Let's Talk About Penny Marshall

Here's the copy of her book I was quoting from in the Debra Winger thread, put it in "reader view" and it's easy to read the whole thing without a download.

Say what you will, but she was a brilliant physical comedienne on Laverne and Shirley.

She didn't mumble as much when she was acting. Why didn't one of her many friends or family members tell her to knock it off?

Girl liked a retro kitchen!

I always assumed she was closeted.

R5 - she did give off a strong lesbian vibe - and hanging out so closely with Rosie O'Donnell didn't dispel those rumors.

Why did she and Meathead break up?

I looked at the plain looking pool at her home shown in R4.

Shouldn’t it have been a big, cursive Laverne “L”?

She was talented. A little nepotism, but she was an entertaining original and had a rocking little body and probably good cocaine

R9 The "Laverne & Shirley" set my was turf. And I had the best shit anyway.

She made BIG. That's what made her big.

A League of Their Own was an amazing movie. Just for that she has earned admiration.

She got a solid acting performance out of Madonna. Obviously, she was a very talented director.

I loved her as Myrna Turner on the classic sitcom Odd Couple.

But not so much on the idiotic Laverne & Shirley.

Wasn't she Carrie Fisher's "love of her life"?

She was fucking awesome and worth every penny.

Seriously. Nepotism or no nepotism, this woman added great value to all of her projects and Laverne & Shirley was never skipped in my room each week.

Soon as I knew it was about to go on, I had on my nightgown, my huge bowl of Thrifty’s (now known as Rite-Aid), strawberry ice cream, and my backpack next to my bed with my completed homework assignments and my outfit for school ready, to wear the following day.

I was remarkably organized and had my shit together as a kid, and Laverne & Shirley were part of my life when it was still amazing, and before it eventually turned to shit and all of my orderly routines were abandoned due to my very sick BPD mom’s mental illness and multiple hospitalizations.

R16

MARY!

MARY!

MARY!

and once more

MARRYYYYYYYY!!!!!!!!!

(but also xoxoxoxo R16. sounds rough)

[quote] Laverne & Shirley was never skipped in my room each week.

Your room at the asylum?

She was talented and people did seem to like her. A nice case of things working out well for someone who deserved it.

Pick-up, Betty; Betty, pick-up.

R21 LOL! My friend and I used to quote that episode ALL the time.

She always seemed pretty butch to me, but she had sex with a number of actors and musicians (all male). She and Carrie have a huge party every year for their birthdays that everybody went to (or were desperate to go). Since her bestie was Carrie all through the heaviest years of her drug use, I'd be shocked if Penny weren't also partaking, maybe even dealing a little on the side.

Just friends?

[quote]she had sex with a number of actors and musicians (all male)

Do you have proof of that claim?

The true love of Carrie Fisher's life was Joan Hackett.

Lol to you bitches @ R17, R18, and R19.

😂

It was ROUGH. My mom was an undiagnosed bipolar 1 disordered person, had undiagnosed Borderline Personality Disorder, and had 3 breakdowns in a matter of 4 years.

At least one of those breakdowns put her on a psych-ward for 6 months.

Everything fell apart. I had to go to work, earn a living, feed myself and attempt to finish high school, and I wasn’t even 18 yet when it all broke down BAD.

Eventually, I got into drugs (introduced to me by my first serious bf & first love-who I now know was a drug dealer and a POS trash person), and all I’m gonna say is that it’s a fucking miracle that I didn’t end up homeless & selling my ass on the streets, because FOR SURE that was an option, and the odds were pointed in that direction, and overwhelmingly so. Which is why I never judge people who end up there, either, by the way. It should have been me, and I missed it by mere millimeters and sheer fucking luck.

So yeah. ABC’s lineups from back then brought me great comfort, and tremendous solace because I had no one to guide me through that but a television and a bowl of ice cream.

I’d watch Laverne & Shirley and I’d actually cry because I wanted a roommate to talk to, and I knew that it would not be my mom, when she got back.

And I was right. 🤷🏽‍♀️

Yes R25, I have the used condoms. You can test them for DNA. 🙄

She wrote about them in her biography and nobody called her out for lying. Some, like Art Garfunkel, have spoken publicly about their relationship (Art credits her with saving him from suicidal depression). Her first husband was actor/NFL player Mike Henry, her second husband was Rob Reiner. Other actors she dated included Larry Breeding and Sam (yuck) Kinison.

Maybe she fucked women, too, I don't know. But if she was a lesbian, she was really, really bad at it.

She always struck me as one of those pretty girls…that isn’t too feminine and can hang as one of the boys…but is a great lay.

[quote] one of those pretty girls

That seems...extremely generous.

I’m always interested by actors/actresses who run with an A-list crew but never really break through with the public as A-list celebrities. I assume they must just be a lot of fun. Kathy Najimy and Mary McCormack are other examples of this.

Taking acid with Carrie Fisher:

[quote]I met Carrie in Chicago, where we hung out with John Belushi and Danny Aykroyd. They were shooting The Blues Brothers movie. One night Carrie, Judy Belushi, and I took acid. It was my first time taking LSD; same with Carrie. It seemed like the thing to do.

[quote]We played pool for hours and took pictures of ourselves with a Polaroid camera at a hole-in-the-wall bar that the guys called the Blues Bar. We thought the cops there were extras from the movie and so made no effort to hide our silliness; but they turned out to be real police officers.

[quote]After several hours, Carrie and I went back to the Ritz-Carlton Hotel and gave ourselves facials. Laughing at everything we saw, we rode up and down on the hotel’s elevator, lying on the floor so we could stare up at the pretty deco ceiling. I can’t say how long we did that, but it was a while. Only once did the elevator stop and the doors open, and then Eric Idle, of all people, stepped in. We laughed too hard to even say hello. He understood.

[quote]I broke the spell by going out to get some more Polaroid fi lm. Being outside in the lights and around other people wasn’t so good for me. I went back to my room and had an anxiety attack. Danny tried talking me through it. He put on some heavy metal music. That didn’t help. Upset, I called my brother, who didn’t know from acid. His drug of choice was still Benadryl. But Carrie and I were supposed to fly to Albuquerque the next day and play baseball in a Happy Days charity event, and I felt an overwhelming need to tell him that I was freaking out on acid and might have gotten too high. I didn’t know what to do or how long it was going to last — hopefully not forever. “Is anyone there?” my brother asked. “Yeah,” I said. “But not at the moment. I’m in my room. Carrie’s here, though.” “Well, I think you just need to go through it,” he said. He was right. I got to Albuquerque and saw him on the baseball field. He rubbed my back. “So tell me, that was fun for you?” he asked. Fun enough.

[quote]Undeterred, I dropped acid again the next time I was in New York. I was with Carrie and Paul, and we were shopping for folk art. Before leaving Paul’s apartment, Carrie and I took acid once more. There was a reason behind our madness: It was fun. I’m not going to apologize. We laughed our asses off. It added a touch of adventure and unpredictability that we enjoyed. The only fallout in this case was transportation. We changed limo drivers fifteen times. At the tiniest hint of something out of the ordinary, we called for a new car and driver. A little paranoia was nothing. In fact, we took it in stride when Carrie accidentally lit her fur coat on fire instead of her cigarette.

[quote]By that afternoon, we had ditched the folk art and gone in search of the city’s best marzipan. When we finally staggered back into Paul’s apartment, I remembered that I had a date with Artie. I had forgotten all about it, as happens when you’re on acid all day. We were supposed to double-date with Stephen Bishop and Karen Allen. I called Artie and told him to pick me up at Paul’s. “I can’t just come over to Paul’s,” he said. “Why not?” I asked.

[quote]I knew nothing about their long history together other than that they had made some of the most popular and enduring music of the ’60s and ’70s, including “The Sound of Silence” and “Bridge Over Troubled Water.” I wasn’t aware of their very complicated, touchy relationship. They had known each other since grade school. Sometimes they were friends. Sometimes they weren’t. I didn’t know they would sometimes go years without speaking to each other. I had more than enough of my own issues.

[quote]Eventually, Artie explained why he couldn’t just come over to Paul’s. He had to be invited, he said. Invited schmited, I said. I didn’t care. I couldn’t follow what he was saying. I had been tripping, and as a result, I couldn’t leave Paul’s by myself. Finally, he understood and agreed to pick me up. Once he was there, everything seemed fine. He and Paul were friendly to each other. I gave Artie a tab of acid. “Here, join me.”

[quote]We invited Carrie and Paul to come to dinner, too. They declined. I offered to bring them something back if they wanted. Looking back, it was funny. Here I was, totally ignorant of one of the most strained partnerships in pop music history, arranging a social date with these two guys who have wanted nothing to do with each other for God only knew how long.

[quote]Outside, Artie and I got into a cab, and now, thanks to the acid, we were glued to each other. We walked in the restaurant, but couldn’t find Stephen and Karen. After fifteen minutes, we realized that we were in the wrong restaurant. We were supposed to be in the one next door. So we went there, had a nice time, and went back to Paul’s, where the good times continued.

[quote]As conversation flowed, I innocently said, “Why don’t you guys sing something?” After an awkward silence, Paul and Artie shrugged. I guess they couldn’t think of a reason why not or just didn’t want to go into years of slights and bickering in front of Carrie and me. Paul got up and walked slowly to his guitar closet. Then he and Artie carefully searched the room for a spot with the best echo, the best sound, and they started to sing. They played oldies in lieu of their own songs, but it was, quite frankly, the most thrilling night of my life.

[quote]Artie and I spent the night at Ricky Dreyfuss’s apartment. He was out of town and left the keys for me. We floated inside, knowing we’d had a sensational evening. I wouldn’t have guessed it could get better, but it did when Artie serenaded me with an absolutely beautiful rendition of “There’s a Place for Us.” He filled that song with emotion and meaning from both of our lives — his grief, my new life, the fact we’d found each other — indeed, at that moment, it was about us. How could you not fall in love with that?

She did lines of coke off my clit.

"Soon as I knew it was about to go on, I had on my nightgown, my huge bowl of Thrifty’s (now known as Rite-Aid), strawberry ice cream, and my backpack next to my bed"

And your parents weren't surprised by their son behaving in such a way?

LMAO, R35.

Much better in many ways and sorta unsure about other ways, but I’ve probably had just as much fun as Penny Marshall did, and did shit and experienced cool AF moments on Acid, and eventually those experiences happened while completely sober, & I suspect are not over just yet, due to just the sheer randomness of life.

That’s how life works.

Most of it is based on either strong and consistent support systems around us, which push us towards success, even when we believe we cannot do whatever it is we mistakenly believe we cannot do, yet accomplish despite it all, SPECIFICALLY because someone literally shows up to get us through it (like for Penny it was Rob), or we get random lucky breaks, which ALSO require support networks to make opportunities stick and develop into a meaningful career/life.

We get nothing by ourselves is the point.

Planned out or random AF, anything we have or believe we “accomplished”, ONLY happened because people backed us up somewhere along the line.

I’m not sure Penny would have had the opportunities she had to shine as brightly as she could on her own merits, had nepotism not been in play. Which is why I’m not against nepotism, as it can elevate an extremely gifted & talented person like Penny into her well deserved job and career.

Penny was special AF, no matter who she was related to. I cannot imagine all of the laughter I would have missed out on had she not been on ABC every week.

Sigh… Mom’s never coming back from that hospital, even though her body has been here forever. I’m attempting to figure out how to leave that room I was in when she checked out on me. If I can accept that no one was or is responsible for mental illness and how it devastated us, I’m probably gonna make it out of that room, and leave behind that empty bowl and television set. Dropping acid doesn’t get anyone out of that bad trip (and I had the real stuff). That much I do know.

So yeah. I’m doing much better. I finally found the doorknob. 😂

Penny didn’t like working with drew Barrymore on riding in cars with boys, but she had great things about Brittany Murphy. Also she despised bill Hudson and blames him for Cindy Williams departure of Laverne and Shirley.

*great things to say…

Also the last season of Laverne and Shirley penny looked great and she showed it off in the opening credits.

[quote]my huge bowl of Thrifty’s (now known as Rite-Aid), strawberry ice cream,

Thrifty Ice Cream is still known as Thrifty Ice Cream. It's just sold at Rite-Aid (formerly Thrifty) Drugs.

The woman smoked her way through lung cancer. A treasure.

I love Penny’s names for everybody. Danny Aykroyd, Ricky Dreyfuss, Joey Pesci.

