What Songs Made Artists Jump The Shark?

It launched the end of her winning streak.

I wasn’t around for this but I was surprised to learn most people thought this was embarrassing.

Her first crash and burn.

The beginning of the end for her.

As big as it was, this was the end for them.

They went from being a respectable pop band to full on sell outs people found annoying.

She redeemed herself but this is was the song that proved everything she touches doesn’t turn into gold (or Platinum).

Samantha Fox - "(Hurt Me! Hurt Me!) But the Pants Stay On"

She was on a winning streak before she put out this debacle. It killed her career immediately, at least in the States.

Ringo Starr's unexpectedly successful solo career came crashing down almost overnight with the release of his 1977 album "Ringo the 4th", considered by many to be the worst-ever release by a former Beatle.

The album's second single was a disco (!) version of Joe Simon's soul classic "Drowning in the Sea of Love". By all accounts, Ringo himself was drowning in a sea of booze at this time, and it shows.

I'll give him credit for not holding back on his vocals, he really attacks the song. Unfortunately, the song attacks him back, and he winds up hitting more bum notes than good ones.

His career as a hitmaking solo artist was over.

The Kiss Disco album. Nobody thought that'd happen, including me.

Garth Brooks when he became 'Chris Gaines) and made an album. That was weird.

"Chris Gaines" is a great example

"Bad" and "Moves Like jagger" were big hits

It was weird, wasn't it? I remember thinking, WHAT is he doing.

MJ didn’t fail with Bad, it was successful and he had further success. Blood on the Dance Floor was his first complete bomb.

R14 also making a song about “blood” in the tail-end of AIDS hysteria was not smart

OP LGaga jumped the shark with Born This Way, Applause was just the follow-up to that jump. BTW was a hit because she was on a hot streak and it did have a good beat, but once the straights dissected the message they were done with her. BTW made her a gay act like Cher. She might pull off a late career ‘Believe’ moment or get lucky with another ‘Shallow’ but her Number 1 days for pop bops are over. She’s basically a gay legacy act now.

Janet

R16, no one needed to 'dissect' the message of Born This Way, and while I agree it was her jump the shark moment, I would contend it was because the song was so heavy handed and blatant in its pandering.

For a few years, I kept trying to convince myself that they were still good, still relevant... but after this absolute nonsense, I was DONE. Didn't care when they broke up soon after.

R18 straights don’t listen to the words, probably took them 5 times to understand the message of the song

R19 shit link

Not sure what happened, here's the link:

I disagree with OP about Lady Caca and Applause. It depends what one means by performance. The song is OK, or meh, and the singing is fine. The only thing bad is the silly derivative art direction of the video.

Lady Gaga started out so strong, her first few singles were great. Then she fizzled out fast.

Janet was hit by a one-two punch of the Super Bowl disaster AND that shitty lead single off ‘Damita Jo.’

Billy Squier

Op is a turd

R23 She thought she could get a hit song writing a song about everyone applauding her. She thought it was a strong lead single and the world would “give her the thing that she loves”.

Her ego was so huge.

It was just like “Death Becomes Her” song.

“I see me! I see me!”

R28 it’s such a faggy song. It’s like Mommie Dearest level.

R29 read the full OP

In 1997, 55 year old Barbra Streisand thought it was a great idea to team up with 29 year old Celine Dion (the hottest up-and-coming female singer since Whitney Houston) for a dreadful duet called 'Tell Him'.

Radio stations worldwide received the song via satelite at 9 pm ET on October 7, 1997 - followed by a promo CD (with both the single edit and the album track) to play the single. At the same time, the RealAudio Netcast released the single for Web users. A few weeks later, the video of these two songbirds in the duet was released on VH1.

The single was released all over the world - except in America. It was to be released in record stores on November 4, 1977 but was canceled when Dion's label (550) and Streisand's label (Sony) couldn't agree on American distribution (sure - had nothing to do with the fact it was a flop on the radio ?). Keep in mind, Streisand had done duets with other artists from other labels for nearly 20 years prior, and never had a problem with releasing a duet - the labels always worked it out.

To qualify for a Grammy, the single was released in the US at specialty record stores in major markets only in late September, then pulled from the inventory after a few days. The record is since OOP, but doesn't exactly command a high price on the second market. (I own a copy, given by a friend who worked at Virgin Records in Times Square - he said they didn't sell any copies at all, so they were giving them out for free on the third day).

After this disaster, Streisand never made the Top 40 charts ever again.

I completely disagree with Applause and Born This Way being Lady GaGa's jump the shark moment(s). They were both global hits and kept her relevant. I do think that Artpop itself was a turd of an album and her actual follow-up single to Applause was that horrible collaboration with R Kelly. WHO thought THAT was a good idea? It was that song where she started to fizzle out if I remember correctly. She ultimately had that track scrubbed from iTunes and other platforms.

Tell Him was played a lot in Europe, where I lived at that time. It's a pretty good song on radio. Treacly but then consider the two singers implicated.

“Applause” was played because it was her lead single and payola. It reached #4 and probably cause of her Little Monsters.

It wasn’t a real hit.

At first it looked like Gaga was going to be the next Madonna, but that faded after a couple of years. Say what you want about Madonna, but that old whore had an incredible run as a legitimate, relevant pop star.

R34 It didn't make a dent in the USA. I caught the video once or twice on VH1 before they dropped it. Funny thing - ardent Streisand fans blamed Dion for this mess, not Streisand (even though it was a duet). They blamed Dion's vocals for it flopping - said it would have never happened had Streisand teamed up with a 'better singer'. HA ! And then Dion released this other little tune called "My Heart Will Go On"...and the rest is history.

