Four Students Found Dead Near the University of Idaho - Part Five

Thank you for the new thread, FoxyBoodle

My pleasure R1 xo

A little early.

...Santa Claus?

Not without my car

I hope the FBI gets involved because those Idaho cops are bumbling fools.

Oregon must the perfect training ground for a fledgling thrill killer, since there have been several unsolved fatal stabbings with no suspects and no known motives. But according to Moscow PD, they are definitely unrelated to the Idaho, because… ?

^^”Idaho killings.”

Poor r6. So lost.

Pa Goncalves:

"In the end they died together; in the same room, and the same bed."

Making Chaturbate videos?

I guarantee you that the reason there is no leads here is because of shitty police work. Do you really think the crazy Trump supporting cops are good at their jobs in fucking Idaho?

R4 house was targeted? by whom and for what? the house was known for party in a college town, not drugs and it is not in Mexico or some border town.

They're not used to multiple daily murders as in r12's hometown.

The dad who keeps talking to the press feels sketchy. He didn’t want a funeral for his dead daughter for fear the “killer would show up”. Um everyone knows you do want a funeral in hopes the killer shows up. He just doesn’t seem broken up for a dad who lost his child.

Speculation the killer could attend vigil for victims.

Are they still dead?

R17 Not a Jesus among them.

The fathers were a mess. Kaylee’s had the demeanor of a guy who was convinced he was the life of every party. He also started off by reciting the Goncalves Declaration of Separation: “The two that I’m up here to talk about are the ones I knew.”

Madison’s dad was just sad, standing there fidgeting in his borrowed suit. He seemed like one of those shy, socially awkward kids for whom there was no intervention. It was especially poignant when he said he was nervous about following Kaylee’s dad, because he’s “really good at talking.” Yikes.

Ethan’s mother was standard middle-class mom. She didn’t mention Xana at all.

How many Xanax did Ethan’s mom take to get through that all? She was just probably holding on to get to the next one.

From the pictures I've seen, they looked like good kids. FBI, parents listen to me.

[quote]…house was targeted? by whom and for what? the house was known for party in a college town, not drugs and it is not in Mexico or some border town

The new speculation is that the residence was targeted for being a sorority house, similar to Ted Bundy’s stalking of sorority girls and subsequent spree killing in their home. Even though there are no signs of sexual assault, one of the ex-FBI profilers (I think it was the fur-collar Xmas lady) explained that stabbings can have sexual overtones, namely close-up penetration and gross bodily violation.) In some cases, stabbings are a substitute for rape. And it is possible it was a popular location for drug deals because of the lack of security cameras. Also, Idaho has a drug epidemic — meth, heroin, opioids —- and two of the victims’ parents were recently arrested for drug offenses.

What a clusterfuck. A reporter from Boise's NBC affiliate interviewed the prosecutor this morning and then tweeted this:

[quote]NEW: I just interviewed @LatahCountyID prosecuting attorney Bill Thompson. He confirmed that one of the victims in the home was in fact the target. He also said he’s confident they are going to find out who did this & hold them accountable. Tune in to @KTVB at 4 for his intvw

That was followed by:

[quote]BREAKING: I just received this letter on behalf of the Latah Co Prosecutor I interviewed earlier: "Thank you for the opportunity to speak with you today. We want to let you know that there was a miscommunication between detectives and my office. To clarify, investigators do not believe the murders were random, but we cannot unequivocally state the residence, or any occupants, were specifically targeted. I apologize for any confusion."

She tweeted:

[quote]Earlier, he told me that one of the residents was definitely targeted, and investigators were trying to figure out who.

Then the Moscow Police emailed her:

[quote]CORRECTION FROM #MoscowPD

[quote]"Conflicting information has been released over the past 24 hours. The Latah County Prosecutor’s Office stated the suspect(s) specifically looked at this residence, and that one or more of the occupants were undoubtedly targeted. We have spoken with the Latah County Prosecutor’s Office and identified this was a miscommunication. Detectives do not currently know if the residence or any occupants were specifically targeted but continue to investigate.

On the 4 o'clock news, she said: "Yesterday, the prosecutor told a national news outlet that investigators believe the house was targeted but couldn't say yet whether a particular person was targeted. Today, the prosecutor, Bill Thompson, told me that he's not sure where the confusion is coming from, and investigators believe this attack was focused on one specific person in the home, although he said they don't know for sure which of the four victims it was.

And now she was just on the 10 o'clock news reiterating very emphatically that he told her that it was one specific person who was targeted.

To be fair, Christmas Eve is just around the corner and he's probably overwhelmed with elf drama and reindeer too fat to get off the ground.

R19 I feel bad for the girl but I'm starting to turn against this family who decided to star in the movie. It's very disrespectful to everybody else and I heard the dad already hired a PI. I don't trust these PIs I think 90% of them have to be scammers like psychics who prey on the grieving. The other families seem lovely. Very sad. Never seen a man look so lost like that Madison's father. He seems like a sweet guy. I wonder if Kaylee's dad hired the PI after getting scolded by LE for jabbering too much, spitefully.

I'm still amazed that two of them have jailbird parents!

“The house was targeted” could mean the landlord was targeted. The house lost any value on the market, no one would ever live there again. A local lunatic and extremely violent person wanted to ruin the landlord’s business. Lunatics always find “political and social” motivation for their insanity.

The other stabbing of a young couple happened last year in Salem, Oregon on August 13th, at around 3AM, but luckily the woman survived. No suspect, no sexual assault, no robbery, no other apparent motive. Then, in the Portland area last September, there were two more fatal stabbings, two days apart. The victims were both men in their late 40s who were killed only a mile from each other. One lived in his car and was found dead in a church driveway on Sept. 12, while the other was found dead in his residence at 1:30 AM on Sept. 15. Again, no suspects, no known motives.

It could be that some whack-job(s) is/are hunting humans for excitement, and the stabbings are only getting bolder and more violent. Portland had a record number of homicides last year and is an ideal place for a fledgling serial killer to fly under the radar before getting bolder and moving on to another area with more challenging “prey.”

What a nightmare for the families. I just feel bad for them. Horrible.

The dog has shifty eyes!

Can anyone say more about which two parents were arrested for drugs? I just tried to Google this and couldn't find anything.

There is always arson if it’s “the house” that is targeted.

Also, r22, if you think idaho stands out for having an epidemic related to those drugs mentioned vs the rest of the USA right now, you may be living under a rock. It doesn’t appear so far that the parents with drug issues are being looked at as factors for the murders at this point so that’s is sort of irrelevant speculation related to a “house” being targeted.

Still, if you "target" one victim, just remember, the guy went into a house where there were SIX people, intending to kill ONE of them, using a KNIFE, and then get away without being caught, in the middle of the night. He had no idea, for certain, whether the people inside were asleep or whether they were in separate bedrooms, or in 2 rooms, or 3 rooms, etc. Additionally, it occurred to me recently to wonder whether these folks usually turned off all of their lights in the house at night. It seems unlikely to me that the house was completely dark inside, so what signaled to the killer that everybody inside was likely asleep? How do you know that kind of thing unless all the lights are out inside? (And you still can't be certain that everybody has gone to sleep.) The cops can quibble about whether this was a "serial killer" all they want to, but yes, what happened here pretty much fits the bill, in and of itself: he killed FOUR unrelated people for no discernible reason (and certainly no immediate provocation, it appears), with a knife. Killer is a deranged maniac, without any further information needed.

I think they know it’s a most likely a serial killer (maybe not the same one as Oregon) and are just concerned about mass pandemonium there and across every campus within an umpteen mile radius emptying out for the rest of the school year and ruining the economy of these small college towns.

If they truly don’t understand yet who was “targeted” then it’s odd for them to rule out a serial killer. Also they have only ruled out the Oregon connection. I don’t think they ever have said specifically “it is not a serial killer”. The “targeted” thing doesn’t actually rule out a serial killer either.

This will go unsolved for a while. At least until another killing happens to link it to - and given how long these guys can go dormant that could be some time. Unless these killings ignited an urge that the killer can’t resist satiating again soon. Given how “sloppy” they claim the killer was, it’s not out of the realm of possibility that this was someone not yet as methodical as the more seasoned serial killers, that leave signatures etc etc.

I don't believe it's a SK. I'm going with Nancy Grace who has prosecuted similar cases.

It's someone local in the orbit of one or more of the girls. Ethan didn't live at the house so he wasn't targeted.

It could be anybody...client/worker at the restaurant, rejected incel...even the pizza delivery guy.

I still think video/CCTV will solve it. Yes, it was in the middle of the night, but these college kids are up at all hours and we know their phones are permanently attached to their hands. And yes, it was in the PNW, but we're not talking a monastery in Tibet, here. There are cameras everywhere. It takes time to go through all that video, but they'll get him.

Does anyone else have trouble blocking the image of the blood drenched killer, knife in hand, making good his escape? And that he made that escape, unobserved by insomniac dog walkers, weak bladdered curtain twitchers, shift workers and Ring doorbell owners? In my Hicksville community can’t fart, day or night, without multiple witnesses anxious to report the incident next day.

Too bad Tru Capote and Nelle Lee aren’t around…they would get to the bottom this more quickly…along with some juicy LE dish for the inevitable New Yorker piece (10, 000 words).

R37 Only if the killer/s are rough trade.

True. There are no good investigative journalists today. Most writers are crap. Poor grammar and spelling mistakes never mind they have no desire to dig in and think/work a case.

r30, they're discussed in the previous thread, starting around reply 320.

It's my understanding the police dogs didn't go far from the house so it seems unlikely the perp walked away.

The dogs did go above the house beyond the trees to the dirt area where a car could have parked.

But has no one with whom the perp crossed paths later not noticed some irregular behavior? Like excessive cleaning of a car, throwing clothes in the washing machine very early in the morning, etc? Cuts on the perps hand?

I stopped reading these threads because you all seem batshit crazy but I remain fascinated by the case. HOW HAVE THEY NOT CAUGHT THE PERSON WHO DID THIS BY NOW?!

I’m the opposite. Once they didn’t find a crazed killer clutching a blood stained knife by following the trail of blood to his doorstep the next day, I stopped thinking they would find the killer. Police haven’t solved that other local murder, and the wife survived. I wonder how she feels, seeing all the national attention and FBI.

R42 Yeah, it’s like that NYC apartment murder not so long ago where the person went to Home Depo and bought that saw to cut up the body. I expected a pretty quick turn around on this like that. The authorities must be be fucking this up at every turn.

R43 The murder where the wife survived was not local to Moscow. It happened in Salem, Oregon, which is 350 miles away. But there are are enough similarities that it’s surprising the Moscow PD announced that they did not believe the two incidents are linked. This goes to show that since strangers are the last to be considered suspects, they always have an advantage over law enforcement because, statistically, most killers are known to the victims.

[quote]It doesn’t appear so far that the parents with drug issues are being looked at as factors for the murders at this point so that’s is sort of irrelevant speculation related to a “house” being targeted

R31 I apologize, but I did it mean to imply that. I was replying to the poster who claimed that the house (or the area around it) is not known as a place to score drugs — we don’t know that yet. I’m not saying the victims were drug dealers, but the open house parties and lack of surveillance cameras could have attracted drug dealers and drug users to that area, which greatly expands the pool of potential suspects.

I clicked on a random YouTube live and the guy is going over pics of the ex because he put his hands in his pocket. He’s probably hiding wounds on his hand from his family! This is what’s going on. YouTube TikTok etc seriously need to do some content moderation or idk what needs to happen but how is shit like this not breaking a rule or a law or anything?!

"There are cameras everywhere. It takes time to go through all that video, but they'll get him."

No. At 0300 in a small hick town, there wouldn't be that many cameras in use, and at a quiet hour, the town has enough space between buildings and tree cover that a person could walk for miles without been seen clearly or having an identifiable photo taken. And winter's coming on, it'd be considered normal to be out there in a heavy jacket and hat that obscures the build and face. I don't think they're going to find any useful video from the night of the murders.

I don't know if they're going to catch the guy without video or witnesses, and how are they going to find DNA traces with a sea of blood at the crime?

The Ex FBI LAdy in Fur said the killer was familiar with the house and had been there before. IMo I think Ethan was in the wrong place wrong time. I think the two girls were the targets and had pissed off someone unstable and vicious. A psychopath.

R49 Right after that, she says the killer also likely “has prior experience being in other people’s homes,” implying he has a history of home invasion, which could include murder, sexual assault, robbery, rifling through possessions to learn more about the residents, or simply scoping out the floor plan ahead of time.

Kaylee’s father was back on Fox, hammering the wedge in a little deeper.

[quote]Q:Do you believe that your daughter was the target? Or do you have any reason to think that she was, over someone else? Or that someone else was?

[quote]A: I do have some inkling that there was some behavior difference. I call them a footprint. When you commit a crime, you do different behaviors. I’ve asked permission to give any of that out, and they told me no, it would not be beneficial. So I’ve held back on that, and I try to keep my word.

[quote]Q: I’m sorry; behavior of her, or of someone she knew?

[quote]A: Behavior of the victims.

Also, he acknowledges that the police won’t be happy that he divulged that Kaylee and Maddie were in the same bed. He doesn’t seem to think he did anything wrong because Kaylee’s made bed was visible in photos of the crime scene being processed.

Finally, he wants the killer to be sick of seeing his face on the news. Therefore, he’s “not going nowhere.”

I’m starting to get a Joe the Plumber vibe and predict a run for office in 2024.

What kind of MAGA dumbfuck puts his murdered daughter's investigation in potential jeopardy because he wants to get his mug on TV?

What is wrong with these people?

I posted this in response to the father constantly interviewing on the last thread:

Now I see why Kaylee's sister was doing so much talking. The apple does not fall far from the tree.

Arrogant ignorance can't be reasoned with; no matter how much being reasonable would help them and everyone else,

"Ain't nobody gonna tell me my business."

The behavioural footprint thing sounds like a phrase he learned talking to investigators, but it made no sense because it sounded like he was talking about the assailant then said he was talking about the girls. No wonder the police are telling him to keep His trap shut. At least though he and other chatterboxes are keeping this from fading from the news cycle.

How many illegal-alien Mexican blacks are being hidden by the secret libs in that town?

If any of these kids wanted to be famous, they achieved that, but not in any way they would have imagined.

How many illegal-alien Mexican black transgendered groomers are being hidden by the secret libs in that town?

Alivea will be his Ivanka when he makes his congressional run.

From the jump, they've come across so badly that I have to wonder what it is they're trying to hide. At first I thought the "Kaylee and Jack would eventually have gotten married and had babies" narrative was just grief-fueled fear that internet mobs might slut-shame her for some of her clothing choices. But there's something more complicated going on.

They're relentless in pushing the K&M v. X&E thing. Every time a Goncalves speaks, shade is thrown. When it came to light that Xana's mother had a lengthy criminal history and was presently in jail I thought their attempt at distancing was basic MAGAtry: White woman consorted with brown invaders and THIS is the end result! Build that wall! Let's go, Brandon!

If it's true that Xana's mother Madison's stepmother (who's in the same jail!) are old friends, that adds several new layers, especially if she's estranged from Madison's father. The two men couldn't be more different in demeanor, and Kaylee's father almost assumes ownership of Madison when he speaks. It's just a very weird dynamic.

What he's saying, without actually saying it, is that he has been told things by LE that would seem to place the blame of K&Ms murders on Xana and/or Ethan.

Part of the problem is that he has a PI feeding him information. He believes that's "his" and he should be able to talk about it as he sees fit, and the cops are telling him to keep his mouth shut.

[quote] There are no good investigative journalists today.

There are still some - Skip Hollandsworth, William Langewiesche, Pam Colloff, David Grann…

She’s been dressed like a typical college co-Ed in everything I’ve seen. Who is doing the actual slut-shaming r60? 👀

“ They're relentless in pushing the K&M v. X&E thing.”r60

Umm well they are the murdered ones. Two were dating. Two were best friends since childhood.

“If it's true that Xana's mother Madison's stepmother (who's in the same jail!) are old friends, that adds several new layers…, “

Huh?

“

R51 I actually cannot figure out what he is talking about. The reporter asked him if she was a target, or someone else was a target and his answer was “I do have some inkling there was some behavior difference”, the he clarifies ‘when you do a crime you have different behaviors” Reporter asked “Behavior of her or someone she knew” and he says “behavior of victims”.

So he’s talking about someone who commits a crime does different behaviors, then he clarifies it to the victims have different behaviors. I can’t make out what that all means.? And of course how could he be talking about the person who does the crime has different behaviors when he does not know who did the crime?

Jeremy Reagan was just on Ashley Banfield's show. He said he volunteered his DNA today in order to clear himself, and that this would be his last interview for now. Then he quickly added that he can still be reached via social media.

R64, there was some pearl-clutching early on about underboob in a few photos.

Who is Jeremy Reagan?

