, someone could have Trump killed. That’s a significant health issue. I surprised it hasn’t happened already.

Even if Trump doesn't get the nomination, MAGAts will write-in his name for their ballot.

DIVIDE!!

[quote]Even if Trump doesn't get the nomination

He will get it if he's in the race. I seriously don't understand anyone who thinks otherwise. There is ZERO way for anyone else to get it.

Never happen.

Israel decides. It will be Niki.

[quote]Israel decides. It will be Niki.

Moronic comment.

“We need to look forward, and he’s not it. He’s a whining 5 year old dragging his feet. We’ve given him enough time, and now we have to move on as a party.”

Delulu OP. Very very delulu.

There’s a black swan event that takes Trump’s nomination right off the table.

[quote] Trump is running for his life in this election. Being reelected is the only way he avoids prison

How? He can’t pardon himself when it comes to non-federal convictions.

R67 Yes, if he dies or drops out. BUT even in that case, DeSantis is quite a lot more likely than Haley to win the nomination.

R52, he’s on tape saying it. We aren’t deaf nor brain dead.

R70, since you have full aural and cognitive capability, why don’t you provide a link to that “tape”? Thanks!

Trump could be a rotting corpse by the time the election rolls around and his braindead magats will still vote for him.

Nikki Haley could get some of the Bernie Bros because she looks like Tulsi Gabbard without the acne scars.

R69 but that is not true—

1. All bets are off in the case of outlier, including Trump simply underperforming in Iowa.

2. She’s already ahead of DeSantos in the “behind the scenes” primary.

[quote]Trump is running for his life in this election. Being reelected is the only way he avoids prison and he knows this.

Win or not, he is never going to prison.

She’s already said that the first thing she’s going to do if she’s elected is pardon Trump. And if you believe she won’t try to ban abortion you are delusional.

If she wins the nomination, and Trump runs independent, that will divide the Republicans, and Biden will easily win the election.

R74

It would be something to watch, how he might react if he underperformed in Iowa. That could make for fantastic tv.

His base is not going to let anyone including Iowa voters upset their plans. Trump owns far too much of the gop.

Funny if trump turned out to be the easiest of the gop front runners to beat in the general election. And one on one I think he would be.

Agree, Trump would have to drop dead. MAGAT crazies control the Republican primary now, They'll vote for him even if he's sitting in jail. If by some weird chance he loses the primary he HAS to invent his own party and run for office to keep the grift going. Nothing less than president will satisfy his ego. That will doom the Republicans.

That’s my point—he doesn’t have to lose Iowa or NH …any outlier works against him…and the most likely beneficiary is Haley not DeSantis… the good press and $ will go to her and not to Rhonda. And then it’s South Carolina’s turn. A poor January for Trump means a good February for Haley. That is all.

Could Haley Really Beat Trump? Big Donors Are Daring to Dream.

Powerful players in the business world have gravitated toward Nikki Haley, aware that she remains an underdog but beginning to believe she has a chance.

" How? He can’t pardon himself when it comes to non-federal convictions. "

No, but he can make those cases go away. If he is reelected democracy will be over. We will be living in a dictatorship.

I think people are badly overestimating the number of Trump supporters out there. He could ensure a democratic win by running independently, but he can’t win the election and it’s very, very unlikely he can win the nomination.

R! "destroy Republican's chances": Oh, dear.

[quote]I think people are badly overestimating the number of Trump supporters out there.

Oh, his supporters alone certainly can't get him elected president. But I think you are underestimating the number of reactionary voters out there, who vote against the incumbent because they're not happy with the way things are going. They don't much care who the other guy is or what he stands for, they're just registering their dissatisfaction.

No, Republicans will win thanks to frustrated and desperate people who will either stay home or give protest votes to Trump. No way they will vote another corporate shill, it is why Biden is losing.

Trump is the ultimate shill —slashing corporate and high income tax is all they want or need

R69, DeSantis needs to place a very strong second in BOTH New Hampshire and Iowa or else he is out of the race. They fucking hate him in New Hampshire and he will probably come in fourth place there.