R33, I agree that the R. Kelly single is a better example of Lady Gaga jumping the shark. What was she thinking?

I actually love Applause lol. I’m not huge into GaGa but do love this song (and vid). Some of the lyrics are v funny. She does have a good sense of humour which occasionally comes out when she’s not so earnest (I think).

[quote] no one needed to 'dissect' the message of Born This Way, and while I agree it was her jump the shark moment, I would contend it was because the song was so heavy handed and blatant in its pandering.

Plus the fact it was a shameless ripoff of Express Yourself. That moment revealed the empress had no clothes, meatdress or not.

Lady FraudFraud

Jane followed up her top 10 smash "Rush Hour" with this going nowhere tune.

Belinda Carlisle followed up her Top 40 smash "Summer Rain" with this drabby anorexic video & it ended her chart reign =

The Go-Go's followed up their top 20 hit "Turn To You" with this mediocre tune & then broke up soon afterwards -

The day that Prince the myth dies,……. Horrifying for fan.

R45 funky fresh for the 90’s - ugh 😩

I think the biggest jump the shark moment actually came during the promo for Born this Way. I remember there being a good deal of hype for the album cover because since it was Gaga, everyone assumed it would be a really striking one. What they got instead was an album cover that looked like it was made via MS Paint. That album cover is awful. And I think that was a sign of things to come. Red One is what made her and without him, she just doesn't have the good sense/taste to know what the public wants. Remember that terrible song The Cure she released? Just dumb.

So bad. So straight though!

The heavily tattooed model who was in the Born This Way video died the same way Jeff Thomas died, by falling off a balcony.

Although, Rick Genest's death was ruled an accident after much speculation about it being a suicide.

Indie college rock legends go camp and are never taken seriously again.

R50 going camp is a huge mistake

Pop music itself is essentially a jump the shark entity. I feel like delving into it for moments when artists you loathe dud something you find especially loathsome is funny.

R52 Do you love English, also?

R47 I think the born this way artwork is v funny in how amateurish it is.

R54, I remember being genuinely surprised when it was released. I kept thinking "this has to be a joke". But it wasn't.

Clint Black-Iraq and Roll

I think Lady Gaga tried to turn her image into this “Pop God” Michael Jackson type of image and it was rejected.

R55 no I thought the exact same, like it was fanmade mock-up or something - but then it is kinda funny that they just made her head the motorcycle lol. I think it was kind of an internet joke on their part.

Born this way album cover was intentionally schlocky. Pulease, people!

Didn't much like Gaga but finally enjoyed her Pandemic bomb, Chromatica.

R33 Applause was not a good lead single but what it killed Gaga's career on radio was Do what you want. Not the song, in fact the song is pretty good, but nobody with brains would team up with R Kelly.

She only needed to chose an R&B singer and made a good video (there were a lot of rumours about the never released video and noone of them was good) and she would recover like The edge of glory made her come back after Judas flop.

Of course she is very successful as actress but it's true that she seemed destined to be the queen of pop and that train derailed fast

R50 Umm NO. REM had a good bunch of acclaimed albums after Shiny happy people (which was a hit by the way)

A thread brimming with piss poor examples. This thread jumped the shark at OP.

^R61 Reread what the OP post in the first 2 sentences.

It doesn't matter if it's a hit. It must be the signal that the chart end is near for the artist.

REM had no major hits after SHP.

R48 Ricky crashed and burned from overexpossure, but he always has the spanish market (he even had a revival after coming out which was supposed to be the death of his career)

The Born This Way cover is hilariously awful. There’s no other word for it. If she hadn’t been so unbelievably pretentious about her “art”, I’d have felt embarrassed for her.

Enrique Iglesias when he started doing all those shitty, annoying and overplayed collabs with reggaeton artists. They were successful on the hispanic market, indeed, but it quickly declined his quality as an artist.

I remember when Enrique released his first song in Spain, he was laughed because he was basically the son of Julio Iglesias and known for being in the cover of magazines, but the song was a hit.

Then he decided to release an english song and i thought he would fail big time, but Bailamos was a big hit.

The truth is the guy had an incredibly long career and when you think it's dead he suddenly has another hit

That would only qualify as a song you don't like, r19/r22.

Not only is it a good, fun, cute song imho, but it was a hit and on their top-selling album ever. They released more hits and widely respected albums after that, calling it quits before they could be said to have gone downhill...

Not really a "jump the shark" moment imho, just a change in style you didn't care for.

Rappers in the late 2000’s began collaborating with rock, only few were successful. One unfortunate attempt was Busta Rhymes partnership with Linkin Park. “We Made It” destroyed all the momentum he had with his album The Big Bang and he hasn’t recovered since.

If we are talking about actual permanent declines, then Madonna jumped the shark with American Life (in America) and Four Minutes (in the rest of the world). The latter was her last really big hit song globally.

A "jump the shark" moment for an artist doesn't necessarily mean a flop.

It can pertain to the idea that the artist has run out of ideas, or is repeating themselves, or is desperately chasing trends when they used to be leading them.

It can mean that there's just something that they've put out that has caused the worm to begin to turn, even if the masses, or the devoted fanbase, may not notice it at the time.

Happy Days, the TV show, is the origination of this phrase, for an episode where Fonzie enters a contest to jump over a shark on waterskis in a lake. The show was at the top and the episode was not a financial failure, but that was the moment people went “I’m not tuning in next week”.

A JTS moment is typically during a ratings and rankings peak aka heyday, when a successful creative venture or artist does something that doesn’t necessarily fail, but causes their audience to lose interest and change their mind.

Gaga was never taken seriously enough to jump the shark

[quote] REM had no major hits after SHP.

