Orson Welles's private thoughts on Laurence Olivier

HJ: Did you see Olivier’s Lear on the BBC?

OW: The first two scenes are the worst things I ever saw in my life, bar none. Remember, this is the man who, when he played Hamlet, began the movie saying, “This is the story of a man who could not make up his mind.”

HJ: I understand that Olivier plays Lear as senile in the first scene.

OW: And he mustn’t be senile in the first scene! He has to fall from grace, you see. Such a vulgar conception. You know, Larry is in competition even with the people who were doing Shakespeare before he was doing it.

HJ: Dead actors! Your Jack Barrymore did Hamlet.

OW: When Larry talks about Jack Barrymore, he says, “That ham.” But Jack is wonderful! There’s nothing remotely hammy about him. He was the greatest Hamlet of the century, and the greatest Richard the Third, without any doubt. I can still hear it. And I’ve heard his records, too.

Damn. From the book's title, I had hoped this would be conversations with Orson Bean!

OW: I was very fond of Charles Laughton . He was a sweet man. It was absolutely terrible what Larry did to him. Larry was sharing a season with him at Stratford. Larry was doing—what’s that little-known Shakespearean play that Peter Brook directed with Larry and made a big success? Not Timon of Athens. . . Pericles maybe, and Laughton was doing King Lear and Bottom in Midsummer Night’s Dream. And everyone said he was very interesting in both parts. But in front of the entire company in Stratford, Larry said, “Charles, you are an amateur actor and you have never been anything else in your life. Don’t ask us to take you seriously.” And Laughton went away and cried, wept like a child.

I told you what Larry did to Miles Malleson, the old character actor, in Rhinoceros. Larry put his arm around his shoulder and walked him up and down in front of the lights. And I heard him saying, “Miles . . . Miles, old boy, you know, you’ve had it. You’re washed up.” This defenseless old man. All so that Larry could take control and tell him how his part should be played.

HJ: This was his way of tearing them down, or something stupid like that?

OW: It was heartbreaking for him. Laughton never got over it. He was like a little fourteen-year-old boy, totally immature. Laughton couldn’t bear the fact he was a homosexual, you know. He was so afraid the world would discover it. He believed in art, and all of that, always searching for something that went beyond what acting can be, or writing, or anything. Really, he was really looking for the bluebird.

This is great. More, please.

OW:I wanted Jack Hawkins to play Iago for me in the theater.

HJ: That was in ’51? When you were Othello?

OW: Yeah. And I would have had him. Jack would have loved to do Iago, as anybody would. But Larry didn’t want him.

HJ: Because he was straight?

OW: It was Larry’s theater, and the leading actors had to be approved by him. So I had to use [Peter] Finch.

HJ: He was straight.

OW: But he was fucking Vivien.

HJ: Did Larry know that?

OW: He knew it, sure. He wanted to go away on a yachting trip with Vivie, and keep Finch busy on the London stage. And Finch was a wonderful Iago. But not as good as Hawkins would have been. He played him as eaten up with bitterness.

Jack Lemmon and Olivier

HJ: (To Jack Lemmon) You did the TV version of The Entertainer?

JL: Yes, I did.

OW: I loved it. But it’s an overrated play. You would be astonished at what a rattletrap piece of crap it is. It does not hold up at all!

HJ: It was Americanized, right?

OW: No—yeah. But that wasn’t important—it was essentially the same play. Fakey and off-pitch. Like Larry. The thing that was better about Jack’s performance, and the great mistake that Larry made— You see, Larry can’t bear to fail, even if he’s supposed to fail. So when he played the comic onstage, he played for real laughs from the paying audience, instead of giving the feeling that he was in a half-empty theater where nobody was laughing. He did not play a failed comedian. Success to Larry demanded being an effective comedian, even though it made no sense! Because if he was that good, what was he doing out in a Brighton theater? What was his problem? But Jack played it like the theater was empty and nobody was laughing. A couple of guys with raincoats on, and that was it, you know?

OW: I was close to David Selznick because friends of mine liked him. I used to go to his house on Sunday nights. Everybody in Hollywood would be there, and we’d play “The Game,” which was just charades, you know. But Selznick played to win.

