Carrie Coon finally does some acting in this episode.
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Carrie Coon finally does some acting in this episode.
|by Anonymous||reply 206||November 23, 2023 2:49 PM|
It tickled me how Foghorn Leghorn…I mean Mr. McAllister crossed the road secretively from the Russells to the Van Rhijns.
|by Anonymous||reply 1||November 13, 2023 3:59 AM|
She yells a lot. I wouldn't call it great acting.
|by Anonymous||reply 2||November 13, 2023 4:01 AM|
R2 Honestly, it’s more nuanced than Christine Baranski yelling about New England clam chowder as if she were served a murdered corpse.
|by Anonymous||reply 3||November 13, 2023 4:01 AM|
Going to Bloomingdale's?---it was a rather low end place in those days, like Gimbels.
|by Anonymous||reply 4||November 13, 2023 4:02 AM|
NEW ENGLAND CLAM CHOWDER!?
|by Anonymous||reply 5||November 13, 2023 4:03 AM|
The last scene in the episode was Ada and the boring Rector looking at watercolor paintings? Really? This show is so going to be cancelled.
And did they go out of their way to cast a Tucker Carlson look-alike as Oscar Wilde? Uhhh…OK.
|by Anonymous||reply 6||November 13, 2023 4:08 AM|
I love how Oscar Wilde basically told on Oscar van Rhijn.
|by Anonymous||reply 7||November 13, 2023 4:35 AM|
R6 I disagree. It showed that Ava was finally getting a possible happy ending. We haven’t really devoted any time to her character alone without Agnes being by her side.
|by Anonymous||reply 8||November 13, 2023 5:55 AM|
He’s interested in Agnes.
|by Anonymous||reply 9||November 13, 2023 6:08 AM|
That Union scene had some of the worst acting I have ever seen on cable TV.
|by Anonymous||reply 10||November 13, 2023 6:27 AM|
Yeah, I wasn’t impressed with the union leader. He didn’t make me care about his plight, R10.
|by Anonymous||reply 11||November 13, 2023 6:29 AM|
Eleven rather short posts and I'm convinced not to bother with The Gilded Age.
Julian Fellowes wears thin fast.
I had some hope seeing that Carrie Coon is in it, but she is an actress who shines in proportion to the complexity of the character, a weak point for Fellowes.
|by Anonymous||reply 12||November 13, 2023 7:07 AM|
I wonder what Bertha has up her sleeve regarding the Duke of Devon or whoever he is. Sounds juicy.
|by Anonymous||reply 13||November 13, 2023 9:27 AM|
|by Anonymous||reply 14||November 13, 2023 9:52 AM|
What a great episode. The scene between Peggy and her mom was so chilling, I've never seen a conversation like that on TV before. Wilde was 28 at this time and apparently shitting out bad plays? I wanted to see way more of him, what a scene stealer. The male servants were so handsome, as was the newspaper man in the street and the striking worker guy with the huge stache at the end. The casting folk sure have a good eye.
While I appreciate that we get to see horse ordure on the streets because it helps with immersion, I was eating lunch and took a huge bite just as a pile of it was displayed centre screen. Lost all appetite instantly. The Brooklyn Bridge gets a mention, I'm thinking they're definitely going to mention the stampede later that year.
[quote]The last scene in the episode was Ada and the boring Rector looking at watercolor paintings? Really?
I thought it was such a sweet, touching scene. Like something out of an Austen novel. But I also sensed people weren't going to like it because there was no drama, just old-school flirting between two older people, which we don't see nearly often enough.
|by Anonymous||reply 15||November 13, 2023 11:57 AM|
R15, I have to wonder if the Pastor doesn't have a sinister purpose. Ada is so open and so accessible to kindness and attention from a man. He seems nice but that may be a facade. Although Fellowes isn't known for subtlety so if there is a sinister purpose he would have telegraphed it.
|by Anonymous||reply 16||November 13, 2023 3:27 PM|
Why were Ada and the Reverend looking at oil paintings and calling them watercolors?
|by Anonymous||reply 17||November 13, 2023 3:40 PM|
I find the criticisms of the actor playing Wilde surprising. He could have played him cartoonishly camp or not camp enough, in which case we'd be raising hell for Fellowes straightwashing him. I think he managed to find just the right balance to come across as clearly gay to us and passably straight to the more clueless folk around him.
He actually reminded me of a typical bitchy DLer much more than the other two homos on the show, so perhaps that explains this reaction.
|by Anonymous||reply 18||November 13, 2023 3:41 PM|
Denee Benton's dresses and matching hats are far too lavish and extravagant for a young woman who works as a secretary and free lance reporter. If she dresses like that in the deep South she will be in big trouble.
|by Anonymous||reply 19||November 13, 2023 3:42 PM|
Honest question, but does Cynthia Nixon have false teeth for this portrayal?
|by Anonymous||reply 20||November 13, 2023 3:44 PM|
r17 They weren't? It was an exhibition of Adolph Menzel's work, which included both watercolours and oil paintings. They mentioned at the luncheon that they enjoyed his watercolours, they didn't say his work using other methods was shit.
|by Anonymous||reply 21||November 13, 2023 3:50 PM|
Dear God in Heaven....whose idea of the scintillating wit of Oscar Wilde was that melodramatic claptrap which everyone (deservedly so, I might add) was so yawningly underwhelmed. I have read almost everything Wilde has written (including The Selfish Giant, a fairy tale concocted for his children) and what was presented as Wilde's work in this episode was monstrous.....unforgivable. This was particularly galling coming from Julian Fellow, a fellow Brit.