"Drive," "Man on the Moon," "Everybody Hurts," and "What's the Frequency Kenneth" were all big hits after "Shiny, Happy People." No, they weren't Top 10, but they all were in the Top 40, got plenty of airplay, and got tons of play on MTV and alternative/college radio. The album "Automatic for the People," which came after "Shiny, Happy People," went multiple platinum and was critically acclaimed. R.E.M. had several more years of success after "Shiny, Happy People."

R64, His career did fizzle out after he "came out". He tried his hand at acting but failed so began exploiting his "trauma" of being "outed" by Barbara Walters. He later claimed he actually sleeps with women and doesn't want to be labelled as gay anymore. The controversy involving his nephew is the only reason he is still relevant.

Madonna’s was American Life. She was very successful after Erotica, and if fact, Erotica the song was not disliked. SHE was disliked for going too far (in some eyes) during that era.

Erotica the single did well (I think it hit the top 5) but the Erotica album was considered something of a sales disappointment compared to her previous albums

I would say Madonna was B list in between the Sex book and Ray of Light. Yeah, she was still somewhat popular but she was not competing well with Whitney, Celine or Mariah during the mid 90s (in terms of album sales). That all changed with Ray of Light. Madonna is unique compared to the rest of the big 4 females in that she had a third decade of popularity whereas they only had 2. Erotica's numbers are OK but nothing spectacular. It only had two top 10 singles only one of which hit the top 5. And the reason the songs charted as high as they did is largely due to airplay.

After riding high with “Rush Rush,” Paula crashed back down to Earth with this song and its infamous VMA performance.

Jump the Shark means the singer didn’t recover in a meaningful way.

Madonna- Give me all ur luv. Top 10 in 2012, but killed her radio career.

Lady Gaga- Born This Way. God she really exposed herself as shameless and boring.

MJ- Bad started the damage, but there isn’t one song. It was just a string of mediocrity.

Mariah Carey- just a string of mediocrity.

Katy Perry- what was that song after her epic string of huge hits that flopped? Bon Appetite? Whatever it was, that is jumping the shark.

Adele- the 1st single from her latest.

Katy Perry- Bon Ap & Happy birthday

Adele … that shitshow Griffith Park concert for all the A-list hypocrites mid-COVID

If I had to name a "Jump the Shark" song for Michael Jackson it would be that "Jew me, sue me" crap

Applause is my favorite Gaga song. Lol. I love it.

Vadge is super fuglee. That is a given but Lady Kaka izz a billion times fuglier. Good lawd.

"lol" r84

Gaga jumped the shark when Laurieann Gibson was fired for acknowledging she intentionally ripped off Madonna to piss her off.

She was like a fish out of water without Gibson's direction... she had no direction whatsoever. She's a decent signer but not creative at all. Everything that was interesting, was somebody else's vision.

That's why she tried appealing to the right wingers a few years ago. The only audience left who will buy her garbage.

Justin Timberlake - when he released that song with him trying to look all butch and lumbersexual in the video.

For Michael Jackson, it was that nonentity of a song (I forget the name and the album it launched), where he had Marlon Brando in the video.

George Michael - that dreadful "True Faith" cover.

R88, oh god, George Michael covered New Order?!?

We’ll always remember the version of you we liked, Lani.

I agree that “Born This Way” was Gaga’s shark jump — the cheap album cover, the “reductive” lead single, the shade from Madonna fans…

She was infallible before that.

[quote] It was almost as bad as Meryl Streep’s “Look At Me” performance in “Death Becomes Her”.

Oh, [italic]dear.[/italic}

Born This Way is one of Gaga's best known songs and it was a hit. Not a Jump the Shark moment, even if you don't like the song

"Happy" absolutely killed Pharrell's solo music career. It was a massive, massive mainstream hit but all of his subsequent singles tanked.

R87 Gaga’s choreography was always terrible though.

I think Laurieann did this.

Gaga is a horrible dancer so maybe she made it easy for her but it’s still terrible.

It looks like a dance a bunch of teenage white girls made up in their bedroom to NSYNC in the 90s.

R80 “American Life” was the end of Madonna’s radio career. In the US.

“Hung Up” was only a hit by digital downloads. It peaked at #7 the week the album came out.

It really wasn’t played on the radio.

Oh and “4 Minutes” but that was very much Justin and Timbaland.

Madonna could get her lead singles on the charts but anything after that was a bomb. And unfair cause songs like “Sorry”, “Get Together”, “Give It 2 Me”, and “Ghosttown” were great songs.

"I'm in You" by Peter Frampton

I happen to love this song, and it turned out to be his highest-ever charting single in the States, but the "Tiger Beat"-esque album cover ("POSTER INCLUDED!!!") proved that his record company was focused solely on exploiting his appeal to young females at the expense of the legions of male rock fans who liked him because he was a kick-ass guitarist.

"I'm in You", though a great little record, was a sentimental love ballad aimed squarely at the female fans. Peter Frampton and his male rock fans mutually parted ways, and his career was never the same.

Whatever relevance he had left disappeared the following year with the infamous "Sgt. Pepper" movie debacle. He managed one more top 20 album and single in 1979, by which time he was definitely yesterday's news.

Heart's These Dreams, i.e., when they stopped performing songs that they had written, themselves. They actually probably made more $$$ off of performing other people's songs.

Lady Gaga had limited appeal. Her singing voice is not memorable or all that pleasant. It isn’t unique. She jumped the shark with Born This Way. What horrific pandering with the most vanilla song imaginable.

Katy Perry- yes, Bon Appetite! She was on one hell of a hot streak. It was huge hit after huge hit after huge hit. Her career just stopped cold.

