MA WALTON IS ONE LOW CLASS BROAD AND HYPOCRITE

You’d be all over the place too if you had to live with your screwy in-laws. Grandma criticizes everything! The old bitch can’t let anything go. Criticizes my biscuits, criticizes the way I wash the floor. And the old people stink coming off of her. Whew!

Yeah but she had a hot snatch.

Only the Tiara Troll can rescue this thread.

My favorite line from Mrs. Walton (Patricia Neal) was when John Boy was up late at night reading by candlelight with the door closed and locked. She said "John Boy, what are you doin' in there behind locked doors?". I so wanted him to say "I'm fisting my hard cock you nosy old bitch so leave me the fuck alone so I can get a nut".

I watch this movie ("The Waltons: The Homecoming", 1971) every Christmas Day and have been doing so for 20 years.

I adore this movie and this is why I watch it only on December 25th.

I had the VHS for so long and I was thrilled when it finally came out on DVD!!

R5 - None of that is necessary. The entire movie has been on YouTube for a few years.

AND THIS YEAR IT IS STILL TRUE!

Never trust Mellie Grant.

We got your number, hussy.

They aren't that smart. The Dukes of Hazzard beat them in Family Fued.

DL has a Ma Walton troll?

You just know she sent John-Boy out into the night so that she could read his diary uninterrupted.

After we saw this movie on TV my mom somehow found those Indian writing pads that John Boy's mom gave him and she gave me some for Christmas. I loved that.

God bless you mom R12

Meh, she let her children believe animals could talk. There were no social services or child welfare in those days.

*your

As a kid I remember thinking Patricia Neal's Ma Walton was mean and violent. I was terrified of her in that movie.

r16, Me too, she seemed like a boozer and smoker, and just plain mean.

I think I read CBS's original plan for the Waltons TV series was to star Patricia Neal and Henry Fonda But seeing as Fonda was only 3 years younger than Will Geer, and was six years older than Ellen Corby, that probably wouldn't have worked...

Momma and Grandma would fight over the recipe.

Patricia Neal’s version of Olivia was a mean nasty old bitch. Couldn’t stand her. And that Gramma was always a nosy old cunt.

Both Grandpa and Grandma Walton kind of grossed me out. He was a lecher and she was a crank.

I always read John Boy as gay.

The original TV movie was kinda dark overall. I was worried Ma Walton was gonna fuck John Man in front of everybody. He seemed to be the only thing that made her happen and when that mannish jaw cracked a smile sitting next to him, I was sure it was on.

Ma Walton as portrayed by Miss Patricia Neal was a fierce, dangerous scorpion with a paradoxical lust at war with her overall Christian crusader viciousness. Ma Walton as portrayed by Miss Michael Learned was a more Xanaxed, Hallmarky Ma that was more digestible week over week.

Grandma Walton was nasty & miserable.

Ma Walton as played by Miss Michael Learned found her way to Godsey’s Grocery and bought herself a bottle of peroxide.

And in the first season or two of the tv show, they had Learned play the character in the Neal style, being mean to the children. Eventually, they did soften her up.

I always wondered if 1970s tv drama was trying to indicate hardship = meanness or if they were trying to copy the gritty feel of 1970s movies. Because Caroline Ingalls over on Little House wasn’t always a joy either.

[quote] I think I read CBS's original plan for the Waltons TV series was to star Patricia Neal and Henry Fonda

They wanted Henry Fonda because The Homecoming and The Waltons are both continuations of the movie Spencer’s Mountain which starred Henry Fonda.

Every time I tried to watch that show I broke out in hives.

It's interesting, what age are you guys who think Olivia Walton was "mean"? When the TV special, and the hugely popular show, came out in the 70s, I think she reminded us of our moms. Not in every way, but I think she was just kind of upright and beleived in structure and discipline, and wasn't a sloppy, overemotional nutcase. She had morals and standards, and did her job, but you still knew she and John got int on in a big way, and not just to make all those kids.