|by Anonymous||reply 22||November 13, 2023 4:00 PM|
I don't know, I enjoyed this subversion of expectations. Let's be real, we were all expecting the Americans to fawn over Wilde and his work. I thought showing him flopping humanised him.
|by Anonymous||reply 23||November 13, 2023 4:04 PM|
The whole episode seemed ridiculous. Buying into Booker T Washington's approach to things was unbelievable, we have Russells problems being too quickly resolved and Ava's sudden discovery of independence and libido---but Bloomingdale's would not have been where she shopped. The union guys were a bunch of stereotypes but Julian probably hasn't the slight notion of what they are really like. The clam chowder subplot really fell flat, even Baranski didn't seem invested in her character's wise cracks.
|by Anonymous||reply 24||November 13, 2023 4:27 PM|
I didn't think Ada's flirtation with the rector was about libido at all, she just has a sweet little crush on him and has decided to pursue it further. And why not, it's never too late.
The union guys intrigued me because we don't really get to see this sort of thing in period shows very often, if at all. Striking action is fine, but dying for it? Just goes to show that organised labour didn't have things fully figured out just yet back in the day.
|by Anonymous||reply 25||November 13, 2023 4:44 PM|
R24, but the Booker T. Washington philosophy was something a lot of middle and upper class educated African Americans embraced. And still do. The Black Middle Class certainly leaned that way. And the depiction of the arrogant capitalist, George Russell trying to break the union was very typical. I knew from the moment he told his man to bring the Union leader to NYC it would fail.
|by Anonymous||reply 26||November 13, 2023 5:26 PM|
Can't wait to watch tonight. Is Bertha going to try and land a duke for the Aardvark?
|by Anonymous||reply 27||November 13, 2023 5:27 PM|
R25, saying they're willing to die for it was no exaggeration, because their corporate adversaries were perfectly willing to kill. Henry Ford employed a small army of goons whowere aggressive in attempts to break the unions.
|by Anonymous||reply 28||November 13, 2023 5:29 PM|
I have not been a fan of the overly extravagant look of this series but I thought the union meeting was beautifully lit and designed and shot. It was nice for a change to see people dressed in real 1880s clothes and not the Disney-colored version. As a matter of fact, I was so taken with the look I stopped listening to what happened in the scene, so I can't argue with those saying it wasn't written well.
|by Anonymous||reply 29||November 13, 2023 5:40 PM|
R25: The stakes were high in these early days with paid goons like the Pinkertons etc. The dialogue and direction were kindof lacking. Julian probably does not do much looking at history. The union guy ate with his mothful, etc.--made to look vulgar compared with the Russells.
|by Anonymous||reply 30||November 13, 2023 5:47 PM|
Each one of the guys in the union meeting had some kind of speech impediment.....it was very distracting.
R22 I am sure you know that Oscar wasn't a Brit - he was Irish.
What was happening onstage in the episode was a Wilde play "Vera, or The Nihilists."
|by Anonymous||reply 31||November 13, 2023 5:49 PM|
R24 have read about Black history of the era? Do you understand that soon enough DuBois supplanted Washington?
|by Anonymous||reply 32||November 13, 2023 5:49 PM|
|by Anonymous||reply 33||November 13, 2023 5:51 PM|
Du Bois had a message that would have resonated with northern Blacks. There is something of a pathway from Washington to Garvey but Washington probably was more popular among white plutocrats than anyone else.
|by Anonymous||reply 34||November 13, 2023 6:04 PM|
I thought the minister showed undo interest in Agnes and was treating Ada as a friend who could get him closer to her sister. Did no one else see this?
|by Anonymous||reply 35||November 13, 2023 6:07 PM|
I was wondering that r31. I assumed there was an actual play, and I don't know enough about Oscar Wilde, but did he have an early, heavy-handed period of dull moralistic plays? Before discovering what he really was good at and willing to stop doing "acceptable" expected crap?
|by Anonymous||reply 36||November 13, 2023 6:08 PM|
It’s the Duke of Buckingham. As in Buckingham Palace. Perhaps you’ve heard of it?
|by Anonymous||reply 37||November 13, 2023 6:20 PM|
It’s not like he built the Palace or ever owned it…it passed to the Hanovers long before this shitshow came about.
|by Anonymous||reply 38||November 13, 2023 6:23 PM|
His ancestors built it. That’s what matters.
|by Anonymous||reply 39||November 13, 2023 6:26 PM|
I was interested in the Harry Richardson- Laura Benanti storyline in the trailer for episode 2.4. Looks like things will become a little too heated for Mrs. Blane. There was a bed scene between the two actors, ostensibly nude together. I had to wind back and freeze frame to see if the glimpse of flesh I saw was Richardson’s back/ass. Alas, it was Benanti’s bare leg outside the bed clothes, resting on Harry’s hip. I’ll bet his ass was hairy and they thought the fraus in the audience would be disgusted so they put Laura’s leg where Harry’s bare ass should have been.
I also thought the scene between Audra McDonald and Denée Benton was terrific. The problem with racially diversifying period dramas can be that you overlook the very real prejudices and persecutions of the time. Peggy Scott’s cosiness in the VanRihjn/Brook household is arguably anachronistic, so it’s valuable to hear some home truths being expressed with vehemence and emotion. I think McDonald can expect an Emmy nomination.
|by Anonymous||reply 40||November 13, 2023 6:57 PM|
R39 my ancestors built Stonehenge—see how dumb you sound?
|by Anonymous||reply 41||November 13, 2023 7:20 PM|
Not really. Doesn’t help that you’re lying.
|by Anonymous||reply 42||November 13, 2023 7:33 PM|
Audra always expects a nomination.
|by Anonymous||reply 43||November 13, 2023 7:34 PM|
[quote] The problem with racially diversifying period dramas can be that you overlook the very real prejudices and persecutions of the time.
