Anne Bancroft

Miss Bancroft on Charlie Rose 04/25/2000

One of my favorite movies is "84 Charring Cross Road."

The Yma Dream

I love, love, love 84 Charing Cross Road, r2. A truly exquisite film.

Loved her as the dope smoking countess in THE HINDENBURG. Bloated bore of a film, made watchable by her presence. She played her as a grand diva.

Bitch!

One of the few performers to win the Oscar, Emmy & Tony Award

Love her but I really don't think she was exactly "classy" in real life. She was earthy and funny and rather vulgar, actually.

Volare...

r7, indeed. By coincidence, I was looking at the list of Triple Crown of Acting winners earlier today -- there are 24 people who have achieved this:

that's just what I was going to say, R8 - the classiness was an act, even the fake name sounded "classy" it's what she wanted to convey.

she did the best English accent I've ever heard an American actress do

sorry, posted the link in the wrong box

I always thought she was classy

Did she get her boobs out on film?

(R2) Totally agree with you.. 84 Charing Cross Road

Fabulous in a little film called Garbo Talks.

She was robbed of the role of Fanny Brice in Funny Girl by Streisand's deceitful intrigues.

Yes, yes - it's all a rich tapestry!!

Her performance in The Pumpkin Eater was at least as good as in The Miracle Worker.

Dyke

"Garbo Talks" is one of my absolute favorite comedies.

Anne is magnificent in it and should have been nominated for an Oscar.

Her grandson looks a bit like her.

[Quote]Her and Mel Brooks always seemed

Oh, dear.

She gives an odd performance in The Girl in Black Stockings.

Seven Women with Mike Mazursky as the barbarian is one of the worst movies ever and she’s shite in it. Her best performance was in Pumpkin Eater and she’s hilarious in To Be or Not to Be. Sorry, Op, her character in Elephant Man didn’t fall in love with Merrick.

Pre-Talkies...

Mrs. Robinson, people!

The Pumpkin Eater

A gritty comedic role in Home for the Holidays with Downey, Jr., as her gay son and Holly Hunter as her daughter.

[quote]Her and Mel Brooks always seemed...

No one is going to say 'oh, dear' about this?

r28, see r23.

I absolutely loved her in almost every. Wonderful actress and always came across in interviews as warm and genuine. I see her son Max and am instantly reminded of her. One of my favorite movies of hers (and Sidney Poitier's) was "The Slender Thread." It seemed to show up on the 4:30 movie out of ABC NYC a lot. She was suicidal and had taken pills and Sidney was on the end of the suicide hotline. But she's at her peak when she's a bitch like Mrs. Robinson and in The Turning Point. R28, OP was "oh, dear"ed at R23

R22, the SON looks like her, not the grandson. Anne had at least one rhinoplasty, probably two.

Mrs. Robinson

Beautiful? No, attractive yes.

My favorite performance is in "Gorilla At Large " from 1954 in 3D!

I saw her in an early tv show Tales of Tomorrow as Anna Italiano.

Is Max Brooks her biological child? She was pretty damn old when he was born.

There is something almost supernatural about her in their remake of "To Be or Not To Be."

I saw The Miracle Worker for the first time in 30 years a few months ago on TCM. She and Patty Duke truly were brilliant in that.

I thought she was very good in ‘night, Mother. A film that really disturbed me.

R2, I agree. That film was wonderful!

She was only forty years old when she got pregnant with Max.

Anne Bancroft is one of the very rare actresses that got better looking with age.

Beautiful no, but she was very attractive and had great appeal.

Her scene in The Elephant Man: "Why your not an elephant man at all" got me.

A male friend of mine thought she was incredibly hot.

I read in Jane Fonda's autobiography that her father Henry disliked acting onstage with Anne because when she cried in a scene she'd get overwrought and snot would drip from her nose, which repulsed Henry.

Loved her in THE TURNING POINT! Without ever dancing a step I totally bought her as an aging prima ballerina.

Unlike some other posters here, however, I found her performances in GARBO TALKS and 84 CHARING CROSS ROAD very hammy and self-indulgent. I think she became impossible to direct in her later films.

[quote]I read in Jane Fonda's autobiography that her father Henry disliked acting onstage with Anne because when she cried in a scene she'd get overwrought and snot would drip from her nose, which repulsed Henry.

I guess Henry wasn't a fan of daughter Jane in Klute (one of my favorite all-time movies).

Henry Fonda wasn't a fan of Jane at all, R46.

Anne Bancroft may not have been classically beautiful, but she was sexy as hell.

Henry Fonda was always an old grouch.

She was the sexiest milf in the history of milfs

I loved her brief scene in the movie Malice. She's always been one of my favorite actresses.

The word is striking, r33.

I think it was William Gibson, r42, who described Anne and Patricia Neal as..."weathered beauties".

She wrote and directed "Fatso". It's actually a charming and funny film.

blimp

The Hindenburg was on TCM a few nights ago. I tried to watch it with happy childhood memories, but they were dashed as it really is boringly awful.

Watched the clip from The Graduate upthread, and I was left wondering how DH ever won one Oscar let alone two. (Yes, I know he did not win an Oscar for Graduate). Totally method in all the worst ways--mumbling, flat affect, and that dull dreary voice.

What, no love for Torch Song Trilogy?

[quote]Henry disliked acting onstage with Anne because when she cried in a scene she'd get overwrought and snot would drip from her nose, which repulsed Henry.

What was his problem?

Turning Point

R12 That whole movie was so disjointed.

The role was intended for the middle aged Patricia Neal so Bancroft looked too young and kardashian to fit the role.

And there were so many more interesting performers in supporting roles which took our attention away from the dysfunctional wife and husband.

Another vote for Gorilla At Large! And her co-star Raymond Burr - guess which one ended up in a gorilla suit?

Always worth a look.

She aged really well. Had that Helen Mirren thing going on where she got sexier as she aged.

[quote]Did she get her boobs out on film?

Are you kidding?

Anne Bancroft and Mel Brooks were lovely when I met them in the mid-1990's.

[Their son, Max, was a student at a college I used to work at. They showed up for commencement like any other parents of graduating seniors and looked around for seats. The development (fund-raising) office had decided – without consulting them – that they had reserved seats up front. They were embarrassed by the attention and insisted on sitting where there were open seats. They ended up directly behind me on an aisle.]

We chatted on and off for an hour or so and they were truly friendly, down to earth, and proud.

Great actress- R17 is full of you know what. She bowed out because she could not sing the score. While others were considered for the role, Jule Styne wrote the score with Streisand as Fanny. He got his way.

I think Seven Women is one of the greatest B movies ever and Bancroft is great in it. Not to mention Margaret Leighton, Mildred Dunnock, Sue Lyon, Flora. Robson etc.

And wasn't the Yma Ulu Abba sketch written by someone of note?

R44 Mr Fonda was pretty in his youth. But I get the feeling that he was quite damaged for the last 60 years of his life.

Where are the inevitable What's My Line? appearances?

[quote] I really don't think she was exactly "classy" in real life.

I think it was a mistake to adopt that pseudo surname.

She looks like an Italiano and she should have traded on that earthy, skinny sexy image rather than a fake something else.

[quote] Seven Women is one of the greatest B movies ever

Another role meant for Patricia Neal.

Bancroft was too young for the role and made the main character incomprehensible. John Ford was obviously close to death because it was set up on a studio set with NO camera movement at all.

I'm with R2. "84 Charing Cross Road" is one of those Art House films that stay with you.

I also liked her as the mother superior in "Agnes of God." She gave a believable turn as a hard-nosed, yet vulnerable, nun.

Helene Hanff's books are short, easy to read, and stay with you. Recommended.

Fatso! “you ate the -ONY!”

[quote] She looks like an Italiano

That is actually her real surname - Anna Marie Italiano

Anne Bancroft is a stage name

I'm sure when she began her acting career in the 1950s she could not only not keep her real last name which was Italiano, but had to choose something very Anglicized to avoid being typed in lowly ethnic supporting roles. She was no Sophia Loren or Gina Lollobrigida.

Thomas Meehan, r66. And she got to act with Marilyn.

Anne Bancroft was only six years younger than Patricia Neal. Patricia Neal was one of those people who always looked older than she was

Exactly. Saw no evidence in the film that the character had to be older than Bancroft was. It's just a lot of fun to watch.

Wasn't "Gorilla at Large" in 3-D or something?

[quote] She was no Sophia Loren or Gina Lollobrigida.

Bancroft would be the first she didn't want to be Sophia or Gina

You're thinking of Kiss Me Kate, r79!

Widmark was hot, and had a great voice.

[quote] Anne Bancroft was only six years younger than Patricia Neal.

Patricia Neal was forced to take a SUPPORTING ROLE while Anne Bancroft had TOP BILLING in The Miracle Worker

[quote]Patricia Neal was forced to take a SUPPORTING ROLE while Anne Bancroft had TOP BILLING in The Miracle Worker

Forced? Did someone tie her down? She played Helen's mother, a supporting role.

Regina

I worked with Mel Brooks, and had many dinners with him and Anne. I know people think they were an odd pairing, but I've honestly never been with any couple who were more in love than they were.

What are your pronouns, OP? You seem to have a problem controlling them, dear.

Sweet Georgia Brown

^ So skinny.

Yet she directed "Fatso."

The leg and hand used in the promotional artwork for “The Graduate” belonged to Linda Gray, later of “Dallas.”

R88 came here to post that. The first movie I saw from either of them (was probably 5 or 6 years old). Wish they had made more movies together.

They were an “odd couple” in the best way. Complemented each other perfectly.

I've posted this story on DL before: many years ago I was working part-time at Theater Row on 42nd Street. One of my jobs (I had several, including working stage door) was to direct the patrons to their theater as they entered the complex. Well, one night Anne Bancroft and Mel Brooks came in to see a play (they were producing it) and I had to point them in the right direction. She looked a bit frail (this was probably not too long before she passed away) but still I told her how lovely she looked and she just lit up -- it appeared to be just what she needed to hear. "Oh, thank you!" she said, smiling. He also smiled, seemingly happy she was happy, and off they went.

I only know of her from Torch Song Trilogy which she amazing in.

[quote] Anne Bancroft was only six years younger than Patricia Neal. Patricia Neal was one of those people who always looked older than she was.

Well, a series of strokes in your 30s will do that to you.

I've read that some people felt she was miscast in Torch Song Trilogy as the Jewish mother, since she was not Jewish. But I think she did a convincing job. If you're married to a Jewish guy for 40 plus years, and you've been in social situations with your Jewish in-laws for all of that time, I would think that any actress worth her salt would be able to find whatever she needed out of her personal experiences. I would have loved to have seen Estelle Getty in that role, since she originated it when it was playing in theaters.

I adore Anne. I always have. saw Miracle Worker as a child and became OBSESSED with her. And, over the decades, she rarely disappointed. Would have loved to have seen her play the Madelaine Kahn role in Young Frankenstein. I believe, she would have nailed it.

Just like with Cloris Leachman, it's curious to associate both of them with hilarity as well as really stark, serious characters. Both were very good at playing things both ways. It's unusual.

Another product of Italian-American New York City, the Bronx to be exact. Have always loved Anne Bancroft; great actress and fine person who never forgot where she came from.

With Perry Como..

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

Jack Lemmon and Anne Bancroft starred in 1975 film "the Prisoner of Second Avenue".

Did Anne Bancroft have any Black ancestry? That picture in the OP suggest so.