[quote]If it's true that Xana's mother Madison's stepmother (who's in the same jail!) are old friends, that adds several new layers…,

The only layer it adds is that Moscow is not Mayberry, and that middle class white people in an Idaho college town use and sell drugs, contrary to the belief of some folks.

This thread is devolvong into Monty Python, word salad, mis-intended words, mixed-up meanings.No hyperbole yet, though.

That isn't at all what I was talking about, R69. I was referring to the dynamic between the two families and Madison's constant presence with Kaylee's family—on vacations, going on cruises, attending family events, etc.— while there is zero evidence of Kaylee ever being with the Mogen family.

R70 is right.

[quote] I'm not going nowhere.

Oh, dear!!

Any cash rewards for tips from local PD? FBI offers up to $100,000 these days, sometimes money does talk!

R60 Kaylee's family members have been taking ownership of Madison right from the beginning , from telling everyone that she was like a daughter and sister to them and that Kaylee and Madison where pretty much sisters not just friends .

People would have opened their mouths by now if it were the jilted pizza guy who knifed these students to death. But I guess it was some sort of a local mobster who ordered these murders and people are too scared to talk.

The creepy dad was obsessed with the one girl, that’s what happened. The others were collateral damage. His own daughter as well as he just seems odd. Talks too much, never cries like the other dad and weird comment on why he didn’t have a funeral for his murdered daughter. I don’t trust the dad.

This sounds like someone one of them knew. He probably did not expect Ethan to be there. Whoever it was, was really fucking angry. So much blood and using a knife, Jesus, brutal.

R71 why are you so obsessed with the families? Your comments keep getting called out because it’s odd. It seems to others that the r71 comments refer a lot to you and your cryptic “layers” , while comparing and contrasting two different fathers, with zero sympathy. Grief manifests itself in many ways. Harping on the step mother and mother is ghoulish. Drug addiction is a massive pandemic in the USA. It’s tragic. You likely have neighbours who are addicts. They just haven’t been caught.

^^ yeah, I think the Parents are dealing with their grief by talking to the press. I feel for the families too. Every problem (such as addiction) will be compounded by this horrible event. A nightmare.

R79 True but they could use some serious coaching . The way they do it they just fan the flames and give out more contradictory statements .

Yes R80, they need an advocate. They are in the midst of grief AND national press. They're feeling a million different things and probably bewildered by what's happened on top of grief. Very awful.

Who ever did it is deranged. Blood lust. Four people were stabbed. Not shot. they were butchered. I believe some predator scoped out the party house, maybe even hung out unnoticed at some gathering. Something triggered him to believe he could go back and slaughter whoever he found. IMO it was that house that was targeted by some psycho who felt like an outsider and who knows what triggered him.

Constantly booking yourself on tv is one way to frantically push aside the thoughts of what happened to your child. I feel so awful for the families.

I'm usually the first to defend people who are being pilloried for "not grieving correctly." That said, Kaylee's dad needs to stop running his mouth to the press, because his blabbing is hindering the investigation of not just his daughter's murder, but that of other people's kids, as well.

He has no right to do that.

“A dingo ate my baby!”

This needs to be solved.

R84, the police should stop talking to him about the information they're developing. That would also help.

While perusing reddit, I see people saying things like "Kaylee wouldn't do that", or "That's not like Ethan". As if they actually knew these kids, and weren't complete and total strangers to them. It's sick.

R88 Guys hear me out, what if the cashier at Jack in the Box became enraged when Xana demanded an unreasonable amount of ketchup and ranch dressing?

r83 Plus, it gives you the feeling you can do something FOR your child still, AS their father (for example). Hard to face the fact that that was that with little Kaylee or whoever and you have to move on after something so sudden and brutal. It's pretty much a common reaction.

Kaylee's father hints at that even saying he is his daughter's protector. Heart breaking frankly.

Yah, that R83, and the fact that he is probably getting paid for all these interviews.

Not all grieving parents are saints. Just because some are socially awkward or complete asshole does not mean they were involved in or contributed in some way to the murder of their kids. Maybe the dad’s an arrogant MAGA Republican who believes the libs are responsible for the crime wave that took his daughter, and then Fox will platform him as a crime avenger. Still, he’s a grieving dad who’s obsessed with finding the killer. John Walsh comes to mind.

Maybe the dad did an old fashioned American honor killing when he realized his daughter was lezzing out with her BFF?

The dad is a maga moron, but I don't think he had his daughter killed, R93.

R80 They do, and the outlets interviewing them are not going to help them with it, unfortunately. They know that the messier these families are in live interviews, the more views their stories will get through reposts on Websleuths, etc. A parent who isn't grieving "correctly," or who is over sharing info from a PI, especially when there are two mothers in jail for meth addiction, is broadcast gold. They're cruel but not stupid.

Is John Walsh a MAGAT?

I don’t know if he’s a MAGAT, but Republican senators in Florida have worked with him to draft anti-crime legislation. Also, he’s a frequent guest on Fox News. Also, he’s very pro-cop and draconian when it comes to punishment, which is more typically conservative than liberal. Back in 2015 he claimed to be friends with Trump, but disagreed with his fear-mongering over illegal immigration.

If the families have been instructed not to speak about what they know, they should not be speaking out in interviews. They need to stop going on TV and Live and release prepared statements only.

Grief is not an excuse for jeopardizing the ability of prosecutors to secure convictions.

These people are arrogant idiots.

A few years ago, a young woman was murdered in Jamaica Bay park, while going for a run in broad daylight. Her father became alarmed when she didn’t return; she was like 15 minutes late. He called the cops and got a search party right away. He discovered her body FFS. He was talking to the press right away, talking talking talking with a cigar in his hand. It twigged me immediately. The way the story was first reported made it seem like a young daughter of a single parent had been murdered. The mother was nowhere to be seen for a very long time.

Anyway, it was strange. Turns out that a mentally disturbed black man killed her. I was sure that the father had something to do with it, because he was a little shady and “connected”.

Sometimes men just act all macho and proprietary and want to run the investigation. I guess it’s just a weird form of grief. It looks suspicious but it’s just their way of coping.

I remember that. It was the Karina Ventrano case. The father knew she was jogging in an area that was dicey, among tall rushes by some dunes and the shore where homeless had been known to camp. So he was right to be alarmed right away. Wasn't he a retired fireman with friends at the local police station? He did come off as wanting to sound like a "connected" tough guy. The mother must have had a breakdown and wouldn't/couldn't appear before cameras. She did go to the arraignment and looked shell-shocked and grief stricken.

Ted Bundy channelled by The Psychic Sleuth.

R101, Watched until 25:28 while doing something else. Painfully slow speech. All I got was that speaker claims serial killer is in his 30's and inwardly shy, copying Ted Bundy's MOO. Stopped when she couldn't even give a clear eye color.

All other info good be gleaned from reading WebSleuths.

R101 i wonder all the time how many people i see every day are doing something like this when they get home.

R103, I have a co-worker who's an amateur ghost-hunter! But then, I work in an extremely high-stress field, and some people cope with alcohol, and others cope with going nuts over hobbies. I've worked with cosplayers, rock or ice climbers, beauty bloggers, artists of various stripes, Star Wars nutters and gamers, and I'm a birdwatcher - and we're the sane and healthy ones!

If someone at work told me they were a psychic who was asking Ted Bundy about the Moscow murders, I'd be fine with it.

Kaylee’s dad did say in one interview that he was having a really hard time handing over the role of being his daughter’s “protector” to others ie police which was partly why is is still getting involved.

Madison’s dad breaks my heart a little. He said she was his only child and everything for him revolved around her.

Such sadness.

Cool r104. Curiosity is getting to me. What sort of field do you work in? (When not birdwatching of course lol)

R104, I've encountered psychics who usually go by another moniker due to the many who falsely claim to have special powers.

I'd compare those with true talent to top criminal profilers who combine years of study with a special ability to gain insights or to "read" people. Compare to a very skilled HR interviewer/manager working for a major company who has superior visual abilities and can read cues the average person doesn't observe or even sense.

Sorry but that woman in R101's video greatly exaggerates her abilities for money and the wrong kind of attention.

Was Madison’s father still married to the stepmom who is in jail?

How many downvotes would these questions receive (separately) if I posted them on the MoscowMurders Reddit sub? Assuming they lasted at least 90 minutes before they were deleted.

1. "I have a VERY reliable Moscow source that says it's about a 99.5% certainty, that M & K were lesbian lovers, and why K broke up with XJ. This makes him totes sus, IMO".

2. "Im here for the uncensored crime photos! HELLO!?"

3. "Are we sure Papi Goncalves didn't have a drug smuggling ring going with X's mom and M's stepmom?? Maybe Ethan was a mule (he drove a Jeep). Just a theory, but I think I might be on to something, TC fam!"

4. "All the roomies were addicted to Tik Tok, which we all know, is Communist Chinese Spyware. Has LE searched for Chinese Nationals attending the U of I, and/or belonged 2 N E of the Frats on Campos? I'm concerned."

That is what that sub looks like right now, R109. The Idahomurders one seems even worse. I know I saw number 1 on there already.

When I managed an apt building this one tenant committed suicide by slashing his wrists. His lover had came screaming into the office and I ran up with him to see what the hell was going on. His lover was curled up against a wall,coated in blood.He was a little thing,all of 5'6 . You wouldnt think he could bleed that much.I never knew how much blood people have until I saw that apartment.It was drenched. I vividly remember that sight,I cant even imagine the amount in that house.

Some good pics and article. Wow that sigma chi house really is close!

Cara Northington (the mother of Xana, the one who was recently jailed on drug charges) spoke publicly for the first time tonight. She sounds absolutely devastated and broken, probably none the wiser that the internet's most elderly detectives think she might be at fault. Sad. Daddy Goncalves is also complaining that the cops are clearing people too quickly, I assume he's trying to shade the roommates?

One thing I haven't seen addressed yet is how the killer left the scene without leaving a trail of blood outside, and no sign of discarded, bloody clothes anywhere. This indicates that the killer may have brought a backpack to stash the weapon and bloody clothes in, using the victims’ bathroom to wash up and change after the murders. A guy carrying a backpack at 3 AM would be odd, but still less alarming than seeing a guy soaked in blood.

The Goncalves clan is also complaining that the cops won't tell them where the dog was found at the scene. How ridiculous. Why should these blabbermouths be privvy to information that isn't relevant and is also something that only the killer and the police would know? It's sad but inevitable how eager the media is to exploit them.

[quote]Daddy Goncalves is also complaining that the cops are clearing people too quickly

But not Jack. Jack wan't cleared too quickly.

They're pissed that the cleared people's alibis haven't been shared with them.

In other news, they have Maddie's ashes.

R116 that makes sense. I thought it was pretty weird when he was saying something like "WE were the family that figured out the real timeline, WE were the family that got into the phones...." to justify not understanding why LE would withhold anything from them. "figured out the real timeline" = a difference of two minutes and the sister kept going on about this "I knew it was 1:47 AM not 1:45". I can't remember what it was about, Kaylee getting the ride from the food truck or something like that. Stupid. Xana's mom implied she's suspicious of the roommates too. I really feel terrible for the survivors. Bad enough being accused by internet schizos but now the families of your butchered friends are shading you too? What a mess.

ENTERTAINMENT LAWYER 12/01 **9** You know that mom is sitting in jail right now, wondering if her trying to short change the cartel is the reason those four kids are dead. Decapitation is super personal and sending a message. (Questions Raised After Mom Of Idaho Murder Victim Allegedly Arrested Days After Daughter's Death)

[quote]"figured out the real timeline" = a difference of two minutes and the sister kept going on about this "I knew it was 1:47 AM not 1:45"

You can say it's stupid all you want, but the timeline was established early on as them getting home at 1:56, then the cops changed it to 1:45 for no reason, and it took 10 days for them to correct themselves back to the original time which was the right time. I don't know where you got 1:47 from.

Has decapitation been verified?

Nope.

6th roommate

My new theory is that killer dude might have gone into the house before they all got home. The best time to invade would be while they are all out on a Saturday night. Also, it’s a lot easier for no one to wonder if they see you you entering a home if it is 10pm vs 3am.killer dude hid in the sixth bedroom which is on the second floor, he’d know when the victims settled down to sleep etc The basement girls had been out of town and arrived home separately around 1am. He may have had less confidence they were down for the night than the others who eventually would have quoted down and shit off the lights.

Thank you, Foxy. You're going to break the internet !

BTW, my cats love your cat food, Kit & Kaboodle. It's the only thing they'll eat.

Kaylee and Madison in the same bed - with another bed fully made and available. In two photos, I've seen Madison sitting on Kaylee's shoulders. I think they're Lebanese!

Kaylee’s sister did have a valid concern regarding the timeline. The police were giving out 1:45 as the time they returned home, so she was afraid that people would review their security-camera footage and stop watching at 1:45, believing they were already home.

Can't wait till this case blows wide open.

We are all going to be in for a massive shock.

Murder in a small town ......

If only Ann Rule was still alive.

R123 It creeps me out to think that the killer might have been hiding in the extra bedroom, lying in wait while everyone went to sleep. If it’s true that K and M were sharing the same bed, I wonder if it was because they heard odd noises in the building or felt that something was watching them, so they stayed close together like two frightened little kids.

Girls who are friends often share a bed, probably especially when they're drunk and one is leaving soon and another bed isn't made up.

R118 - ENTY is a fucker for inserting himself in this situation by megaphoning others' baseless claims.

R129, yeah that’s the least suspicious part of this. I shared beds platonically with friends all the time in college, especially if we’d been drinking together.

[Quote] It creeps me out to think that the killer might have been hiding in the extra bedroom, lying in wait while everyone went to sleep.

I live in a semi rural area and leave my doors unlocked all day (got nothing worth stealing). I must admit that after reading the first thread, I checked all the cupboards before bed one night.

The call… it’s coming from… INSIDE THE HOUSE.

Everything about this multiple murder points to a hired pro and the work of a drug cartel.

Killers were probably South of the Border within hours of the horrific scene and will never be found. DNA results are useless if they don't return to the US. No wonder they don't have a local match on record.

Comments after the above CDAN post are informative re Zana's mother:

AND, her prior arrest record showed trafficking charges as well.

When I heard the FBI were helping I thought it was odd since they only get involved if crimes cross state lines (which registers as a federal crime) not just because ‘a local small PD needs help’

I have a feeling the case will go cold…

Case will go cold because the actual murderers aren't US citizens and have escaped South of the Border.

Explains why the search dogs' trail stopped a short distance behind the woods surrounding the house. Killer was likely carried into a vehicle and driven away after putting on protective clothing to prevent a bloody trail.

I don’t buy the cartel angle.

Drug cartel hired hitman from South of the Border also justifies Mr. G emotional outbursts on interviewers knowing his daughter's death will never be fully solved and the killers brought to justice.

Initially he claimed his daughter wasn't the target and he was correct.

R138, If you don't buy the cartel angle please explain why the FBI were so quickly brought in. Small town LE? Not a good enough reason.

Savagery of the killings and the murder weapon, a knife, point to hired cartel murders for revenge. Common when anyone directly related has ripped off the cartel for drugs or money.

R140, the mother would have to be serious business to the cartel to account for such a horrific scene. It’s one thing in Mexico where the officials and the media can be silenced. A mass stabbing of four white college students would bring immediate international attention and would be very sloppy. I don’t think rise up that high in a cartel being sloppy.

I could see her daughter and just her daughter being killed. But to take such a massive risk would mean she posed a serious risk and a couple of minor trafficking charges and some short changing would not bring such drastic results, particularly over the border.

Perhaps the talk of similar MO/crimes nearby across state lines got them there?

R141, Zana's mother was arrested in AZ for drug trafficking.

Six days after the murders whe was arrested for meth (and possibly heroin) and is currently in jail in Moscow, ID.

Those who are familiar with drug cartel tetribution killings if anyone tries to rip them off financially or might ever rat on them immidiately recognized this as a signature crime.

Far more cruel and viscious knife killings have been recorded on the dark web with many innocents also the victims.

Why do you think so many from South of the Border are risking their lives to come to the US? They don't want to be kidnapped in their home countries and forced into the drug wars as "cannon fodder."

[quote]Everything about this multiple murder points to a hired pro and the work of a drug cartel.

It absolutely does not.

The FBI was called in because it's a quadruple murder. Any state in the Union would have called in the FBI. The FBI showed up immediately for the two girls murdered in Delphi IN and there was no drug cartel involved there.

R114 I don't know why anyone with a back pack on would be suspcious regardless of the time of day and especially in a college town.

But are these dark web stabbings happening in the US?

All the noise indicates to me, someone is going down for this, whether they did it or not.

What's with Ethan's effeminate Eyewear? Kinda sus.

This is some "Money owed to very dangerous people" bullshit written all over it.

They had FBI profilers at the scene. My money is on a serial killer. There are several recent unsolved bed killings in the NW. They’re keeping it close to the chest until they have to. They’re also clueless who it is.

[Quote]please explain why the FBI were so quickly brought in. Small town LE? Not a good enough reason.

