THEATRE GOSSIP #504: The Airing On The Cunty Side Edition

Previous thread:

Nicely done, OP!

Chef's kiss, OP.

(Okay, the title was my suggestion. But well done.)

Oh Good, ANOTHER Sondheim tribute concert....

We need more sex tapes please.

Going to see SLIH tonight, apparently with J Harrison Ghee's understudy. I'll report back for all those interested!

Has anyone seen Merrily yet? Is it the second coming or a let down?

Phantom extending through April. It’s not going anywhere.

Let me guess - Judi will be doing Send in the Clowns again? For God's sake, Judi, give Liaisons a try instead.

She's already been assigned Lucy & Jessie, r10.

That London tribute is not quite a year old. Cameron Mackintosh put it together to jump-start the funding for the Sondheim Foundation.

Re the Playbill excerpt from D.T. Max's "Finale, Late Conversations with Stephen Sondheim," the introductory blurb refers to "that time Meryl Streep starred in The Frogs," although a few paragraphs later Streep herself says she was in the chorus (along with Christopher Durang and Sigourney Weaver). The stars were Larry Blyden, Jeremy Geidt, and Anthony Holland. Durang remembered that, "The chorus was split up by voices. I was with the baritones. Sigourney Weaver was with the altos. Meryl Streep was singing soprano. Stephen Sondheim had written 'It's Only a Play' for us. It's mournful and very pretty, a song about breaking the fourth wall in the theatre -- how you try as hard as you can, but you still can't get there. Sondheim himself came in to teach us this song and I found that exciting." The members of the Yale swim team who played the frogs were dubbed "the chlorines."

Anyone read the book yet?

Shall we continue talking about Bernadette in Follies and if Sally should be frumpy or hot for the show to work?

Apparently, Sondheim loved Bernadette's take on the role and was happy that she was playing her as really crazy, so make of that what you will. She wasn't a complete disaster in the role, but she's one of those performers who seems to change things from night to night depending on how she feels and how the audience response is. I don't think of this as a bad thing, because it means she's truly alive in the moment, but I can see where that leaves audiences with differing impressions of her performance. We've seen it throughout all of her performances, especially Gypsy. To this day, you have some who thought she was brilliant and those who thought she was the worst Rose of all time.

Imelda Staunton opened the show exactly how others have described Sally should be when we first encounter her. She was manic and excited to be there, but I still found her performance lacking and over the top, but with a few good moments. She was at least in a better production than Bernadette even if the Loveland sequence fell flat.

Has there ever been a Sally who came close to Dorothy Collins and landed all the right notes (both acting-wise and singing-wise)? I think that, if that film adaptation gets off the ground within the next decade or so, Amy Adams would be superb in the role. I've only heard her sing a bit, but I have the feeling she has most of the notes required and she's been making a career recently by playing incredibly depressive women, so it's easy to forget she got her start playing really energetic and perky characters in movies like Drop Dead Gorgeous and Enchanted. She could pull off both sides of Sally which seems to be the problem with many others who give it a try. They lean too much in one direction or another.

Dorothy also had the advantage of originating the role, so it was going to fit her like a glove.

Delighted to know my "airing on the cunty side" made it into a classic TG title...appreciate the endorsement, R3 / OP!

Also, the fact that no one jumped on rhyming "#504" with "Bajour!" is no small miracle.

They don't rhyme, r16, maybe that's why.

Meh title, OP.

R17 - Four and Bajour DO rhyme though...

I read it, r13. Save your money. This is largely a book about D.T. Max's adventures in interviewing Sondheim. It seems clear that Sondheim washed his hands of the interview a year or so before his death, and Max just kept pestering him.

I agree with you re Imelda's entrance, r14. But my god, by the time she got to Losing My Mind, she seemed to be channeling Dorothy Loudon. Just awful.

Imelda was staged horribly for Losing My Mind. It works better as a simple number

La LuPone

And so she’s not left out. Betty Buckley

No they don't, r19.

ore vs ooer

[quote]Apparently, Sondheim loved Bernadette's take on the role and was happy that she was playing her as really crazy, so make of that what you will. She wasn't a complete disaster in the role, but she's one of those performers who seems to change things from night to night depending on how she feels and how the audience response is. I don't think of this as a bad thing, because it means she's truly alive in the moment, but I can see where that leaves audiences with differing impressions of her performance. We've seen it throughout all of her performances, especially Gypsy. To this day, you have some who thought she was brilliant and those who thought she was the worst Rose of all time.

Exactly. I've been saying this for years, and I thought it was common knowledge. And P.S., with GYPSY there was the added factor that, apparently, Bernadette was really quite ill around the time of the opening.

I, for one, would like to hear Judi sing "Broadway Baby".

Judi, of course, did Send in the Clowns.

This is the full list of who sang what.

I'm. suspicious about. any assertion that begins, "apparently, Stephen Sondheim loved . . . "

Apparently, Stephen Sondheim loved socket wrenches and Dippity Do.

Apparently, Sondheim loved light bondage and underage trade.

The absolute WORST version (or at least the weirdest) of "Losing My Mind."

Is "airing on the cunty side" anything like "steppin' to the bad side?"

Liza!

r33

magically appearing tambourines!

So Losing My Mind has been performed by:

Barbra Streisand

Liza Minnelli

Bernadette Peters

Patti LuPone

Betty Buckley

Kristin Chenoweth

Why hasn’t DL fave Bette Midler sung it?

True Story: I saw Bernadette in Gypsy twice. One night was one of the greatest nights ever in 30 years of Broadway theater going. One night was one of the most pallid, off kilter performances I've ever seen. If I wasn't with a newbie, I would have left at intermission.

She's hit and miss, that one. But by all accounts, a lovely person to work with.

Excuse me, r36...ex-c-u-u-u-s-e me.

R25 is correct. They have different vowels.

Bajour /baˈʒʊɹ/

Four /fɔɹ/

What's the deal with OHIO STATE MURDERS? Why inaugurate the James Earl Jones with such a slight play? It's playing to half-empty houses already. After Frankie and Johnny, I was hoping Audra would want to be in something actually good.

Because Idaho State Murders is happening in real life?

She might be getting the reputation that she'll only really sell tickets in musicals. Not too bad a rep -- other than lots of missed performances.

r33 That just KILLED me :) :) :) I pictured him bouncing around the stage and the tambourines shaking..."Stepping to the CUNT SIDE - Woo Woo Wooo! STEP! STEP INTO THE CUUUUNT SIIIIIDE!"

Shit.

Rewatching that Dreamgirls clip reminds me how many things that were perfect about the show were so...off in the movie. The slower tempo of this number...why? Just to accommodate the tambourines and the dance moves with them? And where are the trumpets? Are we really supposed to believe Jimmy (and Curtis for that matter) would waste money on a dozen dudes dancing in the background when all the focus should be on Jimmy and the rest on the Dreams?

Weird.

Honestly, I really liked what they did with Jimmy/Eddie Murphy in the movie, but very very little about the rest. Anika Noni Rose was fine as Lorelle, from what I remember...but I kind of wish they'd cast it completely differently otherwise. I didn't enjoy Jennifer Hudson much in it, and definitely didn't enjoy Beyonce, who needs to take a seat. I guess Danny Glover was fine. And Christ was the movie loooooong.

I hope someone remakes the Dreamgirls movie with a better cast and tighter pacing but I doubt it'll happen.

[quote]Anika Noni Rose was fine as Lorelle, from what I remember

Who the hell ever remembers Lorelle?

r45, I sure as hell did, since it was clear she was the only one of the three who could both sing and act. They had to take her big song away from her just to prevent her from overshadowing their designated awards contender, since it would have made Hudson look worse.

(I also remember it's Lorrell.)

L.A. '83

Dreamgirls the movie definitely would have benefitted from tightening and dropping at least one of the Oscar bait songs (looking at you, "Listen").

Now that I'm looking it up, I forgot that all three of the new Dreamgirls songs lost the Oscar to the song from An Inconvenient Truth. Or that there was a song from An Inconvenient Truth.

I liked Patience as a song. What a good idea to tell black people to take a seat, and just wait for equal rights...

For the person in the last thread, you are right, I still haven't watched the pro-shot Follies with Imelda. I don't really like her at all, TBH. I only saw a YT clip of her replacement doing Losing My Mind, and incorrectly assumed the vanity/pills/wig stuff was all originated by Imelda.

I completely understand the desire to see Sally build over the show, and for an actress to show levels and range, but I think she's too easy a character to devolve into a "Big! Acting! Opportunity!" for some actress just looking to pull focus. Glenn Close as Norma Desmond comes to mind. In the 90s, from the footage I've seen (and there's most of the show out there), she was pretty silly in the part because she wanted to play it ALL. By the end, she's practically licking the banister and cackling. It was just too much. And most other actresses I've seen playing Norma do the same thing. Any "woman falling apart" roles can fall prey to this. It's difficult to find someone willing to hold back in places, or not swing for the fences.

And yes, casting an extremely homely Sally doesn't work for me, because you have to imagine she's a woman who stood a chance. Not only was she cast in the Follies back in the day, but Buddy actually loves and adores her and thinks of her as a catch, in spite of her mental issues. To me, that means she's pretty or pretty-ish. Even the most deluded person can know, deep down, if they're "ugly" in the eyes of most people. For Sally to believe Ben might still want her, she has to have been taking care of herself to some degree and shown up at the reunion ready to stun him - and possibly get him back. If she's a dumpy old mess, it's just laughable and she seems completely deluded. She's waited 30 years or something to hook back up with this guy...if she sees a hag in the mirror, why would she believe he'd want her?

(continued)

Bernadette is beautiful and alluring, in her own way, and you could easily see how young Ben would have wanted her or been drawn to her. It wasn't her looks that were the problem. He just sensed she was a needy insecure mess (betraying Phyllis, her close friend, and Buddy at the same time) and saw more dignity in Phyllis probably.

I mean, everyone is welcome to see it differently (and can I say, I'm loving this conversation!) but to me, Bernadette was great as Sally physically. Imelda might have acted it differently/better/more dynamically, but there's a reason she was cast to play The Queen. She looks like a church lady. Unless Ben is very interesting (and really, he doesn't seem to be) and open-minded and attracted to various types, I don't see how he'd give Sally more than a quick glance if she looks like a tiny grandma. He's shallow and self-involved. If he indulges this idea of loving Sally, even temporarily, it's because he sees her, gets a boner over how good she still looks, and gets off on the memories of their forbidden tryst and her undying desire for him.

That clip above of Bernadette isn't my favorite - she's overselling the crying a wee bit for my tastes. When I saw her, she was standing there and more low-key destroyed and crying/singing. There's another vid of her on YT where she sings it with fewer pauses and it's just gangbusters, and more like the performance I saw.

It's such a weird unsettling performance too. The way she barely moves her arms, as if she's physically dead or frozen or scared...the way she looks off to the wings as if to say "....what....what do I.....!?!" like she's being forced to re-enact her old number and can't leave, but can't hold it together either.

And the long drawn-out "miiiiiiIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIiiiiiiiiiiiiinnnnnnnnnnnnd" which floats over the final bars. Beautiful vocal arrangement.

I really don't care for her recording of LMM on the Follies cast album because she sings the climax slightly differently than she did on stage, proving the "she mixes it up" point, I guess.

Interesting r37. What made the first night you saw her so good? Was she in better voice...or was she making stronger acting choices?

I will say it was weird seeing Bernadette play a character so...weak. Her Sally was pretty much embarrassing herself by walking around so obviously mooning over Ben and play-acting some great reunion, as Danny Burstein's Buddy stood there like "come on, dear, let's maybe call it a night" and Jan Maxwell's Phyllis looked at her like "oh...wow. Seriously? This is...so sad. Honey. No."

I should go watch the DC bootleg video to see if she was really playing Sally with more manic pep at the start. I think there was a bootleg of her in the red dress.

Can we all agree that Jayne Houdyshell SLAYED Broadway Baby, though? Holy shit - THAT was amazing!

Here's the awesome clip of her singing LMM. Though this was apparently from the DC run, I remember her playing it this way on BW the night I saw her, plus or minus a few more tears.

Sublime.

I think Imelda Staunton is one of those odd Brit faves that just don't travel well, like some cheeses or sausages. Or blood pudding.

I admire the commitment, but not much else.

Lorrell (thanks) is a pretty minor role, but Anika stood out in it, proving that the star wattage of the others really wasn't all it was cracked up to be.

I love Lillias White, but And I Am Telling You I'm Not Going is just not her song. She doesn't have the belt for it, and her beautiful runs just aren't a good substitute. She kills I Am Changing, for sure, but not the Act One closer. Watching that video above just proves it. I'm glad she got the exposure though and I'm sure she acted Effie well otherwise, but that song just isn't for her.

There were THREE new songs for the movie? Yikes.

I didn't like giving Beyonce a solo in the form of Listen in the film, but I think the new duet version in the stage show is thrilling and a much-needed resolution to the Effie/Deena drama. Amber Riley and her costar in the UK really killed it. It's too bad we'll never hear Jennifer Holliday and Sheryl Lee Ralph sing it now because they just don't have the notes anymore. It's a pretty high belty song.

The scramble for Phantom tickets tomorrow is going to be brutal. Call me a fool but I believe them when they say this is the One and Only Extension because renovations have to start afterwards.