The Prisoner of Second Avenue is worth seeing if nothing else for watching an older Jack Lemmon chase and beat down a young (and very handsome) Sylvester Stallone in one of his early film (cameo) appearances.

^You mean like Sicily??

Bancroft on working with Marilyn Monroe in "Don't Bother to Knock."

According to Anne Bancroft, Marilyn disagreed with both Baker and acting coach Natasha Lytess on how to play the final climatic scene, ignoring their advice. “The talent inside that girl was unquestionable,” Bancroft told John Gilmore. “She did it her way and this got right inside me, actually floored me emotionally.”

Does anyone. remember that I accepted. her Oscar—beautifully?

She had the perfect bone structure ,nose and eyebrows for a Crawford bio-pic.

I've always loved her but my husband couldn't stand her. I could never understand why. Fatso is one of my all time favorite movies. It's just good, escapist fun. I use so many lines from it in exchanges with my best friend who also loves it.

Now that you mention it, Joan, I'll never forgive Bancroft for so insensitively humiliating me on that hideous night.

Wait!!! You mean Anne Bancroft gave up attending the Oscars on the night she won so that she could continue appearing in her Broadway show??

[quote]I've read that some people felt she was miscast in Torch Song Trilogy as the Jewish mother, since she was not Jewish.

Heard when, lately? That's ridiculous, and there was no talk at the time that she was miscast. Lee Grant played the part on stage, but she never read 'Jewish' to me though she was in real life. Was James Caan miscast in the Godfather because he was a Jew playing Italian? Other than casting whites as people of other races, which I object to, whether an actor is Italian, Jewish, Irish, Polish has nothing to do with a role if they play it convincingly. That's why they're called ACTORS.

[quote]Her and Mel Brooks always seemed to have a very happy and stable marriage.

Oh, dear.

OP, are you another illiterate college grad? Only a moron would write the beginning of a sentence "Her and Mel Brooks..."

Now try too write it correctly. I'll wait.

TO write it correctly. See, I corrected myself.

[quote]There was no talk at the time that she was miscast. Lee Grant played the part on stage, but she never read 'Jewish' to me though she was in real life.

But there was lots of talk at the time that Bancroft overacted that role in "Torch Song Trilogy" at a cartoon level.

R112, Lee Grant did not play that part on stage. It was Estelle Getty, and a few other actresses as replacements, but not Lee Grant. Where the hell did you get that piece of "information?"

And also, R112, although James Caan did a great job of acting that role in "The Godfather," I would say he was indeed miscast in that he really didn't LOOK Italian, nor did he look like he could have been the brother of Al Pacino and John Cazale. P.S. I'm surprised you didn't mention that Brando also wasn't Italian, but maybe you didn't mention that because some people did indeed question his casting for that reason.

[quote]Lee Grant played the part on stage

Where, r112?

R116, Lee Grant and Peter Falk starred in the play on Broadway in it's original run. Guess you're used to dinner theater versions.

Really great actress. Could always deliver great performances even if the film itself wasn't that great. It reminds me a bit of Kidman in this sense. My favourite performance of hers is definitely The Graduate - she was robbed at the Oscars.

[quote]Lee Grant and Peter Falk starred in the play on Broadway in it's original run. Guess you're used to dinner theater versions.

We were talking about "Torch Song Trilogy," not "The Prisoner of Second Avenue." What are you smoking R118?

YOU are talking about Torch Song Trilogy, R120, "we" weren't.

R112 quoted R96's post, "I've read that some people felt she was miscast in Torch Song Trilogy as the Jewish mother, since she was not Jewish," and then responded: "That's ridiculous, and there was no talk at the time that she was miscast. Lee Grant played the part on stage." So step away from the keyboard, R121.

She picked a great stage name. "Bancroft" sounds like the name of a luxury hotel with thick towels. "The Bancroft."

Mel Brooks was gay? I thought he was oven dodger?

I have posted this story before, my partner's parents were very close to Mel and Anne and saw them frequently. Once when I was staying with them they came by to pick Rob's parents up in a limo and first went to McDonalds (going through the drive through) and then went to a movie together. That is the only story i have personally. Rob has many more.

R125 I assume Rob is your partner?

Yes, his father was a famous doctor in Beverly Hills.

Bob & Rob?

[quote]Did Anne Bancroft have any Black ancestry? That picture in the OP suggest so.

Well, I see the "Italians are really not white" troll has returned. Nazi swine.

Yup. I have posted many stories about Rob and his family. He lived with Ava Gardner in London for a year. Sinatra asked his dad to put Ava back together after she was beaten and they were very close after that. I have also posted about how his mom and dad were close friends with Lucy and Gary Morton. They were members of the same country club and Rob's dad used to golf with Gary a lot.

[quote]r108 She had the perfect bone structure, nose and eyebrows for a Crawford bio-pic.

Yes. Bancroft was initially attached to MOMMIE DEAREST, but dropped out when she didn’t like the script rewrites.

Then Dorothy Faye swooped in with talons outstretched… to her eternal regret.

I saw Estelle Getty in TST a couple of times. She was fabulous. He had already miscast Broderick so he could have a name. He was a grasping shit for not giving the film to Getty. You have no idea what a terrific actor she was if you only know her from GG.

R132 what does Estelle have to do with Anne?

Anne stole Estelle's role from her.

According to Harvey Fierstein biography the casting of Anne Bancroft in Torch Song Trilogy happened like this

The director Paul Bogart had directed Estelle on Golden Girls and felt she wouldn't showcase as well on film, as opposed to TV. Unbeknownst to Harvey he sent the script to Anne Bancroft who loved it and got excited, and then the production company got excited that they had ANNE BANCROFT committed to the film

This was all going on before Estelle was even considered. Harvey doesn't say if he agreed with what happened. All he says is that Estelle was disappointed (who wouldn't be) but remained close until the end of her life

And if anyone asks Harvey his opinion who was better (Estelle or Anne) he tells them that Estelle performance in Torch Song has been preserved at New York Library and that can see her performance and decide for themselves.

Mike Nichols offered Mrs. Robinson to Doris Day before Anne Bancroft. As iconic as Bancroft was, Doris Day was an inspired casting choice. She would have played it differently than Anne, but I suspect she would have been just as memorable (e.g. MTM in Ordinary People).

"Classy," OP????? If you say so.

Prisoner of Second Avenue is Simon at its most annoying, with Lennon mugging all over the place. Bancroft did not redeem that mess.

Is Max Brooks her biological son or is he adopted?

What is not mentioned is that Mel Brooks has children from a previous marriage

The public seems to think Max Brooks is Mel Brooks only child.

Anne Bancroft was peeved that she was passed over for the role Loretta (Cher's mother) in Moonstruck

The excuse was that her fee was too high, but Bancroft says that is hogwash. If they came to her and said they had no money, she would work for scale,

There was no discussion or no negotiation, as the next thing she knew Olympia Dukakis was cast in the role.

Somewhere Estelle Getty is thinking "Poetic Justice"

When I was young I studied acting with Sanford Meisner. One of the assignments was to do something you’d never done or would do in front of others. The teacher that was in charge of that particular class told us that when Anne Bancroft was a student. Her choice was to masturbated in front of the class, successfully I might add. She came in front of everyone. No, she was not demure. He also said everyone knew even then she would be a success as she was the best in the class, at acting too. He also said she was extremely likeable and daring in her acting choices, obviously, lol.

I’m probably the only one here to mention Bancroft’s appearance in “Demetrius and the Gladiators “ (1954). She’s memorable as one of several women, provided as “entertainment” for the gladiators the night before their fight in the arena. She’s wry and almost funny, as she tries to make small talk with stalwart condemned Christian Victor Mature.

It’s curious to see her in these early roles, because she never seems to really belong. Her humble courtesan here seems more like a hanger-on at a cocktail party. I don’t think Hollywood knew what to do with her. Which helped, because she ended up going back to New York, and greatness.

It should be mentioned that Bancroft's TURNING POINT co-star Shirley MacLaine stole the role of Jewish waif Gittel Mosca in the film of TWO FOR THE SEESAW, which made Anne Bancroft a bankable Broadway star and led to Bancroft securing the role of Annie Sullivan in THE MIRACLE WORKER, also written by SEESAW playwright William Gibson. Arthur Penn, who directed both plays, had to be convinced by Gibson that Bancroft could pull off the role of Sullivan who couldn't have been more different from Gittel.

Of course, all DLers will know that when TWO FOR THE SEESAW was turned into a big Broadway musical in 1973, Lainie Kazan was cast as Gittel but fired out of town and replaced by Michelle Lee who made a huge success for herself.

I wonder if MacLaine and Bancroft ever discussed TWO FOR THE SEESAW. Though MacLaine might have gotten some of the waif part right, she could never be believed as Jewish. Robert Mitchum played the role of the married Midwestern businessman opposite MacLaine that Henry Fonda created on Broadway. I'm not sure how Bancroft won the role of Gittel initially as she was not a star of Fonda's caliber then and it was a 2 character play.

WML?

One of my top 5 actresses. I could watch Miracle Worker, Graduate, Prisoner of Second Avenue and Night Mother on an endless loop and not get bored.

"Two for the Seesaw" was a big box office flop in 1962, particularly for director Robert Wise, who had just won an Oscar for "West Side Story." Bancroft dodged a bullet, getting her Oscar for "The Miracle Worker" instead that same year.

[quote] I wonder if MacLaine and Bancroft ever discussed TWO FOR THE SEESAW

Anne Bancroft is not one to rehash history - she likes to look forward not remise about the past

That is why she never wrote an autobiography or appear on "The Actors Studio"

R148 but she appeared on Charlie Rose?

R149 which was RARE - if you look there is hardly any interview with her - unless she was promoting a movie

and her chat with Charlie Rose came in her later years

R144, casting MacLaine in the film Two for the Seesaw made the character "acceptable" since an obviously Jewish woman as a romantic lead in a 1962 was way too much for the movies at the time. That is, too much for studio execs, audiences probably would have loved it.

R150 Yes it was, even he said it was rare. This was the Virgo in her. She did not like to be the center of attention or do live performances.

You can tell she was the introvert and Mel was the extrovert.

Wonder if she ever flirted with doing a musical after the Funny Girl discussions.

She did a TV Special...

[quote]This was the Virgo in her

My cousin is a Virgo, and she craves attention from EVERYONE and will do anything to get it! Anything.

Good looking? Beautiful? Don't quibble. She was louche and earthy and well made and DIVINE.

Her voice and mannerisms are so memorable that people sometimes forget what a great PHYSICAL actress she was. I totally can see her mastubating as an acting excercise. Her movement and positions in The Miracle Worker, Agnes or God, The Turning Point, Torch Song Trilogy and To Be Or Not To Be are such a great part of her performance. She lives in the character's body. Fascinating to watch. She could transform from an old bent women, to a slattern, to face pulling and then BE the most glamorous creature.

Her name doesn't come up near enough when people speak of Great Actresses.

[quote] Bancroft would be the first she didn't want to be Sophia or Gina

Anna Maria Italiano was too skinny to compete with them. But Anna Maria Italiano could have had a decent US career alongside with Pier Angeli, Anna Magnani, Elsa Martinelli, Marisa Pavan, Milly Vitale, Rossano Brazzi, and Anthony Franciosa.

The fake surname "Bancroft" is as inappropriate as Margarita Cansino adopting the fake surname "Hayworth".

How absolutely lovely she is in her WML appearance! Kind of a sweet beatnik vibe to her look.

