Have you ever been to Australia or New Zealand or both?

Brit-derivatives in the sun. It never really appealed to me, too far away.

I've been to Australia. I didn't enjoy it. In no particular order, it's jarring to go to the beach and see beware of snakes signs. To my surprise they have (or at the time had) some really wonky rules around who could retail what etc. and at what hours. My overall impression was of a place that for it bangs on about breaking away from Mother England, is actually more English than the mothership. I was there because we had an Australian division. The whole time I found them whiny and passive aggressive. That matey humour is just meant to camouflage the endless complaints about everything. An insular nation of whiners and wankers.

[quote] The whole time I found them whiny and passive aggressive. That matey humour is just meant to camouflage the endless complaints about everything. An insular nation of whiners and wankers.

Sounds very similar to American MAGATS.

No, MAGATS have more unvarnished malice. Australians at least try to fake it.

They are both beautiful OP. Don't try to visit both at the same time. Australia is just too big, and New Zealand is just too beautiful to be tacked on to the end. Please come with an open mind. I'm sure the above posters have never been to a country that they couldn't judge harshly.

Well, that's very open minded of you, R5.

For what's it's worth, Italy is the country I most recently loved wholly. Greece the year before. So your certainty, like your ability to bulletproof, is misplaced.

Very very racist. The wealthy apartheid families from South Africa all fled there and they fit in just fine.

Yes both OP. I was born/raised in New Zealand and have lived in Australia since I was 18. Happy to answer any questions.

[quote] are there as many evil bigots in Australia as in the US?

An emphatic YES!

Australians love to be racist. They enjoy it. Casual racism is a thing in Australia. These people have nobody to hold them accountable. It's a white world. I would sooner move to the Gaza strip right now before I move to Australia

My boyfriend is Australian. He's tall and hot.

Sydney/Melbourne for 2 weeks in February. I had fun. It was cheap, tons of good cheap Asian food. Both cities have a strong beach-town vibe to them. Takes forever to fly there from the US, but once you're there it's quite easy to get around. Both cities are quite gay-friendly.

Lived in both. The Kiwis are nicer if a bit dim. Australia has better weather and food. Neither worth the long trip, considering you can find anything they both have in North America and Europe.

If you’re going to waste your time flying down there, rather do Bora Bora.

I visited Australia ten years ago and was surprised by the large number of Asian-Australians, but pleased to see no sign of any racism toward anyone. Using frequent flyer miles for business class is a good way to travel there. I remember that grocery prices were high, but accommodations were reasonable.

I took a cruise that started in Sydney and ended in Auckland. Arrived a few days ahead of sailing so that we could spend time in Sydney. All of the cruise ports of call were in New Zealand, so I felt like we got to see most of both islands. I would go back to both to explore more. But I would probably give priority to Australia since I don't feel like we really got enough time there.

Don't let the cute accent fool you.

Australia is one of the most racist places I've ever been. I've spent many months there in both Sydney and Melbourne for work.

One of the worst experiences of my life.

R8 why do most New Zealanders leave there?

People always hear about how beautiful New Zealand is, but the people who are actually from there, can't seem to run away fast enough!

And when I asked them about it, they give vague answers, but nothing concrete.

So I'll ask you. Why do most New Zealanders want to get the hell out of there?

I'd move to NZ if they'd let me in but their cash reserve requirements are too high (for me) if you are a retiree.

I thought it was great when I visited in the mid-'80s.

[quote] I'd move to NZ if they'd let me in but their cash reserve requirements are too high (for me) if you are a retiree.

Plus, they have to let in all the Chinese people first, so that they can drive up NZ real estate prices.

Westerners aren't welcome.

You all speak of racism but won’t go into detail.

I’m black and visited Australia back in 2016. It was one of the few times I did have a racist experience. I was walking in Bondi beach when an Aussie said, “Nice tan” in the most snide, passive aggressive, manner. His face and sneer said it all.

But that’s the worst I experienced. Wasn’t the end of the world after being the US, I could handle some Aussie racism. Also, for stares on the bus. But holy hell, and Aborigine looking man got on the bus and the stares would stop for that poor man.

So there is certainly more outward racism there the. I’ve seen in other places.

