Shelley Long — what's her deal?

Shelley Long has always been said to be difficult because of her perfectionism.

But Midler's opinion means less than nothing to me on this. Shelley is supposed to be difficult, but Bette "DO YOU KNOW WHO I AM? DO YOU?" Midler is said to be flat-out horrible to work with--an out-and-out bully.

Kelsey Grammer admitted she was “difficult” to work with because she was extremely perfectionistic, probably to a neurotic degree. Ironically, she hated his character in Cheers and lobbied to have him written out! The producers couldn’t stand her so they increased his role just to annoy her, and the rest is history. To Grammer’s credit he didn’t hold a grudge and she was invited back several times on Frasier.

Probably Aspergers.

I love Shelley.

Bette is loathed by everyone she's ever worked with so yeah, her testimony is unreliable.

Ted Danson said Shelley could really obsess over things, but that it was never about her ego, just wanting it to be good.

With Shelley it always sounds like an obsessive/compulsive mental health thing than her being an out and out, monster. The set of Cheers was pretty much a party set non-step and for someone as consumed with their 'art' as long was, I'm sure it wasn't a good fit. However, that doesn't necessarily mean she was a bad person. With all that said, I do find it rather amusing that Lond would be so consumed with her craft when she can esseentially only play variations on the uppity, white woman.

My friend went to high school with her. Colossal bitch. But, that doesn’t prevent me as seeing her as kind of an 80s Carole Lombard. Both from Indiana!

Don't care. She was brilliant on Cheers.

[quote]I love Shelley.

Thank you, gurl.

She's had some hilarious parts - I wonder why she wasn't on Modern Family more

More clicks for Murdoch. Great.

There's a quote on her daughter's IMDb page (Juliana Long Tyson) from 2015 when she got married saying:

[quote] My father giving me away meant everything to me. He has been my rock throughout my entire life - my mother is mentally ill and was unable to attend the wedding.

Some years ago, she appeared in a Hallmark Channel Christmas movie as the mother of the leading lady. I guess she figured that a job's a job, but that was quite a comedown for her.

GQ oral history

I loved her in the Money Pit.

If what her daughter says is true.....that's very sad.

It also means that both the famous, quirky 80s Shelleys - Long and Duvall - have mental health issues.

The photos make me think: elderdyke going to buy cat food on her bike.

The cast of TBB movies eviscerated her in a podcast I heard.

The reported suicide attempt with quotes from her (ex-)husband.

Shelley is absolutely brilliant as Carol Brady in the Brady Bunch movies.

Her daughter's public quote about Shelley being mentally ill is kind of wild, huh?

R20- Her daughter shouldn't have said that even if it's true. That must have been painful and humiliating for Shelly. People shouldn't shame those who suffer from mental illness. It's wrong and i feel it's cruel.

[quote]To Grammer’s credit he didn’t hold a grudge and she was invited back several times on Frasier.

R2 this was my favorite instance, when Diane writes a pretentious, fictional play about the Cheers gang called RHAPSODY & REQUIEM 😂

R21 You try living with the crazy bitch.

R13 do you mean HOLIDAY ENGAGEMENT with the gorgeous Jordan Bridges (Beau's son, Jeff's nephew)?

It actually wasn't that bad, but I initially watched it because I saw that he was the male lead.

R22- Thsnk you that, was great. I watched that episode one time years ago and had forgotten about it.

R24 Starring Shelley Long, Jake Gyllenhaal, Tamra from RHOC, Sarah Michelle Gellar and Hillary Duff’s fug sister (at least according to the photos on the poster).

Cheers was too hetero for me. I couldn't stand Sam Malone. He was so creepy looking.

I loved her as Carol.

Her skin shows so much pallor . That’s not a healthy woman . Drinking too much?

[quote]Cheers was too hetero for me. I couldn't stand Sam Malone. He was so creepy looking.

Agreed. The faux Sam Malone in Diane's play at R22 is way hotter/sexier and has a nice ass to boot!

She has gained weight. This is the first time I have ever seen her when she wasn't rail thin. She sure didn't like having her photo taken lol. That is one mean, almost evil look in her eyes. 👀

Shelly out Brady Bunched Flo. She WAS Carol Brady. She owned it.

I liked her in Irreconcilable Differences. Seems like it was a perfect role for her - plenty of comedic moments but also a chance to show off her dramatic side.

She was a bitch and now she is old.

R34 AN OLD BITCH.