True. The thing with Armstrong is she'd be much more the norm than some odd exception in the household. Most of the servants would resent this black woman eating with them. But in a show like this, you need to pretend that good people were basically tolerant and only a few bad people were racist. It would be more like pretty much everybody was racist and a few exceptional people wouldn't be.
|by Anonymous||reply 44||November 13, 2023 7:48 PM|
This was post Civil War Reconstruction period too, and many Northerners who were in in the educated upper classes might be open to employing a Black secretary. The other thing we must be aware of is that not all the servants downstairs were literate. The resentment wasn't just race as much as it was dealing with an educated Black person.
|by Anonymous||reply 45||November 13, 2023 8:10 PM|
I'm finding it very hard to come to terms with an aristocratic woman who is horrified by water coloring, embroidering in the parlor and New England clam chowder at lunch hiring a young black woman she doesn't even know as her social secretary.
Maybe that's just me.
|by Anonymous||reply 46||November 13, 2023 8:40 PM|
Where was the alarm clock ⏰ plot?
|by Anonymous||reply 47||November 13, 2023 9:20 PM|
What year are they in? The Duke of Buckingham died in 1889.
|by Anonymous||reply 48||November 13, 2023 9:34 PM|
|by Anonymous||reply 49||November 13, 2023 9:35 PM|
|by Anonymous||reply 50||November 13, 2023 9:38 PM|
Yes, R44, it reminds me of Carson in Downton. He was portrayed as old-fashioned and out-of-step for being homophobic and anti-Semitic... in a show set in the 1910s-20s. It was ridiculous.
|by Anonymous||reply 51||November 13, 2023 9:50 PM|
If they don’t put THE GOOD FIGHT fierce twosome of Christine Baranski and Audra McDonald in a scene together this season, I will be so upset.
|by Anonymous||reply 52||November 13, 2023 10:01 PM|
I doubt very much these characters would have gone all the way downtown to see an unknown play by the still unknown Oscar Wilde
|by Anonymous||reply 53||November 13, 2023 10:05 PM|
[quote]I have not been a fan of the overly extravagant look of this series
While I agree this series looks "overly extravagant," it renders exceptionally beautiful on my big-screen TV. I wonder what the budget was for sets and costumes? The location they used for the Newport Casino tennis match was breathtaking.
It looks indeed like the Gilded Age.
|by Anonymous||reply 54||November 13, 2023 10:31 PM|
That location WAS the Newport Casino.
|by Anonymous||reply 55||November 13, 2023 10:35 PM|
Why do they call it a casino? It's just a country club, no?
|by Anonymous||reply 56||November 14, 2023 12:14 AM|
R56 is in 5th grade—he thinks the word casino must mean a gambling establishment. He’s too dumb to understand the concept of a social club.
I pity the fool.
|by Anonymous||reply 57||November 14, 2023 12:17 AM|
WHY do all the Womens' dresses in this Series, look like Upholstery from the DRAPES????
|by Anonymous||reply 58||November 14, 2023 12:52 AM|
That lady maid Trollope is gonna get BURNED
|by Anonymous||reply 59||November 14, 2023 12:54 AM|
Morgan Spector has lost all of his sex appeal this season.
And why are they styling Carrie Coon's hair (wig) like Wilma Flintstone?
|by Anonymous||reply 60||November 14, 2023 1:00 AM|
[quote] The last scene in the episode was Ada and the boring Rector looking at watercolor paintings? Really?
What did you want? A race riot? Chariot races up and down fifth avenue? You realize this isn’t a marvelverse epic?
|by Anonymous||reply 61||November 14, 2023 1:00 AM|
R61, Alarm Clock Jack in Spandex!
|by Anonymous||reply 62||November 14, 2023 1:01 AM|
[quote] Just goes to show that organised labour didn't have things fully figured out just yet back in the day. Just goes to show that organised labour didn't have things fully figured out just yet back in the day.
Ohm, they did, but the stakes were higher. Twelve hour days? No workman’s comp? Striking back then regularly meant Striking the plant, like burning it to the ground. Destroying it. They were inevitably violent back then.
|by Anonymous||reply 63||November 14, 2023 1:06 AM|
[quote] am sure you know that Oscar wasn't a Brit - he was Irish.
Anglo-irish I believe
|by Anonymous||reply 64||November 14, 2023 1:09 AM|
Anglo-Irish…I know for a fact…he’d cut you down for calling him a Brit.
|by Anonymous||reply 65||November 14, 2023 1:16 AM|
It wasn't so much the actor's mediocre performance but I really would have expected a series like this to have a big name Broadway actor playing Oscar Wilde. Was Harvey Fierstein really not available, lol?
|by Anonymous||reply 66||November 14, 2023 1:48 AM|
^ now THAT’s Stupid
|by Anonymous||reply 67||November 14, 2023 1:49 AM|
R66, Oscar was still in his 20s at the time, Harvey is ancient
|by Anonymous||reply 68||November 14, 2023 1:57 AM|
Brooks Ashmanskas as Oscar Wilde!
|by Anonymous||reply 69||November 14, 2023 1:58 AM|
Well r58, the women saw the dresses in the window and just had to have them
|by Anonymous||reply 70||November 14, 2023 2:41 AM|
This show just sits there, liked a soiled sofa.
|by Anonymous||reply 71||November 14, 2023 3:05 AM|
I hated the Oscar Wilde casting. Oscar Wilde was very tall and less hideous than the creature they cast.
