When Are They Going to Ban These Small Engine Planes?

OP = JFK Jr.

OP, they're the aviation world's equivalent of compact cars. Banning them wouldn't even be in the realm of remote possibilities.

the pilot was a Dr. who flew back and forth between his offices. He was told numerous times to pull up because he was too low but didn't. I am going to guess that he had a heart attack or something similar.

Gunshots and car accidents claim approximately 100X more lives than small plane crashes. There are only a few hundred plane crash deaths per year in the U.S. and your chances of dying if you are not a pilot or passenger are minute.

I live in Dayton and there are airports all over the place. I live between two in the south Dayton area that are for small planes, then there is WPAFB and the International Airport. I grew up very close to the International Airport and my grandmother lived near the base. Plane crashes are rare. Its kind of nice on a Sunday morning to sit on the deck and watch all the smaller craft fly over. Something very Americana about it. The Wright Flyer went over one day and I geeked out. A couple times some of those small craft looked like they were too low and too fast, but I can only think of one in our area in the last decade.

[Quote] Banning them wouldn't even be in the realm of remote possibilities

Why is that?

^^ Because banning them would leave a massive gap in local air transportation, for both personal and commercial purposes.

These seem like such an unnecessary risk. I have no desire to get in one of these or a helicopter.

They are good at eliminating rich people. I worked for an asshole who flew drunk. About a year after I stopped working for him he crashed on his birthday. Coincidentally it was my birthday as well. I shed no tears. He was a Trump-loving 1%. Good riddance.

Residents below need to be more diligent about filing complaints with the FAA.

[Quote] ^^ Because banning them would leave a massive gap in local air transportation, for both personal and commercial purposes

I don't think OP is about smaller local transportation aircraft but about the little private ones like in the article.

^^ Have you googled images of the plane model (per OP's article link) that crashed? That not quite what you would call a "little private" aircraft.

No. Post one hun.

OP, the number of people killed in these small planes each year in the US is about the same as the number of people killed by gunfire on a holiday weekend in Chicago. If you want to be safer, work to overturn Antonin Scalia's spurious and corrupt reinterpretation of the 2nd Amendment in District of Columbia v. Heller. That would make you much safer.

Do both.

[QUOTE] OP, the number of people killed in these small planes each year in the US is about the same as the number of people killed by gunfire on a holiday weekend in Chicago.

Here we go with the Chicago stuff. What are you, a rightwinger?

You know how I avoid gun violence in Chicago? BY NOT LIVING IN FRIGGIN CHICAGO! I can’t avoid these friggin planes! They’re everywhere!

Every time I hear one buzzing in the sky over me, my anxiety rises.

61 yo UPS driver killed in his truck. It's not right.

Brazil’s most popular singer killed in small plane crash:

Another celebrity and his whole family dead in a private jet crash. They’d still be alive if they were on a real airplane.

oh fer god's sake OP

you have more of a chance of being struck by rainbow lightening while pleasuring your mussy in the back seat of your Hyundai than you do of getting killed by a falling prop plane

erm, rainbow lightning

Weirdly, I crashed landed on the runway yesterday. It was scary and, yes, the plane is a mess. But, we all walked out and I'm less injured than if I'd been in a car. Planes go through far more mechanical oversight than even the most dangerous of big rigs. Get in front of one of those things and slam on your brakes. You'll die a lot faster in your car. For those who do have anxiety about planes above (and aren't just being ... difficult), If the plane is above you, it will not "drop out of the sky." That doesn't happen. It will glide for a long time, depending on its altitude. We are trained to look for places to land. We don't just plop the thing down in your backyard. Small aircraft contribute billions of dollars into the economy and we are one of the only civil aviation countries in the world, thanks to our history.

Sorry. I drone on when I'm sort of traumatized. I'm a student pilot and, while I would gleefully climb back into the cockpit, I was shaken by the knowledge that I could have killed two other people. I'm not sure I'm willing to take that risk again. And, I wouldn't think twice about putting people in my car, so there is a psychological aspect to the risk.

OP - word order matters. Your insane fear is NOT "small engines", it is "small planes".

[quote]If the plane is above you, it will not "drop out of the sky."

No, those are helicopters.

When they malfunction, they drop like a boulder.

[QUOTE] For those who do have anxiety about planes above (and aren't just being ... difficult), If the plane is above you, it will not "drop out of the sky."

R24, tell that to the victims’ families from OP’s article.