What about her role in Modern Family? I thought she was fine as "Dee Dee," I just found the character ridiculous. Irish Catholic curmudgeon Jay Pritchett would never have married a hippie wheat germ feminist like Dee Dee in the first place.

Faye Dunaway once called Shelley Long her least favorite working actress. They did a chemistry read together. Apparently, it did not go well.

Dun Fadeaway’s testimony is less reliable than Bette Midler’s, R37.

Faye has never gotten along with anyone.

[quote] I couldn't stand Sam Malone.

I loved Sam Malone. So hot.

According to the GQ profile posted above, and the late Kirstie Alley, Ted Danson is very well endowed.

Did Kirstie fuck Ted?

R41- During her cocaine years she fucked everyone.

R41 Not sure, but in the article she says there were showers where everyone got their photos snapped - nude obviously - as they came out, and Ted was one of them.

[quote] Kirstie Alley: Upstairs, everyone had dressing rooms, and there were bathrooms where you'd take showers before the show. So the big game became getting the door open, so that you could take pictures of nude people. I have the greatest picture of Ted. That was a big caper: There was one person [opening] the door with a butter knife and another person kicking the door in so I could get a photo. He's decapitated, but totally nude. And he's really well-endowed.

When Rhea Perlman was on Andy Cohen, he asked if the set was difficult, and Rhea said airily (paraphrasing), "There was, but she left and Kirstie came in and everything just kept going fine."

[quote]According to the GQ profile posted above, and the late Kirstie Alley, Ted Danson is very well endowed.

Perhaps that is why Mary Steenburgen is still married to him after nearly 30 years.

She was previously married to Malcolm McDowell for 10 years.

In the GQ history when they ask Rhea about Shelley:

[quote] Rhea Perlman: It's not really something I can talk about, to tell you the truth. I can't go there. I don't think it's worth it, at this point in life.

Ted's big wang must have been why Whoopi dated him, too.

She loves big white dudes. Frank Langella too.

Danson's ass is really flat, though.

Team Shelley. Most of the rest of the cast sound like monsters.

I read once that the fat Norm guy said years later he felt bad for how everyone acted toward Shelley, when she was really the only one taking the work seriously and really trying.

A hundred years ago I saw the fat Norm guy at a Husker Du concert somewhere in NYC. He was wasted out of his mind and wandering around for hours carrying the merch he'd bought.

The rest of the cast wanted to party and do drugs, and just wing it when it came to taping time.

It's hard to believe that fat Norm guy is the uncle of the thin and hot Jason Sudeikis.

I wonder what project Shelley Long and Faye Dunaway were doing a chemistry read for. Supergirl II?

r16 Shelley and Shelly are cursed names. In addition to the mentally troubled Shelleys (Duvall and Long) we have the tragic Shellys: murdered actress Adrienne Shelly and missing cult victim Shelly Miscavige.

Shelley Long always reminded me of Valerie Cherish.

Valerie Cherish could have been Shelley Long with the sitcom fame, but failed career

R55 Don't forget the wonderful Shelley Winters

R55 fuck right off.

As a gay male, there was something about Diane Chambers that really resonated with me when I was growing up. Maybe because she was "better" than the people in her orbit, but still longed to be accepted by them, and she wasn't. She was smarter than dumb jock Sam, but hopelessly attracted to him. I knew THAT feeling. She belongs in the pantheon of great television characters along with Archie and Edith Bunker and Tony Soprano. Just the best.

I’ve never heard the Brady movie kids didn’t like her. I remember reading a producer or director on the show saying she wasn’t rude or mean, just that she took her job seriously and that she just liked to do her work and go home and wasn’t into partying.

A few years back ET had a troop Beverly Hills reunion and Shelley was thrilled to see the girls and talked about how much fun she had making the movie.

I loved Diane / Carla feuds

[quote]I’ve never heard the Brady movie kids didn’t like her.

Fake news.

Since this is a gossip site I will share this old Hollywood gossip - relayed via a Cheers crew member — Shelly was pregnant when Money Pit was in pre-production, and she supposedly had an early labor induced so she would be ready for the shoot.

No wonder the daughter resents her.

[quote] She was smarter than dumb jock Sam, but hopelessly attracted to him. I knew THAT feeling.

A gay boy's rite of passage. We've all been there.

Ted always attributes a lot of Cheers success to Shelley. I think Shelley always came from a place of making the show better, but no doubt she was a pain to deal with sometimes. The show kept chugging along when Kirstie came onboard and remained a hit, but most Cheers purists would believe the Shelley years were the best.