R28. She went from Tarzan to Meathead? Holy shit.

Reading Anjelica Huston's description of what Marshall was actually like was kind of shocking & sad. I never had a strong opinion about her one way or the other, but the idea of this brilliant woman spending all her time buying all this shit off of QVC just seemed terrible.

Bill Hudson didn't learn by watching Alan Hamel. Your wives were replaceable. Suzanne Somers rebounded, Cindy never did and ended up divorced.

Penny says stuff about Bill in her Television Academy interview. She and Cindy are interviewed together for a while too but the bickering was so annoying.

Cindy was a treasure. Watch the episode in which Shirley tries to teach Laverne to drive, in their apartment, with cans of food subbing for the pedals. When Laverne pisses her off and Shirley's had enough, she pantomines slamming the pretend car door perfectly. A treasure.

Penny's memoir skipped around a lot. Big missing periods of and episodes in her life go unaddressed. If I remember right, Penny's was the first Amazon title, when Amazon was testing out being a publisher. I think her book could have used a true editor who could help shape it. I wish we could have read the memoir a great editor could have coaxed out her.

Didn't Cindy and Penny hate each other? It's a testament to their professionalism that they seemed like the best of friends.

I’ve never heard they hated each other, r46.

[quote] Laverne & Shirley was never skipped in my room each week.

[quote]Your room at the asylum?

Five minutes to Squiggy.

Five minutes to Squiggy.

Even as a young boy, I knew Carmine wasn't as hot as the character was meant to be. But still much hotter than the Fonz.

She smoked like a chimney right to the end.

[quote]Reading Anjelica Huston's description of what Marshall was actually like was kind of shocking & sad. I never had a strong opinion about her one way or the other, but the idea of this brilliant woman spending all her time buying all this shit off of QVC just seemed terrible

Penny doesn't come off as being the most introspective person in her own book. The book is great for Hollywood dish, but at the end you get the sense that she hadn't learned anything. There's no real insights or anything.

I do have to say that she did seem like a good person to work for. She had to ream Denzel out on the set of Preachers Wife because he was acting like an asshole to everyone and even made him apologize in front of the entire crew. In fact, she explicitly states that despite Whitney's issues, she was far easier to work with than Denzel.

She really doesn't badmouth anybody aside from him. Drew Barrymore, and a little shade at Whoopi.

[quote]Didn't Cindy and Penny hate each other? It's a testament to their professionalism that they seemed like the best of friends.

They had a weird relationship. Cindy was convinced from the start that there was going to be favoritism on Penny's end because of her relation to Garry (well, duh). So she complained whenever she felt slighted. In the beginning, Penny kind of shrugged it off, but it got a point where Marshall started feeling like she had to speak because she felt she was being minimized as well. It got so ridiculous that they were counting lines of the scripts each week to make sure that Penny and Cindy got an equal amount. Then came Cindy's marriage and she walked off the show at the start of season 8.

Almost everyone who worked on that show behind the scenes had nothing good to say about their experiences. In fact, many have said it was the worst experience of their careers.

She and Fisher drifted apart in their later years and their parties stopped.

Fisher got even more druggy and crazy as the years went on and Penny couldn't deal

Cindy and Penny eventually set things right. I doubt they were best buddies but from what I’ve read, they’ve kept in touch.

I interviewed an actress from a short-lived 80s show. She and her male co-star were two ships in the night at the time. Different ages, different backgrounds. A few years ago, they met up again, and now they email and call on a regular basis. She said they were always going to be connected and they may as well be friends.

I think that’s what Penny and Cindy realized.

[quote]Her first husband was actor/NFL player Mike Henry

Stop making shit up. Her first husband (and her daughter's father) was named Michael Henry, but he was NOT the actor/NFL player of that name. (Nor was he the current voice actor by that name.)

r42 No. Fake news.

I saw her scouting film locations in the Bowery in 1998. I remember a group of people surrounding her, and she looked pretty “no-nonsense”, with a metal clipboard binder.

I stopped watching Laverne and Shirley at one point because I could no longer take her yelling.

She was robbed.

"Big" was perfect.

Uh, I’d rather hear more about Carrie Fisher and Joan Hackett.

Nepotism or not, A very talented family.

R60, it was Rose. It truly was.

I lost interest in "Laverne and Shirley", because of the increased musical comedy shows. The writers, obviously, did not have fresh material. It was cloying to watch.

In LA in the early 80s, a friend who was an aspiring standup comic used to hang out with a guy (another wannabe comic) who claimed to be something of a "coke dealer to the stars." He said some of his biggest clients were Robin Williams (duh), Penny Marshall and Johnny Carson. I believe he said Penny sold to other celebs. I have no idea if this was true, but pretty much all of Hollywood was coked out in the 80s.

Johnny Carson used coke? I knew he was a drunk, but coke...would not have guessed that. He just didn't seem to have the demeanor, and also, he was in his sixties when coke was at its zenith. That's really dangerous for people his age.

Whatever happened to Penny's nepotist fail daughter Tracy?

In her biography, Penny goes into detail about every recreational drug she took, and there were a lot of them -- all through her life. She never expressed regrets about her drug use, which is refreshing considering many Hollywood celebs do a mea culpa for sympathy.

Cindy became close to Penny during Penny's cancer battle, and would often visit Penny at her home where they would lie in bed together, eat junk food, and watch TV. Sounds rather sweet.

Full text of her biography is linked at R2.

She tried heroin and didn't like it:

[quote]In early 1982, I participated in the Night of 100 Stars, a fund-raiser for the Actors’ Fund of America. Taped for TV, it was a clusterfuck of confusion once Warren Beatty, Elizabeth Taylor, Diane Keaton, Dudley Moore, Liza Minnelli, and others descended on New York’s Radio City Music Hall. I went with Saturday Night Live writer Tom Schiller, and we were there all day and some of the night. I saw Gina Lollobrigida sleeping against a coat rack, and the producers forgot a frail and aged James Cagney was waiting beneath the stage in his wheelchair.

[quote]Afterward, a bunch of us went to a club where Cher sang and Robin Williams entertained. Following hours of standing around and taking direction, we all let loose and partied. I went to the bathroom and overheard Bobby De Niro and Al Pacino outside the men’s room, saying, “So who’s taking Liz [Taylor] home?”

[quote]I kept thinking one major star was missing from the festivities: my friend John Belushi. John had dropped off my radar — and most everyone else’s — after making Larry Kasdan’s movie Continental Divide. I heard he was bored. I wasn’t at my best when I was bored, and John was worse. Merely walking down the street with him was an experience. People gave him drugs. They pressed it into his hand or shoved it into his pocket — and he’d do it.

[quote]With John, there was no such thing as casual drug use. I knew John Landis had fought with him on The Blues Brothers about the amount of coke he did. I had witnessed him in action myself. We were once at a party where he led me into the bathroom and pulled out a bindle of heroin. He said I could try some, too. I flushed it down the toilet. “Don’t fuck with that stuff,” I said. I had tried heroin once. It made me carsick. The person who gave it to me said it was an acquired taste. I didn’t need to acquire that taste.

[quote]Artie didn’t like it, either, thank God. When others were chipping on weekends, he was my ally in not doing it, and I will always be grateful to him for giving me the wherewithal to keep saying no. I wish John had done the same.

Around this time, Paramount-based producer Don Simpson asked me to direct The Joy of Sex, an adaptation of the bestselling how-to book by Dr. Alex Comfort. He showed me a script from John Hughes, the first one from the prolific screenwriter who went on to write Sixteen Candles and Home Alone. It was done as a series of vignettes, and it was funny. I thought the parts that didn’t work could be easily fixed.

With Laverne & Shirley going into its eighth season, I liked the idea of a new challenge. I received encouragement from friends, including Jim Brooks and Steven Spielberg. Steven compared directing to babysitting. He jokingly pointed out that I already sat on the phone with half of Hollywood at night, dispensing advice. Why not get paid for it? I asked Barry Diller what he thought I should do. Even though The Joy of Sex wasn’t his kind of picture — he made Reds, after all — I knew he would tell me the truth — and he did.

I didn't mean to paste the last two paragraphs ^

Lots of people get sick the first time they use heroin. After a few more tries they grow to love it. I think Penny Marshall probably would have, too. That being said, she ran with that whole druggie SNL crowd. She was to have directed John Belushi in "The Joy of Sex", a comedy based on the book of the same name. Belushi was supposed to have played characters in different stages of sexual maturation; in one segment he was going to be an infant in diapers. That God THAT movie never got made.

Belushi was fucking insufferable, I never found him funny.

R66, I have no idea if the story about Carson was true, but what I recall being told is that he used massive amounts of coke but he did not buy it directly (i.e., the customer claimed it was for Carson). Frankly, I was more shocked about Penny M.

Carson did have a lot of facial ticks and mannerisms consistent with coke users.

I hate to write this but...did she partake with Whitney?

I consider myself fairly knowledgeable about Johnny Carson and I’ve never heard anything about him and drugs, particularly cocaine. Alcohol, yes, but not drugs.

Carson did have major heart problems in his sixties.

Her and Cindy patched things up not long after the show went off the air. They had a “agree to disagree” understanding about the show and why it ended the way it did. Penny felt that if her and Cindy could’ve got together one and one and hashed things out, they could’ve worked everything out.

Penny’s first husband was a college football player and she didnt have anything bad to say about him. Did rob reiner actually adopt her? Penny wrote that her first husbands parents helped raise Tracy and she spent a big portion of her childhood living with them.

Brilliant at physical comedy with Cindy.

Couldn't get past the condo board but Louie DePalma did.

All I can say about DeFazio is that she was a bimbo back then...nothin' but a bimbo...

I want to hear the part from the book when Penny dropped acid with Mary Tyler Moore.

What was Artie's grief?

His girlfriend Laurie bird killed herself r82

Eek.

I love you R16 My father has the gist of your mother's mental health diagnosis but I have a feeling he's far older.

Penny Marshall seemingly had a good time of things. She lived a rich and full life and did what she pleased. Good for her!

I think she had her own thing going with Carrie Fisher. They were sisters from different misters (if you will) who had a deep bond.

The fonz was far from good looking

He looked old as shit too. Wasn't Fonzie supposed to be around 20-ish?

30 years old play teens and 35/40 year olds play 20s.

Fonz was comical, but not hot by any means

Penny directed The Vagina Monologues in the early 2000s in LA and an acquaintance was in it. She said Penny's girlfriend was at the theater a lot and Penny was "quietly" out.

Re: Johnny Carson and cocaine. He was known to drink a lot of alcohol. Back when I did do cocaine, it just went hand-in-hand with alcohol. It somehow enabled me to drink more with less of the down-sides of drinking. It was an enjoyable combination.

Now, I don't do coke and I also don't drink.

Anjelica Huston on Penny Marshall:

[quote] Early on in her career, she became friends with Penny Marshall, who died last year, but according to Huston, the friendship dwindled over the years.

[quote] “Her habits conflicted with mine,” Huston explained. “She stayed up all night smoking cigarettes in subzero temperatures. Her rooms were freezing. Like air-conditioned, way up. She stayed up all night, followed QVC for beanbag dolls and stuff. She had this collection of sports memorabilia. She had a sort of museum in her basement full of signed baseballs and Lakers shirts. I just couldn’t relate. And also, frankly, she took a lot of coke.”

[quote] Huston says she’s unsure if Marshall’s “habits” continued all the way to the end of her life because they fell out of touch before her 2018 passing.

There is a longer article in Vulture, but it's paywalled if you've reached your limit of articles in Vulture.

The Fonz was packing if you know what I mean.

R91 back in the 90s I worked with a guy who told me he nearly died of alcohol poisoning at a wedding because he was so high on coke he didn't know how drunk he was as he was drinking.

R92 yeah I’m sorry don’t be catty and bitchy about the dead like that - especially someone who was once your good friend. And she was such a druggie herself so really Shes differentiating to try to feel superior to someone who may have been “more” of a druggie than she? At least Penny didn’t enable Polanskitje rapist. She sounds insufferable and full of herself.

Henry Winkler was hot for a hot minute. Which reminds me. Why did The Fonz say his catchphrase "Sit on it" only to guys...

R96 He’s such a nice guy. That’s attractive. And even though he was type cast he’s genuinely talented.

R95 I'm in agreement. Don't be a horrid bitch to a dead friend. They can't defend themselves. Angelica comes across as a cold bitch with oversized ego.