The FBI will enter any and every case when invited in by overwhelmed police.

Trafficking is a relatively new term used instead of SALES meaning the offender was in possession of more than a certain amount of product. And that amount is usually pitifully low.

There is zero evidence either mothers/step mothers were arrested on drug charges. It's more fapping from reddit carelessly repeated here.

Fa fa fa fa

R150, the FBI will assist at many overwhelmed crime scenes but it’s important to note what type of FBI agents are attending. There are profilers there. That’s the biggest hint of what authorities think is going on.

Anyone surprised by the FBI’s involvement here clearly hasn’t followed true crime long enough to be positing anything about it.

I am noticing more and more Boomsters speculating that it's gotta be either Kaylee or Maddie's boyfriend/ex. Because they were sleeping in the same bed! LESBIANS! THE HORROR! I honestly can't believe how fucking out of it and stuck in the past some people can be. Like, do they use an abacus?

Maddie's boyfriend Jake is balding. Most shocking break in the case to me yet!

r147 cheap novelty glasses are common party wear now - i have glasses shaped like kissy lips with red lenses and im a straight guy. everything about that ethan is your typical fratty fake hippie guy. he looks exactly like xana's father, at least in that pic of them on the boat.

Former cop, undercover fbi narcotics agent, etc going over the Idaho case (recent) . Most sensible guy I've found who's following this case - he thinks the drug angle is laughable btw. I'd probably trust the instinct of a guy who worked in narcotics enforcement. He shuts down a lot of the silly angles people are taking.

Like R139, he explains that in reality scent dogs aren't very useful or reliable and movies/tv lead people to believe they work like magic

Right R148, because a sure way to get your money back is to murder their kids, now they'll pay you since they have fucking left to lose, right? Christ, this thread is ridiculous.

I read a book years ago with a cartel type enforcer who said that when you want to make a point and get your money, you don't fucking kill the guy's kid or his wife, you kill his fucking sister's kid, it sends a clear message that his kid is next and if he doesn't pay up, you can let his sister know who's responsible for it.

I thought standard Cartel enforcement involves killing the person who's betrayed the Cartel, and maybe their whole family to send a message to others. They don't leave the traitor alive and kill a bunch of innocents, not for small-timers like these kids and their families.

I don't believe this is a Cartel killing related to a relative,

Yeah probably R159, I meant this guy was saying to get money from a particular flake, not to send a message per se, but to get your fucking dough, you do shit that scares him that his kid or wife is next and that if he doesn't pay, his grieving sibling is going to know why her kid is now dead.

[Quote]when you want to make a point and get your money, you don't fucking kill the guy's kid or his wife, you kill his fucking sister's kid

Do you kill the fucking sister's kid whilst she's fucking? Who is the sister fucking?

It's going to be someone they knew that hasn't even crossed anyone's mind yet. Like the handyman in NYC (or was it CT?) who killed the wealthy Russian married woman who broke off their fling. Everyone thought it was her teenage son because he was in the house when it happened and didn't hear anything.

R161, sorry, I was slipping into my wise guy accent and saying it like a mafia capo.

How does the crime of passion angle work into the cartel killing?

Charlie doesn't like a snitch.

Oh thanks for reminding me R165, someone posted on one of the other threads that many killers are high at the time of their crimes and they used Manson as an example. Manson didn't commit the mass murders he's associated with, he had ugly, hairy chicks like Sadie Mae do it. Jeff MacDonald, however, was all gakked out on speed.

I'm inclined to think it's a nutty customer or kitchen coworker at the restaurant

I don't believe for a minute that it was a Cartel killing, if the Cartel ever wanted to stage a murder that made international headlines and attracted the interest of every true crime buff on the internet, they'd only do it if some really big money or a power grab was at stake. And these kids and their families are as far from big money and power as it's possible to be.

No, it was a local nutball, a serial killer, or an angry ex, and the killer found himself in a snowballing situation where he had to kill four instead of one or two. That's all there is to it.

This reminds me of when Nicole Brown Simpson was murdered and there were cartel rumors. This was a lone psychopath.

R168, For exactly how much money do you think Xana's mother supposedly ripped off the drug cartel rumored to be the Surenos? Note the weapon used, a type of knife featured in many, many dark web videos showing extremely bloody killings.

Are you aware how vicsious they are "to send a message" for even minor slights, butchering entire familes and relatives? Again why do you think so many South of the Border, who've had relatives kidnapped and brutalized by a gang, risk their lives to come to the US by any means possible

Now for the facts of the case that point to a professional hit. Easiest way for killer to get away from the murder scene is to walk behind the house into the woods and then to be carried and/or driven away. There had to be at least one accomplice, and possibly 2 professional killers.

Oh shut up, Cartel Troll. You haven't convinced anyone, no point in keeping on repeating yourself.

How “International” beyond the UK and maybe Canada is this?

R171, Why don't you offer an alternative while closing the obvious gaps that make top profilers believe it was a professional hit by someone who's killed before?

No it's not a Ted Bundy copycat nor as LE admits linked to the brutal home invasion murders in OR and WA.

[quote]This reminds me of when Nicole Brown Simpson was murdered and there were cartel rumors. This was a lone psychopath.

BTW, has anyone heard from O.J. lately?

Sorry, R163, I was just shitposting whilst wide awake at 2am. I actually did read your post in a mafioso voice and appreciated it.

R161^ not 162. I'm tired and hot.

Repeating but...its the freak killer that kills all those animals. A boy, loner, creeps out everyone, was made fun of at school. Its a kid or young adult living in the area. Go door to door in a 2 mile radius asking if there are any odd acting persons that live close to them.

If you can't collect soft trophies because of a rush job, you have to start over.

R161

Joe Pesci? Is that you?

A gentle reminder to people who are new here and also those who've been around but haven't yet put two and two together: Allowing yourself to be drawn into a debate is a fool's errand. Long after you've dropped to the floor in exhaustion, she'll roll on, high on the energy she sucked out of you.

That energy will be used to fuel increasingly bizarre theories. Before long, we'll be into Masonic symbolism in the design of the house, sorority blood rituals, and the very devilish implications of a bunch of Jacks in a story involving roads called King and Queen.

Posters on Reddit are talking about this interview with K's father.

I don't think Davida gets a high from sucking people into online fights anymore. She's been on here longer than I have. I think at this point it's developed into a personality disorder on her part (one of many) and, given the amount of threads on here that are honestly just her and a few sock puppets, I don't think she cares if anyone replies to her or not. As long as she can post, that's all she cares about.

Which is another good reason to just put her on ignore.

I've managed to keep her on ignore, for the most part, for years. But something has happened recently where she keeps popping back out.

🤔 I want to know who paid for the pricey new cars the students were driving around?

Student loans?

R181's link wouldn't open for me, but if it's the same as this one, Kaylee's father sounds like he's gearing up to spill everything he knows. When asked about targeting:

[quote] I'll cut to the chase: their means of death don't match.

Lawrence Jones: Maddie's...

[quote]They don't.

LJ: ...and Kaylee's cause of death, it does not match based on the autopsy report?

[quote]They don't match.

LJ: It would indicate that one of them...

[quote]HE DOESN'T HAVE TO GO UP THE STEPS! LET'S STOP PLAYING GAMES, GUYS! I need somebody to step up and start being an [I think he meant to say "alpha"]. Be somebody to be a leader. DON'T MAKE ME DO IT! I DON'T WANT TO DO IT!

[quote]He doesn't have to go up those steps. Their...their...points of damage don't match. I'm just gonna say it; wasn't leaked to me. I earned that. I paid for that funeral. I PAID FOR THAT! IT'S MY RIGHT! YOU AIN'T TAKING THAT FROM ME!

[Kaylee's mother tells him to calm down.]

[quote]If you don't want to say nothing, that's your [bit?], but don't say I'm leaking anything. I. PAID. THAT. BILL. Sent my daughter to college to get an education, she came back in a box, and I can speak on that.

I assume he misspoke and meant to say cremation instead of funeral, because we know that the Goncalves family has possession of both girls' ashes. I guess we'll be finding out exactly what was done them—integrity of the investigation be damned—because he "paid" for that information. Did he pay for Maddie's as well?

If he was indeed comparing Maddie and Kaylee, then how the hell does "he doesn't have to go up the steps" even make sense? Wouldn't that denote that he's actually contrasting Ethan's and/or Xana's injuries with Kaylee's and/or Maddie's, and that E and X were the ones targeted and killed first? Is that what he just told us? He makes my head hurt.

Toward the end they say they're going to try to raise money to hire a private investigator. Huh? He's been saying all along that he has one. He also wants DNA collected from everyone in Moscow for genetic genealogy.

Why do the Goncalves family have both Kaylee and Madison's ashes?

r187, my personal opinion is that they have the ashes because the Goncalves family are a bunch of bullying assholes, steamrollering their way through this whole situation, thinking that by being tough and making a lot of noise they'll solve the problems, but they're actually making everything worse.

I don't have any concrete reason to think this other than the dad gives me bad vibes and won't shut up.

r186, I think he meant that he personally doesn't have to take the same steps the investigators do, with regard to the chain of command. Basically, he's saying he doesn't have to give a shit about the integrity of the investigation. Police and FBI have to take certain steps before they'll release information, but he doesn't have to, he's an independent citizen, and also he paid for those independent autopsies and those funerals and by god he's gonna say what he wants about it, and that's why he doesn't consider it a leak.

Vibes are totally valid. As are gut feelings.

R184, Ethan's Jeep was shared by his brothers for a while, there were Facebook photos of others driving it.

Kaylee bought her own car just recently, it was a 2016 so not new at all. That was part of the reason she was back in Moscow, to show off her "new" car to her friends.

No idea about the other cars. There have been posts on the r/MoscowMurders group about all the cars which I'm sure would have detailed info, people seemed to really get into the cars for a while, after they finally got over obsessing over the dog.

[quote]"I'll cut to the chase. Their means of death don't match. They don't match. He doesn't have to go up the steps. Let's stop playing games, guys. I need somebody to step up and be an alpha, be somebody to be a leader. Don't make me do it. I don't wanna do it. He doesn't have to go up those steps. Their points of damage don't match. I'm just gonna say it. Wasn't leaked to me, I earned that. I paid for that funeral. I paid for that, it's my right. They ain't taking that from me...If you don't wanna say nothing, that's your bet, but don't say I'm leaking anything, I paid that bill. I sent my daughter to college to get an education. She came back in a box and I can speak on that."

That's the transcript of Kaylee's dad's rant, apparently.

I think that "he" means a specific police officer or investigator he's mad at, but reading it all typed out like that, I'm struck by how nonsensical it is. My original thought was that he was saying that police don't have to go up those steps and he can, he doesn't want to but he'll be the alpha if he has to, and he'll tell the world that the girls had different types of wounds. Reading it again I think it's more likely an unfocused rant from some guy who hates the cops like Dale Gribble hates the cops.

R188 I agree and I find them SO off putting but it seems like with Maddie that her family is really dysfunctional or significantly poorer than the Goncalves'? The kid with poor/addict parents being sort of semi-adopted by a friends family? I've seen this situation before

Why were the survivors running out of the house ala Carmen Electra?

Fair point, r193. That could very well be true. I just hope that they're not being taken advantage of here.

R182 I'm very new to DL is there some kind of glossary of all the posters? I could walk right into some infamous trolls trap and be none the wiser. I'm innocent.

R192 Who?

[quote]Why were the survivors running out of the house ala Carmen Electra?

What? Someone tried to murder Carmen Electrica?

R198

The father places two thoughts/sentences together, twice:

"They ['points of damage'] don't match. He doesn't have to go up the steps."

"He doesn't have to go up those steps. Their points of damage don't match."

Why the repetition, and why the clinical euphemism ("points of damage")? Is the man speaking not figuratively about "steps," but literally? That there was no "reason" to slay whoever was in an upper-level room (implying there might have been a reason for the other killings)?

Is the "he" the man who was killed? Does he mean he didn't have to go up the steps? And by "the points of damage were different", does he mean the women were stabbed by someone and the man's wounds were self-inflicted?

It's the only sense I can make of it.

Someone on Reddit posted this photo of an investigator in one of the rooms. I found it very striking and gave me a somber feeling.

New Uncle Intel claims that a Spokane WA based serial killer, who's obviously murdered before, will soon be arrested for this gruesome crime.

R182, Please block and/or ignore me but 99.99% of the posts I'm accused of writing are definitely not mine. Just ckeck the style of writing or the one laptop I currently own if you don't believe me. Or don't, your choice.

[quote]That there was no "reason" to slay whoever was in an upper-level room (implying there might have been a reason for the other killings)?

That's how it sounded to me - that he's implying E & X were the targets and the killer had no reason to go upstairs to M & K's room.

It's an odd aspect of culture that so many people think the police should put out information for all to have immediately. Basic information with intermittent updates wouldn't be understandable. But the ranting on reddit and elsewhere that the police aren't sharing enough fast enough seems counterproductive. The FBI, ISP investigators, and local police are all working on it. Two of those groups investigate crime for a living; it seems like letting the pros who know how to evaluate evidence and apply it should have time and space to do their work. Justice is usually swift if you're pulled over in a car or the murder is an obvious suspect (like family member or significant other), but when it's someone else who's not an obvious candidate, it often takes longer to identify the suspect(s) and gather and evaluate evidence sufficient to prosecute.

Why don't people get what the father is saying?

He (THE KILLER) didn't have to go up these steps (TO THE THIRD FLOOR), if he just wanted to stab someone. This means he was targeting either Kaylee or Madison or both. But: They deaths don't match. Kaylee and Madison were treated VERY DIFFERENTLY BY THE KILLER. This means one of them was the target. The other one was probably treated like Xana and Ethan, just stabbed until they were dead.

Now he seems to be losingiti, I wouldn't rtake his word for it. Maybe he is holding on to an insignificant detail as clear proof. Butt it's obvious what he is saying,

[QUOTE]Wasn't leaked to me, I earned that. I paid for that funeral. I paid for that, it's my right.

Didn't he say the family didn't have a funeral because they were afraid the killer might show up? Or was that Xana's father?

If it wasn't leaked, is he saying he bribed an official for it? Or that he could only get information from a hired PI? And how would the PI get it?

It's hard to make sense of his word salads.

Maybe he's saying he paid for the cremation (which he's just calling a funeral) ?

Or, he paid for the cremation, so why doesn't he get the autopsy report?

So weird that he thinks having paid for something is more important than being her father, when it comes to being entitled to something.

He's a nut.

Look. One of those four had to be "the last victim." so to speak. This killer got 3 people dead. Stabbed multiple times. Maybe by victim #4 he ran out of steam, or ran out of time, or his blood lust was sated. Or maybe he delivered a disabling blow to each of the victims, then went back and carved each one up. There was probably so much blood around that scene maybe by the last victim, he had enough so he didn't complete his task as thoroughly as he had with the first three. And maybe he heard noise or something and had to flee the scene.

He clarified what he meant by “steps” in his morning interview. He was talking about the killer walking upstairs. The entry point was the slider or a window on the second floor, therefore he had an exit on that floor. He went to the third floor for a specific purpose.

Next:

[quote]I can kind of tell by my daughter’s texts, messages… She did call 911. She wasn’t saying anything along the lines of, like, she had heard something or she was in fear, so… I’m just putting the dots together.

Here we go again. He inserted “911” for some reason; misspoke and said “did” instead of “didn’t"; then characterized her texts, making it sound like he was describing her demeanor on a 911 call.

Anyone else would have just said: "I saw my daughter's texts and there was nothing to indicate that she was in fear."

Finally, in closing:

[quote]She was conservative. She was always looking up stories on child, you know, getting trafficking. She was telling me she thinks it’s a lot bigger than people understand.

Ruh roh!

His daughter knew too much.

The cops should be looking for a 70-something blonde in a smart pantsuit.

The father seems to be manic. It's terribly sad if you allow yourself some empathy. He is close to collapse.

Doesn't mean he is necessarily a likable guy in general, but he is going insane with grief right now. I don't want to use this to entertain me and will probably ignore the case for a while.

I can't judge these people as they are experiencing the unimaginable. The parents are clearly frustrated with the investigation, what with the police and the college trying to save the reputation of the university by not allowing "Missing Persons" posters with a reward, etc. I'd be fucking livid too.

I don't think a Missing Persons poster would help here.

R214, forgive me, I meant "Reward" poster. I'm a little high.

The Youtube guy linked above, the ex detective (I think his name is Mains) says one of the girls who was the primary target might have been stabbed extensively in the vagina.

He says he's seen this in multiple cases in the past with perps who couldn't get it up or who were rejected. He says they use the knife almost as a penis to carry out their freak.

Parents are not yet prepared to see autopsy reports. It'll send them over the edge.

What I like about Mains he says he just doesn't know about this case. Too few clues to pull threads together. He takes no position about who may have done this, why, age of perp, etc

He speaks primarily about fact finding. .

