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JC Leyendecker

What does the DL think of his work? He used his lover Charles Beach as a model for most of his work, especially the Arrow Shirt advertisements. Some love his obvious homoeroticism in his art; many say that his work lacked depth. By his own admission he was a commercial artist. That’s what paid his bills.

Was he talented or just another commercial hack?

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by Anonymousreply 277April 3, 2023 10:17 PM

Did Beach actually look like that? I doubt it.

by Anonymousreply 1February 27, 2023 6:21 PM

Not a hack at all. Yeah, he had bills to pay, but that didn't mean his work wasn't great

by Anonymousreply 2February 27, 2023 6:22 PM

His backstory alone is worthy of a movie. Four siblings, the oldest son was the only one who married and had children. The sister was a spinster who lived with JC and younger brother Frank. Frank was also gay and resented JC and died a drunken recluse. The sister HATED Beach, who basically took over their household. Took Norman Rockwell under his wing as a protege at THE SATURDAY EVENING POST, only to be shoved aside by him…held lavish parties at his mansion…fell out of favor in the forties and had to give up his lavish lifestyle.

by Anonymousreply 3February 27, 2023 6:42 PM

Okay, F&F me if I'm wrong, but I'm too lazy to confirm - if I remember correctly, I believe that Norman Rockwell exploited Leyendecker's goodwill/tutelage and ended up throwing him under the bus. I can't stand Rockwell, but technically-speaking, he was quite skilled. People love to shit on illustrators of the past, not only because figurative illustration has devolved to the point of being nearly non-existent, but because it was sincere and blissfully UN-self aware and UN ironic (These two seem to be a requirement for all art nowadays). Yes, Leyendecker's art is painted obviously by a flaming homosexual, but it is gorgeous eye candy - and so much earthier than that heavy-handed Puritain, Rockwell's.

by Anonymousreply 4February 27, 2023 6:42 PM

Daaaamn r3, you beat me to it! W&W, well-deserved!

by Anonymousreply 5February 27, 2023 6:46 PM

Rockwell attempted to pit JC and Frank against each other. On occasion, he’d take Frank in when he was down on his luck, which was often.

by Anonymousreply 6February 27, 2023 6:47 PM

What a stupid poll.

by Anonymousreply 7February 27, 2023 6:48 PM

R4 & r5, your contributions are very appreciated as well.

by Anonymousreply 8February 27, 2023 6:49 PM

Genius!!!

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by Anonymousreply 9February 27, 2023 6:53 PM

Guuuurl

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by Anonymousreply 10February 27, 2023 6:55 PM

I wasn't familiar with his work.

Thanks for drawing attention to it.

by Anonymousreply 11February 27, 2023 6:55 PM

I think there's a distinction between illustration and fine art. Leyendecker was a good draftsman but there's not much else to it. If it weren't for the homoerotic aspect of his work none of you would have ever heard of him or paid any attention to him. It's fluff.

by Anonymousreply 12February 27, 2023 6:56 PM

But pretty fluff

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by Anonymousreply 13February 27, 2023 6:59 PM

Word, r12, but like the best of classic 1930s-50s pulp illustration, it is both fun AND a bit subversive/ballsy. Nothing much else to "get," besides just delighting in the well-executed visual and sensual appeal of it. Does it belong in the Hermitage? Fuck no, but nothing wrong with that. 😉

by Anonymousreply 14February 27, 2023 7:00 PM

I know I'd sure as hell lift caftan, present hole, and 'Yum!' for the Arrow Shirt Collar Man, any old time - hahaha

by Anonymousreply 15February 27, 2023 7:03 PM

Same goes for Rockwell, he had talent as an artist, but his cutesy, punchline-oriented, jokey depictions are kind of treacly. The same holds true of Andrew Wyeth if you look carefully at most of his pictures; they are extremely sentimental, trying to take advantage of the viewer's feelings.

by Anonymousreply 16February 27, 2023 7:03 PM

Leyendecker is perfect for the F Scott Fitzgerald milieu. But I prefer Paul Cadmus. His homoerotic art had more depth

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by Anonymousreply 17February 27, 2023 7:09 PM

I love him.

by Anonymousreply 18February 27, 2023 7:14 PM

Cadmus had a love of buttocks ☺️

by Anonymousreply 19February 27, 2023 7:18 PM

Cadmus showed the ugliness of life. Leyendecker showed us idealized beauty, an impossibly perfect life and impossibly lovely men to dream about.

Life is ugly and sleazy enough on its own. I prefer to lose myself in a Leyendecker.

by Anonymousreply 20February 27, 2023 7:18 PM

Leyendecker's Arrow Collar Man defined the idealized aesthetic of American malehood at the beginning of the last century just as Charles Dana Gibson's Gibson Girl did for the opposite sex a few years earlier. They left us with an idealized portrait, perhaps rarely achieved in life, that defined an era.

by Anonymousreply 21February 27, 2023 7:22 PM

His technique alone is exceptional. Yeah it's always illustrations but it is "artful" and above "fluff".

by Anonymousreply 22February 27, 2023 7:34 PM

This sort of thread (becoming increasingly rare) is the reason why I still foolishly hold out hope for Datalounge. Nice to see homosexual aesthetes (lol!) discussing the visual arts, without it devolving into a big, toxic mess. Thank you, OP.

by Anonymousreply 23February 27, 2023 7:42 PM

This was always one of my favorites of his

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by Anonymousreply 24February 27, 2023 8:14 PM

Reason alone to get Paramount +

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by Anonymousreply 25February 27, 2023 8:16 PM

True, R20, but there's a certain beauty in Cadmus' work, too

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by Anonymousreply 26February 27, 2023 8:52 PM

His brother Frank did one of the sweatiest sexy paintings, the blacksmith. This has a slideshow of his work.

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by Anonymousreply 27February 27, 2023 8:56 PM

Neil Hamilton (known as Commissioner Gordon in the 60s TV show Batman) was a model for J.C. Leyendecker when he was young and very handsome. Sorry I’m unable to post links but if you Google both their names you can see a photo of Hamilton admiring a painting Leyendecker gifted to him.

J.C. And brother F.X. are buried in their family plot in Woodlawn (in the Bronx.). Their monuments were cleaned not long ago by the cemetery.

by Anonymousreply 28February 27, 2023 8:59 PM

Not to be confused with Waldo Lydecker, the heterosexual newspaper columnist in love with Gene Tierney's Laura.

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by Anonymousreply 29February 27, 2023 9:10 PM

R25, thanks for posting that! I'll have to get Paramount Plus

by Anonymousreply 30February 27, 2023 9:16 PM

[quote]Leyendecker was a good draftsman but there's not much else to it. If it weren't for the homoerotic aspect of his work none of you would have ever heard of him or paid any attention to him. It's fluff.

What on earth ate you talking about?

He was a commercial artist without pretension. Commercial artists were indispensable in advertising before the advent of mass print photography for magazines and newspapers.

Leyendecker's job was to sell clothes. Arrow Shirts, Kuppenheimer men's clothing etc. And he did a magnificent job at it.

Advertising illustration lasted through the 1960s. There were a number of names that are highly regarded and Leyendecker is one of them.

by Anonymousreply 31February 27, 2023 9:18 PM

R28, here it is:

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by Anonymousreply 32February 27, 2023 9:40 PM

Thanks to r25, r26, r27 and r28, as well as a few upthread posters for contributing to this lovely thread. Appreciated by us all, I'm sure.

by Anonymousreply 33February 28, 2023 12:03 AM

Yummy

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by Anonymousreply 34February 28, 2023 12:36 AM

R32 thanks for posting the Neil hamilton photo.

by Anonymousreply 35February 28, 2023 12:43 AM

Are there any actual photos of Charles Beach?

by Anonymousreply 36February 28, 2023 1:05 AM

R36, this is the only one I can find

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by Anonymousreply 37February 28, 2023 1:29 AM

What is interesting is to examine how Leyendecker laid out his illustrations. They nearly all center around a man's crotch.

Look at the illustration at R34 as an example.

Note the vee- neck of the sailor's top pointing down. The sort of "penis" formed by the empty space between the chair's rungs pointing up.

See the thumb on the man at the left. Note the length of the thumb is exaggerated and pointing to the sailors crotch. The sailors forearm does the same.

The little boy's rear is in the forefront covered by his hands.

It's all very sexual. It's not just a matter of handsome faces, his work is coded and it's all about the crotch.

You'll see it in illustration after illustration of his.

by Anonymousreply 38February 28, 2023 1:50 AM

Aaron Rodgers probably has this hanging in his house

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by Anonymousreply 39February 28, 2023 1:52 AM

Go to the article that OP posted. Look at the second illustration down.

by Anonymousreply 40February 28, 2023 1:53 AM

R39 is another. The hands over the crotch are the focal point. Note the veins on his hand. "X" marks the spot.

by Anonymousreply 41February 28, 2023 1:55 AM

The two guys are subtly checking each other out

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by Anonymousreply 42February 28, 2023 2:09 AM

R42 And of course the guy on the left is sitting there with his legs open and his hands around those golf clubs...

by Anonymousreply 43February 28, 2023 2:12 AM

Great points R38

by Anonymousreply 44February 28, 2023 2:20 AM

We do not seem to know what Charles Allwood Beach looked like in real life, nor for that matter where his remains were buried.