So the big question is...how expensive will tickets for the final weeks be?

[quote]What's the deal with OHIO STATE MURDERS? Why inaugurate the James Earl Jones with such a slight play? It's playing to half-empty houses already.

Can you really not figure out why this play, by a black female playwright, was chosen to open this theater? Not that I think that's a good reason -- I don't, because the play is very poorly written -- but I'd be willing to bet lots of money that this is precisely the reason why it was chosen. I hate to say it, but I'm not sorry to hear it's playing to half-empty houses, because it's REALLY not good.

The only sensible reason for PHANTOM having to close would be if another show has already been booked into the theater after the renovation and there was no possibility of moving it elsewhere. If the closing were just because of the renovation, with no show booked afterwards, that makes zero sense to me, because then the renovation would not have to begin on any specific date. Color me cynical.

Their announcement features a quote from Andrew LW about how the show has to close for the renovations, but would otherwise continue to run indefinitely. His words, pretty much. And then CamMack says it'll surely be back, maybe as a tour so....who knows.

I doubt they'd be able to appear in public if they mess with audiences and Phans again and say "whoopsie - ANOTHER extension! Sorry! Now we're ending in August! Our bad!" It's just not a good look to play games like that. Extending once in the wake of popular demand? Okay. Multiple times? Nope.

But again - will it be 500 dollar tickets?

Speaking of Sir Andrew...

Is he worried about his creative legacy? Or is it just a cash grab?

And apparently, every stage actor in NYC will be appearing in the benefit staging of CHESS.

Who's got tickets? Will it be another PARADE?

Darren Criss, Lena Hall and Ramin is a formidable trio. With Michael Mayer directing, Lorin Lotarro choreo, David Rockwell sets (?) and new Danny Strong script seems like it’s aiming for more than being just a one night event…

Did anyone see Little Mermaid on Broadway?

I only saw clips but the whole show looked like it was covered in multi-colored plastic wrap. Super cheap. Did the plastic-y waves and sets look better in person and catch the light well?

Speaking of Dreamgirls, here are Ryan Jackson, Logan Keslar, and Billy Fagen with Manuel Santos as Effie.

Side by Side by Dreamgirls

[Quote] And apparently, every stage actor in NYC will be appearing in the benefit staging of CHESS.

¿No me recuerdas?

Whatever happened to Raul? Is he still gay, bi or back to women?

I'm reminded of the absolutely ridiculous Dreamgirls medley at the Oscars, where Beyoncé and Jennifer Hudson - all smiles and performative sisterhood - were aggressively trying to out-sing each other. Both straining at the limits if their respective instruments, it's a remarkable and awkward performance of passive aggressiveness.

And then Anika Noni Rose saunters on, cool as anything, and manages to effortlessly out-sing both of them as if she wasn't even trying. She's a class act.

Still gay, r68. Been in current relationship for 11 years now.

It's a phase.

Seeing SLIH this afternoon. Hope the understudy is well-rehearsed.

[quote]Tony-winning composer Andrew Lloyd Webber and producer Michael Harrison have joined forces for a new musical theatre partnership. Entitled Lloyd Webber Harrison Musicals, the company will find and develop musicals and create new productions from Lloyd Webber’s existing catalogue.

As if there haven't been MORE than enough "productions from Lloyd Webber's existing catalogue" already. Just what the world needs......

Interesting to see so many comments about Imelda being miscast in FOLLIES and/or miscast in GYPSY

Honest question: Is there any evidence that Darren Criss can sing that extremely difficult role in CHESS? He has sounded fine when singing within his limitations but it seems to me that he simply does not have the power or range for that role. In contrast, when this version of CHESS was done at the Kennedy Center in D.C. a few years ago, the role in question was sung by....Raul Esparza :-)

[r70] thank you for the update. That’s awesome for him!!

wife still around too but do we know if they fuck?

[quote] Beyoncé and Jennifer Hudson - all smiles and performative sisterhood - were aggressively trying to out-sing each other. Both straining at the limits if they're respective instruments, it's a remarkable and awkward performance of passive aggressiveness.

r69 your description is great but then I watched I don't know if I see what you see. Yes they're both 'oversinging' or whatever it's called but it doesn't look competitive. They seem fine although JHUd looks and moves awkwardly which she always does

I wouldn't want to see any production of CHESS with that cast. Darren Criss? Oh, please.

Will Harry Connick ever do anything on Broadway again? Pajama Game was a big hit, Clear Day was a big flop, and Thou Shalt Not flopped too for him as songwriter. Would he ever come back?

People raving over JHud has always mystified me. She has talent and a voice but both were/are somewhat untrained, and despite all the claims of her as the second coming, I just never saw it.

She's now on a struggling talk show, which is not where someone who is supposedly the voice of their generation should be.

She IS talented, so maybe this is part of the search to find whatever might fit those talents better.

R80-As the live "Annie" last year proved, Harry has specific limitations. Maybe he could play the Beggar Woman in Sweeney.

[quote]As the live "Annie" last year proved, Harry has specific limitations.

And, unfortunately, he has a bad habit of choosing projects that exceed his limitations, at least when it comes to musicals, as proven by ON A CLEAR DAY...., THOU SHALT NOT, and ANNIE and SOUTH PACIFIC on TV. When he is well cast, as he was in THE PAJAMA GAME and THE STING at the Paper Mill Playhouse, everything is fine.

Harry might have been well-cast in The Sting, but the show stunk. No surprise it never left New Jersey.

And they should have found another male star to pair him with, as Newman and Redford were paired in the film.

My own personal take is &Juliet will be completely shut out at Tony time.

That's it! Harry can replace Paulo Szot!

Are directors scared of Imelda? Why can't they reign her in a little bit? I'm terrified of her Dolly. Will she have rage issues as well?

[quote]Why can't they reign her in a little bit?

Oh, dear. We are not amused.

Right now, the best musical Tony battle seems to be shaping up as Kimberly v SLIH v NYNY.

How can anyone judge NYNY's Tony chances when virtually no one has seen or heard it yet -- and, for that matter, I'm not sure if it's even completely written?

SOME LIKE MY TWAT!

Holy crap! It has just been announced that a new musical based on the life and career of Frank Sinatra is in development. Which is maybe not such a bad idea in itself, but the book will be written by.....Joe DiPietro, and the show will be directed by.....Kathleen Marshall. Need I say more?

Will the protagonist be called Frank or Johnny Fontane?

Loretta Devine was the best thing in the Dreamgirls movie. Lovely cameo. Jennifer Hudson has dead eyes. Beyoncé is pretty. Jamie Foxx was 100% unlikeable. Curtis needs to be charming.

Having seen it, I don't think SLIH will survive the bad reviews.

[quote]Having seen it, I don't think SLIH will survive the bad reviews.

What bad reviews?

Presumably, the bad reviews R95 thinks the show is going to get. But that's not what I'm hearing.

^ Me either. Word of mouth has been pretty good.

[quote]Jamie Foxx was 100% unlikeable. Curtis needs to be charming.

Really? I thought Foxx was just about perfect for the role. He was charming in a very calculated way, and also, he's gorgeous, which further helps explain why the character becomes so successful.

r90 Because the first LMM post-Hamilton musical is simply guaranteed to be nominated

Just saw SLIH. The words that came to mind as I was watching: relentless, hollow, overlong, forced. But occasionally charming and well-staged. Borle is annoying, and the Sugar a misfire. Monroe made the film her own; Hicks merely fills the space. She's lovely and has a big voice, but is still pretty much a cipher. And they can't afford to make the character a childlike innocent. Saw Ghee's understudy, who was perfectly fine, but doesn't bring the kind of magic the role needs and that Ghee reportedly brings to it. (And this may have been the understudy's first performance before an audience.) Audience seemed to enjoy it, but didn't go crazy. Think the reviews will be very mixed but without a big star . . . who knows?

Seat was 10th row, dead center. Thanks, TDF!

[quote]And they can't afford to make the character a childlike innocent.

What do you mean?

Also saw SLIH with Ghee's understudy and agree with all you say, r101. I think now that a couple of weeks of previews are in, older and more discerning audiences will see the show, and we'll be hearing more pans than raves. So often those first previews and the initial word of mouth come from younger audiences whose first Broadway show was Sunset Boulevard and the like. And they probably don't know the film of SLIH very well, if at all. I found it all crass and crude and loud with no charm or warmth or genuine affection for its characters. And never sexy, perhaps the biggest flaw.

I'm curious if anyone knows if Matthew Lopez is still with the show. So much onstage seemed like it was ad-libbed in rehearsals.

The first Broadway show I saw was the revival of Dreamgirls in 1987. Went by myself so ended up on the second row, dead center. Arnetia Walker as Lorrell was the highlight of the show, so it isn't a throw-away role in the right hands. She lit up the stage.

I mean, r102, that the wide-eyed naivete that Marilyn brought to the role wouldn't fly in 2022. The character today has to be savvy and career-driven; her pursuit of the Borle character is driven more from her desire to get to Hollywood (she thinks he's a famous screenwriter who will make her famous) than her physical attraction to him . . . a good thing, because he looks terrible.

Raul Ethpartha ith weeth ah Man??

Curtis totally needs to be charming, 100% manly and sexy as well as cunning. Ben Harney was SEXY as hell, and alluring and powerful. He did all those great jumps and judo moves/dance steps at the beginning of Steppin' To The Bad Side, and ooff...it was impossible not to feel hot watching that.

Jamie Foxx just seems like a jokey guy to me. I see him and I think he's about to crack up. I didn't buy him as appealing enough to build an empire or keep Deena in his thrall.

No offense to whoever they cast in the UK Amber Riley production, but from what I saw, he was not as intense and macho and sexy to pull it off. Honestly, I think Curtis is the hardest role to cast because he has to be macho, brooding, sexy, able to dance, able to sing...there probably aren't a lot of black male actors like that who want a career on the stage. They really found the perfect guy in Harney.

Anyone get Phantom tickets today?

Seems the final public show, on Saturday April 15th at 8pm is sold out, as well as the 35th anniversary show in January.

R64 -- I saw The Little Mermaid during previews (Tom Schumacher was in the row head of us) and it was a complete fiasco. And BORING. Holy hell. How they could translate such a winning, emotionally satisfying film into THAT was hard to reconcile.

They were all on Heelys (a version of a roller skate) which seemed like a good idea, but wound up looking ridiculous. The main set piece also looked like a massive glittering vagina. It DEFINITELY aired on the cunty side. It felt tacky, plastic and ill-conceived.

Sierra Boggess was great casting, but the script and direction stunk. And everyone around her was either cloying (I'm looking at you Eddie Korbich) or cartoon cookie-cutter bland (pecs does not an actor make, Norm Lewis!) The best part was Schumacher and Co looking around during the 1st act to see how many people were actively watching the show. My companion at the time actually fell asleep 2/3rds of the way thru. I couldn't blame him!

Of course, this was also the doomed production that had Adrian Bailey fall thru a faulty trap door in the rising ship set piece -- basically ending his career and launching a major lawsuit.

[quote] younger audiences whose first Broadway show was Sunset Boulevard and the like

Oh, honey. The original Bway version of SUNSET closed over 25 years ago. Unless these "younger audiences" saw it in diapers, you might want to update your references.

I'm hearing MERRILY will transfer, but not til fall of 2024. Lindsay Mendez and Daniel Ratcliffe will both transfer with it for a year. Jon Groff will transfer with it, but he's not yet promised to do a full year--might be 6 months.

So this avoids Best Revival of a Musical having WOODS, SWEENEY, and MERRILY. So CAMELOT and 1776 probably both get in.

R111 Has any fucker seen it yet?

r109 I never heard about the lawsuit. Is that actor is disabled now...?

The Heelys did look so stupid. It made the whole thing look like a tacky theme-park show, at least from the bootleg I saw online. And what the hell were they thinking with Sherri Renee Scott as Ursula??? A skinny white actress playing the character as snotty? Jesus. What a huge wasted opportunity.

[quote]I mean, [R102], that the wide-eyed naivete that Marilyn brought to the role wouldn't fly in 2022. The character today has to be savvy and career-driven.

Wouldn't fly with who? Radical feminists?

What these socialist wokesters without a head for business don't see to get is that you need to appeal to the majority to be successful/profitable, particularly in the long run.

The people who are "offended" by MM's character/portrayal are not the majority of musical theatergoing public/women who still enjoy a traditional love story.

Part of the reason why Broadway is currently in the shitter is because they keep producing shows that don't have widespread appeal. Like it's more important to them to promote their far-leftist agenda/propaganda than to create art or make a profit.

Tomorrow marks the 40th anniversary of Andy Gibb's less-than-two-month run in Joseph and the Amazing Technicolor Dreamcoat.

R113 -- That's a good question. It was in litigation FOREVER it seems. The company who manufactured the trapdoor got off scot-free due to it being "human error" and not mechanical. That was in 2012. I know Bailey broke both wrists and had a shattered pelvis. So it essentially, even with rehab, cut his life in the dancing chorus short. Very sad!

Between MERMAID and TARZAN, Disney Theatricals really shit the bed in the mid aughts. Ugly, ill-conceived stage vehicles. They should've brought in a revamped "Hunchback" and called it a day. Far better score and better source material for the stage.