[quote]She was conservative. She was always looking up stories on child, you know, getting trafficking. She was telling me she thinks it’s a lot bigger than people understand.

Oh lord, so all this hinting he's doing is about some QAnon CP ring stuff?

I can absolutely judge this man. He's hurting an investigation and I guess if he really wants to tank the investigation into his own daughter's murder, he's got the right, but not the murders of three others.

I agree with posters who posit Maddie was semi-adopted, unfortunate to the Goncalves family, a "second daughter", etc.

Also agree Papi Goncalves may be manic, in light of these terrible events. He's finna spill ALL the tea!

This is the case that is going to blow the pedo rings WIDE OPEN.

WWG1WGA!

[quote]Oh lord, so all this hinting he's doing is about some QAnon CP ring stuff?

To put it in context, it came up at the end of the interview when they asked him to talk a little about Kaylee.

Will he go back to it when we get to the part where he begins listing all of his presumed motives? Stay tuned.

R217, I interpreted his comments as supporting his belief that his daughter was "conservative" as in cautious, and careful and read about bad things happening to women i.e. human trafficking.

He wants the alibis of people who the police say they've cleared. How's he going to use those? Start his own investigation? Go on Fox News and broadcast names and alibis to get the home sleuths to investigate the details? Sounds fun.

Maybe somebody already addressed this though I have read pretty much every post on here and the other 4 parts. If the target victim was where the rage was spent, going crazy attack style, how in the world did at the very least the person in the same room not wake up during that and do something, scream, run, try to fight off the person, call police, run to other floor...something other than sleeping through the whole thing. Couldn't have done that. Yes, it makes for a good case of more than one attacker but so far nothing on that so how did this whole frenzied scenario play out?

Even if there was no target person, or one more frenzied wild vicious attack on one person, how in the world did this killer attack in such a way there was so much blood, so much the house oozed it, I think the police even commented on how awful the scene was. How did they do that much damage and nobody got out of there or did anything ? The target idea, where the killer concentrates all the fury on one, I mean it takes time to stab the vagina over and over and whatnot else, do big damage to that target, ignore the person right next to them or in the same room? To be basically speaking have his back to everyone else. They can't be sleeping through all of this ? Were they hit over the head at first, incapacitated as he entered the room like Bundy in the Florida sorority?

I think he either disabled them or killed them by slitting their throats, then came back to each victim to mutilate them.

Haven't you ever been so drunk that you would have slept through anything?

[quote]How's he going to use those?

He's going to hand them over to the Mike Lindell Detective Agency.

R223, I think you're underestimating how easily even an unathletic man can overpower a woman. There could have been very little noise. Again, you adjust to the noises in your area. If you live in a college party street full of frat houses and off-campus living, you will sleep right through screams and rummaging noises. If you live in urban NYC you sleep through car horns and trains. If you live in the rural South the Cicadas don't keep you up at night. You might sleep easily through gunshots if you live in an area where gun crime is common or hunting is common. So if you keep in mind

1. It's entirely possible the attack played out with relatively little noise, on different floors, previous tenants said it was difficult to hear things from other rooms in that house. 2. The kinds of noises that would be generated during the incident are similar to the typical ambient sounds of the area 3. The survivors may have been drunk or under the influence of benzos, opiates, etc.

I'm the poster who previously mentioned my own experiences dating women who were in greek life - having stayed over at these sorts of houses many times. The sound of screaming girls and people stumbling around loudly is ever present. It becomes white noise quickly.

R216 I wonder if the Delphi case was an impotent killer. The family leaked some info about the crime scene, and there wasn't proper SA but one of the girls was supposedly violated with tree branches.

So the victims have been cremated already? I wouldn't leave the autopsies to such high profile victims to the county coroner, in this case an elected official, not a trained MD. The FBI or the ISP have their own forensic examiner to do a thorough autopsy first, right?

Are most American women like the web sleuth fraus? Those women are fucking nuts. Scary nuts.

R230 only the most sick and depraved of the olds are posting online. Daddy Steve bringing Qanon/maga vibes into this is going to take them to a whole new level!

R229, Spokane County performed the autopsies. They have a busy department and contracts throughout Washington and Idaho.

The ME sends her report to Latah County’s coroner, who then writes her own report. “Writes” typically means just filling in a template with the ME’s data.

The FBI and ISP don't do autopsies.

I was briefly on Websleuths several years ago because someone nearby went missing, but the posters were crazy, and the owner inserted herself into the case for no reason. Then she told people she was absolutely sure she was one of Bundy's intended victims, but her story seemed fake. I never went back to the board, though I did mention the incident on here at some point.

A good year later some Websleuths frau came to DL and brought up what I had said about Websleuths all those months earlier, writing a huge essay-length post where she insisted that I should be reported to the FBI and was clearly wanting to harm or murder the Websleuths owner.

That was creepy as hell. I hate the people who post on Websleuths.

Did Goncalves pay for independent autopsies, too? I thought when he said he "paid" for the information, he was talking about an independent autopsy, but maybe he meant information that came from the funeral home who took care of the bodies.

R233 that totally sounds like Websleuths drama! I like reading it, but would never comment on or about it. Just brings out the trolls.

I thought his “going up the steps” comments were referring to not making him (the dad) solve the case himself. “Don’t make me go there”. That’s how far out I was thinking. His speech patterns are confusing.

It's understandable, R236. Every phrase out of his mouth can be interpreted at least three ways, and then he patches them together in a manner that would make Brion Gysin's head spin.

Brian Entin reported tonight that he had confirmed that Kaylee's injuries were “significantly more brutal.” Maybe Pa has turned over a new leaf and will be leaking instead of blurting from now on.

Next he'll be blaming Hillary and her emails.

[quote] Brian Entin reported tonight that he had confirmed that Kaylee's injuries were “significantly more brutal.” Maybe Pa has turned over a new leaf and will be leaking instead of blurting from now on

Well, if that's true, pop's statement is even more confusing - he didn't have to go up the steps - or whatever. Well, if Kaylee was the target OF COURSE he had to go up the stairs, but might have been confronted by Ethan when he was trying to get to Kaylee (someone said Ethan was not in his bed when found). Then he could have thrown Xana back in the bed after killing Ethan and possibly struggling with her a bit (defensive wounds, I think on more than one of them?), and then gone upstairs for his real target.

At least something has come out. Pop may be defensive because the other three might have been killed because somebody wanted HIS daughter dead and they just happened to be there.

If I was the other parents, I’d be pissed that this low-class blowhard might be botching the investigation in bringing the criminal to justice. I won’t hold it against LE if they stop giving him any updates about the crime because he can’t keep anything to himself.

Exactly. He's fucking up the investigation and three people who weren't his daughter and their families might not ever see any shred of justice because of it.

My sympathy and goodwill towards Papa Goncalves are used up at this point.

Going on FUCKS NEWS just destroys your credibility

These are the people who inhabit the area.

Dangerously batshit.

In today’s installment, the police aren’t tech savvy enough so he’s working with a geriatric PI who thinks DNA is overrated.

[quote]One of the murder squad officers is only 26, he complained, meaning he was only 19 when the sleepy city of Moscow last had a slaying, in 2015.

[quote]“So they’re just inexperienced — and I don’t want anyone making mistakes in my child’s case,” Goncalves told The Post, also blasting the officers as “not exactly the most tech-savvy people.”

[quote]As well as his own fears, Goncalves said started working with private investigators because there were “enough insiders telling us we should be concerned” about the lack of any clear leads in the Nov. 13 murders of his 21-year-old daughter and her three friends.

[quote]“I talk to detectives,” he said, making clear he was keeping away from internet sleuths, whom he dismissed as “Hollywood s–t.”

[quote]“One of the private detectives I talked to has 50 years in the game,” he said of his outside help.

[quote]That gumshoe told him that he “had to break cases when there wasn’t DNA,'” suggesting younger cops rely on it too much.

[quote]“We’re trying to give them the benefit of the doubt,” he said of police investigators.

I’m telling you NOW, so I don’t have to tell you THEN: if this guy doesn’t run for office after cutting his teeth at Fox News as a loudmouthed crime pundit, I will buy a MAGA hat and eat it.

So it's confirmed Kaylee was overkilled compared to the others ir is it still just a rumor? Many have assumed that early on.

These quotes are uncharacteristically coherent. I'm going to assume this is the post writer's interpretation and crafted narrative, rather than what he actually stated.

The Post is trash.

As somebody suggested above and as ex detective Mains explains in the Youtube link above yes, the perp usually kills everybody then returns to the targeted person and mutilates her..

The perp may also pose the body to further humiliate the person (spread her legs, etc)

This may or may not apply in this case.

Today's update from the Moscow PD:

1. Shut the fuck up, Steve Goncalves.

2. They're looking for information on Xana and Ethan between 9 and 1:45.

3. They've interviewed two men regarding an incident with Kaylee in October. One followed her around inside a business and then out to her car before turning back without apparent contact. They told police they were trying to meet women. Police believe it was an isolated incident, and there's nothing to suggest they were involved in the murders. They continue looking into information about Kaylee having a stalker.

4. Murphy was found in a room "where the crimes had not been committed." No evidence was noticed on him, and there was nothing to indicate that he ever entered the direct crime scenes.

[quote]2. They're looking for information on Xana and Ethan between 9 and 1:45

I think this is one of the weirdest aspects of the case because: was there no activity on their phones during that time, and they disappeared for over four hours without telling anyone. If they turned their phones off, why?

R249 Why would they necessarily be on their phones during that time? They're young and horny and this is when they have a lot of time for fun time.

I went on Websleuths once, made a reasonable post about a highly discussed subject. The administrator who I think may have owned the site went on there, said something insulting to me which I forget now what it was but it just surprised me because I only gave my surmise on something which was a reasonable thought, and then she banned me for ever or something. I won't ever even try to go back there I thought it was totally a weird response, especially considering there were so many other posts on the subject all of which were postulations and mine was fairly reasonable, nothing whack about it. I was surprised that she would get so emotional over someone just suggesting 'maybe this' type thing. Who needs that crap.

I hope the father does not completely screw up this case.

[quote] Why would they necessarily be on their phones during that time? They're young and horny and this is when they have a lot of time for fun time.

FOUR HOURS though? And where?

If the posters on Websleuths are representative of average Americans then no fucking wonder there's such a gun problem. Those nutbag fraus have mentioned getting a handgun either for themselves or for their college aged kids. JFC.

R252 Yes, four hours. There was probably some napping and cuddling in between sessions, maybe some tv-watching, possibly a late night snack or beverage in bed.

R254 Do you think they were at the sorority house, or at Ethan’s place during those four hours?

R255 My guess would be the sorority house but I can't say for sure. I think they may have taken advantage of being alone.

R256 That makes sense, because the most likely scenario is that they came back to the sorority house around 9-10 PM and turned off their phones for some private time, although the reports made it sound like they RETURNED to the house at around 1:00 AM. It could be that, instead, that’s the time they turned their phones back on.

R257 Sounds reasonable.

R225, I once slept in my tiny dorm room throughout others having a pinochle game and delivery pizza!

R259 what was on the Victrola ?

R256 and r257 What’s this now about a sorority house?? They were at a fraternity house gathering at sigma chi fraternity. This is the first I have heard about them also visiting a sorority. And no they are not the same thing.

R261 Sorry - that was my mistake. I meant the off-campus home occupied by sorority girls —where the murders occurred — not the actual sorority house.

Some very interesting pieces of this CNN article which goes into more detail than I have seen in a while.

Explains an lot about what thee roles are of the various branch’s of LE involved and how long it takes to process various pieces of info, including “mixed dna samples”.

Also gets into the word salad of “no suspects identified”

Lastly, I will link later if I can find it again but I believe it was a fox article very recent that stated Murphy the dog was found behind the closed into a room in the house not at all a part of the immediate crime scenes. My guess is that was either a bathroom or that 6th bedroom that was unoccupied at the time and is just off the living room. Wonder if the murderer led him in there so he was out of the way. It was just a quick mention in the article.

Also dives more into the

Also from the above cnn link:

"It's highly unlikely, although not impossible, that a first-time offender is going to come prepared with a tactical knife and murder multiple people, even in the face of resistance, and that this is going to be their first encounter with violent crime or the use of a knife," Miller said.“

Correction about the dog. Did not specifically state closed in a room, however it had zero contact with the crime scene.

“Additionally, MPD determined that a dog belonging to Goncalves located at the crime scene after the murders did not have any evidence on him before he was released to the Humane Society and then a "responsible person."

"During the search of the home, a dog was found in a room where the crimes had not been committed. Officers did not find any evidence on the dog and there was no indication the animal had entered the crime scene. The dog was taken to Animal Services and released to a responsible person," MPD said”

Also some detail on kaylee and the stalker thing. Might be a dead end.

R257 I understand what you meant by sorority house: the girls' house.

NewsNation's map has "Nez Perez Dr." as the address of the Sigma Chi house.

……,,,

I thought we had video of Kaylee's ex-boyfriend Jack leading Murphy into his car? Isn't that the dog they co-owned?

This is a college town but also a mountain town. I've been there a good while ago. But, there would be - even among the student population-experienced hunters. Who knows how to butcher/dress their kill. Probably have a father who taught them.

Not that I’ve ever seen. Maybe that was not post crime or maybe he was given the dog after humane society released him to a “responsible party” (him).

R270 cutting up a dead animal isn’t quite the same as killing for humans likely in the dart, some of whine put up some resistance.

Thanks R271. I worry about poor Murphy. I had the idea that he was outside during the murders - somebody saying something like, "The dog has been found."

In any case, I hope he's ok. Wish the owner would give us an update!

*four humans

*some of whom

Jesus my post at r272 had so many typos. Here is is again:

R270 : Cutting up / butchering a dead animal is not the same as entering a home and killing four human beings, likely in the dark, some of whom also put up a fight.

Kaylee's ex, Jack, is the co-owner. The dog was removed from the scene by Animal Services and then release to him.

IDAHO FOUR: Roommate's Letters, Kaylee was the target?

Since we're resisting Murphy, I was going to repost the TikTok of him that I posted in the last thread, but everything involving Jack was taken down by that account.

For those who didn't see it, Jack is laughing while one of his frat-douche friends torments Murphy by making loud monster noises into a paper-towel tube. The dog runs in a circle, jumping from couch to couch; at one point even trying to jump onto the kitchen counter and then bouncing off and falling to the floor. He's clearly agitated, but he never barks once.

I hope Jack's parents have him, and not Jack. It was infuriating to watch.

"He described two different versions of "cleared" – one in which a person has "a rock-solid alibi," whose lack of involvement was somehow proven, and one that involves "an alibi that hasn’t been fully checked out, or perhaps something that was just a feeling that they got when doing interviews.""

They once 'cleared' the Green River killer. They spoke with him, had no evidence but they did have fluids from one of the victims that had been raped; Forensic scientists immediately extracted the sample to use for DNA comparison. Gary Ridgway became their main suspect. In 1980, he was accused of choking a woman -- the method used by the felon to kill the victims in the Green River case. However, the police searched his house and found nothing suspicious. The police then asked Ridgway to take a polygraph and he passed. The police also asked him for DNA samples and he complied. The police had no choice but to let him go. With no success, the case remained a cold case for over 2 decades.

Detective Reichert found interest in the case and reopened the investigation. When the new investigators read the suspicions the police had about Gary Ridgway, they decided to reinvestigate him. Using the DNA they found when searching one of the crime scenes and the DNA given to them by Ridgway they were able to identify the killer. Forensic scientists used a new method of DNA profiling and they were able to see that the unidentified DNA from the crime scene matched Gary Ridgway’s. Bingo.

I'm not saying anyone they've looked at and cleared is the murderer but you never know. I'm sure the cops are very well aware that this is the case.

^^Revisiting

No good can come of pets being kept by a bunch of partying undergraduates.

I hope pepper read the CNN article. It’s very insightful about how the investigation is being run.

^i hope PEOPLE read it too.

The latest (this afternoon) update from LE formally, by name, cleared almost everyone in the mix. Except:

Kaylees ex bf.

I don't think he did it, though. This fucking dorky,, weak ass milquetoast kid couldn't rob my 6 year old niece's lemonade stand, much less stab 4 adults to death, and not be charged immediately.

I'm not resisting Murphy - he's adorable!

[quote]The latest (this afternoon) update from LE formally, by name, cleared almost everyone in the mix.

Was there a press conference today? Today's written update didn't name anyone.

No idea. I couldn’t find it either. I looked too after I saw that post about it.

R263 = Kaylee’s dad, unable to string a cohesive thought or understandable sentence together.

"Cutting up / butchering a dead animal is not the same as entering a home and killing four human beings, likely in the dark, some of whom also put up a fight."

A typical American hunter will kill prey with guns, and butcher the corpse with knives, which is why I've said all along that the cops need to look for hunters who can kill with something other than a gun. Some hunter who will do shit like injure a deer with a gunshot, and then track them and kill them with a knife, up close and personal. Maybe the local hunters know of someone like that, but who knows if the gun nuts of Idaho are willing to talk to anyone in the government, there's some crazy shit going on up there.