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by Anonymousreply 45February 28, 2023 2:22 AM

Leyendecker and his siblings Frank and Mary along with Charles Beach all moved into a beautiful estate in New Rochelle.

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by Anonymousreply 46February 28, 2023 2:28 AM

"While Beach often organized the famous gala-like social gatherings that Leyendecker was known for in the 1920s, he apparently also contributed largely to Leyendecker's social isolation in his later years. Beach reportedly forbade outside contact with the artist in the last months of his life.[21]

Due to his success as an illustrator, Leyendecker enjoyed a luxurious lifestyle which in many ways embodied the mood of the Roaring Twenties. However, when commissions began to wane in the 1930s, he was forced to curtail spending considerably. By the time of his death, Leyendecker had let all of the household staff at his New Rochelle estate go, with he and Beach attempting to maintain the extensive estate themselves. Leyendecker left a tidy estate equally split between his sister and Beach."

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by Anonymousreply 47February 28, 2023 2:29 AM

"Joe’s popularity and productivity reached its peak in the 1930s. Although Norman Rockwell blatantly copied Leyendecker's style and subject matter, Joe was undaunted. By that time his work had appeared on more than 300 covers of the Saturday Evening Post. However, commercial photography was rapidly becoming the go-to medium for print advertising, and Joe's commissions began to dry up. About the same time, during the 1940s, Joe began to feel the ill-effects of heart disease. While sitting in his garden in New Rochelle in 1951, he suffered a heart attack in the presence of Charles and died in his lover’s arms. Soon thereafter Charles destroyed all correspondence between them, as requested by Joe, in order to conceal their private relationship from future scrutiny. Charles had inherited half of Joe's estate but had to sell many of Leyendecker's original canvases in order to support himself. Tragically, Charles died in 1954, just three years after Joe’s demise."

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by Anonymousreply 48February 28, 2023 2:31 AM

J. C. Leyendecker and his lover also had a studio in Manhattan, NYC at 80 West 40th street across from Bryant Park.

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by Anonymousreply 49February 28, 2023 2:36 AM

He came from the same town in Germany, as Germanwings pilot Andreas Lubitz, who flew his plane into a mountainside.

Pretty little place.

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by Anonymousreply 50February 28, 2023 2:36 AM

How gay can you get?

Bet even between the war years society saw right through this painting.

Still that some of J.C. Leyendecker's work is in vaults of MET museum is something anyway.

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by Anonymousreply 51February 28, 2023 2:39 AM

About equally talented was the brother Frank Xavier Leyendecker. We do not know much about this fellow besides his addiction to booze and drugs. He died of an overdose (morphine) aged 48.

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by Anonymousreply 52February 28, 2023 2:43 AM

Really love this thread. Thank you all for the excellent contributions!

by Anonymousreply 53February 28, 2023 2:44 AM

More of F.X. Leyendecker's work.

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by Anonymousreply 54February 28, 2023 2:45 AM

Work from both brothers.

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by Anonymousreply 55February 28, 2023 2:48 AM

Actor Neil Hamilton (who played the commissioner on Batman television series), was also a model for J.C. Leyendecker and possibly the brother as well. Mr. Hamilton started out as a model for shirts and collars so there was a natural fit.

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by Anonymousreply 56February 28, 2023 2:53 AM

More...

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by Anonymousreply 57February 28, 2023 2:54 AM

: Neil Hamilton was quite good looking in his day.

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by Anonymousreply 58February 28, 2023 2:55 AM

J.C. Leyendecker's former estate in New Rochelle is now home to "Mount Tom Day Camp".

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by Anonymousreply 59February 28, 2023 2:59 AM

I’m somewhat familiar with these brothers, but this thread contains so many images I’ve never seen before. I could look at these all day.

by Anonymousreply 60February 28, 2023 3:18 AM

Same, R11. Enjoying all the references to other gay artists. Homoerotic art is a very interesting topic, I’ll be keeping my eye on this thread.

by Anonymousreply 61February 28, 2023 3:27 AM

According to Find A Grave Charles Allwood Beach indeed interred within their grounds.

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by Anonymousreply 62February 28, 2023 3:57 AM

For those unfamiliar with Fernwood cemetery and mausoleums it is a lovely place in Greenburg, Westchester County, New York, Same area as that "Sorta Bewitched" Tasteful Friends house in different thread.

City of New York banned new burials in Manhattan in 1852, thus those who died in city had to be buried elsewhere unless they were lucky enough (like Ed Koch) to land a spot in an existing cemetery.

Many of the rich and famous ended up in cemeteries scattered about Bronx, Brooklyn, Queens and Staten Island such as Woodlawn, Moravian, Green-Wood, etc. Others opted for cemeteries in Westchester such as Ferncliff, Gate of Heaven, Kensico Cemetery, Greenwood Union and others located in "rural" country. These places all predate motor cars but wisely are located near railroad stations (in a few instances railroad actually runs through cemetery grounds).

Coffin and mourners were put on a train at Grand Central Terminal, got off at station nearest (or in) cemetery where coffin would be loaded onto another hearse and mourners piled into carriages and off things went to grave site. Returning mourners were taken back to station to await next train back to city.

Thus those Westchester cemeteries are full of very famous persons. Charles Allwood Beach is in good company,

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by Anonymousreply 63February 28, 2023 4:19 AM

Final resting place of Joseph Christian Leyendecker.

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by Anonymousreply 64February 28, 2023 4:22 AM

Rockwell Kent was another artist who composed many illustrations around the crotch,

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by Anonymousreply 65February 28, 2023 4:30 AM

Looking at this thread makes me sore that I cannot draw for the life of me. It’s one skill I’ve always wished I had.

Really enjoying all the pictures in truth though!

by Anonymousreply 66February 28, 2023 4:35 AM

JC has major big dick face! Woof!

by Anonymousreply 67February 28, 2023 4:40 AM

No mention of Quaintance?

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by Anonymousreply 68February 28, 2023 4:44 AM

Harvard Rower

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by Anonymousreply 69February 28, 2023 5:21 AM

More

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by Anonymousreply 70February 28, 2023 6:14 AM

What about Maxfield Parrish? Surely with a name like that.....?

by Anonymousreply 71February 28, 2023 2:07 PM

Lovely picture of Charles and JC on Findagrave

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by Anonymousreply 72February 28, 2023 3:00 PM

R63 That was an excellent read.

Lots of DL faves interred there!

by Anonymousreply 73February 28, 2023 3:25 PM

Good bio on JC…

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by Anonymousreply 74February 28, 2023 4:06 PM

R72, that's a great picture, never seen it before

by Anonymousreply 75February 28, 2023 6:02 PM

I shall be buried in the Kensico Cemetery with Sergei Rachmaninoff, Ayn Rand and Soupy Sales.

by Anonymousreply 76February 28, 2023 6:10 PM

I picture you all sitting around playing Canasta, r76.

by Anonymousreply 77February 28, 2023 7:38 PM

Ayn cheats.

by Anonymousreply 78February 28, 2023 8:05 PM

Two weeks ago I spent art of a Saturday at the Rockwell Museum. I think some of you need to visit it and experience the full-range of Rockwell's work and learn about the control magazine editors had over the illustrators hired for cover art, view the decades of his work.

Like Leyendecker, Rockwell was a working ILLUSTRATOR. He had a family to support... he had bills to pay. He illustrated as directed, until he left the Post (at that point he was financially sound). His work shifts dramatically in the 1960s.

by Anonymousreply 79February 28, 2023 10:34 PM

Agree, r79!

And the Rockwell Museum is one of the jewels of the Berkshires if you find yourself there.

by Anonymousreply 80February 28, 2023 11:41 PM

It looks a pretty little place.

by Anonymousreply 81March 1, 2023 12:08 AM

If we're honest with ourselves, apart from the hypnotic brushwork and hypnotic male beauty, there's something incredibly attractive about the clothes on Leyendecker's men. Yes, I know he was doing advertising illustrations for clothing. It's just that it's so rare today to see a beautiful man dressed beautifully in tailored clothing -- crisp white shirts, wool gabardine suits with perfect drape, silk ties, sensuous tweeds, and all the rest of the glorious wardrobes he drew.

by Anonymousreply 82March 1, 2023 12:46 AM

R73

Kensico and Gates of Heaven aren't short of famous names as well.

Actors Equity long ago purchased land at Kensico for burials of actors at reasonable rates including those who died impoverished or otherwise wouldn't be able to afford. Given nature of the profession as one would imagine over years plenty of actors both famous or not have been buried in those plots. This includes that young actor who took his life in Central Park a few years ago.