Also -- Sherie Rene Scott was really NOT good as Ursula. Totally miscast. They wound up replacing her with Faith Prince -- which on paper, seemed like a better idea -- but she also fell flat in the role. Seemed to be dialing it in and not comfortable in the garish production around her. This clip is from The View, so I take it with a grain of salt, but she wasn't any better in the theatre.

In a different era, Kay(e) Ballard, Mary McCarty or even Marcia Lewis would have been ideal casting.

That bus and truck revival of Dreamgirls that landed on broadway was so much better than the original. Lilias White and Sharon Brown were both amazing Effie’s and, yes, Arnetia Walker nearly walked off with the show. The physical production was smaller and we were able to focus more on the characters. It ended up extending and, sadly, Bennett passed away during the run.

I miss Raul on Bway. His talents are wasted on a middling TV show.

The Bway Dreamgirls is a classic. The movie has been forgotten

[Quote] The scramble for Phantom tickets tomorrow is going to be brutal.

The people who wanted to see it for the first time or revisited it have already seen it

Joan Lunden doesn't seem impressed. Because of that, I'm glad she lost her hair.

[quote] I'm hearing MERRILY will transfer, but not til fall of 2024. Lindsay Mendez and Daniel Ratcliffe will both transfer with it for a year. Jon Groff will transfer with it, but he's not yet promised to do a full year--might be 6 months.

It’s because he has a television commitment next year…

Any news about Parade transferring, even for a short run?

A poster on the BWW boards claims Maria Friedman is already telling people Merrily will transfer.

This is one of the rare shows I’m actually anticipating the opening night reviews for, since it seems like no one was able to get tickets for it.

Joan Lunden lost her hair?

Explain, please.

Jamie Foxx was a little too Ike Turner in the Dreamgirls movie. At one point he says to Deena ‘I’ll deal with you later’ and it was chilling (MARY!)

From Reddit: Another whiner comes for Jesse Green and one of his reviews, this time a cast member of KPOP. I can't decide if this is as ridiculous as Ms. Pinkins, or if its relative brevity in comparison makes it less bad.

Jesus, that tweet ran longer than the show will.

What ever happened to Arnetia Walker? Her aunt Tobel was divine...

r122 you do t do Dreamgirls with a piano. Even in rehearsal

Jesus Christ. Between Pinkins and this whiner, the results of "everyone gets a trophy" have officially come in. What a bunch of entitled, ungracious brats. Of course, these wokesters justify it by stating they're not going to abide by "respectability politics". As if grace, humility and discretion are strictly white/patriarchal. What a load of horseshit that is.

Act like a professional. Choose your moments. Choose your words. Be grateful. Be gracious.

There are so many shills commenting on Jesse Green's K-POP review! It's so obvious I wonder if the Times will turn off comments on future reviews.

r130:

R107, that's disappointing to hear. I did not see the UK production but enjoyed Joe Aaron Reid in other shows.

To the poster in the earlier thread about Carrie Fisher in Irene-yes, she was lovely in the ensemble and in one particular number with the other ladies she was given a fun bit where all their umbrellas closed in unison but hers failed to. She was strategically placed at the end of the line of girls on the audience left. It got a big hand.

This recent production of Merrily began with a curtain call. Is this the first time that’s been done?

R135 oh all I saw of him was that very video you posted. True, it's not an entire performance but....look at him. He's...fine?

The tempo is too laid back, the choreo is a mess and the song lacks bite ....none of which are his fault. But he clearly doesn't exude that Red Hot savvy thing that Curtis needs. And this is his only number in the show so.....yeah.

It's a tough part.

So the idiot who wrote that tweet at R128 thinks the use of the word "squint inducing" in reference to the work of an Asian lighting designer is somehow racist? Can he possibly mean that when people squint, he thinks their eyes look Asian? Isn't THAT the horribly racist perspective, rather than the original comment, which only referenced the fact that people tend to squint when their eyes are assaulted by very bright flashes of light?

Sorry, I meant to write "the use of the phrase 'squint-inducing'"

Too bad it’s not ‘squirt inducing’ because that might actually sell some tickets.

R138, I assume the harping on "squint-inducing" as racist is meant to get Green to apologize and abase himself. Unfortunately, Twitter falling apart, so it's going to make the usual Twitter SJW pile-up a bit harder to pull off.

What these can't-take-criticism types don't get is that no amount of haranguing on Twitter will make an audience spend $200 on a show they don't want to see. Green's allegiance is to his readers, not the cast.

Nobody cares about Twitter. It’s BAJOUR!

A decent editor should have queried ‘squint-inducing’, as it leaves JG open to accusations such as this which can’t be easily refuted. I don’t know; maybe it was raised and the writer decided to use it anyway.

But the rest of the complaint is spurious nonsense, and the idea than one should look beyond their ‘lived experience’ is bullshit. Our lived experience is all that any of us has to interpret and evaluate an artwork. If the content and conceit of your show is too narrow to work without the audience having needed to do their homework beforehand, then its artistic and commercial merits are going to be pretty limited.

Well said, R143! Completely agree on the latter point.

GO WOKE, GO BROKE.

The original "Step into the Bad Side" was probably the best choreographed number I've ever seen.

SLIH audiences have been heavily papered recently. And even then, the show hasn’t managed to fill up the house.

It’s not selling because nobody cares!

Marc Shaiman has THIN skin and can’t accept criticism…but he needs to read the room and realize that this was not the right time for this musical no matter how much smoke was blown up his ass.

Shaiman needs to regularly remind everyone on social media how successful he is.

The film of SLIH is just about as un-PC as you can get, and in spite of that, it's aged beautifully, still as sexy and hilarious as it was in 1959. That is, if you have a sense of humor. Trying to push and pull this property into the Woke Show was a huge misstep.

Billy Wilder would have hated it. And yes, I have seen the show.

Oh fuck now JOH is a co-producer of Ain't No Mo, and he seems to have Tina turner's hair

Why do producers continue to try this "celebrity producer" crap? It didn't work for STRANGE LOOP - all it did was piss off the industry when a bunch of people who did nothing -- Mindy Kalling, JHud -- got Tonys.

What is with all these celebrities becoming producers on shows AFTER they begin previews? Is it just for status (and a possible Tony) for both them and the original producers? Do the celeb producers put any money into the production or is it just so shows like SLIH can brag that Mariah Carey is their producer? I noticed that Kenny Leon is a producer on SLIH but was that a move by the producers to be seen as more BIPOC inclusive?

Silly and annoying trend indicating the ongoing death of Broadway.

I recently saw Some Like It Hot on Broadway, don't waist your time or money. It's mediocre at best. The set design is cheap looking, the score dull/unmemorable, way too much busy choreography, and the performances disappointing, especially from the actress in the Marylyn Monroe part - she just fades into the ugly scenery. Borle is doing Borle, which doesn't work for a leading role, and the non binary actor tries hard, but lacks the "it" factor. I don't see this show lasting.

I think there needs to be a major revamping of the rules for producers to be eligible for a Tony award. This is some bullshit.

[Quote] don't waist your time or money

Do any of the singers belt?

r150, you mention "sexy." That element is SO lacking in this new version. You wanted to see Tony Curtis and Monroe do it, but Borle and Hicks have negative chemistry.

PS Borle and another guy are credited with "additional material." Anyone know what that material might be? If it's all the vaudeville "German" Borle's alter ego speaks, it's dreadful.

I have heard generally good things about SLIH from people who have seen it, but no on is on fire about it, which you need to be in today's tough Broadway climate. I don't see the critics panning this. What is surprising is how much the audiences are staying away so far. The fact that they didn't go up last week during Thanksgiving weekend spoke volumes about the non-interest out there. They need raves to jump start.

I know that DL denizens are not the target audience for & JULIET.

But I think we're underestimating the show as 1) a certifiable hit of the season and 2) a TONY nominee across multiple categories. It's been selling very, very well, particularly to the much-sought-after "young audience."

Bernadette was wonderful when I saw her in Song and Dance, Gypsy, and Follies; I hated everything about the revival of Annie Get Your Gun, including her performance.

r159, "young audiences" don't garner Tonys. Or, with the exception of Wicked, long runs.

r159, "young audiences" don't garner Tonys. Or, with the exception of Wicked, long runs.

[quote]A decent editor should have queried ‘squint-inducing’, as it leaves JG open to accusations such as this which can’t be easily refuted. I don’t know; maybe it was raised and the writer decided to use it anyway.

Why should a "decent editor have queried 'squint-inducing?'" This is literally the first time in my life that I've heard a reference to squinting called out as "racist." Should Sondheim be retroactively canceled for that line in "I Remember" from EVENING PRIMROSE, the one that goes "I remember snow, falling down like lint, and it made you squint?" And if I say to someone "The sun on the beach was so bright that it made me squint," am I going to be labeled as a racist?

It's all so completely, totally ridiculous.

The people raving about SLIH are the same people who were raving about Beanie in FG. They so desperately want to feel like they’re seeing something special when they’re not. They yell and scream and jump to their feet while performers are still singing which must be unnerving for the people on stage and surrounding audience members. This is why I don’t go to broadway shows anymore.

Adrian Bailey continues to recover from that Little Mermaid disaster. According to his FB page, he's now in rehab for hip replacement. The scar photos are horrifying.

It’s incredible how these theaters get away with injuries. The Met has financially destroyed people when they’ve been injured on stage and they take zero responsibility. The unions do NOTHING.

Do you mean fall 24 re merrily or is it fall 23? Delaying it for almost two years seems weird and ill advised …

[quote][R113] -- That's a good question. It was in litigation FOREVER it seems. The company who manufactured the trapdoor got off scot-free due to it being "human error" and not mechanical. That was in 2012. I know Bailey broke both wrists and had a shattered pelvis. So it essentially, even with rehab, cut his life in the dancing chorus short. Very sad!

I know Adrian, r116 and r165. Not well, but well enough. His injuries were horrific. His life as he knew it was over. Multiple surgeries. Not only physical issues but cognitive ones. Sweet guy.

Whatever money he got? It wasn't enough.

[quote]The unions do NOTHING.

You are wrong about that, r166.

R111 I think Merrily is transferring in the fall of 2021.

[quote]Silly and annoying trend indicating the ongoing death of Broadway.

I have been hearing about the death of Broadway since the earlies 1970s.

Broadway is more alive and lucrative than it ever has been. Old geezers have never understood the importance of changing with the times.

Is the title song of SLIH almost the same as the theme song of "Huckleberry Hound"? I thought something sounded very familiar when I've heard the commercials.

r172, someone said that in the previous thread. I listened to them both and admit I don't hear the similarity.

SLIH

HH

Up next: "Huckleberry Hound: The Musical." Featured Tony noms for Yogi, Boo-Boo, and Quick-Draw McGraw.

[quote][R172], someone said that in the previous thread. I listened to them both and admit I don't hear the similarity.

I hear it. It isn't even of the "My Sweet Lord"? "He's So Fine" variety.

My money's on Boo-Boo.

At SLIH yesterday, there was no screaming and shouting after the songs. There was mostly polite applause, a few of the mandatory "Woos!" and some energetic responses now and then. Absolutely no jumping up mid-song. Of course there was the standard SO at the end, but as usual it seemed more obligatory than enthusiastic. So, r164, you can safely return to Broadway, at least for this show.

r179. I experienced the same audience reactions to SLIH a few days ago. A relief, as I hate over-enthusiastic and unearned whooping, but also indicative that the mass audiences are not falling all over themselves on this one.

They badly needed a "name" onstage. If Borle is the best they could do, lots of luck.

As others have mentioned, the title song for the new "Some Like It Hot" is perilously similar to the semi-standard "The Lady's in Love with You." Listen on YouTube to any of the numerous vocalists who have recorded it.

There's some "Let's Take A Glass Together" in that title song as well.

r155 Given it's one of the top things used by producers to attract investors, there's pretty much zero chance of that.

Though it is embarrassing when even the Oscars have tighter rules on producing credits.

"Beauty and the Beast" 30th anniversary special -- combined animation and live action -- coming to ABC. Josh Groban, Rita Moreno, Martin Short, David Alan Grier, Joshua Henry, Jon Jon Briones, and Shania Twain. And starring "H.E.R." OK--I'm an eldergay ... who the hell is S.H.E.? (I guess we know her pronouns anyway.)

Didn't they miss the anniversary by a year?

Sinatra on Broadway!

Who will play Mia? Who will play Ronan?

Maybe they're counting from 1992, when it won its Oscars.

Is Groban going to keep that terrible beard for SWEENEY TODD? In a vain attempt to appear more threatening? He’s such a lightweight on every level.

H.E.R. Nice jazz sound, but she's not Belle.

"What do you mean?"

Jess B. Semple

[quote] Can we all agree that Jayne Houdyshell SLAYED Broadway Baby, though? Holy shit - THAT was amazing!

She slayed it all right and not in a good way. She was terrible. Only a first year drama student would indicate waiting by filing their fingernails. And that eye-popping! Oy vey, what was that about? Just sing the damn song, Jayne. Sondheim crafted a great song that sells itself.

Hattie is not a role for an old troll that should be doing chorus work in the Cincinnati Children’s Theatre Production of “3 Billy Goats Gruff.”

