Unemployed actor has no money to pay for anything.

Time to downsize. Don't allow that home to be foreclosed on.

Typical narcissist. Get a good thing going, fuck it all up through carelessness and poor impulse control, then demand that somebody else fix it. Because it’s never their fault.

His wife is an insane alcoholic. I don't Balme hime for seeking to happiness.

blame!

Time to start an Onlyfans.

His American bank account… what about the others?

His wife is delusional + refuses to work + has told their children vile things about him. She taunted him when drunk and said he had 'saggy vagina eyes' + she looks like an overweight wino + she is a fucking racist.

Hope he gets it all.

Gets what? He is saying he doesn't have anything

His wife is nuts! Look at this psycho.

Can’t his (fuck) buddy Matthew Rhys help him out?

I"M BROKE! BROKE I TELL YA! NOT A FARTHING TO ME NAME!

Join the club.

It takes two to tango bitch. Stop queefing out kids you can't afford!

He's very handsome

[quote]She taunted him when drunk and said he had 'saggy vagina eyes'

Which was hilarious and if she'd said it to anyone else, she'd be a Datalounge hero.

This is a piece planted by his divorce attorneys in a pathetic attempt to not give anything to his ex-wife or the kids from his their marriage.

R9 wow had not seen that - or anything from her really - what a looney

I would visit the website but I dislike reddit too much.

Where there's a will there's a way..

[quote]On top of that, he said the parties’ debts are mounting. He said the mortgage payments are three months behind and he owes $15k. In addition, he owes $11k in property tax payments and €67,760 in taxes to the French government for his 2021 work there.

[quote]Gruffudd said other debts with Evans include thousands in back taxes and $4,616 to the Los Angeles Department of water and Power.

The ex has her own problems, but he's a deadbeat and I feel bad for their kids. His lower income in 2022 was probably an intentional maneuver in his fight against Evans.

I don't have any sympathy. He said in an interview before they split that she was a handful and pushed him to propose and that they spent hundreds of thousands on IVF.

So...she was a bitch, she's been a bitch since you were dating, and you CHOSE to marry her and worked hard to have children.

Fucking moron.

R7 that’s a strong accusation…what proof do you have of her racism?

Daughters Ella and Elsie.

Wow, these two are creative.

Well, he’s Welsh so he has excuses.

Most marriages lead to destruction. No wonder men nowadays are walking away from marriage. I hate straight people

R21 it reminds me a bit of the subreddit Borderlines loved ones. The stories from relatives and children are usually very sympathy inducing. But there's a large segment of male posters who whine all day about their ex girlfriends. The problem is that they tell anecdotes about these women that make it clear that they were always mean spirited raving lunatics. So what does that say about them that they stayed for so long.

R9 who took the video?

The schadenfreude is strong.

Maybe his Welsh bud Matthew Rhys could jump in and help. Crazy how Ioan seemed like the more promising actor at one time. But that's Hollywood for you.

He could flash his cock and ass on cam and make that money in a day

He owned that house before he married the cunt.

He's welcome to stay with me...

In most divorce cases, especially when kids are involved, if neither can afford to maintain the house, as a marital asset, the judge rules it must be sold and more suitable/affordable arrangements are made.

He doesn’t have an investment account? No savings?! Ugh, what a dummy.

How come the ex-wife isn’t paying him alimony?

[quote]R25 Most marriages lead to destruction.

My sister just divorced after 20 years, but she loves her kids more than anything in the world and can’t imagine life without them.

A marriage can dissolve but it doesn’t mean it was a mistake.

Can someone tell me what films these 2 have been in? They look familiar but I can't name anything I remember.

R37 = Glenn Close

He should've taken their fertility struggles as a sign from the Universe

Been there. Done that.

Have him call me. I can help.

7 grand per month? That figure is the asking rent for an apartment in a so-so neighborhood in New York City.

Kate plus 8 just "downsized" to a home in the South that costs the same.

Sell the home and move to London

Ioan was in TITANIC & SAN ANDREAS…for r37.

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

Her daughter took the video and has complained to Ioan about their mother's alcoholism

Bet the younger piece who he cheated with is rueing the day she hooked up with him. Hope she has been practicing her gold digger skills cuz she’s gonna need to find a more successful mark.

He needs to sell that bony ass of his!