Didn't even know that happened, R60

That’s funny, R63.

I love crazy bitches—and I wonder what Long’s specific mental illness is — but man oh man if you have to deal with such people (or, god forbid, live with them), your perception of them becomes forever tainted, no matter how talented or hilarious or charismatic they can be in their saner moments.

I’m surprised to hear this about Long, though. Never knew it, never woulda guessed.

[quote]I love crazy bitches

Gays do - I've noticed this. Who do you think my friends are these days?

Her being a perfectionist doesn't surprise me, though I'm not sure why that is. I know she was severely depressed after the breakup of her second marriage, and perhaps she's never recovered from it. I am assuming when her daughter says "mentally ill", depression is what she's referring to.

If he was riding my ass and that beefy belly slammed up against me while he was doing it I would shoot about 20 feet into the air out of excitement.

Are you talking about Fat James Franco, R70?

I'm pretty sure there is some Shelley in Valerie Cherish, R56. Specifically the tendency to over-rehearse and lose any semblance of spontaniety/naturalness. Plus, Michael Patrick King wrote for Shelley's comeback show, Good Advice.

Specifically Valerie is based on Shelley Long during the short lived show 'Good Advice' which Michael Patrick King wrote for. She had a mental breakdown on her set and got the show cancelled. Then Lisa took the Shelley Long vibe and added her own elements from her own life (the back brace, her clashing with the Friends writers when trying to bring her own ideas to the table etc).

I always remember a line from Tea Leoni's sitcom where one character, in response to "dead actors you miss", said "Shelley Long". When told she wasn't dead, he replied "Oh yeah... they should put her in something." I felt sad for her then and I was probably not yet 12.

The network, production company, and Long's people insisted it was a prolonged flu that kept her from returning to work on 'Good Advice.' The press, to their credit, repeated the official line but then came out and said Long had a mental breakdown.

She attempted suicide a decade later.

This does make you feel bad for Juliana, who would have been eight at the time of Shelley's breakdown.

Whoops r70 belongs in the Jon Hamm thread

Shelley also had a gay hairdresser named Mickey. If that doesn’t confirm it I don’t know what will.

My God I'll never forget when Letterman and Shelley Long - both Indiana natives - co-hosted the Emmys and Shelley had her big dance number which Letterman cast shade on her throughout the show and Shelley was too dim to realize it.

She's a funny bitch.

According to Michael Patrick King, “I need to know I’m being heard” is also a Shelley-ism.

The Diane character - as portrayed by Shelley Long - was essential to Cheers. I'd say Shelly was the least replaceable actor in the cast.

Woody Harrelson got along with Shelley.

She was great in "Irreconcilable Differences." Sharon Stone was in that, as well.

True fans know the Diane years were Cheers’s heyday. It’s a shame that Shelley apparently saw herself as the next Mary Tyler Moore. Apparently she tended to want more takes, to rehearse her lines to the point where they stopped being natural (remember Valerie Cherish practicing “I don't need to see that!”) and seemed to want her hand held quite a bit. You can see why that'd be frustrating week after week. But ultimately, who cares when the final product was that good? When Shelley left, some of the magic left with her.

Memorable Diane episodes:

1. The local PBS station interviews Diane. Diane thinks the gang is playing a joke on her and she impersonates a chicken. The interview is aired on the TV at the bar.

2. Woody (a good bowler) choked during the Cheers / Gary's Old Towne Tavern tournament. Diane's secret bowling skills are revealed. Diane steps in for Woody and the Cheers gang wins the tournament.

3. Diane enters the Miss Boston Waitress contest.

4. The Cheers gang takes pity on Diane and tells her what a good ballet dancer she is. Diane takes this to heart and barges in on Boston Ballet rehearsals.

My friend was a writer for Battle Bots, yes…. That show where home made robots would fight each other. He said there was a basketball hoop on the lot, and George Wendt brought the booty. Very physical player who likes to post up and back you down.

I enjoyed her work in Outrageous Fortune. With Bette and Shelley, I imagine the energy on set was very tense.

R36 All I remember is they ended up killing off her character for some reason.

I just watched the first two eps of "Good Advice" on YouTube. Very 1990s "smart" sitcom where Shelley plays a version of Diane as a brainy counselor whose husband cheated on her. Treat Williams is her co-star (but Shelley is definitely the lead) as a divorce attorney; they have a Sam/Diane love/hate relationship.