Houdyshell, who can be great in certain roles, was HORRIBLE as Hattie. I couldn't imagine WTF they were thinking, from her performance to her washer woman look. How were we ever to believe that woman headlined the Follies? Or even was backup??

"Old geezers have never understood the importance of changing with the times."

Young know-nothings have never understood the ignominy of pandering to the undiscerning. Fixed it for ya.

"the wide-eyed naivete that Marilyn brought to the role wouldn't fly in 2022"

In other words, in 2022 there isn't one wide-eyed female naif left to be found in the entire world, that it would be a grossly false betrayal of womanhood to depict such a character since we know that everyone today is perfect and empowered and flawless and.....are you out of your mind? In your concept of depth characterization, we'd have to eliminate all of humanity.

[quote] How were we ever to believe that woman headlined the Follies? Or even was backup??

Or was ever a baby. I imagined someone found her under a toadstool.

What, nothing about the 2024 revival of The Wiz with new material by Amber Ruffin?

R196, there’s a whole thread about it.

r196, we're all still reeling from the announcement of the Frank Sinatra bio/jukebox musical written by Joe Di Pietro and directed by Kathleen Marshall.

the KPOP retort to the critic is absurd. But we all know that the foolproof way of discrediting someone who made you feel bad is to call them "racist"

Eviliene might be a star part. Who could play it?

LaChanze?

Tonya Pinkins?

Patina Miller?

Heather Headley?

Jennifer Holliday?

H.E.R. is an acronym for "Having Everything Revealed," which tells me far too much about H.E.R./her.

[quote] Eviliene might be a star part. Who could play it?

Step aside, bitches. I have more handicapped audience members to yell at.

[quote]Eviliene might be a star part. Who could play it?

Tyler Perry

Fuck Amber Ruffin- this is a textbook case of I'm getting work because of political correctness. She doesn't have a talented bone in her body.

Never understood why Stephanie Mills never came back to broadway. She could have played Effie, Ceile, Nell in Ain’t Misbehavin. She was also the best thing in The Wiz tv adaptation.

Our Stephanie had a face for radio.

Maybe her return in the 1984 revival of The Wiz cured her of wanting to do Broadway ever again.

Idina just said on WWHL that she was offered Funny Girl but Covid got in the way and..... get this, girls.... LEA was the right choice. Ouch! Poor Beanie.

So Lea was the right choice when they couldn't get a woman who was 20 years too old for the part? Poor Lea.

Idina said something about revising the show to add more of Fanny’s later life which sounds ridiculous. They might as well have offered her a stage version of Funny Lady. But she did admit she was too old for it.

[quote]Idina just said on WWHL that she was offered Funny Girl but Covid got in the way

If those producers ever actually considered casting Idina in that role at her age, then they are even more idiotic than I already thought they were based on the way they have handled this show thus far. And THAT is saying something.

Is there any precedent for a show waiting almost a full year after it ends its off-Broadway run to transfer? Why would Merrily allegedly be waiting until fall 2022, when all the buzz will be gone?

Fall 2023, I mean.

[quote]Is there any precedent for a show waiting almost a full year after it ends its off-Broadway run to transfer? Why would Merrily allegedly be waiting until fall 2022, when all the buzz will be gone?

A lot of weird decisions are being made. I know it wasn't a DL fave, but Come From Away was solidly in the black when it was evicted for a limited run of Take Me Out.

Evilene is really a small role, albeit one with a great number.

That's one of the problem with The Wiz...it has a lousy book. Evilene really only has one scene. And, the annoying Addaperle has too many scenes. And, the ending is just too damn long.

Lousy book but great songs.

“Director” Schele Williams is Andy Williams’ untalented granddaughter.

Will Dorothy be 40 again as with poor Diana in the lamentable film? Perhaps they could go all the way to 80, if so… dear Glenn desperately needs the work (even in blackface).

I saw the Idina clip: The story is true, this was also when Rosie was playing her mom. Rosie still hasn’t said why she left the project and was replaced by Jane Lynch.

I thought it was interesting that she was pared with DL fave Sally Field on WWHL. I think Sally thought she was on with someone else for two/thirds of the show.

R159 if this is selling well, I’d love to see what you think selling poorly looks like.

I believe the reason for the Merrily delayed bway transfer is because Groff wasn't going to be free again until next fall.

When Sally Field was asked about projects she worked on that were misfires you know she was dying to say Glass Menagerie but pled the fifth instead. She’s turning into quite the quirky old lady. Idina looked great.

When will this come to the states?

Just stop this shit

Welcome to the new Broadway, where art has taken a back seat to social experimentation.

Will this GATSBY be GREAT?

Coming in September 2023: "Cinderella" as retold by the third mouse turned into a horse pulling the royal chariot, featuring songs by NIN.

[quote] Will this GATSBY be GREAT?

Although I strongly believe any story can be musicalized, I’m pretty sure this is going to misunderstand the source material even more than the Baz Luhrmann film did.

Gatsby is a dark story, despite what Hollywood’s done to it over the years.

Well, R227, I would say that dark musicals are "in" now more than ever, so maybe that won't be an issue here. Not to say it's going to be a good show overall.

Look at who's writing the score: Jason Howland. Composer of "Little Women" and "Paradise Square." Case (and show) closed.

[quote]Look at who's writing the score: Jason Howland. Composer of "Little Women" and "Paradise Square." Case (and show) closed.

Incredible that anyone would ever hire him for anything again, even after just LITTLE WOMEN. Talk about failing upward.

I liked the Little Women score.

Also Sally Field’s big misfire was mispronouncing Santino Fontana’s name during the Tonys a few years ago.

What was the last Broadway musical song to enter the public mainstream?

Songs like Tomorrow from Annie, Aquarius from Hair, etc.

I Dreamed A Dream.

[quote]Also Sally Field’s big misfire was mispronouncing Santino Fontana’s name during the Tonys a few years ago.

These things happen.

Ain't No One Mo Time or whatever the Fuck opened last night but reviews are delayed because of cast absences

[quote] Following the show, writer/cast member Jordan E. Cooper gave heartfelt remarks, including a reading of his manifesto.

Fo Fuck's Sake

Gatsby went into public domain and everyone is going for it

[quote]Following the show, writer/cast member Jordan E. Cooper gave heartfelt remarks, including a reading of his manifesto.

How long will shit like this continue before Broadway officially dies, victim of wokeism.

I loved "One Mo' Time" years ago -- great show, minimal book, but the musical numbers were so good, the lack of book was a plus. Was a big success off-Broadway and in London. On Broadway, they should have put in a name or two. Wonderful show though.

I saw an earlier reading of the Howland/Tysen version of Gatsby and liked it a lot. The music is very stylistically tuned to the characters and it's much more skilled than I ever thought it was going to be, given how difficult the novel has been to adapt. I wouldn't dismiss it outright. I came out really wanting to see the show's next steps.

[quote]Fo Fuck's Sake

It's premature. But I would vote for this as the title of the next TG thread. Just sayin'.

How about "Forever Amber -- NOT!"

All of those major literary musical hits like Les Miz...Little Women...Rebecca...Jane Eyre...Tom Sawyer.

Amber Ruffin and Amber Riley

Sarah Steele and Sarah Stiles

Betsy Wolfe and Betsy Morgan

I'm just beginning to realize these are different people.

I can't believe the shit being worked on for Broadway. Will one of these bombs play the new Times Square Casino And Brothel?

I'm reading (and loving) Mary Rodgers's "Shy," in which she said that Once Upon a Mattress moved four times in its original Broadway run of a year. Has any other show moved as many times? (I also didn't know that Ann B. Davis replaced Carol Burnett as Winnifred.)

If a legal and advertised brothel opens up, who should play Miss Mona in a revival of "Best Little Whorehouse in Texas"? Maybe some "Naked Boys Singing" types for the Aggies?

The Aggies need to be masculine and hunky, so no "Naked Boys Singing" types.

Julie Benko IS Miss Mona!

I guess I meant more liked guys who'll do nudity but sure, hunkier, masculine and not all smooth types.

Those crazy kids at MERRILY.

If she can sing how about Annie Potts as a Meemaw-type from "Young Sheldon" as Mona?

Annie Potts did Pippin, so I guess she sings well enough.

Annie Potts is 70. Just saying.

A WHOREHOUSE revival is unthinkable without major book revisions, even as a period piece. The "girls" would have to be enlightened and diverse sex workers making a radical statement about bodily autonomy and gender fluidity.

Mona doesn't have to be quite as active, and Meemaw has been shagging off-screen. I think Potts might be great actually.

More men need to be nude in show to catch up to all the women doing nude scenes over the years.

Heard that Adam Guettel's DAYS OF WINE AND ROSES musical is finished and ready to go. Anyone else hear the rumor?

Wasn’t Scott Rudin producing that?

With talk of a SINATRA bio musical coming in via his daughter Tina, Kathleen Marshall and Joe DiPietro -- I'm surprised some savvy investor hasn't optioned the Aussie hit "Dream Lover" aka "The Bobby Darin Story". Sure, Bobby Darin's appeal might skew older initially in demographics, but his catalogue of originals and covers he made famous is a knockout.

The problem I foresee with both these shows is casting of the central roles. You DO NOT want a legit musical theatre voice going near those songbooks. You need a pop crooner in the Harry Connick mold. Jonathan Groff assayed Darin at the 92Y but it was total miscasting. Stylistically, those songs need to swing, so you need a jazz/pop vocalist to really put them over. And in Darin's case, someone who can move and strut like an old school entertainer. That's a tall order!

Don't forget. Last season, LCT produced a stinking horrible musical about LSD, and then followed it with an equally stinking horrible inept revival of "The Skin of Our Teeth."

This season they're doing CAMELOT.

[quote]The Aggies need to be masculine and hunky, so no "Naked Boys Singing" types.

Are these guys better? It says " Nude opera singers," but no one would ever mistake " Naked Boys Singing" with opera.

I really like Bobby Darin as a singer, and his life was interesting. But he's not the household name that Sinatra was.

The Kevin Spacey biopic of Darin was a complete fiasco, but I'm not even sure there's an audience for a good story about him.

Ronan can sing!

Did someone say "Bobby Darin"?

Matthew Broderick IS Babbitt!

I thought La Jolla's season was interesting, since it's such an incubator. Only one identity show (woman on spectrum) and only one no whites allowed (Japanese sumo wrestlers). Then there's Babbitt, a musical about Hunter S. Thompson and something on Billie Jean King.

It actually all seemed kind of interesting.

A pop singer? For Mack the Knife!?! Ach du lieber!

R239, those were the days when you could see a *great* off-Broadway musical!

The SKIN OF OUR TEETH revival was not inept. There were some bad choices made, but overall it was an appropriate staging of a very difficult and unfriendly play.

Annie Potts is a Doatsy Mae

[quote]The SKIN OF OUR TEETH revival was not inept. There were some bad choices made, but overall it was an appropriate staging of a very difficult and unfriendly play.

Disagree. I would say rather than it had its wonderful elements, for example the puppets, but the overall production was misguided and a mess.

SHY was a great read. She didn't hold anything back.

R262 There was a workshop of a Bobby Darin musical a few years back with Jonathan Groff playing Bobby. I believe Alex Timbers directed and they did a concert series at 92Y.

As mentioned above, R273, but I didn't think of it as a "workshop," and that show had already come from Australia.

...including stuff she invented, r272. And she might have left out a few relevant facts about Hank, but who's counting?

Yes, I friend was over there for a party and was shocked how gay Hank Guettel seemed.

R261 Those aren't opera singers. That's from a later cast of "Naked Boys Singing" that someone recorded excerpts of in the audience. But, yes, there are some cuties in the cast. But it's from over 10 years ago or so. Not right or Aggies, but then again, I wouldn't mind seeing a show featuring some naked daddies instead of the the smoother twinks that the newer producers, who switched over the years, preferred casting in the show.

[quote] The Aggies need to be masculine and hunky

Point out which one of these chorus bottoms is masculine. They all look like they’re in between sets at the Gaiety.

Potts in Pippin

Speaking of hunky chorus boys, the only reason to see SLIH is the very hot Casey Garvin. He's gay and out, too. Check out his Insta for lots of sexy photos.

But curiously, he's the only piece of hotness in the entire ensemble and I'm including all the chorus boys and girls. And believe me, I had plenty of downtime to check them all out during the 2 &1/2 hour+ show. What has happened to Broadway ensembles? Where will all of us Stage Door Johnnies go for Broadway Bares calendar models now? Casey Nicholaw, who cares if these kids can tap??

It’s because all the hot chorus boys these days are too busy selling themselves on OnlyFans to learn how to tap.

[quote]All of those major literary musical hits like Les Miz...Little Women...Rebecca...Jane Eyre...Tom Sawyer.

Are you suggesting that "Les Miz" wasn't a hit?

Casey is on Grindr, isn't he? All the other chorus boys are.

I hope the house staff at A Beautiful Noise is getting hazard pay. I cannot imagine the drunkenness they have to deal with every night.

I never had any complaints about this bunch. More like this.

Nice to see Jeff Calhoun and Jerry Mitchell.

r282, no.

Even as someone who absolutely loves and adores Jonathan Groff, I have to ask: why the heck would they delay a transfer to Broadway for a whole year just to wait for him? Isn't Daniel Radcliffe the main box office attraction here? Plus I would think that there are plenty of other performers on Groff's level (Darren Criss?) whom they could get to move with the show now so they wouldn't have to wait.