I also hooked up with an Aussie visiting the states. See was fine but the pillow talk was frightening. He had such backwards views of African Americans. All based on what he saw on TV. He was trying to tell my back ass about black people in America. I kicked his ass out of my house with the quickness. That cunt!

The good:

I had a great time in Australia. Partied, fucked (Sydney boys could get enough) and enjoyed the scenery. Would I go back? In a heartbeat! Other counties probably say the same shit as the Aussies but in another language so I’ll never know.

I don’t let passive racism to stop me from having fun. Aussies are a lot of fun in the snack. I had one of my most memorable dates of my life the first day in Sydney. Buffed 6’3 power bottom took me on a date overlooking the Opera House and harbor. Great conversation, great sex, great food. Was a magical night.

Op, I hope you enjoy your trips!!!!!

You all speak of racism but won’t go into detail.

I’m black and visited Australia back in 2016. It was one of the few times I did have a racist experience. I was walking in Bondi beach when an Aussie said, “Nice tan” in the most snide, passive aggressive, manner. His face and sneer said it all.

But that’s the worst I experienced. Wasn’t the end of the world after being the US, I could handle some Aussie racism. Also, for stares on the bus. But holy hell, and Aborigine looking man got on the bus and the stares would stop for that poor man.

So there is certainly more outward racism there the. I’ve seen in other places.

I also hooked up with an Aussie visiting the states. See was fine but the pillow talk was frightening. He had such backwards views of African Americans. All based on what he saw on TV. He was trying to tell my back ass about black people in America. I kicked his ass out of my house with the quickness. That cunt!

The good:

I had a great time in Australia. Partied, fucked (Sydney boys could get enough) and enjoyed the scenery. Would I go back? In a heartbeat! Other counties probably say the same shit as the Aussies but in another language so I’ll never know.

I don’t let passive racism to stop me from having fun. Aussies are a lot of fun in the snack. I had one of my most memorable dates of my life the first day in Sydney. Buffed 6’3 power bottom took me on a date overlooking the Opera House and harbor. Great conversation, great sex, great food. Was a magical night.

Op, I hope you enjoy your trips!!!!!

[quote]why do most New Zealanders leave there?

Because it's insanely expensive to live in New Zealand - wages are low and cost of living is crazy high. The average house price in NZ is over a million NZ dollars.

I love living here but i would be a lot wealthier if I lived pretty much anywhere else.

[quote] Because it's insanely expensive to live in New Zealand - wages are low and cost of living is crazy high. The average house price in NZ is over a million NZ dollars.

My understanding is that it's because the government encouraged asian immigration and they bought up most of Auckland and other cities.

Now real estate prices are through the roof, and the native New Zealanders can't afford to live there any more.

True or false?

R23, that sounds like Canada

R23 - partly the reason, but there are a few different factors. The fact there's a supermarket duopoly doesn't help.

I'm sorry you had to deal with that awful racist garbage R21. Especially at Bondi.

Yes R17 a lot of New Zealanders leave either permanently like me or to see the world before returning and settling down because NZ has limited opportunities. It's part of NZ culture to stretch our wings because we are so far from everything.

NZ is a beautiful and very safe and clean place to live with a great quality of life but limited culture and opportunity. We leave go to see the world and experience something different. Learn another language. To see and experience European culture. A lot leave to have a "gap" year or two in the UK. To visit and live in the country where our families came from because a lot of us have dual citizenship to other countries. To get better work/professional experience and pay which we then bring back to NZ later in life. Anyone highly qualified and very specialised is limited in employment opportunities and very competitive to get a job so NZers leave to get a suitable job. Many come to Australia because there are more opportunities and it's still close to NZ to fly back for Xmas and family things. Often NZers plan to live somewhere for a couple of years and return but end up falling in love, having children or staying in those countries for other reasons.

For me - I left in 1988 and at the time homosexuality had only just become legalised in 1986 when I was 16 and that was daunting and heavy growing up with that in the back of my mind. There were 2 gay night clubs in Auckland when I was 18 (Staircase and Alfie's) and there wasn't much going on for a gay person. It was a very "alone" time to be gay in the late eighties. So that was one of the reasons I moved to Australia - a larger gay populace, better opportunities, learn about my Australian family and I've been here 35 years so far. I'm more Australian than a New Zealander now. I'm a dual citizen. There are about 700 thousand NZers who live permanently in Australia like I do.