He is hanging by a thread. Nobody likes him, not the voters and not the donors who he needs to fund his so-called campaign.

Nikki Haley only needs to outperform expectations before she takes flight. She is actually peaking at the perfect moment.

[quote][R15] She took it down after severe pressure, then presented it as her own original idea, she's just the worst.

She was under severe pressure from both sides of that argument and she made the right choice. End of story.

R83

He has enough hard core supporters to totally dominate the GOP. If you doubt this you have not been paying attention. He is dominating the field. Different than being able to win a general election.

The only thing that can stop trump is trump. Or the mothership returns a few decades to early and returns him home before his time.

R87 But he has problems with the most important of them, the military industry complex. Wall street people who are behind this don't like him.

Nimrata kicks forward.

WTF is going on with the site

I'm sorry, but Biden does need to drop out. I think he has been a good president but when you put him next to Trump in a debate, I don't think the contrast is going to look great, especially amongst an electorate that is actively looking to confirm their own age-related biases against him.

And he may not be "on tape" promising that he would only serve one term, but there was credible chatter in the run up to 2020 that he would term limit himself. Frankly, it was inconceivable four years ago that he would run for a second term at age 82. He was already too old in 2020.

Yet he won with no psych promise. Handily.

*such

Maybe Trump will pick Haley as his running mate.

His age was not on the public's radar in 2020, R95.

I don't know why you are ignoring the polls that show this is a problem for him. Nor do I know why you are ignoring the fact that, regardless of how much younger Trump is or is not, Trump comes across as completely lucid (though deranged) and Biden can barely keep himself awake. He is too fucking old and he will lose the election because of it if he remains in the race.

Trump will refuse to debate Biden R94, just as he's refused to participate in any of the GQP debates. It's because he's sundowning and will say really crazy shit in a debate format.

Now carry on witb your "Biden is old" talking points, hon.

R94

The best thing biden can do is stand next to nutso trump in a debate. Trump coming out to debate may be joes best hope.

why aren't links working

This site is so fucking bootleg. Seriously.

[quote]Trump will refuse to debate Biden [R94], just as he's refused to participate in any of the GQP debates.

He is refusing to debate in the GOP primary because he has nothing to gain from it. That will not be true in a general election against Joe Biden, where all he needs to do is show up and register consciousness in order to look better than the incumbent president.

You're comparing apples and oranges and you have misunderstood his reasons for not showing up at the GOP debates.

" Trump comes across as completely lucid (though deranged) "

If you him believing that he is running against Obama and President Biden is " going to get us in to WW2 lucid, ok. Then there is the windmill cancer. 🤣

You clearly don't understand the concept of lucidity if you wrote that nonsensical post, R104.

Why should we listen to you when you communicate less clearly than even Joe Biden?

Are you 82 years old?

R105- Did you even watch the last debate? Trump was geeked out of his mind. He has been using drugs to prop himself up and that isn't working any longer. His father had Alzheimer's, which Trump brutally picked him for , and after a lifetime of drug abuse and the stress of the indictments he is far from mentally competent. He is also about to lose his businesses, which I believe has upset him more than the criminal charges.

^ Mocked, not picked.

[quote] you have misunderstood his reasons for not showing up at the GOP debates

Apparently R103 has some sort of super-secret insight into Trump's reasoning. Miss Thing wants us to not believe what we see with our own eyes. TRUMP IS SUNDOWNING, JOE BIDEN IS NOT. Watch five minutes of any Trump rally and five minutes of any Biden speech and get back to us.

Dream on.

The GOP is a total train wreck. 2024 is going to be an absolute blood bath for them. No matter what the media says, the majority of Americans are not that stupid.

They’ve alienated women, African Americans, Hispanics, etc. It’s not going to happen for them.

They’re going to do about as well as Moms for Liberty did in the recent election. You can monopolise right-wing media, it doesn’t necessarily translate into votes.

Maybe OP…

"In a series of early morning tweets, retiring congressman and long-shot presidential candidate, Dean Phillips, articulated his thoughts on the 2024 election.

He said while he was a staunch supporter of the Biden agenda and respects the president, he thinks the level of government missteps is “staggering” and that its “delusional” to believe that Joe Biden could beat Donald Trump again.