I thought the Fonz was hot when I was a kid, and still find him attractive in that time period.

Honestly, even now I find him appealing in a gentle way, like how I imagine I'd want a husband to be when I'm older.

She was a real one. And apparently a very kind, yet tough, person. Her motto was “Try hard, play by the rules, help your friends, don’t get too crazy and have fun.” She was salt of the earth in Hollywood and she was respected. And she was talented.

They were dolls.

What Angelica Huston said about her was harsh, but it was the truth. I'd heard the same things about her from other sources.

Y'all mean she never came out? Gurl..

She was a homebody.

R101 It was harsh and it didn’t need to be said in an interview. There’s an honor among thieves. Anjelica Huston should have respected their history and said nothing.

No, R104. The dead don't care and their fans have an unquenchable thirst for more information. Give it to them unvarnished.

We lie when we pretend drug use was always demonized.

The QVC and beanbag dolls allegations were more embarrassing than the cocaine allegations.

I really enjoyed her book

Jon Lovitz and Joe Pesci lived with her for a year.

For sure, R106!

😂😂😂

Penny sounds like my kinda gal. Anjelica sounds like a bore.

R105 But Penny was very open and unapologetic about her drug use. She never hid it and I doubt Anjelica Huston was asked directly about it. She tried reducing a dead woman to her quirks and drug use.

I never bought Anjelica Huston's trash talking of Penny Marshall. All the druggies that she hung out with and she's complaining about Penny doing coke? She defends rapists but draws the line at Beanie Babies? Come on.

R112 = Serial sharter on the DL

Anjelica is God. She has the right to dispense her judgments where She wishes.

R112 Anjelica Huston was in the house when Roman Polanski raped that child, so she should STFU.

R113 What, exactly, makes Anjelica Huston a god?

[quote}What made Penny Marshall such a A list scenster?

She was funnier the fuck. That's what.

She also directed A League of Their Own and Big.

Anjie sho is ugly.

More importantly, Oprah won't talk to her.

Penny Marshall also made the wonderful and rather underrated Awakenings.

I was just going to ask why nobody brings up Awakenings, r119.

Angelica is a product of nepotism

I watched those Foundation one on one interviews on YouTube with Penny and I always thought she was on the spectrum. She has a really interesting take on some of the questions. In some of the interviews, Cindy pulls her back to the question at hand. I always found her directing work to be amazing. I never figured out why the Happy Days group found her hot.

Early 1970s commercial with Penny and Farrah Fawcett. The director referred to Penny as the “homely girl” in the script. Marshall got upset and Fawcett went after the director for referring to her as homely and demanded that it be changed. Penny said just change it to plain, that was about the best I can do next to you

Another early Penny commercial with Tom Selleck, Teri Garr and Patri Deutsch.

I remember that article, r118. She complains about Penny using a lot of coke but then excuses Jack Nicholson by saying he used it "like espresso" and "the way Freud did." Ridiculous. She's a ridiculous woman.

Let’s not forget Penny Marshall fended off two ninja burglars who broke into her home. She disarmed them with her natural charisma. Let’s see Anjelica Huston do that.

Here’s the link

Penny & Farrah had a lot of chemistry together! Missed opportunity for a sitcom.

Yeah every time Anjelica opens her mouth, I like her less. I also read her book and I'd much rather do lines with Penny

16 Reasons

Penny vs. Ninja Robbers was a riveting read

Reread the Anjelica / Page Six article again. Oprah does sound like a bitch.

Anjelica's complaining about how her deceased husband's death & the financial impact:

[quote] In 2008, Huston lost her husband, Robert Graham, to a rare condition called granulomatosis with polyangiitis, a condition that causes inflammation of blood vessels. Because of his passing, Huston says she can’t take a break from work.

[quote] “I was left with no money, less than no money … He didn’t have medical insurance. It was like a sword of Damocles that came out of the blue,” she said. “I would have to say, apart from a few days directly following my mother’s death, that it was the worst time of my life, partly because everyone thought that I had lots and lots of money.”

Husband had no health insurance? They're both not young. Sounds dumb.

[quote]Her motto was “Try hard, play by the rules, help your friends, don’t get too crazy and have fun.”

But the thing with drug use is that you don't know how your body will react to it before you start taking it. Some people don't get addicted and some do. So it may have been easy for her, but for some of her friends it obviously wasn't.

And one wonders how much of a role all that recreational drug use played in Carrie Fisher's mental health struggles as well. The last fifteen or so years of her life seemed to be really tumultuous. I think Penny distanced herself from Carrie because of all the drama. Watching that Debbie Reynolds/ Carrie documentary was just heartbreaking.

Penny also was a chain smoker, I think. She was overweight as well. I'd guess she was a baby-taster and ate stuff like Pop Tarts. I can also picture her drinking lots of Coke or Diet Coke, all day long. She probably did snort coke for late-night benders in her sub-zero basement memorabilia room, shopping QVC, smoking cigs, etc.

Carrie's drug use was probably off the charts compared to Penny's.

Penny's drug use was probably slightly more than Anjelica's. Anjelica sounds like she's made some bad decisions in her life and blames others.

This is my thread, you fat whores, not Anjelica's!

R134 The milk and pepsi thing was real. I’m sure Penny drank a lot of that. The milk has to go in first.

Madame Alexander was kind...

Fuck Penny Marshall. I wanna know all about The Big Ragu

Could you imagine fucking the Meathead? Yeesh.

What did Penny say about Whoppi ?

"She's gassy."

I still think this is funny I don’t care what any of you bitches think.

I don't think Angelica was "trashing" Penny at all; she was just being honest in stating how their lifestyles diverged to such a degree that a close friendship was no longer possible. It's fairly obvious that Angie is not the type to sit around the house in sweatpants for days on end, bingeing junk food and watching shitty TV, and the fact she's still living today suggests she put her '70s/'80s party days behind her while Penny clearly hadn't. Sadly I'm sure most of us have had to end friendships/relationships because of substance abuse or felt powerless when a friend's clinical depression made them reclusive/uninterested in social interaction. That AH was being matter-of-fact about what happened shouldn't be construed as a moral judgment.

^ He doesn't do a very good Penny, r142.

What did Penny say about Drew Barrymore? TIA.

Terrible lisp.

[quote]It's fairly obvious that Angie is not the type to sit around the house in sweatpants for days on end, bingeing junk food and watching shitty TV, and the fact she's still living today suggests she put her '70s/'80s party days behind her while Penny clearly hadn't.

She weighs as much if not more than Penny did so I don't think we can safely say she doesn't binge on junk food. And there are plenty of her druggie peers who are still alive (Liza, for one) so who lived and who died doesn't seem to be much of an indicator of anything.

The sticking point for me was the "Jack only used coke like it was espresso, thoughtfully like Freud" while saying she and Penny weren't friends anymore because Penny "did a lot of coke."

Anjelica is the definition of male identified.

Anjelica is what is now called a “pick me”

Angelica is an overgrown thumb.

Who gives a shit? I like that Anjelica, as shitty as she is, is open about it. She has never pretended to be some "sisterhood" type which is so refreshing to me. Women mostly despise each other.

I love R16 makes a thread about Penny completely about herself, adding info that none of us care about and then expects us to believe it's HER MOM that has BDP!

Sure, Jan.

[quote] The QVC and beanbag dolls allegations were more embarrassing than the cocaine allegations.

That part kind of reminded me of the stories about Candy and Tori Spelling and their beanie baby collection. I also vaguely recall stories of Delta Burke being a shoppign addict and hoarder and rent 8 storage lockers to store crap that didn't fit in her house.

Tapa...tapa...

Every time I heard Eddie Mekka sing about rags to riches I wanted slam my nuts in car door

Diabetes did her in finally at 75.

[quote]What did Penny say about Drew Barrymore? TIA.

Not a whole lot, here's what she said about filming Riding in Cars With Boys:

[quote]Jim Brooks had gotten ahold of the rights to Riding in Cars with Boys from Sara Colleton, who had optioned Beverly Donofrio’s memoir about getting pregnant at fifteen and overcoming numerous challenges on her way to getting a degree and becoming a writer. After reading the script, I didn’t love it. But, as Jim probably knew would happen when he pushed the project in front of me, I identified with the character from my own experiences of having a kid and getting married. Even if a girl hasn’t gone through that she’s probably thought, What if.

[quote]My wheels began turning. I had people in New York read actresses for the part of Beverly and I read them like crazy at my house. I brought in Kate Hudson, Marisa Tomei (I didn’t need her to play ball in this one), and Reese Witherspoon, who was pregnant and asked me not to videotape her. I said fine. So she read and did a good job. Hillary Swank and Angelina Jolie both came in. Anne Hathaway did, too. But she was too young. I sent her over to my brother, who used her in The Princess Diaries and said thank you to me.

[quote]I had readings for the other parts, too. I wasn’t even through the list of actresses and actors being sent to me and I could have cut a whole movie together just from my readings. But then Jim came to me and suggested [bold]Drew Barrymore[/bold] for the lead. He saw her in the role. I thought she was a terrific girl and very nice, but I had Marisa and Kate in mind. It didn’t matter. Amy Pascal, the studio president, informed me that Jim had already promised the part to [bold[Drew[/bold]. I was furious. If that was the case, why not tell me? That’s all I ever asked from anyone. Tell me the truth. I wouldn’t have wasted so many people’s time, including mine. So I hired Brittany Murphy as her best friend, added Sara Gilbert, and got ready to go.

[quote]Then suddenly we had to put everything on hold and wait for Charlie’s Angels to wrap. Once we did start, nothing was smooth. [bold]Drew[/bold] didn’t think my Academy Award–winning cinematographer, Chris Menges, was lighting her properly. Chris explained why she was wrong. But Jim made me fire Chris, one of the nicest people in the business, and I had to bring Miroslav out of retirement. I brought in Jimmy Woods to play Beverly’s father, but he was on a movie with Denzel that went long, requiring me to shoot pieces of scenes as I waited for him. Lorraine Bracco, who played his wife, would say a line that should have had Jimmy there to respond to, but what could I do?

[quote]The script also drove me crazy; there were no transitions. I’d call Steve Zahn in all the time to make them up as we went along. One time he said, “Can I bring my dog?” I said, ‘Sure.” I didn’t care who or what was there as long as I could get from one part to the next. I mean we saw Beverly as a child, then as a teen, then raising her child, and then as an author needing permission from her ex before she could publish her book. There were no in-betweens. It just skipped years. Plus Jim, who could normally be counted on for his share of brilliant ideas, was going through a divorce and producing What About Joan, a television series with Joan Cusack, so he was a little preoccupied. It all was a mess from the get-go. As a general rule, don’t work with people who are getting divorced. They’re thinking about other things.

[quote]We shot a bit on City Island, in New York, but spent the bulk of production in New Jersey. We built our own town on the campus of the defunct Upsala College, in East Orange. After we finished, the fire department set fire to the homes and storefronts we’d built and used them for practice. Meanwhile, I brought in people I knew, like Rosie Perez, who was funny, and David Moscow, who had been in Big. If he could understand me when he was twelve, I figured he could do even better now in his twenties, and he did.

[quote]Brittany Murphy was also a trouper. She would work through anything. She was sick as a dog when we shot a scene where Drew’s kid fell in the pool. No problem. I also knew she could sing; I’d seen her test for the Janis Joplin movie that never got made. So I asked her to sing “Soldier Boy.” She jumped into it. No problem. I appreciated that attitude. [bold]Drew[bold] required more finesse and patience. However, Miroslav was able to say whatever he wanted to her because he didn’t speak any known language, so she always thought it was something nice.

[quote]This was the first of all the pictures I did where I felt less than fully in control of the challenges, and it was because I didn’t I have any support. Even when Whoopi was angry on Jumpin’ Jack Flash, I had Joel Silver and Larry Gordon backing me up. Jim was going through too much shit to pay attention, and his response when he did focus was usually a variation of “Well, cut to Drew.” He wanted all Drew, all the time. That might have worked in another movie, but this wasn’t one of them. There was too much other stuff going on.

[quote]We’d had several screenings for the studio and had sort of finished putting it together when 9/11 happened. The studio pushed all the violent movies back and asked if we could come out in October. I said sure. The movie wasn’t going to get any better. It was what it was. The bigger problem was getting people into the theaters. The president of the United States was warning the public to stay away from malls. Where were we going to open?