|by Anonymous||reply 72||November 14, 2023 3:13 AM|
Stunt casting, troye sylvan as Oscar wilde!
|by Anonymous||reply 73||November 14, 2023 3:19 AM|
NOT MISS ELLEN'S PORTIERES, r70!!!
|by Anonymous||reply 74||November 14, 2023 3:31 AM|
I actually very much enjoyed this episode. Louisa Jacobson wasn't flapping her arms around with every line, Cynthia Nixon seems much more than a dull normal, and the story moved forward a bit. I could do without the Turner drama but I'm hoping Bertha (my favorite) will railroad her back where she belongs.
|by Anonymous||reply 75||November 14, 2023 3:57 AM|
Funny that we haven't yet met Turner's rich old husband played by Broadway fave Dakin Matthews. The discrepancy in their ages alone is quite dramatic so I don't know what they're waiting for. They need all the drama they can find.
|by Anonymous||reply 76||November 14, 2023 4:01 AM|
Carrie Coon is actually growing on me. I feel like I understand her choices as an actor the season, I can’t really say that was the case last season. I love this show.
|by Anonymous||reply 77||November 14, 2023 4:55 AM|
I think Turner's reasoning is flawed. If she thinks she can blackmail Bertha she is only going to expose herself. She'll fling an accusation about George Russell which he will deny and Bertha will back him, and Turner will simply expose her own role in the accusation. Here she is married to a man with more money than God and she is going to tell the world she was a lady's made who got fired so she accuses the man of the house of improprieties? No way those society matrons will receive that information in good grace. She will instantly become a pariah, and her husb and may see their marriage as a critical lapse in judgement easily corrected by a divorce with a reasonable cash settlement.
|by Anonymous||reply 78||November 14, 2023 5:01 AM|
[quote]Denee Benton's dresses and matching hats are far too lavish and extravagant for a young woman who works as a secretary and free lance reporter.
I thought the same thing when she visited the newspaper office in a shimmering silk ensemble. How she could afford such a garment aside, she’d know it was likely to get ink all over it there.
Her parents aren’t poor, though. And she gets a salary. Maybe she REALLY knows how to sew and whipped it up herself one weekend.
|by Anonymous||reply 79||November 14, 2023 7:43 AM|
Benanti and Larry are like newlyweds, their scenes together make me uncomfortable. She gives off this sex freak energy and he's too young to be exposed to that sort of thing. Bertha better come in like a wrecking ball soon and save poor Larry from that insatiable cougar.
|by Anonymous||reply 80||November 14, 2023 9:22 AM|
R79, ha! I love these conjectures.
|by Anonymous||reply 81||November 14, 2023 12:48 PM|
R80, I’d eat him up with a spoon
|by Anonymous||reply 82||November 14, 2023 12:48 PM|
In the preview for next week somebody said: "....the money is all gone....." or something like that.
I couldn't tell who it was. Who done lost all their money?
|by Anonymous||reply 83||November 14, 2023 2:35 PM|
Perhaps that Stuyvesant marriage prospect Agnes has in mind for Larry?
|by Anonymous||reply 84||November 14, 2023 2:52 PM|
|by Anonymous||reply 85||November 14, 2023 2:52 PM|
that would be a shame
|by Anonymous||reply 86||November 14, 2023 2:56 PM|
r83, that is the president of the metropolitan opera company. Bertha is going to have to put her money where her mouth is and bail them out
|by Anonymous||reply 87||November 14, 2023 2:59 PM|
No R57 I'm not but where I'm from we call them country clubs and casinos are gambling establishments. Maybe the casino thing is an East Coast thing.
|by Anonymous||reply 88||November 14, 2023 3:01 PM|
[quote] I couldn't tell who it was. Who done lost all their money?
I don't know, but there is this little depression around this time that I'm pretty sure they are going to get into.
|by Anonymous||reply 89||November 14, 2023 3:14 PM|
Casino, like bungalow, is a word whose meaning has changed over the decades.
|by Anonymous||reply 90||November 14, 2023 3:26 PM|
[quote]I'm not but where I'm from we call them country clubs and casinos are gambling establishments.
did you call them that in the late 19th century?
|by Anonymous||reply 91||November 14, 2023 3:37 PM|
Coon has at least deviated from a flat delivery of her lines. There still isn't much going on behind the eyes though. Her scenes with Turner were the best, so hopefully they don't jettison the former maid too soon.
|by Anonymous||reply 92||November 14, 2023 3:40 PM|
No chemistry with the husband, even when angry.
|by Anonymous||reply 93||November 14, 2023 3:47 PM|
Bertha is a cipher IMO.
|by Anonymous||reply 94||November 14, 2023 3:57 PM|
I don't know how long Miss Turner can keep this little secret of hers. Those servants are going to gossip like crazy with other servants. This whole thing is just too juicy. And despite the show's attempt to make her a kind of inspiration, like if she can do it, so can we, I think a lot would be really pissed that this bitch maid is now pretending to be some grand lady and they're supposed to wait on her.
And ladies' maids tell ladies. There will be a lot of tittering in drawing rooms this season.
|by Anonymous||reply 95||November 14, 2023 3:58 PM|
I swear I can't tell the belowstairs staff of the two different households apart.
|by Anonymous||reply 96||November 14, 2023 4:01 PM|
Yeah, it's hard, r96, and they should probably be really distinctive. The servants proud to work for an Old New York Family versus the servants willing to work for the upstarts, maybe even like working for the richer family that seems to do more with their lives. Servants are famously as snobbish as masters, sometimes even more so.