“He’s going to lose to Trump,” Phillips wrote to X, citing a recent Politico analysis of Biden’s worrisome poll numbers. Once a fervent Biden fanboy, Phillips has become the only elected Democrat to mount a primary challenge against him."

WHY is everyone taking these jenky polls at face value? Um, hello, Democrats have been OVERPERFORMING in the last few election cycles, including off-year elections where people don't typically turn out.

And we're to believe some poll that has 34 black people in it saying they now love Trump to extrapolate to all of the black people in the country? I can't get over how some people just swallow the obvious BS.

That doesn't mean that Democrats should slack off, but I've had it with all of the gloom and doom pants wetting.

Haley wants to cut Social Security which is opposed by over 85% of Americans. That looks like a policy targeted to rich donors.

Haley is an establishment Republican, which is now considered a moderate Republican

Trump, to use the wise words of Rex Tillerson, is a "fucking moron"

Biden is too old and not living in the real world

Whitmer ,Philips, Buttigieg, and Newsom are really are only hope.

Newsome has far far worse reputation thsn Biden.

Democrats don't need a candidate that would attract upper class and upper middle class voters. They already have them. They need someone who can attract people who are frustrated by the inflation, housing crisis, immigration crisis etc. They don't need another corporate shill nor batshit "progressive" that are runining cities with crime and homeless crisis. Do they have one? Bernie was the one who could have attracted white and hispanic working class, but he has been marginalized.

There’s never going to be a face to face debate with Trump, he will evade direct confrontations becuase they KNOW he’d flub them.

Oh God here we go with the Bernie shit.

The idea that Donald Trump is “sundowning” (and I had to look this ridiculous term up) and Joe Biden is somehow not is hilarious.

Donald Trump is flying across the country participating in four different criminal trials, while also running a presidential campaign, and we still see him every day on the news. Joe Biden can barely handle a trip to Ukraine and only does a photo op while he is there. No questions allowed.

Did his interview with Kristin Welker a few weeks ago? Donald Trump’s I mean? If you saw that interview, and you saw how animated and lucid and evil he was, and you’re now trying to tell me that this man has dementia, then I have a bridge I want to sell your dumbass. He walked all over the newly-appointed moderator of MEET THE PRESS. Someone with dementia is not going to be able to do that.

Speaking of which, when is the last time Joe Biden sat down for a fucking interview?

Biden needs to stand down and let someone (who is not Kamala Harris) step in.

Hopefully even Bernie knows that he has no chance at this point.

R119 They are both useless old fucks. If we are going to have someone useless in the WH, it should at least be someone young and hot.

No, OP. What could people convince to choose her?

R121 That's what porn sites are for. Politics is fame for ugly people.

Andy Beshear is someone I'd keep an eye on.

Desantis doing real well in Iowa among voters

Haley doing real well in New Hampshire.

If both of these are true and translate into votes it does beg the question, what could those two do together as a ticket now before primary votes are cast. It could be really good for them or not. But it would be interesting.

DeSantis is barely holding off Nikki Haley in Iowa. He needs to come in second place in Iowa or else he is done, and Nikki Haley is polling, on average, two percentage points behind him, with all of the momentum on her side.

And DeSantis and Nikki Haley are not going to unite as a single ticket because one of them would have to agree to be Vice President and neither one of them has any reason to agree to that right now.

DeSantis might wish he had though, in a couple of months LOL

By 'real good' in Iowa you mean that Trump is polling an average of 44.7% and DeSantis an average of 17.5%? Even IF DeSantis and Haley's vote share were combined (not likely, since they have different appeals), they still don't beat Trump.

[quote] DeSantis is barely holding off Nikki Haley in Iowa. He needs to come in second place in Iowa or else he is done, and Nikki Haley is polling, on average, two percentage points behind him, with all of the momentum on her side.

Not necessarily because neither are winning if Trump are in the race. Any sensible person knows this. And if Trump is out of the race, you can't assume that Trump voters would go for Haley over DeSantis. The opposite is a lot more likely.