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by Anonymousreply 83March 1, 2023 1:07 AM

Some on DL will recall that horrible train/motor vehicle accident several years ago in Valhalla; it occurred at a grade crossing along Lakeview avenue which runs through Kensico Cemetery.

Indeed a number of roadways run through Kensico and Gates of Heaven cemeteries. The two take up so much real estate that otherwise it would be almost impossible to get from one side to other easily if at all. Oh and those named streets and avenues make it a bit easier getting around inside both places.

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by Anonymousreply 84March 1, 2023 1:16 AM

Aforementioned train station at Mount Pleasant which serves both Gate of Heaven and Kensico cemeteries.

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by Anonymousreply 85March 1, 2023 1:18 AM

Kensico Cemetery station was closed down back in 1980's.

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by Anonymousreply 86March 1, 2023 1:19 AM

Am guessing what we see today as homoerotic art simply represented way men and women lived (at least middle and upper classes) prior to say after WWII.

Spheres of men and women simply were two different worlds. From boyhood on males often moved in a world that was exclusively just that sex; schools, universities, clubs, employment, professions, etc...

Common in Europe but could be found in some upper reaches of American societies males bonded in ways back then that would be likely considered "gay" today. Then and still today many European men have no problems kissing, touching or otherwise being close to other males, no one things anything of it.

Remember that conversation between Lord Marchmain's mistress and Charles Ryder in Brideshead Revisited? Cara sees no worries in the closeness between Charles and Sebastian. Going on how common it was for English and German boys to have another male as their first loves. She also goes on about how it is "normal" if it doesn't go on too long. Realizing (and letting Charles Ryder know) she doesn't think the former is gay, but Sebastian was another matter.

by Anonymousreply 87March 1, 2023 1:33 AM

I get my towels here and occasionally sheets.

by Anonymousreply 88March 1, 2023 1:37 AM

Part of it is the time.

Men were skinny (lean).

Clothes were tailored.

Jackets were more constructed than they are today.

Everyone smoked and had a lovely waist.

by Anonymousreply 89March 1, 2023 1:38 AM

Not everyone smoked.

And, yes, fat people existed, although there were fewer of them than there are today.

by Anonymousreply 90March 1, 2023 1:40 AM

Charles looks dashing, even in middle age (I assume) from that findagrave photo. Leydendecker was a lucky man to have that as a muse and lover. Maybe he WAS well-hung.

by Anonymousreply 91March 1, 2023 1:42 AM

Those who admire Leyendecker should check out the artist Mark Beard, whose work references Layendecker's explicitly.

The Bryant Park Studios Building is one of New York's great cultural landmarks and has housed numerous significant designers and fashion houses as well as commercial artists.

by Anonymousreply 92March 1, 2023 1:44 AM

Jesus, I was looking up Leyendecker's work and infamous hard on portriat came up and now I can't find it.

It's a full illustration of a man in a nightshirt (basically a caftan) and he's got a hard on. The woman who now owns the painting says after she owned it for many years, Whoopi Goldberg visited her (can't remember why) and Goldberg asks what the deal is with the picture of the guy with the hard on?

The woman laughed at how incredibly obvious it was and how she was completely blind to it for so long.

by Anonymousreply 93March 1, 2023 1:49 AM

Here's the hard-on.

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by Anonymousreply 94March 1, 2023 2:02 AM

Thanks, r94.

Apparently Ivory Soap isn't the only that floats in the picture.

by Anonymousreply 95March 1, 2023 2:03 AM

R95 It is, however, the only thing that's 99% pure.

by Anonymousreply 96March 1, 2023 2:16 AM

Note how he has tassels as balls. Even one high than the other.

by Anonymousreply 97March 1, 2023 2:32 AM

I'm watching 77 Sunset Strip

Who Killed Cock Robin?

Fay Wray

Myrna Fahey

and...

Neil Hamilton!

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by Anonymousreply 98March 1, 2023 2:44 AM

And the white emblems in the circles on his nightshirt look like squirts.

by Anonymousreply 99March 1, 2023 3:00 AM

Even before WWII, his style probably began to seem pretty dated. In some ways, his vision of manhood seems like a better fit for Nazi Germany than 30s USA.

by Anonymousreply 100March 1, 2023 3:26 AM

Depression Era men had no use for Kuppenheimer tailored suits and dressing gowns. Whereas they could easily relate to the Sears Roebuck and Montgomery Ward-dressed men of Norman Rockwell ads.

by Anonymousreply 101March 1, 2023 3:38 AM

Hummina hummina

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by Anonymousreply 102March 1, 2023 3:43 AM

Hot sailors

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by Anonymousreply 103March 1, 2023 3:44 AM

Quaintance

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by Anonymousreply 104March 1, 2023 3:47 AM

In an odd and twisted turn of events Kuppenheimer ended up being Men's Warehouse brand.

by Anonymousreply 105March 1, 2023 6:58 AM

I'm really surprised to see that J C hasn't featured in gay history and folklore, as much as he should of done.

I wonder why that was?

by Anonymousreply 106March 1, 2023 11:16 AM

Paramount + released short story "Coded: The Hidden Love of J.C. Leyendecker" not long ago.

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by Anonymousreply 107March 1, 2023 12:33 PM

More...

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by Anonymousreply 108March 1, 2023 12:36 PM

R101: Kuppenheimer was a fairly low end brand (along with Botany 500), a step up from Bond's or Richman Brothers. Arrow was a mid-market brand. Ivory soap was something everyone bought. He was not creating images of elite products , he was stylizing pretty mainstream products and doing it with a pallate that ultimately became dated.

by Anonymousreply 109March 1, 2023 12:41 PM

J.C. Leyendecker knew what he was doing; the "homoerotic" content people say was in his art was put there on purpose by the illustrator himself. It was his way of expressing what couldn't be said and expressed openly.

Leyendecker met Beech when former was 29 and latter 17. Early when Leyendecker brothers and sister lived in Manhattan, NYC Beech lived nearby. When J.C. Leyendecker built his wonderful mansion/estate in New Rochelle Beech moved in with J.C. his brother and sister (latter took an almost instant dislike of Beech), and that was that. Beech pretty much ran that house and perhaps not "controlled" J.C. but very much was the dominate one in that relationship.

Norman Rockwell basically stalked J.C. Leyendecker. He would hang about New Rochelle watching J.C., emulating the man's walk and mannerisms. Rockwell was also the showman and PR hound that J.C. was not. Norman Rockwell took his illustrator act on Vaudeville circuit for goodness sakes.

Unlike J.C. Leyendecker Norman Rockwell was not encumbered (or tortured by more like) being gay in the closet. Again this allowed for more freedom and so forth which gave Rockwell an edge so to speak.

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by Anonymousreply 110March 1, 2023 1:07 PM

R110: Do you know how to spell--it's Beach.

by Anonymousreply 111March 1, 2023 2:22 PM

I’m surprised that he didn’t do travel posters…

by Anonymousreply 112March 1, 2023 2:43 PM

This reminds me of one of my favorite genre of DL threads--the "old department stores" kind.

by Anonymousreply 113March 1, 2023 3:09 PM

Is it giving you a warm fuzzy feeling R113?

by Anonymousreply 114March 1, 2023 3:13 PM

Well, I haven't started drinking today yet...

by Anonymousreply 115March 1, 2023 3:16 PM

[quote]J.C. Leyendecker knew what he was doing; the "homoerotic" content people say was in his art was put there on purpose by the illustrator himself.

Uh....well who else would have put it there?

JC Leyendecke's work has an almost 1970s sensibility. The decade of Bruce Weber, Tom of Finland.

by Anonymousreply 116March 1, 2023 3:43 PM

Cadmus is much closer to Tom of Finland.

by Anonymousreply 117March 1, 2023 3:51 PM

To be clear J.C. Leyendecker's commissions only began to decline by sometime in 1920's into 1930's, but the man still was getting work. In fact J.C. Leyendecker was working on Christmas cover for The American Weekly, when on July 25, 1951, he suffered a heart attack and died at 77.

There is more so much more about J.C. Leyendecker and Charles Beach and a good bit of it is out there if one bothers to look.

For a start Charles Beach appears to have been somewhat of a bully, dominating his partner and running that household with an iron fist.

J.C. Leyendecker at some point became engaged; Beach was furious and threatened to expose Leyendecker as a homosexual. Wedding plans did not go forward.

Meanwhile F. Leyendecker ended up leaving (or being evicted) from his brother's estate and moved into rooms above Rockwell's garage. It was there he eventually died by suicide.

At time of his death J.C. Leyendecker left an estate (IIRC) with about $60k in cash, the property and other assets. A bequest of $10k was made to Charles Beach who was described in news papers reports as "friend", "secretary" or "aide" of J.C. Leyendecker. The house was left to the sister and Beach but they soon had to sell, probably because as often happens they simply couldn't afford taxes and otherwise to keep the place up.

Curious thing about Charles Allwood Beach, Find A Grave has his grave as " Unit 8, Private Storage, Niche L-001 (Not Open To The Public). What does that mean anyway? Have never heard of "private storage" at a cemetery. Is it a pauper's grave?