They kind of get into it with the Cunting Butlers, but I think in general there would be this weird rivalry and this kind of sense of who has standards and who doesn't, and who is looking to the future and who is stuck in the stale past.
|by Anonymous||reply 97||November 14, 2023 6:04 PM|
Now if I were George and Bertha, I would very discreetly approach Turner's husband through a third party to suggest that he address the problem. Tell the wealthy society husband that his new wife has threatened a prominent person with a public scandal which will be embarrassing for Him, and he needs to address it discreetly. All they have to do is tell the truth. She attempted to ensnare Mr. Russell in compromising behavior, he rejected her, and she was terminated. She has harbored a desire for revenge ever since and it is embarrassing. So the Russells are very reluctantly and privately turing to him, hoping to avoid the public shame it will bring to him and his new wife.
|by Anonymous||reply 98||November 14, 2023 6:19 PM|
For the life of me I can't comprehend what Turner gains by exposing the fact that she was once a ladies maid even if the boss made a play for her.
|by Anonymous||reply 99||November 14, 2023 7:03 PM|
Exactly, R99. And it will reflect poorly on her new husband who is reputed to have more money that anyone else. I cannot understand how she would risk his reaction. But I do believe the Russells need to act quickly to counter any measures she may have been considering. For all we know she told an inventive version of the story to her husband who feels pity. But I bet the risks of being treated as a pariah and embarrassing him will carry more weight.
|by Anonymous||reply 100||November 14, 2023 7:39 PM|
The whole thing makes no sense. Turner is threatening Bertha so Bertha will keep Turner’s “secret,” but as those above pointed out it’s no secret and inevitably everyone will know within a very brief time.
|by Anonymous||reply 101||November 14, 2023 8:11 PM|
Such bad plotting!
|by Anonymous||reply 102||November 14, 2023 9:18 PM|
Yes. Bad plotting. Turner would NEVER be invited to the Russells, ever. Opera boxes be damned.
|by Anonymous||reply 103||November 14, 2023 10:25 PM|
Rich old guy isn't going to care what some upstarts say. Based on age alone, the marriage probably already was a scandal.
|by Anonymous||reply 104||November 14, 2023 10:51 PM|
He’ll die in the next episode
|by Anonymous||reply 105||November 15, 2023 4:03 AM|
Tactically, Bertha can't be the one to make the first accusation publicly. It has to come from Turner, who will be regarded as behaving badly. A kind of shoot the messenger situation. Then Bertha can expose her as a lady's maid who was fired for behaving badly.
|by Anonymous||reply 106||November 15, 2023 4:27 AM|
I think bald father is going to have a rousing time in San Francisco. I know I'd give him a 19th century rowdy time with him.
|by Anonymous||reply 107||November 15, 2023 4:41 AM|
Alarm Clock Jack had all the pieces spread out on the table. I can’t wait for the assembly!
|by Anonymous||reply 108||November 15, 2023 9:07 AM|
That clock is making me horny.
|by Anonymous||reply 109||November 15, 2023 9:38 AM|
Is that rector Ada has her eyes on Catholic, or what denomination do she and her sister belong to, has that been mentioned? I noticed all the rich people were at the same church for Easter; would it be considered weird at the time if some of them were, say, Presbyterian instead? I listened to a podcasts about the Methodists last week and I assume that was more of a working folk kind of thing, unlike today (see: Hillary).
I guess what I'm asking is, were you expected to belong to a particular denomination if you were loaded back then?
|by Anonymous||reply 110||November 15, 2023 11:27 AM|
I'm enjoying this more than the last season so far. Yes, it's become more soapy, but it's also become more fun.
|by Anonymous||reply 111||November 15, 2023 12:12 PM|
R110. He is not Catholic; Agnes made a comment about him being in a church where the clergy could marry. May have been Episcopalian but I honestly don’t remember.
|by Anonymous||reply 112||November 15, 2023 12:23 PM|
Yea like an old NY Dutch family would ever be Catholic😳
|by Anonymous||reply 113||November 15, 2023 12:33 PM|
r112 Ah, thanks. Completely missed out the Episcopalians as a possibility.
|by Anonymous||reply 114||November 15, 2023 12:34 PM|
r113 Forgot about their roots even though their Dutch last name is mentioned in every episode, my bad.
|by Anonymous||reply 115||November 15, 2023 12:37 PM|
Guess you missed Agnes' line to the rector about his parents, "And when did they escape the clutches of the vicar of Rome?"
|by Anonymous||reply 116||November 15, 2023 12:39 PM|
Thrilled to see the green carnation in Wilde’s buttonhole; which was a historically accurate signifier for gay men.
|by Anonymous||reply 117||November 15, 2023 1:24 PM|
For the young’uns
|by Anonymous||reply 118||November 15, 2023 1:27 PM|
He's wearing fancy dress and the church looks Catholic=Episcopalian
Presbyterian would have been arriveste---Scots-Irish mostly, later they absorbed some of the Dutch Calvinists; in those days they were stiff people who weren't allowed to have fun on Sunday; Presbyterian shopkeepers would cover their display windows on the "Lord's Day". Andrew Carnegie was a Presbyterian---the Church made all kinds of excuses for his horrible behavior.
Methodists would have been down a rung from the Presbyterians. John D Rockefeller was a Baptist and gave a great deal to Baptist causes.
|by Anonymous||reply 119||November 15, 2023 1:52 PM|
[quote]Is that rector Ada has her eyes on Catholic, or what denomination do she and her sister belong to, has that been mentioned?