Adele- yep, her career deflated like her weight. She started to buy her own hype a little too much. Her concert special was off putting.

MJ- he lost the magic as did Prince. Or Prince went crazy and started producing music that wasn’t for the masses, or even the few.

Madonna- definitely GMAYL. She should have given it to a younger artist because it would have smashed. It was not a good fit for Madonna. Madonna should have had a massive hit with Ghosttown, but GMAYL did her in.

Mariah Carey- payola ran dry (let’s be honest)

Why do people think Mariah benefitted more from "payola" than anyone else? I'm sure they all benefitted, to a degree

Applause was the most pseudo pretentious crap ever. Rather than rip off Madonna, Gaga turned her attention to Lene Lovich. So basic.

Love, Thy Will Be Done was a bit of an odd departure for Martika.

I remember her being interviewed in Smash Hits and she waffling on about losing her virginity to Prince, thinking it was TMI.

Britney Spears, Work Bitch. Sad comment on our times that this is considered a gay anthem.

I Don't Feel Like Dancin' - Scissor Sisters

Yes the single hit number one in the UK, but that second album was diabolical. A message to gay pop stars - never get involved with Elton John - your career will never recover.

[quote]Madonna is unique compared to the rest of the big 4 females

The big 5. You’ve neglected to mention the only one with seven top 5 Hot 100 hits from a single album. The one whose chart success also occurred in three decades…

"Love, Thy Will Be Done" is still an amazing song, certainly her best, and the video, from what I recall, was great - very sophisticated for its time. What killed Martika's career were drugs, not that song.

Wasn't she anti drugs though R107? Or at least in 1989!

Drugs or mental illness - after that second album, something went off the rails and the general consensus was that it was one of those two.

“Love…Thy Will Be Done” was based on a hymn/prayer that Martika wrote. She showed it to Prince and he added lyrics, crafted the song and the rest is Top 10 hit history. The song clearly samples Cocteau Twins’s “Fifty-Fifty Clown.”

Agreed that the video was lovely R107. And yes song was ahead of its time, a total sidestep from where she was prior to that.

Yes, she was, in fact Toy Soldier's who is her biggest hits was about that.

Love thy will be done is an amazing song but it was a dissapointment back then (it didn't perform that bad, it peaked at 11 at the billboard hot 100 and 10 on the pop chart)

Lightweights.

[quote]Love thy will be done is an amazing song but it was a dissapointment back then (it didn't perform that bad, it peaked at 11 at the billboard hot 100 and 10 on the pop chart)

It reached #10 on the Hot 100.

I think the issue with Gaga and "Born this Way" wasn't the songs so much as everything else. As irrelevant is it should be to music, Gaga's style was a key part to her appeal, and everything stylistically about "Born this Way" starting with the album cover seemed to be either scattershot and/or low effort. She was supposed to have revived the music video as an art form, but the ones for Born this Way seemed very basic. IIRC, the singles were also pushed out one right after the other, which didn't help with the scattershot feel.

Tbh, Paula Abdul was commanding that market in 1991. Martika had gone 'avant-garde'.

The singles were pushed one after another because Born this way burned pretty fast. The song was number 1 for six weeks but after that dropped like a stone and Judas was a flop.

The edge of glory revived the album and You and I did well but then Marry the night was her first single to not reach the top 10 (it was not even close)

While the era was pretty much over for female singer songwriters with guitars, Jewel could have continued to have had a smaller but respectable career. Instead, she released…

For me personally:

"Chicago III"---The entire album.

"Rise"---Herb Alpert minus TJB. His MOR decline.

Chad Mitchell's solo efforts, great as they were, never reached the perfection of his Trio's harmonies.

This pile of crap for Bowie. What possessed him.

R101 she was married to the head of Sony or something like that. That might have something to do with her insane string of hits.

I think the public got tired of Gaga more than she did anything wrong. It's easy to Monday morning quarterback, but Born This Way was a huge hit and the album was a monster hit.

She had, what, 11 or 12 straight top ten singles in the span of three or four years across three albums. She was also EVERYWHERE. Everyone either hated her or loved her. She was the "moment" for a very long time.

In my lifetime, only Madonna had a more insane, all encompassing peak for female pop stars.

She was bound to crash at some point. I think Applause, even though I do love the song, is the correct choice as to when that happened. Had the same song been released during Born This Way, it would have been a number hit. No problem.

However, she then did a very smart thing. She went away from Shock Pop and focused on her vocals and her acting. ASIB totally revived her in both respects. Shallow might be her biggest hit. And the album was one of the biggest of the year. That kept her relevant and, in some ways, more relevant than her peers.

Maybe she's not the biggest pop star on the planet, but she's firmly A list in pop and now is very much A list in movies.

R121, being married to a powerful guy doesn't guarantee anyone dozens of hits singles and albums

"ArtPop" was definitely GaGa's Shark-jumping moment. It had ONE good song, the lead single "Applause", and the rest was just insufferable, self-absorbed, "read the room, bitch!" crap. So it wasn't really a single song, it was the ALBUM.

Really, her best song was not her most popular: Paparazzi.

I don't think she comes back. Her attempts at shifting to acting have all been rather meh.

Janet Jackson’s “Doesn’t Really Matter” was when she jumped the shark for me. The Nutty Profeesor II: Return of the Klumps tie-in; the stupid dance dance revolution choreography in the video; the descent into totally incomprehensible whispercooing. Tragique.

r125 I actually like that song. The video is also kind of adorable.

Doesn’t Really Matter made Janet the first artist to have a Hot 100 #1 in the 80s, the 90s and the 2000s. The choreography is athletic, intricate and FAR from stupid.