[quote]I wanted a premiere in New York. Besides drawing attention to the movie, it would serve as a positive event for the city. It was shot in New York. We had a New York crew. Most of the actors were from the East. And as a New Yorker myself, I thought it was important to show the terrorists and the world that the United States was not going to be intimidated and New York City was not going to be stopped. But Jim said no. Like many others, he didn’t want to come in from L.A. I was furious. I took it personally.

[quote]I called Lorne and said I needed a date for [bold]Drew[/bold] to host Saturday Night Live. He said fine, no problem, and put her on the October 13 show. However, unbeknownst to me, she didn’t get on the plane from Los Angeles to rehearse. I got the call from Lorne. “Guess what? She’s not here.” Eventually she showed up, but fled again when an envelope containing white powder and a note stating that it was anthrax was delivered to NBC’s offices at 30 Rock.

[quote]I called Ronald Perelman and said I needed his security people, all ex-cops, to find [bold]Drew[/bold]. They located her in the doorway of her hotel and took her to their doctor. Rosie O’Donnell was ready to fill in. “Look, I’m already on Cipro,” she said, referring to the antibiotic that was a treatment for those exposed to anthrax. But [bold]Drew[/bold] resurfaced in time, summoned her courage, and did the show. Her monologue was an accurate account of what had happened. “I was so afraid to fly here — so I canceled my trip,” she said. “And then I saw Giuliani on television saying to be brave. So, the next day I got on an airplane. Then we started rehearsing, and I got calm, I got really excited. And then, yesterday, they discovered anthrax in the building! So, I immediately left. I went back to the hotel, and I thought again about being brave. So I came back, and I’m here, and you’re here, and you’re being brave, too! And I thank you for it! And I want to thank my husband, because he’s here and he’s supporting me — Tom, thank you!” They cut to comedian Tom Green, who was sitting in the front wearing a gas mask.

Sorry about the bold at R158

Drew sounds just as exhausting as you'd imagine.

Well, Drew knew Penny didn't want her. Marshall should have bailed on the project.

Drew (and Marisa) were too old for the role.

I'm glad it wasn't Kate Hudson, but Drew was the weak link in that cast.

I agree with Penny that the movie is missing something. Maybe it was that the movie was rushed into theaters and it wasn't given enough time to work on, or it was the casting of Drew. I had wanted to see it because I was a fan of Penny and Drews and others in the movie (Brittany Murphy, Sara Gilbert) but once I got around to watching it, it left me cold. It didn't tug at the strings the way Big, Awakenings, and A League of Their Own did.

Penny also seems oddly detached about the whole experience as well in her book. I don't think she ever directed again after that.

R43 I NEED to remember to get both volumes if Huston's autobiography. I ADORE her.

Her Miss Botz will live forever in the annals of cinematic history.

About her 1984 abortion:

[quote]At the end of December, I went to see A Passage to India with Jack Nicholson and Anjelica Huston. The state of California had just passed a law prohibiting smoking in movie theaters. Jack and I smoked anyway.

[quote]Jack and Anjelica and I decided we wanted to have a New Year’s party. None of us, it turned out, had plans, though actually organizing it was a careful negotiation as we were all a little territorial. Jack wanted it at his house, Anjelica wanted it at hers, and I wanted it at mine.

[quote]Finally, Jack got producer Lou Adler to open his Sunset Strip nightclub, On the Rox, and we had a party there.

[quote]It quickly became the party. Jim Brooks, Deborah Winters, Warren Beatty, Debra Winger, Harry Dean Stanton, Tim Hutton . . . everyone came.

[quote]I was surprised at how many famous people had nothing to do on New Year’s. We stayed up late and then a bunch of us went to Canter’s deli in the morning for breakfast. As I recall, Sean Penn and I were the last to get dropped off there.

[quote]My New Year’s resolution was to get out of town. I needed a new backdrop, a change of scenery. I found a willing accomplice in Joe Pesci. I knew Joe through Robert De Niro, whom I’d met years earlier in Hawaii when I was with Rob. Joe had come to Carrie’s and my birthday parties. He was living in the Mayflower Hotel in New York but needed to be in L.A. for a movie. It was perfect. We swapped places — sort of. He ended up staying at my house for three years.

[quote]I’m serious. He overlapped with Jim Belushi. My niece Penny Lee also lived there. Others camped out, too. One morning she walked into the kitchen and found Joe and ballet great Mikhail Baryshnikov eating breakfast. Baryshnikov made her eggs. Once, Joe called to tell me the toilet was broken. I said, “Are your fingers broken? Call someone to get it fixed.” I think that’s when he began to think of it as his house. He still does.

[quote]He wasn’t alone. At another point, Louise Lasser and Michael O’Donoghue occupied different guest rooms. Michael and Mitch Glaser wrote the Bill Murray movie Scrooged there. Friends knew my door was always open.

[quote]New York turned out to the refresher I wanted. I did a reading of Eden Court, a light comedy about two couples living in a trailer park. Melanie Griffith, John Goodman, and Guy Boyd were already committed to the Off-Broadway production, with Barnet Kellman as the director. Following the reading, they asked me to be in it, too, and I said sure, why not? I hadn’t done a play since I lived in Albuquerque. I thought it would be fun to work in front of an audience and be around people who stayed up late and smoked, like me.

[quote]Before rehearsals started, though, Melanie got pregnant and dropped out, and John jumped ship to the Broadway musical Big River. Ben Masters replaced John, and Ellen Barkin stepped in for Melanie. As we got ready for previews, the play’s author, Murphy Guyer, hated one of us each week. The play was at the Promenade Theater on the Upper West Side. I was excited about getting in front of an audience. Having come from three cameras, I knew the audience would tell you whether the material worked and exactly where the problems were. You didn’t need tons of previews; all you had to do was listen the first night.

[quote]I liked hanging out in the theater. I was reminded of my days with the Civic Light Opera in Albuquerque. Developing the piece onstage exercised new muscles and let me apply the experience I had in a new way. Since I wasn’t in the opening scene, I would listen from the dressing room and tell Ellen where she was walking through her laughs. “That’s a joke,” I said. “Let the audience laugh. Take the butter dish, put it in the refrigerator, and then go on to the next.” She has credited me for teaching her comedy.

[quote]My own entrance was a challenge that I worked on. I came in from nowhere, with no warning, and had to get the audience’s attention without angering them, as I went into a long speech. I played it as if I were out of breath and struggled to get the words out. “You’re not going to believe . . . what happened . . .” Gradually, I crossed over to Ellen and, as I did, I brought the theater with me. Later, Ellen told me that she hadn’t ever seen a performer direct an audience like that. She hadn’t spent eight years doing a three-camera sitcom.

[quote]The New York Times critic Frank Rich singled out Ellen’s performance (“If it were possible to give the kiss of life to a corpse, the actress Ellen Barkin would be the one to do it”) and praised the rest of us, including Barnet’s direction. The problem, he said, was with the script. I knew that was the case. During previews, I had brought in friends to help fix it — Jim Brooks, my brother, everyone in the world. I was like, Why do you think they call Neil Doc Simon? If something doesn’t work, you fix it. But the writer wouldn’t change a word.

[quote]In the meantime, I starred in an off-stage drama of my own. Backstage one afternoon, Ellen noticed that my breasts were larger and my clothes seemed more snug. “Are you pregnant?” she asked. It turned out I was. I hadn’t been thinking about it because I wasn’t with anyone at the time. I thought it might be Artie’s, but I wasn’t seeing him anymore. It must have been Immaculate Conception, I told myself. I didn’t know what to do.

[quote]What I did was talk to everyone who I trusted or who might have been involved. Those who had children said, “You did it already.” Others pointed out that I could afford to raise another child. Money wasn’t the point. I barely had five dollars when Tracy was born. I debated the issues. Did I want Artie in my life forever? Did he want a child? Did I want a child? Would I be able to live with myself if I didn’t have the baby?

[quote]Joe Pesci touched me by offering to be the child’s father. As much as I loved Joe, I said no thanks. I sat with my brother and his wife Barbara and made a list of pros and cons. I asked my daughter, who confessed to some experiences of her own that I didn’t know anything about. I was shocked. But it didn’t sway me one way or another.

[quote]Ultimately, we all live our own lives and make decisions based on many factors, including whether we can live with them, right or wrong. Who knows what’s right or wrong? There’s no one-size-fits all answer. It comes down to the individual. I had never had an abortion, and I didn’t want to be that person who did. But . . . I just didn’t know until I had to know.

[quote]The play didn’t run that much longer. After it closed, I decided to terminate the pregnancy. I did it with a heavy heart. My friend Carol took me. My shrink, who I’d also been talking to, came with us. I was the one person who always said I hadn’t had an abortion, and then I was one of those people. It’s the one thing I’ve regretted most. It fit that difficult time of my life. I guess everyone goes through a blue period. This was mine.

ts:cr

R147 Penny's cocaine habit was clearly different from Jack Nicholson's, so I don't understand why the distinction Anjelica draws is so hard for you to accept. Like most other famous female cokeheads of her day (Carrie Fisher, Mackenzie Phillips, Tatum O'Neal, Melanie Griffith, Julia Phillips, probably Anjelica too), Penny's habit was tied to her insecurity, depression and social anxiety, problems that cocaine at first glance seems to fix. Jack Nicholson, for all of his faults, was not a sad homely girl trying to be the life of the party. His habit didn't become an addiction that drove away friends and lovers (he had other ways of repelling people) or negatively affected his career. Both Jack and Anjelica were messy and made bad career choices, but they also made movies that are aesthetically and historically significant; Penny made commercial, sentimental schlock that people remember fondly nowadays because it makes them nostalgic for their youth. I mean, the Preacher's Wife? Renaissance Man? Jumping Jack Flash?

And even Liza eventually traded coke for pills like any self-respecting grande dame.

I like that Penny and Joe Pesci were friends and that he lived at her house (I'm sure she had a huge house) for 3 years and offered to be the "father" of her baby when she was pregnant.

I never liked Joe Pesci. I always imagined he was mean and crazy, like his characters in Goodfellas and Casino. This humanizes him a lot.

I'm surprised Drew Barrymore was such a pain in the ass and hard to deal with. I had never heard that. She's third generation in acting, so, you'd think she'd be more professional and more of a trouper (the show must go on!).

I have never seen Riding in Cars with Boys. Sara Gilbert was in it; did she bring anything to the role? She seems so dull, to me. Then again, she and Penny have that same deadpan way of talking, so maybe Penny liked that.

[quote]I saw her scouting film locations in the Bowery in 1998. I remember a group of people surrounding her, and she looked pretty “no-nonsense”, with a metal clipboard binder.

That was for the opening of "Riding In Cars With Boys" where Drew is driving and picks up Adam Garcia around the corner of Bowery, on Elizabeth Street. I lived on Elizabeth for a few years.

Penny and Cindy stayed friends. They did autograph shows together. I have L&V Season 1 signed by both with the inscription "Betty Please" and when Cindy booked a national tour of "Nunsense", Penny taught her how to tap dance. Penny's Mom ran a dance studio back in NY.

All actresses are protective of how they look on camera. Drew knew she was too old for the role. It doesn't sound like she was being unnecessarily difficult. As for the 9/11 stuff, it shouldn't surprise that someone in New York might be a nervous wreck.

A little Laverne and Shirley went a long way for me, but they were talented, great in those roles and had great chemistry. I wonder if the show was made now if they would still clean them up from their original Happy Days version where they not quite as "good "(especially Shirley). The later Shirley would probably be shocked at the version she played in her initial guest star appearance.

I wonder how Simon and Garfunkel are getting along these days. Hopefully they are in good standing. As talented as Simon was on his own, and had the song writing skills etc. that Garfunkel never had - I prefer the stuff he did with Art.

On YouTube, there are lots of those "Archives of American Television" interviews posted. I think there's one of Cindy and Penny, together. They seem like they had a rift due to Cindy's husband (Bill Hudson, ex-husband of Goldie Hawn, bio father of Kate Hudson). It's such a head-scratcher to me when someone allows their spouse, who has nothing to do with anything, to interfere in work / income / livelihood.

[quote] As for the 9/11 stuff, it shouldn't surprise that someone in New York might be a nervous wreck.

That's true. It must have been a nerve-wracking time.

Because they lack the cojones to do their own dirty work...