* is, not are

I predicted Haley would be the first female President years ago. Maybe not in 2024 but she’ll be unstoppable in 2028.

[quote]Not necessarily because neither are winning if Trump are in the race. Any sensible person knows this.

I don't agree with that. This is exactly what people thought about Barack Obama. Black voters were VERY hesitant to line up behind him, they stuck with Hillary Clinton right up until Obama won in Iowa. Once we demonstrated that he was viable, people who had been completely loyal to Hillary Clinton started tearing away and moving towards Obama. I think a similar dynamic is at work here.

Trump has captivated the GOP but a lot of this is Stockholm Syndrome. Once someone shows they are viable then there is going to be a dogfight. I am not saying Trump is going to LOSE all of his support. But he really only needs to lose 30% or 40% for another candidate to become viable. I think Nikki Haley is that candidate.

"Once we demonstrated that he was viable" should read "Once [bold]he[/bold] demonstrated that he was viable."

R128

Thanks for the reality check. I needed it. So trump can’t be stopped. None of them alone could come close.

And that maybe the absolute best news for Biden. Trump in front of the voters just might get a dead man elected. Assuming no significant 3rd party to suck up votes.

Go Trump

R131 The polling gives Trump over 20pt a lead in Iowa at present. If you understand polling that means it's outside the margin of error. That is, he's going to win. Unless something radically changes in between now and January.

Of course Trump is going to win Iowa, R134. You are missing my point. Nikki Haley does not need to win Iowa or New Hampshire in order to win the long game. She just needs to demonstrate viability. And then, when she does win in South Carolina, the dog fight begins.

R135 The sad thing is that Dump is likely to win South Carolina as well. Yes, Haley's own home state.

I just read through this thread in one sitting.

It's almost like some of you bitches WANT Trump to win.

R135 Here you go if you don't believe me:

"Donald Trump maintains a dominant 35-point lead in the latest Winthrop University Poll of Republican voters in South Carolina, the state that will hold the First in The South Republican presidential primary.

A recent CNN poll found Trump’s support in South Carolina is at 53%, with 82% of his supporters saying they have made up their mind.

With roughly one-in-five of Trump’s South Carolina supporters being persuadable, it leaves a narrow path for Haley to be victorious in the winner-take-all Feb. 24 primary."

R138

Narrow path :-)

Yes I’d say that article defines a very narrow path for Haley even in her own home state. I am surprised by how far ahead trump is over her in SC.

Go Trump

R139 Fuck you and your 'Go Trump'.

Push polls hype buzz SPLAT

R141 It's called reality. If someone is polling 30+ pts ahead that's a mountain to climb in just 3 months. This isn't remotely like the Biden-Trump polls which are all within the margin of error.

R138, it isn't that I don't believe the numbers. It's more that you are assuming those numbers can't or won't change overnight the moment that Trump appears to have a viable alternative.

You will just have to wait and see.

Don't worry, I will be right here to say "I told you so."

[quote][R141] It's called reality.

It's a poll. It is anything but reality.

Are you 25 years old or something? It's like you have never seen an election before.

[quote]Don't worry, I will be right here to say "I told you so."

You will not. Unfortunately. Trump has a death grip on the Republican party. Only way anyone else has a chance is if he dies or is forced to drop out.

[quote]It's a poll. It is anything but reality. Are you 25 years old or something? It's like you have never seen an election before.

Weird comment. I have seen many elections and made a lot of money from several too. It's just that you don't understand how to interpret polls nor politics.

We'll see.

[quote]It's just that you don't understand how to interpret polls nor politics.

You're not even interpreting.

Your version of interpretation is: "Derp. Trump is up by 30% so Trump is going to win the nomination."

If you make your money off elections then who is your candidate because I doubt he or she is winning very much with those analytical skills.

Unfathomably, Nim🐀 is uglier on the inside than on the outside

R148 Funny because you've just shown how you don't understand polling at all. If you're up 30% that means you're outside the margin of error. And I have been clear that things can drastically change in between now and the election.

This is all about what happens if he has a physical or mental breakdown.

[quote]And I have been clear that things can drastically change in between now and the election.

