Miss Manners: We were shamed out of taking food from the wedding home

Miss Manners reply at link:

I thought this was some sort of joke post. I’m really really surprised to read it likely isn’t. Both sides are utterly insufferable.

Miss Manners screwed the pooch on this one. I would have said that the parents of the bride should write a letter to the couple apologizing for the horribly rude treatment they received at the hands of the other guests. Miss M. says that the food wasn't theirs to take or request -but even if that is true, the situation had nothing to do with the other people who ran to the bride's parents. They overstepped far more than the original couple did. If something like this happened where I was the host I would instantly apologize to the first couple -rudeness is not allowed in my name. As for the second couple, I would privately ask them to not play policeman with my guests, and to refrain from making scenes.

White Christians and food...

OP- You mean Vivian’s Capri Pants 👖

I don't know how Miss Manners brought her daughter up, I think she is writing the column now. I agree with R3. These 2nd-generation legacy advice writers are clueless.

Here is what Miss Manners replied for those who can't access the Washington Post material behind a paywall:

The boxed cake that you so fondly remember from your childhood was likely offered, not demanded. And while it may be perfectly OK to ask for leftovers at a restaurant where one has paid for the food, the same is not true at a private function where one has not.

Wasteful as it may have been, the leftover food was not yours to take. You might have reasonably gotten away with one of these transgressions, but Miss Manners is afraid that two does indeed look a bit greedy.

But while that does not justify your fellow guests’ extreme reaction, it does give insight into why they thought you were treating the event like a trip to the midnight cruise buffet.

If you do write a letter of apology, do not make excuses, simply tell your hosts that you are sorry for the overstep and you hope that they will forgive you. You may also add how sorry your daughter was to have missed the event. Although, maybe do not mention that what she really missed was the cake.

New Miss Manners columns are posted Monday through Saturday on washingtonpost.com/advice. You can send questions to Miss Manners at her website, missmanners.com. You can also follow her @RealMissManners.

©2022, by Judith Martin

Boxing up / taking home the beef and salmon seemed OK. Otherwise, it would have gone to waste.

Asking for a boxed-up slice of cake for an "absent guest," was tacky. You're either at the wedding (a "guest") or you're not at the wedding.

I mostly agree with Miss Manners.

If you're not paying for the food, its not really yours to take.

The people made a mistake by not being discrete. You don't ask for to go boxes in front of everyone. That's tacky.

You privately ask for a to go box or a small ziplock bag. And then you discretely put the food into the box, or bag, away from prying eyes.

Discretion is the better part of valor.

[quote]If you do write a letter of apology, do not make excuses, simply tell your hosts that you are sorry for the overstep and you hope that they will forgive you.

I disagree with that. If it was a mistake, it was an honest one. The context is fair to add.

It seems like no big deal if you just took your own uneaten portion. Different if you scoured the table for anything not bolted down plus the decorations. The table mates were very wrong in their comments if it were the former. That said, I would never do it at a formal dinner where I was a guest. Eat up and leave the rest.

It was bad manners to tattle during the event.

I think the doggie bag is tacky. The request for the daughter I have mixed feelings about. Probably not this case, but I can see where that might be reasonable. Surprise hospital stay that keeps a guest from attending? Maybe. Nice thought for the ill/injured. Pregnancy isn't really a surprise tho.

But whatever the case, what happened after was so out of line that it is the major concern here. Inexcusable behavior and if I were the host, I would apologize to the doggie baggers. And if anyone called me out like that, I certainly wouldn't be writing an apology. Miss Manners? Clueless.

It would be entirely the decision of the people (I assume the bride's parents) who paid for the event where leftovers should go; it's not the decision of the guests. Miss Manners is correct that they need to apologize--being a guest does not mean you are entitled to take home food for other people or for your dogs.

However, they were treated inexcusably rudely by the groom's parents and the woman who reported them to the groom's parents. They should apologize for making their guests feel embarrassed and for calling the guests names--that is simply not how you treat guests. However, that is not the fault of the bride's parents.

That's a bit gauche to take leftovers from a formal event but they seemed harmless in asking for their leftovers. They couldn't be reused.

Agree about the boxed cake for the pregnant absent guest- that should not have been asked for.

Still, neither of this actions is the groom's parents or the other's guests responsibility to police. They were terribly rude to the doggy baggers (even if they were gauche and a bit clueless, they didn't mean any harm).

A simple loud hissing from the groom's parents were all they needed to do to signal their displeasure.

I have a black tie optional wedding to go to in a week and I am so grateful for the helpful advice in this thread. Thank you one and all.