"Big" Nominated best Actor and Best Original Screenplay

"Awakenings" Nominated for Best Picture, Best Actor DeNiro and Adapted Screenplay

"Awakenings" and "Ghost" were nominated for Best Picture but directors Penny Marshall and Jerry Zucker were snubbed for Barbet Schroeder for "Reversal of Fortune" and Stephen Frears for "The Grifters", neither Best Picture nominees

Rosie only hosted SNL once.

I wonder why. She was good.

People look down on daytime.

This is Top 10 of all-time SNL for me.

[quote]On YouTube, there are lots of those "Archives of American Television" interviews posted. I think there's one of Cindy and Penny, together. They seem like they had a rift due to Cindy's husband (Bill Hudson, ex-husband of Goldie Hawn, bio father of Kate Hudson).

It looks like this is true...

[quote]Over the years I had seen Cindy in a number of relationships, but never one where she fell as fast or as hard as she did for Bill Hudson. Best known as one-third of the musical comedy trio The Hudson Brothers, he had split with Goldie Hawn following a brief marriage that produced two children, Oliver and Kate, before meeting Cindy at a celebrity softball game in 1981. In March 1982, Cindy got pregnant, and two months later, after Bill finalized his divorce from Goldie Hawn, they married. I went to the wedding. There was a lot of pink. Everything seemed good.

[quote]I was happy for Cindy and supportive. I thought, She’s pregnant; let her be healthy and happy, and we’ll figure out a way to deal with her growing belly on the show. At the time, we were headed into our eighth season. We had the show down. I didn’t see why it had to be a big deal.

[quote]But it was. In May she told the studio about her pregnancy and began negotiating an out date of her own. I was in New York and followed the details long-distance. She was due in November and only wanted to act in thirteen episodes, insisting she finish in October so that she could rest through the end of her pregnancy. She also indicated a willingness to make small appearances after the first of the year if more episodes were ordered. In any event, whether she did thirteen or slightly more, she wanted to be paid for a full season of episodes, and she wanted her hours kept to a minimum. Everyone said okay.

[quote]A month later — the same month Tracy graduated from high school — Bill, now acting as her manager, delivered an additional set of demands, including more money, a Winnebago trailer, and shorter workdays not to exceed eight hours. I think Bill wanted credit, too. But Paramount balked. I guess they’d had their fill of demands the previous month.

[quote]By the time we began shooting in July, Cindy was one very unhappy pregnant actress. I thought I could talk sense to her the way I had years earlier, alone and logically. I said, “Take all the dialogue. Go home after four hours. Have them write all your scenes with you lying in bed. Be the biggest pain-in-the-ass pregnant person. I’ll do the running around. Let’s just do the work.” But she deferred to Bill. She was in love and thought Bill was taking care of her.

[quote]Whatever the reason, we managed to get through the first two episodes, “The Mummy’s Bride” and “Window on Main Street,” and then she was gone. It all just blew up. I tried calling Cindy at home, thinking I could work out the problem. Bill refused to let me speak to her. I ended up not talking to her for years because Bill wouldn’t let me.

[quote]Soon lawyers got involved, allegations flew, and she went to the press, claiming the studio wanted to exclude her from the series or “drastically reduce her participation.” She also told TV Guide, “What they want to do is axe me out of the show, and finally give it all to Penny.” It was all absurd.

[quote]As this transpired, I realized that I had to get out of directing The Joy of Sex. I couldn’t handle developing a movie at the same time the show was blowing up. I jetted to New York, where I hid out at Lorne’s house in Amagansett while the studio negotiated with Cindy. If she wasn’t going to do the show, I didn’t want to do it, either. It was Laverne AND Shirley. However, my agent said I had to come back. Mike Ovitz explained that walking out, or in my case, hiding out, was not an option. “We did enough episodes,” I said. “Let’s just stop.”

[quote]“That’s not the way it works,” he said. “It’s not your call.”

[quote]“I don’t want to come back,” I said.

[quote]“You have to,” he said. “They’ll sue you.”

[quote]I flew back and met with Gary Nardino, Paramount’s president of TV. I asked for double or nothing. I didn’t even go to Ovitz. I said, “Since I’m here and it’s Laverne AND Shirley, I get her money and her points. If she comes back, it reverts. But if I’ve got to do it alone and explain to the goddamn audience why she ain’t here, it’s got to be worth more money.”

[quote]They gave me the money.

[quote]I went back to work, but the show was a mess. Although the show’s title stayed the same, Shirley was edited out of the opening montage and her absence was explained in a note she left behind saying that she moved suddenly overseas with her husband. I recall the log in the TV Guide saying that Laverne was depressed and then angry that Shirley would only write a few words and not say good-bye. I felt the same way in real life. I was depressed, angry, and hurt.

[quote]The following week things went from bad to worse. I was injured on the set. In the episode, Laverne takes a job at an aerospace company. Bored, she slips into an antigravity suit. As we shot the big comedic scene, I was in a harness attached to wires and spun all over the room. During rehearsals, my brother and I had a to-do because I didn’t wear a helmet. It was hot.

[quote]“I don’t care,” Garry said. “The next time you do it, you put on the damn helmet.”

[quote]That was at the taping. I did as my brother said. I wore a helmet — and I was lucky I did. As I flew over the stage, one of the wires snapped and I fell to the floor with a thud that just stopped time. Everyone froze. Director Tom Trbovich yelled cut as my driver, Clarence, watching from the wings, raced over to me. I told him not to touch me. I stayed down and assessed the damage. My toes moved. My fingers moved. I was breathing. But my upper body hurt like hell.

[quote]Phil Foster was already entertaining the audience, distracting them with jokes that Garry had written for his act twenty-five years earlier. Ironically, my brother wasn’t on the set that night. I heard someone say they were going to take me to the hospital. Then I could come back to finish. No, I didn’t think so.

[quote]Slowly, I got up on one knee and said I wasn’t going anywhere. I called the cast together and said I didn’t want to come back and do this shit over again. Instead, I showed those who still had scenes with me where they could touch me (my head, the right side of my body) and where they couldn’t (my left shoulder, the left side of my body). Then we finished the show. I could’ve sued, but I didn’t want some prop guy to get reamed. Shit happens.

[quote]Later, I did go to the hospital. That was funny — trying to explain to the ER doc that I hurt myself while flying across the room in an astronaut suit. Luckily, nothing was broken. I’d heal. I went home, took a Quaalude, and reported to work the next day.

[quote]The rest of the season was simply painful. At least I still had my November “out” date from the movie. I wouldn’t have to work through March. To get through the remaining episodes, I called friends, including Laraine Newman, Carol Kane, Louise Lasser, Anjelica Houston, Jimmy Belushi, and Larry Breeding, who I’d gone out with for about a month while Artie was off walking God knows where. Carrie also came on; she was a Playboy bunny with me.

[quote]We taped that episode (Laverne gets a job as a Playboy bunny) the same week Tracy left for Bennington College. My niece took her; I had to work. I was in a bunny costume as I hugged her good-bye in front of the soundstage. Carrie cracked, “Study hard and one day you can be as successful as your mother.”

[quote]Finally, after 178 episodes, Laverne & Shirley taped its final episode (“Here Today, Hair Tomorrow”). The series went out with a whimper. The last show focused on Carmine (Eddie Mekka). I was barely in it, Michael had left to work with Rob on This Is Spinal Tap, and Cindy was long gone. Although lawsuits from her departure made the end more bitter than sweet, the memories from the eight seasons were positive. We had done more good episodes than bad ones and provided millions of people with laughs. I was proud. Between reruns and syndication around the world, I felt confident that Laverne & Shirley would always be best friends.

[quote]It turned out I was right.

She is a world class name dropper.

The last season was at that point where they just stopped pretending that they were in the 60's. Laverne had an eighties haircut, the kids in the beginning of the montage were all dressed in modern day clothes, and there was even an episode with the Spinners where they were breakdancing.

Happy Days went through a similar situation, where it was like why bother?

That was sad about her baby. Did she know who the father was?

Where does she drop a name where it isn't pertinent to the story, r188?

Penny's Television Academy interview, Cindy joins her at the end. Worth watching.

I didn't know I cared at all about Penny Marshall, but these excerpts are oddly fascinating.

Thanks for sharing...

Read Penny and Gary's books back to back and got the distinct possibility they had the same ghostwriters.

Cindy produced Father of the Bride.

She was a camp counselor at the co-ed sleep away camp I went to in upstate New York. She is 11 years older than me, so I was rather young at the time. So was she. I would guess she was late teens/early 20s.

Cindy had quite a good movie career going for her when she accepted Laverne and Shirley.

Travels with My Aunt, American Graffiti, The Conversation to name a few.

The First Nudie Musical.

Has the child who killed "Laverne & Shirley" gone into the business?

Cindy got to work with DL fave Michael Lembeck early in her career.

About Steven Spielberg & Quaaludes:

[quote]Right before Rob quit All in the Family at the end of the 1977–78 season, we bought a home in Encino with a tennis court, a swimming pool, ample parking for friends, and a guest house. It was supposed to be our dream house, the place that said we had made it. We called it “the house that yuks built.” Jerry Belson came over one day and said, “Wow, this is a great house — if life was worth living.” Before long we were agreeing with him. We wanted to add a master bedroom and update the kitchen. We hired an architect and a contractor, who told us the job would take six months max. So we moved into the guest house: Rob, Tracy, me, our two dogs, Barney Google and Joey, and a white cat we referred to as The Ghost of Howie for the way he coughed and wheezed like our old cat, Howie. We thought we could handle the close quarters for a while. But two years later we were still living there. Somewhere in that time span we lost our sense of humor.

[quote]Our contractor and architect would assure us that the job was coming along and then something would happen. The wrong materials arrived or they weren’t shipped at all. Or the wood we wanted to use was too heavy for the floor. When I complained, the contractor said, “You can go ahead with that flooring. But you might have a cave-in. Your call.”

[quote]To get through the annoyances, Rob and I relied on our ability to turn even hardship into humor. Without All in the Family, he worked hard. In June 1978, he and his partner, Phil Mishkin, wrote and produced Free Country, a period sitcom about Lithuanian immigrants in turn-of-the-century New York. Rob also starred in it. I think he wanted to do the Eastern European version of Roots. But the network canceled it after only five episodes. He tried a variety series the next summer, and despite contributions from Billy Crystal and Martin Mull, and the debut of This Is Spinal Tap, it also had a short run.

[quote]Rob was unaccustomed to failure. Frustrated, he struggled and second-guessed himself into a place of self-loathing. Once he was in that state of mind, there was no getting through to him. If you liked him, you were a fool, and if you didn’t like him, you were an idiot.

[quote]I knew we had problems when I got out of bed one morning and he asked where I was going. I reminded him that I had a show. He drifted and stewed about the little things that we had always tried to ignore, including my paycheck, which was now bigger than his. What did it matter? Well, apparently it did. We were out of sync. He was fiercely ambitious, and I didn’t give a shit. While he worked, Albert and I would take mushrooms and watch Family Feud. Then he would come home and find us laughing at “Show me ‘banana’!”

[quote]Egos were fragile. With our house in disarray, friends didn’t hang out as much. We had people over to swim and play tennis, but it wasn’t like the old days. I would go to New York to hang out with my SNL friends. One day I went to The Sherry-Netherland Hotel to say hi to Jerry Belson, who was working on a rewrite of Close Encounters of the Third Kind, and Steven Spielberg was there.

[quote]“So you’re the Jaws of TV?” he said.

[quote]Steven and I became instant friends. He gave me a small part in his movie 1941, his action comedy starring John Belushi and Danny Aykroyd about a feared Japanese attack on Los Angeles during World War II. It was a high-concept, big-budget film, and as Hollywood’s wunderkind filmmaker, he knew many in the business were looking for him to fail. When you get too successful, people want to see that you’re fallible, like everyone else.

[quote]He understood. When he offered me a couple days work on the movie, he joked, “I have a hundred and seventy-one speaking parts. If this dies, I’m going to need someone to talk to.” He covered a lot of bases because it was hard to find someone who wasn’t in the movie. Even Michael McKean and David Lander were in it; they played machine gunners defending the coast.

[quote]My scene took one day and then I spent another day on the set watching Steven work. I didn’t know shit about cameras or directing, and he knew everything. He was experimenting with a Louma crane, which was this long expandable, extendable arm with a camera at the end that could snake through crowds and fly overhead while being operated from a seated position far away.