And Dorothy does have on her white satin plush mask.

[quote]The director Paul Bogart had directed Estelle on Golden Girls and felt she wouldn't showcase as well on film, as opposed to TV

Paul Bogart was the original permanent director of the Golden Girls. But Betty and him did not get along well at all and clashed so much during the handful of episodes he directed that she went to Witt, Thomas and Harris and told them that she couldn't work with him. Not wanting to lose Betty, Bogart was fired and Terry Hughes brought in.

I can't help but think that Bogart's decision might have been influenced by how he was treated on The Golden Girls. Especially since Estelle had already done three motion pictures at that point, two of which she had sizeable roles in and were hits at the box office. His excuse really doesn't hold much water.

"Yes, Miss Kilgallen, I do work in the legitimate theater."

My sister went to a posh high school in Pasadena that was an old mansion that had been donated to the nuns. The property was rented out frequently for movie/TV shows. Mel Brooks was filming a remake of To Be or Not To Be there during a school break. My sister was taking an intesive gourmet cooking class in the mansion's kitchen and told me to get over there. I rode my bike over and Mel and Anne stopped by and hung out with us. We were in awe, they were equally stunned at my sister and her friends - and the school in general. A different world.

I thought her directorial debut "Fatso" was a funny, amusing movie, but critics hated it. REALLY hated it. I'm not sure why. Seems like they had a grudge against her for being a woman who dared to direct a film.

What were the 3 films (2 of which were hits?!) that Estelle made before Torch Song, r159? I have no memory of them.

R163 Mask & Mannequin

As OP's picture shows, Annie looked much better after the nose job.

^ But the nose became more prominent in her latter years as the flesh sagged on her cheeks.

She never had a nose job

I believe I read the weekend after the stage production of The Miracle Worker opened both Bancroft and Duke took off because they had location bridal showers to go to. It was agreed upon with the producers in advance who were more than happy to allow them time to be with friends at such an important time in their friends' lives.

R159, Paul Bogart (real name, Bogof) was also the parent of Jennifer Bogart who lived off and on, and was married twice, to DL fave and ex-Babs husband, Elliott Gould. In the 1980s she left him for another woman.

Bogof is an unfortunate name.

Because they all were fat, R162.

Anne never had a nose job. Check out the WML clip from 1962. Is that supposedly before or after said nose job?

Yeah, I don't buy that Estelle wouldn't translate to motion pictures. She was more than adequate in Mask, and she was the least of the problems of the piece of excrement that was Stop or My Mom Will Shoot!

I think Bogart deliberately snubbed Estelle out of hurt feelings. Bea was pissed that he was let go, and for those who worked on Golden Girls this incident was what supposedly started her rift with Betty.

[quote]Anne never had a nose job.

HA HA HA! You must VERY blind, R172. Simply compare this to OP's original pic. If you can't see one or TWO nose jobs, see an optometrist.

She co-starred with Sissy Spacek in the film version of the play "'night, Mother." I liked movie, but Bancroft was really wrong for the role of the mother. Sissy Spacek was fine, but Bancroft seemed really unsuited for that role. The mother was, as described in the play, "chatty and nosy", but Bancroft played her as way too energetic and manic. A younger Geraldine Page would have been much better casting.

[quote]Mike Nichols offered Mrs. Robinson to Doris Day before Anne Bancroft.

Apparently, this oft-repeated story has been debunked. You can keep repeating it if you wish, or you could do some research and learn the truth:

"Just finished reading a fascinating article about the making of "The Graduate." According to the film's producer, Larry Turman, Doris never had a chance to even reject the role of Mrs. Robinson. Here's the direct quote from this 2008 feature:

"Larry Turman had a slew of actresses under consideration for the now iconic role of Mrs. Robinson: Patricia Neal, Geraldine Page, Deborah Kerr, Lana Turner, Susan Hayward, Rita Hayworth, Shelley Winters, Eva Marie Saint, Ingrid Bergman, and Ava Gardner. He also gave a copy of Webb’s novel to Doris Day’s husband and manager, Martin Melcher. “I sent him the book, but he hated it—he thought it was dirty—and wouldn’t even pass it along to her,” he recalls.

That's quite the range of actresses, r176.

The very idea of Doris Day is laughable. What a disaster that would have been.

Anyone who believes or believed Doris Day, America's sweetheart who went from innocent young girl to respectable society matron, wife and mother was going to play part of an sexually aggressive middle aged woman who actively seduces and beds a young man on screen wants their head examined. It just never was going to happen.

Doris Day never could pull off a scene like one shown in linked clip. Audiences would be howling mad at such filth! Doris Day sitting on a chair with her legs open, smoking and admitting she was an alcoholic?

From start to finish Anne Bancroft had Mrs. Robinson down to the ground. She understood the character in ways just don't think Doris Day ever could.

I can't believe with all this talk of Mrs. Robinson that nobody has mentioned Lucy was the first choice of director Nichols. Perhaps because Ball was more famous for turning down the Angie Dickinson role in Dressed to Kill people forget that she was Hollywood's first choice for roles for 'women of a certain age', well into the 1980s but frequently backed out at the last minute.

Lucille Ball as "Mrs. Robinson"? Whoever was behind that idea ought to have been shot.

[quote] Doris Day…who actively seduces and beds a young man

The ideas is ludicrous, especially if Hoffman was playing the young man.

Doris Kappelhoff was a proud Germanic Aryan who worshipped Good Health and would never touch a weedy Hoffman.

Anne Bancroft wrote and directed film "Fatso", and it was brilliant on many levels.

Using a main cast made up of largely Italian-Americans it is a memorable and funny slice of old Greenwich/West Village (which historically were heavily Irish and Italian areas), and of course focus on the family.

Even when her brother eats all the Chinese food, destroys her son's (his nephew's) birthday cake. Antoinette may yell, scream and even whack her brother a few, but she never stops loving him.

Would have loved to see Anne Bancroft as Rose Castorni.

In interviews Olympia Dukakis said upon being cast for role she had major doubts. "I'm a housewife from New Jersey, I don't know about being Italian" or words to effect was her worry. Julie Bovasso told her not to worry, and from first script reading onward coached Ms. Dukakis on being "Italian".

Have strong hunch Anne Bancroft wouldn't have done Rose Castorni as such a long and quietly suffering wife. There would have been some screaming and few choice words in there somewhere.

There was no way Doris Day would have played Mrs. Robinson anyway. This was barely a year after The Glass Bottomed Boat; it's not like she was looking to remake her image for some long-overdue comeback.

She was a gorgeous woman. My father had quite a thing for her.

The nude scene in The Graduate was done by a body double which she confirms in the Rose interview though she had planned on doing it herself. The moment came and she said no. Nichols was angry but she didn't care and they were too along with shooting for him to do anything about it. Nichols makes it work in the editing.

If Doris Day were first choice why didn't he then ask Audrey Hepburn, Julie Andrews. Sally Anne Howes and Carol Burnett?

I agree that it's highly unlikely Doris Day would ever have accepted the role of Mrs. Robinson at that point in her career, BUT....if she had accepted it, I think she might have been brilliant. It's sad and surprising that a lot of people still don't give her full credit for being the excellent, versatile actress she was. And as for audiences not accepting her in the role, I expect that anyone who would have gone to see THE GRADUATE in the first place would have been inclined to accept her in the role and fully support her for such a bold change of pace.

R161

That would be the Dr. Charles H. Strub mansion "Marshallia".

Dr. Charles and Vera Strub IIRC never actually lived in the mansion, they purchased the property and promptly donated to the order Society of the Holy Child Jesus. Nuns had space issues with their then current property and thus needed to expand, but zoning and other issues prevented. So in stepped the good Dr. Strub...

Who is spreading this BS about Doris Day as Mrs Robinson, the fans? The same kind of fans that say drugged out by 1967 Judy Garland was also a choice?

Even funnier, consider Doris as Mrs Robinson and Robert Redford as Benjamin. That's actually true - Redford WANTED the role according to Mike Nichols. He was rejected. But Redford likes to tell it the other way around, that Nichols wanted him and he rejected it. Hmmm.

Marshall mansion, Pasadena was actually built by Charles K. Eagle, a wealthy silk merchant who came to a very sad end.

Since we're on the subject of implausible casting, how about Olivia de Havilland for Mrs. Robinson and Warren Beatty for Benjamin?

Or Anouk Aimée and Terence Stamp?

Or Rita Moreno and Troy Donovan?

^ OR Totie Fields and Elvis?

Geraldine Page? She was fine for that crazy nympho in "Sweet Bird of Youth" but Mrs. Robinson wouldn't have worked with someone who chewed scenery like a crazed wolverine.

Eva Marie Saint would have been interesting---the slightly icy cool blonde would have been a great take on the part. I always figured that if they really considered Doris Day, they should have thought about Donna Reed---not as big a star, but she'd played a mother for years, had a brittle distant quality in her better roles, and was giving vent to all the bullshit she'd taken from male studio people, sponsors, etc. when after her show was cancelled and she became a peace activist.

[quote]Since we're on the subject of implausible casting, how about Olivia de Havilland for Mrs. Robinson and Warren Beatty for Benjamin?

Warren Beatty would certainly have been closer in type to the role of Benjamin as written in the novel than Hoffman was, but Beatty tended to come across as very self-possessed on screen, and I don't imagine he would have been able to play the comedy as well.

My dream cast:

Vivian Vance and Bob Denver

Has anyone here read the original book of The Graduate? I'd be curious to know how Mrs. Robinson is written.

Perhaps she's more of an All-American former cheer leader type in the novel? Less of the dark, disturbed Dragon Lady of Bancroft (who I think is unsurpassable btw).

Didn't she stop doing theater at the end of the 60s altogether except for one play Golda's Balcony which seems to for some reason have had a short run?

The actress who played her in Feud: Bette vs Joan was nothing like her. Way too bland and white bread.

Feud was awful, although occasionally I could suspend belief and buy Sarandon as Davis.

Many here have seen this already, I’m sure, but young Patty Duke bratted out when Suzanne Pleshette took over for Bancroft in The Miracle Worker, and had to be practically thrown across the stage before she’d behave.

I love Anne Bancroft but I think Dukakis was perfection as Rose, particularly because she did not scream and yell. It's a gorgeous performance.

Apparently one of the main reasons Ball turned down Nichols' offer was because of the nude scene, she thought it would be full frontal and she was not prepared to do that. When she saw the finished product she regretted not agreeing to do it, which is why she was so keen on doing the Dickinson part in Dress to Kill, and told DePalma she was a-okay with the nudity that role required. As it turns out, she was counselled not to take the part for other reasons.

Nudity wasn’t a problem for Ball when she campaigned to be in “Deep Throat”.

Fucking hypocrite.

IBDB says she did "Duet for One" with Max von Sydow for a couple of weeks in 1982. Twenty years later she was in previews of Edward Albee's "Occupant" as the sculptor Louise Nevelson, but contracted pneumonia before the premiere and was unable to return to open the play. Al Hirschfeld sketched her in that role.

WIlliam Daniels (who was only 10 years older than Hoffman, but played his father in "The Graduate") said Paramount wanted Redford for the lead, but Nichols insisted on Hoffman. Daniels said Hoffman joked to him that Daniels was getting paid more than he was; he said Hoffman wisely turned down a three-picture contract with Paramount at a low salary, and was then paid a small fortune for "John and Mary" after "The Graduate" became a box office smash.

Elliott Gould looked sexy in the picture in r169's post.