I remember this quote from an old thread of the movie which made me laugh:

[quote] "Grandma was a narrow minded bitch, so provincial and self-righteous. I wish John Boy had thrown her and her rocking chair off the front porch."

I wish ssomeone had thrown John Boy and that mole off the front porch. Atthe time I didn't really notice but Richard Thomas could be insufferable in that role.

R22 = BILL TAYLOR

R31 my brother, sister and I hated John-Boy when our mum put The Waltons on every Sunday morning (our version of church). He was a smug, superior ass-kisser.

Stop yelling, OP.

R33 Back in the day I think (?) it was on Thursday nights and most of the kids in my high school watched it and a lot of the girls liked Richard Thomas. I thought at the time he was a great actor, how could they have discovered such an amazing young actor for this TV show? I don't remember his age, but we usually didn't know anyone's age on TV and we probably thought he was a teenager. Anyhow, that's funny. At some point when I watched the show later I just thought Thomas was so smug and humorless.

I think RUTH TAYLOR (OP) drank a little too much of the recipe.

R35 I guess because our mum thought he was such a good boy and someone we should be more like, made us dislike him even more. And that the adults couldn't see through him! Lol

Ruth is obviously still pissed off that John Boy bought Ma a washing machine, and all Bill has ever given her is a hernia.

I love that movie. I love it when Mama is screaming at him, thinking he had liquor and he says "Mama its eggnog" BAM BOYA! He got her! But, I remember as a kid being so relieved when Daddy finally got home.

Olivia is meant to be mid-30s at most, John Boy is 15 here and she and John married not long after high school

As a kid a kid I was traumatized by the doll.

She’s a high ridin’ bitch.

So I rewatched it last night and she wasn't that bad. It was Neal's delivery, she could just sound kind of menacing to a child, but to a now not child, she was just a strong woman who actually was very kind. Though the subtext about John Boy having a wank was a bit protracted.

[quote] Though the subtext about John Boy having a wank was a bit protracted.

Was that really the intended subtext, or are you just projecting?

His deeply Baptist mother kept drilling him at length on what he was doing upstairs in his room alone with the door locked? WTF do you think, Rose?

The one time John Boy forgot to lock the door.

R45 I don't know, fuckface, I haven't seen it since 1971. That's why I was asking. Thanks for your kind reply.

PS -- I. e. I don't remember the scene at all.

R47, the thing about being a dick is you also need to be a good liar when you get caught out and try to change tack. No one levelling the accusation of projecting was just "asking." But thanks for your general transparency.

It was pretty obvious they were hinting at Olivia being worried that John Boy was masturbating. She was a self-righteous Southern Baptist. Touching yourself was probably in her mind a one-way ticket to hell. And sex to those types was something you only did if you were married, and she no doubt threw masturbation in as sex in her mind. Obviously she and John liked to bone or they wouldn't have had so many damn kids.

I always preferred Neal's take on Oliva to Michael Leaned's colder portrayal. Neal did come across as an uptight Baptist who was dealing with the Depression and poverty with a whole gaggle of kids to take care of, not to mention she thought her husband may have been injured or even killed in a bus crash. But she had some sweet scenes with Elizabeth and Mary Ellen, and even John Boy. Michael Learned's take on Olivia always seemed so cold.

RUTH, while you’re huffing airplane glue, I’m going off thread. Yes, I’m an asshole, you can click “ignore”.

In theory, these are my people. Same geographic locations for both sides of the family.

Hill folk (means “Non-drinking baptists in a dry county” amongst the poor) women were supposed to be strict and mean. They were stewards of children that belonged to God. They were accountable for any child’s moral deficiencies they failed to address. They were also allowed to be psychotic monsters with free reign.

The idiot who wrote “Hillbilly Elegy” managed to capture some of the Depression era woman I recognize in the representation of his Grandmother.

R49 Haha, so now I was a "levelling the charge" of projecting? Are you a lawyer?