Hairdresser. Lucille Cataldo's agent dropped her the next day.

OP, I think you meant well but this topic has ultimately added up to being a bunch of nonsense.

I was under the impression that in order to have "jumped the shark" meant that an artist would had to have suffered a major dip in artistic and/or commercial success? But using the logic makes the majority of these choices ridiculous.

Madonna's 'Erotica'? Michael Jackson's 'Bad'? Really? Not only were those singles uber successful but those 2 particular artists went on to record some of the most commercial successful, critically acclaimed material in their careers Since when was that jconsidered jumping the shark?!

Uh oh R127 stay pressed

La Ross, "Workin' Overtime," which even her fan base walked away from.

[quote] The big 5

There wasn't a big 5. Madonna, Celine, Mariah and Whitney all sold between ~150-250 million. Janet only sold about 80 million. If there was a big 5, then Barbra Streisand would be the contender, not Janet. Adele, Gaga, Rihanna, Beyonce and Taylor Swift have all outsold Janet.

Painful

[quote]Adele, Gaga, Rihanna, Beyonce and Taylor Swift have all outsold Janet.

And every single one of them was inspired by her. Control is eligible for diamond status, as are RN and janet., but none of her albums have been re-certified. Janet most certainly is one of the “big” ones, for her influence alone.

Speaking of Babs, she and Janet are the only two females with #1 albums spanning 4 consecutive decades

The Meadows Sisters went a bit too far with Japanese Rhumba.

R134 You tried it

The big four are Madonna, Celine, MAriah and Whitney purely because of sales. That's it. Therefore, Janet is not part of this group.

The "sales" figures are bullshit since worldwide sales that you see reported are usually b.s.

Countries outside the US don't have soundscan so it's easy for stans to claim that so-an-so sold so many albums in Bumfuckistan

[quote]The big four are Madonna, Celine, MAriah and Whitney purely because of sales. That's it. Therefore, Janet is not part of this group.

Sales is not in the equation when the one you’re leaving out has never had her catalogue re-certified. Suffice it to say, the fact that pop starlets from the 80s through today have often mimicked Janet’s style or outright spoke of her influence, and that Janet is the only woman out of all of those you mentioned to ever have an album inducted into the Library of Congress, are just two reasons that she is automatically one of the “big” ones.

[quote]The "sales" figures are bullshit since worldwide sales that you see reported are usually b.s.

Precisely.

Might be interesting to compare actual soundscan scales, though that wouldn't include Madge, Whitney, and Janet's 80s sales

Umm, just because soundscan isn't a thing, doesn't mean those countries don't have ways of documenting sales. If all those sales were BS, then by that logic, Janet's record company must be inflating her sales as well. Even if an artist's albums have not been recertiifed, you can still find documentation of their sales. FYI, Madonna's albums have also not been recertified.

Janet was the first artist to debut at #1 in the Soundscan era.

R143 is big mad now

[quote][R143] is big mad now

No, my dear. But you tried it.

[quote] Unless you're Taylor Swift or Beyonce or someone in the same league good luck getting #1 hits or any radio play once you turn 25 or 30.

Really?

When this came out, I remember thinking this is the beginning of the end for Culture Club.

R124 she already did come back from Artpop. The ASIB soundtrack sold close to 10 million world wide. She also had two more number albums. And two number one singles (and two more top 5 singles as well).

No, she's not as big as she was during her Bad Romance heyday, but she's still a force.

With Gaga, I think it's that her target audience changed, we're pretty much talking about two very different genres of pop music, going from an arty, somewhat provocative take on dance pop to a more "respectable", more polished grown up artist. Personally, I found the former more interesting but she's been savvy in realizing that she needed to change in order to have that kind of longevity in the new environment where pop acts have a relatively short shelf life. That's the difference between her and someone like, say, Katy Perry.

OMG, I loved when Jewel did Intuition. The obesity mob of women on AOL boards lost their fucking minds.

The same fat cat ladies that would infest all other female musician boards declaring Nora Jones the savior of music... or whatever flavor of that time of the month, they were into).

I miss the AOL boards and chats. Lots of good early internet dick and seeing these moo cows lose their minds. Good trolling times.

Katy Perry - Chained To The Rhythm

She tried to add some depth and maturity to her music since she was getting older, but people don't listen to Katy Perry for social commentary. And the Ellen Degeneres hairdo certainly didn't help. I feel that people were done with her after that. If she didn't want to be the fun, silly, sexy pop singer anymore, the public decided she'd be nothing at all.

R149 agreed. Soccer moms now love Gaga. Which is weird. In her prime those types hated Gaga. And she'll always have her gay fans.

I think the Joker movie is going to huge and I think I heard it's a musical. So that's another possible soundtrack album.

She really is savvy. You're totally right. So smart to go more adult musically and veer into movie stardom too.

R151 I can honestly say I never owned a Katy Perry song or album in my life. I actively hate most of her stuff. But I really liked Chain To The Rhythm. But I agree with you. That was the song that broke her stranglehold on huge hits.

Kesha - Die Young

It was the worst possible timing. Kesha's hit song repeated "We're gonna die young...we're gonna die young..." and then the Sandy Hook massacre happened so no radio stations would touch it anymore. Between that and the fact she couldn't release an album for 5 years because of her legal battle with Dr. Luke, her career was toast.

Whitney - Whatchulookinat (2002)

A huge drop in the quality compared to her previous album, Bobby Brown's fingers were all over that mess, critics savaged it, it was a commercial flop, and she was starting to be perceived as a druggy mess whose music took the backseat to her personal drama. Yeah, I think we can consider it a "jumping the shark" moment.