Of course it could be a serial killer, there's too little information for anyone sane to come to a firm conclusion, but I'm still leaning towards the idea of a psycho who lived in the town, and who didn't seem any crazier than the typical Idaho resident.

The only recent change is the addition of the sixth person on the lease. I think that was added at the end of last week.

At this time in the investigation, detectives do not believe the following are involved in this crime:

• Two surviving roommates,

• Male in the Grub Truck surveillance video,

• Private party driver who took Kaylee and Madison home on November 13th,

• The male Kaylee and Madison called numerous times during the early morning hours of November 13th,

• Any individual at the residence when 911 was called, or

• The individual on the lease who moved out of the residence before the school year started and was not present at the time of the incident.

My comment about hunters was trying to say, without being too gross, that a hunter would have knives that most would not have.

"Male in the Grub Truck surveillance video"

Interesting, and I believe purposefully vague, language. WHICH male in the Grub Truck video?

[quote]The male Kaylee and Madison called numerous times during the early morning hours of November 13th

I thought that was Jack?

R260, Vaughn Monroe, DUH!

So they still know nothing? I've been checking in way less frequently because the DL Nancy Drews have failed to solve the case (per usual) and nothing is really happening.

R244, that dad is going to fuck this up. This is from that Fox News interview about the dad getting Private Investigators

>>>>>As well as his own fears, Goncalves said started working with private investigators because there were “enough insiders telling us we should be concerned” about the lack of any clear leads in the Nov. 13 murders. “I talk to detectives,” he said, making clear he was keeping away from internet sleuths, whom he dismissed as “Hollywood s–t.”

“One of the private detectives I talked to has 50 years in the game,” he said of his outside help.

Goncalves is working with private eyes as he fears “inexperienced” cops are not up to solving the murders of his daughter and three friends. That private detective told him that he “had to break cases when there wasn’t DNA,'” suggesting younger cops rely on it too much. “We’re trying to give them the benefit of the doubt,” he said of police investigators. The grieving dad still hopes cops will “be heroes” and prove him wrong by ultimately emerging with breakthroughs that solve the case.

What bullshit. Have any of you heard of private detectives helping to solve lots of cases? I don't think I have. They charge by the hour and just want the dad's money. They'll follow up ridiculous leads and feed that to the dad.

OMG, can one of you go tell those websleuth fraus to knock it off with the "everyone was jealous of Kaylee and Maddie because they were in college, rich, and beautiful"?

Pretty, sure. Rich? No fucking way. And in college? Who would be jealous of someone going to a low tier school like U of Idaho??

Could someone be jealous of their seeming popularity, yes, but these victims were not "rich elites." Have they not heard how Kaylee's father speaks?

Fuck those people on websleuths are delusional.

Kaylee! Kaylee! KAYLEE!

All of this talking to the media can used by the defense. All these crazy theories, could very well allow a jury to feel there's reasonable doubt and not convict someone.

The most successfully prosecuted high profile cases were not played out in the media. The biggest prosecution failures (casey anthony, O.J, Robert Blake), were all played out in the media. The defense lawyers used all those crazy theories as part of the defense. It got their clients off.

Republican Dad is giving the future defendant's lawyers lots and lots of examples of reasonable doubt. He's making this a circus

[QUOTE]I hope pepper read the CNN article. It’s very insightful about how the investigation is being run.

Sgt. Pepper Anderson is on duty and will resolve the case within ONE convenient episode.

Go fuck yourself, R298. I didn't claw my way to the top of this shit to have some arriviste with a misspelled name trying to nip at my fucking heels.

I have a mad crush on the annoyingly talkative dad.

First, he's clearly the protective type. Hot.

Second, he's a moron. I like 'em dumb.

Third, he's a wannabe alpha. Those types will do anything in bed.

I like them big and stupid.

Buck never would have been stabbed to death in his sleep.

R297 the yokels in Idaho could have seen in that way though. They don't know the difference between a used range rover and a brand new maserati.

R295 I DID solve the case, but the FBI will not respond to my phone calls. Chastin "The Butcher" Buttigieg is behind this.

Placing a handgun into the soft, tiny, alabaster hands of a daughter and teaching her how to shoot it in the dark? My word, how terribly dangerous.

D-A-N-G-E-R-O-U-S!

Imagine trying to correct the truculent behavior of an armed pop-pop tot in a snit because her flippers are cutting into her gums, when that little butterball Paizleigh-Rynnae is up five points after Talent, and she just needs to get on with it before her loving, self-sacrificing mother’s dreams sink like a fucking lead weight!

Whew! Breathe, Pats. But truly, I shudder to think. I would never get a decent night’s sleep. What is this world coming to?

My god, what trash parents, R307. She did not want to fire that gun and the parents forced her, at night, in the dark, and with no hearing protection.

If that’s Kaylee’s dad and Kaylee @ R307, then I see nothing wrong.

These folks are from Idaho, not Manhattan. Teaching kids how to shoot isn’t a rare occurrence in those parts.

What’s awful is that even if she had a legally registered firearm in her home, which she could handle proficiently, it didn’t spare her from being murdered by a psychopath.

LE have to solve this and soon. This guy will do this again.

[quote]These folks are from Idaho, not Manhattan.

Yeah, I get that. I grew up in Utah, and I also learned to shoot—with ear and eye protection, and after passing a safety course. I certainly wasn't being encouraged to shoot blindly into the darkness with no protection and being told "it'll stop" and "be strong" after my hearing was blown out.

R309, teaching kids to shoot is one thing (I think it's stupid, but then again, I hate guns), but taking a kid out in the dark, firing into the sky, with zero hearing protection is outright dangerous.

Has it been mentioned that Kaylee’s dad has confirmed that her injuries were “significantly more brutal” than Madison’s? He didn’t mention how Xana’s and Ethan’s injuries were comparison though, probably because he doesn’t know. He got his info from the private autopsies of the two girls.

^^ Nevermind… it was mentioned about 100 posts ago.

Shingles doesn’t care about all of your stupid opinions

But r310, Sometimes you just have to shoot "blindly into the darkness!"

Gun rights nuts like R309 *aways* think that having a gun in the house will protect you - when in reality you are more likely to have it used against you.

Tell me how a sleeping woman with being knifed to death would grab her gun? This is reality not a Batman film.

Always the man, hey Oscar R310 - you don't have a leg to stand on here!

Whoops? I was replying to Oscar at R315. It's hard to type properly when you're dead.

P.s. R315 I got a mighty chuckle out of your Pistorius reference!

R316 well, Billy the Kid slept with a gun right beside him, so I guess you could keep one in a drawer right beside your bed, and if you hear anyone, you could grab it and shoot them. Occasionally you hear of a homeowner doing that - not sure about women but I know I've heard of men shooting an intruder, and in at least one case, he killed the burglar and then was prosecuted for "overkill or whatever

Like the kid only broke in to steal a computer but you shoot him dead - is that legal? Well, in Florida maybe, with the "stand your ground" law which I don't understand. Anyway, if I lived in a dangerous area, I'd probably get one and keep it handy. (I don't but there's one in the house I could reach pretty fast)

R316, what makes you think I’m a gun rights advocate or a gun nut? Nothing could be further from the truth.

I’m pointing out that kids in these rural areas are taught to shoot fairly young. Do I agree with it or think that it’s safe? Nope and nope.

And while I may be a certified liberal, I don’t see anything wrong with an adult who has been well trained in how to use a gun, owning one and storing it away SAFELY in their own home.

Also, I wrote pretty much what you did. Having a gun or not having a gun did Jack shit to protect these kids from being slaughtered.

Jesus Christ, a 20 year old, drunk sleeping kid, isn't going to able to defend themselves against a maniacal, knife-wielding intruder, I don't care how many guns they have in their nightstand. Stop being dicks, and get this thread on track. Four very innocent lives were brutally ended here. Show some fucking compassion.

As an elder gay, I may need to remind some of you, that DL has been successful in the past in finding a murderer. The case of the Butch Sous Chef.

Ted Bundy had a club in the sorority house. His ferocious attacks on the sleeping young women precluded any of them grabbing a gun.

This thread has gone off the rails. Just when I thought we were rid of ICT (insane cartel troll), we end up now with sun rights discussions.

What’s all new at Chop-Chop U.?

It's really tough to believe LE has not a single suspect. Maybe they do, but damn. If your kids were attending this School, would you send them back there, after the holiday break? It seems like the investigation is moving towards a frat party? Shit, who knows? This is pretty awful

Never, not with Bigfoot running around with a knife and a raging hard-on

R327 I think they've got nothing - the frat party has some time that isn't exactly accounted for, they were probably fucking and hanging out in one of the rooms. Not unusual ignoring their phones for four hours if they were watching shows, smoking bowls, whatever in between rounds but if you just assume that chunk of time is "private time" for E/X it makes sense to me. The nature of the crime just doesn't strike me as someone that got pissed off that night and did this impulsively. It's so over the top and really seems like a fantasy killing and something that was thought out for a long time, maybe a life time of fantasizing. I'm reminded of the Jayme Kloss case, where LE just couldn't imagine that the person who did it was outside of the area and outside of the "profile"

Today I learned that the Larry Craig is a popular drink at the Corner Club. I hope it doesn't contain toilet water.

Any word on how far early admissions applications have dropped this year?

"As an elder gay, I may need to remind some of you, that DL has been successful in the past in finding a murderer. "

Yes, but that murder took place in *our* world, in good restaurants and cities where people can be out and proud on the job!

And this case is set in small-town Idaho, a place we know damn well we don't just need to avoid, we ought to help other gay people escape from there. So no, I don't expect the Datalounge Detective Squad to come up with anything useful here, even if my suspciions are correct and this is the only place on the web that the case is being discussed in a sane manner. Or mostly sane.

R332

R529 the CNN article explained all of what you are asking. They do have suspects. They aren’t sharing them. And a suspect today can be cleared tomorrow. And someone cleared at the beginning when they barely knew what happened that night and had no forensics, are advised to “look over their shoulder”. They aren’t necessarily going to remain in the clear by tomorrow or next week or next month.

They are processing the mixed DNA samples now which is very complicated. There will still be some upcoming twists and turns soon, before this either ends in an arrest or goes cold.

Someone will go down for this, but not the killer. They'll have to convict someone to appease the community.

R333, thanks for posting that segment.

The Pastor and the Christian café owner came off as two very angry men, who feel that they’re being singled out in a community that isn’t very interested in attending their bigoted, hate filled church.

They come off as offering legitimate (to them only) grievances and reasons why they’re being persecuted for their faith.

Not once does it dawn on either of them that they’ve centralized themselves in a college town where most kids aren’t interested in attending church, because college kids wanna party, not pray.

There have also been articles throughout the last 7 years or so, regarding white supremacy groups and ethnic-white nationalists nestling their way into the community.

There are plenty of really angry men living up in those parts.

Just like clockwork...

[quote]Grieving father Steve Goncalves told Fox News Digital on Tuesday that he has consulted with multiple attorneys who could potentially force police to release more details about the case. "There are things that we can request and things we can do to get to the truth faster," he said. "You have to fill out forms to get this evidence released to you. I don't know how to do that."

[quote]The family has already hired a private investigator to help crack the case, asserting that local police may be ill-equipped to handle the complex investigation. Goncalves wouldn't share the identity of the gumshoe but said it's a former cop with 50 years of experience and an 87% success rate in solving cases. "He's a true pro," he added.

[quote]He also questioned the department's decision to hastily clear people as suspects while refusing to disclose their alibis. "If you don’t share your alibi, then you’re scared your alibi isn’t strong enough to share with the community because that gives them a chance to peer review it," he said.

[quote]"They’ve messed up a million times. But I don’t get to say that because what experience does Steve have? He doesn’t know. He’s just a dad who woke up one day and had his life turned upside down."

Maybe Kaylee's dad is the killer? Wouldn't that be something?

What?!?

R339 as far as I know this africa thing and the "5 hour road trip" thing are completely fabricated and there's no reason to believe that he didn't provide DNA to LE either. Someone just made up shit about this kid and it's now circulating around because all of the other rumors had no legs. I hope all these channels get sued. I've unsubscribed from almost everyone I subscribed to when this story broke lol. One of the subreddits had to make a megathread just to contain all the misinfo and accusations about this guy.

" "If you don’t share your alibi, then you’re scared your alibi isn’t strong enough to share with the community because that gives them a chance to peer review it," he said."

That dickhead would rather rely on the nutters at Websleuths than the FBI and their fifty agents and forensics labs!

I'd say that grief had made him irrational, if I had any faith his thinking process was *ever* rational.

Oh God. They have one of those Christian gofundme things for Kaylee's father. I won't link it here but it's one Reddit if you want to check it out. Sketchy as hell.

[quote]There have also been articles throughout the last 7 years or so, regarding white supremacy groups and ethnic-white nationalists nestling their way into the community.

North Idaho is another world. In addition to a steady stream of far-right Californians, they've had waves of mass migration triggered by specific events going all the way back to the '60s when Ronald Rankin took note of North Idaho's support for Barry Goldwater and moved there.

Within a couple of years, he had attracted a group of benefactors from Orange County and the Central Valley. They set up shop in Kootenai County (later, the home to Aryan Nations) and began trying to rebuild the Republican Party from the ground up into something more fascist.

By the time he died in the mid-1980s, North Idaho had gone so nutty that the racists and militias that had poured in—based on what he was trying to build there—considered him a sellout and borderline liberal, and he called them the "Far-Righteous."

I think Ethan is the only one without a North Idaho connection. The Goncalves and Mogen clans moved to Kootenai County from CA and OR, respectively, in the early 2000s (Kaylee's mother and both of Maddie's parents are originally from there), and Xana's family is from Sandpoint.

Nobody is obliged to give police DNA. In fact only a fool would.

Something that has turned up in some mystery novels, and which might be true: If you're being interviewed from the police and they offer you water or coffee, do NOT drink it and then throw the paper cup in the garbage! Even if you don't consent to give them a DNA sample, it's legal for them to fish the paper cup out of the garbage and use it to get a DNA sample. They've seen that nobody touched the lip of the cup but you, the interviewee, and they saw you discard the cop and walk away so it's no longer considered your property. The books said that if you ever accept a drink from the police, you can foil this by keeping the cup and putting it in your pocket or purse to take home.

Does anyone know if this is true?

R345, yes, they can take your trash too if it’s in public or they could say ask your boss to take a cup or something from you. Here’s a case where they got a guy that way

[quote]They have one of those Christian gofundme things for Kaylee's father.

GiveSendGo. Imagine that!

Are we giving Jack advice so he can get away with it R345 - lol. Surely he'll be under a microscope forever, unless the FBI are idiots (I know the Idaho gang are).

Unless he didn't do it, and then why not give your DNA? Unless you think people are often framed with it??

[quote]The family has already hired a private investigator to help crack the case, asserting that local police may be ill-equipped to handle the complex investigation.

That's why the FBI is there, dumbass.

[quote] Goncalves wouldn't share the identity of the gumshoe

GUMSHOE. For fuck's sake. Someone get Fox to cut this shit out before they ruin any and all chances of the FBI catching the murderer.

He'll be the perfect co-host with Nancy Grace, what a power-duo for Maga-land.

[quote]As an elder gay, I may need to remind some of you, that DL has been successful in the past in finding a murderer

We did no such thing. Someone on DL said he'd hooked up with the victim and we urged him to call the police. Another guy on Joe My God had also hooked up with the victim and he was encouraged to talk to the cops, too. THOSE GUYS helped find a murderer. We on DL didn't do jack shit.

It just gets more North Idahoan by the minute!

The crowdfunding account is run by Jack-the-Ex's aunt. She and her husband own $5 thrift shops as well as a coffee place in downtown Coeur d'Alene.

They acquired the latter when the original owner was frightened out of business after saying that although he believed in people's right to arm themselves, things were getting out of control. He said that in response to half of North Idaho, all armed to the teeth, turning out to patrol the streets in anticipation of a ginormous and imminent Antifa raid on Coeur d'Alene.

Turns out it was just a Facebook rumor.

Enter the new owners:

[quote]“Luckily for us, the new owners are Dave and Brooke Miller (owners of the Beau Monde chain of businesses) and 2 partners, and highly patriotic,” the article says. “First order of business was changing the name from Calypsos to LYFE Coffee Roasters and Public House. LYFE = Live Your Freedom Everyday.”

[quote]According to her husband, Brooke Miller attended the President Trump rally and demonstration in Washington, D.C., on Jan. 6, 2021. However, she was not among those who stormed the Capitol building.

[quote]“My wife went to see what was kind of going on there, see what all the craziness that was happening,” he told The Press on Tuesday. “She didn’t go in the Capitol or anything like that.”