He's very sexy

I have no time for "artists" who complain about not having steady work. Do what most people do and get a 40+ hour per week job to pay your bills.

Covid derailed plans and careers for some. The wife was a stay at home parent and in hindsight that was a mistake.

I think he would have been fine with her being a stay at hoe mom if she hadn't become a fat abusive alcoholic.

Crazy person

The youtuber is a skank, watch the video

I hate all these people including the YouTuber. But I would suck his dick dry.

He peaked in the early 2000s, but he has continued to work consistently until this year.

[quote]He revealed his savings have been depleted since the split and he currently holds $2,829 in his American bank accounts and approximately £12,193 in his United Kingdom bank account. He said he has no investment accounts.

I can't imagine making a few hundred thousand a year, let alone the money had was pulling in at one point, and not having any investment accounts - I call bullshit. His only asset is the home he had with his wife and kids? Impossible or incredibly stupid - I'm unsure which.

People burn through cash. Unless they have inherited wealth, many do go broke after a period of being flush. Fast, flashy, image conscious people. Show biz people.

It’s really not that much once the agent, PR, stylists and makeup people are paid, plus I bet there are a lot of hangers-on around.

I burn through cash and love to shop. Because stores now have reduced hours of operation (covid) and many locations have closed permanently, compulsive shopping has been less problematic for me. Online shopping doesn't do it for me.

The only thing I remember him in is those two "Fantastic Four" movies in the early 2000s when he played Reed Richards. He was alright, but I was focused on Chris Evans.

No matter his other expenses (his hair, teeth and tan alone probably cost more on an annual basis than he's willing to pay for his kids), the lack of investments is unusual simply because it's a simple tax reduction strategy. Then again, he's stopped paying his taxes, so why would he care about that?

"102 Dalmatians star" is the saddest like I've ever read.

Line ^^

Hi Alice! Can’t Piers Morgan get you a job?

No one that handsome should have to go through this.

I thought he was on some show or did that end?

Harrow was an Australian drama about a maverick Medical Examiner. It was fine for what it was, but a typically low-budget production.

After the divorce even if he is bankrupt, Ioan will be fine if he moves back to the UK and gets an arc on Coronation Street and teaches acting at a regional drama school. Obviously the USA grind is not for him but he will be able to make - a much smaller - living.

I don’t see how most actors can pull in big salaries anymore. I’m sure many of them must be close to broke.

Can we call him “Loan”? Because that’s what his name looks like anyway (the ‘I’ just looks like a lowercase L here on DL), and it’s funny.

didn't he used to be into wet work?

He received excellent notices for playing the title role in the Hornblower series back in the late 90s, but inexplicably his career seemed to stall afterwards. Most of the actors I know in LA spend every penny they earn, and then some.

He should have known that you NEVER spend a penny unless and until you have enough in your savings account(s) to cover at least 3 months but preferably 6 months of living expenses — every conceivable expense that might come your way (medical, pet, unexpected travel), on top of basic living expenses, x3 or x6.

I think he’s learned his lesson now, though.

R63 🤣🤣🤣

Can’t Ioan take out a loan?

R70, if he's spent several months making the house payment, he did in fact have money saved. The wife is a cunt for not wanting to sell- he has $1.2 million in equity. If that place ends up in foreclosure, they both get squat.

She should definitely be forced to sell!

I’m totally Team Loan.

He's lying. And he's not living off the girlfriend.

They were together for so long... water found its own level.

The wife argues moving will disrupt the lives of their daughters too greatly.

Wikipedia credits him with appearing in over 30 movies and 32 television shows, he should have saved some of that money.

I’m Lois Ioan.

Better days.

Pussy just ain’t worth the trouble

I oan nothing!

He was often naked on Forever.

Someone tell Alice it'll be more disruptive if they get thrown out of the house and no money for a new place

It's strange that he has so much of the mortgage left to pay. That Aussie show of his ran for three seasons, right? It sold internationally?

Alice would love to be thrown out. She wants to bury Ol' Saggy Vagina Eyes.

I've seen Harrow.

He's a massive ham.

He's very handsome and a very good actor - especially in Hornblower and Forever.

I also remember seeing him in a mini-series or PBS special in which he played an architect who was having an affair with his client's wife. It was very good - and so was he.