But was it a cash bar?

The whole 'doggie bag' thing is seen as very gauche in the UK and most of Europe.

I've never seen in happen anywhere in my 50+ years here.

I don't for a second believe that some guests would go complaining to the groom's family. EST published by Miss Manners.

Tacky AF. Definitely Americans. This does not happen anywhere else.

[quote] The whole 'doggie bag' thing is seen as very gauche in the UK and most of Europe. I've never seen in happen anywhere in my 50+ years here.

How is that relevant?

Different countries and, especially, different countries on different continents will of course have different customs. I don't expect people in other countries to follow our customs, and I would hope they would feel the same about my country. To do otherwise would be incredibly self-centered.

Europeans are so cheap - they would never be serving bountiful portions of salmon and braised beef.

No one expects Americans to think it's okay to shit in the open just because they do so in China and India.

How do those greedy cheap ass guests know the food was going to go to waste? For all they knew, maybe the bridal party intended on feeding their own dogs with the leftovers.

"Each plate could have fed at least four people".....bullshit "When the servers finished serving cake to the guests, and it was obvious there was plenty left over, I politely requested a piece for “an absent guest.” The pregnant daughter wasn't an absent guest. Unless they're going to say she accepted the invite but then decided not to show, which again is trash behaviour. This pair of guests deserve any scorn directed to them.

Gosh, I could totally see my mother pushing to take home leftover cake at a wedding.

The letter writers were mildly rude and the people calling them out were super rude.

Can you just see all those nosy, waspy faces watching your every bite: "She had TWO salmon filets. Dear gawd!".

Most caterers/venues would refuse to wrap food to take home. It's not sanitary and a liability. How long did the couple stay after dinner with their steak sitting there at room temperature? Gross.

I don’t think the issue is the food. It’s placing additional demands on the waitstaff. They made two special requests. That’s annoying. They should have considered how difficult it would be if every guest made two unanticipated special requests. It’s NOT a restaurant and they probably don’t stock to-go boxes for all guests. There is a reason you have limited menu choices at a wedding. The waitstaff isn’t there to cater to your every whim. So that WAS selfish.

But the other couple was much worse. Once the food is on your plate, it’s YOUR food. I very much doubt that anyone else was going to take home a stranger’s half eaten steak, except maybe for THEIR dog. The leftover uncut cake is a different story, but you could argue that it was a way to communicate their daughter’s regrets at missing their special event.

The other couple are just lunatics.

[quote] Gosh, I could totally see my mother pushing to take home leftover cake at a wedding.

Aww, I can see my mom (RIP) wanting to take cake home, as well. In the old days, the bride & groom would give out a little box of cake to each guest. (Not the exact same cake as what's served at the wedding, but some type of cake.)

The reason I think asking for cake "to go" was rude is because the cake was for someone who wasn't even at the wedding. Let's face it. These days, it's expensive to attend a wedding. I.e., you've got to give a pretty substantial gift, knowing that the wedding was expensive for the bride and groom.

So, at least the beef and salmon were leftovers from people who actually attended and presumably gave a gift.

R23 You are quite correct, with European portion sizes it would be unlikely that there would be enough left to take home. Probably why it isn't something people even consider.

The guests requesting doggy bags were definitely from Flyovertsan.

Has anyone asked The Darfur Orphan how he feels about it?

^^^^ He's currently Googling the word 'plate'.

Darfur Orphan is now available for adoption AND weddings.

Both couples were tacky.

No one has any business policing the guests and making a scene and calling them out. No one. I would not want anyone to treat my guests like that and I would have intervened to tell everyone to please stop, and I would handle it. I would then have let the guests take the food and had everyone move on. Yeah, it’s somewhat tacky, but it’s just not that big of a deal.

I hate when hosts berate their guests — or someone, unasked, on behalf of the hosts, and make them feel uncomfortable. If they’re stealing the silver, you handle it discretely. But over some damn leftovers???🙄

The biggest problem here is that the real Judith Martin would have handed down an ironclad verdict with wit and reason.

Her kids writing the column have neither.

R37, I totally agree with you.

[quote]They made a scene, pointing at us and using words like “bumpkins.”

I laughed, even if it does show that EST is not strictly a DataLounge phenomenon.

r17 owns a tux, but has no money for food.

[quote] They made a scene, pointing at us and using words like “puny cocklets."

Fixed it for the letter writers!

[quote]owns a tux

I do now, r41. I got the tux, shirt, tie and black Bally oxfords on eBay. Came out to be just a bit more than if I'd rented.