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by Anonymousreply 118March 1, 2023 4:12 PM

I recall reading about them in this rather obscure book of famous gay couples I can’t remember the title of. I do remember reading the siblings hated Beach (probably because he had the favoritism and total love from JC - I don’t really see him as a “bully”) and they had endless disputes about living arrangements and money issues with him.

by Anonymousreply 119March 1, 2023 4:14 PM

Estelle Getty, even if she was a republican (like about 50% of actors her age back then), was a major HIV/AIDS activist and socially liberal. They weren’t vile bigoted MAGA types then. Either way, the character of Sophia was a Democrat.

by Anonymousreply 120March 1, 2023 4:18 PM

Oops wrong thread. That was meant for the most recent golden girls one.

by Anonymousreply 121March 1, 2023 4:19 PM

I am glad to see Golden Girls controversies are alive and well.

by Anonymousreply 122March 1, 2023 4:22 PM

But this does beg the question: would JC and Charles have enjoyed the Golden Girls? Or would they be too “above” it?

by Anonymousreply 123March 1, 2023 4:31 PM

Fuck, that's hot.

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by Anonymousreply 124March 1, 2023 4:33 PM

The football player's arms and hands, though erotically charged, are abnormally long and large in that illustration at r124. Do you think it was intentional on JC's part?

by Anonymousreply 125March 1, 2023 4:43 PM

R119, threatening to expose JC’s homosexuality kinda qualifies Charlie as a bully to me…

by Anonymousreply 126March 1, 2023 4:54 PM

R125 yeah, I think he was definitely trying to match the scope of the Pilgrim. I see what you're saying but it fits with the perspective of the image. It's almost as if the men are leaning back in pride.

by Anonymousreply 127March 1, 2023 4:57 PM

R65, I've always had trouble believing Rockwell Kent was straight.

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by Anonymousreply 128March 1, 2023 5:13 PM

Leyendecker's contemporary illustrator Otho Cushing was also a closeted gay.

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by Anonymousreply 129March 1, 2023 5:18 PM

R10, Tom & Lorenzo! Also fabulous!

by Anonymousreply 130March 1, 2023 5:38 PM

Wish Leyendecker had done nudes

by Anonymousreply 131March 1, 2023 5:39 PM

Rockwell Kent for Vernon Kilns...

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by Anonymousreply 132March 1, 2023 5:45 PM

R129, wow, Cushing was even more homoerotic than Leyendecker!

by Anonymousreply 133March 1, 2023 7:37 PM

I'm enjoying this thread and looking through these illustrations greatly. So far, I'd say that I really enjoy the style of Leyendecker, however in a way Cadmus is much more interesting to look at. I don't usually like grotesques, but there is something about his work that draws your eye (see Bar Italia, for example). I also really love the story about The Fleet's In and how horrified the higher ups in the Navy were. "That never happens!" (uh, yes, it does, I live in a port city haha!). Also, his style is more varied, and he also does stuff in more of a beautiful style too.

Before I saw the dates, I thought Leyendecker might have been a 50s artist, because it seems to have that kind of sensibility too. He was quite ahead of his time like that, maybe?

Keep 'em coming, this is really great! It reminds me also a bit of being a kid, and finding my dad's and uncle's 60s-era "boys adventures" type books with illustrations, and how I'd be transfixed by the illustrations of shirtless men fighting and stuff like that.

by Anonymousreply 134March 1, 2023 7:47 PM

Who did these Cannon towel ads?

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by Anonymousreply 135March 1, 2023 7:52 PM

and...

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by Anonymousreply 136March 1, 2023 7:53 PM

Those are amazing, R135/R136. It's fascinating how perceptions change - that reads as very gay today, but I guess at the time no one would've thought anything of it.

by Anonymousreply 137March 1, 2023 7:56 PM

And very white.

by Anonymousreply 138March 1, 2023 7:58 PM

I don't care for the cartoonish illustrations as much. They remind me of Michael Kirwan illustrations which I never found to be arousing or interesting.

by Anonymousreply 139March 1, 2023 7:58 PM

Nothing gay about those towel ads; just a bunch of enlisted men blowing off steam, completely oblivious to each other's gleaming, muscular wet physiques! Likewise, J. C. Leyendecker was probably a heterosexual man who found it convenient to room with his model for business reasons—it certainly saved on bus fare! You boys need to stop reading every innocent thing as secretly homo.

by Anonymousreply 140March 1, 2023 8:27 PM

[quote]I don't care for the cartoonish illustrations as much. They remind me of Michael Kirwan illustrations which I never found to be arousing or interesting.

I’m finding some of the illustrations interesting to look at, particularly from a historical perspective and how homoeroticism could be presented, however I agree that I don’t find them arousing. Maybe if I’d grown up with them being the only thing like that I could see, it would be different though.

by Anonymousreply 141March 1, 2023 8:34 PM

Leyendecker's illustrations are very stylish, occasionally sensuous, and always beautiful. His work takes the viewer back to a period of time that I adore artistically. He had a real flair for telling a story via his art.

by Anonymousreply 142March 1, 2023 10:04 PM

The artist who did sketches for Advocate Men had a slightly Leyendecker-ish vibe to his drawings, though they lacked a certain sensuality or pizzazz.

The porn artist Josman also reminds me a bit of his work. (Josman's stuff was hot....but sometimes sketchy and or too pervy.)

by Anonymousreply 143March 1, 2023 10:10 PM

The quantity of paintings (and that's what those illustrations are) is extraordinary for Leyendecker, Rockwell and others.

From Illustration History website: Between 1896 and 1950, Leyendecker illustrated more than 400 magazine covers for the nation’s trade and general interest publications, including Collier’s, Ladies’ Home Journal, Judge, and The Saturday Evening Post, for which he created 322 cover paintings (one more than Rockwell’s 321). In addition to his series of New Year’s baby covers, the artist depicted such all-American holidays as the Fourth of July, Thanksgiving, and Christmas; the tradition of giving gifts of flowers on Mother’s Day began with his May 30, 1914 Post cover, depicting a bellhop carrying a bouquet of hyacinths. Leyendecker was the artist most closely identified with the Post during the first decades of the 20th century.

by Anonymousreply 144March 1, 2023 10:14 PM

R124 - the vantage point of the viewer in that image is quite low, giving the men "heroic" bering. Your "eye" is closer to the level of hands then the faces, so they are exaggerated.

by Anonymousreply 145March 1, 2023 11:12 PM

Charles Beach was quite sexy, but this blonde model - goddamn!

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by Anonymousreply 146March 1, 2023 11:17 PM

same guy

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by Anonymousreply 147March 1, 2023 11:18 PM

LX had it goin' on!

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by Anonymousreply 148March 1, 2023 11:21 PM

It's nice that they don't skip leg day.

by Anonymousreply 149March 1, 2023 11:40 PM

I think it also could be said that at the time Leyendecker created some of his most homoerotic and sensuous images - the post-WWI years into the Roaring Twenties - was one of the most culturally liberal eras in American history.

As they sang back then: "How ya gonna keep 'em down on the farm, now that they've seen Paree?" Those 10 years before the Depression hit were probably only comparable to the late 1960s-early 1970s in sexual tolerance.

by Anonymousreply 150March 1, 2023 11:40 PM

^ lol, no they weren't. Sodomy laws were on the books, women who had kids out of wedlock were shunned, etc.

by Anonymousreply 151March 2, 2023 12:30 AM

I specifically said "culturally liberal" eras, r151. Which they were.

by Anonymousreply 152March 2, 2023 1:52 AM

R137 I think those illustrations at R135 and 136 are probably by McClelland Barclay, who was killed in the South Pacific during WWII.

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by Anonymousreply 153March 2, 2023 4:01 AM

*

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by Anonymousreply 154March 2, 2023 4:27 AM

Love Otho Cushing

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by Anonymousreply 155March 2, 2023 4:43 AM

The one at R146 vaguely resembles contemporary actor Callum Woodhouse....but obviously bulked up, bigger and almost a Viking in stature.

by Anonymousreply 156March 2, 2023 5:29 AM

"I do remember reading the siblings hated Beach (probably because he had the favoritism and total love from JC - I don’t really see him as a “bully”) and they had endless disputes about living arrangements and money issues with him."

We know very little about J.C. Leyendecker and much less about Charles Allwood Beach. Much of what is supposedly known about J.C.L over years either is quite false. Happily some bits have come to light and things are being pieced together.

It does seem as if many did not like Charles Beach at all, or at least didn't have much or anything good to say about the man. Some say his detractors were simply jealous of his (supposed) great physical beauty, others go on about how he wasn't that bad a person.

We do know yes, Frank Xavier Leyendecker and Augusta Mary Leyendecker did not get on with Charles Beach very much if at all. Things were not quite so harmonious in that New Rochelle mansion with much of the quarreling seemingly centered in Mr. Beach's spendthrift ways (all those wonderful parties and so on) with money that wasn't his. To put it bluntly some likely felt Charles Beach was sponging off J.C.L

In any event things came to a head and resulted in a show down; end result was F.X.L and A.M.L left/were evicted/vacated that New Rochelle mansion. F.X.L would die about three months later which likely weighed heavily on his brother's mind.