[quote]When he filmed me, Steven was literally around the corner. I made him stick his picture on the end of the camera. I was used to talking to another person. I think I amused him. We watched movies together and discussed changes we would have made in scenes and different endings. I was endlessly fascinated. I don’t know that everyone at our place was as enamored by him. Some were intimidated. Others were jealous. Steven didn’t do drugs. He was a straight arrow, and that made some people uncomfortable.

[quote]I tried to get a Quaalude in him. They were my drug of choice. I constantly joked about wanting to know what he would be like if he relaxed.

[quote]“I want to know what’s inside you,” I would say.

[quote]“Celluloid,” he would say, laughing at me.

Seriously. Did she ever hang around anybody who wasn't famous? Practically everybody she mentioned is a household name. LOL.

Btw, she and The Big Ragu were incredible dancers in that clip. I wonder if she was offered. To compete on DWTS? Man, she was such a diverse entertainer. Loved her as Myrna Turner with that unique laugh of hers.

Apparently Garry was a little bit handy with the ladies.

I have to say her book sounds really good. It’s the entire thing available on google books for free?

After Garry died, a PA came out with a story that he proposed that she become his mistress and when she refused, she was the only member of the crew who didn't move on to his next project.

I believe Marshall's long term gooma (sp?) had small roles in several of his films. She also fucked Trump and posed for Playboy/Penthouse.

She turned down Forrest Gump to help a sick friend and because she didn't know how to do special effects.

It's on OpenLibrary Xennial, R204!

(although I prefer to hold a book)

I hated Forrest Gump when it first came out and now I have a soft-spot for it. There probably isn't another director alive who could have done a better job special-effects-wise than Robert Zemeckis.

[quote] It was harsh and it didn’t need to be said in an interview. There’s an honor among thieves. Anjelica Huston should have respected their history and said nothing.

Mary, who the hell do you think you're fooling about taking the high road? You're on a fucking GOSSIP site, and you came here willingly.

Carson's cocaine use was fairly well known. Remember when his name was linked with DeLorean? No accident.

There was a funny rumor going around that Penny was fucking Suzi Quatro who played Leather on Happy Days.

I remember the Ninja story. It was on the news and they caught Marshall walking out of her house with police. It somehow seemed so unHollywood but very much like Marshall. On the witness stand, Marshall said the intruder said he liked her show and apologized to her.

Penny lets it all hang out in this book talking about her nutty motherr, her abortion and her drug use. What AH revealed isn't all that shocking, all things considered.

The sunglasses.

Shotz Showcase

R213 Gloria is Leland Palmer

[quote] She is a world class name dropper.

I think most people in her circle were famous. Her brother was Garry Marshall. She was married to Rob Reiner. She was a successful actress, director, and producer. I'm sure famous actors wanted to be friends with her and were kissing her ass (trying to get movie parts).

She seemed like she was relatively down-to-earth (not much of a diva) and a pretty good problem solver.

Their only concession to the 1960s was The Beatles poster.

It's so sad that "Laverne and Shirley" crashed and burned so horribly. First of all, having the girls (and everybody else) move to California: TERRIBLE idea. Does she talk about that in the book? And then Cindy Williams goes nuts after marrying Bill Hudson, causing the show to go right into the toilet, where it never recovered. That show deserved a proper finale but it just degenerated into an incoherent mess. And oh my God, having Shirley just take off and leave her lifelong best friend without even saying goodbye, just leaving a crummy little note! Shirley Feeney would NEVER have done that. So sad the show had to decline so badly. I would have liked to have seen a finale where Laverne and Shirley both get married, not to the well off professional men they were always trying to hook up with, but with regular blue collar working guys. I think that would have been a sweet way to end the series.

Did Cindy go nuts? She'd done seven years on one TV show. She wanted out.

Weird that talking about an abortion is still considered controversial when so many women have had them.

There are a lot of people who are technically pro-choice who understand why the controversy around it exist. There are a number of very serious questions involved with all of that.

She was in her forties and had already raised her daughter, she didn't want to go through that again at her age.

R174 Your comment about being shocked about Drew Barrymore not being professional when she is a third generation actor cracked me up.

She's the daughter and granddaughter of hot messes. Her father, aunt and grandfather were all notorious booze/drug addicts.

You don't snark "Ugh, she's such a NAME DROPPER!" about someone who knows, works with and is herself a major celebrity.

Name dropper is a criticism for wanna bees and amateurs and hangers on who don't really have much to do with actual famous and talented people but like to mention, ever SO casually that they know people they actually don't know at all.

I don't understand people like you, r172, who invent entire lives and personalities for celebrities you'll never meet, and then demand everyone else "accept" your made-up version of their lives. You think you're being insightful, but you're just dull. You've probably never had an honest conversation in your life, you've been too busy telling everyone else what to think and how to feel.

R224, that was the best read all day.

I do recall reading that big things were expected of Awakenings, it was a highly in demand property. It's less than stellar performance was blamed entirely on Penny Marshall, and it knocked her right off the director's A-list.

[quote] That was for the opening of "Riding In Cars With Boys" where Drew is driving and picks up Adam Garcia around the corner of Bowery, on Elizabeth Street. I lived on Elizabeth for a few years.

Oh wow! That must’ve been awesome for you. I would love to see something like that and then see it on the big screen.

[quote] And oh my God, having Shirley just take off and leave her lifelong best friend without even saying goodbye, just leaving a crummy little note!

Dude! Spoiler alert!

I've actually got Penny's bio somewhere, picked it up at a library sale years ago but haven't gotten around to reading it yet. This thread is going to make me look for it.

Yes, I'm a book hoarder and I like it. I LIKE IT.

Penny couldn't keep pets because her breath would kill them.

On the other hand, her basement "sports museum" never had any spiders or centipedes.

And her breath did take your mind off her B.O.

No doubt the Cindy Williams situation helped end the show, but it was already passed its prime. I am not sure it would have gone on that much longer as it was. It moved to California because they needed a jolt and am guessing the ratings were in decline. The actresses were also getting a bit too old to be playing the roles as they were written. What is funny for a character in their 20's sometimes seems a bit pathetic when the character is pushing 40. A lot of sitcom actors suffer the fate of playing the same character type long after they have aged out of it,

[quote]And oh my God, having Shirley just take off and leave her lifelong best friend without even saying goodbye, just leaving a crummy little note!

At least it wasn't a Post-It.

Penny in the book says that her biggest regret was having that abortion. It was a big deal for her.

I'm assuming she was brought up Catholic, so that would necessarily cause a lot of guilty feelings.

She wasn't brought up religious.

She was brought up Lutheran and Garry, Episcopalian.

Boo Boo Kitty was the one name she didn't drop. 😸

Penny said she wanted to move the show to New York, the production, the setting, and everything. Both Penny and Cindy said the move to California definitely killed the show and it should have never been done. It didn't make sense and it took away everything that drove the basis of the show: two poor girls living in a basement

Closeted lesboan but funny as a second banana, like on Mary Tyler Moore or the Odd Couple. Not really star alone material.

If she was a lesboaen, wouldn't she just admit it?

Laverne & Shirley certainly wasn’t a prestige, quality written sitcom like MTM, All in the Family or even Taxi but if was often VERY funny and it had a warmth to it

I still can’t believe that neither Penny nor Cindy never received a single Emmy nomination for this show, they were both great in their roles and the physical comedy

I always liked PM (Laverne &Shirley, Big, A League of Their Own); now I know I LOVE her!

You will really enjoy her book. My dog's all have names ending in an IE sound because Penny's mom told her that she named her kids with names ending in "Y" because that automatically moves your mouth into smile position.

HUGE coke head.

Makes you wonder about people who can afford to do as much coke as they like. How do they live as long as they do? I think it's the comforts, outside of coke, that money provides: good medical care, nice house, protection from a lot of the harshness of life.

I remember watching o ne of those Television Archives interviews with Winifred Hervey, who wrote for a whole ton of shows including The Golden Girls, but got her start writing for Laverne and Shirley, and she said, that she said that L&S was not considered a 'cool' show, and suspect that Cindy Williams' ambivalence about the show at the time came from that, especially having done a collection of highly regarded films. To go from The Conversatio, Travels with My Aunt, and American Graffiti to becoming most famous for Laverne and Shirley on tv (back when there was a huge 'class' divide in Hollywood between tv and films) might have been bitter-sweet. Of course, now she's accepted her career but I'm sure at the time, especially because she was a big star for a while because of the show, her ego was probably a bit out of control and would have thought the show was 'beneath' her.

They have to have teflon septums, r245.

Because of L&S, Penny was able to attain *beloved* status.

R246 but she never became even close to famous on those movies - and probably made very little money on each of those as well (the first six episodes of the show probably made more then all those films combined) So I could understand if she was bitter that her fame came from TV at the end of the day, but how could she see it as beneath her when it was clear she was never going to find success (or even really make enough of a living) as a film actress at that point?

ABC screwed Laverne and Shirley (and all of its top rated shows) by moving them around in the fall of 79. Happy Days, Mork and Mindy, Angie, and The Ropers also plummeted in the ratings following the schedule shake up. ABC went from having four of the top five rated shows that spring to only having one in the top five in the spring of 80. Three's Company was the only one whose ratings stayed strong.

Prior to moving its time slot, Laverne and Shirley had been the top rated show on TV for two years in a row, drawing 30 million viewers a week. After it's move, it wasn't even making the top forty. In the winter of 1980, ABC, realizing what a disaster of a decision they made, moved it back to Tuesday nights. They also decided to move the duo to California to try and generate interest again. Moving to California actually saw a bump in the ratings, but it would never again crack the top ten, and would only get as high as 20.

Cindy Williams was the Jacob Elordi of her day?

Cindy Williams never did much after Laverne and Shirley. She probably could've had another series, but she practically disappeared.

She tried a series of something called Steal Magnolia.

The power of all the milk and Pepsi!

[quote] Moving to California actually saw a bump in the ratings

I'm surprised by this. Moving to California was an obvious jump-the-shark moment. It was like adding Cousin Oliver to the cast.

The charm of L&S was, as stated above, 2 girls in blue-collar jobs, dreaming of something better, living in a cheap, basement apartment.

I did like Lenny and Squiggy as neighbors and the pizza parlor.

Power of connections!

Coke and 'ludes too, I guess.

[quote] I'm surprised by [the ratings bump].

I think it was short lived and had to do with “oh, let me see what their new apartment” etc. is like.

I was very young when Laverne and Shirley was on tv but the reruns I've seen haven't struck me as being very funny. I guess it was just because there were only a handful of tv channels back then, no cable or internet, and you were just stuck with whatever the networks were showing.

Yes...I had the record.

Cindy make a lot of TV movies in the 80s and 90s, including the epic dramedy Tricks of the Trade with the late Markie Post.

R260 she produced the Father of The Bride movies too

[quote] I was very young when Laverne and Shirley was on tv but the reruns I've seen haven't struck me as being very funny. I guess it was just because there were only a handful of tv channels back then, no cable or internet, and you were just stuck with whatever the networks were showing.

L&S was a spinoff of "Happy Days," which was a very popular '50s-themed TV show.

In the first few episodes of L&S, Shirley had more of a working-class accent (speaking). Later, she lost the accent and became prim and proper (as a humorous contrast to the more crude Laverne character).

L&S was not sophisticated humor but it was often very funny. Michael McKean and David Lander were wonderful supporting characters, both very talented, funny actors. The show involved a lot of physical comedy bits but they were very well done. In fact, Penny Marshall and Cindy Williams won some kind of award from a stuntman's organization because of how well they did the strenuous physical routines on the show.

Her voice should have come with subtitles. I get every third word. What is up with all the sniffing?

On Letterman. Voice was very different.

They both seem like they're on coke, r265

Letterman too? How so?

Now this song reminds me of Penny Marshall.

The first time remember seeing Cindy was on a short-lived variety/comedy show (I can't think of a better way to characterize it) called "The Funny Side," in 1971. It featured five couples of varying ages and ethnicities. DL faves John Amos, Michael Lembeck, and Teresa Graves were among the actors playing the couples, along with Pat Finley (Twinks Tvedt from MTM and Bob's sister on "Bob Newhart"), Dick Clair (gay) and Jenna McMahon, who went on to write the "Family" sketches on "The Carol Burnett Show" and also to create "Mama's Family". And the whole thing was hosted by (of all people) GENE KELLY.

John and Teresa were "Minority Couple." Cindy and Lembeck were "Teenaged Couple." That should give you an idea of what it was like.