Espicopalian. NO members of society would be anything BUT. the pastor mentions that his father was Catholic but that he died and his Episcopalian mother had a stronger will
|by Anonymous||reply 120||November 15, 2023 2:00 PM|
[quote]Agnes made a comment about him being in a church where the clergy could marry. May have been Episcopalian but I honestly don’t remember.
not only that she posits the period-apropos barb of, "when were you released from the clutches of the vicar of rome?"
|by Anonymous||reply 121||November 15, 2023 2:01 PM|
Can we please just count on the end of the Cerveris butler character story line once he moves to San Francisco?
The butler was clearly not going to expose his past - why would he? (and what was so scandalous about his past, anyway, other than his legitimate bankruptcy) so what was all the fuss about and why did his daughter's husband feel the need to move the poor fellow cross country? Maybe in Victorian England this would have been viewed as an issue to be dealt with but, surely, not in little old New York where society women like Agnes van Rijn are employing Black social secretaries. They all know about the Russells' working class background yet ultimately came around and support them.
But the biggest gaffe is not giving us any really intriguing details about the bald butler and his daughter's relationship, going back to S1. Why should we care about their characters or their insipid story line?
|by Anonymous||reply 122||November 15, 2023 3:12 PM|
He’s a valet.
|by Anonymous||reply 123||November 15, 2023 3:16 PM|
Oh, right, valet. I should have remembered all of those exciting scenes in which he's sitting at the servants' dining table polishing shoes and not silverware.
|by Anonymous||reply 124||November 15, 2023 3:21 PM|
If people found out that her father had become a servant, in a new money household no less, they would be laughed out of society. Bald butler would be a fool not to take the offer.
|by Anonymous||reply 125||November 15, 2023 3:27 PM|
If he takes the offer, he’s off the show.
|by Anonymous||reply 126||November 15, 2023 3:33 PM|
Maybe the whole point of the bald valet's story is to demonstrate how it's viewed. Maybe they're "setting the table" for the Turner expose'.
|by Anonymous||reply 127||November 15, 2023 3:36 PM|
they will make a spin-off "I Left my heart in San fransisco" the sordid tale of handsome kept bald gentleman and his other gentleman callers
|by Anonymous||reply 128||November 15, 2023 3:38 PM|
Why is John so hung up on Oscar? He's way out of his league.
|by Anonymous||reply 129||November 15, 2023 3:54 PM|
Who's out of whose league? I can see why some don't want homosexuality taught in schools, sentences like those are so confusing. Imagine the poor kiddies trying to parse that out.
|by Anonymous||reply 130||November 15, 2023 4:01 PM|
Have you had a good look at John Adam’s nose? The bridge is flat and smashed-in.
|by Anonymous||reply 131||November 15, 2023 4:16 PM|
R114. There’s a really beautiful Episcopal church on Fifth Avenue, St. Thomas. It would only be a few blocks away from where Agnes, Ava and the Russells live so that may have been the big church for the real life Gilded Age folk. I want to say it’s on Fifth Ave at 53rd Street if I remember correctly.
|by Anonymous||reply 132||November 15, 2023 4:24 PM|
I meant John is way out of Oscar's league, R130. Sorry, should have made that clearer.
|by Anonymous||reply 133||November 15, 2023 4:38 PM|
That dress Bertha has on in OP's pic is ugly. Her clothes are usually stunning. Definitely an ugly couch fabric.
|by Anonymous||reply 134||November 15, 2023 4:41 PM|
R 132: I’ve read that the church they go to is meant to be St. Thomas’ on Fifth Avenue.
|by Anonymous||reply 135||November 15, 2023 7:14 PM|
The Dutch in early New York at least were mainly Dutch Reformed but that seems to have waned with the takeover by the English.
|by Anonymous||reply 136||November 15, 2023 7:39 PM|
When was The Dakota built on the other side of Central Park? That could be a fun episode, dealing with its original inhabitants.
|by Anonymous||reply 137||November 15, 2023 7:46 PM|
[quote] I want to say it’s on Fifth Ave at 53rd Street if I remember correctly.
that is correct
|by Anonymous||reply 138||November 15, 2023 8:25 PM|
the Dakota was indeed being built during this series, between 1880 and 1884
|by Anonymous||reply 139||November 15, 2023 8:26 PM|
Tasteful Friends, here is a Gilded Age townhouse for sale for $55 million
|by Anonymous||reply 140||November 17, 2023 7:18 PM|
Wow, that's beautiful. I wish I had a sugar daddy to buy it for me
|by Anonymous||reply 141||November 17, 2023 7:34 PM|
lovely to see
|by Anonymous||reply 142||November 17, 2023 7:36 PM|
[quote]That dress Bertha has on in OP's pic is ugly.
It's fucking hideous! I don't even watch this show but every time I scroll past this thread, I'm traumatized all over again.
|by Anonymous||reply 143||November 17, 2023 8:35 PM|
Fucking block the images, asshole
|by Anonymous||reply 144||November 18, 2023 1:54 AM|
How did the ladies of the Gilded Age manage to sit down in those dresses? The bustles made them look like centaurides.
|by Anonymous||reply 145||November 18, 2023 2:19 AM|
You made me wonder r145. Apparently there is a method to it.
|by Anonymous||reply 146||November 18, 2023 2:26 AM|
They also made collapsible ones:
|by Anonymous||reply 147||November 18, 2023 2:27 AM|
shoot, think I messed up the copy and paste
|by Anonymous||reply 148||November 18, 2023 2:30 AM|
Thanks, R146 and R147. I can't understand why anyone thought that was a good fashion choice. Kim Kardashian would have fit in surprisingly well in that era.