New production video from SLIH was just released and Borle is barely in it with no footage of him as Josephine. Ghee and the rest are prominently featured.

As someone else suggested, perhaps they're trying to save Borle's reveal for paying audiences?

SLIH looks mediocre at best...the singing may be great, but the diversity casting is unrealistic for the time period.

[quote]but the diversity casting is unrealistic for the time period.

The general audience doesn't care about that, r291.

Sure they do

Not with this show, r293.

Time will tell...

If the show flops, r295, it won't be because of that.

Maybe their delaying for Radcliffe's schedule too. He does quite a bit of film work.

R205, Stephanie Mills had a thriving recording career so likely didn’t want to deal with the grueling life of Bway

In a generation, no one will care about Sondheim shows. Since Bway producers are focused on the tourist dollar and not on developing local audiences so much, in 20 years, all we’ll have is jukebox and movie-to-stage musicals with b-grade movie stars starring.

Considering &Juliet has a ton of Britney songs in it, what’s the point of the new Britney jukebox?

Honestly, there was no point to &Juliet either.

So far, three Britney songs will be in both Once Upon a One More Time and & Juliet: "... Baby One More Time," "Oops! I Did it Again" and "Stronger."

Shes also 4"9" tall....so theres that.

I agree that Sondheim will fade within the next decade, R299.

Sondheim will become like Kurt Weill. Beloved by cognoscenti but with relatively rare productions

Maybe Into the Woods will get revived now and then but even the current version won’t have a long run

R301, I thought Toxic was in &Juliet. I can’t imagine it wouldn’t be in a Britney jukebox

Company was revived successfully on Broadway 51 years after its premiere. Sweeney is next season, Merrily the season after that. They will be 43 and 42 years old. Kurt Weill had nowhere near this level of success.

Company was a big old flop as will Sweeney and Merrily.

Hardly a flop, r308.

My apologies if this has already been shared; I did look fairly far upthread.

Somebody is really determined to ensure Sondheim remains dead and buried. Remember, Rodgers & Hammerstein had a passe period, too.

You're all really underestimating how popular Sondheim's shows are in schools and universities.

Drama teachers and their students will always love them because they're deemed more sophisticated and complex, and I imagine Into the Woods, if not Company, Sweeney Todd and even Passion, will continue to be produced constantly in curriculums. Even schools like Yale School of Drama that has no musical theatre training, sees them produced every year. They're all far more popular in schools than anything R&H (or whoever) wrote.

They will ensure more revivals on Broadway forever.

Sorry.

[Quote] Remember, Rodgers & Hammerstein had a passe period, too.

They’re pretty passé now still

[Quote] Even schools like Yale School of Drama that has no musical theatre training, sees them produced every year.

Yale school of Drama doesn’t produce any Sondheim musicals

Sondheim’s musical are relatively popular in academia because, while he was alive, many of his musicals were produced and were popular. For most, this quickly dissipates once the composers die

[quote] Even as someone who absolutely loves and adores Jonathan Groff, I have to ask: why the heck would they delay a transfer to Broadway for a whole year just to wait for him?

Where are all of these rumors of a transfer coming from? I’ve barely seen any reviews of the show yet and it’s been two weeks. Is Maria Friedman starting the buzz herself?

Merrily might transfer for a short run based on the starry cast. It would only last so long if given an open run

That speech from the Aint No Mo guy - I'm "exhausted" by the never-ending obsession with slamming "white people"

Maria is really good at starting buzz. She announced herself as starting in the Kennedy Center Revival of Follies that Bernadette played.

Then she was announced for a regional production of Gypsy with Daisy Egan as Louise that never materialized.

Basically don’t believe anything with her until you have a ticket in your hand

r314, you're sorely mistaken, Yale School of Drama produced Sunday in the Park... and Passion in recent years. As a matter of fact, James Lapine (who taught at Yale in the 1970s) came to see both of them. Also Assassins. And I remember hearing of productions of Merrily... and Anyone Can Whistle from years ago.

Perhaps you're thinking of Yale Repertory Theater?

[quote]but the diversity casting is unrealistic for the time period.

Please let us not start this dead-end discussion again.

Not sure if the quote at r321 is referring to SLIH, but the big problem with that show is they seem to want it both ways with diversity issues. They make the inter-racial relationships and business dealings an issue when they need it to be an issue but then handily ignore those problems at all other times. It's facile and annoying.

Lapine wasn't on campus to see the shows. It was to stop in on his dealer.

Lapine didn’t teach at Yale; he has a grad degree from their Art & Architecture dept

Oh, I see the "Sondheim will be gone in 10 years/20 years" nuts are out in force again. You know...the ones who love stating "well, none of his shows made money". Which might be true for INVESTORS of some of those shows. God knows Sondheim made millions. And, the theater owners. And, the thousands of people who've worked on the many, many productions.

Weill and Sondheim really aren't very comparable. Weill wrote a wider variety of stuff including operas. He had huge hit musicals but none of them really became established parts of the frequently performed canon other than The Threepenny Opera which is in a class of its own and is still performed frequently.

The "youngest" of Sondheim's works are 30+ years old (Assassins) and it's still produced all over the world. Into the Woods is 35+ and even more so. Sweeney Todd is 43 and still going strong. A Little Night Music is still very much produced. Follies and Company are harder shows to do but still popular. And, of course there's the lyrics only classics of Gypsy and West Side Story.

If you're stupid enough to think that educational and community theaters and semi-professional and even professional theater companies are all going to just stop doing Sondheim in the next 20 years, then you're very, very stupid. Theater people tend to pick shows they adore to produce. Intelligent people adore Sondheim just like they continue to adore Rodgers & Hammerstein and Verdi and Cole Porter and Mozart.

Great art tends to last a long time.

[quote]Not sure if the quote at [R321] is referring to SLIH, but the big problem with that show is they seem to want it both ways with diversity issues. They make the inter-racial relationships and business dealings an issue when they need it to be an issue but then handily ignore those problems at all other times. It's facile and annoying.

Sounds like the same ridiculous, intelligence-insulting approach of that stupid TV miniseries HOLLYWOOD.

[quote]That bus and truck revival of Dreamgirls that landed on broadway was so much better than the original.

That is pure insanity and ridiculously far from the truth. It was a decent, but not brilliant stripped down show with lots of staging magic removed from the lightning-in-a-bottle original production. Nothing can or ever will come close to the incredibly inventive and sublime Michael Bennett staging.

Ben Harney was terrific in the original even with his huge ass. That man was beefy, but moved like a dream.

Thank you r310.

[quote]“Quentin passed in the wee hours of the morning,” his wife Angie announced on Lee’s Instagram page. “It was the most beautiful moment of my life. I saw his last breaths, held his hand tight, and felt his heartbeat slowly drift away. He had a smile on his face, and was surrounded by those he loves. It was peaceful, and perfect.”

One of the most beautiful and loving tributes I have ever read.

[Quote] Intelligent people adore Sondheim just like they continue to adore Rodgers & Hammerstein and Verdi and Cole Porter and Mozart.

Mary!!

[Quote] Intelligent people adore Sondheim just like they continue to adore Rodgers & Hammerstein and Verdi and Cole Porter and Mozart.

The only Cole Porter musical that gets revived with any regularity is Anything Goes. R&H mainly get King & I every decade and Oklahoma, if they can find a cripple.

I’m finishing the book Shy, which I’m loving. Her sense of humor is great.

I had no idea that Larry Kramer and Arthur Laurents were lovers

^huh???

I don't think so, r331.

And I thought Mary's sense of humor was almost completely lacking in the book. She was all about settling scores and having the last word. Not attractive.

R333, she lets out a few good zingers near the end of the book.

Yeah, Carousel, South Pacific and Cinderella haven't been revived in DECADES.

She says that Kramer and Laurents were off and on “intimated and rivals”

^sorry, intimates

[Quote] Yeah, Carousel, South Pacific and Cinderella haven't been revived in DECADES.

Ok, maybe Carousel but South Pacific had one great revival as did Cinderella. It’s not like they keep coming back

sorry; "intimates" isn't a synonym for "lovers."

R339, yes it is

I think very early in their careers, they had sex.

Later, both had longterm partners and almost hated one another.

No r340, as a noun it is not.

[quote]a very close friend or confidant : an intimate friend

As an adjective, it can be. As it is used in your quote, it is a noun. Therefore, it is not a synonym for lovers.

Please—she uses the word to mean lover

[quote] The "youngest" of Sondheim's works are 30+ years old (Assassins) and it's still produced all over the world.

Excuse me? I’m only 28, dear!

And not a Catherine Zeta Jones 28!

And my younger brother, Road Show, is only 23.

[quote] The only Cole Porter musical that gets revived with any regularity is Anything Goes.

Kiss Me Kate?

[quote] The only Cole Porter musical that gets revived with any regularity is Anything Goes.

Kiss Me Kate should be done more often because it can be fun with the right director and cast. I think schools and community theaters do it more often but it should be in the Broadway rotation every 15-20 years.

Speaking of Mary Rodgers. WHET to her son Adam Guettel?

Did he compose anything of significance after Light in the Piazza.

Like Porter’s two shows that show up every 20 years, it will be the same with Sondheim. I predict Into The Woods and Sweeney Todd. Every now and again there will be a splashy revival of one of his other works but most will fall off the repertory

We don’t know what the future will be, so it’s pointless to speculate on what will resonate. Assassins has had the misfortune to get produced during times of national crisis, but 2021 was exactly the right time even with Doyle being Doyle. I’m perfectly fine enjoying Sondheim productions now without worrying whether they will be popular in the 2040s.

oh, please, r343--how do YOU know what she meant?

R349, who’s saying you can’t enjoy them? The problem is most tourists don’t—which is why most will fade away. It’s the same with most other theatre composers.

Of course Kramer and Laurents had sex—two gay men in theatre? It’s a small theatre world and it was a slutty time.

I’m not convinced that Laurents would have had sex with Kramer,. He tended towards beautiful Aryan types because it calmed his insecurities. See: The Way We Were.

I’m sure everyone had sex with everyone else during that time.

It doesn’t matter what someone’s “type” is. You have sex with what’s around and every now and again your “type” shows up

Adam went off the deep end defending Brett Kavenough during the trial and hasn’t said much since.

Yes, he went a little nuts. And afterward removed his accounts from twitter and Insta, and separated from his wife (or perhaps she from him, as she was somewhat vocal about his looniness at the time).

[quote] Of course Kramer and Laurents had sex—two gay men in theatre? It’s a small theatre world and it was a slutty time.

I can think of no reason to have sex with Larry Kramer. Laurents would have had to have been desperate.

r352 says "two gay men in theatre [sic]" like it's a unicorn sighting. The pickings weren't slim by any means. And why at such pains to prove the unknowable?

Oh, good. Another debate to be beaten to death for 2 or 3 more threads.

James Lapine (known as "Jim" back then) was the graphic designer for the Yale Rep Theatre in the 1970s and taught a class at the Drama School on graphic design. I took it. This was before he ever directed anything professionally.

How high was he then?

Matt Doyle out of Little Shop again this weekend. Lousy attendance so far.

[quote]Ok, maybe Carousel but South Pacific had one great revival as did Cinderella. It’s not like they keep coming back

SOUTH PACIFIC was also revived in the mid '60s at the huge New York State Theater at Lincoln Center for a limited run, so it must have still retained quite a bit of popularity by then, and of course, it has been done constantly in regional theaters, stock, community theaters, high schools and colleges. I saw a major tour years years ago with Robert Goulet. CINDERELLA, of course, was written for TV, not for the stage, and sadly, all of the stage adaptations are lousy, so I'm sure that's a major reason why we don't see that one very often.

If anyone is interested in taking the plunge on Mary Rodgers' book, it's currently $3.99 on Kindle at Amazon.

[quote] As an adjective, it can be. As it is used in your quote, it is a noun. Therefore, it is not a synonym for lovers.

Correct.

Thanks r364!

Just bought it.

[quote] Intelligent people adore Sondheim just like they continue to adore Rodgers & Hammerstein and Verdi and Cole Porter and Mozart.

[quote]Mary!!

No. Richard!!

Matt Doyle didn’t have attendance issues during Company. Then again, Patti LuPone ruled that ship with an iron fist!

All I know is, it's boring as hell to read endless laments about how theatre can never be as it was, when you suspect that these whining bitches probably hated it back then, too.

[Quote] I can think of no reason to have sex with Larry Kramer.

Kramer was actually pretty good looking when younger. Laurents was no Adonis either, of course.

Scroll down on the link for a pic.

Oh, they def had sex

Although Mary Rodgers disdained Arthur Laurents, she never says exactly why in SHY.

Yes, he’s infamous for having been an asshole but so are so many others Mary hung with. Why did she hate him the most?

If Larry and Arthur had been lovers, they surely would have beat each other to death before the sex ever took place.

I wonder if Kramer was at that dinner party where Sondheim and Laurents nearly came to fisticuffs over the hustler Laurents bought Sondheim for a birthday present.

r368 Well, he was out for a while when he injured his...knee, I think it was?