In recent years there have also been a lot of NZers that I know who have chosen to move back as the world gets crazier and more unpredictable.

Yes the housing prices in NZ have gone insane - just like in Australia. So yes that's true R23. Like you say - mostly Chinese buyers have destroyed our housing markets so normal everyday NZers and Australians can no longer afford to buy a house now. Fuck knows what's going to happen in the future with our housing market. A lot of wealth creation sits in the Ponzi scheme housing markets in both countries.

I'm Australian. Culturally I think we have the most in common with Canadians, not the English.

The referendum went down in my view because it was quite technical - change the constitution BUT include an advisory body to parliament BUT it won't have any executive power BUT it will be influential enough to change outcomes for Indigenous people. Low info voters need a simple intuitive choice and they didn't get one. And once the conservatives opposed the referendum it was always going to degenerate into culture war.

I think it's arrogant to describe 60% of the population as racist because they voted this down - lets progressives off the hook for failing to convince the majority of the country. Welcome to democracy.

Fun on the golf course.

This article breaks down the factors involved in New Zealand's high cost of living. Fun to visit - too expensive to live in.

God, that accent. So fucking ugly. Australian golf bros screaming. I wish that kangaroo 🦘 had caught them and eaten them alive.

big spider in the car

Yeah, that Australian accent is horrible and grating.

They sound like common trash.

Then again, they ARE descended from criminals and convicts, so....

Australians love rules and telling other people to follow the rules! It's the only place I've ever been to where I was yelled at by a random person for jaywalking, for example.

The whole PR campaign that Australia is super laid back is total proapgganda. It's a very uptight country.

Beautiful country, though. Wonderful sights. Good food and not too expensive.

I think that Australia has the most poisonous and deadly wildlife in the world, so that alone is enough to keep me away.

Deadly snakes, spiders, plants, sharks, etc.

Fuck that.

sharks at Bondi Beach

I love Oz. I go there every few yrs.

A dingo ate my baby.

R37

I wanna go but im scared of the crocs :(

F&F R20 What a load

R39: just don’t go swimming in North Queensland and you’ll be fine. There’s no crocs in Sydney or Melbourne. Just sharks…

I visited Australia and New Zealand in the late eighties when I was in the military. I didn’t experience any blatant racism, but some young people were frankly curious about the black sailors in their port. The older ones were much friendlier and just about everyone on my ship had a home to go to for dinner.

I’ve been to NZ. It was very clean and green, camping and hiking were very popular pastimes. People were extremely friendly and welcoming. One thing that cracked me up. When they mow their lawns, they set the blades low so grass is clipped very short. 1/2” , I swear, every front yard looked like a green carpet.

I was in Melbourne for three weeks a few years ago. I went to shoot a movie so my airfare and accomodations, local travel and meals were all covered. Of course I was working most of the time, but the people were great, the places we shot in were gorgeous and I can't wait to go back.

Except that 16.5 hour flight from LAX!

When I was 16, back in the 80s, I was an exchange student to Bathurst NSW Australia, about 100 miles inland from Sydney. The thing I remember (besides getting kicked out of my exchange for getting drunk at a party and winding up in the drunk tank) most were all the fucking flies everywhere, swirling about your head and face in a cloud. And they have these extra special flies called blowflies that you'd smash with a flyswatter and they'd explode into a zillion maggots that they carried inside them. Apparently they imported dung beatles years later which took care of the fly problem, so never mind.

Oh and meat pies were a big thing.

We LOVE our meat pies R45. Both countries.

[Quote]An insular nation of whiners and wankers.

Yeah, that's a fair summary.

I'd love to know where R2 saw Beware the Snakes signs on a beach. Must've been somewhere up in the far north tropics. I've lived in Australia for decades and never heard of it before.

Just reminding all the shark phobics that the rip currents will kill you at Bondi long before you meet a shark.

And that huge spider at R31 is alarming but harmless.