For all his fame or whatever J.C.L's funeral and burial was a sparsely attended affair with not even a dozen persons attending. J.C.L was buried in an unmarked grave, it fell to a friend of the man to pony up money a few years later for a grave marker. For all the supposed love between Charles Beach and J.C.L the former couldn't be bothered peeling off a few hundred from his sizable inheritance to see that is dead lover had a proper grave stone.

by Anonymousreply 157March 2, 2023 8:20 AM

"Also in 1923 Leyendecker became engaged to one of his female models, a move possibly designed to end his relationship with Beach. If that was the intent, it had the opposite effect. Beach threatened to expose Leyendecker's homosexuality, and the marriage plans were abruptly canceled. Rockwell, in his 1960 autobiography, scores Beach for his domination and intimidation of Leyendecker and calls him stupid and 'a real parasite clinging to Joe's back.' Rockwell also hints at the true nature of the bond between the two men."

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by Anonymousreply 158March 2, 2023 8:22 AM

[quote]The porn artist Josman also reminds me a bit of his work. (Josman's stuff was hot....but sometimes sketchy and or too pervy.)

Oh my god, Josman! That brings back memories of teenage me - I think those sorts of drawings were the first porn I ever saw online as a teen. Wasn't there another guy called Julian or something too? I know exactly what you mean too - when I was 14/15 years old I found those drawings hot (always loved an older man), but if I'm remembering correctly I think I would find some of them sketchy now too - basically age gap porn, which would be ok when the characters are both of age, except it was kinda uncertain on how old the younger guy was from memory. I think they might have been meant to be about my age when I first saw them, so it didn't seem as weird as it does now. But perhaps I'm misremembering, it's been 20 something years after all. I don't fancy looking them up again, anyway.

by Anonymousreply 159March 2, 2023 9:34 AM

Josman was hot but always about father-son incest, which he didn't have the decency even to disguise as a step-relationship or the like.

Charles Beach must have had JCL good and dickmatized if he was such a vapid, uncaring moocher. Team Augusta Mary!

by Anonymousreply 160March 2, 2023 11:37 AM

Do we have any accounts if their relationship from friends. It just seems to me that all of the negative commentary came from people with axes to grind.

I get the lack of a headstone was an red flag. Also, I would suggest, that their not buried together after a lifelong relationship is a red flag too. But, to be with each other for so long, with a bad boy Beach and JC being the bread winner, I find odd. It just doesn't stack up for me that they'd be together for so long, in some sort of abusive relationship. I know it happens, but it's an odd narrative to me.

by Anonymousreply 161March 2, 2023 11:43 AM

Beach functioned as his assistant and model, so he wasn't a total sponge, but may have become more of one as his looks faded and there was less work to be had. The sister ran the household, so if anyone was going to argue about money with Beach, it would be her. FX was a drunk and relative failure,he probably rsented all kinds of people. Relationships are compicated and can chnage over time, simple tossing out simple descriptions doesnt' always work.

by Anonymousreply 162March 2, 2023 1:08 PM

Did Beach finally end up modeling the Old Year when his ass was no longer Arrow shirt collar material?

by Anonymousreply 163March 2, 2023 1:12 PM

"Also, I would suggest, that their not buried together after a lifelong relationship is a red flag too. "

J.C. Leyendecker is buried at what seems to be a family plot out at Woodlawn cemetery in the Bronx, NY. Himself, parents and siblings are all there IIRC. If no provisions were made for Mr. Beach then it wouldn't have been possible for his remains to be interred with his (alleged) lover. Even if there was room Augusta Mary Leyendecker was still alive when Mr. Beach died and am more than usually sure her response would have been "Hell No!" to that man being buried in her family's plot.

Charles Allwood Beach's life after death of J.C.L is bit of a mystery as there aren't many details as to what he got up to (besides drinking) in his remaining time on earth. While Episcopal church records list his death neither a funeral nor burial is noted. As the famous "Arrow Shirts and Collars" model one would think there would be more than the short local death notice.

Even more interesting is how Find A Grave lists Mr. Beach's final resting place: " Ferncliff Cemetery Charles Allwood Beach ( 01-13-1975 ) Location: M08N - ST - - L-001 Unit 8, Private Storage, Niche L-001 (Not Open To The Public).

January 1975 is about 21 years after Mr. Beach died. Ferncliff Mausoleum Unit 8 is final resting place of various famous person (Moss Hart, Alfred Steele (husband of Joan Crawford), Ed Sullivan....) but they are all listed as "interred" or otherwise buried. Mr. Beach OTOH is in "private storage" that is not open to public.

Charles Beach's living siblings (a brother and sister) both died within few months of his own demise (1954). That was end of his immediate family but there were at least two nephews, but they died before 1975.

by Anonymousreply 164March 2, 2023 1:13 PM

R161

There have been some accounts from friends, people who knew the couple and family (a niece IIRC). NYT piece linked above contains some of their comments.

"James Connell of New Rochelle is one of the few remaining people who knew both Beach and Leyendecker. His father used to work at the artist's house, and Mr. Connell and his brother, Thomas, both posed for Saturday Evening Post covers as children in the late 1930's and early 1940's. Mr. Connell remembers Beach as 'a striking man with a very deep voice,' which he would often use 'to bark at you.' Leyendecker, on the other hand, he recalls as being 'very patient and gentle.' He added, 'They were both lonely people.'

by Anonymousreply 165March 2, 2023 1:23 PM

The cemetery mausoleum probably functioned as temporary storage ebfore burial (e.g., when teh ground was too frozen to dig graves), or someone was poky about picking out a gravesite. It also might serve as a non-denom chapel for services. If there was no one to finalize Beach's arrangements and he didn't plan ahead, his remains would stay there.

Odd about Moss Hart--Jewish customes would dictate burial by the next sunset. I wonder if being at the mauoleum (in a secular cemetery) counted or whether he cared. There's an old joke about Kitty Carlisle's mother telling someone that Kitty was Jewish but she (the mother) wasn't.

by Anonymousreply 166March 2, 2023 1:28 PM

"But in the later years of his life, Leyendecker rarely had contact with anyone other than Beach and his sister. When he died in 1951, six people attended his funeral. Norman Rockwell was one of his pallbearers. Leyendecker left a small estate to Beach and his sister, who had to sell his vast catalogue of drawings in a yard sale on the front lawn of the New Rochelle house, for 75 cents a piece."

That is just so sad....

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by Anonymousreply 167March 2, 2023 1:31 PM

J.C. Leyendecker didn't just pick New Rochelle out of a hat, the place was a hot bed of artists by 1920's. Often called another "Greenwich Village".

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by Anonymousreply 168March 2, 2023 1:35 PM

Somewhere out there I think J.C. Leyendecker would be happy at this bit of news.

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by Anonymousreply 169March 2, 2023 1:38 PM

Someone asked why didn't J.C. Leyendecker do posters after his work for SEP ended, well he did...

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by Anonymousreply 170March 2, 2023 1:41 PM

If you haven't, read the NY Time article at r158. It's a great summary of so much about JC and answers lots of questions.

by Anonymousreply 171March 2, 2023 2:23 PM

George M. Cohan wrote a famous song about New Rochelle called "Only 45 Minutes from Broadway."

by Anonymousreply 172March 2, 2023 2:25 PM

The illustrator John Rutherford Boyd (1884-1951) is a new discovery. His watercolor of Window Dressers is blatant in a way that would have horrified Leyendecker.

Boyd was born in 1882 in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, and attended the Pennsylvania Academy of the Fine Arts, where he studied under Thomas Anshutz.

He worked as a commercial illustrator in Philadelphia, and was art director for the magazine The Ladies' Home Journal from 1909 to 1915. He moved to New York City to become art director for Everybody's Magazine. Boyd revamped the magazine's layout under editor Howard Wheeler, but both their tenures at Everybody's were short Boyd next worked as art director at Squibb & Company (now Bristol-Myers Squibb). He attended evening classes at the Art Students League of New York.

His illustration work appeared on the covers of national magazines, including The Saturday Evening Post. During the 1920s and 1930s, he exhibited regularly at the annual International Exhibition of Watercolors at the Art Institute of Chicago. He was a member of the American Watercolor Society, the Salmagundi Club, and the Architectural League of New York.

Although his commercial art was realistic, he also created abstract sculptures and drawings. These intensely geometric works were the subject of a 1937 short film, Parabola, by Mary Ellen Bute and Ted Nemeth, with music by Darius Milhaud. At the invitation of abstract artist Josef Albers, Boyd was a guest lecturer at Black Mountain College in North Carolina. With his friend J. Ernest G. Yalden, he designed the Yalden Memorial Sundial (1937), at Waterfront Park, in Woods Hole, Massachusetts.