Once Selznick wanted to have a fight with me. This was at Walter Wanger’s house. After the ladies had left, the gentlemen sat around drinking port. He said how disappointed he was not to have Ronald Colman in Rebecca. Because he had this fellow Olivier. That irritated me. I said, “What’s wrong with Olivier?” He said, “He’s no gentleman.” And I said, “David, what kind of shit is this? What are you talking about, ‘no gentleman?’ ” “Well, he just isn’t. You can tell that. But with Ronnie you know right away—he’s a gentleman.” And I said, “Why, you pious old fart.” So David stood up, took off his glasses, and assumed the fighting position. We went out into the backyard, and everybody held us back.

HJ: You were really going to fight?

OW: Oh, yes. We used to do that all the time in Hollywood, always stepping out into the garden and fighting. While everybody held you, and nothing ever happened.

HJ: Bogart was always beating up guys, wasn’t he?

OW: Now, Bogart, who was both a coward and a very bad fighter, was always picking fights in nightclubs, in sure knowledge that the waiters would stop him. Making fearless remarks to people in his cups, when he knew he was well covered by the busboys.

HJ: What else did Olivier do that was wrong?

OW: Oh, everything! He was the very incarnation of pure evil. Why, once he wore white after Labor Day! And he drained his pasta in a colander! Can you imagine? And he would even mispronounce "Carnegie Hall"! He could not have been more evil! Why..

HJ: (interrupting) Moving on to other topics...

OW: Wait, I want to talk more about the awful unspeakable things Larry Olivier did....

R8 = Fake ridiculous post. It's Not Real.

Orson Welles was actually knew Olivier very well would know better than a clueless ignorant loser who makes fake posts R8

Get over yourself, R9. R8’s post was funny and in my opinion written in the witty spirit that used to be prevalent here. Don’t be a humorless prick ALL your life!

HJ: How did you first meet Olivier?

OW: We met when he was playing in the The Green Bay Tree, in New York, and I had just finished playing Mercutio in Romeo and Juliet. It was a very nice gathering of people, and we were sitting talking together. The hostess was Margaret Carrington, who had been my voice teacher as well as Jack’s. That’s why I can imitate Barrymore, because I took lessons from her. She charged neither Barrymore nor me, and ruined me and made Barrymore. It took me years to recover. But anyway, she came up to us and, according to me, said, “Mr. Olivier, you must stop boring Mr. Welles.” And, according to Larry, she said, “Mr. Welles, you must stop boring Mr. Olivier.” And both of us believe that our version is right! To this day, I honestly don’t know who is right.

HJ: What about England?

OW: You’re big in England. I was never big in England.

HJ: Every time I mention Lear to them, they say, “Oh, wouldn’t that be nice.” I was worried that Olivier’s Lear would hurt us. It was on TV. But I think it helped. They don’t like Olivier in England.

OW: No, they don’t. They’ve never gone to his Shakespearean movies. Cause they never go to any Shakespearean movies. They want to see Shakespeare on the stage, not in a movie theater . . . You know, everybody may be interested. But are we really going to carry the movie around by bus from country to country so we can make it a national event in every country?

[quote] Fakey and off-pitch. Like Larry.

Buffs my motherfucking nails 💅🏽

Little story about Noel Coward:

HJ: I don’t understand how somebody with liberal feelings would not discuss politics with John Wayne or Adolphe Menjou at a time when they had the power to hurt people, and in fact did a lot of damage.

OW: Well, Menjou was so fighting mad that you couldn’t talk to him. But Noel Coward took care of him wonderfully. Menjou was heading a USO troupe. Noel Coward was heading the equivalent of the USO—whatever it was called in England—you know, entertaining the troops. And they met in Casablanca.

And they were eating in the mess. Menjou was talking about how terrible it was in England, that those “n****” soldiers were fucking all the English girls, and you didn’t know what kind of race it was gonna be: “Isn’t that true, Noel?” And Noel said, “Well, I think it’s perfectly marvelous.” Menjou said, “What?” Noel said, “At last there’ll be a race of Englishmen with good teeth.” No, with Menjou you couldn’t talk. He was a raving maniac.

Wow. I never knew that about Adolphe Menjou.

[quote] [R8] = Fake ridiculous post. It's Not Real.

Oh, DO YOU THINK SO?!?

Gee, was listing wearing white after Labor Day as an act of evil possibly your first clue? Or did you have to read through the entire post to figure it out?

Wonderful stories. Thank you. OP.

I love this thread so much I’m going to rewatch Touch Of Evil this weekend.

Thanks, OP.

Olivier was probably jealous of Charles Laughton who was a far better film actor; though not as sexy as Larry, of course.

Henry Jaglom was big in the UK?