[quote]The Kootenai County Spectator Facebook page posted Sunday said the coffee shop was having a grand opening “so head there after church and congratulate them on taking over a progressive craphole and making it something great!”

Someone earlier in the thread (maybe more than one person) scoffed at the idea that Gonsalves was a QAnoner, but it sure seems like that entire family, and even their daughter's boyfriend's family, were Q loons.

They're going to completely boff this case. Dad Gonsalves is going to get too nutty on TV, people are going to stop caring, the family is going to put out crazier and angrier conspiracy theories as the weeks go on, and the case is going to go cold for years.

Why is the Goncalves family so possessive of Maddie? Even the sister, now.

The police are permitted to use materials like cups, straws, etc to test for DNA, as long as they can document the chain of custody. If a cup gets thrown into a trashcan with other garbage, then they’re likely to have issues with evidence contamination, so ideally, they wouldn’t want to let you toss the cup. But there have been cases where police picked up cigarette butts, took straws out of water glasses, etc. To add another wrinkle, the rules about trash not being protected once it’s removed from the home mean police can take and comb through household garbage for discarded cans. That’s how they claim they gathered DNA from EAR/ONS, I believe.

Maybe the Goncalves were annoying MAGAT Qanons and the girls were in a relationship and decided not to come home for Thanksgiving and papa fucking snapped?

R354 looks to me like maddies family is poor and dysfunctional with both parents substance addicts to me. I think Kaylee's family more or less adopted her, weren't they best friends since elementary school? I think they took pity on her and sort of took her away from that. Not that unusual.

Since Herschel Walker lost in Georgia, he can go back to being an FBI agent and help with this case.

But first he'll have to find Idaho on a map. That could take a few years.

I spent a few months in Coeur d'Alene in the late 70s and it was a lovely place full of warm,caring people.It pains me really to see how full of loons it is now.

What a depressing place to go to university. Cold, grimy, depressed economy.

You wonder why these kids didn’t want to go someplace place warm with lots of opportunity.

I’m not surprised at the Q-lunacy going on in this case. As was mentioned earlier, Idaho is ultra-conservative and has become a refuge for Republicans from the west coast looking to escape liberal politics and racial/religious diversity which in their minds is the root of all the problems in their home states, including joblessness, homelessness, crime, etc. It will be interesting to see how this investigation plays out, especially with Fox News platforming the dad, who has gone off the rails and is jeopardizing the investigation..

Idaho is 92% white, and the majority of them are Christian, so it will be tough to cast suspicion on any minority groups. Lots of frustrated MAGATs swinging at thin air, without any decent folk devils or boogiemen to pin the homicides on.

The rural bashing in this thread reflects typical American ignorance.

Some people like to experience seasons, not the constant seasonless glare of sun in southern parts of the country.

Who said Moscow is economically depressed? Only 9% of the population lives below the poverty line compared to 27% in sunny Los Angeles.

These kids were doing the right thing. They were all progressing nicely in school, some of them preparing for graduation this year and moving on to the next phase of their lives.

R362 The poverty rate in Los Angeles is 16.9% while the poverty rate in Moscow, Idaho is 23.8%. Where are you getting your stats from?

From official data. Where are you getting yours? Plus there's a marked and official difference between poverty and living below the poverty line.

It’s from the U.S. census, R364. Another interesting statistic is that 50% more Idahoans under the age of 65 claim a disability than Californians. I guess it’s from chopping all that wood?

You sound quite irrational. Cite your sources and I'll do the same. Kindly ensure your stats include the homeless population in LA (who actually live in abject povert). The US Census tends to disappear them.

FYI Moscow Idaho is .not a state, it's a city of about 25k where the median age is approx 24.

[quote]FYI Moscow Idaho is .not a state, it's a city of about 25k where the median age is approx 24.

Then why are you comparing it to Los Angeles?

^^ another brilliant American scholar.

Here’s the link to the data for Moscow, Idaho:

Here’s the data for South Pasadena, CA, a city 9 miles from downtown L.A. with nearly the same population size as Moscow, Idaho.

More irrationality from you, Sir. There is no state university in Pasadena.

This discussion arose from a question as to why any person would choose to attend Uni in Moscow, Idaho when it's cold, economically depressed, etc.

And now this discussion has devolved into your citing stats and comparing Moscow, Idaho to a wealthy LA suburb that has no state University.

You do see the problem, do you not?

R371 Pasadena Community College is not a university, but it is one of the 2-year colleges that transfers a lot of students to CSULA (6 miles away) and UCLA (20 miles away.) So it is quite a college town, and has a large population of young people.

^^^ fuck me. I'm out.

Pasadena Community College and Santa Monica Community College are considered nationally as some of the best community colleges.

Agreed, R374. And tuition is free to California residents, and the per-unit fees are waived if you qualify through FAFSA, making college virtually free. The textbooks, though…

[quote]And now this discussion has devolved into your citing stats and comparing Moscow, Idaho to a wealthy LA suburb that has no state University.

You’re the one who brought Los Angeles into it, R362 / R371. I was merely comparing California to Idaho in order to explain the migration of Republicans.

Are you telling me these students could not have attended CalTech?!

[quote]Are you telling me these students could not have attended CalTech

B-b-b-but… that’s a PRIVATE college, not a state university… typical American not knowing data statistics!

Will you two get back on topic? They are both awful places.

Girls! Girls! Both Idaho AND California are shitholes!

It sounds like a freezing shithole

For a shithole, California is pretty goddamn popular.

You guys should check out Kaylee's dad's LinkedIn.

Why, R383 ?

Anyway... are they still dead?

Link please 383

[quote]The rural bashing in this thread reflects typical American ignorance.

The unintentional irony of that statement made me LOL.

Congrats ya'll. You've managed to completely derail a legit thread. I'll check back in a few days, to see if all these nebbish and cranky, sunken-facial-featured Qweens have moved on. Pasadena? Get serious.

[quote]MOSCOW, Idaho — Detectives working the quadruple homicide investigation near the University of Idaho in Moscow are interested in speaking with anyone who may have been in a white 2011-2013 Hyundai Elantra. They don't have license plate information.

[quote]"Tips and leads have led investigators to look for additional information about a vehicle being in the immediate area of the King Street residence during the early morning hours of November 13th," the press release stated. "Investigators believe the occupant(s) of this vehicle may have critical information to share regarding this case."

It was removed by reddit mods before I could get the images - someone posted a screencap from the facebook group, preceding the announcement regarding the Hyundai of interest. They were complaining about an antisocial worker who always insisted on keeping his hunting knife on him until after the murders, the day after which he didn't go to work, there's a corresponding police report for a welfare check that matches the story and that address has a 2011-13 white elantra parked outside. I can see why the mods removed that because they just straight up posted this guys full address but that's pretty spicy!

Finally, something!

i got the guy to send me all the screencaps but im unsure about posting the rest because they all have the guys address. it's just a screencap of the report showing the welfare check called in, a few different street view type photos of the white elantra being at that address, and the route between the address and the crime scene.

Welfare checks in Moscow are public records.

R393 it's this one then

22-M10055 Welfare Check

Incident Address: 1500 blk LEVICK ST

MOSCOW ID 83843

Disposition: ACT

Time Reported: 16:37

Cad Comments:

RP would like a welfare check done on employee who hasn’t shown up to work.

since Monday, she has called and text with no response back. No report.

Allegedly, that guy with the Elantra is Jack S.

ALLEGEDLY…

Christ, these threads are endless.

DL-ears, just solve the thing already!

R394 In street view, you can see what looks like a white Elantra parked between a red sedan and a black pickup truck, but it could just be a coincidence. The block is very short, and terminates at both intersections. It’s an oddly zoned area of residential apartments and commercial buildings.

R392 The murders occurred on Sunday the 13th, but the welfare check happened on Thursday the 17th, so it’s doubtful that it was the knife-bearing “co-worker” who allegedly skipped work the day after the murders. And who knows if that car even belongs to that co-worker? Someone either fabricated the co-worker story or connected the dots incorrectly.

The street-view car is a Sonata. Sonatas from that period have a square gas door and a strip of chrome trim that runs under the windows all the way to the headlights. Elantras don’t have the chrome, and the gas door is round.

2011-2014 Elantra

Doesn’t the guy who escaped to Africa live right there too?I read something that he’s just a little up the street.

2011-2014 Sonata

The police did it. Duh.

R398 the welfare check was done on the 17th because the person had not been into work since the 14th and was not reachable for those days.

Oh well, another dead end. Give it time, and the leaking dad will leak more info. Also, some interesting news about his family and his/their criminal past is about to break.

Yea, Moscow is the Flagship of U of I…which would put it in the bottom third of Cal State campuses…and would be a moonshot compared to Merced—much less any other UC campus.

P.S. There are two highly ranked schools in Pasadena or directly adjacent: Caltech (one of the top 10 research universities in the world) and Occidental College (one of the top 29 small liberal arts colleges in the U.S.)…and JPL to boot.

The person had not been at work the entire week so the welfare check was requested on the 17th.

We care not r406. Perhaps start a separate thread about that topic.

*20

Coincidence?

No, random.

Well, one good thing about Moscow is that rent is super-cheap. Maybe use that extra money to install Ring cameras to keep an eye out for all the local thieves, drug addicts, mentally unhinged psychopaths and quadruple murderers who’ve been skulking around the neighborhoods.

AKA, the residents.

Haha, R413.

[quote][R398] the welfare check was done on the 17th because the person had not been into work since the 14th and was not reachable for those days.

And his employer didn’t fire him for not showing up or calling in for nearly a week?

There's a fundraiser for the Goncalves family on GiveSendGo.

[quote]With the money raised from this fundraiser, Kaylee's family will be able to hire a private investigator, get expert legal advice, and possibly offer a reward for any information leading to the arrest of this criminal, who murdered Kaylee, her best friend Maddie and 2 other students in the house that night.

..."and 2 other students."

This is from Kaylee's dad's LinkedIn -

[quote] A versatile techie veteran with 3 decades of IT infrastructure, Bitcoin Foundation member & certified securities S7 registered representative. Financially semi-retired multi-millionaire whose knowledge, analysis, and prediction VC crypto disrupters reports are legendary!

If he's a multi-millionaire, then why the GiveSendGo?

His grammar is atrocious so it's kind of hard to believe that someone who sounds like such a rube is a multi-millionaire.

IDAHO FOUR: Police May Be Reinterviewing "Cleared" Individuals

[quote]Financially semi-retired multi-millionaire whose knowledge, analysis, and prediction VC crypto disrupters reports are legendary!

Bro, are you sick of you're deadend job? Sick cuz all the ways you're life could of been better if you had just jump at some oportunity's and shit you past up in the past? Bro, myself has allready made my Million'$ and now my passions is creating new Millionare'$!

Bro, HMU if you want me to tell you how you can join me and me and you can sore beyond the cryptosphere as the newest diamond platnum shooting star on my Fortian 500 crypto team! Just ask me how within the next 20 minutes or my offer will be resinded and never offer again to you from me!

No BSer's, timewaster's, looser's this offer is for future boss's with strong work ethnic only

#Entrepanuere #BuiltingBoss's #TeamMillionare'$ #LedgandaryCrypto

R416 “And all the rest!”

R417 The list of “people also viewed” on his LinkedIn account is crazy. It includes others involved in the case, among some other, more familiar names…

Okay, knife obsessed weirdo missing work seems like a really good lead!

R398 the story says this coworker skipped the entire week of the murders not the one day, it would make sense for the welfare check to come in after a few days of no showing

R416 heaven got two new angels

Papi Goncalves acts like the other 2 kids also being murdered is kinda besides the point? He obviously blames them, for some obtuse reason.

This dude is a fucking weirdo, who obviously needs to step aside. I'd bet a mortgage payment he's got some of Maddies underwear stashed somewhere.

Well r415 they probably needed to make sure he was still alive first. You know…with a welfare check.

R425 isn't Ethan jewish? Maybe MAGA daddy doesn't like that too much

I’m not sure that the people left on this thread are even interested in the story anymore. It seems weird to be stalking and posting the father’s LinkedIn for example.

Or posting stuff that was covered a short time earlier about suspects being cleared may not always be cleared (thanks captain obvious).

This thread is pretty much dead.

I'm still somewhat interested in it, mainly because for such a brutally, blood-soaked and obvious crime in a very small/contained area... no one has any idea who did it??

I don't really understand the idea/trend of becoming completely obsessed and emotionally investedwith some strangers' life-ending, horrible trauma, but millions are. It only takes a quick trip to reddit to realize (sadly) many people's lives revolve around these cases, and I surely would like to know why. When the current "tragedy of the month" is over, done, and quickly forgotten... there's always a new tragedy for these folks to insert themselves in. It's really kind of sick.

I will say this case, the Delphi murders, Gabby Petito, Maura Murray, etc have changed the way I look at social media and the internet, and not in a good way. Not trying to be all MARY!, but I really think it has gone a long way towards completely destroying society, and even perhaps mankind one day. We're living in a virtual reality hybrid fantasy life we created for ourselves, somewhat unintentionally. It's scary to me.

R428 has decreed the thread dead, therefore we must all disperse now. Thank you, my liege!

[quote]Well [R415] they probably needed to make sure he was still alive first. You know…with a welfare check.

R426 Yes, I understand that, but the knife guy’s “co-worker” claimed that when he returned to work, he “stopped wearing his knife”, which sounds like he did NOT lose his job.

[quote]I'm still somewhat interested in it, mainly because for such a brutally, blood-soaked and obvious crime in a very small/contained area

And people wonder why the nation is collapsing, with this sort of "thinking" proliferating.

Someone needs to be elbow-deep in a carcass for a little reality training.

People on the coasts are more distanced from their protein sources than homesteaders in the midwest who are comfortable with raising their food sources and then nonchalantly slaughtering Wilbur in front of the kids.

I have been into true crime for years, but I know nothing about this case. The conspiracy loons are ruining TC for me.

The latest rumor is that K’s dad was convicted of a felony a few decades ago, which is why the police have been treating him differently than the other parents. The conviction would have been around the time he moved from California to Idaho. The interesting thing about this is: were the police initially standoffish to the dad for being a felon, and he reacted by leaking info and conducting his own investigation? Or are they being standoffish because he’s a loose cannon with poor impulse control?

new hot rumor is that they were bullies and some girl killed herself?

R435, most felons have poor impulse control.

R429, Are you from another planet? Humans have been interested in the deaths, maybe especially horrible and horrifying ones, since, oh, I don't know, the dawn of Time?

Public executions. Gallows doggerel ("Lizzie Borden took an ax...."). Ballads ("Tom Dooley") and folktales. Myths and epics. Children's stories of murderous giants, wolves, kidnappers, monsters. "Crime of the (pick a) Century." Movies and television.

And then there's human history in all our depravity.

I'd venture to say that the oddball is he who is not interested! After all, no man is an island unto itself.

Maybe it was someone furious with the Dad - probably about bitcoin -and decided to kill daughter and friends in revenge.

Does anyone know the whereabouts of Jimmy?

Four dead sounds like more than one murderer.

Two victims in one bed on the lower floor; two victims in one bed on the upper floor. I think that arrangement made it possible for one person to commit all the murders. On the other hand, if they all were in separate beds on the same floor it would have been more likely that one or more of the victims would have woken up after the first attack and escaped — if there was only one attacker.

What's the about them bullying some girl into committing suicide? I can't find anything on it. Mean Girls was their fave movie.

[quote]Maybe it was someone furious with the Dad - probably about bitcoin -and decided to kill daughter and friends in revenge.

Who would kill 4 innocent people over money? Why not kill the actual perpetrator of the fraud? Also, K & M looked like twins, and if K sustained far worse injuries than M, it must have been an obsessed stalker or someone who had a relationship with K.

Tell me about it, r441!

Speck R445,you were so goddamn lucky you walked into a house of submissive Asian chicks, had you gone to the fiery Latinas nursing school, you would have been emasculated years before that black dude in prison turned you out.

Only 2 Speck victims were Asian.

Well maybe it's the fact they were nursing students and women in a more submissive era, or maybe they thought if they did what he said, they'd be alright. The Hi-Fi killers in Utah also had that youngish girl, 19, who was compliant with them thinking they'd spare her, they did not, but at least she didn't have to drink Drano. If someone breaks in, fight as hard as you can, you may die but at least you'll die fighting, try and scratch the fuck out of them, maybe you'll get their DNA under your fingers and that will be what catches them.

Were the 2 girls a couple?

I think One person did it. I think it was some deranged killer. Each vic was stabbed multiple times. If you slit throats no one struggles or cries for help.

I just hope everyone who is working so hard on this case with me takes enough time out for self-care. Your important. K,M,E,and X would've wanted it that way, IMHO.

My new Tik Tok vid, "Today's Sus Vibes" will be streaming L8R 2Nite.

Has anyone heard from Mr. Goncalves in the last few days? I'm getting very concerned he's been silenced by the pedo ring bitcoin drug cartel or HG. YMMV. #justice4theIdaho4

They've had so many calls about white Hyundais that the tip line had to be routed to an FBI call center.