He married fellow PAFA alumna Harriet A. Repplier, and they had two children, Lydia, born 1914 and David, born 1918. The couple bought the Cole-Allaire House at 112 Prospect Street in Leonia, New Jersey in 1916, and spent three years restoring it. They renamed it "Boyd's Nest," and lived there until their deaths. The house is now listed on the National Register of Historic Places.

His watercolor, Flower Garden, Irises and Poppies (1929), sold at Sotheby's New York, on September 24, 2008, for $43,750 – an auction record for the artist.

He died in 1951 in Leonia, New Jersey.

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by Anonymousreply 173March 2, 2023 2:50 PM

The composition of Window Dressers is horrible. The eye doesn't know where to focus, never mid the subject matter. No wonder we've never heard of this illustrator.

by Anonymousreply 174March 2, 2023 3:25 PM

The Josman stuff was hot and only some of it was incestuous, but as with anything published in Handjobs magazine, the undefined ages of the younger characters could make one uneasy.

It was seldom an issue with Josman's drawings but some of the other illustrators they had were much more vile.

Josman's sketches definitely had a classic male form about their bodies and faces.

by Anonymousreply 175March 2, 2023 4:01 PM

The composition is intended ti be jumbled, r174.

He's a very interesting illustrator, much closer to Reginald Marsh than Leyendecker (whom I love) oof Rockwell.

This "In The Subway" is perfection.

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by Anonymousreply 176March 2, 2023 4:07 PM

Yummy!

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by Anonymousreply 177March 2, 2023 4:11 PM

Gay English artist William Bruce Ellis Rankin had elements of Leyendecker, like this wetdream of a Covent Garden worker.

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by Anonymousreply 178March 2, 2023 4:28 PM

Love this crowded soda fountain too.

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by Anonymousreply 179March 2, 2023 4:29 PM

Oh, I love William Bruce Ellis Ranken, r178! Thank you foresting that.

Love "The Garden Door".

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by Anonymousreply 180March 2, 2023 4:33 PM

Another very gay Rankin.

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by Anonymousreply 181March 2, 2023 4:34 PM

Here we go. Rankin: The Garden Door.

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by Anonymousreply 182March 2, 2023 4:36 PM

Someone is going down the garden path for sure........maybe all three of them.

by Anonymousreply 183March 2, 2023 4:39 PM

Ha Ha, 181, 182 Great minds think alike! Love it.

by Anonymousreply 184March 2, 2023 4:39 PM

"Fine Feathers" indeed!

Very glam.

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by Anonymousreply 185March 2, 2023 4:41 PM

The Boy With The Lantern.

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by Anonymousreply 186March 2, 2023 4:45 PM

Cover artwork.

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by Anonymousreply 187March 2, 2023 4:49 PM

Leyendecker imitator?

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by Anonymousreply 188March 2, 2023 4:54 PM

This artist seems to be heavily Leyendecker-inspired and does a lot of gay-themed male nudes. No, I am not him, nor do I know him, but I find his technique interesting and JCL-adjacent.

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by Anonymousreply 189March 2, 2023 5:11 PM

R189 !!!!!!!

I **love** Kenney Mencher's work. I have a print of his hanging on my wall - a shirtless daddy who looks sort of like DL favorite, actor Mark Moses.

by Anonymousreply 190March 2, 2023 5:20 PM

Mencher's work is very much a mix of subjects but is often more bearish men, blue collar men, etc.

He also features nudes. (Warning - NSFW - to see the image click on the listing below, then the second image featured)

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by Anonymousreply 191March 2, 2023 5:23 PM

poster I mentioned at R190

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by Anonymousreply 192March 2, 2023 5:24 PM

*

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by Anonymousreply 193March 2, 2023 5:32 PM

LOL at the fact that a frau is holding that image (an Etsy thing to insert frau)

by Anonymousreply 194March 2, 2023 5:35 PM

Yes, if Leyendecker lived today he'd be portraying overweight saggy-titted bears for sure!

by Anonymousreply 195March 2, 2023 5:35 PM

aw, yeah

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by Anonymousreply 196March 2, 2023 5:40 PM

His work is gorgeous. People who put down illustrators and illustration are just jealous, or trying to be fancy. It is true art. So what if it makes us happy? His work is beautiful.

I was thinking about Brideshead Revisited too. Such glamorous images. Beautiful people and beautiful clothes. I want to watch some historical dramas now.

I don't know why more men don't get those sorts of haircuts. I might pull up an image of one of these guys when I take my teen son to get a haircut this weekend. I'm always trying to describe how I want it to look and these are perfect. (I am a bit of a hair bully but the barbers always ask him if he is okay with what I say. He is super shy so I do have to do the first bit of talking.)

by Anonymousreply 197March 2, 2023 6:38 PM

Otho Cushing lived very close to Leyendecker in New Rochelle

by Anonymousreply 198March 2, 2023 6:46 PM

So Beach was assumed to be Leyendecker's lover but from some of the posts here, I wonder if he was trade or in some sort of BDSM relationship with Leyendecker, where he clearly held the controls.

by Anonymousreply 199March 2, 2023 7:06 PM

You people do too much analysis. BDSM? He was at most kind of controlling. Beach is painted in such a bad light solely by Leyendecker's less famous siblings, who wanted his $$$.

by Anonymousreply 200March 2, 2023 7:37 PM

Same as if Beach had been an opportunistic young woman.

by Anonymousreply 201March 2, 2023 7:40 PM

R201 Oh, very much so. I'm just surprised their relationship lasted if that's the case. Usually a mutually beneficial thing lasts a few years and then everyone moves on.

by Anonymousreply 202March 2, 2023 7:44 PM

They obviously had a symbiotic relationship.

by Anonymousreply 203March 2, 2023 7:48 PM

R28 I know him from What Price Hollywood? (1932)

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by Anonymousreply 204March 2, 2023 8:01 PM

r204, which is the very first version of A Star Is Born (obviously, with a different title).

by Anonymousreply 205March 2, 2023 8:55 PM

So Commissioner Gordon was the first Mr. Norman Maine?

by Anonymousreply 206March 2, 2023 9:00 PM

No, Lowell Sherman was the first Norman Maine. Check that poster art again, r206

by Anonymousreply 207March 2, 2023 9:11 PM

"Leyendecker left a small estate to Beach and his sister, who had to sell his vast catalogue of drawings in a yard sale on the front lawn of the New Rochelle house, for 75 cents a piece."

Am guessing Beach and Ms. Leyendecker "had" to sell J.C.L's catalog and other bits to raise ready money for paying estate taxes both federal and NYS.

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by Anonymousreply 208March 2, 2023 9:52 PM

"The cemetery mausoleum probably functioned as temporary storage ebfore burial"

Assume you are referring to a receiving vault.

As with many other cemeteries in NY Ferncliff isn't exactly inexpensive; current charges for remains interred in a receiving vault are nearly $200/month. In other words that "storage" isn't exactly free and someone or something must have paid or is paying to keep Mr. Beach's remains interred there, otherwise they would have been removed.

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by Anonymousreply 209March 2, 2023 10:12 PM

Well, well; one learns something new every day.

Nosing about for information on Ferncliff Cemetery came upon information listing number of notable LGBT persons whose remains are interred. Had no idea Ona Munson (Belle Watling in "Gone With The Wind" was a lesbian, or at least bisexual.

Elsa Maxwell and James Baldwin OTOH are common knowledge...

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by Anonymousreply 210March 2, 2023 10:16 PM

His work reminds me of another, Charles Gibson, as in the Gibson Girl.

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by Anonymousreply 211March 2, 2023 10:26 PM

I used to have this Royal Doulton plate...

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by Anonymousreply 212March 2, 2023 10:31 PM

Wasn't Judy at Ferncliff before she got plucked off the shelf and moved to Hollywood?

by Anonymousreply 213March 2, 2023 10:39 PM

R213

Yes, Judy Garland's remains were transferred from Ferncliff to Hollywood Forever cemetery several years ago. Stated reason was because former did not offer enough space for Ms. Garland's children and grandchildren to be interred near. Liza M. did the deed.

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by Anonymousreply 214March 2, 2023 10:45 PM

We used to have celebrate childhood birthdays at Farrell's Ice Cream Parlor and their logo was Gibson artwork.

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by Anonymousreply 215March 2, 2023 10:47 PM

Hollywood Forever even named new mausoleum after Judy Garland in honor of her remains being interred.

One wonders if Liza M. negotiated a sweet deal that gives some sort of reduced rates in exchange for lending her late mother's name to that mausoleum. Think of the marketing possibilities!

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by Anonymousreply 216March 2, 2023 10:47 PM

This guy was a very great artist. Real talent. The only fluff about him is those jealous bitches claiming his art is fluff.

Below is the rest of the story when it came to that illustration with the nurse.