Exactly. So why are you talking about the margin of error?

Hillary Clinton was outside the margin of error at this point in 2007 as well.

PRINCETON, NJ -- Despite extensive news coverage of Illinois Sen. Barack Obama's improved position in Iowa and New Hampshire recently, there has been little change in the positioning of the Democratic presidential candidates on a national level, according to a new USA Today/Gallup poll. New York Sen. Hillary Clinton continues to have a substantial lead over the group of Democrats vying to win the party's nomination for president in 2008. Obama remains a solid second, as he has been all year, with former North Carolina Sen. John Edwards continuing to hold down third place. Clinton's support improved modestly from a dip earlier this month and is nearly back to her high levels from the late summer and early fall. Obama's support has shown a gradual improvement in the past month, and has returned to its late summer/early fall levels.

The Dec. 14-16, 2007, poll shows that Clinton continues to have a large lead over her competitors, with 45% of Democrats and Democratic-leaning independents saying they support her for the nomination. Twenty-seven percent of Democrats support Obama and 15% support Edwards. Sen. Joe Biden (3%), Gov. Bill Richardson (2%), and Rep. Dennis Kucinich (2%) are well behind in what has pretty much been a three-person race the entire campaign.

[quote]If you saw that interview, and you saw how animated and lucid and evil he was, and you’re now trying to tell me that this man has dementia, then I have a bridge I want to sell your dumbass.

Seriously? Go to his social media site and look at the rageful shit he constantly posts there. Then tell us just how “lucid” he is.

But you are all forgetting the hierarchy for Boomer Evangelical Christians:

TRUMP

jesus

Being rude and not tipping at lunch after Sunday services

Everything else

R140

If you are a dem and hoping trump does not get the gop nod and you want biden to face Haley or Desantis then you have either not been paying attention or you are dumber than shit..

Trump is Biden’s best hope. He might be Biden’s only hope.

[quote]How? He can’t pardon himself when it comes to non-federal convictions.

Pardons aren’t the only consideration. If he’s chief executive of the USA how does a state imprison him? It just creates a constitutional crisis.

It’s like freedom of speech — when the founding fathers established the constitution, did they anticipate that an anti-democratic (small D) Australian would use that freedom to move a large percentage of Americans away from the rule of law and representative government?

[quote] The idea that Donald Trump is “sundowning” (and I had to look this ridiculous term up) and Joe Biden is somehow not is hilarious.

For R119, since it thinks that sundowning is ridiculous, but then uses that term to describe Joe Biden. But I must be a RADICAL DEMOCRATIC OPERATIVE to use it to describe Trump's ranting and raving about running against Obama or us fighting in WW II right now.

Maybe R119 is DJT Jr., trolling here to defend his Daddy. Junior, it's okay if you want to dip your toe in the gay boy pond. Maybe you're tired of dating an ugly coke addicted whore Kimberly Gargoyle.

Either that or R119 is 12 years old and knows nothing.

[quote]For [R119], since it thinks that sundowning is ridiculous, but then uses that term to describe Joe Biden. But I must be a RADICAL DEMOCRATIC OPERATIVE to use it to describe Trump's ranting and raving about running against Obama or us fighting in WW II right now.

No, dummy. You're not a radical Democratic operative. You are far too simple minded for that.

What I think, actually, is that it's ridiculous to even attempt to make the argument that Donald Trump has dementia while simultaneously making the argument that Joe Biden does not. This is a very simple comparison to make.

You can try and shame me all you want, you reactionary dipshit. You're not going to shame me. Everyone can see what an idiot you are, and frankly, you are embarrassing yourself with these non-serious arguments.

Grow the fuck up.

[quote]For [R119], since it thinks that sundowning is ridiculous, but then uses that term to describe Joe Biden.

And you are drunk and referring to yourself, because I never used that term to describe Joe Biden.

Trump will NOT be our next President. The CIA will see to it, in one way or another.

Have a look at this ridiculous photo that his tonedeaf team had the nerve to post to Insta.

That ain't the look.