It seemed weird to me that in a 1971 TV show they would have a scene suggesting a kid was masturbating in the bathroom. I don't remember things like that on TV at the time. I was 13. I do remember TV back then. Network "standards and practices". And worried sponsors.

That Certain Summer, about a kid with a gay father, was considered revolutionary, for example - and didn't come out until '72. And it was as mild as could be. They even had to add a speech about how the dad wouldn't be gay if he had a choice.

So my question was along the lines of, are you projecting 2022 perceptions onto a show from 1971. If I'm wrong, I'm wrong. I just wondered.

R49 Also I should say the scene could have gone right over my head at age 13, and probably did. As I said, I may be wrong, I won't know unless I re-watch the show. But I don't get why you're calling me a dick, and all the rest of it. Did I insult you that much?

RUTH TAYLOR used to baby sit grandpa Walton in her retirement.

[quote] It seemed weird to me that in a 1971 TV show they would have a scene suggesting a kid was masturbating in the bathroom.

He was in his bedroom when confronted.

It’s a poorly written scene because the mother says something like, “John-Boy, are you smoking cigarettes in there?”

First off, she’d be able to smell smoke if he was. Second, if he was trying to smoke, there are plenty of woods behind the house where he could go do it in peace.

I was a kid when this was first broadcast and even then, I knew that in a small house with a lot of people, on Christmas Eve no less, you wouldn’t be doing anything your strict mother might find out about.

He was having a wank and she knew it. She should have told him to wash his wickedness in the snow

I’m surprised nobody had this show banned. White people having to beg black people for help? Wouldn’t fly today. Black people coming in the parlor of old, rich white ladies? Wouldn’t have happened back then.

R55 Yeah, I meant to write the bedroom. Must have been remembering something...

The two actresses who played the Baldwin sisters...Dorothy Stickney (the original Mother in Life With Father - the title role played by her husband, the co-writer, Howard Lindsay) and Josephine Hutchinson (a stage and screen leading lady who became a character actress)...they were both recast in the TV series. I think these two are better actresses. I'm not sure who's a better grandpa - Edgar Bergen (the ventriloquist - father of Candice) or Will Geer. Edgar and Ellen Corby had acted together previously, in the film, I Remember Mama - as middle aged lovebirds Mr. Thorkelson and Aunt Trina.

[quote]I watch this movie ("The Waltons: The Homecoming", 1971) every Christmas Day and have been doing so for 20 years.

The Datalounge condoles you.

Have you considered discussing this with a professional?

It was a real drama, not the sappy shit of the TV show. Though it never got as puke as Little House.

The TV show was great the first few seasons. There was no other family TV drama show like it. Also it was set in the Depression (at first) which made it unique. A lot of people were alive that remembered those times, even some people still in their 40s.

Now the real twister: with all this John Boy masturbating talk, would these country-colonial, late 19th-century American boys be cut or uncut? Probably not, as from being born in the sticks. They gave birth in barns.

Scientologist Judy Norton (Mary Ellen) has her own YouTube channel where she discusses the show and occasionally has other cast members/crew members on.

R63 does she ever ask her cast mates if they ever masturbated over her playboy layout?

Ignorant. Morally benighted. Religious freak. Sanctimonious. Control freak. Unhappy. Bored. Unfulfilled. Jealous. Pompous windbag. Resentful. Vindictive. Emotionally immature. In need of a goddamned makeover. Frump. Hypocrite. Manipulative. …and her pussy stinks.

R65, it was the Great Depression, she was stuck with no money, a judgmental mother-in-law, seven children, no social life, no beauty in her life.

No wonder she faked being sick so she could be sent to a sanatorium.

She had that Christmas cactus!

[quote] She had that Christmas cactus!

While everyone else had a poinsettia.

I'm now watching the episode and I have to say Richard Thomas in those days was pretty cute.

I like that Olivia has that red dress on because clothing in those days was colorful, and the Walton's TV series always had those Ralph Lauren-ish 70s drab browns, denim blues, and grays. It wasn't until I saw some color film on the Depression era that I realized even everyday clothes for women then were bright and colorful.