And in fairness, this weekend was also one of his pre-planned absences. Now I agree, it'll bullshit that he's arranging time off so soon after starting, but it is at least better than just calling in sick

The producers of Kpop are now demanding a formal apology from Green. Desperate for any attention I guess. Didn't realise one of the producers was the son of Malcolm Forbes.

Fucking snowflakes.

KPOP sukd.

Wow, thanks, r370. I'm one of those who would have hard time imagining Kramer being attractive, only knowing him as he looked in the 80s and after, but he wasn't bad at all.

Laurents wasn't bad at all either back in the day.

R380 He was a total cunt.

r381, everyone knows that. We're talking about physical appearance, not the disgusting interior. (Though of course the exterior wasn't much either by the time you encountered him, MC.)

I don't think anyone ever said Mary Rodgers hated Laurents any more than anyone else did. That notion began when Jesse Green approached her for comment for a NY Magazine article he was writing about Laurents when she famously replied, something to the effect of: " "Come back to me when he's dead!"

Of course, Green did come back and it all lead to the fabulous SHY.

I'd be so curious to get Frank Rich's take on this KPop vs Jesse Green kerfuffle. I wish he'd write an editorial for the NY Times. I bet it'd be a lot more interesting than Green's rebuttal (if that ever happens). Also, would love to hear Helen Shaw (NY Mag) or Elizabeth Vincentelli's responses. Perhaps the NY Times will eventually do a roundtable discussion.

the KPOP "controversy" is a desperate attempt to get some buzz on a very bad show.

Mary Rodgers hated Laurents because Arthur revealed some very hidden Rodgers family secrets -- secrets not in her "honest" tell-all, by the way -- and she never forgave him for that. And she shouldn't have....

And that's all I'm sayin'...

Laurents was a loathsome cunt.

[quote]Although Mary Rodgers disdained Arthur Laurents, she never says exactly why in SHY.

There are at least two good reasons given in the book. Mary imparts that Laurents wrote her a horribly hateful note after she offered criticism about DO I HEAR A WALTZ?, even though her comments came at Sondheim's request. Also, though she doesn't give details, she writes that Laurents was originally going to write the book for Mary's son Adam Guettel's show THE LIGHT IN THE PIAZZA, and when that deal fell apart, Laurents apparently behaved in an extraordinarily beastly manner towards Guettel, even for him. I would think those two things alone would be reason enough to despise the man.

He wrote her a nasty note after she offered notes on ANYONE CAN WHISTLE.

Checked Laurents' autobio for references to Kramer. Only one, late in the book. Kramer complimented him for living openly with his male lover at a time when that was not common. Laurents said he was neither proud nor not proud; he lived the way always had. Then he recounts a woman saying the same thing to him later, to which he snapped, "Don't patronize me." Rude!

Nothing in the book about whether Arthur and Larry ever fucked though.

I can't believe someone believes K-POP is "cultural." It's about at cultural as The Spice Girls, BoyZtoMen, The Osmonds, The Jackson 5, NSYNC, and every other unabashedly commercial pop "factory" creation of the past 40 years. Just because it's from Korea doesn't make it "cultural." It's just a starting point for a pop commercial enterprise, nothing more, nothing less.

K-Pop, the musical is not cultural. In fact, the singing and dancing is quite inferior to the real thing. K-Pop the musical form, however, is cultural, reflective of and instrumental to the change in Korean society.

Helen Shaw's New Yorker review of "KPOP". Brilliant writing; she makes the show's shortcomings clear, while understanding the complexities of K-pop culture.

Wish I'd had seen the Ars Nova version.

K-POP is a money grab from tourists. Period

[Quote] I don't think anyone ever said Mary Rodgers hated Laurents any more than anyone else did.

In Shy, she herself makes it seem she hates him more than anyone else

What were the secrets Laurents spilled about the Rodgers clan?

[Quote] Mary Rodgers hated Laurents because Arthur revealed some very hidden Rodgers family secrets -- secrets not in her "honest" tell-all, by the way -- and she never forgave him for that. And she shouldn't have....

Spill the tea!!

[quote]He wrote her a nasty note after she offered notes on ANYONE CAN WHISTLE.

Sorry, my mistake. The show in question was indeed ANYONE CAN WHISTLE, not DO I HEAR A WALTZ?

[quote]K-Pop, the musical is not cultural. In fact, the singing and dancing is quite inferior to the real thing.

Perhaps that's one big reason why the Broadway show is doing so poorly at the box office? Why would fans of the genre want to pay to see some ersatz Broadway version of that kind of music when they can still attend concerts that feature the real thing? Obviously, MJ and the Neil Diamond show are very different situations, because one of them is dead and the other is no longer performing.

[quote]Green's rebuttal (if that ever happens)

If Green has even one iota of sense, it won't

Yeah what secrets could Arthur Laurents have really said that anyone could give a fuck about?

I mean Rosie O’Donnell told a complete stranger writing a book about The View that her dad molested her and that she had a crush on Elizabeth Hasslebeck. This was after speaking to the man for 15 minutes!!

I just attended the matinee on MWRA and I really loved it. The main trio was outstanding. Radcliffe did surprisingly well with Franklin Inc. He was great. I loved it and I was not expecting to. I never liked this musical (my last time was in DC with Papi Esparza, I believe). But it works and it is very moving.

Maybe Arthur blabbed about Hank's sexuality.

[quote]But it works and it is very moving.

Would it be more moving if they'd kept the graduation framework, rr401?

^r401

Anyone with half a brain knows claiming "racism" when a critic calls the sound and lighting "squint-inducing" is one of the most disingenuous, dishonest assertions. Be honest. You're (understandably) angry that the show you worked so hard on got a bad review. It makes sense that you want some sort of social-media revenge. But what do you do? Claim that the critic is "racist" because there's no arguing that! And even the idea that you can tell someone of the 'offended' demographic that something is or isn't racist is immediately shot down on social media by the uber-woke. It's all such dishonest rhetoric.

Dishonest? It's lunatic.

R401 How were Groff and Mendez?

Guess the Musical

r405 Oh it's gone beyond just 'squint-inducing' now. In the letter from the idiot producers, they accuse him of racism because he didn't mention the composer is the first Asian American woman to have a score on Broadway, he's racist because he didn't mention 18 Asian actors are making their Broadway debuts, he's racist because he mentioned there's only three instrumentalists, he's racist because he doesn't single out any individual performance, and he's racist because he didn't like the show (just ignore the fact he did like it off-Broadway, but I'm sure they'd find that racist too).

It's all such a massive reach and you can tell they're trying whir up the outrage machine, but doesn't really seem like anyone cares all that much to take up arms for a shitty show

Some normally sane people I follow are agreeing with the mob on this Green review. Even the casting office of the show reposted the outrage letter to the Times. Has everyone just decided to err on the side of agreeing with the latest woke outrage in order to stay safely in people's good, woke graces?

[Quote] he's racist because he doesn't single out any individual performance

That does seem a little racist

[Quote] that dinner party where Sondheim and Laurents nearly came to fisticuffs over the hustler Laurents bought Sondheim for a birthday present

Every. Fucking. Thread.

It's still backwards.

[quote]Some normally sane people I follow are agreeing with the mob on this Green review. Even the casting office of the show reposted the outrage letter to the Times.

That's extremely disturbing, I would even say terrifying. Honestly.

Groff was excellent. In complete control, and great voice. But can someone fix his pants? Mendez is also very good. One bite dramatically but it is not a great role.

I'm sure that there are plenty of folk willing to fix his pants.

Before all of DL jumps to Green's defense: there are some puzzling elements to his review of KPOP, which I just saw.

He describes the show as an "ear-pounder" and the lighting as "squint-inducing." Neither comment is accurate. While I didn't care for the score, I thought both the sound design and lighting design were absolutely first rate. The volume was consistent and never uncomfortably loud. The nicest thing Green can bring himself to say about the dancing (which is outstanding) is that the choreography was "minutely detailed." Is that... a good thing, Jesse?

I don't know or care if racism factored into his review. It does read like someone old, bitter, and determined to dismiss every aspect of a show he disliked, whatever the reason, whatever the result. And that doesn't make for very good arts criticism.

There is a persistent rumor that Hank Guettel is not Adam's biological father. (The theory that Sondheim was Adam's dad seems to have faded.) Maybe Arthur was in possession of that knowledge and was ready to spill. Would give Mary plenty of reason to loathe him.

Kpop was just not good. Period.

Hank is apparently not Adam’s Dad—but doubtful that Sondheim is.

What of the rumor that Mary diddled Adam as an adolescent?

Adam's dinner with Hank, Stephen, and Arthur: "Which of you bitches is my father?"

Okay, R421 just won the thread.

[quote] Adam's dinner with Hank, Stephen, and Arthur: "Which of you bitches is my father?"

Hank, Steve and Arthur: Harold Prince

Who does the strikingly handsome Guettel (then and now) remind you of?

Mamma Mia! 3: Once Upon your Mother’s Mattress

Mary Rodgers has a type so I'm guessing she date raped Tony Perkins so she would make sure she had a good looking kid.

Also confused by morons who equate a show's popularity by how many revivals it gets on Broadway.

The Rodgers & Hammerstein and Lerner & Lowe and Kander & Ebb and Sondheim and Meredith Willson and Jerry Herman and every other major musical theater composers' estates aren't all rich as fuck because of Broadway revivals. They're all rich as fuck because thousands of high schools, colleges, community theates, regional theaters, cruise ships, etc all over the world stage those shows EVERY day of the year.

Yeah, all those estates love to get a big showy Bway or West End revival every so often but mainly because it regenerates heat for that show for another 5 years or more. Owning copyright to beloved shows is like having your own cash machine.

Even Mary Rodgers with her one little show managed to earn a $100k a year despite the fact it hasn't had a B'way revival in decades (and that one was a bit of a floppo).

The Sondheim Estate will be making millions for decades to come.

He certainly looks nothing like Sondheim.

This Sunday in the Book Review section of 100 notable Books of 2022 and Mary Rodgers book is on that list. How I miss this lady. Her beautiful notes to me at Christmas.

You will always have a place at the Datalounge table fake mlop troll.

[quote]You will always have a place at the Datalounge table fake mlop troll.—With or without Chit's raised leg.

I love fake mlop also, but this is a direct quote from the original:

I'm not the real 'fake mlop' troll, who is/was a true genius. I am more the 'authentic mlop posts with or without context' troll. I like adding her to the conversation, whether appropriate or not. Here it was slightly appropriate, given the discussion of Mary Rodgers. I especially love how her last sentence has no verb. It's sublime.

No verb but actually very articulate for mlop.

Well whoever fucked Mary Rodgers to produce a son, I’m sure Arthur Laurents lifted his caftan too as well. He slept with everyone despite having a face that looked like a muddy boot

Adam Guettel is as if Tom Stoppard and Stephen Sondheim had a baby. Kill it.

Is Adam gay?

[quote] No verb but actually very articulate for mlop.

I think she finally learned how to use spellcheck

Two things, R 417: (1) It all comes down to a difference of opinion, but also (2) You somehow fail to mention, or maybe you're unaware of the fact, that Green reviewed the show very positively when it played off Broadway, which presumably would not have been the case if he objected to the lighting and the sound level back then. His problem there seems to be that everything was pumped up for Broadway.

Me love you long time!

Stunt bullshitter Rick Miramontez is working on both KPOP and Aint No Mo which explains the desperate hubbub that doesn’t help the show but makes producers feel good

Arthur had a tight body and a lot of influence in show biz. Of course he got laid a lot.

Arthur allegedly had a big dick, and that explains a lot of the cocky swaggering confidence on his part. He was incredibly average in most other departments, including his skills as a playwright.

A storm in a teacup over something so trite and juvenile--who cares? Theatre is so much greater than this nonsense.

Arthur was a mean dwarf Jew and no looker.

Talent skipped a generation in the Rodgers clan, Mary.

So did looks, personality, and purpose.

I read "Shy" and unlike every other pretentious queen, I found the book to be unrelentingly tedious, and Rodgers to be pathological, mean and completely inauthentic. Any reasonable reader can tell most of what she's saying is some degree of false, and the constant contradictions between what she's saying and what she actually does are depressing. No wonder all her kids walked away. Why people keep holding this book up says more about the reader than Rodgers. It should have been titled "Sad".

Can't just be some people have a different opinion to r447, no if they disagree with him then they're pretentious and there must be something wrong with them. The irony.

R447=Barbara Barrie

Actually, Adam looks a lot like a young Larry Kert.

Was there ever a young Larry Kert?

Considering all the innuendo and slurs here about Hank Guettel, someone none of us here knew at all, I can only imagine the nasty rumors spread by Arthur Laurents during Mary and Hank's long marriage. Of course, Mary hated Arthur.

Also, I think Arthur was jealous of Sondheim's adoration and love for Mary and their long loyal friendship.

The irony, r448, is that r447 is also r386:

[quote]Mary Rodgers hated Laurents because Arthur revealed some very hidden Rodgers family secrets -- secrets not in her "honest" tell-all, by the way -- and she never forgave him for that. And she shouldn't have....

[quote]And that's all I'm sayin'...

SHY is the best theatrical memoir since Moss Hart's ACT ONE. It's sad that Mary Rodgers isn't alive to take in all the love for it.