U2 was pretty good throughout the 80s, up to the early 90s when they released the Achtung Baby (1991), their peak in my opinion. Then came the Zooropa album. A giant turd. For instance, try to watch or listen to the video clip below. Farcical.

If only it was a one-off farce. After that it was all downhill. Bono became the insufferable lecturing asshole that we know. The band's music became mostly irrelevant, and despite a few good tracks in 30 years, never recovered.

When Celine Dion started singing in that affected voice, saying 'lurve' instead of 'love'. She should have stuck with the power ballads.

Linda doing New Wave.

Mad Love is a great album. Linda would go onto more success in the '80s with Songbook albums, Pirates of Penzance, Trio, and her Spanish-language albums, and then end the decade with one of her biggest pop hits.

I disagree that Madonna jumped the shark with Erotica. It underperformed and was overshadowed by the Sex book, but was still successful. Erotica, Deeper and Deeper, Bad Girl and Rain are some of her best singles. And Erotica is one of her best albums. I think the '90s is the best period for Madonna, musically.

Linda's "new wave" sounds the same as her 70s rock songs, with an occasional (very timid) synthesizer appearance.

Surprised nobody mentioned Rod Stewart. This song was a huge hit, but basically crashed his reputation as a "serious artist".

R127 Janbot has to stick her syphilitic nose into every thread with her WhisperCooing hog. No thanks, Janbot.

R150, no one "lost their mind" over Jewel. She was already over by then, anyway

I actually loved the song "Lemon" by U2. Huh.

I literally cannot name a single GAGA single or song after "Applause". I don't think anyone I know has heard anything from her or about her since. It's like she fell off the planet. You say she came back but... It's not much of a comeback if most everyone I know is oblivious to it.

R165 Well, Shallow was a big hit, but it's a soundtrack song.

[quote]I don't think anyone I know has heard anything from her or about her since. It's like she fell off the planet. You say she came back but... It's not much of a comeback if most everyone I know is oblivious to it.

You can't even lie straight. Shallow was HUGE. It was everywhere. The woman has been winning big awards for her acting and releasing lots of new music since ArtPop.

I agree, R151. Everyone mentioning “Bon Appétit” forgot about the flop single that preceded it.

Also, the swipe at Britney at Grammys killed the last goodwill a lot of gay men had for her after enduring “I Kissed a Girl” and that “Ur So Gay” sludge.

Lady Gaga jumped with "Judas." Trying to make that awful song a hit showed she was believing her own hype and no one was telling her no. She jumped back with "Shallow."

Katy Perry jumped with "Chained to the Rhythm." She promoted it as "purposeful pop," but put in eighth grade lyrics like "stumbling around like a wasted zombie." The sudden short hairstyle changed her image too drastically and made the jump higher.

U2 jumped with "Beautiful Day." I like the song a lot, but it marked the end of U2 as a band that takes chances and is more content to play it as safe as possible.

I remember not liking Lemon at the time but watching the video at r156 I find it visually interesting and I can appreciate U2 was in experimental mode. The chorus leans back into more familiar U2 sounds which helps.

The problem with Gaga is that she is desperate to be liked by everybody. People wanted "real music" from her so she made the album with Tony Bennett and then Joanne. But her pop fans missed her old dance stuff so she threw together the half-assed Chromatica. That's why everything she does seems inauthentic, because she does it just for approval and there's no true passion. She doesn't realize it's impossible to please everyone.

R165 Gaga's had a couple big hits since then, but she needs help to get them. From Bradley Cooper in the case of Shallow and from Ariana Grande in the case of Rain On Me. Unfortunately her name by itself doesn't hold much power anymore.

Don’t forget that “You and I” song had different versions for different states.

That line where she says “he was a cool Nebraska guy” or whatever would be different on the radio in different states. “Cool California guy”… “Cool Texas guy” depending on where you heard it.

Yep. High art.

I thought “jumping the shark” is when an aging or fading star does an embarrassingly gimmicky stunt to stay relevant or to attract a younger audience (Fonzie on waterskis) but it backfires because the blatant pandering turns off the fans. The Michael Jackson song I nominate is “Remember The Time” because although it’s a bland, repetitive song, it was marketed with a garish big-budget music video set in ancient Egypt, co-starring… Eddie Murphy and Magic Johnson?! What the hell were they thinking. But let’s face it… MJ was always trying to attract younger audiences with silly fantasy short films like Thriller and Captain Eo. However, “Remember The Time” was his most embarrassing, IMO, and his career never quite recovered from it.

"Remember the Time" was a hit, though, even if the video was cheesy

r174 Yo. That's an unpopular opinion if I've ever heard one. Even newer artists very clearly try to emulate songs from the Dangerous album (which was mostly produced by 90s R&B producer Teddy Riley) and its sound/style.

Bruno Mars' song Finesse is very obviously the same chord progression.

Full stop, Teddy Riley's production was immaculate. He's, as they say today, the G.O.A.T.

He also produced and composed the song Joy which was originally written for Michael Jackson's Dangerous album but never made it onto the album for some reason and instead he gave it to his group Blackstreet.

You can definitely hear the "Dangerous" vibe in the song. And it's fire.

i agree the video for Remember the Time has a lot of cheese but the choreography is outstanding and I like the song.

Corey Feldman’s interpretation of mystical MJ in a black hoodie is straight out of the RTT video.