I would've taken my gift on the way out. (Dung doesn't grow on trees.)

and the second part?

I don't attend weddings unless I am friends with the bride/groom/family, and any of my friends would have happily offered to send a piece of wedding cake to someone who had been invited but was unable to attend at the last minute due to a medical condition.

Nothing in the original post said this was a black-tie affair, so I don't know why people are assuming that. It was a hotel kitchen and staff. They were probably quite used to people requesting doggie bags, and were clearly prepared for it. The request may have been gauche, but it was far from the biggest breach of good manners that day.

I guess Miss Manners couldn't really advocate for this behavior, because then doggie-bagging at weddings would become an epidemic among American pigs.

If it had happened at my wedding, I'd have been appalled that they got called out.

Give everyone take-home cake until it's gone. Who cares? It's going to go to waste otherwise. And guests are essentially "paying for" the meal via their wedding present(s). You spend your money on a gift, you take the time to get dressed up and show up, have an extra piece of damn cake for the road. People think attending a wedding is the height of pleasure—it's actually a huge pain in the ass.

I also wouldn't mind if women discreetly take home the centerpiece of their reception table (another tradition among some).

Who's food-policing wedding guests? I would kick those invitees in the cunt and never associate with them again.

(Although I imagine that the letter-writers weren't held in tremendously high esteem by the marrying couple, being seated at the same table as these judgmental distant relatives.)

[quote]I disagree with that. If it was a mistake, it was an honest one. The context is fair to add.

Absolutely disagree. For an apology to be accepted and the transgression forgiven, you must demonstrate remorse. The prerequisite for demonstrating remorse is accepting full responsibility for the wrong you've committed without equivocation or justification. "Context" in an apology is always intended to mitigate the transgression by suggesting that it was somehow justified or warranted due to the circumstances...or context.

The second you attempt such mitigation, you fail to accept full responsibility for your actions.

Why, I never in all my life, r49.

[quote]The people made a mistake by not being discrete.

Oh, dear.

I would say the doggie baggers didn't necessarily do anything wrong. It's one fucking piece of cake. However, once they saw the reaction to the wrapping up of the steak, I wouldn't have pushed my luck. At the most, I might have just not eaten my piece of cake and taken it home for my daughter if it was that important. Or I would have asked the family of the bride beforehand- So and so really wanted to be here but she's having a difficult pregnancy (whatever the fucking excuse is), we'd love to cheer her up by taking her home a piece of cake.

Nevertheless, they did nothing so egregious as to be treated the way they were.

I would NEVER ask especially at a wedding.

I was informed that African American culture permit the guests to leave with the flowers. False?

Don't pull that doggy bag crap again and you'll be fine. It makes you look poor.

Where do you stand on the centerpieces, r55?

R19- World War One and World War Two were seen as VERY gauche in the United States 🇺🇸.

A real lady keeps Tupperware in her purse for such an occasion.

Or simply lines her purse with foil and clingwrap.

People who are getting married used to understand this, and I don't know why it's changed.

When you're getting married, you are not doing your guests some great favor by inviting them. You are hosting them as if they were at your home.

You are inviting them to your wedding to give you gifts. They are sacrificing for you—paying for the gift, the fare or gas to get there, the child care, the emotional cost of skipping a night of relaxation, etc. You have an obligation to throw a nice reception they will enjoy. "Enjoy" means, at its minimum, not being shamed for asking for one extra fucking piece of cake.

The height of rudeness. Trying g to excuse themselves too! Guess who will be left off the guest list next time!

[quote]They thought you were treating the event like a trip to the midnight cruise buffet.

Best line in the response. Bumpkins gonna bumpk.

Classless and tacky to ask for take away from an event such as a wedding. Very Homer Simpson.

" Each plate could have fed at least four people. It seemed like such a waste that I quietly asked for a doggie bag"

The poor acquaintances or Jewish. Nice they got an invite.

I think this is going to vary significantly across socio-economic tiers.

They're going to throw all the food left on plates away whether a guest takes it or not. Also, other than the top tier of the cake that is usually saved for the bridge and groom by custom, what do they do with a half eaten cake.

While I would never ask, I wouldn't care in the slightest if folks wanted to take food or cake with them as it's likely to be tossed or eaten by catering staff anyway. Now, if people started to put liquor in flasks to take home, that is where I'd draw the line.

[quote]I got the tux, shirt, tie and black Bally oxfords on eBay. Came out to be just a bit more than if I'd rented.

Sounds like somebody went shopping at a Men's Warehouse.