I only saw one episode of Harrow, about a teen swimmer death. Gays boys abounded. I can well belive he fucked his TV daughter.

He's not a very good actor. He has a good voice but he makes little impression otherwise.

R87 I became a major admirer of Ioan since the Hornblower series.

I can’t feel sorry for overpaid actors.

Huge trainwreck and I can't look away

Alice Evans IS Francine Fishpaw

IS THERE ANY QUID OUT THERE!

Ioan's naked butt in 'Hornblower':

Why doesn't he start an OnlyFans account like normal people??!!

What ass? Where’s he hiding it? Lol, POW butt.

Alice Evans IS what they wanted to paint Amber Heard to be. But those Deppstans don't care because it was never about the "hidden epidemic of women abusing men"

She sounds like a real bitch...

No money? Sure, Jan.

Ioan Griffudd is pronounced YO-an Griffith.

Can't his old pal Matthew get him a gig or two?

This guy is nice looking but dumb. Ignored huge red flags on the crazy cunt he married and mismanaged money.

She is crazy and drunk but it sounds like he bought a house he couldnt afford as well. Will a divorce judge order them to sell the house and just split the money?

The real indicator of him being broke or not will be if the new girlfriend leaves him.

He's quite handsome

^The dim ones often are...

[quote] POW butt

Prisoner of war butt?

R80, it's men who are the problem

I liked the Australian series he was in where he was a coroner, but they pretty much played out every scenario and it got a little ridiculous and I couldn’t be bothered watching another season.

I seriously thought he was gay for some reason.

He could do a porn video called The Horn-blower.

I'd buy a copy to boost his savings.

[quote]I seriously thought he was gay for some reason.

About 20 years ago, DL thought he was gay because he lived with Matthew Rhys and they played a gay couple in [italic]Very Annie Mary.[/italic]

Very cute ass at R95.

Haha....so well deserved.

[quote]Sell the home and move to London

I genuinely laughed at this one. But the house absolutely should be sold and they need to downsize regardless.

Straight people problems.

How does one pronounce Ioan?

R49, lounging around in a $2MM dollar house for free and collecting $7k per month from him. If anyone is a deadbeat here it's her. This whole "stay at home mom" as a "career" is such bullshit for women like her to be living the life of luxury like that for doing little to nothing.

R76 Translation, it will "disrupt" HER life too much. She's a lazy freeloading bitch using the kids as pawns because she's to bothered to do any work herself, and is living way above her means and wants to keep it that way.

It's nothing to do with work. She doesn't want Ioan's plans to come to fruition. Simple as that.

[quote] He revealed his savings have been depleted since the split and he currently holds $2,829 in his American bank accounts and approximately £12,193 in his United Kingdom bank account. He said he has no investment accounts.

This is a game. As soon as he knew he was leaving wife he moved his assets offshore. Decades in the business and some gigs that paid well, he's got money. He's hiding it from ex and the court. He could get voiceover work, or do Capital One commercials, tomorrow if he truly needed money. Instead he wants to sell his children's home?! Court should force him off his lazy ass and back to work.

He saved Rose in "Titanic"..."COME ABOUT!"

R116 His name is pronounced Io-an Griffith. dd is in the Welsh alphabet and it's pronounced th. You can Youtube or google to hear pronunciations.

If I had been on Titanic, I'd have used that very supple ass at R95 as a flotation device.

I’m glad that women are not able to easily take men to the cleaners in divorces anymore, and I’m a woman. This bitch needs to get a fucking JOB, and he does too! Both of them can drive an Uber, yeah? That’s what all other Americans are doing right now, but I know that destroys their cognitive dissonance that they aren’t the working class. He thinks telling the courts he’s broke is the ultimate. No, the ultimate is getting a fucking job again so you can support your kids — no excuse for either parent to remain unemployed.

Did he burn bridges at work? He had a solid working actor career. He should have his agent work and take everything that's offered from Hallmark movies, pilots and commercials. He has kids to feed.

Maybe he refused to put out.

This is like Depp vs. Heard, they're BOTH monumental assholes! She's a leech, and he's hidden his assets to avoid paying child support and to deny his ex community property that is hers by legal right.

He was pretty big in the 90s and 0os, and has been working steadily since. He isn't broke, he's dragged his kids to fucking horrible Twentynine Palms because he's playing the ROLE OF A LIFETIME, the supposedly broke and abused dad.