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by Anonymousreply 217March 2, 2023 11:31 PM

R205

Yes, it is. But one important change in the A Star is Born films is that the protagonist's career mentor and lover are combined in character. What Price Hollywood? features a director who boosts her career and the man who becomes her husband but doesn't understand her ambition. Still, WPH is a good movie.

by Anonymousreply 218March 2, 2023 11:37 PM

Very sexy thread.

by Anonymousreply 219March 3, 2023 12:00 AM

What happened with Judy Garland is a fairly common situation.

Know of at least two persons going through grief because they cannot be buried near parents or other family because there isn't space. Family plot or plots are full as are those surrounding, so that is that. Unless there is an disinterment which creates a space they will have same choices as Liza M.

by Anonymousreply 220March 3, 2023 12:12 AM

That wasn't the first time Judy Garland was laid in Hollywood.

by Anonymousreply 221March 3, 2023 5:01 PM

GASP!

by Anonymousreply 222March 3, 2023 5:52 PM

R217, love that one. I like how it looks like the guys are subtly cruising each other

by Anonymousreply 223March 3, 2023 5:56 PM

Subtly?

by Anonymousreply 224March 3, 2023 6:06 PM

If only that damned nurse wasn’t in the way…

by Anonymousreply 225March 3, 2023 7:42 PM

I do love Datalounge.

How a discussion about an eminent gay illustrator can turn into a discussion about Judy Garland's final resting place.

Never change DL. Never change

by Anonymousreply 226March 3, 2023 8:53 PM

And r226, this why we must never castigate posters who ask questions, the answers of which, might be easy to google. It's all about the wide-ranging conversations here and what prompts them.

by Anonymousreply 227March 3, 2023 8:59 PM

Glad you said that, R227 - I agree totally.

by Anonymousreply 228March 3, 2023 9:01 PM

R227 Lol!

I have to say that some of the best threads go off on tangents and then come back again to the original subject some how.

by Anonymousreply 229March 3, 2023 9:10 PM

I’m a bit surprised Liza chose Hollywood Forever over a Forest Lawn or Westwood. When I was a film student in 80s LA I loved going to what was then called Hollywood Memorial Park because it was so neglected and overgrown. The owner was embezzling from the trust and the place felt semi-abandoned, Douglas Fairbanks reflecting pool was dry and weedy, there was a permanently half built mausoleum along the Paramount lot border and they had recently built two cheap strip malls full of muffler shops along the Santa Monica Blvd frontage on either side of the entrance. It was the perfect spot to contemplate the folly of fame as you stumbled upon the graves of long dead A-Listers.

New owners turned the place around, but now it is crammed to bursting with many new Tasteful Friends level graves of what appear to be Russian Mobsters - shiny black tombstones etched with photorealistic images of dead drug dealers. It’s weird and tacky in a completely different way than it was weird, tacky and forlorn a generation ago. I bet Liza did score some coin.

by Anonymousreply 230March 4, 2023 12:02 AM

I love he did the Arrow Shirt ads. I love those crisp beautiful shirts and he knocked it out of the park.

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by Anonymousreply 231March 4, 2023 12:38 AM

R188 That advertisement....for the general public.... of two men getting ready to go to bed together says so much about how society and the relationship between men changed over the decades.

by Anonymousreply 232March 4, 2023 12:56 AM

This is what I'm finding fascinating about these pics in general, R232. It's such a different view of masculinity in some ways. It reminds me of my grandfathers who never saw the "gay" in things that I did, if you get me.

I remember as a kid reading Agatha Christie's and in the early ones men would often walk arm in arm and it wasn't considered anything out of the ordinary. All this stuff really interests me.

by Anonymousreply 233March 4, 2023 1:01 AM

[quote]I remember as a kid reading Agatha Christie's and in the early ones men would often walk arm in arm and it wasn't considered anything out of the ordinary.

You will still see that in the Middle East. Until not to long ago, you'd occasionally see that in Italy Not as much today but it still exists.

by Anonymousreply 234March 4, 2023 1:17 AM

Oh yeah, I remember seeing guys holding hands in the Middle East even.

Male friendship is a beautiful thing, it's a shame these ideas of masculinity we've had over time can negatively affect that.

by Anonymousreply 235March 4, 2023 1:31 AM

In many other cultures including Latin based or "Arabic/Muslim" it is more about certain behaviour than how men interact with each other.

Italians, French and many South American males have no problems showing affection in public between two men. Sucking another man's cock or taking it up the ass; now that would be considered gay.

You see this in gay porn where plenty of Latin sort of men will kiss or fuck another man, but are tops only. The infamous male brothels of Paris and elsewhere in France were full of working guys who were otherwise straight. That they fucked other men or allowed themselves to be sucked off by same seemed to be neither here nor there.

by Anonymousreply 236March 4, 2023 1:42 AM

Bringing up another DL favorite film "Maurice" again you see no one was bothered about Maurice and Clive spending so much time alone together. Clive's mother and his wife saw nothing strange about that relationship. Only one who put two and two together and realized there was something more was that butler. He knew what time it was far as Maurice was concerned and even warned Scudder off.

This is why DL always breaks down into heated debates whenever threads are started about vintage photos supposedly featuring gay couples. It may have been possible the couple in question were lovers, or just that two men that were close in way things were then had a picture taken together.

by Anonymousreply 237March 4, 2023 1:48 AM

[quote]Sucking another man's cock or taking it up the ass; now that would be considered gay.

And then of course how in many cases GIVING it up a man's ass, or letting a guy suck YOU wouldn't be considered gay. We humans come up with a lot of funny ideas, huh?

by Anonymousreply 238March 4, 2023 1:49 AM

R238 Nothing odd about it in many cultures. For them, that YOU see it as gay is odd.

by Anonymousreply 239March 4, 2023 1:54 AM

No, I know. But it does come across very much as trying to have your cake and eat it too, to me, anyway. But this is what's so interesting about how we view things.

by Anonymousreply 240March 4, 2023 1:59 AM

R238

Because the sin (if that is correct word) is being passive which implies weakness. Totally opposite of the dominant/machismo culture.

by Anonymousreply 241March 4, 2023 2:01 AM

Perhaps Beach's remains are just his ashes in an urn/box, unclaimed or just left in storage? Someone contact Ferncliff and ask.

by Anonymousreply 242March 4, 2023 2:01 AM

R236 Italy has many similarities. Men will kiss each other warmly there and are affectionate. And there are plenty of places for a married, primarily heterosexual man to find a cocksucker in the grotto to get him off, but none of that would ever involve kissing or buttsex.

by Anonymousreply 243March 4, 2023 2:01 AM

Gore Vidal lived in Italy and said there were plenty of young, straight men prepared to do things for money all the time.

by Anonymousreply 244March 4, 2023 2:03 AM

I think J.C. is taking the piss out of a naive society by planting homoerotic imagery 'hiding in plain sight' in his work.

by Anonymousreply 245March 4, 2023 2:05 AM

Charles Allwood Beach- an apt middle name

by Anonymousreply 246March 4, 2023 2:08 AM

Trust me, he was "all wood"

by Anonymousreply 247March 4, 2023 2:29 AM

JC wasn’t that good looking, was he?

by Anonymousreply 248March 4, 2023 4:35 PM

Men only loved JC for his schvanzshtucker.

by Anonymousreply 249March 4, 2023 4:44 PM

JC was a pocket gay

by Anonymousreply 250March 4, 2023 8:02 PM

The original pocket gay

by Anonymousreply 251March 4, 2023 10:07 PM

But he weirded a Big Brush.

by Anonymousreply 252March 5, 2023 2:19 AM

He bore an unfortunate resemblance to Joseph Goebbels.

by Anonymousreply 253March 5, 2023 2:26 AM

While not perhaps a paupers grave, remains or cremains of Charles Beach seem likely to be "stored" in some unusual arrangement.

If remains were interred Ferncliff would simply say so, but they don't; instead all they give out about Mr. Beach's final resting place is "storage" and "not open to public" which is not usual at all.

It does seem after J.C.L's death Mr. Beach faded into obscurity and or people no longer largely bothered with the man. For all his fame as "Arrow Collar and Shirt" model there is only one small death notice and no real obituary at time of his demise.

Mr. Beach continued living in New Rochelle for rest of his life; thus obviously people locally who knew him "then" as were also knew of his death even if by only second hand sources. There doesn't seem to have been any sort of funeral. Then again for all his fame J.C.L's funeral was sparsely attended and death not widely covered at the time.

by Anonymousreply 254March 6, 2023 12:33 PM

Pure and utter FILTH!

by Anonymousreply 255March 6, 2023 12:47 PM

Was just reading about Ann Sheridan on "Find A Death" website.

Apparently after cremation the ashes were placed into "storage" and never interred as per Ms. Sheridan's final instructions. The cremains remained in storage from time her death (1967) until 2005 when they were finally interred.

Remains or cremains of Charles Allwood Beach may yet be released from storage.