Has anyone taken The Indian Pacific, or The Ghan trains?

I'd love to save up and go one one the next time I visit Australia.

You asked the same question last Australian thread R49 and I answered you there. I'm not wasting time doing it twice.

R48: it was Perth.

R17, my understanding is that the NZ economy simply isn't big enough due to population size to offset the costs of importing what they need to import. Thus prices are high and goods are often sub-standard. I have also heard numerous times that the construction industry is one of the most corrupt in the developed world and that houses are basically uninsulated mold-making machines.

That said, I always enjoy meeting people from New Zealand.

R31 video is so funny when they get the spider out and then it tries to go back to the car.

This one became an instant classic.

[Quote]You asked the same question last Australian thread [R49] and I answered you there. I'm not wasting time doing it twice.

R50 told you then, R49, so he didn't have to tell you now.

I want to go and meet some foxy morons and hornbags.

An interesting choice, between taking time for a kind courtesy and taking time instead to scold and deny.

What a cheery disposition must accompany that one's days.

Those giant spiders are called Huntsman spiders, and they are very common in Australia. It is very common to find one tucked up under the visor in a car, and one scuttling along the ceiling. It is true that they are not poisonous, but they can give you a total heart attack when you see them.

Do any Aussies here have Huntsman stories?

I had movie posters stuck on my walls in my childhood bedroom which had a skylight opening in the ceiling instead of a window. One day I pulled one poster off and found a huntsman sitting behind it.

Another time I was reading in bed at night and sensed something. Looked up and saw a huntsman walking towards me on the bed. I screamed and flung the bed covers off. My parents came rushing in and they claimed they saw me in mid-air. But we couldn't find the spider. I slept in the living room that night.

Huntsman and jovial music.

The three tips everyone needs to know before heading to Australia

1. Never forget to shut your windows at all times - even if your car is safely parked in the driveway. This isn't because of thieves, the unwanted guests are much worse. Spiders.

2. A must-know for anyone who wants to catch public transport. Don't forget to hail your bus. If you don't it will drive right past and it is quite heartbreaking really.

3. Tipping culture. Don't feel obliged to tip - it isn't customary and you will receive top service regardless.

[quote] 1. Never forget to shut your windows at all times - even if your car is safely parked in the driveway. This isn't because of thieves, the unwanted guests are much worse. Spiders.

Speaking of number one, that's the number one reason I'd never visit Australia.

Well, besides the snakes, crocodiles, sharks, and other deadly/poisonous creatures there.

It's such an inhospitable place. I truly don't know how people can live there.

[quote] 2. A must-know for anyone who wants to catch public transport. Don't forget to hail your bus. If you don't it will drive right past and it is quite heartbreaking really.

That's obnoxious. American drivers make ALL the stops, anytime they see someone waiting at a bus stop. You shouldn't have to wave the bus down like a taxi. The driver should just know to make the stop, if someone is waiting there.

[quote] 3. Tipping culture. Don't feel obliged to tip - it isn't customary and you will receive top service regardless.

In America, that's the whole point of a gratuity. To reward good service.

I'd feel horrible not leaving a little extra for good service.

I am certain they are both absolutely stunning countries - but the people are fucking awful. Arrogant, racist, ignorant, loud, cocky, think the sun rises and sets on their assholes. So, like Americans but without the culture to back it up. They do have a good sense of humour though.

It’s a funny thread describing both the cultures as racist in the most racist manner possible. Sometimes you Americans make me shake my head at your cluelessness. But do carry on - you know best, as always.

[quote] I'd feel horrible not leaving a little extra for good service.

R62 they’re already being paid a living wage, and you’re in turn paying that in the price you pay for the meal.

Huh? Hailing a bus is commonplace in every European country. This is because most bus stops serve more than one line, so you hail the line you’re waiting for, and you let the others drive by.

Larrikins. Too many fucking larrikins.