At least she didn’t have a bad perm like the mother in A Christmas Story.

I really do not remember The Waltons except Elizabeth was UGLY.

I wonder how the wholesome Christian families who flocked to that show in the 70's would have reacted if they'd known Will Geer was a bisexual communist, and Ellen Corby was a lesbian?

R72 you know they wouldn’t have cared.

I wish that Richard Thomas would have had that mole removed. He would have gotten so many more roles if he did. I bet even Will Geer said to him "Get rid of that fucking ugly ass mole!".

As a young child I got so confused trying to watch the Christmas movie because it has different actors than the show.

Must have been harder to hide if you'd been masturbating back then as all clothes were handwashed.

The advent of the washing machine must have been a gift to wankers everywhere

The TV remake (2016 or so) was unnecessary, but with much better looking men folk, especially John-Boy. Was craving a shirtless scene.

I think it's weird how so many TV shows now have to have better looking people instead of better actors. It's like prime time has turned into soaps. Of course there are exceptions (like Stranger Things).

I was never aware that The Waltons was a particular favorite of Christian viewers vs. other viewers. It was a top rated show, that's all. There was never too much that was overtly religious about the show, even though they had a preacher character (John Ritter).

They guy who played John-Man was perfectly cast. 0

I wish Elizabeth and John Boy had got sold to passing nomads.

We used to wonder why they were so poor if they owned the mountain!

RUTH TAYLOR, are you BILL TAYLOR with a few...um...'alterations'?

all i know is Judy Norton was Mary Ellen Walton!!!

R80 Look up the Great Depression.

Confession: I went to the Walton's Mountain Museum in Schuyler, Virginia, in 2021...and I loved it. Waltons creator Earl Hamner (the real-life John-Boy) also created Falcon Crest...and I went to that show's filming locations in Napa Valley and Sonoma last month! 😃👍🤗💋🍇🍷

R84 I love wine country, esp. Sonoma.

Isn’t this why they recast for the series? Too soften her up a tiny bit?

Michael is another one who got the botox clown face.

I remember when the TV movie aired. I made my opinions known about Johnboy (I have a birthmark like the idiot’s; mine has faded) and the Evil Mother. My folks defended Neil’s performance. They expected a wall-eyed woman gimping around, shitting on the floor, and flinging ropes of spit when she spoke.

I didn’t know her story.

I rewatched this because of this thread. TWICE in the same day, the grandmother mentions John-Boy in his room with the door locked. How does she even know he’s locked the door? Why does she care? Why is she stirring up shit on Christmas Eve?

Gramma Walton wanted to diddle herself out in the barn, away from grampa.

He promised, and I believed him. But sin never dies. Sin never dies. We know what's goin' on behind that locked door.

Grandma was a just an overall shit stirrer on that show.

Grandma Walton needed to drink more prune juice.

Grandma Walton was a nasty old bitch. I wish she'd walked in on Olivia getting ridden by Ike Godsey's six-incher and keeled over

I met Pat Neal once, it was just by accident, long story but anyway it was ten years later than this and she was gorgeous. I was suprised, never forgot my surprise because she didn't seem all that gorgeous (even when young) on TV or the movies. It made me realize how stunningly beautiful stars sometimes are in real life compared to other people. On screen they seem run of the mill because so many people on the screen are good looking. You take it for granted. A good looking person will play a 'plain' person, on screen, for example. They aren't.

Like Stanwyck, r95, she had a stern beauty.

Fun fact: At just over 21 minutes screen-time, Patricia still holds the record for shortest screen time for a Best Actress Oscar win

R96 Nothing stern about her when I saw her, she had a big smile and was wearing a floor length fur coat.

(Ankle length. Was with her daughter, who also had one.)

Stanwyck had a lovely smile as well, r98. It's about bone structure.

Did Patricia ever do nudity ?

She never discussed her Minsky's years, r101.