Lots of Valerie Cherish "I'm It!" vibes.

I think she got a raw deal . I never got bad vibes from Shelly . The chemistry between Diane and Sam was electrical. Kirstie was obnoxious by comparison

Shelley was kicked out of a Whole Foods in LA for spitting at the cashier. To say she’s a nut job is an understatement.

This bitch sounds like a fucking mess. She was famous for what, 20 minutes in the 80s and can’t seem to let it go.

Fascinating how Bette’s first instinct was to answer honestly and then she thought “wait… do I want to go down this path?” and quickly backtracked. Apropos of nothing but, the queen who asked the question was an absolute snack.

People with mental illness can be real cunts. Both good and shitty personalities have personality disorders. It sounds like Shelley's paid the price many times over if she genuinely was terrible.

OCD. There's your answer. It's a well known fact.

Outrageous Fortune is a guilty pleasure of mine. Never fails to cheer me up on a rainy day.

[quote]R13 do you mean HOLIDAY ENGAGEMENT with the gorgeous Jordan Bridges (Beau's son, Jeff's nephew)? '

That was it, R24. Jordan Bridges had done a couple of other Hallmark Christmas movies in recent years,

Jordan Bridges, from Rizzoli & Isles is BEAU Bridges son?! Whoa... he looks nothing like his dad or Uncle Jeff.

R88 LOL! I was about to type something yesterday that I had a crazy idea she was in a show with Treat Williams. Then I forgot to search IMDB. I guess it was true.

Shelley on Donahue.

No cunt Marlo in sight.

Shelley wanted to spend more time with her husband and daughter.....she isn't talking to either of them now...?

R21 I get what you said but being the child of a mentally ill mother is horrible. I know from having one

The Brady Bunch reunion podcast was not as critical of Shelley as I expected -- the comment about her being a pain in the ass came from Henriette Mantel, who was justifiably annoyed that Shelley thought she was her maid, but it seems more like she lacked self-awareness as opposed to being deliberately cruel. Christine Taylor seemed open to the idea of having Shelley as a future podcast guest, and Jennifer Elise Cox said she might be able to make it happen.

The situation with her daughter is sad. I recall reading a post on Shelley's Facebook in which she said her "weirdness was too much for most people, including Juliana unfortunately."

R59 - I think you perfectly summed up what a lot think/feel. Thank you!

Shelley Long has a Facebook page?

R90 Weird thing to make up

R81 Michael Patrick King has severe forceps-mishap-during-birth head

R103 I never hear that perspective on her. But when I see her on Cheers, I really feel an instant kinship. She gets it.

Beverly Hills, what a thrill!

Ken Levine, a writer and director involved with shows like 'Cheers', 'Frasier', 'MASH', 'Wings", and 'Almost Perfect', had this to say on his (now retired) blog 'Hollywood and Levine.":

[quote]Now let me say a few words about Shelley’s behavior. She could be difficult. She could be obstinate. She could over-think something to death. But it was never out of spite. It was just her very exacting process. At times I will admit it was frustrating. And exhausting. But Shelley has a good heart. She is a sweet person. And in her defense, she had an incredibly complex difficult character to play. To make Diane Chambers loveable and funny while still maintaining her haughty attitude took a very special actress. It would be so easy to just hate Diane. Shelley did an extraordinary job. I can't think of a single actress who could have done the role better... or even as well. So if it took her longer to find the moments and just the right shading then tough. The results were on the screen.

[quote]But the point I want to reiterate is that she is a lovely person. I know actors who are just mean-spirited monsters -- unhappy miserable people who want everyone around them to be as unhappy as they are. That’s not Shelley.

Ken's blog was great. Take the time to listen to some Podcasts.

I was tired of that thin, uppity, white woman too!

Ken Levine also had this to say about the Shelley Long/Kelsey Grammer story:

[quote]The article claims that when Kelsey Grammer first appeared on CHEERS, the only reason producers kept him on for more than the initial three episodes he was signed for was because Shelley Long hated him and the producers hated Shelley so much they retained him purely out of spite. They weren't just fabricating a story. The article makes this claim based on Kelsey’s autobiography.

[quote]So with all due respect to Kelsey Grammer, whom I love and have worked with since his first day at CHEERS till his last day on FRASIER – let me categorically say that this is just not true. Not remotely true. I don’t know where he got his misinformation. I suspect it was hearsay, but I can tell you unequivocally that it is wrong.