It’s so weird reading SHY because she’s dies at the end. Usually memories don’t include the death of the subject

If the huge Asian community in NYC turned out to support K-Pop and turned it into a big financial success that would be the best fuck you to the alleged racist critics. Will that happen? No.

R455

Most of the Asian community in New York is Chinese, Japanese , and South East Asian.

Would non-Korean people feel any connection to Korean culture?

I know that Cubans, Puerto Ricans and Venezuelans do not feel connected to Chicano plays. Or for that matter, French, Germans, and Italians do not feel connected to Scandanavian culture.

Just because one’s Korean doesn’t suddenly make one either a Kpop or a Broadway fan.

Typical white people thinking: we’ll make a musical about some small part of (insert culture) and they’ll all rush to Broadway and pay insane prices to see it!

[Quote] If the huge Asian community in NYC turned out to support K-Pop and turned it into a big financial success that would be the best fuck you to the alleged racist critics. Will that happen? No.

Because Asians are a monolith and are desperate to see a show about what Americans are obsessed with in Asia…

I'd have done Laurents. No hesitation.

r459

same here

And so would Larry Kramer

Arthur had alienated nearly all his friends by the time he died. I think that what he did, among other things, was carry tales, and take any opportunity to create or widen a rift between two friends. Sondheim was loyal to him (and almost everybody else, for that matter) till nearly the end, but Laurents' repeated trashing of Sondheim in his incessant memoirs and elsewhere finally turned him off permanently.

For R450.

Larry Kert and Carol Lawrence

Carol Lawrence and Larry Kert

Did any of these dames ever do Follies?

Eve Arden Kay(e) Ballard Betsy Palmer Betty white Carol Lawrence Michele Lee Lanie Kazan

Only on the Datalounge r465, only on the Datalounge.

Kaye Ballard was Hattie in the Papermill Playhouse Follies.

I really miss Ethel Shutta's "grandma at the Bar Mitzvah" ensemble in the original "Broadway Baby" that Kay Ballard does in her pink caftan at Paper Mill. All the body language is lost in the latter, as well as a real character. Florence Klotz was truly a brilliant costume designer.

Is this correct?

"Broadway Baby" is Hattie singing about herself but Solange in "Ah, Paree!" and the couple (the Wittmans?) who sing "Rain on the Roof" are actually singing songs they performed in the old Weissman Follies.

If so, it's just occurred to me after all these years, that it's odd Sondheim made them into a trio.

Hattie is singing her number from the Follies.

Does anyone know what happened to Julia Levy at Roundabout, she was there for years with Todd Haimes; but I was surprised to not see her name in my 1776 Playbill.

There was a joke around the time Bedknobs and Broomsticks came out that it really should be the title of The Arthur Laurents Story.

[quote] I really miss Ethel Shutta's "grandma at the Bar Mitzvah" ensemble in the original "Broadway Baby"

I’ve seen many productions of Follies and I agree that Shutta’s costume was the best for Hattie, right down to the corsage.

I think of Broadway Baby as a kind of Helen Kane-soubrette number in the original Follies—with present-day Hattie trying to recover the coyness of the younger self. That seemed to be Jayne Houdyshell was trying for, but not succeeding with (and I generally like her—thought she was excellent in “The Humans”). Stritch’s version succeeded in concert because of the ways in which we were all aware she was NEVER a true soubrette, but there was still a campy nod to the tradition. Shutta’s is still the best—she was better served in this than playing Mary Martin’s mother in the ill-fated “Jennie.” Martin was right not to want to bring it in—she was too old for it and, while there were a few good songs, the script sounds awful and her leading men not equal to supporting her (though the one sounds as queenie as Richard Halliday).

As has been rumored, HERE LIES LOVE at the Broadway theater this spring. God help us.

They’re pushing back the Merrily transfer for THAT?

I ate Ruth Mitchell’s pussy like a champ.

Roger Friedman is a mess.

Has anyone told the person who wrote that article that the Tonys mean nothing anymore.

I don't think Gregg Barnes had a very good experience with that production, r468. I met him at a party around that time and had seen both Side Show and FOLLIES. He said those two productions were the zenith and the nadir of his career.

Gregg Barnes is a bad designer. His work on Some Like It Hot is awful.

[quote]If the huge Asian community in NYC turned out to support K-Pop and turned it into a big financial success that would be the best fuck you to the alleged racist critics. Will that happen? No.

They are probably afraid of being attacked by thugs on their way to the theater.

That's too bad, r481, I loved his Side Show designs.

[quote]If the huge Asian community in NYC turned out to support K-Pop and turned it into a big financial success that would be the best fuck you to the alleged racist critics. Will that happen? No.

If the huge white community in NYC turned out to support " Follies," would it have been the flop that it was?

Levy is listed on Pictures from Home (in January 2023) at Roundabout.

The spring season isn't looking that good. I have high hopes for Sweeney and Merrily if it doesn't delay a move.

[quote]r5 Oh Good, ANOTHER Sondheim tribute concert.... —Seriously, let's take a break...It's been done

Please, please don’t let Glenn strong arm her way into this one with some dirge-like ballad, lowered a key.

r481, I think what r480 is saying is Side Show was the zenith and Follies (at Paper Mill) was the nadir of Gregg Barnes' career. Of course, that was before he attacked Some Like It Hot, not his finest hour.

I think Gregg does fabulous beaded gowns for divas and drag queens but can't design a character. He doesn't seem interested.

Presumably the mediocre notices for the Neil Diamond slog won’t matter much.

Well, as much as I want to champion him, r487, that has as much to do with him being a nice guy as anything. To be honest, there were things I didn't like about his second FOLLIES. Jan Maxwell...eh-eh.

Am I the only one confounded by the NYT review of A BEAUTIFUL NOISE?

Put down the thesaurus for a moment, please. And tell us whether you actually liked the show.

For all of her fighting against it and wishing it weren't so - by the end of SHY it seems like Mary had turned into her mom.

Morose? Who wants to see...morose?

[quote]They’re pushing back the Merrily transfer for THAT?

What are you referring to?

R490, I'm afraid to ask which words in that review are beyond you and prompted your "thesaurus" comment.

I am annoyed by the fact that here's YET ANOTHER review that uses the incredibly trite, hackneyed, overly sentimental phrase "beating heart." Seems like I've read that bullshit phrase in every other theater review written over the past 10 years or so.

[quote]r240 I saw an earlier reading of the Howland/Tysen version of Gatsby… it's much more skilled than I ever thought it was going to be

I was in THE GREAT GATSBY!

My big interpretive dance “Melody for Myrtle” was cut.

I'd definitely go see Benko in Funny Girl...if the show wasn't a huge pile of poo. Because she's excellent in this clip. I love her acting throughout the song. She has great tone and pitch and all the big notes...she's warm and even looks a bit like Fanny....she's really terrific casting.

So fine, she was never on a hit TV show and doesn't have millions of fans...whatever. Lea reads as completely unlikable up there doing her Barbra imitation. Benko is rootable.

Really, just watching videos of both of them singing this song, I respond more to Benko. I kinda hate that somehow Lea is overshadowing her as the savior of this production, when it's Julie that did the saving. And good for her!

Kinda makes you wonder how things would have gone if Benko was the one to open the show in the first place.

[quote]R291 SLIH looks mediocre at best... the diversity casting is unrealistic for the time period.

[italic] (Klan granny, rolling her hair in rag curls for the night)

I somehow missed the rude comments about Jayne in Follies. Why the hell are you guys so down on her performance of Broadway Baby??

I LOVED that she was this Plain Jane type who didn't take herself too seriously. You could just imagine her barely getting into the Follies and posing and faking her way into seeming "glamorous" when in reality, she was an ordinary type gal underneath.

And what exactly do you think most people look like once they're in their 50s or 60s and have gone through shit? Fine, Jayne's big - aren't most of the women in your life big?

I loved that they didn't all look like creepy LA Moms still dieting their way through life.

And Jayne sang the song for all it was worth. It's not what I'd call a beautiful voice exactly, but it told the story very very well. She was such a breath of fresh air when you saw her up there on the stage. Teri White (I believe her name was) who did the Mirror Number/Who's That Woman was a similar kind of gal in the piece. They contrasted nicely against Sally, Phyllis, Carlotta and Heidi, who are all more poised and "pretty".

What exactly are you guys comparing Jayne against to say she is bad? I've heard others sing the song and really, she's still the best to me. Maybe you had to be there.

alwys found bernadette peters a turn off.

Jayne Mansfield was in Follies?

Houdyshell. Jayne Houdyshell was in Follies.

The Julie Benko conversation has been over for months now R496. No one cares.

You should have heard MY version of Broadway Baby. Who needs Sondheim lyrics when you can just scat?

I have always thought that the only person who could be as good as Ethel Shutta was Rose Marie.

Chita Rivera hosting BroadwayWorld’s 20th Anniversary Gala, directed by Richard Jay-Alexander. Twenty years went by fast…

Don't waste your time on this, R498. Jayne Houdyshell was great in FOLLIES, except in the twisted minds of some bitches who are posting negatively about her performance because they didn't like the way she looked.

why does everything look the same?

[quote]If the huge Asian community in NYC turned out to support K-Pop and turned it into a big financial success that would be the best fuck you to the alleged racist critics. Will that happen? No.

Get the thugs off the streets and subways and you might get some people willing to go to Broadway.

Nope. Jayne Houdyshell was anemic in Follies. And it had nothing to do with the way she looked. She's one of the great mysteries of 21st century Broadway. There are so many other older actresses who are more talented. Why did she get plucked from obscurity at such a late age and suddenly leapfrog over all of them?

She's basically the June Squibb of theater.

Why isn't this headed to Broadway?

R509, you are a loon and/or you have a personal agenda against Jayne Houdyshell, of all people. Either way, shut up, or at least stop stating your minority opinion as if it's fact.

[quote]Nope. Jayne Houdyshell was anemic in Follies.

I saw this production in D.C., pre-Broadway, so I got to see DL fave Linda Lavin as Hattie.

Interesting! I hope Rudin loses.

paywall

[quote] [R509], you are a loon and/or you have a personal agenda against Jayne Houdyshell, of all people. Either way, shut up, or at least stop stating your minority opinion as if it's fact.

Asshole, I'm not the person who's been saying things about her. This is my first post about it. So maybe, just maybe, there are people out there who feel differently about her than you do.

So tired of people crying PAYWALL about The New York Fucking Times articles! Yes, you have to pay to read them, the way you had to pay for newspapers. THIS is the reason we have shit journalism today...it's supposed to be free. But the same people demand better pay for everyone. Rant over.

I was the waiter for a quiet restaurant dinner wherein Arthur begged Mike Nichols to direct the Streisand Gypsy. Nichols was adamant about never even considering working with Babs. Arthur was practically in tears.

Hottie Conrad Ricamora on Broadway? I'm so fucking there. However, I doubt Ruthie will repeat her role. It would probably take a huge emotional toll on her. Not to mention postponing Light In The Piazza for a second time.

Oh, get off your fucking high-horse r516.

[quote]I LOVED that she was this Plain Jane type who didn't take herself too seriously. You could just imagine her barely getting into the Follies and posing and faking her way into seeming "glamorous" when in reality, she was an ordinary type gal underneath.

This is who Hattie was, r498...

Ben has a line to Hattie fairly early in the play:

[quote]You wore a white dress cut to here. I didn’t hear a note you sang.

Now Ben is oozing charm from every pore at this point, but it has to be somewhat believable that in the past Hattie looked good enough to be mesmerizing in a low cut dress.

Thanks [R520] for that great number!

Yes, indeedy! Hattie was more of a looker, and a hoofer, than I thought!

[quote]Asshole, I'm not the person who's been saying things about her. This is my first post about it. So maybe, just maybe, there are people out there who feel differently about her than you do.

YOU are one of the people who flatly stated your opinion of Jane Houdyshell's performance in FOLLIES as if it's the ONLY opinion. That's my objection to what you posted.

[quote]Now Ben is oozing charm from every pore at this point, but it has to be somewhat believable that in the past Hattie looked good enough to be mesmerizing in a low cut dress.

Yes, we're supposed to think she looked that good 35 OR 40 YEARS PREVIOUSLY. Do you really not understand that people's looks can fade and they can gain lots of weight over that long a period? Some people would argue that it's more poignant to have Ben honestly compliment a now frumpy, frowzy, old-looking broad for being a looker in her youth, rather than an older woman who still looks smashing. Do you not get that, either?

I thought Here Lies Love was next summer...Are they really trying for the Spring?

Y'all are talking as if Ethel Shutta was still hot

Fat Ham going to Broadway in 2023...American Airlines Theater.

What I miss in other performances of "Broadway Baby" is the personality Ethel Shutta brings to it and the brisk tempo. She does it in a offhand throwaway style where it was clearly a comic turn in the Follies, but with her spry old bird persona. Stritch did her dirge-like deadpan thing in the concert version, and since then, all of the fun went out of it. Performances of it became more ponderous, more self-aware.

[quote]Delighted to know my "airing on the cunty side" made it into a classic TG title.=

But it should be “erring on the cunty side.” The original saying is “erring on the … side.”

Nobody’s arguing she has to look great now

But there’s no way Jane looked great at any point in her life

[quote] YOU are one of the people who flatly stated your opinion of Jane Houdyshell's performance in FOLLIES as if it's the ONLY opinion. That's my objection to what you posted.