When I saw "ban" "small engine" and that California was involved, I thought the thread was going to be about the state's impending ban on small engine lawn mowers, leaf blowers, etc. 🙄

The plane involved was a commuter jet, not a "small plane." A small plane, with one engine or two, will not drop out of the sky. That would defy physics. This jet didn't drop out of the sky. It was trying to return to the airport. I know that any goddamned explanation of any kind on this platform is going to be ripped apart, but I did read the article and I do fly. So, at least give me a chance.

There are lots of people with a lot of anxiety about flying and planes. I was trying to alleviate some of the concern by explaining that true "small planes" won't just drop out of the sky on them. If that were true, we'd see quite a few more news articles, I'm sure. This was a malfunction of the plane. Allegedly, someone had complained about mechanical problems. Those things happen rarely. The perception of loss of control and lack of knowledge of what's happening is what causes the difference in anxiety between someone in a car and someone in a plane, both on the ground and in the air. We are willing to risk the vastly increased odds of dying in a car accident than in dying in a plane accident.

Since I just went through a near death experience flying a small plane, I thought my meager understanding of simple physics and proximity to doom would qualify me to comment. I apologize for my thumping arrogance.

R2 nonsense. Ban them!

OP should new more concerned with houses falling down on her.

Another one:

R24/R29

Can you tell the story of exactly what happened, or is it all a bit too traumatic? Glad you're still among us, in any case.

Regarding the one at R32:

Yeah, he definitely fell. But Jumped or pushed? I'd want to chat with the other passenger/pilot.

This smells funny.

Small plane crashes are always national news. How common could they be?

They’re crash landing on highways now.

Good number of incidents involving small planes can be attributed to pilot error. This includes famous (or infamous) crash of JFK, Jr.

Above being said even most experienced and qualified pilots of small planes experience situations they either cannot comprehend or are able to correct in time to avoid crashing.

Dr. Sugata Das was apparently a well qualified pilot who flew same route fairly often. No one will have a clue until various reports are completed and results released months from now.

Crashed and burned? Wasn’t me this time.

[quote] When Are They Going to Ban These Small Engine Planes?

We will put banning Assault Cessnas next on our list

Looking at JFK, Jr. link in R37 hard to believe it's been almost 25 years since event with anniversary just a few weeks ago.

One wonders had things gone differently what would JFK, Jr. be like today. Would he even still be married to Carolyn Bessette. His magazine was going down the toilet (not far behind JFK, Jr's marriage), so what would have have done with himself?

He had no future. The last issue of George Magazine worked on by Jr included the story of Bill Clinton trading US diplomatic pressure on behalf of Scientology in return for a softer and more sympathetic portrayal in "Primary Colors".

All pilots should have to pass a breathalyzer test before being allowed to fly a plane.

Or have two pilots on every plane, R43..

R44- Definitely they should have two pilots, I agree.

[quote]Would he even still be married to Carolyn Bessette.

Not a chance.

Having two pilots doesn’t guarantee shit.

No, no, OP. They should ban the big giant planes. After all, far more people are killed when one of those go down than a small plane.

A big plane takes out hundreds. A small plane takes out, what, three people? Four?

🙄

When’s the last time you heard of a commercial aircraft going down, R48? Flying those is safer than driving.

Small planes need to pilots like motor vehicles require two drivers.

Daily some several hundred if not more small aircraft take to skies over USA. Only a handful per month crash, that's hardly reason to go overboard with regulations. More so when in majority of cases crashes are due to pilot error.

Small aircraft do not have nearly as sophisticated instruments as large jets. The fly lower because even with advanced instruments pilot often needs visual markers.

JFK, Jr. (IIRC) really wasn't cleared to fly at night and or without advanced instruments. That doomed flight was supposed to take off during day; but the SIL had to work late and other factors meant plane departed far behind schedule.

It's rather like driving a long a highway or major road looking for visual clues as to where one happens to be. If you cannot find that "red barn on left" to drive "about 50 miles past...", it could spell trouble.

They'll be banned over my dead body.

I like to fly larger jets.....

This is what happens when you take your kids to work and let's then fly your plane. Chilling audio.

Another one:

Anyone can be a pilot now. Because of a pilot shortage, we do not delicense older pilots, or even the problematic ones.

Two dead in New York from small plane crash

And helicopters. I've lost count of the number of stories I've read of people dying in a helicopter crash. Often rich people too.

Actor Christian Oliver and two daughters killed in small plane crash

You're probably more likely to get killed by a lightning or by a meteorite than by a prop plane falling on you, doll.

[quote]I’ve got to worry about one of them falling out of the sky and killing me at random..