Agreed R159. Erotica was Madonna transitioning from the 80s into the 90s,something a lot of 80s performers did not successfully do. I know people think that American Life was her "jump the shark" moment here on this thread, but I kind of see that album as Music part 2, but it just wasn't that good. She had already done folktronica better with Music, but if there's one "jump the shark" moment on American Life, it's that horrible 45 second rap on the title song. Other than that, American Life isn't horrible. She followed that album up with Confessions which gave her her last "hit" in America - Hung Up. That album gave her a solid 25 year run of hits. These past 15 years have been pretty sad for her as we've seen her just take misstep after misstep, culminating in probably what is arguably her worst album, Madame X. All this being said, Hard Candy is probably the album that one can say she jumped the shark with because she tried to do what Nelly Furtado did just a couple of years earlier to much more success (and a much better album with Loose).

The way I look at you and stand beside you…

And now Madonna is teaming up with Max Martin. The world's most generic producer. Madonna is being a follower rather than trendsetter (yet again). Max Martin became a big thing about 30ish years ago, it's a dumb idea.

R182 She’s so desperate for a hit.

She was always best working with remix producers. Shep, Orbit, Mirwais, Stuart Price were mostly guys who produced remixes.

She’s been fully mainstream pop since Hard Candy or relied on previous producers to recreate magic and has failed. Working with Orbit and Mirwais again were bad ideas.

I think she should make an album with Mac Demarco.

R182 Max Martin and Dr Luke is why the radio is so horrible. It’s literally been two guys writing and producing everything for like 15 years straight.

R183,you are right about her producer choices. The best ones were ones who weren't exactly popular at the time until SHE made them popular. When she worked with producers who were already well established (like Babyface or Timbaland or even William Orbit in 2011), the work is always middlebrow.

R184, yes. 1000%. Horrible. They are the reasons all pop songs sound exactly the same. There is minimal variation between pop songs.

Poor fat ass Jabba trying so hard to make Janet Jackson happen and no one cares.

I think U2’s shark jump was “Get on your boots”, or the piece of crap song that was evidently about wearing condoms. Terrible lead single and they never recovered really.

R184 Literally like

R174 That is correct

Is Gaga's career in decline, DL, as OP claims? I fail to see that, but I'm no expert on Gaga, though I certainly like her. Asking people who aren't Gaga haters.

R190 yes, she’s really hoping this Joker film will bring her back to relevance but it’s grasping for straws. Her heyday is over.

Gaga's music career after Born this Way has had more downs than ups. Sure, she had number one albums but aside from A Star is Born (a big fluke), none of them sold that much. Chromatica didn't even make the twenty best selling albums of the year. However, people know she is a great performer which is why her concerts continue to sell out. So she's still loved by her fans while the general public isn't nearly as invested.

R192 her lifeline is bilking her Little Monsters out of their money for her tours

R186 once again, bringing Janet back into the conversation when the abject failures of his hatchetfaced queen HAGdonna are being discussed. Poor thing - always desperate to diminish a woman who achieved more by the time she reached her mid-twenties than he has in his own pitiful, meager po-dunk life.

No, Jabba, I'm bringing up your failed attempts at trying to make Janet seem valid. You always fail and you always will, because you are a retarded fat gorilla.

Will Hung (the name is a stretch) jumped the shark with She Bangs. One of the very few who jumped the shark before his career had even begun. Sad.

This embarrassment.

R195, jumping like the f*ggot monkey he is not even 3 minutes after my last post.

You pressed, fat ass Jabba?

[quote]trying to make Janet seem valid

Honey, a post on an internet forum is not needed to establish that.

The OP keeps trying to bring this thread back to "Let's bash Lady Gaga" but you all won't play along! Clearly this person created this thread to trash Lady Gaga so stay on topic, please!!!!

R201, this is for you!

R190 she's no longer the biggest pop star in the world. But neither is any of the tops mid-to-late 00s pop stars except Swift. She's transitioned into a Movie Star - against all odds. Joker should be huge and that will make her 3 for 3. But who knows? She could tank I suppose. It's certainly not a bad thing, however, that she landed one of the most coveted roles in recent memory.

Her mainstream album drops are still a big deal. She doesn't release many these days, but they still sell over 3-4 million ww. Plus the ASIB soundtrack album which was gigantic hit. She also dropped a passion project jazz album with Tony Bennett. Got nominated for a ton of Grammys.

She still has hit singles - though, again, she doesn't release many singles anymore. Only 5 album singles from Joanne, ASIB and Chromatica (they charted at 15, 4, 1, 5, and 1, respectively). Her latest single, Bloody Mary, was a TikTok viral hit from a 12 year old song. Seems the kids love her.

Don't let DL fool you. She's doing just fine.

[quote][R174] Yo. That's an unpopular opinion if I've ever heard one. Even newer artists very clearly try to emulate songs from the Dangerous album (which was mostly produced by 90s R&B producer Teddy Riley) and its sound/style.

I’m not saying the album isn’t good, R176, but it was obvious MJ adopted New Jack Swing to stay relevant rather than evolving his own style. RTT sounds like a tepid afterthought compared to other NJS songs of that era. It was like the Fonz abandoning his motorcycle for waterskis.

R44 I hated that song. I thought they should have released "I'm the Only One."

MJ adopted the New Jack Swing sound because Janet was having massive success with it. His “Jam” was sort of a retread of Janet’s “Alright,” complete with a funky bass line, a horn section and a Heavy D. rap cameo.

Sure, dear. Keep lying to yourself.

[quote] Don't let DL fool you. She's doing just fine.

Seems that way to me, too, R202. You can tell the ones who dismisss her as in decline sound pretty invested in that line.

I've never heard of a song called "Shallow", sorry. Had to google it. It's from that movie I had zero interest in seeing, and never watched. Sorry, I played the video, never heard it. I still think she has a great voice though.

And we're talking about music, I'm aware she's been acting... just not in anything I've actually seen or wanted to see. But her huge music career just fell off a cliff. I guess she's niche now, because I literally cannot name anything she's done since Applause/Art Pop, and I asked around and none of my friends can either.