Jesse James killed my Daddy.

Don't forget From a Bird's Eye View, r269...

Cindy Williams with Maggie Smith and Alec McGowen in "Travels With My Aunt"

Cindy looks like Amanda Plummer there.

r272 Alec McCOWEN. And he was gay.

[quote]A League of Their Own was an amazing movie.

A League of Their Own was a fun movie.

I recently saw "Travels With My Aunt." It was an amusing movie. Critics liked Cindy Williams in it; one of them called her "adorable." I think she would have had a much different career is she hadn't become a star in a silly tv sitcom. It kind of destroyed her acting credibility. During and after L&S no one wanted to see her doing anything but comedy fluff. But she proved in the moves she was in that she could really act. And by way, at NO time did Cindy Williams ever resemble Amanda Plummer. Cindy Williams was cute; Amanda Plummer was butt ugly.

Madeline Kahn had a movie career. She still ended up doing a lot of crap, including sitcoms. Cindy wouldn't have fared better.

Cindy seemed fine with Laverne & Shirley until she met and married Bill Hudson, who also became her manager.

Cindy Williams really didn't have that big of a film career. She had one good role in one big hit (American Graffiti) in 1973 then that small role in The Conversation the following year (prestigious film but not the kind of film or role to do much for her) then some supporting role in a Dean Martin vehicle in 1975. She then did The First Nudie Musical around the time she got Laverne & Shirley and snagging the lead female role in a very low budget indie film about dancing dildos wasn't really a sign her movie career was prospering.

The TV show made her rich and famous.

Rich but for how long?

I don't think Cindy Williams is living in poverty. She's been a working actress for over 50 years. Apparently not even a gold digger like Bill Hudson could drain her dry.

Maybe she invested her money well. Not everyone in Hollywood is an idiot with their money.

She's done crap like Nunsense. I doubt she didn't have to work.

Did she ever do "Medea" at the Mr. Burt Reynolds Dinner Theatre?

A league of Their Own is a truly great movie

A few years ago Cindy was guest star in "Menopause: The Musical" at Harrah's hotel-casino in Vegas. It was a long-running show for fraus who needed something to do in the afternoon in Vegas. Cindy would step in a couple of days of week in a part that was specifically written for her.

Not big money but it paid the bills. And it proved her popularity was still strong with the boomer fraus.

Cindy in Vegas

She also toured with it.

Cindy produced the Father of the Bride movies which were huge hits all around the world.

She had to have earned a nice penny from that alone.

Someone brought up Alan Hamel. Cindy actually did try going the Suzanne Somers route by taking a role in a TGIF series, but it was one of their duds.

You never hear anything about Cindy's two kids with Hudson (unlike the Hudson spawn with Goldie.)

Cindy's kids are not in the industry, they live totally private lives. They would be in their late 30s by now.

I would imagine Cindy would have been pretty present in the lives of Kate and Oliver as they had to be fairly young when she married their father.

Bill Hudson "disowned" Kate and Oliver (Goldie's children).

Bill Hudson seems like a real piece of shit

Five Years On...

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

I'm sure they're ALL assholes, no need to select one from the many.

On filming Awakenings (tl;dr and not that interesting but someone mentioned it… I cut out as much as I could):

[quote]After becoming a $100 million director, I was given a little office at Fox, and it was there that someone gave me a documentary on the All-American Girls Professional Baseball League, a professional league of women ballplayers that started in 1943 as a diversion while men were in the service and lasted until 1954. I had never heard of the league before, and I was a sports fan. The studio suggested it could be a made-for-TV movie, but after watching the documentary I thought it was worthy of a feature film and set about getting a script.

[…]

[quote]As they wrote, I turned my attention instead to Awakenings, a script based on a 1973 memoir by Dr. Oliver Sacks, then a young British neurologist working in the Bronx, who had used the drug L-dopa to wake up patients who had been catatonic for decades. I don’t remember how it got in front of me. It was a dead project at the studio, gathering dust. Producers Walter Parkes and Lawrence Lasker were attached, and the screenplay was from A-list writer Steve Zaillian. Everyone in the world had looked at it and passed — I think because the studio had fixated on turning it into a love story.

[quote]But I saw it as a medical mystery. I thought of my mother in her final years when she knew nothing and didn’t respond to anything I said. I wondered if she could still hear me.

[quote]I also liked that this story was about doctors treating sick people as human beings deserving of care and compassion even though they were ill. I immediately thought of De Niro for the role of Dr. Sacks. I owed Bobby for giving me validity on Big. I went to him and explained that I wanted him to play the doctor. He was quirky and withdrawn. I saw the fit. But Bobby said, “No, I want the glitz.” I understood. So then I had to find someone who would give me the energy the picture would need. As great as Bobby is, he’s a solitary figure and self-contained, except with Marty. They are always in a Winnebago, making phone calls.

[…]

[quote]Barry Diller did not share my enthusiasm for Awakenings. Having Bobby De Niro and a script by Steve Zaillian didn’t change his opinion.

[quote]Without Barry’s backing, the project was still dead at Fox. But I still wanted to make this movie. I met with Barry about taking it to another studio, even if there was another actor in it. The business term for that is “change of elements,” but I didn’t know that. I simply said, “Can I take it somewhere else? And if I do, are you going to change your mind?” Barry gave me his blessing to shop it elsewhere.

[quote]I called Dawn Steel, one of the most impressive people in the business. Only the second woman to head a film studio, Dawn was president of Columbia Pictures. She had brownish-red hair, a warm smile, and eyes that took in everything. She was at Columbia during a tumultuous time, and even then she managed to gain a reputation for supporting filmmakers, boosting confidence, and championing women.

[quote]I met with Dawn in a conference room full of studio executives. She and I were the only women in the room. I pitched the script and my vision, which included Bobby. I was halfway through my pitch when Dawn excused herself to go to the bathroom and told me to follow her.

[quote]“Don’t trust any of these guys,” she said when we were alone. “They will fuck you over.”

[quote]“Do you want to do it?” I asked.

[quote]“Yes,” she said.

[quote]“Are you going to be here still while I make it?” I asked, knowing studio heads changed every two and a half minutes. “Will you be here when I finish it?”

“I hope so,” she said.

[quote]She wasn’t. But she green-lit the film.

[quote]Then I went after Robin Williams, who I had briefly spoken to about playing Dr. Sacks. I had watched Dead Poets Society and known him since my brother created Mork & Mindy. Ronny and I had actually brought Robin to my brother’s attention.

[quote]I called Peter Weir, who had directed Dead Poets, and asked how Robin was to work with. “He’ll do anything you want,” he said. Robin had costarred with Steve Martin in a production of Waiting for Godot that Mike Nichols did at Lincoln Center, and through various sources I’d heard his soon-to-be wife, Marcia Garces, had been giving notes. Okay, I thought, as long as he wasn’t the problem, I could deal with her.

[quote]I told Bobby to watch Dead Poets. I said, forget the trailer. It’s the one scene where Robin broke character. Just watch the movie. He did, and he agreed that Robin was the right guy for the role.

[quote]When I spoke again with Robin, he had one concern — that Bobby would blow him off the screen. I said, “Look, it’s my job to make sure that doesn’t happen.” I arranged for them to meet. I took Bobby to Robin and Marcia’s hotel. I knew Marcia was going to try to sit in on the meeting and worked out a plan with Bobby to keep her out. “I’ll just say you’re shy,” I said, and that worked. The three of us had a productive, positive talk about the movie, their characters, and personal stuff, and I walked out with my two leads in place.

[quote]Then I met the real Oliver Sacks. We got together at the Botanical Gardens, his daily lunch spot. It was near Beth Abraham Hospital where he worked, in the Bronx. The food was terrible, but he was the fascinating, quirky character (he rode a motorcycle, misplaced his keys) I had come to know from reading the script and his book, as well as from talking about him with my therapist, who happened to have gone to school with him. He promised to be available on the set as often as I needed.

[quote]Production was about to begin on Awakenings when Fox green-lit A League of Their Own. Lowell and Babaloo had handed in their script and Joe Roth, who was running Fox that day (a minute earlier it had been Scott Rudin and Larry Gordon), wanted to do it. I wanted to do it, too, but I was about to leave for New York.

[quote]We hired David Anspaugh to direct. We thought he would get to the heart of it, as he’d done on Hoosiers. I didn’t think he’d get the comedy, but to me the heart was more important. I moved to New York and began work in Brooklyn during one of the darkest, coldest winters ever.

[quote]My friend Miloš Foreman introduced me to Miroslav Ondříček, the brilliant Czech who had worked on Amadeus and Ragtime, as well as The World According to Garp and Silkwood. I adored Miroslav from the start. I could look in his eyes and know exactly what he thought, and if he didn’t like a shot he walked in front of the camera. But his thick accent was impenetrable. I couldn’t understand a single word he said. Miloš said he couldn’t either — and he was Czech. From what I could tell, the man spoke no known language, which made him a perfect complement to my equally brilliant production designer, Anton Furst, who had worked with Stanley Kubrick on Full Metal Jacket and won an Oscar for Tim Burton’s Batman. His sets were un-fucking-believable. I had called him and asked if he’d like to do a smaller movie. “It’s a little hospital setting,” I said. Anton spoke with a thick Cockney accent, and when we initially met to discuss the movie he kept talking about plinths and lintels, which I thought were beans. Both were actually different-size pieces of wood. Miroslav and I had no idea what he was talking about. Between all of our accents, though, I don’t know if any of us ever understood one another.

[quote]We did a pre-shoot at Throgs Neck, the sliver of land dividing the Bronx and Manhattan. It was early morning, and we were working with the second unit, which meant we didn’t have a still photographer. The AD kept looking at his watch as the crew built a platform to put the camera on. We were racing against the tide to get a shot of Bobby on a rock in the water while Robin stood on the dock saying, “Come in, Leonard.” But the tide came in so fast some of the crew found themselves treading water. We got the shot. In a later take, it looked like Bobby was walking on water. Luckily someone on the crew had a Brownie and snapped a picture. That became our poster.

[quote]Our primary location was the Brooklyn Psychiatric Hospital, a working psychiatric hospital that treated patients with severe or long-term mental illnesses on the first and second floors. We shot on the third floor and used the fourth for dressing rooms. There was no shortage of atmosphere, screams wafting through the air ducts, or potential extras. Bobby likes to shoot in order, so the first part focused on Robin, who held the picture together as Dr. Malcolm Sayer, a research neurologist who steps gingerly into his first clinical position and finds himself wading through hallways filled with patients in wheelchairs who’ve been literally frozen in time for decades and essentially forgotten, except for Bobby’s character, Leonard Lowe, a middle-aged man whose devoted mother still tends to him. For that role, actresses walked in with their Oscars. I was overwhelmed. They were amazing. We tested a few of them, including Theresa Wright, who had spunk, and an older woman, Ruth Nelson.

[quote]Ruth was a great lady. She was a New York stage actress in the 1930s who transitioned to movies but was blacklisted in the 1950s when her second husband was among those Senator Joseph McCarthy labeled a Communist. She was victimized by association and didn’t work for three decades. When I met her, she was eighty-four and had battled a brain tumor and also had arthritis. I stared at her slender arms and gnarled hands. It looked like she had pushed her kid’s arms and legs down for years. I liked her. I couldn’t get her insured, but I didn’t care. Neither did she. She wanted to do it. To me, that’s what the movie was about.

[quote]I also had an open call for people in wheelchairs. I needed them for background. Why not use real people? Everyone was shocked when they heard me audition them. Okay, what happened to you? One told me that he had been run over by a car while sleeping on the street. Others had similar tragedies. My directness shocked some people around me. But I had to ask. Can you use a manual wheelchair? Because this takes place in 1969. If they said yes, they were in. We learned a lot about different afflictions from being around and watching these people.

[quote]The patients in Dr. Sacks’s real story had survived an early-twentieth-century outbreak of encephalitis lethargica. There was one survivor from the group of original patients. We visited her in a hospital. It had been twenty-some years since Dr. Sacks had treated her. She was very sweet. We would be talking with her, though, and then suddenly she’d freeze. It was like a light switch had been flipped. I put her in the movie, but unfortunately she was cut out of the final version.