I'm guessing that 99.99% of the calls are coming from Redditors, Websleuths, and TikTokers who've spotted them in very suspicious places, like Hyundai dealership lots and Vermont. Also, keep in mind that the red Hyundai you see today was probably white on 11/13.

Those Richard Speck prison videos are some of the most depraved shit I've ever seen. When the black dude starts sucking on Speck's hormonally enhanced breasts.... Jesus fucking christ.

I saw a Hyundai once.

What about me?

R438

You are so right. People are still trying to figure out who Jack the Ripper was. Bundy sells like hotcakes. To think R429 had to either spend time skipping down the thread to where they could post, or has been reading this column the whole time, arriving at the last post. This thread of over 400 posts to that one they wrote here. If they were not interested well, what gives R429? How could you get to the bottom of the thread barrel without doing one of those things? Sometimes I do wonder if it's a case of being morbid, sometimes I think it's the nag of a mystery but tonight I think it's one time when we really do see ourselves as brethren. One of 'us' has been treated most unfairly, the vacuum of injustice surrounds it. Looking for answers, hoping for justice. Wanting somehow to make it better. To make sense of it. To satisfy perhaps an old instinct, one of our brethren harmed, what DID happen to them.

As outlandish as this sounds sometimes I have a brief thought, a wish, of being like the 'blue fairy' waving a wand, making it all better. I want to help but cannot, can't even fathom why things like this happen at all.

That’s atrocious if his LinkedIn is true. He can’t use his own money for a reward? Something not right somewhere….

He's grifting off his own daughter's death.

Daddy Dit It

Most atrocious of all is that a 50-year-old man has so little self-respect, self-control, and self-awareness that he thinks writing, "I'm a multimillionaire, bitchez!" will give him the validation he so clearly craves. What's next, a $64/hour private-jet photo shoot?

I despair for Ethan's family.

Sometimes (often?) bad things happen to trash people.

For example: a kid should never be parked in some fifth-rate, MAGAT-factory “university.”

If she DID end up in such a place, she shouldn’t be living in some flop house where people are constantly coming and going and sharing security codes. That’s insane.

As a non American, I find the whole sorority/fraternity thing strange. I understand their value in a top-tier university, as connections could help with future employment, but in the case of these students, sorority thing just seems like an excuse to party and be cliquey.

If he really was a millionaire, he could have bought her a spot at USC.

Why can't I get my head busted open by your crazy MAGATs who insist you're touched in the head? Que bueno. Putanza!

R463 - these "Greek" things suck. They separate out the better looking students so they can feel superior; it's only sort of class-based but mainly fucking LOOKS. The way our newsmen and women; "influencers"; hell even politicans, to an extent, are chosen. All surface and no substance, for the most part. God I hate the system even more than major college sports which make the institutions more about surface shit and not actual learning, skill, intellectualism -- the things you'd think a university should value.

btw, I'm a dumb poor American from the South - but what was that club with Boris Johnson, David Cameron, and some other toffs at Oxbridge? I may have my details way way off -- but aren't/weren't all those exclusive clubs sort of the same thing? Ways to set yourself apart as better than everybody else? Meanwhile involving copious partying, drug-taking, orgies, god only knows. Well, now I can't remember the name of their toffs' club but seems like the frat shit exists there too.

Good looking people are advantaged in every part of life. It kind of sucks that when you’re a kid you believe life rewards hard work, brains and good character. They should be honest with kids from the outset.

R466, it was Bullingdon, at Oxford. And yes it was very posh and "fratty".

[quote]They've had so many calls about white Hyundais that the tip line had to be routed to an FBI call center.

I popped into Reddit last night and saw about one million posters who incorrectly thought a white unmarked police car in the bodycam footage was the white Hyundai Elantra, and it didn't matter how many people tried to correct them, they just kept posting that mistake over and over and over again. Probably half of those calls they got were Reddit idiots talking about the police car.

Hmm, should be able to make a portmanteau out of "Reddit" and "idiots" but it's not really coming together. Reddiots?

I was pleased that you did not misgender RiRi, R453.

Suss!!!!

I think we’re all transfixed on this case because we want justice. That’s my reason, anyhow.

I’m into true crime, but only three cases have really gotten in my head the last 10 years:

Shann’ann Watts & her girls.

The Delphi murders.

These kids in Moscow, ID.

We were ALL into the Watts case because it basically played out as a documentary, due to Shann’ann’s constant social media postings. And it’s just inconceivable that a father would murder his kids over some pipe dream and hard on over a work related adulterous affair.

The Delhi murders captured our attention because the victim recorded her murderer, so there’s that.

And this one probably gets our goat, because much like the Chris Watts ordeal, one wonders how one person could pull this off, why, and how?

Also, no one likes to see parents lose their children. Whether they’re toddlers or college aged kids, it really doesn’t matter. Our society despises people who murder the children of our fellows. We demand justice. Plain & simple.

Personally, I want this POS arrested and fried for this, as much as I did for Chris Watts and Richard Allen.

And IDGAF that Kaylee’s dad is an ex felon. He obviously turned his life around, and appears to have stayed out of trouble, and raised a family well enough to have all of his kids attend college, etc. I understand his frustrations. I get it. I don’t necessarily agree with the way he handled himself in the beginning, but JFC, if anyone deserves a break, it is he! Losing your baby girl cannot be something we would wish on any man.

Give the guy a break. He was a decent dad to Kaylee, and even to her BFF, Maddie, whose parents were obviously not able to properly raise her.

R472 The dad’s past is pertinent because cops are usually prejudiced against people with felony records, regardless of what they’ve done to turn their lives around. If this is what caused the antagonism between the dad and law enforcement, it‘s a key factor in the conflicting “facts” reported about the crime scene, and undercuts the legitimacy of the entire investigation.

How do you know he was a decent dad, R472? He was a felon and a magat.

You type boring R466

Who's gonna take over the car payments on that 8 year old Evoque?

Fair enough, R473.

R474, you’re correct. I don’t know if he was a decent dad, but I guess I assume he is/was, because he wants this murderer caught so badly. That’s a bias on my part, admittedly.

And sadly, he is a MAGAt. But if his entire family were/are also MAGAts, what difference would it make to them? They wouldn’t be the wiser, imo.

What’s interesting is that Watts, and Allen, both killed multiple people on their own, and many theorized that both had accomplices, yet they didn’t.

I wonder if this will turn out to be the case as well, with these 4 kids? I’m guessing it will.

Well, obviously someone got him shut his mouth quick, after his last unhinged rant.

[I tried to include a link to the article, but the post wouldn't go through. It's about 1/3 down the Idaho Statesman's main page.]

A new article with quotes from two neighbors...

One sleeps with earplugs because of the noise. That night, her dog woke her up at two and she couldn't go back to sleep so she played a computer game until five. She alternated between headphones to no headphones because she was enjoying the quiet. The other thinks he heard a scream as he was falling asleep around four, but he discounted it as a "party sound."

Kaylee's father is a felon now?

Ex felon, R479.

Allegedly over 20-something years ago.

Probably drugs or some bar fight is my guess.

Anyone here in the know regarding Kaylee’s dad & his arrest record?

"Felon" is permanent. Anyone with a felony conviction is a felon for life.

So does the mystery Hyundai mean food truck showalter guy is not likely our killer now? Did he have a Hyundai? If not, can he come back from Africa now?

Thanks for clarifying as this thread is the first time I have ever heard the term ex-felon 😂. Where do people come up with this shit?

R482 I thought JS lived in one of the apartments within walking distance of the crime scene. It’s also possible that the occupant(s) if the Hyundai are being considered as witnesses because the car was seen in the area around the time of the murders.

R453 I'm glad I haven't seen THAT.

I remember the day that murder happened. I went to school the next day. Our teacher was doing roll call. Got to a kid named Bob Speck. After he called it you could hear a pin drop. We were all young but we all knew of the story.

Then a kid laughed and the deafening silence was over.

I should have added that it is possible, when there was originally the option to charge as either a felony or a misdemeanor, to have a felony reduced to a misdemeanor. Crimes that could only have been charged as felonies aren't eligible for a reduction. In some cases, there's also expungement, but that varies by the crime and by the state.

In any case, a reduction or expungement would make it like the felony never happened, so "ex-felon" still wouldn't be applicable.

Didn't one of those nurses survive by hiding under the bed? I watch so much true crime maybe I'm confusing the Speck case with something else.

R484 what is the point/relevance of your comment that “you thought he lived near the crime scene” in relation to what is said at r482??? There doesn’t appear to be any.

I get it r486. There’s some stuff written on this thread that can make one feel kinda ragey.

Them kids is still daid.

Mad men had a episode that included the Speck murders and featured the girl’s game “Dream Date”. The game had a plastic door where the dream date comes in. Very interesting juxtaposition

So, Betty’s mother in law is watching Sally and scares the crap of her telling her the story of the Speck murders. They both take a Seconal and pass out in the living room

Betty and Henry Frances come home and look at them and he says “what the hell is going on around here”

R487 from Wikipedia

"One woman, Corazon Amurao, escaped death because she crawled and hid under a bed while Speck was out of the room. Speck possibly lost count or might have known eight women lived in the townhouse but was unaware that a ninth woman was spending the night. Amurao stayed hidden until almost 6 a.m".

[quote][R484] what is the point/relevance of your comment that “you thought he lived near the crime scene” in relation to what is said at [R482]??? There doesn’t appear to be any.

Because R482 implies that JS not owning that car would clear him as a suspect. If he lives a stone’s throw from where the murder happened, why would he drive instead of walking along the narrow shortcut between homes and apartment buildings, which is far less obvious than driving a car past road cameras?

^^ In other words, let’s hope whoever was in the white Hyundai saw something, and they’ll report it to the police. Like maybe some guy with a backpack leaving the murder house and walking quickly through the narrow path.

The unaired portions of those Speck prison includes "Ri-Ri" sucking cock, and his prison pimp inserting rolled-up one dollar bills into Riri's hole, allegedly. Lovely people.

Actually in reading about speck he was caught in July, I wasn’t in school then. Must’ve been when his trial occurred. The papers were all on it.

To make a fast getaway out of town you moron.

So using your logic, if food truck guy has a white Hyundai it still can’t be him because why would he not just walk home after killing them! You seem to feel it is better to be seen walking home on foot covered in blood by others than to hop into his car quickly and gtf out of town like he supposedly did in the early morning hours to his parents’ cabin.

Glad you’re not in the fbi Sherlock!

R497 There was no blood trail anywhere, not in the driveway, not in the pathway, so it’s likely he washed up in the victims’ bathroom and changed into clothes stashed in a backpack. Went home before going to the cabin (if he really went there) to cool down and clean himself up some more to make sure not to leave any traces in whatever vehicle he “drove” later. And if he HAD a white Hyundai, L.E. would have seized it by now, don’t you think? Did he take it to Africa?

I apologize for not keeping up well enough, but now there's a cabin that the killer may have gone to?

Have they checked the cabins along the shore?

I was about to ask the same thing, r499. First mention of a cabin that I've see.

Do we know there isn't a blood trail?

Or do we just know that the cops haven't told us whether or not there's a blood trail?

[quote]There was no blood trail anywhere, not in the driveway, not in the pathway

We don't know that. We don't know that there wasn't a trail inside, which may have dwindled to nothing by the time he got outside.

Surely the cabin thing is just the crime thread meme someone always brings up on these threads, right? Tell me there isn't really a cabin involved now.

It was R497 who brought up the cabin alibi. I have not heard of it before. Who’s your source, R497?

It's the Reddit Law of Materialization. If a Youtube psychic says it and Reddit repeats it enough, it becomes fact. Just like Kaylee's ex is untouchable because his family founded Coeur d'Alene. I mean, just look at his last name. Duh.

Is the cabin situated on a lake with brackish water?

There was a rumor ages ago that an ex-boyfriend and/or hoodie guy left town immediately after the murders and went to his parents' cabin. It was debunked a long time ago. I guess 497 thinks it's funny to bring that up again.

The sky was so brack that day.

Yes, it was hoodie guy who supposedly was the designated driver, who later that night supposedly -- per rumor and nothing else -- left town and went to his parents' cabin for the weekend. The Redditors who still think hoodie guy is guilty say he has rich parents and a dumb alibi and owns tons of Kaybar knives and an anger problem etc. etc. It's all rumor. I guess that's what the angry cabin replies earlier are supposedly about.

[quote]There was a rumor ages ago that an ex-boyfriend and/or hoodie guy left town immediately after the murders and went to his parents' cabin. It was debunked a long time ago.

I don't think it has been debunked.

Idaho Four: The Usual Suspects, A Recent Arrest & Updates.-

Hmm....well the websleuth fraus found a tiktok video (apparently taken in the house) which shows one of those Qanon flags hanging on the wall. (The flag with the snake)

Hoodie guy has been cleared by the police.

If you want to say "Someone online said he went to his parents' cabin that night so that means he's guilty" then go right ahead, but it's a dumb thing to say.

I don't watch shitty true crime vloggers, sorry.

Here's a screen shot from the tiktok.

That symbol has long been debunked as a QAnon symbol.

I hope we’re not going to pretend this is a QAnon incident and totally lose the plot.

I found it. The cabin rumor started with a Youtube video by a psychic called Donna Seraphina. After being repeated so many times, it has now entered the realm of: "I don't know where it came from, but everyone says it and nobody ever calls them out so it must be true." Batshit crazy, every last one.

The following is taken from a change. org petition calling Jack the Hoodie Guy to be reinvestigated. Even though his last name is all over the internet, I don't want to be a party to that. You can find the petition by searching "Donna Seraphina" with "politicalfamilyties." The video, which describes things that are fucked up beyond belief, is on the Youtube account: Psychic Reverend Donna Seraphina.

******

[quote]If you listen to my reading, you will see that the person who did these murders drove straight up to his family cabin and buried the knife and a trophy that he took from the crime scene.

[quote]~ I am not saying that I believe that Jack [...] is guilty. ~

[quote]I don't know if he had a part-time job at any of those bakeries, and I definitely saw the person cutting himself on the bread machine on purpose so that everybody would believe the cut on their hand was from the bread machine instead of the murders.

[quote]Could there have been more than one person involved?

[quote]The rumor around the internet is that his father whisked him off to South Africa, where he cannot be questioned further, nor can he be asked to give DNA. That rumor can be false, and if Jack would like to contact me, I would happily interview him and let him give his version of events.

[quote]In looking to the situation further, it is clear that Jack [...] and his entire family are extremely politically connected and wealthy.

[quote]You can join my Group on Facebook, where we have more information about Jack [...]. That group is called "Psychic Reverend Donna Seraphina's Readings and Investigations".

And on and on it goes....

This is how wild conjecture gets repeated and becomes "fact", r516.

[quote]Have they checked the cabins along the shore?

I know r500 wasn't the one who first brought up a cabin, but they are making a joke, referring to fans of actress Naya Rivera, who went missing after she took her 4-year-old son out on a boat on Lake Piru. The boat and her son were found. The child said his mother had been unable to reboard the boat after they had gone swimming.

Some of her fans insisted that she might still be alive, asking "Have they checked the cabins along the shore?" and a DL meme was born (she was later found drowned).

[quote]Do we know there isn't a blood trail?

No, we don't. We really don't know much at all, so people just start making things up. Others repeat it, and it becomes gospel.

Case in point, regarding Anne Heche's death. Hours before her fiery car crash, a podcast was aired in which she was apparently drinking heavily.

In this linked DL thread, a poster shrieks that "a fucking photo at the first crash site (the garage) that shows the vodka bottle in the car", something that was widely reported - pretty obviously a drunk driving accident, right? Except that while it is true that a photo exists, showing a bottle with a red cap in Heche's car, it has never been verified what kind of bottle it was. We now know that the podcast was from days before, and that there was no alcohol in her system at the time of the accident.

An assumption was made somewhere down the line that it was a vodka bottle, that she was drunk - and eventually all of that became "fact" - and none of it was true.

tl:dr? All of this may be a way to pass the time, but most of it is bullshit.

It is true that they haven’t checked all the cabins as they are currently waiting for the National Guard’s Tactical Team Special Forces Unit

You sound like a fiction writer r498. And not a very good one.

R518 That was not supposed to be released. That has not been cleared.

Remember the Tara Grinstead case?It looked like it would never be solved either but then it finally was and it was the son of someone important in town also. Who knows? maybe it is some asshole kid of a rich man or something.

[quote]The cabin rumor started with a Youtube video by a psychic called Donna Seraphina.

Aw jeez, I didn't know it came from a psychic. I assumed it was one of the fake "locals" on Reddit.

R519 If you think Occam’s Razor sounds like bad fiction, I’m guessing you have a more “imaginative” theory about the murders.

R515, I don't think it's a QAnon murder at all but since the flag was featured a lot on Jan. 6th, hanging this flag on the wall does tell you what kind of people these students were.