[quote]I love Anne Bancroft but I think Dukakis was perfection as Rose, particularly because she did not scream and yell. It's a gorgeous performance.

Agreed. And my guess is that if Bancroft had done it, there would have been a LOT of screaming and yelling.

“We just did the scene in bed and he was as hard as a rock. Short Jewish guys....”

Anne on Dustins ardent acting.

[Quote]“We just did the scene in bed and he was as hard as a rock. Short Jewish guys....”

So THAT'S why she married Mel Brooks!

Well as the former wife of the above mentioned Elliott Gould inquired of a young man interviewing her in 2012.

“Why are all Jewish boys so horny?”

According to Frank Langella, she was a Narcissistic cunt. There, somebody had to say it.

And Langella is such a bastion of grace and integrity!

She became a famous actress, so of course she was narcissistic. Frank Langella accusing anyone else of narcissism is hiLARious.

Langella, always looking in the mirror.

Olympia Dukakis was perfection as Rose, as noted above. With the right director, Bancroft could have also turned in an outstanding Oscar-worthy performance, but a different one. Both great actresses.

"Old man, you give those dogs another piece of my food and I'll kick you till you're dead!"

Helen Lawson went on a week long acid trip when Nichols rejected her for the role of Mrs. Robinson. When she snapped out of it, she was married to a Black Panther and had “honky bitch got some good pussy” tattooed on her left buttock.

But he smells real BAD, R209.

R207 That looks like an accurate portrait of the septuagenerian Anna Maria Italiano.

The sunken cheeks and the nose and jaw— well they're just a little too long for the face.

Accurate portrait of R221

Doris Day was a good actress. I think if she had played Mrs. Robinson she would have done a great job. It would have been so fantastic to see her in a role so completely different from what she usually did.

I read it when I was 11 or 12, r199. I don't really remember much at all. I was staying overnight at a friend's house. His (much) older sister saw me and said I probably shouldn't be reading that book.

From the list above, I think Lana Turner would have been interesting as Mrs. Robinson, especially for the contrast with Dustin Hoffman.

[Quote]Doris Day was a good actress. I think if she had played Mrs. Robinson she would have done a great job. It would have been so fantastic to see her in a role so completely different from what she usually did.

Perhaps, but I don't think moviegoers would've appreciated the movie very much had she starred in it. They either would've been appalled, or would've laughed inappropriately.

[quote] Doris Day … It would have been so fantastic to see her in a role so completely different from what she usually did.

Yes, and it would have been so fantastic to see George Arliss dance with a Hula-Hoop. Or Veronica Lake play Lady Macbeth. Or Lassie sing Verdi.

Lassie's Violetta was transcendent, r227.

It would've been like Kaye Ballard, Jo Anne Worley, or Rose Marie in that role. I'm sure all three would've done a very good job, but the audience never would've appreciated the movie in the same way they did with Anne Bancroft.

Day's movie days were numbered, if not over. She would not have been an asset and "playing against type" tends to work only if you're a supporting actress playing a prostitute.

Dodo Day was not sexy and could not play sexy. She had a nice ass though.

[quote] Dodo Day was not sexy

Dodo was sexy for some hetero men. She the All-American/All-German Woman. She admired strength, good health and good teeth. She was a slightly-less angry version of Frau Maria Von Trapp.

She had a good vocal range but very a LIMITED range as a thespian.

R223, go home. Just go home.

[quote]Dodo was sexy for some hetero men

R232 REACHING...REACHING

Dodo was top box office for decade.

But this man was much more pretty!

[quote] Yes, and it would have been so fantastic to see George Arliss dance with a Hula-Hoop. Or Veronica Lake play Lady Macbeth. Or Lassie sing Verdi.

I guess you're trying to be funny but it's obvious you're just an ass. At any rate, Doris Day could have tackled dramatic roles and done well with them, but was pigeon-holed into doing almost exclusively comedic fluff. There ARE comedic actors who do drama equally well. John Candy could. Tony Curtis, known for lightweight fare, could. Doris Day could have too. So fuck off.

[quote] Doris Day could have tackled dramatic roles…

How was this?

[quote]She was a slightly-less angry version of Frau Maria Von Trapp

Yes, r232...

R229: Kaye Ballard or Joanne Worley probably would have had the role if it had played the straw hat circuit. With Paul Lynde in the William Daniels role and John Davidson as Benjamin.

Dodo Day had no interest in doing more challenging or provocative roles. Her place in film history is exactly as it should be. She got what she wanted. And it was mostly PAP and CRAP. Doris was also slightly hideous looking. Bad everything. Take her from behind.

As a singer - she should be much better remembered. Extremely gifted.

Doris Day was terrible in dramas, just check out Midnight Lace and Julie. And she isn't much better in The Man Who Knew Too Much and Love Me or Leave Me, imho,

Day was the perfect age for Mrs Robinson. Much more so than Miss Italiano. She was an excellent actress who could go from dark drama to sunny musical comedy. Like how many could do that? Besides Judy.

As for Bancroft's SUPPOSED nose job, please compare her young face IN MOTION in the clip at r76 and in the Charlie Rose interview, late in life, at r1.

I see the SAME nose and, no, I'm not blind, r174. Still photos can be very deceiving, what with studio photography and particular angles.

Judy who? Judy fucked up twitchy mumbling Garland? Someone here really dislikes Anne Bancroft.

Because Judy Garland and Doris Days were singers. Who had film careers. One of them could act. When she was young. Neither were sexy. Neither could have played Mrs. Robinson. Are you on crack R242? Garland would have loved crack, to be honest.

Doris Day had a nice crack. Edith Head said it was the best in the business.

Lots of better actresses were Day's age, including some of the ones already named. Bancroft was never an ingenue and basically a character actress, so she could play older and unconventional roles more easily than someone like the terminally perky Doris. Someone a little icy or brittle around the edges like Eva Marie Saint might have been good. Ava Gardner was a bit lazy as an actress and its easy to expect her to be predatory. I can't believe that they'd taken Turner seriously---she's too obvious a seductress and a limited actress.

Lana Turner would have insisted on a Jean Louis wardrobe and god knows who to supply her jewels.

[quote] Doris Day was terrible in dramas,

No, she wasn't. You just can't stand seeing her in anything different from comedy roles. That's very shallow.

R245 Good analysis.

R233, fuck off. Just go fuck off.

"Her and Mel Brooks..."

Oh dear.

Her and Mel Brooks has been repeated and oh deared so often it's beginning to sound correct.

Annie sings Cole

^ What are those big heads in that clip? Lee J Cobb?

Lana Turner=Plastic

The late Doris May Kappelhoff was an excellent example of strong Aryan Womanhood— quite similar to this later Aryan woman named Haack.

The cut out heads were of Bancroft's co-stars in the TV special, including Lee J. Cobb (whom she had also acted with in "Gorilla at Large"). She won an Emmy for that TV special in 1970.

Thank you, R256, I recognised Lee J. Cobb but not the other ones.

Doris was one of the most talented singers ever. She also had a lot of pain and struggle throughout her life. Despite that, she had a good heart, which is hard to encounter in Hollywood. At a time when gay people were oppressed beyond belief, they identified with her struggles and she theirs.

R142: Sure, Jan.

I’m quite the Carroll Baker fan, but even I was puzzled to see she was on the initial list of actresses considered for the role of Elaine in The graduate. She was 35 or something!

[quote] Shortly after hiring Nichols, Larry Turman started a wish list for the roles of Benjamin Braddock and Elaine Robinson. For “Elaine,” he wrote, “Natalie Wood, Ann-Margret, Jane Fonda, Tuesday Weld, Carroll Baker, Sue Lyon, Lee Remick, Suzanne Pleshette, Carol Lynley, Elizabeth Ashley, Yvette Mimieux, Pamela Tiffin, Patty Duke, Hayley Mills.” Under the “Ben” column, he listed “Warren Beatty, Steve McQueen, Bob Redford, [George] Peppard, George Hamilton, Tony Perkins, Keir Dullea, Brandon De Wilde, Michael Parks.”

I can’t see Patricia Neal as a ballerina.

^ I'm surprised at that WASPY list.

I watched the movie recently and I couldn't separate the Hebraic actor playing Ben and the Hebraic director (whose real name is Igor Peschkowsky).

They look like siblings.

Dustin Hoffman is such an ugly man. And annoying. He couldn't pull his usual bullshit with Anne Bancroft. Good.

She's always been one of my favorites, one of those striking, talented actresses of the 1950s-80s who aren't much remembered anymore.

As to her beauty--my mother was often told she looked like Anne Bancroft, which I understood as a great compliment. They both have/had a kind of beauty that ages well--strong nose, good bone structure.

Debbie Reynolds could have played Mrs. Robinson. Seriously.

No one was ever going to believe Doris Day as "Mrs. Robinson". Elizabeth Taylor? Susan Hayward? Perhaps, but that speaks to the character. You just cannot picture Doris Day being a slut and barfly, it doesn't work.

Since we're throwing around names, Lee Remick who goes from nice girl to alcoholic tramp in "Days of Wine and Roses", now there might have been a more distinct possibility.

Accepting the Oscar for Liz.

That hair toss moment when she steps on stage , side eyeing the audience and going from nervous resting bitch-face to flashing a smile- very Crawford-ish.

^ Marvin refers to Taylor and the Redgraves as 'girls'.

People still remember Doris Day. Who remembers Anne Bancroft?

"Who remembers Anne Bancroft?"

Obviously at least 200 some odd posters to this thread. So there!

Besides it isn't to compare the two as Doris Day began as successful Big Band singer, then became an actress during what was left of Golden Age of Hollywood days. With the studio system still working in full force Doris Day had an entire machine behind her that wasn't always there for Anne Bancroft.

AB OTOH was a method actor who began in film but soon went over to theatre, something Doris Day never did. Anne Bancroft took work where she found it and often did interesting projects from television to stage and screen. Doris Day detested television, and only did so detested because her then husband an advisors signed her up.

By 1960's Doris Day was considered the "world's oldest virgin" and her box office numbers began to slide. Yes she still was popular with her generation and those above, but younger folks found her increasingly a relic from their parent's era.

Doris Day was offered Mrs. Robinson, but turned it down finding script "vulgar and offensive". So tell me how was she supposed to have been a good choice for role, as many here suggest, when Doris Day found entire project distasteful.

Doris Day was a singer who got lucky in movies. She was a natural actress in most of her roles. I like that she didn't want to be challenged and went with what worked for her. Screen history is littered with the bodies of actors who were never content and insisted they were better than what they were given.

[quote]I see the SAME nose

Calm down, R243. Getting a nose job is not a crime nor indicative of a lack of character, more actors that you know have had a little nose work done. Anne Bancroft had a little work done on her nose. They removed some cartilage from the tip making it thinner.

Reynolds would have been as poor a fit as Day. Non-acting Pamela Tiffin would have been all wrong for Elaine. Patty Duke and Tuesday Weld would have been too weird as people. She clearly needed to be a schiksa Goddess who was more rebellious than she looked.

Anyone know why Bancroft accepted for Taylor? Was it the Virginia Woolf/Graduate Mike Nichols connection? And where was Taylor—sick, again?

Richard Burton was also up for an Oscar that year, but racked with insecurities feared he wouldn't win, and didn't want to be sitting in audience with egg on his face. So Mr. Burton decamped for Paris, France before the ceremony and La Liz went with her husband as a big "fuck you" to the Academy.

More

Near as one can figure out Anne Bancroft accepted Taylor's Oscar because La Liz asked her to do so.