Nice try. You literally accused me of being the "loon" who's been posting about Jayne Houdyshell. The only loon around here is you.

[quote]Stritch did her dirge-like deadpan thing in the concert version, and since then, all of the fun went out of it. Performances of it became more ponderous, more self-aware.

I've always thought the reason why Stritch performed the song at that ridiculously slow tempo was because she wanted to hog the spotlight in that FOLLIES concert for as long as she possibly could, but none of the performances by other people that I've seen since then have been anywhere near as slow or have struck me as "ponderous." That interpretation worked for Stritch but probably wouldn't work for anyone else.

Sorry, R531, I assumed you were the same person who had been posting about Jane Houdyshell, but the fact that you are not doesn't make you (or the other poster) any less loony.

[quote]Nobody’s arguing she has to look great now. But there’s no way Jane looked great at any point in her life.

Seeing as how there have been countless examples of people in show business (and not in show business) who were beautiful and/or sexy in their youth but who wound up looking pretty bad 35 or 40 years later, your comment strikes me as very stupid. Even if Jane Houdyshell herself did not actually look great in her youth, the point is that many people who look like she looks now DID, in fact, look great in their youth. Understand?

[quote] Fat Ham going to Broadway in 2023

Oh dear lord, please, no more about Beanie.

What exactly do the producers of Fat Ham think is going to happen that is any different than what's happened to nearly every other recent play that has been mounted in the past year to capitalize on theater about the POC experience?

....

R520. I love how Shutta does some of the same steps from that number decades later as part of the Broadway Baby number.

Wow, I just looked ol' Ethel up, and according to Wikipedia, her last name is pronounced Shoo-TAY.

Anyone else been calling her Shut-a this whole time?

Merde!

Fat Ham going into the American Airlines but has no association with Roundabout! Let's hope they beef up the cheesy special effects for Broadway. And, btw, it's only scheduled through June. That from an usher at the AA Theatre who was told 3 weeks ago. So the Public will have two new productions on Broadway this season.

You know it’s a Monday on Datalounge when Ethel Shutta has 50 comments on a thread

[quote]Peppy "Ten Gallon Hat" dance number from 1930

Peppy dance numbers are what's missing from today's musicals.

[quote] Seeing as how there have been countless examples of people in show business (and not in show business) who were beautiful and/or sexy in their youth but who wound up looking pretty bad 35 or 40 years later, your comment strikes me as very stupid. Even if Jane Houdyshell herself did not actually look great in her youth, the point is that many people who look like she looks now DID, in fact, look great in their youth. Understand?

Elizabeth Taylor

[quote]But it should be “erring on the cunty side.” The original saying is “erring on the … side.”

I assumed the entire reason this was considered amusing and was chosen as the title of the current thread was because whoever posted this phrase originally mistakenly wrote "aired" instead of "erred."

At least we're clearing the err.

[quote] You know it’s a Monday on Datalounge when Ethel Shutta has 50 comments on a thread

Forget it, Jake. It’s Follies.

There used to be entire clubs devoted to pep, r542.

That champagne dress did nothing for Jan Mazwell with her plucked chicken skin tone.

[quote]There used to be entire clubs devoted to pep, [R542].

Not to mention a breakfast cereal.

I saw the original Merrily We Roll Along on Broadway twice and loved it, despite its many flaws. Every production since then has had pluses and minuses, but I have to say that the new one at NYTW comes closest to fixing this troubled show. I saw the British production when it was broadcast in movie theaters and wasn't too impressed. But even though the set is still a dud in this new production (what the hell is that top level with potted plants doing up there?) the performers are all huge improvements over the Brits. Jonathan Groff is so charismatic that he actually makes you care about Franklin even though the character is a shit in the first act. The contrast when he is charming in the second act really works. I wasn't crazy about Lindsay Mendez when she played Carrie in Carousel, but here she is the best Mary I've seen. (I know...MARY!) Her reprise of "Not A Day Goes By: is heartbreaking. Pocket-sized Daniel Radcliffe (Lord, he is tiny) isn't as dynamic or neurotic as Lonny Price was in the original, but Radcliffe clearly wins over the audience's affection and sympathy. The actresses playing Beth and Gussie are both excellent, and I liked what Reg Rogers did as the producer. It's only a seven-piece band, but Jonathan Tunick's reduced orchestrations sound great. I still miss "The Hills of Tomorrow" from the original production, but this is the first production where I didn't think there was too much Gussie or too much of a lull in the first act when Frank sings that newly added song. If they can sign up Groff and keep Radcliffe if this transfers to Broadway, this should be as big a hit as Into the Woods was...at least for a while. Long term, though, I'm not sure Merrily is ever going to be a big crowd-pleaser.

^^Oops, my mistake. It's a 10-piece band.

Neil Diamond makes surprise appearance at opening night.

I am not a megafan of Diamond, nor of jukebox musicals. But this still made me cry a little.

Does Neil Diamond have Alzheimer's?

Parkinson's.

Hmmm

FAT HAM is an extremely poor piece of writing. It's possibly the worst play ever to win the Pulitzer.

A Diane Warren stage show could be fun if it were based around her filthy persona.

Julia McKenzie in SIDE BY SIDE BY SONDHEIM sings the song rather slowly and quietly—until an explosive finish when she gets to a "BIG TIME BROADWAY SHOW!" Way before Stritch did the same thing.

Ethel Shutta is the gold standard but I also enjoy Mimi Hines.

Shutta was the gold standard, but my second favorite would have be Dorothy Loudon on the Tonys.

[quote]Jonathan Groff is so charismatic that he actually makes you care about Franklin even though the character is a shit in the first act. The contrast when he is charming in the second act really works. I wasn't crazy about Lindsay Mendez when she played Carrie in Carousel, but here she is the best Mary I've seen. (I know...MARY!) Her reprise of "Not A Day Goes By: is heartbreaking. Pocket-sized Daniel Radcliffe (Lord, he is tiny) isn't as dynamic or neurotic as Lonny Price was in the original, but Radcliffe clearly wins over the audience's affection and sympathy.

This is exactly why this casting sounded so great to me. Because all three of the main characters are at least somewhat unlikable in several scenes in the first act, it's essential that the actors playing them have enough innate charm to get the audience on their side regardless. Otherwise, the show really does not work.

What's the word on Saheem Ali, director of Fat Ham? He's quite cute. I'm getting a little bit of BDF from him. He was born in Kenya, though I believe he's of South Asian descent. I think he's making his Broadway debut with the transfer of Fat Ham? Never seen any of his other work, but really enjoyed Fat Ham, though, I wonder if can work as well in a proscenium staging.

If thread 505 isn't named for Ethel Shutta I will viciously slap the OP

r513

this website is useful!

Mimi went up on the BB lyrics on, I think, her first performance in Follies. She simply stopped, calmly asked to start over and nailed it. The audience loved her.

Some interesting and amusing comments in the New York Times review of the opening performance of AIDA at the Metropolitan Opera:

[quote]As for the new “Aida” coming in a couple of seasons, it will be directed by Michael Mayer, best known for his work in theater, like the fusty “Funny Girl” currently on Broadway. For some reason, he has been tagged by the Met as a Verdi specialist. His 2013 “Rigoletto,” since replaced, jazzily but incoherently updated the story to 1960s Las Vegas. Even worse is his “La Traviata,” which drowns in garish theme-park-princess crinolines even talented artists like the full-voiced soprano Nadine Sierra earlier this season.

It's not that Jayne Houdyshell isn't pretty enough to play Hattie, it's that she was made up (the dirty unstyled hair and furry eyebrows) and costumed (that awful baggy brown suit) and behaved like a deranged bag lady who stole onto the stage when no one was looking. It looked incomprehensibly like they were attempting to make appear poor Jayne LESS attractive than she is. And there was a bizarre edge of desperation in her performance that made no sense for the song, like she knew she didn't deserve to be up there, and she had to belt out the number before she was removed from the stage with a big hook.

It was especially peculiar because Linda Lavin, who brilliantly played Hattie and sang the number in the same revival in its DC tryout, was NOTHING like that in any aspect.

But then, just look at the non-direction throughout that entire revival. The actors were on their own.

Is Michael Mayer fucking Peter Gelb?

Good. They both deserve each other.

" Fat Ham." Hurray, another play articulating the black experience!!!!

I saw the DC Follies and Linda Lavin seemed like she said to the director that she was too big a star for this part so in order for her to do it, she wanted a big entrance up center, all alone, and to sing it solo, with no one else coming in at the end. And to be as glamorous as possible. It really looked like it was FOLLIES, with special guest star LINDA LAVIN! (as herself!)

What.....mayer and Gelb? Details, please.

[quote]I’m not convinced that Laurents would have had sex with Kramer,. He tended towards beautiful Aryan types because it calmed his insecurities.

What??? Would you describe David Saint as a "beautiful Aryan type"?

r544 is correct. It's like WHET--an DL error deliberately continued.

[quote]But then, just look at the non-direction throughout that entire revival. The actors were on their own.

Well, look who directed it. Anyway, his career is now over, but ironically, not because of his lack of talent.

Next thread for when the time comes, per the request of r244 and r563.

R572. Laurents and Saint do seem to have had some sort of unholy alliance, but it never occurred to me that they were romantically sexually involved. I've always assumed it was just because Saint produced LOTS of Laurents shows at the theater where he (Saint) was artistic director, even the really crappy new plays.

Make that r241, not r244.

Mr. Groff mispronounces Shutta on the Audible version of the Follies book, Everything Was Possible. Drove me crazy!

ShuTAY ShanTAY

I've always pronounced it Shut tay.

You would be correct, r576.

Exactly, r570. I have a feeling Barnes had to deal with ego issues on both FOLLIES productions.

While I'm not sure I'd see it myself, I'm glad that shows like Fat Ham keep getting produced on Broadway. Pisses off the "Go woke, go broke" crowd, who I suspect would be more tolerant if it was about a queer white guy.

A) Jayne's hair did not seem dirty at all. When I saw it live, it seemed grey and fluffed out from a quick blow-dry. The kind of thing a woman who didn't really care about her appearance anymore would do.

B) Also, she wasn't wearing a suit. She was wearing a brown dress with a brown blazer over it and glasses on a chain. She looked like an old librarian.

C) Holy shit, Linda's performance is awful r582. Her "GEEE!!!!" is drawn out, and everything just seems like an exaggerated attempt to earn applause from an audience that's bewildered as to who the hell she thinks she is. It's so self-indulgent. She seems like an extremely drunk Aunt carrying on on New Year's Eve for no one's enjoyment but her own. I'm so glad she didn't transfer to Broadway.

Honestly, one of the things I love the most about Jayne's performance is the rhythms of it. She doesn't draw out notes, just to show that she can still hold them. She doesn't try to overly milk it. She sings it, she tells the story and she hits the notes. Solidly. She's not sharp or flat, she doesn't have some stellar voice or perfect vibrato. It's just good and it's direct and it cuts through with a sort of forcefulness that speaks to the drive behind the lyrics of the song. She's someone who was going to make it regardless of whether or not the world thought she had any talent.

I think Jane carried it off beautifully. I didn't look at her character as pathetic. I didn't look at her situation as laughable and unlike so many of the other female characters in the show who are putting on airs and trying to imagine themselves as being more beautiful than they are, she seemed like the one person in the room who looked around and said, "yeah we're old, we're past our prime that's fine with me."

I don't like that Dotty Loudon "Broadway Baby." Too shticky. Too enamored of herself. Key changes but she rumbles her way through the whole thing.

You've got to see star quality (however faded) when she sings Broadway Baby, r584. I didn't see remnants of any. I also was underwhelmed by Miss Garrett.

I saw "Fat Ham" at the Public.

I laughed. Frequently.

Not fond of the ending. They're following the Hamlet playbook up to the point where bodies start piling up, at which point they wrap things up in a tidy little bow. Up until that point I was quite entertained.

I saw Here Lies Love in Seattle and it was....ok. Some nice songs but the book isn't good at all. It's basically a "Poor Imelda's journey into the Valley of the Dolls" story but not that much fun.

It was also an immersive experience.....are they doing that for the Broadway? Because being down on the floor was half the fun....without the immersive thing, it's just a shitty show with cute Filipinos in it.

I thought Fat Ham was outrageously silly at The Public. Lots of laughs at the expense of poor trashy black characters. The ending was a complete cop out.

Utterly shocked it won a Pulitzer. Have no idea how it will do on Broadway even if it wins a few Tonys.

[quote]I thought Fat Ham was outrageously silly at The Public.

You say that like it's a bad thing.

I didn't really mean it as a bad thing. But the whole show for me was very lightweight and sit-comish, certainly not worthy of a Pulitzer or even must-see reviews. And even more amazing to think it was awarded the Pulitzer on the script and not the Public's production, which certainly had its fun moments and some riotous performances. I can't imagine how that script must read....and that the words alone could impress anyone.

But hey, I'm in the minority here. Happy to admit it.

From what I understand, they *are* having Here Lies Love be an immersive experience, which is certainly going to be interesting for the bridge and tunnel crowd.

[quote]I have a feeling Barnes had to deal with ego issues on both FOLLIES productions.

Who's Barnes?

Yes, I

will be

the guy

who will

close this

thread.

BAJOUR!

Molly!!!