I spent a couple months in Australia almost 20 years ago, so my info is dated. Visited Sydney, explored much of Tasmania, visited Melbourne, drove between Melbourne and Adelaide, went to Kangaroo Island. I felt like I just barely scratched the surface. I liked the nature aspect best and saw many cool wildlife (kangaroos, koalas, wombats, Tasmanian devils, platypus, echidnas, quolls, possums, sugar gliders, glow worms, various marine mammals). Culturally, I encountered Bogans as well! ;-) Australia is an easy country for travel, but you have to keep in mind the scale and time it takes to get places. It’s more similar to Canada and US in that respect than Europe.

I’d like to go to Rottnest Islams in WA to see the quokkas.

SMH, R62. Nothing wroth with your logic, fucking hell, in America, in America, in America...

[quote][R50] told you then, [R49], so he didn't have to tell you now.

What I've learned is that they are trains popular with CUNTS!

Choose the right season to visit, as Australia has different climates in different regions.

Learn some Australian slangs to enjoy the local culture and communication.

Protect yourself from the sun with sunscreen, hats, and sunglasses.

Disconnect from your phone or internet and enjoy the natural beauty of Australia.

Apply for a visa before your trip, as every visitor to Australia needs one.

R62 = talking out of your arse.

Quite likely, I've traveled regularly and know everyplace inside and out!

Here are some things you should not do in Australia:

Travel during wet season in the North of Australia

Travel during nighttime

Feed wild animals

Start your trip completely broke

Eat Vegemite

Always expect a warm welcome!

[quote] Travel during nighttime

Why not?

Dangers Of Night Time Driving in Australia

1. Australian wildlife are nocturnal ...

2. Australia is big with long, isolated stretches of road ...

3. Visibility is decreased at night time ...

4. Open grazing livestock pose a potential hazard ...

5. Driver fatigue is a major cause of accidents ...

I'd love to go to NZ, but I'm in the UK, so I'm about as far away as it's possible to be. Most flights seem to go via Dubai/Qatar, with the flight from there to Auckalnd being 15 - 16 hours. Not sure I could do it.

It's worth it R78. It's not pleasant but it's definitely worth it.

The Koalas are whores, they all have chlamydia. No joke.

Speaking of Crocks, Steve Irwin's son has turned out to be quite handsome. Love the accent.

R79 Yeah I will go eventually and plan to spend a few weeks touring the two islands to make the long distance travel worthwhile.

It doesn't help that you lose a lot of time travelling so far east. I looked up the flights and, with the time difference, you land two days after you took off from the UK.

Well r82, if you plan to return to the US you will gain those 2 days back. Are you that stupid?

If you are a circuit party queen, the trick is to celebrate News Years in Australia then fly to the US and with the time change you can celebrate again.

R83 I made clear in R82 that I'm from the UK, but you talk about me returning to the US while calling me stupid. Pot, kettle!

And I'm aware I'll gain back time when I return home, I was merely showing how the time loss just adds to how long the journey seems.

They play Celine Dion too loudly in NZ. Don’t go.

r43 they have loads of dangerous insects and reptiles which may account for the super low grass. You don't want anything hiding in your hard. Then it probably went from necessity to tradition with the grass height.

r45 I went to the Blue Mountains and holly hell were the flies all over you like you said, a cloud of them. Never stopped, annoyed me so much that I ended my little journey before making it down into the actual valley/forest. Also heard too many stories and warnings from my hostel about tourist getting lost down there (similar to the Grand Canyon, but with trees to hide your body). I went with this eccentric older man that was staying in my hostel room. He was nice but his vibe was off. I kept thinking, this guy could toss me over the ledge of the rickety old stairway and call it an "accident".

Safe to say I'm a city or suburban boy through and through. My black ass just wanted to get back to Sydney and ASAP. Also, coming from Sydney to some towns near the Blue Mountains is like entering into a Wild West recreation or maybe a 1950s west. They had one good bar with a saloon style vibe, that was original. It was a small town, flies all over, dust. I was charmed but felt isolated.

But, DON'T skip the blue mountains. It's worth a trip. Signed, r20/r21

[quote] You all speak of racism but won’t go into detail.

I think I only see one reply attempting to give a specific account. I wonder how many people saying racism actually experienced discrimination for being unattractive. It will help to be able to judge the veracity of these claims if people would provide specific examples.

The worst sort of entitled in Australia. New Zealand men have the best and meatiest thighs you will ever run across.