He is a simpleton but she's a dumb bitch. Never stop travelers. Let him leave with grace. This makes her look like a moron - which she probably is.

[quote] I’m glad that women are not able to easily take men to the cleaners in divorces anymore

This is a common assumption in divorce but the reality is divorced men are far more affluent after divorce than women are. Studies show this time after time. This holds true in when children are involved as well.

As far as child support, Gruffudd is positioning himself to be as impoverished as he can so child support will be minimal. He wants custody so he needn't pay any child support at all, not because he's such a devoted father or worried about his kids welfare with his ex-wife who is the middle of an extended nervous breakdown. BTW, if he tries to get custody based on Alice's ravings on social media her attorney will argue it was all due to the stress of divorce, and if she is such a bad mother why did Gruffudd let her take care of the kids for 13 years? They will be awarded joint custody which is the usual default judgment.

If Gruffudd is found to be as poor as he says during discovery, the court will order the house to be sold and child support to be determined by a formula based on Gruffudd's income and the INCOME of his non-working ex. That's right, Alice will have an income attributed to her even f she is not working, usually based on her past earnings and other criteria like education. This will mean less child support goes to the stay at home spouse even thought that was the status quo.

Mothers need to understand their full time mothering is irrelevant when child support is calculated. If they continue to take care of the kids they will have to pay for it in the form of reduced child support based on this imaginary income. The numbers are cold, hard computer-generated formulas. No spouse takes the other to the cleaners in divorce but men are better off financially post divorce than women.

This is sad to me because he may be a jerk and a nerd, but Gruffud is a brilliant actor. He has gotten in his own way a time or two, but he really is a fine actor given the chance. I hope he gets back on his feet. I always liked him. I loved Horatio Hornblower, but his turn in the movie Solomon and Gaenor in 1999 was totally brilliant. I urge you to try to find it and watch it. It is not a happy movie. But he was incredible.

I agree with your post too r129 (I’m the poster you quoted). I should have been more specific in my post as I was referring to women who choose not to work their adult lives and then expect to be financially supported “in the lifestyle to which I’m now accustomed” a lá Betty Broderick. I didn’t work my fucking ass off as a woman so that I can depend on another person to support my existence, no adult should do that.

I believe that the reason men do better financially after a divorce is because they make more to begin with, and the bulk of childcare costs always fall onto the mother too, so women take the double whammy on the back side of the divorce. Women and children get hurt more than the men. But I don’t appreciate women who are leeches, they don’t help our cause either.

"This is a common assumption in divorce but the reality is divorced men are far more affluent after divorce than women are. Studies show this time after time. This holds true in when children are involved as well."

R129, you're just admitting the very reason she's a freeloader and a negligent parent. Her only aspiration in life was to throw her legs in the air to some guy with $$$, so she never has to work a day in her life and earn a real living. She's deflecting trying to make it "all about the kids".

R132 I'm not 'admitting' anything. You sound damaged. Childcare is work. Didn't your mommy love you?

She can make it 'all about the kids' and it won't do her any good. The courts don't care. That's my point. Women with kids don't take their exes to the cleaners, it's more the reverse. After a short dip the man's income is higher than ever.

Happy now asshole?

You wanted to be a pick me girl R133. It won't win you any gay fans.

R133, "Women with kids take their exes to the cleaners"

There, fixed that for you.

"Childcare is work"... so is flipping burgers at McDonalds. That doesn't get you into a multi million dollar mansion. You sound like you're whole journey in life was to just get laid, fart out some kids and sit on your fat lazy ass all day while they're off at daycare and school and your husband is off making actual money.

That's a total false equivalency. Did I strike a nerve with you because that's all you yourself ever did was never pursue a real career in the first place?

R135 Do you think you are talking to your Mommy? What happened to you? Wifey take you to the cleaners? Mommy didn't like your squished little face?

You bitter straights really need to educate yourself about the law, which was all I was talking about. I actually KNOW what I'm talking about. You should try it.

I believe you r136, that poster is completely unhinged, I recommend you not respond to it.

R136, hey ding dong. You are aware this is a GAY site aren't you?

It's beyond obvious how to out the straight women and the "stay at home karen's" on this site...