[quote]And in the process he does a disservice not only to Shelley but to himself.

Long later said that she thinks Grammer was influenced by untrue rumours. Maybe he and Perlman were just a bit envious.

If a so-called bitch calls a so-called bitch a bitch, does it make a sound?

Knowing very little about her but reading this thread, it definitely sounds like Aspergers. Female Aspergers is rarely diagnosed (90% of all Aspergers diagnoses are men) unfortunately because it sort of just gets written off as “female neuroticism.” For actresses this translates into “Being difficult.”

However as with the other suspected female Aspies I’ve observed (Kim Cattrall, Jennifer Saunders), Long succeeded in creating an extremely memorable character/persona which defined her career.

Interesting to hear. I don’t know a huge amount about Cheers, it was before my time and I’ve never felt the urge to watch it all. But I know on Frasier, Kelsey Grammer would simply show up and do his scenes first take. He didn’t like to rehearse because he felt it lost the spontaneity of his performance. I recall hearing the other actors found this difficult but got used to it. It sounds like Shelley was probably the polar opposite and wanted to repeatedly rehearse until she felt comfortable or confident. Which I can understand tbh.

She doesn't have a deal anymore, OP. She's all washed up.

She was great on Modern Family. In the beginning when she went from syrupy sweet to physically strangling Gloria was hysterical and really set the tone of her character and her relationship with the family.

Since she was only an occasional guest on the show, I hope the reason they killed her character off was for a plot device for the other characters, and not because she had done something so awful they would rather have the character die than to simply never to return.

I'm trying to imagine Al Bundy and Diane Chambers together and.....no.

I'm suspicious of any person - men in particular - that call a woman "difficult." It's a code word for "bitch", and it usually describes behavior that would often be lauded if it were undertaken by a male.

(I'm male, so don't bother.)

R109 quotes Ken Levine as saying;

[quote]I know actors who are just mean-spirited monsters -- unhappy miserable people who want everyone around them to be as unhappy as they are.

R118, why would you think only male actors fall into this category? I'm not saying Shelley Long is one.

R119 Ken Levine was probably thinking about Roseanne when he wrote that. He had some choice words for Roseanne - basically calling her a crazy cunt without calling her a crazy cunt.

Intriguing insight, R120. Thanks.

Levine and Roseanne had a bit of a feud and it went on forever, but this is the most pertinent piece of writing where he lambasted her behavior.

R122, Levine had scathing words for Bill Cosby as well, and his treatment of his writers.

I'm sure Levine has his blind spots, but I trusted a lot of his observations.

R119

I don't think [bold]only men[/bold] fall in the category of "difficult = bitch." I said any person - I didn't say all men - I said "but men in particular." If you read enough about entertainment, the being difficult issue becomes pretty obvious.

Though I also think that women - having been subject to that bullshit - are less likely to play the "difficult=bitch."

Unless I am misunderstanding your comment?

[quote] She is an enormously talented woman who has enough psychological problems to keep the industry in business for the next two hundred years. I’ve always believed that fame and money and power just make you more of what you really are. And if that’s the case, than Roseanne is a monster. No amount of spinning on her part is going to change that. No amount of “woe is me”, “no one understands me”, “I’m the only one who cares” laments are going to change the fact that she treated people like shit. Routinely. Constantly. Knowingly.

Ahaha, Levine truly had Barr’s number. This was written over a decade ago and she’s only gotten worse and more destructive (self-destructive now).

Shelley Long seems like a genuine, decent human being, whether she wound people up on set or not. I don’t believe she has any malicious streak whatsoever, maybe just a perfectionism that maybe borders on the spectrum a little. Who knows.

So Danson and Harrelson did juvenile shit like this to her?

[quote] Reader submitted blind item. This very popular TV series named after the location where it took place had among its cast two actors - The lead who has been in a number of other TV shows since the show went off the air and another actor who joined after the show had started and went on to success in movies. His most recent film is a sequel. The two actors shared a dislike for a snooty actress who was on the show for a number of seasons. To take out their frustrations, they would find out where and what she was drinking on set and urinate into it. Many times, the actress unknowingly drank the two actors’ urine. This includes when she came back for guest starring roles after leaving the show. -- CDAN June 27, 2020

Nah, I doubt Ted nor Woody would do such a thing. Sounds like more half baked and quarter baked bullshit from CDAN.