Also in the video, you can see that the other end of the flag has the silhouette of a assault rifle.

Maybe they all committed suicide.

Just another failed family and friends business venture.

When will they ever learn?

Sorry haven't been keeping up but do we have a suspect now?

Boy, being young white and pretty and murdered sure gets a LOT of attention in our society. Enough with these fucking threads, move on already.

That part of Idaho is so full of heavily armed right-wing wackjobs that it's going to take forever to sort through the movements of any possible suspects! Absolutely anything could set off one of those nutballs, from a "militia" leader who didn't get special treatment at the restaurant where the girls work, to someone thinking house was possessed by evil spirits, to a psycho hunter who wanted to go after human prey, who the fuck knows.

And there's enough anti-government sentiment that there are people who won't talk to the police, they'd rather see a murderer go free than cooperate with the gummint.

R530 I just remembered that ex-comic and white supremacist Owen Benjamin set up a homestead in Idaho. Even the long-time residents are scared of him and believe he’s preparing for a Ruby Ridge type showdown with the local government..

You bitches are in trouble now!

R529 has stated his boundaries. Move on already! Enough of these threads. Go talk about Days of our Lives or Meghan Markle.

[quote]"Felon" is permanent. Anyone with a felony conviction is a felon for life.

Apparently not, as I just chatted with a coworker yesterday who had his felonies removed by participating in a special program. He did various community service gigs helping other ex-cons get GEDs or vocational licenses. He's working for a major school district that does not hire anyone with felonies, which means they aren't on his record now. He's supposed to give me info about the program next week, so I can share it with my sister, whose son is getting out of prison next year.

This case reminds me of the Gainesville Ripper in Florida.

I love when people come up with idiotic speculation and try to qualify themselves as being ‘smart’ by using the expression “Occam’s razor’.

Tell me r498 and r523, where did you get the info that there was no blood trail? The only reference to the scene from reputable news sources is that the killer was sloppy. Please do attach it for us.

R542 is on point. My friend's cousin's wife has a friend who is local to Idaho, and peeps are yanking white-haired seniors outta white Hyundais state-wide. I'm triggered!

R534, as I said in my follow-up post, expungements and reductions are possible in certain cases, depending on the jurisdiction and the severity of the charge(s).

That does not make someone an “ex-felon”; it makes the “felon” designation disappear entirely.

First, I think who ever did this is a psycho. He's creepy and weird. Second, I think he was familiar to a lot of people on campus. He would be around. Inconspicuous, part of the furniture, but he was around. Maybe he worked at the Uni. Maybe he came to some parties. Maybe he was hangout out awkward, and making some people feel uncomfortable. He watched. He may have had a crush on one of the residents and was laughed at or dismissed, not taken seriously. Something triggered him so he followed the two drunks. IMO those were the targets. And he killed them. At some point the coroner might be able to say who died first. But the point is, I don't think he is gone. I think he is still around, still watching, and still on a high from what he was able to get away with. He feels no remorse. He is really feeling...jubilant for want of another word. He will do this again, but he is still not over this one. Eventually he will need a new challenge. That is when they will catch him. After the second bloodbath.

Before the recorded screams become “fact,” like the psychic’s cabin, the audio was taken from an old domestic-violence livestream and manipulated to sound like it was being recorded from a distance.

The Daily Mail hack who wrote the article shown in the video has confirmed that the text was changed after the fact, and that there was no mention of recorded screams in his article.

A lot of people have confused “messy” with “sloppy.”The crime scene was messy because arteries were slashed. But “sloppy” means carelessness, and whoever did this managed to evade authorities for nearly a month. Either some careful planning was involved, or he’s one of the luckiest mass killers in history.

The killer is fond of ice cream. Vanilla AND chocolate. He's seen Disney films, eaten at a McDonalds, and has walked barefoot on sand.

Tire tracks, and forensic evidence gathering OUTSIDE.

R543, the investigators are going to prove that a lot of different vehicles were in that area and they all left....(gasp) tire tracks!

If we have to put up with your shitty threads, r529, then you can put up with these. If you don't like it then put the thread on ignore, eventually it'll take. If it doesn't, go bitch to Muriel about it.

Stop being a goddamned hall monitor and telling us what we can and can't post.

[quote]Before the recorded screams become “fact,” like the psychic’s cabin,

Seriously. Apparently the Joseph Morris guy who posted the scream video is notorious for making stuff up, but YouTube won't do anything about it. Someone on Reddit said he occasionally posts photos of dead bodies in his videos, and even THOSE don't get taken down.

This is why I don't watch shitty YouTube "sleuth" or "true crime" videos. They're all scams.

As Kaylee's father is investigating the case on his own, he should have sought advice from a psychopathic killer like Hannibal Lector. '

"Amputate a man's leg and he can still feel it tickling. Tell me, dad, when your little girl is on the slab, where will it tickle you?"

Thanks for you inside track insight r544. You must be in the fbi to know it all like this.

“Kaylee’s father! Can you still hear the cries of the potatoes?”

Commencement weekend is underway and the Moscow PD is doing their best to allay visitors' fears.

[quote]As always, we want to remind the public to stay vigilant, travel in groups, and communicate with family and friends as you travel.

I guess they had to say something, but geez...

LOL! R550 our Perp isn't going to be doing any stabbings this weekend. IMO he doesn't like big events . I mean he may well be there, but he'll be watching. Mingling, listening to people talk about his bloodfest. Getting secret thrills out of being the talk of the campus.

R551 here. I do believe this is the biggest thing our Perp has e ver done. Maybe he tortured and killed animals. Maybe he bullied and abused his siblings. Maybe he even killed before. But 4 people in one event? No, not ever.

Jack with knife on Instagram and the caption.

I have a question and I don't care to find out myself.

Was Kaylee the one who bought the car and came up to Moscow to show it off before leaving Idaho? And is she the one who is said to have gotten 'special attention' by the killer?

I've gotten confused - what's the last name of the Jack that was Kaylee's ex-bf. It wasn't Katovic, was it?

Have we cast the movie yet?

I've find myself skimming and paging down a lot because there's absolutely nothing new about the case and there's so much extraneous crap thanks to Websleuthing nutfraus, Redditing crazies, YouTube psychics, and Kaylee's Q father. Jesus, what a brew!

I still wonder about a serial killer due to the three separate attacks on the 13th around 3:00 a.m. and the increasingly challenging nature of the attacks within easy driving distances. An elderly woman first victim, a couple with a third person in the house, and four killed at once. The Moscow PD gave no reason to eliminate the second attack, just trust them. I know local LE is supposed to take the lead, but they don't inspire confidence. Perhaps they don't want widespread panic by definitively linking the murders. That would be heading into Richard Ramirez territory in terms of terror. That Criminal Minds trope "We won't be able to catch the unsub until he kills again" may be the case here.

Well, R557, make sure you sleep with a tire iron on Monday night.

Excuse me, Tuesday night. I forgot it is 3am here RIGHT NOW, because I am in the same time zone as U of Idaho.

Does that food truck still stream themselves serving up mac n cheese to all the drunk kids every Saturday night?

R550

“…these are common farmers…people of the land…”

R554, yes.

All the Jacks:

Jack D: Kaylee’s ex.

Jack K: Friends with all of the victims, particularly with Ethan.

Jack S: Food truck hoodie guy.

Jake: Maddie’s boyfriend. Maddie was the girl killed with Kaylee. They were BFFs since childhood & Maddie was considered a part of the Goncalves family, because the family basically adopted her unofficially, due to her own parents leading a troubled lifestyle when she was a child.

Out of all of the suspects, Jack S is the one who hunts and has multiple Kabar knives. His mother’s IG and FB had multiple photos of them with knives and antelope they had carved up on the field. The photos are disgusting and not appropriate for online consumption, IMO, but to each his own. Hunting animals isn’t illegal during hunting season in Idaho.

Still, his fascination with the girls at the food truck is odd. Doesn’t make him a murderer, but there’s a lesson to be learned here for straight men in particular:

There’s absolutely nothing wrong with finding two college girls attractive. Nothing wrong with even glancing their way in hopes of a connection via a smile. But if a woman makes it clear she’s not into you? Just leave her the fuck alone. Move on. For the love of God, you’re in college! There are thousands of girls to ask out on a date!

Speaking of which… ask her out on a date! Don’t follow women around like a lost puppy. Just get some courage and do it. Facing rejection is totally normal, which means once she says NO, the only thing left is to continue asking women out, until one says YES!

Stalking women and following them around is not a way to get a date and it truly is creepy AF, which is why men need to understand that things can get serious and not in a good way. Imagine this Jack S. person has nothing to do with this? Now the idiot is being harassed to no end, because there’s video of him acting like an inappropriate asshole, at some food truck.

Is he harmless? I have no idea, but his mom’s social media photos did him zero favors, nor did that food truck video.

Young men need to get the fuck off social media, get into sports or something that involves team building and being a part of social groups, because this new generation of men appear to have zero game when it comes to asking women out and dating.

The majority of the world is not filled with supermodels and male movie stars. The majority of us here on earth are average looking, and even unattractive. Yet all of us managed to get laid, date regularly, get into serious, long term relationships, get married and eventually have children.

Young men need to get over themselves and understand that dating is about SOCIALIZING with others NORMALLY and respecting the boundaries of others, as well as setting boundaries for themselves. Being shy is not a good enough excuse to not date. Being intimidated by the prospect of rejection isn’t a good enough of an excuse either. Shy people who feel intimidated still manage to date.

And what most young men don’t realize is that young women ALSO feel shy, unsure, and intimidated. It’s normal. It’s part of the early dating process. But once you keep on putting yourself out there, despite rejection, the rejection no longer stings, and eventually, a young lady will say YES! Let’s have coffee together or dinner.

Also, these young men need to realize that women they’re attracted to do not owe them shit. Not a single thing. If you’re an adult and can’t get laid? Then hire an escort and respect her boundaries as well by being a gentleman.

Life isn’t fair, but it’s ALSO not fair to stalk and hate someone who isn’t into you romantically or doesn’t even want a one night stand.

That’s not how dating, attraction or desire work.

But were the three girls wearing lipstick that night?

And just a couple days ago it was shoawker or whatever his last name is that went to Africa. Now it’s a whole other Jack per r553. The Reddit websleth fraus can’t keep anything straight.

R562: Nice rant “mom” but you apparently don’t realize you’re on a mostly gay men’s website. And TLDR anyway.

R562, I wonder how many straight men deliberately follow girls around in a creepy cowardly way, and how many do it in a state of "lust induced brain freeze" (Dave Berry's phrase), without being fully conscious that theyre being creepy.

It's rude and creepy either way, and guarantees the girl will never fuck them, but I just wonder what's going through their heads, if anything.

Thanks to whomever uptrend for keeping the Jack characters straight.

Why did they release bodycam footage the night of the murders a few hours after the murders occurred to refresh people’s memories? They then said that the people in the video are unrelated. How the fuck does that make any sense?!

They didn't release it to refresh people's memories. They released it to stop rampant speculation that it was related to the murders.

[quote]Rumor control:

[quote]There has been extensive media interest regarding an incident at Taylor Avenue and Band Field on November 13, 2022, at 3:01 a.m. This incident was an alcohol offense which was addressed by the on-scene officer. This call is not related to the murder investigations. For further details regarding this incident, a Moscow Police Department Public Records Request can be submitted referencing incident number 22-MO9896.

What time did the murders occur?

I still have trouble buying the other roommates hearing nothing while four people were slayed.

Were any of the bodies "posed", I wonder?

R566 the trouble is that is just how it is as of today. Tomorrow, a different one will be in Africa etc etc.

Asking again who confirmed Jack S. to be the food truck guy? Seems to me this is just another rumor that became fact. Can you really actually recognizes his face? Or has someone who knows him or he himself confirmed it?

Nancy Grace said the murderer came in the second floor glass window.

It’ll end up being a student. These investigators are just stupid.

What was with the Venmo $6 at 3:30am?

R575, I'm not so sure an enrolled student, but I definitely think it's someone younger and someone familiar with the campus, the community, and someone on the fringes of the campus social life, maybe pretending to be a student? etc. I'm thinking the killer is between 19 and 25 yrs old.

Still no one in custody? I think DL needs to start a private investigative agency, to teach these cops how to snoop.

What are they doing?

DL is usually good about solving these mysteries. We understood right away that those two guys in the Chicago Hyatt died of an overdose and were probably fucking (though the last part was never proved).

Jack S (hoodie guy) didn't seem like he was stalking the girls to me at first, mostly because he was talking so much to the big guy there that he didn't even notice when they left. He seemed to be there more out of obligation than anything, and I didn't get a vibe from him that he felt so humiliated that he would stab four people to death about it.

But he's the guy whose Insta had a post after the murder weekend with some friends saying "best weekend ever," and also some weird post about “am i proud? no. am i the tiniest bit sorry? lmao no” but it was hashtagged #murderdrones which is a TV show, so maybe he was quoting it.

Anyway, his behavior on Insta was of someone who didn't give a shit that those girls he had just been with were murdered, which made me think less charitably about his hanging around them at the food truck.

It's certainly possible he's just an asshole and didn't have anything to do with their deaths.

This is a completely botched "investigation". Heads should roll.

Jesus...Don't get killed in Idaho. OTOH, should you want to commit a murder...

DL is usually good at solving these things? DL is usually terrible, with some notable exceptions.

I see a Fargo like movie made based on this when it’s all good and done, possibly by a child of one Cohen or the other.

The Facebook group for this case is the one considered the ultimate resource. They even have records on all the cars fitting the description.

The Facebook group is: University of Idaho Student Murders - Case Discussion.

[quote]What was with the Venmo $6 at 3:30am?

Since there isn’t one, it can mean whatever anyone wants it to mean. Payment to a really cheap hitman, maybe?

Ethan’s $6 to Jack K was at 11:40 on the 12th.

According to Ethan’s half-brother—who, along with his wife, is verified on the sub linked below—it was for a ride.

[quote]Jk was Ethans Little brother in the fraternity they were in. Ethan would tip him for sober rides home or picking up taco bell ffs get your head out of your ass.

There was a Venmo transaction with “3:30,” but that didn’t involve Jack or anyone mentioned thus far in this story. It was sent by a random girl to Jack K’s sister.

[quote]Jack S (hoodie guy) didn't seem like he was stalking the girls to me at first, mostly because he was talking so much to the big guy there that he didn't even notice when they left.

He definitely noticed. He left just right after the girls left. If you watch the twitch stream at 1h 38m, you will see how Maddie, annoyed, was pointing her finger at white hoodie guy and telling him FU.-

The big guy had to tell him that his friends had left, r588. It's right there in the video.

[QUOTE]This is a completely botched "investigation". Heads should roll.

Interesting. Who should weird roll for the KBar knife? Kaylee's QAnon dad stepping into and nearly botching aspects of the investigation practically uninvited. How doesn't a felon require so much attention?

Actually, Kaylee's father is so overstepping, and outbounding about his Q theories that I'm sincerely starting to believe him as a possible killer. He seems to be decompensating, making less sense the right-wing nut channels that give information.

I know this is far from left field, but the daughter came back with a vehicle she would drive to a presumable new life in Texas totally away and safe from creepy Pops.

I've been following this case with interest because I feel sorry these four were just killed like the didn't matter.I'd love to see this killer apprehended and justice given to those four and their families.

I don't sense that the dad was in any way connected to these killings. I think he might have issues and he is crazy with grief. I don't sense that it was Jack, the Stalker, either, for some reason. It's crazy that all we have to go on is a white car. Hopefully, LE has a lot more evidence they are keeping quiet about while they check it out.

I read that the victims’ bedroom doors were locked and they were killed in their sleep? Is there any complete rundown of what is known anywhere? People are all over the place. If you weren’t following from the beginning you wouldn’t know what this case was even about.

If they were murdered in their sleep behind locked doors, how does that happen? The killer went room to room and locked the doors after they were done?

Who are the two roommates who weren’t harmed? Are they suspects? I mean, it would seem obvious.

The two unharmed girls are probably the murderers. It would make sense that two could pull this off. Blood is reportedly all over the walls and they call and say a person is unconscious and this is 9 hours later. Come on.

There was also a dog in the house. The two girls did it. Influencers are sociopaths.

Springfield Three, Idaho Four, Jackson Five

The Great North Woods are so unforgiving

Bajour!

Stop

This surely can’t help Tex Watson’s parole chances

There’s no sign of a blood trail in the drone footage of the property, and while there were reports of blood dripping near the home’s foundation, there were no reports of a trail. If there really was one, someone would have notified the police much earlier than noon that day. I’m 99% the killer cleaned up at the residence and then escaped on foot using a hidden path or trail to avoid the Ring cameras from nearby residences facing the street.

I think it might be best if Muriel and the Idaho murder threads be turned off

It's starting to sound that Websleuths and Reddit might just to damn me to be alone. They want shit-faced, unencumbered accomplished like idiots to rule!