[quote] The idea that Donald Trump is “sundowning” (and I had to look this ridiculous term up) and Joe Biden is somehow not is hilarious.

[quote] And you are drunk and referring to yourself, because I never used that term to describe Joe Biden.

R119 apparently cannot read what came out of her bloated, puffy fingers. You call sundowning a ridiculous term then basically say that Joe Biden is somehow not sundowning. Go eat some more of Trump's excrement, hon.

That’s the stupidest take in history and it doesn’t rescue your dipshit argument. When I used the word sundown, I was quoting your stupid ass.

[Quote] First of all , if for some odd reason Trump doesn't become the nominee the Magats will raise hell and burn it all down. They will start the whole stop the steal all over again.

They'll just have to suck it up like we did

“He doesn’t represent the party at all these days. He’s off in a corner. We say this about Joe Biden, but why does Donald Trump get a free pass? He had his chance and it’s time to move on. He’s deeply unpopular and controversy seems to follow him.”

The reason some want Biden to move on are his poll ratings; they're afraid he might not win

Nikki Haley is up with the Koch network endorsement. Time for Biden to get out so we can run Newsom. I could also this being a winnable race for Kamala, believe it or not.

Newsome and Kamala would get Yellow Dog (partisan Dem) votes. Massive national failures.

The Dems and the Joe must go and the Joe must stay factions will rip the dem party absolutely apart at the convention if Joe does go.

They will not come together they will destroy .

R168 why do you think that Newsom stands better chance than Biden. Which demography could he attract, that wouldn't already give Biden their votes?

He would meet or exceed Biden's performance EVERYWHERE, dummy. Biden is at 36%, in case you hadn't heard, and that's largely due to a problem THAT HE CANNOT SOLVE AND WILL ONLY GET WORSE. Which is his age.

Yours and R169s "conventional wisdom" logic is sorely lacking. Try reading something more advanced than People magazine for your news and politics.

R169, the Yellow Dogs have not existed since the 1930s.

Next.

It’s spring 2024 in America. Will a dem marriage between California and Michigan save the day?

Or will old Joe prove that as always he is a sure bet?

Or will the Dems fuck everything up?

I can’t wait to find out.

Per the ever-reliable Laura Loomer, Nimrata had an affair with an employee of hers that started in the backseat of her Cadillac in an empty parking lot.

The story has been public for years and she’s never sued.

Yellow Dog exists as a political term for voters who ALWAYS vote straight party tickets out of intense loyalty.

If Kam had any political skills, she wouldn't have dropped out before the first primary with virtually no support anywhere. As for Newsome, the CA woke thing will cripple him in PA, MI and WI.

If nutty QAnon bitch Laura Loomer is spreading around the story of Nimrata's affairs, you know that side is worried about her being a threat to Trump.

I say good, let them tear each other down. Joe Biden and the Democrats will continue to work for the American people.

R177

She is just the next one up that trump and his people will go after. It’s not that at this point she poses any more of a threat than desantis did it’s just that she replaced desantis.

She is not special she was just next

Larry Marchant does have plenty of BDE

Newsom doesn't poll well against Trump so I doubt he would be much better than Biden. Although admittedly that may be because voters don't know him as well.

R180 they know about homeless crisis and crime in California though

There’s a “black swan event” that takes Trump off the list in January.

Wouldn’t it be loverly?

Not that I like the faker.

One of BLM leaders for Trump

[quote] Whitmer ,Philips, Buttigieg, and Newsom are really are only hope

Whitmer has put up with quite a bit of death threats over the past few years. I don't think she'll ever run for president. She'll finish out her second term as Michigan governor and maybe she'll eventually end up as cabinet secretary similar to Jennifer Granholm.

[Quote] Whitmer ,Philips, Buttigieg, and Newsom are really are only hope

Doesn't Pete need to spend more time with the twins?

Is Michael Haley black?

speaking of …., whatever happened to charming hottie Bobby Jindal?

No one but OP

Nikki Haley is now polling at 29% in New Hampshire. Trump at 44%.

So in maybe the most liberal gop state trump has a commanding 15 % lead over Haley which is a lot closer than the 30% lead he has in her home state of S.C.