I loved her in the movie with Gabriel Byrne and Judith Ivey. She comes back to life after choking on something Ivey’s character was eating, I think it’s called Hello Again or something like that.

I don’t believe a single word CDAN has ever come out with. It’s a fiction website. At least I damn hope it is in this case.

Me Big Star

Me play joke

Me do pee-pee in your Coke.

As much as I dislike her, pee is for putting in a cup one throws at a director, NOT--and I repeat this---NOT for drinking!

I don’t think Ted and Woody hated her as much as some of the others, like Rhea and Kelsey.

Also CDAN is 100% lunatic MAGA nonsense

R12 wow that’s fucked up. Why wouldn’t she just say ilI. I guess it removes the stigma.

R92 oh, wow, you're not kidding. The guy who asked the question was indeed model gorgeous. His face is exquisite.

I think the daughter might not have been trying to be bitchy with that post. I agree it would have been better to say Shelley was just plain ill, but if she said her mother wasn't at her wedding without giving a good reason Shelley would have come in for big buckets of criticism. Maybe Juliana was trying, not very smoothly, to prevent that.

As for Kelsey Grammer, a less talented yet more self-absorbed actor would be hard to find. Diane was a realistic character, just hopelessly displaced. Frasier, who was written along the same lines, never was realistic, because Grammer couldn't find the humanity in him. He's a total caricature by the time he gets to "Frasier", in contrast with what real actors Mahoney and Hyde Pierce can bring out in their characters.

From what everyone has been saying about the set I really feel for Long. There are few chronic situations worse than being the only conscientious person in a workplace, yet she saw out her five year contract.

R129 - I watched that for the first time. Few months ago, it really is a funny movie.

Kelsey Grammar is a republican douchebag, nobody should trust a nything it says.

Kelsey Grammer is the luckiest man in the history of show business. Not good looking, not very appealing and not much of an actor. And yet he was in two phenomenally successful series, starring in the second, which is being rebooted.

It sounds like Rhea Perlman was a real bully. What is Danny DeVito like? I always got the impression he was popular among his colleagues.

Danny DeVito is very well-liked. He and Perlman probably had a dynamic where he was the fun one and she was the bitch who kept him in line when he needed it.

Whatever else negative you can say about Perlman - who has been separated from DeVito for a long time - they managed to create a nice looking guy.

Maybe not everybody's type, but I'll take him. Jake DeVito, Producer.

[quote] It sounds like Rhea Perlman was a real bully.

She was always so over the top in talking about how much she hated Shelley I knew she was the actual cunt in that dynamic.

Rhea Perlman had Jay Thomas fired from CHEERS.

He had a recurring role as her French-Canadian NHL-playing lover, which he took in stride, except one time when he was on some radio show and complained about having to kiss her on a regular basis. Rhea threw a fit and he was out.

But then he immediately got another recurring role on MURPHY BROWN, which earned him even more praise/accolades, including two Emmys.

Of course, GOLDEN GIRLS fans probably know Jay Thomas better as 'Sy Ferber,' the TV director who hired Dorothy and Sophia for a pizza commercial.

R142 — Thanks for sharing that pic — I never knew he even existed. He’s very sexy.

She deserved an Oscar for her role in Troop Beverly Hills.

You can tell she must be a nightmare at home.

Rhea.

Guy has to be a catty gay.

Thank you, honey.

She came back to Cheers in 1993 and did multiple episodes of Fraiser and was nominated for Emmys for it.

One Emmy nom for Fraiser.

No Cheers reboot for Shelley.

Hey, Shelley is still alive and Kirstie is dead. Shelley won.

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

[QUOTE] Cheers was too hetero for me. I couldn't stand Sam Malone. He was so creepy looking.

Well we think he's SEXY.

Given the stories from Henriette Mantel about the way Shelley treated her on The Brady Bunch movies, I wonder if she was always asking Rhea to get her drinks

What did Henriette have to say about Shelley?

R157 the difference is that in THE BRADY BUNCH Mantel and Long played maid and employer, whereas on CHEERS Long and Pearlman both were barmaids.

And Carla had seniority over Diane.

Cast interview about the Brady Bunch movies, Shelley didn't participate but everyone else did:

[quote]Sutera: I don’t really get starstruck, but I was just in awe. Shelley was an interesting person and an absolute sweetheart. Henriette and Shelley would butt heads though.

[quote]Hack: I think Shelley thought Henriette was her maid in real life. Betty had to pull her aside and be like, “She’s not actually your maid.”