Go back to LSA or CDAN

I believe you R135, she's an unhinged mess!

Holy shit I just checked R138 posting history. My bad. Do not engage.

So cute

He was really hot and easy to watch in an Australian show Harrow. He did seem to work a lot before his home situation went viral.

Yep. He's hiding money.

R129 is correct, when straights divorce the man is usually the one better off financially, and if I'm right about him hiding assets to keep her from getting her share of the community property, he'll probably be the one better off. She won't be able to prove he's hiding assets unless she can prove it, and what are the odds a housewife whose house is facing foreclosure can afford top forensic accountancy? So he'll probably cry poor for a bit, finallhy accept a couple of jobs, and be praised for a fabulous comeback.

But they aren't just fighting over community property and child support, they're fighting for the hearts and minds of the public... and he'll probably win there too! Weird thing, but the celebrity-following public are always willing to slam the wife of any vaguely attractive male celebrity, and of course nobody in the world has anything but contempt for a housewife who gains weight and loses her shit on social media (even me). So he'll probably be a popular actor again in a few years, and she'll never get another acting job, and getting any job at all is going to be touch.

Maybe Picasso's family will pay for it.

She looks insane.

You think he's going to take a chance and hide assets in a court of law?

^ It would be risky and the penalty severe. I tend to believe he doesn't have much to hide but it's likely his strategic move to be underemployed right now.

"You think he's going to take a chance and hide assets in a court of law?"

The penalty may be severe if he's caught, but who's gonna catch him? I don't believe the courts dig into people's finances in detail, it's up to the opposing attorney or their witnesses to prove that someone's financial statements aren't honest. And like I said, a housewife whose home is facing foreclosure isn't going to be able to afford top forensic accountants.

Why is his head shaped like a tootsie roll?

I can't believe his wife turned up to an event in a white dress with a thread hanging loose at r79. Although it's otherwise clear she didn't engage the services of a stylist.

Well Ioan turned up with his saggy old vagina eyes.

That’s about double what I’ve got in the bank

When was he ever a "popular" actor?

Yeah he gets supporting roles on some big productions, but he's a face people recognize, not a name that gets butts in seats

He has played leading roles even if he never broke through, really. It's very fishy that he had so much left on his mortgage, though. Didn't he do at least two Fantastic Four movies?

R155 I totally forgot about those.

Enough said

Not enough said. The man has made good money over the years.

My point wasnt whether he made money, but whether he was "popular".

He's never been a marquee name. This crazy divorce isn't getting Brangelina coverage.

Well, duh.

Alice Evans IS crazy. The first time I ever heard of her was when a friend of mine got into a fight with her on social media. My friend was a Bernie Sanders supporter in 2016 (as was I) and she equated Sanders supporters with rapists. I don’t care how you feel about Bernie Sanders, that’s a fucking insane line of thought.

That said, I don’t think Gruffudd is a great person either. Last night, after reading this thread, I went down one of those internet rabbit holes and read plenty of nutzoid behavior from them both.

The best thing I found was this post old post on Oh No They Didn’t about Gruffudd and his self-funded “fan” site.

That dampens things a bit, r160. He's still pretty hot, though. I wonder if his ex wife has been diagnosed with a personality disorder of some sort.

Lying about having no money and no assets is Divorce Court 101

[quote]I seriously thought he was gay for some reason.

I thought so too after seeing him as bitchy Lancelot in King Arthur. They scrapped the original storyline of him competing with Arthur for Guinevere, so it ended up looking like he was competing with her for Arthur.

My friend was part of that IMDB group and after Ioan got it shut down, she went to another site and continued to "slag the slag" for several months. That's where I saw their wedding photos, featuring drunk of her ass Alice slinging back mojitos and literally falling down drunk.

Just finished watching Gruffudd's latest TV series 'The Reunion' set in Antibes. Good cast but must say poor Ioan is looking a little hagged.

Yes, what's left of the hair is holding on for dear life.

R164 That's hilarious! Do you have any more stories because I'm now obsessed with these two?

Saggy vagina eyes lives rent free in my head.

I was only on my friend's site for a few months before she finally got bored and closed the account. It was mostly posts of Alice drunk and Ioan trying to wrangle her away from TMZ's cameras. The wedding photos were taken near a beach, and many featured Alice (aka "the slag") drinking mojitos with her gal pals, then staggering around and falling over.