On another note, while we're talking about film "The Graduate", no one mentions Mrs. Robinson was rocking some serious jewelry. That giant marquise diamond engagement ring for a start.

Mrs. Robinson may have been a bored Beverly Hills wife, but she wasn't a fool.

How was her nun a lead in Agnes of God? That's really fucking stretching it.

Really, all those actors named on lists, but only Bancroft and especially Hoffman could accomplish the interplay of sophisticated sexual comedy in their scenes. And that was the genius of Mike Nichols, that he always understood the essential comedic style needed, not unlike scenes he wrote and performed 10 years earlier with Elaine May.

As for Katherine Ross, I think Nichols also understood that he needed a beautiful shiksa cypher, not an actress with an established star presence or personality like Natalie Wood, Tuesday Weld, et. al. Someone entirely new for the audience to discover was helpful in the casting of Elaine.

And really, it was the relative newness of Hoffman, Ross and even Bancroft (playing comedy at that point in her career) that was one of the original pleasures of the film.

The mind boggles at The Graduate with Doris Day, Robert Redford and Natalie Wood.

R278, I saw the play with Geraldine Paige playing the mother superior, and she was great. Elizabeth Ashley played the shrink, fine too. Though I like both Jane Fonda and Bancroft, I don't think it worked - them or the play on film. I can't fault the actors for it.

Anne Bancroft was a ballsy woman. That's why she was so right for Mrs. Robinson.

Sweet, demure and pure Doris Day aggressively sexually pursuing a young man, actively making sure she gets her rocks off in bed, then dropping the kid like *that*? How does that work?

Even when paired with Rock Hudson Doris Day always looked like the type of woman who if she had five minutes of hard loving, and then a cold glass of water she'd pass out.

[quote] Non-acting Pamela Tiffin would have been all wrong for Elaine.

I agree Tiffin would've been all wrong as Elaine, but she showed promise early in her career -- she has some very funny bits keeping up with old pros James Cagney and Arlene Francis in One, Two, Three (1961).

Put me down also as a Doris Day fan: agree she would not have worked as Mrs. Robinson, but Doris DID have an innate comedic ability combined with a dazzling charisma. She has a drunk scene in That Touch of Mink (1962) that is one of the funniest bits of that type I've ever seen.

I read Mel's memoir (which is a love letter to Anne and to Madeline Kahn) and he tells the following story about their first date:

He was poor and she was doing OK as a working Broadway actress. He said "I want to take you to dinner, but I have no money."

She said "Here, I'll give you $20. Take me out to dinner with that."

They go to a Chinese restaurant and order up a storm. In those days, Chinese food was cheap so the big dinner came to not that much. Mel, in the Big Spender mode, gave them the $20 and said "Keep the change."

Outside the restaurant, Anne smacked him. "Don't be so fucking generous with my money."

Mel was in love.

R280 I saw Agnes of God on Broadway also. Don't forget Ammanda Plummer

R282 I can actually see Tiffin as Elaine. Elaine was basically a pushover.

The Graduate with Doris Day, Robert Redford and Natalie Wood would have been a big hit.

Um, r286, The Graduate with Anne Bancroft, Dustin Hoffman, and Katharine Ross WAS a big hit: The Graduate was released on December 21, 1967, to critical and commercial success, grossing $104.9 million, becoming the highest-grossing film of 1967 worldwide. Adjusted for inflation (as of 2021), the film's gross is $857 million, making it the 23rd highest-ever grossing film in North America with inflation taken into account.

[quote]The Graduate with Doris Day, Robert Redford and Natalie Wood would have been a big hit.

The Graduate with Doris Day, Robert Redford and Natalie Wood would have been a big TV SHOW

Anne Bancroft and Jane Fonda; two actresses at top of their game in "Agnes of God".

^ One actress at the top of her game. And Jane Fonda.

Official short list for Ben Braddock:

Warren Beatty Beatty was a leading contender for the role of "Benjamin Braddock" but declined due to the filming of Bonnie and Clyde.

Yul Brynner Yul Brynner was considered for the role of Mr. Braddock.

Karen Carpenter Mike Nichols approached the singer for the role of Elaine Robinson.

Joan Collins Joan Collins wanted to play Elaine Robinson.

Brandon De Wilde Brandon De Wilde auditioned to play Benjamin.

Keir Dullea Was offered the role of Benjamin Braddock.

Robert Duvall Robert Duvall was considered for the role of Benjamin Braddock.

Sally Field Turned down for role of Elaine Robinson in The Graduate.

Jane Fonda Jane Fonda not only turned down the part of Mrs Robinson, but also Elaine.

Harrison Ford A relatively unknown Harrison Ford almost got the role of Benjamin Braddock.

Ava Gardner Ava Gardner flew in for an interview, but reportedly was drunk at the interview and they withdrew offer.

Charles Grodin Charles Grodin turned down the role of Benjamin Braddock because the money wasn't right.

Gene Hackman Hackman was originally cast as Mr. Robinson, Elaine's father, but was replaced fter a few weeks when Mike Nichols decided he was too young for the part.

George Hamilton George Hamilton wanted to play the role of Benjamin.

Goldie Hawn Goldie Hawn screen tested for the role of Elaine.

Susan Hayward Susan Hayward was the first choice for the role of Mrs. Braddock.

Angela Lansbury Angela Lansbury auditioned to play Mrs. Robinson.

Steve McQueen Steve McQueen was considered for the role of Benjamin Braddock.

Yvette Mimieux Yvette Mimieux was in the running for the role of Elaine.

Patricia Neal Patricia Neal turned down the role of Mrs. Robinson around the time that she had her stroke.

Jack Nicholson Jack Nicholson was considered for the role of Benjamin Braddock.

Geraldine Page Geraldine Page turned down the role of Mrs. Robinson.

George Peppard Was a contender for the role of Benjamin Braddock.

Anthony Perkins Anthony Perkins was looked for the role of Benjamin Braddock.

Robert Redford Robert Redford was considered for the lead role but was considered too "stable" in his personality.

Lee Remick Lee Remick was considered for the role of Elaine.

Burt Ward Burt Ward was the director's first choice for BB, got the role after auditioning, but was locked into the Batman TV show and the studio producing the show wouldn't let him film the movie even though they weren't shooting episodes of Batman at the time.

Shelley Winters Shelley Winters was considered for the role of Mrs. Robinson.

Natalie Wood Wood tested for the role of Elaine.

Candice Bergen Bergen auditioned for the role of Elaine

That's basically a who's who of Hollywood c. 1966, r291. Not a believable list of anything to do with The Graduate.

Also, Pamela Tiffin always came off as an air head on film, sort of a prettier version of Paula Prentiss. Neither would have been good casting Elaine.

Sorry to disappoint you Mr. Know It All, but every single name is true.

Just "google" particular name along with "The Graduate" and should bring up various sources confirming.

Burt Ward really, really *really* wanted to do the Graduate, but suits at Batman said "no", and wouldn't budge. So that was that and it was back to square one looking for another actor to play lead role.

How would Karen Carpenter even have been on Mike Nichols' radar given she graduated high school in the spring of 1967, when The Graduate was already filming?

Karen Carpenter was a two bagger and had all the sensitivity of day old velveeta. And she was FAT.

"Day told her autobiographer, A. E. Hotchner, that when Mike Nichols offered her the role of Mrs. Robinson in The Graduate, she turned it down because she could not see herself rolling around in the sheets with a young man half her age whom she had seduced. “I realized it was an effective part,” she said, . . . “but it offended my sense of values” (Hotchner 232–233)."

Page 26 of link below

Cannot explain where or how Karen Carpenter's name crops up, but it does.

Rest of bucket list is pretty consistent, and if it sounds like a "Who's Who" of Hollywood, what of it? Casting a major motion picture normally involves leaving no stone unturned.

Can see Candice Bergen as Elaine. Miss. Bergen was young and beautiful in 1960's/1970's. A perfect example of an American young woman.

I spoke with an actress who worked with Bancroft in 'The Devils' in 1965; she described her as "warm, generous, and funny" which is the same thing I heard from an actor who appeared in her television special 'Annie: The Women in the Life of a Man' in 1970.

She was one of many actresses who turned down Nurse Ratched in 'Cuckoo's Nest,' which is a shame as I think she would have been perfect and likely won a well-deserved second Oscar.

My favorite performance of hers is 'The Pumpkin Eater,' in which she is astounding as a wife experiencing an emotional collapse. Wonderful, versatile actress with an outstanding presence.

For those that never bothered to read novel, the original Braddock family were old California WASPs. Benjamin Braddock was a tall blonde/blue eyed All American surfer type. You can see going there how Candice Bergen would fit as Elaine and Doris Day as Mrs. Robinson.

What happened was what often does; Nichols changed horses in middle stream and decided to take a different approach. Out went WASP and the Braddock family became well off Beverly Hills Jews. This of course shook up casting.

[quote]Doris Day was terrible in dramas, just check out Midnight Lace and Julie. And she isn't much better in The Man Who Knew Too Much and Love Me or Leave Me, imho,

You are entitled to your "ho," but Doris Day's performances in both of those films have been greatly admired by several notable film critics, and of course, audiences as well. There was a critic back in the day, I can't remember which one, who wrote that whenever he heard someone belittle Day's acting ability, he would show them the scene in THE MAN WHO KNEW TOO MUCH where Doris's character realizes that her son has been kidnapped, and they would immediately change their opinion. She really is superb in that scene, her emotional breakdown is wrenching.

She and Cagney are great in Love me or Leave Me. I have no idea what that poster is talking about.

Burt Ward is the only person who says he was up for The Graduate. This has never been mentioned by anyone else. I think he's dreaming that his Batman producers kept him from the part. I can't even imagine Nichols seriously considered him. I haven't read the Nichols bio but is it there?

Redford and Wood would be too old for the roles and Redford hardly seems like someone who's never been laid, and Day would have been a terrible Mrs. Robinson and she herself knew that. Wood was no longer BO. Neither Inside Daisy Clover or This Property is Condemned both with Redford were successful nor was Penelope (1966). Ditto Day with Caprice, Where Were You When the Lights Went Out? and The Glass Bottom Boat.

Every movie she starred in was made better by her presence.

R291, that's ridiculous. Made it up, huh?

The Braddock family was not explicitly Jewish in the movie, and there was nothing specifically Jewish about the parents. Jewishness was a subtext in Dustin Hoffman's portrayal of Benjamin—an "anomalous presence" in Mike Nichols's words.

[quote]The Braddock family was not explicitly Jewish in the movie, and there was nothing specifically Jewish about the parents.

I agree. Truthfully, it wasn't realistic that Hoffman would be the product of those parents. But I don't think Nichols cared about that at all, he cast Hoffman solely on the basis of talent.

I recall hearing Ryan (Peyton Place) O'Neal, Bergen and Day were the first considered for the roles.

William Daniels and Elizabeth Wilson would in NO WAY have been considered Jewish in 1967 or now.

Any actor could have been submitted to casting by the agent for The Graduate but it doesn't mean they were ever seriously considered. And any number of execs could have said to Mike Nichols: Hey, how about so-and-so for that role? But, again, it doesn't mean Nichols ever seriously considered them.

With a few exceptions, in the end, it's just a list of names with no real meaning.

And Mike Nichols was also notorious for often firing a lead actor after the first few days of rehearsal or filming (see Mandy Patinkin; Heartburn). I'd bet that if he'd been crazy enough to cast Doris Day, she would have been fired before the weekend.