[quote]Mantel: That’s true. God bless her. She liked to tell me what to do, but who cares? She’s something.

[quote]Hack: During the second movie, Shelley would do these warm-up vocal exercises before every take that sounded like this: ca-caw, ca-caw, ca-caw! Before every take, even if she didn’t have a line. One day, she did them and somebody off-camera, a crew guy, did it back. She lost her shit.

Also Mantel had played Long’s maid on a sitcom just prior to the first Brady Bunch movie and had treated her like a maid there as well.

Holy FUCK- I am actually surprised by this... Florence Henderson was a CUNT.

Hack: They wrote a cameo [in the first film] for Florence [Henderson, who played Carol on TV], and she was the biggest bitch in the world to Shelley Long. She said something that was so cutting and dismissive in front of all of us to hear. She just showed up and was out for blood.

Sutera: We completely reshot the ending just so we could have Florence in it when she finally agreed to do a cameo. And Florence was just a nightmare. Sweet-ish to us kids, but just not a nice person. You know, that backhanded comment to Shelley. It was something derogatory along the lines of, “Well, I know how to be a real mother.” It was just uncalled for and jarring.

I've always felt that Long (and Colasanto's death) actually helped Cheers go on for as long as it did. As Perlman said in the WWHL clip upthread, the replacements for both (Alley and Harreleson) were perfect and gave new life to the show. With that said, they also turned it into a different show. Woody and Rebecca were very different characters from Coach and Diane and created an entirely new dynamic. In truth, had Danson left instead of Long and been replaced by a gifted (but different type) male lead, the exact same thing would have happened. Sam and Diane had gone as far as they could, so if Shelley had stayed its not necessarily a given that the show would have continued for another five years as it did.

Does Shelley Hack suffer from mental illness as well?

Julianne Moore. Seriously.

R165 No. Hack and longtime producer-director husband are doing fine.

But let me tell you about Kate Jackson…

Okay, I'm totally confused... who is the "Hack" that gets quoted above?

After all, this is DL, so are you really talking about the former "Charlie" spokesmodel/Charlie's Angel replacement?

Am I just being a Rose from GG?

Olivia Hack played Cindy in the Brady Bunch movies.

r12 I love that you found that. That was the most interesting IMDb profile of an actress. I never heard of that I have ever read.

Her daughter, Juliana, now runs a high-end stationery business called Good JuJu Ink.

R163 We're.....impressed with Flo's cuntery.

Juliana looks like if Shelley Long and Shelley Duvall had a baby, she'd totally be the result.

Are Rhea and Danny still separated? I thought they tried it, then reunited. Maybe it's one of those Bob Fosse & Gwen Verdon situations, where they just won't pull the trigger on a full-on divorce.

R176 She did an interview with Today on that subject just last month.

I love Miss Shelley Long. I don’t care if she isn’t the popular kid in the cast. She always makes me laugh, and makes each of her shows funnier than the last.

Shelley is one of the most talented actresses ever. She's also had a lot of pain and struggle throughout her life. Despite that, she has a good heart, which is hard to encounter in Hollywood. At a time when gay people were oppressed beyond belief, they identified with her struggles and she theirs.

[quote]Bette Midler says it was rough to work with Shelley Long on Oprah in 1988

Why was Bette Midler working with Shelley Long on "Oprah"?

Outrageous Fortune II, where Sandy & Lauren are producing Oprah!

Rhea has come off like a mean girl with holding a grudge against Shelley. She comes off super petty to not give Shelley her due at this point. Her exit didn’t sink the show, and she should let bygones be bygones. Her wacko BFF Kirstie didn’t exactly fare well in the last decade of her life. I’d rather be aligned with Shelley than that wacko.

That Oprah clip of Bette talking about Shelley has been posted at least twice, possibly more times in this thread.

WE HAVE SUFFICIENT.

How did Shelley get along with Bette Midler? Has Bette ever commented?

R184 - come sit with me, please.

Team Shelley

Curious how Wikipedia seems to omit any mention of her suicide attempt

I would bet she has a manager or agent who tries to keep that stuff in the past. It's understandable.

[quote] Curious how Wikipedia seems to omit any mention of her suicide attempt

Well, that's the type of thing that tends to dominate one's image.

Shelley

Shelley Long.

That time that Shelley and Dave Letterman hosted the Emmys… and Sandra roasted him for it.