|by Anonymous||reply 149||November 18, 2023 1:43 PM|
r148, I seem to recall that the bustle fashion came from when the Hottentot Venus was popular in England, and the fascination with her backside. Ah yes, here is an article"
|by Anonymous||reply 150||November 18, 2023 1:54 PM|
Fashion throughout history often evolved from practical reasons. The bustle began as the logical result of the ever increasing crinolines and hoop skirts of the 1860s when all of that skirt fabric became so voluminous that swagging it back became the natural impulse.
|by Anonymous||reply 151||November 18, 2023 2:05 PM|
Cultural appropriation, r150. The bloody cheek of it!
|by Anonymous||reply 152||November 18, 2023 8:47 PM|
I somewhat appreciate the sheer audacity of throwing in an Oscar Wilde cameo.
|by Anonymous||reply 153||November 19, 2023 3:00 AM|
He did visit around then and even stayed in Long Beach, NY.
|by Anonymous||reply 154||November 19, 2023 12:02 PM|
I hope we see some homosex tonight.
|by Anonymous||reply 155||November 19, 2023 4:31 PM|
But preferably with some new homosexual characters....
|by Anonymous||reply 156||November 19, 2023 9:06 PM|
Beware the Bertharaptor... she will cut a bustle.
|by Anonymous||reply 157||November 19, 2023 10:17 PM|
|by Anonymous||reply 158||November 19, 2023 11:02 PM|
First clock reference of the night!
|by Anonymous||reply 159||November 20, 2023 2:09 AM|
Bertha called Mrs. Blane a Caneface!
|by Anonymous||reply 160||November 20, 2023 2:56 AM|
OMG is Turner pissed!!!!!!
|by Anonymous||reply 161||November 20, 2023 3:01 AM|
Considering he's a billionaire, Turner's husband was certainly lax in researching his new wife's background.
|by Anonymous||reply 162||November 20, 2023 3:16 AM|
Someone please start a new thread for tonight’s new episode, using proper DL protocol.
|by Anonymous||reply 163||November 20, 2023 3:33 AM|
Is there a new thread? Because a lot happened and it must be discussed! We have to talk about Ada and Agnes. And OMG Bertha has a "talk" with Mrs. Blane! And Ms. Scott's Publisher is falling for her..... and Marian and Cousin Dashiell and his annoying daughter, and I could not believe Turner's husband had no idea of his wife, but since the warning came from Mrs. Astor I don't think Bertha instigated it. I think it may have come from a disgruntled servant. That's my guess. IS Oscar going to get scammed? So much happened. I betcha that guy who told the Valet to leave town and get a pension, was lying. I bet his wife doesn't know he is trying to intimidate her father. Some shit is going to go down. We need a thread!
|by Anonymous||reply 164||November 20, 2023 4:38 AM|
Alarm Clock Jack is still clothed, alas.
|by Anonymous||reply 165||November 20, 2023 4:43 AM|
There’s cum in the Duke’s soup!
|by Anonymous||reply 166||November 20, 2023 4:52 AM|
I'm so glad they found time for slave talk.
|by Anonymous||reply 167||November 20, 2023 5:05 AM|
Aunt Agnes needs some hard kicks to the cunt bone.
|by Anonymous||reply 168||November 20, 2023 5:12 AM|
I think it's time for Agnes to engage in some self-reflection. Her lack of self awareness is coming back to bite her in the ass.
|by Anonymous||reply 169||November 20, 2023 5:34 AM|
Hunny it seems the world is starting to close in on Turner. But I'd sure like to know how Mrs. Astor found out...and talk about balls! Mrs. Astor does not play. The decision was a board decision by Academy members? Bertha certainly wouldn't want Turner's misbehavior with George to come out. She was hoping to get Turner's husband's money for the Met.
|by Anonymous||reply 170||November 20, 2023 5:38 AM|
Damn, Bertha took the cougar OUT.
|by Anonymous||reply 171||November 20, 2023 12:02 PM|
|by Anonymous||reply 172||November 20, 2023 12:30 PM|
I disagree that Bertha would greatly fear the Turner and George story. Turner now has far more to lose if the George story gets out. Because she's been outed as a maid and that would out her as a slutty maid.
My theory is this... old moneybags dies of an apoplectic heart attack when he finds out Turner's been handwashing Bertha's dainties... left with bags of money and a future as shunned Mrs. Chamberlain, Oscar sees a chance and elopes with her... allowing Uncle Julian to tell the Harry Lehr story. Oscar and Turner are locked in a squabbling marriage with comedic value. Sort of the Thenadiers in Les Mis, but with better clothes.
|by Anonymous||reply 173||November 20, 2023 1:17 PM|
|by Anonymous||reply 174||November 20, 2023 1:22 PM|
How about this as format... it can then run to 600 posts without relying on the notoriously reliable search function. The episode by episode approach was a little confusing and the show isn't generating a ton of comment here. Use it, don't use it, but here's an option.
|by Anonymous||reply 175||November 20, 2023 1:27 PM|
^ Shit... stinky linky.... trying again.
|by Anonymous||reply 176||November 20, 2023 1:28 PM|
^ That one works.
|by Anonymous||reply 177||November 20, 2023 1:28 PM|
R173. Love it. Turner and Oscar would make a delicious couple.
|by Anonymous||reply 178||November 20, 2023 2:05 PM|
I am absolutely LOVING the armpit bush Mr. Russell is showing in episode 4. The directors and cinematographer know what they're doing.
|by Anonymous||reply 179||November 20, 2023 2:34 PM|
I must have missed how Turner's story was leaked. I'm assuming Bertha did it but how? That nosy reporter who was asking her about her son and the cougar?