Didn't she have a stroke?

It's Wiki, but her life story is fascinating. She was quite beautiful when you, maturing into a Jane Wyman lookalike phase and then aging out. Still, cool story. She went through a lot. She also had a lot of pain and struggle throughout her life. I don't know she had a good heart on the Garland scale, which is hard to encounter in Hollywood or if at a time when gay people were oppressed beyond belief, they identified with her struggles and she theirs. Still, she went through a lot.

And here's the link.

She had 3 cerebral aneurysms in 1965. She was pregnant at the time and was in a coma for 3 weeks. She recovered, with the help of her then-husband Roald Dahl (author of James and the Giant Peach, Charlie and the Chocolate Factory and other books). She gave birth later that year. "The Homecoming" was made in 1971.

Yeah, they made a TV movie about it with Glenda Jackson and Dirk Bogarde.

But no one saw it. It needs an actress of stature and should be remade as soon as the industry is no longer consumed with shooting the triumphant new production of Sunset Boulevard, the Musical.

R108 You're 75 years old, Glenn. Pat Neal was 39 at the time.

And Norma was 50! I can play anything! I'll never stop!

Stop.

We'll make another picture, and another picture!

I love all the characters in "The Homecoming." Each one is a little son of a bitch in his or her own way. Even the bickering kids and the oddball supporting cast. Nothing sugar-coated or "Hallmark card" about it. It's worth watching again every couple of years.

John-Boy has a very inconvenient scene with Mary Ellen about her bosoms, while milking a cow, no less. (I thought my family’s Christmas Eve conversation was awkward!)

Boy, does that scene seem awkward in light of JN-T flashing her dirty pillows in Playboy!

Confession: I have the DVD collection of all six Waltons TV movies! The last Waltons movie, A Walton Easter, aired in 1997.

Did Gramma Walton ever masturbate?

[quote] Did Gramma Walton ever masturbate?

Gramma Walton never even had sex. John-Man was found on the doorstep one day. Gramma said, “Leave it on the doorstep. I don’t have the energy to raise a bastard. Maybe a cayote will come and take him off.”

The only time Grandma stroked, she literally stroked.

I mwah-ned t-t-t-talk lah-hah-hast eh pisode.

OP, I haven't watched this is over 40 years, thank you for sharing. Lol I forgot how bitchy that grandma was, no wonder they was all in a depression. She soaked her panties instigating shit.

Roses in wintet!

i had to watch some of this shit to see if it was real. that grandma was one mean-ass bitch. why have such a hateful cunt on a hit tv show? did she resonate with audiences or was she all that was available?

Everyone was hardcore in the 1970s cause they grew up during the Depression. That’s why this show was so popular,R121.

Granny was one nasty old uptight bitch. You just know that she smelled - down there.

R114 it's even more awkward when he tells her right after that's she's going to be as pretty as her momma. Poor Patricia Neal was no longer a pretty woman

The actor playing the grandfather was far too stately to play a hill person

One misfire in production is that there is a scene where Grandma is sitting at the table playing cards. Church ladies of that era would never have played cards because it symbolized gambling. You saw how much the mother freaked out about liquor. Well playing cards and drinking went together.

Unless Grandma was doing it just to piss Olivia off, then I can see it.

Esther was such a miserable sow

R126 right. I’m not evangelical but grew up in that part of the South. There was one card game they could play but it used a unique deck of cards. I think they were larger than normal. I’m sure that was not the one in the scene. I can’t remember its name. And why that one game? Cause there is always a way to find an exception and still feel holier than others obviously.

Maybe someone remembers the name.

Do you think Hawthorne fucked Miss Mamie after a double dose of The Recipe?

Why the hell didn't they just movie that little tree that blocked the road to Charlottesville?

I would trust that sinema witch before I’d trust Ma Walton

That's the wrong daddy! She must have amnesia!

They are in the wrong house!

It's like Patricia is acting on a whole different level and the other actors are just reacting to her. It's weird

r128 Strip poker?