I can see them as Hoffman's parents: Daniels is short, and Wilson had a huge head.

Of course, what all of The Graduate actors had in common, with the exception of beautiful Katherine Ross but including Daniels and Wilson and Murray Hamilton and Buck Henry and even Marion Lorne, was a Nichols & May sensibility in their comedic acting skills.

Anne Bancroft was sort of a sexier version of Elaine May.

[quote]I recall hearing Ryan (Peyton Place) O'Neal, Bergen and Day were the first considered for the roles

No, just no.

Plus O'Neal was a TV ACTOR, not gonna happen, even in you imagination.

[quote] How was her nun a lead in Agnes of God? That's really fucking stretching it.

Stretching what, R278?

What was her nun stretching?

Agnes of God is a movie that doesn't really work but that is still so riveting and enjoyable to watch for the three leads.

And for the cold Quebec scenery. Montreal played itself.

[quote] Plus O'Neal was a TV ACTOR, not gonna happen, even in you imagination.

R314 Were you in a coma throughout the 1970s? Ryan O'Neal was an A list film actor for most of that decade.

Yes, he started in television, but he quickly graduated to film and was up and coming when The Graduate was cast. I have no idea whether he was ever seriously considered, but he wouldn't have been kept from consideration because he was "a TV actor."

O'Neal wouldn't have been considered for the lead in a Mike Nichols film in 1967, R317. In fact, a few years later when he was working in features, O'Neal still wouldn't be considered for a Mike Nichols film.

[quote] Nichols … cast Hoffman solely on the basis of talent.

Nichols cast Hoffman because he looks like himself. Compare two photographs of them in profile.

It the same as the ghastly Woody Allen insisting that the lead actor in all his movies replicate his voice and speech patterns.

Funny Fact: Dustin Hoffman is not from New York like most people think. He's from LA.

[quote] Funny Fact

No, not funny. Nothing about this histrionic little man is funny.

He was funny in "Tootsie."

Fuck you, R314!

[quote] Lana Turner would have insisted on a Jean Louis wardrobe and god knows who to supply her jewels.

Why, Laykin at Cie, naturellement.

^^ et*

If given the chance, Doris Day would have done well with dramatic roles. But she was stuck in the image that was made for her. But if if her controlling husband Marty Melcher said to her about Mrs. Robinson "This is a great role and you HAVE to do it" she would have done it. And probably done it very well.

Actually, Doris Day was a good dramatic actress but by the time The Graduate came out, she was already typecast as the oldest living virgin and audiences would not have accepted her in the role of Mrs. Robinson.

Day hadn't played in a drama in a decade and only made a few ranging from horrible ("Midnight Lace") to quite good ("Love Me or Leave Me") with mediocrity in between ("The Man Who Knew Too Much--known for her histrionic scream and "Que Sera" which she initially disliked). She never really did dark humor which about as funny as it gets in "The Graduate". She would ahve been awful and no one would have wanted to see it.

R303

Robert Redford is one year younger than Dustin Hoffman, born August 18, 1936.

Hoffman was about thirty when he did "The Graduate", RR a year younger, how is that "too old"?

Robert Redford never would work for reasons given in links above; no one would ever believe he had problems getting laid, and or wasn't used to females of all ages throwing themselves at him.

For all the Doris lovers, those of us who laugh at the idea of her as Mrs. Robinson can still love her but we also wouldn't want to have seen her Eleanor of Aquitaine, Fanny Brice, Nurse Ratched, Eliza Doolittle or even Maria von Trapp. There are limitations.

That said, I think she might have been interesting in Cloris Leachman's role in The Last Picture Show and maybe as Alice in the film of Alice Doesn't Live Here Any More.

FTR Dustin Hoffman (born August 8, 1937) is actually a year younger than Robert Redford, R329.

R326/R327 see R271

Regardless of age, Robert Redford always photographed 5-10 years older than his age, so it doesn't fucking matter what his exact age actually was.

[quote] There are limitations.

You're correct, R330.

Sensible movie performers need to KNOW THEIR LIMITS!

Doris could not have pulled off Leachman's part in "Last Picture Show". She lacked that kind of haunting sadness. Leachman was both annoying and a treasure because she could play a scene multiple ways. Day lacked that quality.

[quote] She would ahve been awful and no one would have wanted to see it.

I think audiences would have loved to have seen Doris Day play a predatory woman after a much younger man. The novelty of it would have been a big draw "Doris Day as YOU'VE NEVER SEEN HER BEFORE!" She had the acting talent to do it. It might have been her big breakout role, showing audiences she was capable of a lot more than comedy fluff.

R335: That kind of build-up was becoming passe in 1967. Sexual predatory neighbor ladies call for a character actress unless it's purely camp and then you'd want someone more ironic than Day. Doris' movie career was over--totally in the ashcan. Even from a distance of 50+ years, you can't make it happen.

Where are inevitable Doris Day appearances on What's My Line?

She made two, you know, in the mid-1950s, long before her TV series.

I'm not a huge Doris Day fan. However, I can see her doing a great job as Mrs. Robinson with the right direction. I think she could use her image as the happy Southern California housewife on the surface and contrast that with underneath being a bitter, near-menopausal, cheating cougar could work. The problem which I have but apparently many others don't is Hoffman. He just seems too old for someone who just graduated college. Ryan O'Neal would have made and interesting Benjamin. Handsome but also a bit nerdy.

I recently watched this Graduate movie and it's told from the viewpoint of the youngster.

Mrs Robinson is a supporting role. Doris wouldn't appear is a supporting role.

^ Why do you keep repeating the same posts over and over again from different devices and accounts.

Not many people are interested in Doris Day playing Mrs. Robinson. The idea is ludicrous. It's just the same ancient white fag repeating itself obsessively, like it does on so many other topics.

WE know who you are. Get some rest.

Anna Maria Italiano and Doris May Kappelhoff.

They go together like chalk and cheese. Like curdled milk.

I can only say when I first saw The Graduate as a freshman in college in 1967, I had no problem believing Dustin Hoffman as a 22 year old. People simply looked older then. Also, Dustin was incredibly hot as Ben! Beautiful torso with gorgeous skin......totally seductable (seducible?). Of course, this was before we'd ever seen him in anything else.

And I also remember buying a ticket to see him star in a new play on Broadway the following year, an awful comedy called Jimmy Shine....but he looked adorable in that, too, and also appeared shirtless and he was seduced by Rue McClanahan as the local prostitute..

There was only a six-year age difference between Hoffman and Bancroft. The graduate was the first thing I saw Hoffman in and I didn't think he was acting. I thought that was his real personality and told people he was a bad actor. I couldn't stand his character. Then I saw Midnight Cowboy. After seeing that I realized he was really good. My favorite role of his was Tootsi.

I think all of Mike Nichols films are overpraised, except maybe Virginia Woolf and Primary Colors.

Anne Bancroft was never praised enough. Yes, she had faults and tics and actressy moments. But the real womanhood of her through the critics of her time right the fuck off. She wasn't Anna Magnani but she wasn't Audrey Hepburn neither.

Bancroft was never an ingenue - as Miss Dunaway so famously said about herself.

Doris Day at 60 pocked marked years OLD with a vaseline coated lens whisperlilting saccharine crap was still "the" ingenue. She's a pretty gross display in most of her appearances to be honest.

*threw the critics of her time...

[quote]I think audiences would have loved to have seen Doris Day play a predatory woman after a much younger man. The novelty of it would have been a big draw "Doris Day as YOU'VE NEVER SEEN HER BEFORE!" She had the acting talent to do it. It might have been her big breakout role, showing audiences she was capable of a lot more than comedy fluff.

Thank you. Of course, we'll never know how Day would have been as Mrs. Robinson, but it pisses me off that some assholes who post here are ABSOLUTELY CONVINCED she would have been terrible in the part, to the point where they feel there is NO ROOM FOR ARGUMENT about it WHATSOEVER.

[quote]Doris Day at 60 pocked marked years OLD with a vaseline coated lens whisperlilting saccharine crap was still "the" ingenue. She's a pretty gross display in most of her appearances to be honest.

You don't seem to have any idea what an ingenue is -- or about anything else you're trying to discuss, for that matter.

R344 Good analysis (like R245).

Having never paid much attention to bancroft before, I'd say she WAS beautiful from all these pictures. I'd say she just downplayed her beauty. End of.

If Doris had played Mrs. Robinson, would she have done a cover of the Simon & Garfunkel song to run over the closing credits?

[quote] I had no problem believing Dustin Hoffman as a 22 year old.

I had a problem believing he was college student age. I also had a problem with the fact that he was short and unprepossessing. Mrs. Robinson has the hots for THAT? But then maybe her desire for him was an indication of how fucked up she was. I also thought it hilarious that the very Semitic looking Hoffman was supposed to be the son of the very Waspish looking actors who played his parents. No WAY did he come from their loins! But his acting was good, so he pulled it off, even though he was the physical opposite of what the character was supposed to look like.

Why do people misread this movie so much? They all are unsavoury, greasy, dull or covered in nicotine in some way. I thought they were supposed to be? Mike Nichols pushes his character's physical flaws and never makes anyone more than slickly attractive. Anne Bancroft is meant to be a seductive viper, not an irresistible MILF. She succeeds.

There is no sheen or heat to their characters or sex. Katherine Ross does a good job representing something like dumb pretty innocence? Like Dolphins. It's a strange movie. Simon and Garfunkel songs were already worldwide hits. Mike Nichols was really talented with talent. But he was never ahead of any trend. Is there a more corny, disingenuous movie about drug addiction than Postcards From the Edge? Sandra Bullock starred in a better bad one.

Meryl Streep would never tell you this - but Mike Nichols did. He yelled at her when directing Angels in America to "stop putting a hat on top of your hat." It's a strange, deliberate and mean piece of criticism. One that forecast so many of her future performances. Yes, they worshipped each other. As those folk do. A certain shade of blonde hair/wig. That downward turn of phrase.....

Anne and Mel had much more fun.

I love Anne Bancroft and can tolerate Dustin Hoffman. Still, the best thing about The Graduate is the song, Mrs. Robinson. Both of them.

I wonder if the Doris fan is someone I knew slightly in college. He owned one of Doris' dresses, even then, MARY! and treated her birthday like a national holiday. The one stray biographic detail was that he was from Lyndhurst, Ohio.

Who knows? Mary Tyler Moore was risky casting in Ordinary People because the role was completely out of character, yet she was pretty perfect in it. The same might have happened if Doris Day was cast as Mrs. Robinson. I believe she had the chops to have carried it off.

People, let's get down to brass tacks here. How would Doris Day have delivered the line "Did you know I was an alcoholic?" I think she would have given it a whispery, breathy tone, not unlike La Bancroft herself.

MTM played someone close to herself and the film had a rising heart throb and Donald Sutherland to sell it.

There is no way that Day's line delivery would have been anything like Bancroft's.

Yes, the difference is MTM was playing herself in Ordinary People. Mary Richards and Laura Petrie were performances.

[quote] Anna Maria Italiano and Doris May Kappelhoff.

Throw in the mix Miyoshi Umeki, R341, and have a mini Axis powers reunion.

Let's back to talking about the actual topic please

R329 Hoffman was more boyish whereas Redford seemed older and more experienced. Bancroft was in fact only 9 years older than Ross who played her daughter

[quote]Ryan O'Neal would have made and interesting Benjamin. Handsome but also a bit nerdy.