They are fascinating . And thanks to her, he's more famous than he's ever been. It will probably count against him getting jobs though. He's tabloid bait now.

Will he go into the jungle?

He cheated on her away on location most of the time while she stayed home and raised the kids by herself. This went on for years. He's a big party guy, lots of coke.

The wife is a headcase, there's no denying that but I still don't like him and think he's a selfish prick.

I saw a story about him wanting to sell their house. He put in no alternative plan for the children. Are they supposed to live on the street because douchebro here doesn't love Mommy anymore? He complains about her "living rent free" while he says nothing about her being at home for the kids.

He's douchbro, she's a good facade maker.

Isn't it fishy that he has a thing for women with chronic illness?

So how much money would he have blown on coke?

And was he really rumoured to have fucked his on-screen daughter in Harrow?

Test

More stuff I've learned about these two:

Gruffudd bought the house that they own before he married Evans. He put her on the deed after they were married.

The Smaily Smail published some of Evans’ emails to Gruffudd and they are insane. In them, she constantly berated and insulted him. She liked to use Matthew Rhys’s success to mock him, implying that she hitched her wagon to the wrong horse. She really comes across as one of those women who think that every guy is in love with them and could get any man she wants.

When they initially split, Evans basically begged Gruffudd to come back to her on social media and in interviews. It was so pathetic that reading the things she said made me pity her a tiny bit.

After it became clear that Gruffudd was never coming back, Evans berated him constantly on Instagram.

Evans claims Gruffudd started cheating on her with other women; but, in one of her emails, she also implies that he is gay and bad in bed. Which, yes, contradicts the cheating with women claim.

A lot of people think that Evans was the subject of the linked blind. The man in question is Joseph Morgan.

She claims that turning down Whalestein’s advances hurt both her and Gruffudd’s careers. I think she's right on this one.

She got into it with Jessica Alba during the filming of one of the Fantastic Four movies and was banned from set.

Set up a Go Fund Me to beg for money and got around $5,000 from gullible fans.

Was selling cameos but didn’t follow through half the time and was usually drunk when she actually did them.

In one of the court transcripts, she called her older daughter “bitch” because the kid cried when Evans broke her promise not to drink on the child’s birthday. (The fact that her daughter’s birthday request was for her mom not to drink for one day is just sad.) She seems to hate her oldest kid.

I’m a forensic account and I can pretty much guarantee that Gruffudd’s hiding money from her, but she does sound vindictive and legitimately insane.

Evans' gofundme

>>She got into it with Jessica Alba during the filming of one of the Fantastic Four movies and was banned from set.

That would be a reason why his career never took off in Hollywood. Why the hell did he marry her if she's always been a mess? Is he unstable too? I hope her daughters post more embarrassing videos of her until she loses custody. The bit about the daughter not wanting her to drink is tragic.

She's crazy and a selfish asshole.

He's an even bigger selfish asshole and lacks the insanity excuse.

I can't wait for his thirsty girlfriend to bail on him for a guy with money and a future.

I can't believe her gofundme has raised almost $6K! She's an idiot!

R180 If you look at the gofundme, several people admit that they gave the minimum ($5) so that they could tell her how much she sucks.

She doesn't suck, certainly not any more than he sucks. He had a younger mistress for a few years and finally got up the nerve to leave his wife. His wife flipped out and took it public. Then he and the mistress took it public. Both sides have been ugly to each other and it's a mess.

Bad breakup, nasty divorce. Yawn. Happens every day, these two just get more publicity than most couples.

This mess has given them more attention than any acting work they've done.

This mess also feels like it's been going on for years.

Because of streaming and digital, like never before, networks are able to measure with more with more granularity, the impact of its characters with their audience, and the interplay between them down to the minute, moment and the penny, as well as audience responses to introducing new characters, new situations, and even older scripts. Even the best handlers cannot argue with engagement metrics- in the Neilson audiences, they use the front camera to measure which characters are looked at measuring what the viewer’s eyeballs are looking at on the screen moment to moment!

It was very calculated to get rid of Giddish, I’m guessing some of the newer younger cast are popping off those charts and her lawyers cannot argue such pinpoint engagement measurements. Expect them to use it to haggle down future contracts as well.