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by Anonymousreply 256March 17, 2023 11:14 AM

I guess I'm the only one but I never really cared for the work of this artist, maybe because his lover-model is not my type? Whenever I've seen his work I tend to skim past it. Like: Oh, yeah, the square-jawed men with the cupid's-bow lips. Also the upper-class aspect turns me off.

by Anonymousreply 257March 17, 2023 12:51 PM

^Neil Hamilton is not my type, either. Though he seemed like a nice guy. Was at the Ogunquit Playhouse a lot back in the day.

by Anonymousreply 258March 17, 2023 12:54 PM

Didn't they find Dorothy Parker's cremains in a file cabinet somewhere?

by Anonymousreply 259March 17, 2023 5:27 PM

I believe Dorothy Parker’s cremains spent a couple of decades in her lawyer’s office before being buried on the grounds of NAACP’s headquarters (she had bequeathed her estate to Dr. Martin Luther King Jr.; unfortunately he was assassinated about a year after she died.)

When the NAACP moved its headquarters it was eventually worked out that Parker’s cremains would be buried with her parents in Woodlawn Cemetery in the Bronx. It got lots of press. Kevin Fitzpatrick runs the site DorothyParker.com and he was instrumental in getting Mrs. Parker to Woodlawn.

by Anonymousreply 260March 18, 2023 6:48 PM

J.C. Leyendecker and Dorothy Parker are actually buried very close by each other in Woodlawn, just to keep on topic

by Anonymousreply 261March 18, 2023 9:14 PM

Good neighbors, good neighbors!

by Anonymousreply 262March 18, 2023 10:34 PM

[quote] J.C. Leyendecker and Dorothy Parker are actually buried very close by each other in Woodlawn, just to keep on topic

And they said real estate never loses value...

by Anonymousreply 263March 19, 2023 12:08 AM

Let's wish a very happy 149th birthday to J. C. Leyendecker today.

by Anonymousreply 264March 24, 2023 3:31 AM

You boys might find this article interesting, speaking of gay artists:

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by Anonymousreply 265March 25, 2023 6:31 AM

Big Leyendecker show opening at the New-York historical Society next month!

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by Anonymousreply 266April 1, 2023 4:58 PM

BTW - Leyendecker, according to the NY Historical Society - was queer. He's not a gay man, but queer.

Oh, and it was Leyendecker who "helped establish a nationalistic ideal of elite and athletic white male beauty." R-i-i-i-ght. It was J.C. - not the demands, requirements of his clients who PAID him for images and illustrations.

God forbid people were able to simply go to an exhibit and look at the work, appreciate it and move along, appreciating the talent it took to create what have become some iconic illustrations. And you won't do it at this exhibit... because J.C.'s work has to be juxtaposed against "some of Leyendecker’s paintings with artifacts that offer counter-narratives to his works’ exclusionary nature, including depictions of fashionable African American men during the Harlem Renaissance,".

The art world, academia, and other parts of society have become exhausting.

by Anonymousreply 267April 1, 2023 6:16 PM

This insistence on labeling dead people with labels they never called themselves is sinister and repulsive. I'm certain Leyendecker would never have called himself "queer." Just as we know that Marsha P. Johnson identified as a man, not a trans woman.

It reminds me of the creepy practice of the Mormon church: Baptizing the dead, whether Jews, Buddhists, or atheists, into the Mormon church after their death.

The same people who demand you call them by the correct pronouns, labels, and names or it's literal MURDER are the ones aggressively mislabeling the dead, who can no longer defend themselves. It's cheap and sad when you have to recruit dead people into your cult, while at the same time (in this case) labeling them white nationalists.

I really want to see this exhibit, but at the same time, I am so fucking tired of being basically berated for daring to enjoy a painting of a beautiful man. I'm so fucking tired of being lectured and harangued by every cultural institution. We must never enjoy anything without thinking of the oppressed, the less fortunate. The purpose of art is not to inspire or to remind us of the beauty in the world; it's to remind us that our pleasures and desires are evil, our culture is wicked, and our souls are polluted with sin.

Maybe I'll skip it, keep enjoying Leyendecker's work on the web, and go get an ice cream cone. Hopefully I'll be able to enjoy it without being rebuked for enjoying a frozen treat while the oppressed are starving.

by Anonymousreply 268April 1, 2023 11:37 PM

R267 Thanks for that. Well said. And you too R268.

[quote]And you won't do it at this exhibit... because J.C.'s work has to be juxtaposed against "some of Leyendecker’s paintings with artifacts that offer counter-narratives to his works’ exclusionary nature, including depictions of fashionable African American men during the Harlem Renaissance,".

Pathetic. And you ain't seen nothing yet.

by Anonymousreply 269April 2, 2023 12:35 AM

R268 - I agree with you, but I definitely want to see some of his work in person. You can ignore the the other “contextualizing” items on display and skip reading the academic wall text - just enjoy the Leyendeckers.

by Anonymousreply 270April 2, 2023 4:37 AM

r268L: The Met recently had an exhibition centered around their bust by Jean-Baptisr Carpeaux of an elslaved woman angry and proud bound with ropes titled "Why Born Enslaved!" which has always been interpreted as the artists promotion of a progressive, anti-slavery stance ....but OF COURSE that's not REALLY what is depicted.

The Met's Carpeaux retrospective 2014 show displayed the Met’s terra-cotta version of "Why Born Enslaved"! Then the museum could still discuss the work in sympathetic terms. The bust’s early success was due to the “beauty of the woman’s expression and the powerful emotion to which it gives rise,” the catalog suggested. Art historian Laure de Margerie wrote in a catalog essay that the bust “partook of the prolonged enthusiasm generated by the abolition of slavery in France in 1848 and in the United States in 1865.”

In 2019, the Met bought the marble version of "Why Born Enslaved!." The acquisition announcement revealed how much had changed in the museum’s curatorial philosophy. The announcement warned future viewers about patriarchy and white privilege: “It is critical to reckon with the power imbalance enacted when a white male artist transposes the body of a black woman into an emblem of enslavement.” Though the statue had heretofore been interpreted (including by the Met) as “an expression of Carpeaux’s stance against slavery,” the museum was no longer taken in. In fact, the bust was a “disturbing fantasy of aestheticized bondage—the transformation of human carnage into erotically-charged drama,” the acquisition announcement explained.

The Met’s next critique of "Why Born Enslaved"! erases in one stroke a foundational component of Western art: the nude. The garment of Carpeaux’s captive has fallen below one of her breasts. This partial nudity turns the work into racist soft porn, according to the Met. Assistant curator Nelson describes Why Born Enslaved! as “an eroticized object for visual consumption” that gives form to “colonialist fantasies about the physical possession and containment of black women’s bodies.” A wall text echoes Nelson’s outrage at what she calls “so much flesh.” Carpeaux’s bust allows us to accept that the “Black female body can still be collected and consumed, be gazed at, desired, despised, dissected, and distorted by all.”

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by Anonymousreply 271April 2, 2023 5:03 AM

I propose an alternative to the once very, very funny evenings where comics/actors would read from celebrity autobiographies... now we should have comics/actors on stages giving dramatic readings of art descriptions and deconstructions. Gah, that clap trap from The Met should be the opening...

by Anonymousreply 272April 2, 2023 10:26 AM

[quote]erases in one stroke a foundational component of Western art: the nude

Mary!

by Anonymousreply 273April 2, 2023 12:11 PM

R272 That would be so funny.

I find going to a gallery exhausting nowadays. Whereas before you'd get a description of the painting, the background to the artist and maybe a description of the iconography, nowadays you get a whole counter exhibition and a modern interpretation of what the artis really intended to convey. I wish those who write all the guff would get a life.

I just want to go along, appreciate a fine piece of artwork, enjoy it and move on. I don't want a lecture about why it's so bad to enjoy it.

by Anonymousreply 274April 2, 2023 12:21 PM

It's remarkable how similar this "contextualizing" claptrap is to Puritanism.

Aesthetic pleasures and beauty = EVIL.

Hating your rotten flesh and your very existence for the Original Sin into which you were born = GOOD.

Of course, the Puritans believed that the Original Sin was Adam and Eve's. Our modern-day puritans believe it was slavery. No person is innocent.

The Puritans said, "In Adam's fall, we sinned all." The modern puritans believe that all are guilty of racism. ALL. All are guilty of the sin of slavery by virtue of not being black. ALL.

I keep wondering if people will ever feel this puritanism and enforced miserableness has gone too far, but I don't see any signs of a backlash. Instead, it's just expanding exponentially, as the contrast between the 2014 and 2019 exhibits of the Carpeaux bust shows (thanks, R271). Maybe it will never end. I'm just glad I'm old enough to remember a time when beauty could be appreciated for beauty's sake, and people were allowed to put their own interpretations on art.

I feel sorry for people being raised today. They're being trained so that they'll never be able to look at something beautiful without an inner voice nagging them that they're sinners, and being happy in the presence of beauty is a sign that they are oppressors.

by Anonymousreply 275April 2, 2023 1:45 PM

The Facebook group "The Golden Age Of Illustration" has frequent posts of Leyendecker illustrations, including the sexy ones.

by Anonymousreply 276April 3, 2023 1:19 AM

Bravo R275.

by Anonymousreply 277April 3, 2023 10:17 PM
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