LORDY, no. Ryan was not nerdy in the least, and would not be a convincing virgin after banging all those girls on Peyton Place. Or not.

r327 watch Day in Julie or Midnight Lace to see her at her most laugh provoking.

R361 the O'Neal of Love Story or What's Up Doc? isn't too different than Benjamin.

[quote]I also had a problem with the fact that he was short and unprepossessing. Mrs. Robinson has the hots for THAT? But then maybe her desire for him was an indication of how fucked up she was.

Mrs Robinson only wanted a young guy she could push around, she didn't necessarily have "hots" for Benjamin.

R363, the O'Neal of Love Story was not a virginal nerd. Did you even see the movie?

And the O'Neal in What's Up, Doc? was playing a broad character compared to Benjamin in The Graduate. Not only would O'Neal not have fitted the character in The Graduate, he lacked the subtle comedic abilities of a Hoffman.

R317 Clint Eastwood, James Garner, Burt Reynolds, Sally Field, Robin Williams, Steve McQueen . . .were all TV actors like O'Neal and Peyton Place was a huge success and it's where Mia Farrow got her start.

R365 so he was a stud in that film? Big man on campus? WTF! I did see it Did you?

O'Neal made the jump to films in 1969, several years after The Graduate was cast. The third one - Love Story - was a hit. O'Neal was A-list for about five years in the 1970s, then it was downhill with bomb after bomb. And although cute with a great body, Ryan was a very limited actor.

R366 there's a thing called acting and in 1967 O'Neal could have pulled off a Californian, East Coast educated WASP better than Day could a predatory woman

R318 yet America's sweetheart Doris Day was considered to be in a Mike Nichols film as a predatory woman!!!!!!

The real question is how Anne would have been as Joan Crawford. I picture a more subdued performance, with rage just bottling beneath the surface that explodes every now and then. It wouldn't have been as balls to the wall as Faye's portrayal, but I think it would have worked on a different level.

I still wonder why she bailed. Did she read the script or the book?

R372 it was the script. and how about Crawford as Mrs. Robinson?

This is not a Mrs. Robinson thread, this is an Anne Bancroft thread.

O'Neal was in Kubrick's Barry, Paper Moon, Love Story, What's Up Doc? and several other less known films So Fine, Irreconcilable Differences, The Thief Who Came to Dinner, The Main Event, Partners . . . and for a while he was a big star.

Thank you, R374. Nor is it a Ryan O'Neal thread. CREATE THOSE THREADS.

I couldn't find "Kubrick's Barry" when I googled it. Must have been a real bomb.

The Mrs. Robinson shit is getting exhausting.

Move on already.

R377 is a liar and the life of the party, I'm sure. I Googled Kubrick's Barry and Barry Lyndon was the first thing to pop up!

[quote]r373 how about Crawford as Mrs. Robinson?

Sure. She could be in her wheelchair from Baby Jane.

R380 she was able to strut her stuff in 1968's Berserk with Ty Hardin as her years younger love interest and critics noted her still shapely legs

Joan Crawford in the Graduate would turn it into a horror movie.

sounds good R382. And maybe opposite Woody Allen for the ultimate comedy. The part of Mrs. Robinson would have been a great role for Crawford in her prime.

R377 is the reason machines are taking over the jobs of humans. Machines can think!

Welcome to DL, OP!

A 60-year-old Mrs. Robinson is not appealing.

It would also make Elaine around 40.

[quote]r381 critics noted her still shapely legs

Only because she kept hooking them behind her head.

R374 are you a retired schoolteacher?

Not widely known but Anne Bancroft and Lee Marvin had a hot and steamy affair. It was over before that famous 1967 Oscar broadcast when Miss Bancroft accepted Liz Taylor's Academy Award.

Lee Marvin may or may not have known who won and that Liz Taylor had sent Anne Bancroft, but it made for interesting people watching both on stage/screen and backstage.

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

R389, When did this alleged affair take place, before she married Mel?

No Doris Day wouldn't have posed for the LP cover......that wasn't Anne Bancroft's leg......the leg belonged to Linda Gray a model who later played JR's wife on Dallas.

R392, Were those Anne's bare tits in the bedroom scene?

Did Anne ever apologize for "Gorilla at Large"?

R390, enough with that crap you post in every thread. Blocked!

Betty Ebeling seems to be major source of story about Lee Marvin and Anne Bancroft.

Lee Marvin was married to Better Ebeling for 15 years (Feb 1951 to 5th Jan 1967). During much of that time by all accounts (again including then Mrs. Lee Marvin), Lee Marvin was a hard drinking womanizer.

Anne Bancroft didn't marry Mel Brooks until 1964 IIRC. Prior to that she was married to Martin May from 1953 to1957.

As to exactly what went on and when who knows. But watching that clip from 1967 Oscar awards show, it is clear to me at least there was a back story between the two.

R375, a Ryan O'Neal thread for you!

Talking about Oscar presentations: I like Anne's exuberance when she presented the award to Sidney Poitier. I'm sure she knew him from New York, and must've been elated that he won, especially with him being the first Black man to do so.

They had just done a movie together, R398, The Slender Thread. It had nothing to do with New York.

"Lee Marvin was big, wild, and dangerous."

Doris could have used her legs for that photo. They were sensational. And after being crushed in a train wreck. What's that film where she's in a slip and shows them off? Pillow Talk? She was first choice for Mrs Robinson and with Mike Nichols direction she would have been sensational. In her mid 40s she was the perfect age. She just had decades of fans to think about and they would have turned on her like vipers.

R399 Thank you.

The Slender Thread

Slender is right R403. It feels like a padded hour-long TV show

R399 they never appear together in The Slender Thread. One might say their performances were phoned in.

The Oscar clip with Lee and Anne is interesting for a lot of reasons but I see no interaction, even subliminally, between the two stars at all.

Vanessa Redgrave was so fresh and gorgeous then and Lynn looks quite adorable. Interesting that they weren't seated next to each other which might have created some Olivia/Joan drama, esp. if one had won.

I wonder if Ida Kaminska enjoyed being called a "girl" by Lee Marvin?

Anouk Aimee = Resting Bitch Face

Was Anne Bancroft in the middle of filming The Graduate when she accepted Liz's Oscar for Va Woolf? Perhaps she did it more as a favor to Mike Nichols, director of both films? Did Mike win that year or the next? Or both?

For those who have never seen The Slender Thread, the entire relationship between Poitier and Bancroft happens over the telephone. Even so they have some very good scenes, and are truly the stars of the movie. Really bad fun movie.

Anna Maria Italiano looked Italian. She had great hair. She could vamp it up and sing a bit.

That Italian look was fine for a lot of things but it was sometimes unsettling. It was certainly unsettling in that extremely disjointed, unsettling 'Pumpkin Eater' but that was written by Harold Pinter and unsettling was Pinter's stock in trade.

She was unsettling in 'Seven Women', R66, R70, when she mysteriously strides in like Humphrey Bogart into a convent. But that was a crazy mess of a movie.

I refused to watch her in this remake.

I can just tell it's OTT and cringe-worthy.

Yes those were Miss Bancroft's tits. But they didn't grace the album cover.

Cute little moment, reunited.

Anne Bancroft could deliver a line....

"She was unsettling in 'Seven Women', [R66], [R70], when she mysteriously strides in like Humphrey Bogart into a convent. But that was a crazy mess of a movie."

Wasn't she a last minute replacement for Patricia Neal?

R407 I would say yes, yes and yes. Mike won Best Director the following year for The Graduate

R413 Yes

R412, thanks for posting. I saw it when it was originally on, never noticed Dustin's MASSIVE WIG like I do now, certainly inappropriate for a 56 year old.

No they weren't. She said at the last minute she chickened out and they used a double. which is why you see it as a separate shot without her face.

Now she could be lying but why would she?

I always liked her.

She was naturally pretty and earthy.

Mel Brooks was very lucky to have found her.

I first developed a bit of a thing for her in "The Miracle Worker." Those tinted glasses and costuming. I was a child at the time and thought myself horrible for thinking naughty thoughts about Annie Sullivan. But, I was older when I first saw "The Graduate" on cable you know, and man she was something else in that.

I'm linking to the gist of her scene in "The Elephant Man." She knows just what to do in it. Watch her eyes. That's hard for me to do since she was always soo sensual so I've watched this twice.

{quote]Mel Brooks was very lucky to have found her.

FOUND HER? He was lucky she gave his fat ugly ass a second look,

R418 you know what I mean. She could have skipped out in the middle of their first date or something. I mean no harm.

[quote] Yes, the difference is MTM was playing herself in Ordinary People.

Yeah, MTM was "playing herself" in "Ordinary People." The character of Beth Jarrett WAS MTM. They were exactly the same What a big fat steaming pile of horse shit.

7 Women

[quote]he character of Beth Jarrett WAS MTM.

No problem with MTM, but dummy first director time Redford studied under Sydney Pollack. He believed the actor had to BE the character rather than letting actor do their work.

"Garbo Talks" is a fun movie.

Oh lord and now I'm weeping R417. I haven't seen the scene in many years. Bancroft is amazing. She goes from grandness to pity to white knuckling it, feeling sick, sadness and back to the business of sharing enchantment. Bancroft is great actress playing a good actress. Both coming from a place of curiosity and kindness.

It's a sweet movie, r423...

Same here R424, cried through that whole scene.

Broadway Bound

Like Irene Worth, Anne was too good for Simon's schlock.

Thanks for the Oscars link, R398. I posted earlier that my mother was often told she resembled Anne Bancroft. I'd never seen AB with a beehive, the hairdo my mom wore throughout my childhood, and she really is a dead ringer for her. My sisters take after our father, poor things.

For those interested, however faintly because the film is a bore, the complete Hindenburg movie is on youtube. Anne Bancroft for her languid (aka doped up) performance. And George Scott, because he's really easy on the eyes. The good news is you can jump around in the video to only watch the best scenes. It took me all of 20 minutes to watch the film.

[quote]People, let's get down to brass tacks here. How would Doris Day have delivered the line "Did you know I was an alcoholic?" I think she would have given it a whispery, breathy tone, not unlike La Bancroft herself.

You're just projecting your image of Doris Day on how she would play a part. She made a career of playing bright, sunny characters but to say she was all that in real life is nonsense.

The Restless Breed

Kael wrote that Bancroft in Hindenberg looked like she had black potato chips stuck to her head.

^ Madam Kael was very rude.

I'll never forgive her for what she did to David Lean. Bosley Crowther never stooped to personal abuse.

She wasn't criticizing Bancroft, but her wig maker.

Anne Bancroft has 435 responses - most of them discussing how great she WAS!!!

*And that nutjob obsessed with Porous Day.

Short dress & speech at the Tony Awards.

Well, I learned something from this thread. I had forgotten, or maybe somehow never even knew, that there was a TV film of BROADWAY BOUND with Bancroft et al. Based on the trailer that I watched, it looks quite good. At least it's well cast, unlike BRIGHTON BEACH MEMOIRS, with that ridiculous miscasting of Blythe Danner as the Jewish mother.

R437, When Ann walks off the stage, the man at the bottom of the stairs appears to try and lead her away, but she seems to rebuff him and returns to her seat.

Thanks for posting, r437! Is that entire Tony Awards show available for viewing? It appears to have been televised but I thought that wasn't done in the earlier years.

R440, Prior to 1967, the Tony Awards were only broadcast locally in New York.