Poor Shelley. She must know about The Comeback thing, and it's pretty shitty of MPK's to have based it on her. However, The Comeback is absolutely classic -- hope Shelley's made her peace with it. Would be great if she could bring herself to brag about it. I love Shelley.

R193 What's MPK?

R193 Nevermind

Sandra Bernhard later co-starred with Shelley in Freaky Friday (1995). Who knew?!

I haven't seen it in years but at the time I enjoyed the Shelley Long-Gaby Hoffman version of Freaky Friday. Great supporting cast (Eileen Brennan, Sandra Bernhard, Carol Kane, Jackie Hoffman, Taylor Negron) plus twinky Andrew Keegan in an early role. Weird that Disney seems to have disappeared it. Unavailable to stream and it never even got a VHS release, much less DVD. Disney remade several older films as TV movies around the same time (The Computer Wore Tennis Shoes, The Shaggy Dog, The Love Bug.) Maybe they were just options to retain rights or something?

It might have to do with the big-screen remake of Freaky Friday they did less than ten years later with Lindsey Lohan and Academy Award winner Jamie Lee Curtis, which I believe did quite well at the box office.

R36, source? Where did Faye say that?

^ oops, that was for r37

[quote]or why that Paul Lynde imitator keeps singing about a Black Man.

Some people would tell you that Paul Lynde was an Alice Ghostley imitator, including Alice herself. Both got their starts in the same Broadway show, "New Faces of 1952."

Awww.

[quote] Kelsey Grammer has said she resented him because she felt the writers were giving funny lines to Frasier that once would have been given to Diane.

I can understand resentment at this. She signed on as the insufferable female lead of a sitcom. Then the writers go and create a male character just as insufferable and start feeding him all the good lines. I mean, there you are feeling good about your ability as an actress when the writers and a new cast member completely undermine you.

I always loved her but once I found out that Valerie Cherish was based on her, I love her double.

R204 Right? I think Diane Chambers and Valerie Cherish (along with Edith Bunker) are my favorite female television comedy characters. What are the chances one of my favorites would be based on the actress who created my other favorite?

Shelley Long was wonderful. I hope she looks back on her life and realizes how successful she was.

R197: Speaking of Gaby Hoffman....she's been TERRIFIC in HBO Max's "Winning Time: The Rise of the Lakers Dynasty". She's portraying Claire Rothman, long-time president & General Manager of the "Fabulous Forum" (as it used to be called), who introduced Jerry Buss to Jack Kent Cook (former owner of the Lakers/Forum in the '70s)....and stayed in the same position under Jerry Buss. (And the rest, as they say, is history).

Claire Rothman was a fierce businesswoman & leader. It's bizarre to see "little" Gaby Hoffman (Kevin Costner's daughter in Field of Dreams) as Claire Rothman, who was a friend of my mother's....but I guess I'm just now "at that age".

Transparent was an interesting mess that turned into a tedious mess, but Hoffman was always great in it, even when I swore the script was improvised.

In fact, all the kids were great. Jay Duplass was perfect as a self centered sex addicted asshole.

She was an 80’s star. Did a bunch of things & faded away. A lot of stars only have a moment.

I guess I'm the only one, but I never liked that show that much. And I don't care for her or Ted Danson.

Why was her time on Modern Family so minimal?

Voices Within: The Lives of Truddi Chase free on YouTube

I liked her - had a decade of success. Seems about right

I lived Diane. She really nailed that pseudo-intellectual, grad student Boston thing. I didn’t watch “Cheers” after she left for maybe 2 seasons. I thought Kirstie’s early stories about being in love with Tom Skerrit’s character were dull. Then Rebecca became a big sloppy mess as time went by. It was much broader than the Long era and any of the more serious moments from the first five seasons were gone in favor of more and more slapstick.

Ok.

Kelsey Grammar is a pig nobody should stand

I'm not saying Bette Midler is a whore or the band Chicago is a whore, but Shelley Hack might very well be a whore.

I just finished watching Troop Beverly Hills for the millionth time...this bitch can do no wrong. Queen!

The story about Coach's daughter being so insecure about her looks like her mother was was very moving. And nothing like it couldve happened on the Rebecca years.

We just call her Shelley Long Gone.

Of Valerie Cherish is actually Shelley Long that makes the story even sadder because Shelley WAS talented- it wasn't always clear that Valerie was.

I hope Shelley Long is doing ok now and knows how many of us ADORE her as Diane.