Well Patricia Neal did have an Academy award.

Why does everyone mention Pat Neal? Wasn’t she only in the pilot tv movie?

R137 because this thread is about the Christmas TV movie of course!

[quote]Well Patricia Neal did have an Academy award.

And a Tony...

She never won the Emmy for this, or her other two nominations!

R125 That was ventriloquist Edgar Bergen. He had the biggest hit radio show during the Depression - with his dummies, Charlie McCarthy and Mortimer Snerd (who of course couldn't be seen on the radio). His daughter is Candice Bergen.

R126 I doubt that's a misfire, since Earl Hamner, Jr. was writing a fictionalized version of his own family. Since he was also heavily involved in the creation/presentation of this TV movie, he would know .

I asked my mom if she used to watch The Waltons. Her response was “fuck no”.

Olivia Walton used to make ends meat by selling herself at a house-of-ill-repute in Charlottesville!

R141 Will Geer, Grandpa #2, was also a ventriloquist!

[quote] Olivia Walton used to make ends meat by selling herself at a house-of-ill-repute in Charlottesville!

She used that locked door routine on all her “Johns.”

John boy had his five finger discount well under control when they called out his name at ‘nighty night’

Was Ma Walton fucking that guy who brought the stolen turkey? She was very flirty with him

It's a disgrace Pat didn't win the Emmy for playing Olivia. The Glenda Jackson won best actress in a drama series AND limited series for THE SAME Performance !

Victoria Jackson was good as Mary Ellen

I thought Michael Learned was Ma Walton.

I always thought John Boy (Richard Thomas) was a beautiful man. And he aged well. There Was a Law & Order SVU where Richard Thomas played a schizophrenic. He's middle-aged by then with a beard, but damn! Lemme at him!

Here's a candid snap of Mary-Ellen I took out by Hickory Creek. Get your copy for just 39 cents!

Imagine getting that call;. Yep, you got the part. It's a home coming and it's for you! You're on screen 3 minutes!

I find it interesting how the supporting players feature so heavily in this TV movie. Ike Godsey’s store, the black church and the Baldwin sisters are all very prominent, lengthy scenes. They were featured more than Ellen Corby and Edgar Bergen.

Did Hawthorn reappear in the main show?

Why didn't he and John-Boy try to movie that piddly little tree that blocked their road?

R153 I think it's basically because there's no real plot. Kind of, more, character studies. They're all involved with the family in one way or another

R153, remember, the story is told by the John Boy character Those long scenes were what would have had significance to him: the questionable turkeys, the wanting to make a quick visit, instead of seeing their presence as charity, and most importantly, the growing anger of his feeling of not having privacy for thoughts or pleasuring himself.

It's a tapestry.

[quote] Did Hawthorn reappear in the main show?

I don’t remember that he did. But they did introduce a black woman named Verdie.

R151 More like Beaver 🦫 Creek

Pa Walton had a stack of.those dirty magazines with his harlot of a daughter under his mattress. Ma Walton often wondered what Pa was doing locked in the bathroom for long periods of time.

There was a lot of jerking and self touching in that house

Poor Johngurl, I think he was always seen as a watered down, poor man’s Ron Howard

A gal's gotta have hobby!

I'm afraid Patricia Neal is too old for the role, like M in Mamma Mia, when's she's telling the story of how her parents were against their marriage 17 years ago and how they ran away to find a Preacher. Bitch, you were like 30 then, not some wide eyed teen!

R163 Only by a few years. Neal was in her mid-40s.

Who'd you want to play it? Mary Tyler Moore?

I always thought Ralph Waite was pack’n

Stupid ending where Livvie asks John what they're going to live in and he says "love". What he means is he's going to put another bum in her oven.

Jesus Christ, must everybody shit on everything? You fucking suck!

He was trying to change the conversation topic on her, OP, when he knew very well that the subject was roses!

Buh-dhuhmmm (sorry, had to). :)

Michael Learned didn't have the body of a mother-of-7