R208, did you suffocate much under that rock you just crawled out from under?

They released this shit as a single

Keeps Getting Better?

Not for Christina Aguilera...

Janbot at R135 with her obscure, stupid, meaningless stats. Janet IS undercertified, but she won’t get any diamond certs. And she won’t catch any of those females mentioned.

Madonna’s JTS moment was definitely American Life. It killed her radio career in America. Evidence? Hung Up was massive. Gargantuan. It was the #1 selling single in America for 2 or 3 weeks, retired #1 on MTV’s TRL, yet radio barely played an obviously popular song. If radio would have played it just a bit more it would have easily hit #1 since radio play far outweighed sales in calculating chart position.

Mariah absolutely benefited from huge payola. This isn’t even a secret. She also would sell her singles at the cheapest prices by far.

Lady Gaga just stopped making good music. People got sick of her schtick. She’s extremely self absorbed and pretentious. Her movie career has hardly been stellar. Her last movie was a bomb.

Katy Perry’s collapse was shocking.

[quote] Max Martin and Dr Luke is why the radio is so horrible. It’s literally been two guys writing and producing everything for like 15 years straight.

Add Jack Antonoff to that list and you've pretty much nailed it.

Can you blame Jack Antonoff, though? If I had to spend time in Lens Dunham's pussy, I'd have lost all my talent and senses.

R212, saying Mariah discounted her singles makes no sense since everyone has benefitted from discounts at some point. That doesn't explain her high album sales, either. Everyone benefits from payola.

Not Janet. She did whole CD giveaways with Uber rides and no one wanted them.

R208 You say sorry a lot - why are you sorry? How odd.

You also use "literally" unnecessarily, so I suppose you really have been living under a rock.

[quote]Janet IS undercertified

This is the ONLY true thing in your shit-tastic post. The rest reeks of your diseased pussy and the stench of envy emanating from your dirty pores. The fact that Janet has #1 albums spanning four decades boils your blood, and it's hilarious to witness.

R218 I hope that maturity is in your near future.

R219, you can't expect someone who has been deranged for their entire life to suddenly become mature.

We all need to chip in and get Janbot some kind of therapeutic intervention.

I'm shocked, SHOCKED I tell you, to see that yet another DL thread has devolved into a Janet vs. Madonna cunt-fest!

They're bothered.

[quote] I hope that maturity is in your near future.

Ooh, the burn.

Fat ass Jabba is about as acquainted with maturity as it is with the truth.

R32, except tg da t she continued to record #1 selling cD in every decade thereafter and sell out concert venues as long as she chose to tour. Kind of clueless, aren’t you?

R218 Janbot, Madonna is undercertified. Just wait when WBR recerts her. It will add easily 100M to her WW total. Janet is undercertified, too, but she will always be behind Celine, Whitney, Taylor, Mariah Carey, Rihanna.

Lady Gaga’s movie career is not big,yet. She could never open a movie on her name alone. HOG was a flop. Her last album only had one genuine hit because of Ariana. Those others went up and down the chart fast. No real hits. Shallow was 5 fucking years ago.

What is the HAGdonna stan at R227 prattling on about?

He's saying you're a fat, stupid gorilla, Jabba.

R231, your fake picture is as lame as the Trumpian title accompanying the fakery.

But you tried it.

R45?, I must dusagree. First of all, Prince fans don't think he ever jumped the shark. Secondly, that song regularly appears on Prince playlists to this day.

R252 JFC talk about hatchet face. Her nose is gone and her ugly face is flat! Jabba, oh and nobody GAF about what BTS thinks fatass.

^^^^that should be r232

Madonna's jump the shark moment was either American Life because, not the song, but the video pissed off Clear Channel which banned her music, or Give Me All Your Luv, which was a top 10 hit in 2012, but it was seen as way beneath her and mainstream radio never gave her another chance. Not even the excellent Ghosttown which was one of her biggest AC radio hits in 2015. She still charted high in other countries but was over on American radio after 4 Minutes in 2008 when she had no record company behind her.

Prince. jumped the shark with his turning into,a symbol.

Adam Lambert jumped the shark before he dipped more than his big toe into the big-time water when he performed "For Your Entertainment" on the 2009 AMA show.

He was placed as the final act because this was to be his "Ricky Martin at the 1999 Grammys" MOMENT. But no; Adam had to be "edgy."

In that moment, and notwithstanding he has had a career of albums, tours, TV stints, and Queen front-man duties, Adam put the kibosh on the solo stardom dream that he apparently still harbors.

[quote]^^^^that should be [R232]

It’s too late. You failed. As ALWAYS.

R232 Way too much estrogen in dat shawt, ladee. Cute chineeze girls.

R238 You tried

R208 it's cool if you aren't aware of Shallow. But it's one of the most streamed songs ever. It was number one on Billboard. I think the ww SPS is around 10 million.

It was a big, big, huge hit.

I have "blind spot" songs like too. I remember when Dua Lipa started becoming a thing. I had no idea what she was or that she sang a song called New Rules. Totally missed that song. And everybody else in the world knew every word.

R8 - great choice! Stopped Ringo’s momentum cold

#2, that was the height of Michael's fame. Yeah, it looked like a gay biker gang, but times were different.

He jumped the shark with those twee, treacly songs like "You Are Not Alooone".

R156, I could not watch that video or listen to Bono's singing for more than 30 seconds. Too much bad!

Billy Squire is the king of this and always will be. It wasn't so much the song, as the video. But damn, once that video for "Rock Me Tonight" came out, he was OVER.

As a teen i liked Culture Club. Then The War Song happened.