I'm going to guess that Agnes is going to sabotage Ada's chance for romance.
|by Anonymous||reply 180||November 20, 2023 2:37 PM|
Bigger question is how Turner's background could ever have remained hidden.
She was the ladies maid (just last year!) of the wealthiest, most prominent publicity whore on 5th Ave. and, as such, her duties would have involved accompanying her mistress to dress and millinery fittings at all the best salons and shops, as well as all sorts of duties that would have put her in contact with quite a range of society, including the household servants of every other prominent house.
And then, how did she meet and seduce her new sugar daddy? That sort of marriage arrangement doesn't happen without a lot of exposure and stepping on all sorts of toes.
It's not like she was confined in some attic. Her past could have been exposed by any number of resentful people.
|by Anonymous||reply 181||November 20, 2023 3:15 PM|
Why did Agnes say "lamp receipt" instead of "lamb recipe"?
Cackled at Bertha busting out her best tiara and just her best jewellery in general for that dinner with the Duke. Bitch looked like an actual queen.
We got to see Larry's beautiful hairy chest! Hopefully Benanti is out of the picture for good.
The ending was so deliciously dramatic, I loved the pink marble staircase. Funny she called Bertha a witch because I swear she herself looked like Elphaba incarnate in that scene.
|by Anonymous||reply 182||November 20, 2023 3:51 PM|
The constantly churning music is a bit much, on top of the wooden acting. Jesus PETE!
|by Anonymous||reply 183||November 20, 2023 3:54 PM|
*Sorry, I meant "lamb receipt" instead of "lamb recipe".
|by Anonymous||reply 184||November 20, 2023 3:59 PM|
Does Agnes ever leave the house other than for church?
I want more Bertha vs Agnes scenes.
|by Anonymous||reply 185||November 20, 2023 4:01 PM|
Psst! We’re no longer discussing episode 3.
|by Anonymous||reply 186||November 20, 2023 4:13 PM|
Recipes used to be referred to as receipts. Mrs. Patmore used the term in DA and I have a cookbook that is full of adapted recipes with the original "receipt" printed too.
|by Anonymous||reply 187||November 20, 2023 7:15 PM|
The use of "receipts" for "recipes" in the context of this silly series just sounds like Julian showing off. Better he should put his pen to better plotting.
|by Anonymous||reply 188||November 20, 2023 10:23 PM|
I’m still scratching my head as to why Fellows haven’t had THE GOOD FIGHT terrific twosome of Cynthia Baranski and Audra McDonald in a scene or two together by now.
|by Anonymous||reply 189||November 20, 2023 10:42 PM|
Julian has probably never see THE GOOD FIGHT and he clearly isn't listening to anyone about anything.
|by Anonymous||reply 190||November 20, 2023 10:45 PM|
You're probably right r190. He should've been cramming Edith Wharton nonstop during that endless hiatus, maybe Henry James as well, but I suspect he wasn't.
|by Anonymous||reply 191||November 20, 2023 10:53 PM|
^It is evident.
|by Anonymous||reply 192||November 21, 2023 12:37 AM|
Baxter or what ever the upstart lady’s maid is name and Oscar make a great pair
|by Anonymous||reply 193||November 21, 2023 2:02 AM|
I honestly enjoy the Tuskegee story line. I just feel it deserves a full episode of its own, contrasting it with the Duke of Marlborough or whomever makes it feel trivial
|by Anonymous||reply 194||November 21, 2023 2:11 AM|
Dear Ada deserves a wedding
|by Anonymous||reply 195||November 21, 2023 2:28 AM|
Have we discussed the dwarf daughter of Cousin Dashiell? I hope she’ll turn out to be one of those undersized women from a Baltic state passing for a tween while actually being 34. It will be revealed that she killed Dashiell’s wife and is just using Marian as a cover story.
Agnes will definitely kaibosh Ada’s love affair. Her need of someone to control and grind under will be too great. And Ada is too much of a pussy to resist. Maybe the teary priest will die suddenly, leaving Ada his estate and some measure of independence.
|by Anonymous||reply 196||November 22, 2023 3:23 PM|
Ada is a pussy hound
|by Anonymous||reply 197||November 22, 2023 7:57 PM|
And have we talked about. . . . ENID?
|by Anonymous||reply 198||November 22, 2023 7:57 PM|
OK. So far we have the Pastor is a Grifter. Secondly, The Pastor is secretly dying. What are some other options? Maybe the PAstor is using someone else's identity and he is a married man with a tawdry past. Maybe he murdered the real Pastor. I will say this. In that era, at that high society church it is rather startling to me that they would have an Eyetalian Pastor instead of a WASP. He seems a bit too exotic for that crowd. And he seems to know a great deal about that artist. I think it's a CLUE.
|by Anonymous||reply 199||November 22, 2023 11:17 PM|
Pastor was formerly the talk of the town on the DL
|by Anonymous||reply 200||November 22, 2023 11:20 PM|
r199, all of your guesses are far more interesting than what we'll get.
|by Anonymous||reply 201||November 23, 2023 1:44 AM|
I could have sworn Jeanne Tripplehorn was on this show.
|by Anonymous||reply 202||November 23, 2023 1:57 AM|
^^ Not this season.
|by Anonymous||reply 203||November 23, 2023 2:07 AM|
The pastor is Agnes in disguise. She's well and truly committed to trolling Ada.
|by Anonymous||reply 204||November 23, 2023 2:48 AM|
Pastor? Tony Pastor? I think he's dreamy!
|by Anonymous||reply 205||November 23, 2023 1:49 PM|
that's it, what this series about NYC needs is a nice jewess like Barbra to crank it up a notch!
|by Anonymous||reply 206||November 23, 2023 2:49 PM|
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