Wait until electric airplanes become more popular. Better carry some jumpers, or there will be jumpers!

I've watched a lot of footage of Cessnas stalling out and it's bone chilling. The way they just drop like a stone so suddenly. Fuck that. You could never get me inside one.

It's called 'gravity'.

[QUOTE] I've watched a lot of footage of Cessnas stalling out and it's bone chilling. The way they just drop like a stone so suddenly. Fuck that. You could never get me inside one.

Agreed. No small planes or helicopters for me.

r62 Oh wow, I've never heard of that. THANKS

R21 - a Gulfstream IV is a proper airplane.

Great, now we got to worry about fucking HOMEMADE planes crashing from the sky too!

R4 But people have more guns and cars than they do have small planes.

If people had more small planes there would probably be more accidents.

Those stats don’t prove it’s safer. I’m not getting in one.

We are not going to eliminate General Aviation; it will not happen. Anecdotal links aside, the statistical danger is minuscule compared to the far greater risks around us. Cars, motorcycles, Amazon trucks, throw rugs, even Christmas Trees which cause an average of 150 house fires yearly. The idea is ridiculous. We can eliminate all risk of everyday life if everyone stays home and uses no machines, fire or electricity. If everyone does that, no one will live for long anyway.

Well, if you’re flying a plane intoxicated and then you start jerking off, something is bound to go wrong.

R17 no one cares about your psychiatric problems

Another one. 5 dead

Are these small motor planes unable to glide?

why do we keep talking about "small motors" planes? The motor size is not relevant to the issue. There are small jet planes with "big" motors and large planes with smaller motors.

We also need to ban trains.....and cricket!

Don’t be ridiculous, R74.

It doesn't happened often, OP, but you don't want to be there when it does happen, OP

In the early morning hours of Friday, June 26, a twin-engine Piper Seneca cargo plane operated by Cash Air, carrying financial newspapers and bank notes from New Jersey veered off course as it flew over Dorchester in its approach to Boston's Logan Airport. The plane went into a sharp left turn, flew over several Dorchester neighborhoods and smashed into three houses on Lonsdale Street near St. Mark's Church.

R74 Train travel is a lot less risky, probability-wise. Here's the 'death index' for various transport:

Transportation mode Death index

Airlines 1

Intercity rail (Amtrak) 20.0

Scheduled charter flights 34.3

Mass transit (rail and bus) 49.8

Non-scheduled charter flights 59.5

Non-scheduled helicopter flights 63.0

General aviation (like private planes) 271.7

Driving or riding in a car/SUV 453.6

R77, I don't know what those stats actually represent; is higher worse. If so, then mass transit train travel is twice as dangerous as "general aviation(like private planes)" !! Intercity rail is about the same as general aviation

R78 If you travel the same distance, traveling by "Intercity rail (Amtrak)" means that you are 20 times more likely to die than from taking a normal commercial "Airline" flight. And so on, the probability goes up the further down the list you go.

Lord have mercy. You have much bigger probems to worry about than this. People are going to fly planes. Planes may crash. If you don't like small planes, don't get in one. If you are worried about one falling out of the sky and landing on you or your house, you have something to work through with your therapist.

Bigger problems like what, R80?

Amazon drones falling on us, R81.

Amazon drones are unlikely to kill people though? They're too small for that.

Rich white guy problems… until one of them splats on the innocent.

Exactly, R84.

Small plane crashes in yard of Colorado home

This guy needs his landmarks.

Yes OP before it's too late

They think they’re so cool and smart flying above us all and now dead-good.They’re families told them not to.

BANNING THINGS because of a SMALL MINORITY is such a COMMUNIST thing to do.

Over my dead body!

American Airlines just began flying out of our small local airport and our house is on one of those runway routes (I don't know what they're called) and now I'm waiting for one of those big things to scrape along into the neighborhood. I've had a recurring dream since I was small of a jet crashing in my yard, flames and all and I'm in my underwear trying to pull people from the wreckage. I don't want it to come true.

[quote]Gunshots and car accidents claim approximately 100X more lives than small plane crashes.

Well only because there are a lot more cars on the road than private planes.

Fun Fact: The most common cause of accidental death in Alaska is by plane crash. Why? Because more people fly small planes there than cars. So it's not really safer, it's just a numbers game. If everyone in America with their road rage and DIU driving skills were flying personal planes at the same rate as owning cars, you can bet that flying would not be the safest way to travel.

Small plane crash in Northeast Philly just took out God knows how many people.