None better than THE MIRACLE WORKER with Patty Duke ❤️❤️❤️

R176 you do know that the part of Elaine was originally offered to Patty Duke. Miss Duke turned it down because she said, she did not want to work, as she was concentrating on her new marriage🤔

Duke would have been terrible. Just look what a mess she was in "Valley of the Dolls".

Patty Duke wasn't attractive enough to play Elaine Robinson.

PATTY WASN'T ATTRACTIVE ENOUGH?

Look at her here - 20 mi mark

Got to love the ranting moron who asserts that Nichols was never ahead of any trend, then posts a link to a Simon & Garfunkel song from the GRADUATE's groundbreaking soundtrack. (Go ahead, point out all the big movies whose soundtracks consisted entirely of pop songs before THE GRADUATE. We'll wait.)

R437 that was what her Oscar speech was going to be if she was there in person to accept.

Actually, the Simon & Garfunkel songs kind of make the movie.

R446 💯

R449, Along with the Norman Fell cameo.

Oh, no sir, it's completely baked.

Patty wasn't tall enough to pull off Elaine.

R440

14th Annual Tony Awards Astor Hotel Grand Ballroom April 24, 1960

broadcast on local television station WCBS-TV in New York City.

[quote]Yes. Bancroft was initially attached to MOMMIE DEAREST, but dropped out when she didn’t like the script rewrites.

I wonder if she ever watched it after it came out. Talk about dodging a bullet.

R454, Lauren Bacall and Helen Menken on the same awards show, both married to Humphrey Bogart.

Was Patty Duke nominated for a Tony too that year?

BTW, the entire Mrs. Robinson song was not in the film, just a snippet of it.

The 1960 Tony Awards are so.....perfunctory.....and yet a total riot! Well worth a look.

Gypsy received no Tony Awards in 1960, losing to Sound of Music and Fiorello, tied for Best Musical, as well as in all other categories. Mary Martin beat Ethel Merman (Gypsy), Carol Burnett (Once Upon a Matress), Eileen Herlie (who?) and DL Fave Dolores Gray (Destry).

Patty Duke was not nominated for The Miracle Worker but I can only think they thought she was too young to be considered, which is silly, of course.

Patty Duke gave an instinctive performance no doubt. For the rest of her life, she proved to be a very busy faced, lip chewing, ham fisted actress. Her alleged sensitivities and great acting missed me. Oy the fucking big gestures and screaming. Or furrowed brow and lip movements. Nobody even knows who Patty Duke is - aside from that wild alive child from the film of the Miracle Worker. Her performance was not a fluke because I just NOW learned now that she did it on stage first! Who knew?

She is either a downright a bad actress or some Geraldine Page wannabe in anything else I've seen her in.

I think she married a pilot or a policeman. Someone who no doubt kept her locked up. RIP.

R460: Time for a medication adjustment. Even on her sitcom, she was more subtle than what you describe. She was awful in "Valley of the Dolls" but so was everyone , not to mention the script. She also was mentally ill.

Sad that Eileen Herlie is considered a "who?" She was a wonderful, distinguished actress. Played Burton's mother in his Hamlet.

[quote]I just NOW learned now that she did it on stage first! Who knew?

EVERYBODY

Eileen Herlie is best remembered for her long-running role as a retired carny worker named Myrtle Fargate on All My Children.

Eileen Herlie is best remembered as Olivier's mother in 'Hamlet' in 1948.

Many many years ago (1973?) I was working in one of the prominent Broadway costume shops and we were making costumes for a revival of the Pirandello play Enrico IV starring Rex Harrison and Eileen Herlie. I'll never forget Ms Herlie sweeping into the workroom in her slacks and a full length mink coat after her costume fitting and grandly thanking all of us worker bees for the beautiful clothes. The way the shop was set up, an actor did not have to walk through the shop to arrive in the fitting room, so the extra effort of appreciation was especially lovely.

Also, I've always loved her singing in the OBC of Take Me Along, which is the show she was nominated for in 1960.

And finally, Ms Herlie not only played Olivier's mother (Gertrude) in the film of Hamlet but she also played the same role in Richard Burton's Broadway Hamlet.

And her campy rendition of "The Real Me" in All American.

Eileen Herlie had a very short career in English films but a much longer one on the US stage.

[quote]r465 Eileen Herlie is best remembered as Olivier's mother in 'Hamlet' in 1948.

Is she the one who got dinner rolls thrown at her on a train by Vivien Leigh, who was in a manic phase?

Here's to you Mrs. Robinson; heaven holds a place for those who pray.

I'm floored that anyone did not know Patty Duke first played in The Miracle Worker on stage.

Can someone please help me pick R471 up off the floor?

Cleanup on Thread 7!

I'm afraid I won't recover.

Carol Channing played in Hello, Dolly on stage? Who knew?

Julie Andrews played Eliza Doolittle * ON STAGE! Who knew?

* That would be in My Fair Lady for all of you ignoramuses

Patty also played Annie in a subsequent TV version. Annie, Patty, Patty, Annie. Uta, Annie. Uta, Patty. And so on.

Darryl F. Zanuck wanted Bancroft to play the Marilyn Monroe role in "River of No Return" (1954), but the producer Stanley Rubin convinced him to go with Monroe.

The real her...

Bimbo

River of No Return is a shit movie, no matter who stars in it. Both Monroe and Bancroft seem to be unexpected choices. No doubt that Marilyn was the better choice if only for giving Robert Mitchum a talking head role in SO many of Monroe's future biographies. Mitchum wasn't exactly a studio team player or sentimental fool. So I like to think that he kept sharing memories of Marilyn out of a very sincere desire to say what he said. Ha. He liked her and her work ethic - he thought she was a sweet, sad, funny woman. Or whatever they all say about Monroe. He is never hyperbolic.

Bancroft needs no such defense. She was a very accomplished actress and a most successful woman in every area of her life. She didn't inspire many biographies or documentaries or E True stories. But look at HER?!? If she's not as well known as some others - her work is excellent and she's a most unique actress. 💋

[quote] a most unique actress.

You can't be a "most unique" actress.

You're either unique or NOT unique.

There are no degrees.

Nah. You wrong R481. YOU can be the MOST uniquely pedantic ANCIENT WHITE F@G of Datalounge, R481. I suspect you are. This ain't a grammar class from 1940. Back when you were a child.

Yikes you a mess correcting such an impeccable post @R480.

What a fool is you, R481? How ancient do old white RACIST fag posters come in, on this here site? What is the degree of their agedness and pedantry?

May jesus visit healing to your troubled mind and body - this very night. R481! God Bless You. 🙏🏾 🙏🏾🙏🏾

R482 is a uniquely holy man.

Mamie Van Doren once said that Anne Bancroft was jealous of her when they did The Girl In The Black Stockings.

My guess is that Bancroft didn't even know Mamie was in the movie with her.

r482 is off her meds...

Van Doren has said a lot of things--she claimed Rock Hudson deflowered her on her parents kitchen floor. I doubt that she is/was a reliable historian.

I sure hope Mamie was correct when she said hunky Steve Cochran was outstanding in bed.

R453 Hoffman is short, so Elaine need not be tall

Bancroft would have been a good choice for Eve Harrington in All About Eve

Anna Maria Italiano gets acted off the screen in this bravura piece of Harold Pinter scripting.

Besides Bancroft and Yootha Joyce, Maggie Smith and James Mason give excellent performances in The Pumpkin Eater as well

Yootha Joyce, Maggie Smith and James Mason are more interesting.

Anna Maria Italiano was miscast and overwhelmed.

R492, And yet, it was Anne who was Oscar nominated.

The Oscars are rubbish.

I blame the producers for loading the cast with more interesting performers (including the sexy Richard Johnson and venerable Cedric Hardwicke) who naturally overwhelm the two central introspective roles and their private drama.

R494, They weren't rubbish in 1964.

Jack Clayton got an Oscar for the ageing sexpot Simone Signoret playing the unhappy, frumpy, neglected wife in 'Room at the Top' five years previously.

I guess everyone assumed this second unhappy, neglected wife would be equally successful.

R494 Don't forget the always reliable Eric Porter as the physiatrist

[quote] Don't forget the always

At least the producers (the Woolf Brothers) didn't include Donald Wolfit— who was still alive when the top-heavy 'Pumpkin Easter' was being cast.

R498 What is wrong with Wolfit? Porter, Mason, Hardwicke, and Finch were perfect for their roles.

500!

R492 Bancroft's English accent is persuasive and not showy ala Streep

I have never seen the Pumpkin Eater, is it worth it? Seems like it is a win-win-win

Good director- Jack Clayton

Great cast- Anne Bancroft, Peter Finch, James Mason, Eric Porter, Richard Jordan, Maggie Smith, and Sir Cedric Hardwicke

Good screenwriter- Harold Pinter

R502 it's over directed with too many arty touches, and I suspect Mike Nichols saw this film before he made Virginia Woolf. Bancroft is good but her character spends so much time moping around that the film and she became tiresome. It does contain a number of good performances and scenes. Joseph Losey's The Servant (1963) with a screenplay by Harold Pinter is much, much better

R503 Thanks. That is on my list, too. Dirk Bogarde and James Fox ae great actors.

I saw The Servant for the first time last year and it was the best movie I saw all year.

R502, I liked it very much. Anne is absolutely beautiful in the movie, she looks Greek.

R506 Thanks! This must have been fresh off the miracle worker

I wish that Yootha Joyce character at r490 could turn up at least once a season on sitcoms: dropping in for coffee with Mary, Rhoda, and Phyllis or having a parent-teacher conference with the Keatons about Tina Yothers on Family Ties.

Yootha helped Tallulah Bankhead keep Stephanie Powers prisoner in Die! Die! My Darling (1965)

In the Elephant Man she is acting alongside John Hurt, Anthony Hopkins, Wendy Hiller, Freddie Jones, and Sir John Gielgud.

BUT you remember Ann Bancroft, who could hold her own with the aforementioned thespians.

OP, R510 This Italian woman couldn't play an Englishwoman. And she was only in that show for two minutes.

[quote] alongside John Hurt, Anthony Hopkins, Wendy Hiller, Freddie Jones, and Sir John Gielgud.

OP, we know you love reciting lists that have been cut and pasted from elsewhere. But this woman was included to attract all those Americans in Peoria who hate all-British productions.

R511 I thought she was great. A very touching and poignant scene. Maybe she was, but would they really know who Anne Bancroft was? I feel like they would have got Meryl or Sigourney to appeal to Peoria moviegoing audience.

Peoria considers Meryl or Sigourney to be A listers but they're too expensive to hire for a lousy two-minute role.

Peoria is happy to take an ex-A-Lister who is affordable.

The Pumpkin Eater is most famous for a physical fight scene between Bancroft and Peter Finch.

A bit of the fight is in the trailer.

THE PUMPKIN EATER is most famous for the indelible impression made by a very young Maggie Smith in a scene or 2 early in the picture.

What it should be most famous for, however, is this unforgettable scene:

Julie Andrews said when she won the Oscar, she felt she didn't deserve it - and kept it in her attic for years

She said Anne Bancroft should've won for "Pumpkin Eater"

518 Julie deserved it

Paul Simon sang "Homeward Bound" at Bancroft's memorial service.

born Anna Maria Louisa Italiano. You don't get more Italian than that. Too bad she felt compelled to take on such a WASPY name. Never fit in my opinion.

[quote]But this woman was included to attract all those Americans in Peoria who hate all-British productions.

THIS woman got the job in The Elephant Man because it was produced by Mel Brooks' (her husband) company.