[quote]I cast Julie Kavner as the nurse because Steve Zaillian writes beautifully and very tight, but everyone spoke like Dr. Sayer. When you wake up the next morning it twill be the next morning. No one really speaks like that. At least Julie has a different sound. One day she asked how she would change Leonard’s diaper. How would I know? I told her to go downstairs and ask actual nurses.

[quote]I tried as much as possible to utilize actual people dealing with diseases, including a couple of people with Tourette syndrome. It was nearly impossible for an actor to duplicate the reality and reactions of a mentally ill patient, especially when we saw what it was really like. Robin had a scene early in the picture where the simple act of pulling a pen out of his jacket to write on a woman’s chart scared the shit out of her. I read numerous actresses, and they were all right. But then I tested five schizophrenics, including Waheeda Ahmed. I gave her the role. She screamed in a way that shook the walls like no actor could do because they didn’t know what it was like to scream from deep inside your brain.

[quote]On camera, she was perfect, remarkable in fact, and she enjoyed the hell out it. After we finished the scene, I went to thank her. I found her sitting upstairs in one of the dressing rooms. She was all smiles. “I’m almost a star,” she said.

[quote]Thursday was the night in the hospital when the patients on the floors below ours were taken off their meds so they could be checked by the doctors. And that was the night we shot the pivotal scenes where Leonard finally wakes up after Dr. Sayer has spent days giving him different amounts of L-dopa. It was late at night in the movie, too. Dr. Sayer wakes up and sees that Leonard has also woken up and gotten out of bed. He finds him in a nearby room.

[quote]“It’s quiet,” Leonard says.

[quote]“Yes, everyone is asleep,” Dr. Sayer says.

However, as we shot, the patients from downstairs were screaming through the whole scene. It happened several times. What was I going to do? Tell crazy people not to be crazy?

[quote]There was another issue. Until this point, Bobby, like Leonard, had slept through the first part of the movie, and Robin became nervous with him suddenly alive and playing opposite him, reacting, changing the game. Bob is different when the camera is on him. He waits for it to find him. Before I said action, Miroslav asked if I wanted moonlight. I said sure, why not? We shot the scene and I thought it was great. Then I saw the dailies. Robin was blue. The following day when he asked how it had looked, I said, “Your acting is fine. But I have to reshoot your side of the table because the moonlight turned your face blue.”

[quote]Indeed, I didn’t know that moonlight turns people blue. You don’t see it with your eye, but you see it on film. I didn’t know until then. It was only my second full movie.

[quote]Robin and Bobby got along well, though they had different styles. Robin entertained the crew between takes, while Bobby disappeared into his dressing room. Everyone was afraid to get him. That job fell to me because I wasn’t afraid. “What’s going on? Are you ordering silverware patterns for the Tribeca Grill? Let’s go.”

Reports that he and Robin got into a fight on the set were false. In the scene where Dr. Sayer and Leonard argue, Bobby told Robin to actually hold his hands down and prevent him from moving. At the same time, Bobby was struggling to move. They were two opposing forces. And Bobby is strong. One time Robin’s hands flew up and hit Bobby in the nose. Robin dropped to the floor while Bobby continued on with the scene. Afterward I said cut, wondering why Robin had overacted. It turned out he had broken Bobby’s nose.

[quote]“Does it hurt?” I asked Bobby.

[quote]He shook his head. “It’s numb.”

[quote]“Well, do you want to go to the doctor?” I asked.

[quote]“No, let’s finish it,” he said.

[quote]After the scene, I asked how long it took him to heal. I wanted to know if he was going to be black and blue, would I have to shoot around him? He turned out to be a fast healer. It straightened his nose, actually. But the mishap was reported in the tabloids as a fight. Sometimes they said it was Bobby hitting Robin. Sometimes it was the other way around. It was all bullshit.

[quote]What went unreported was Bob’s squeamishness in the scene when a cockroach walks across the table as Leonard freezes while writing. In real life, Bob hates cockroaches. Robin turned the moment into a stand-up routine, saying, “On my last job I was up for a cockroach in a Raid commercial.” But Bobby was so scared that I ended up using one of the other patients to touch him on the shoulder and break Leonard’s trance.

[quote]Then there was a minor interruption when Sony bought the studio. I remembered the conversation I’d had with Dawn Steele when I asked if she’d still be the president when I finished shooting. Well, now she was gone — and so was Columbia Pictures. But it turned out good for us. The new Japanese owners loved Robin, and they just gave us more money.

[quote]We continued to shoot with a lighter attitude. I remember this scene where Dr. Sayer takes Leonard for a drive. We had the car up on a flatbed, and Miroslav and I were on the camera truck, watching. Bob had one line: “What a wonderful place the Bronx has become.” He said it just as a bus rolled by so we couldn’t hear him clearly. In fact, all we heard was Robin turn into Harvey Fierstein and say, “Well, Leonard, if you like the Bronx, wait till I take you to this place downtown. You’re going to love it.”

[quote]Robin made him laugh throughout the whole car scene. Every time we hit a red light or another car slowed us down he cracked a joke. Bobby would laugh and turn red. I had to wait until he went back to his natural pale color.

[quote]Bob was an equally powerful presence. Jazz great Dexter Gordon played a patient named Rolondo. The tenor saxophonist was ill at the time, battling cancer that took his life before the movie opened. He was 6’6’’ and rail-thin. He moved slowly. I had him play the piano after his character woke up. Despite needing a throat box to speak, Dexter kept asking, “Where’s my scene with De Niro?”

[quote]I understood. When Bob walked out of Ward 5 following his speech there I instructed him to shake Dexter’s hand. Then Julie moved in and helped Dexter walk away. But he got his scene with Bobby D.

[quote]To me, Bob’s greatness as an actor was measured in the way he handled the parts that gave him the most trouble. There were three of them — speeches that weren’t written in his rhythm, including the scene in Ward 5 where he goes a little crazy. He wouldn’t let anyone in while he rehearsed, including Robin, who took me aside and said, “But I’m in this scene.”

[quote]“Remember you got nervous the night Leonard woke up, the night you turned blue?” I said. “This is Bob’s turn.”

[quote]I worked with Bob privately and after a while I said, “Okay, Robin is coming in.” The transition was smooth. Bob just had to go through his process. He acts within himself, and it’s his restraint that makes him a ticking time bomb. He can say, “Did you fuck my wife?” and you don’t know how he’s going to react. In the same way, he surprised me in the scene where Leonard is in the bathroom shaving for the first time with an electric razor. I could see him thinking about what he was going to do as he held the razor in his hand. I went over to him — because you talk to Bob privately, not where everyone can hear — and I said, “Does it tickle? Leonard was twelve. This is all new to him.” He got it.

[quote]His performance in that scene was layered with nuances that let you actually see this character’s entire life start to come together. I liked the scenes with Leonard and Paula, the complicated sweetness of him having feelings and discovering the “gift and wonderment of life.”

[quote]Penelope Ann Miller was great as Paula. My favorite scene was when Leonard, his health rapidly deteriorating, tries to say good-bye to Paula, his love, in the cafeteria, and she gets up from the table, pulls him close, and they dance. You had Dexter playing the piano in the background. It was heartbreaking. I also liked the scene when Leonard’s mother sees him awake for the first time. I thought everything in that worked.

[quote]My whole thing with Bobby was that I didn’t want any Raging Bull in his performance. I wanted him to play against type, to play a sweet guy. As he said, it was the glitz. We shot a whole back end of the movie that I knew I didn’t even need, including a scene where Dr. Sayer sneaks Leonard out of the hospital and finds Paula ice skating at Rockefeller Center. It was so cold out that day, the Steadicam froze. None of it was necessary. I had been sneaking in shots of the patients and orderlies the whole time to use during Robin’s final speech. I did make sure to get Dr. Sayer asking Eleanor out for a cup of coffee. That passed for a love story, which the studio had always wanted. But if not for all the extra shooting, we could’ve finished two months earlier.

[quote]Our wrap party, held at the Tribeca Grill, included a slide show of behind-the-scenes still photographs from the production letting us see our struggle against the cold weather. That wasn’t the only challenge. The first assemblage of the movie ran five hours. My brother said, “I think you need to cater it.” But the editor had put everything in, which is what I like to see. An hour came out like butter.

[quote]I walked away from that conversation with two additional editors, who began to cut heavily. I also called in Steve Zaillian and asked what he wanted out, and he basically agreed with my suggestions. We took out the subplot of Leonard building a library out of balsa wood. The whole back end came out then, too. The producers complained that I was ruining their movie, but Steve supported me and so did the studio. I liked the way it ended with a positive message. I was pleased when I saw it.

[quote]The studio loved that I got it down to two hours. They didn’t believe I could do it. The movie premiered in New York at the end of 1990, shortly before its official opening in December — in time to qualify for awards. Barry Diller, bless him, was very proud of me. Although he had passed on the movie, he said, “You did a remarkable job.” As was my habit, I was going away to avoid opening-weekend nerves. I was on my way to Phuket. I think Sean Penn had gone there and said it was beautiful. But Barry stopped me. “You can’t go there,” he said. He reminded me there was a war in the Gulf. “Terrorists are meeting in Bangkok.”

[quote]Instead, he sent me and Tracy and my niece to Australia’s Hayman Island, a ridiculously luxurious and beautiful haven in the midst of the Great Barrier Reef. No one was there, we had a butler, we ate phenomenal seafood, as you’d expect, and, of course, we played in the ocean. Relaxed, I returned to learn that Awakenings had received three Oscar nominations, including Bobby for Best Actor, Steve for Best Screenplay, and the movie itself for Best Picture. Robin, who had held the movie together, should have been up for an Oscar. But he was nominated for a Golden Globe, Bobby won a New York Film Critics Circle Award, and Randy Newman, who scored the picture, earned a Grammy nomination.

[quote]Again, I was left out of the celebrations. Privately and publicly, people complained it was sexism. I don’t know. I didn’t dwell on it. I knew that people didn’t expect me to make that kind of movie. It’s not what I was known for. I hosted a non-nominee Oscar party at my house. As the awards show went on, though, and I saw that only Joe Pesci won from the pack of Goodfellas nominees, I realized I was going to be entertaining a bunch of depressed Italians. They knew about the food — fried chicken, macaroni and cheese, and more — from Carrie’s and my annual birthday parties. It was exactly what you wanted to eat if you didn’t win or get nominated. Even Barbra Streisand showed up.

[quote]She’d presented an award, then left the awards show and headed up the hill to my place. I loved seeing her walk through the door, looking comfortable and ready to have fun. She had been screwed over by the Academy, yet everyone knew she was a brilliant talent and, as far as I was concerned, a great gal who knew real satisfaction in life came from doing work you loved, not winning awards.

JFC, why don’t you just print the entire book?

that's why I said this, R304:

[quote]On filming Awakenings (tl;dr and not that interesting but someone mentioned it… I cut out as much as I could):

I've been posting excerpts throughout the thread but I'll stop and you guys can continue talking about Bill Hudson.

Or, you can refer to the book. I’ve been in the thread from the start and would be surprised if you haven’t posted 90% of it already.

If a comment doesn't interest you, scroll on by. Don't scold someone for posting, you fuckwit.

I did scroll on by, all FOUR fucking posts of it.

Four!?! Heavens to Betsy!

You can’t tell the difference on a message board between saying “Oh, yeah, the Awakenings movie. She talks a lot about it in her book and here’s a link to read it” and posting numerous, numerous excerpts?

The OP carefully formatted the excerpts, which made it even easier for you to ignore as you scrolled.

This is not a book board.

It’s a “message board” for a reason. Short, quick messages.

You can quickly exit this thread.

Nope, I love Penny. Or loved, anyway.

Maybe I’m wrong. Maybe I’m the only one who feels this way, who knows? Wouldn’t be the first time I was wrong. It just seems to me to be a bit much.

Whereas your harping on about is not a bit much.

She fucked a lot of guys. She must've had a really tight, warm and wet pussy to keep them coming back for more.

This guy loves Cindy Williams but Suzanne Somers and Alan Hamel not so much.

Thanks R303, I did read her book and just read the excerpt you posted.Still interesting.

r317 I can't believe that guy is actually bragging about being the creator of She's the Sheriff, arguably the worst sitcom of all time. But that's Hollywood for you.

R317 at what minutes respectively? I ain’t sitting through that whole thing.

I liked the excerpt from Awakenings. I’ve always meant to get around to watching it, but have never.

Same here r318. That was a good movie. She made 3 great movies that will stand the test of time. Amazing woman.

An hour with Penny & Cindy talking about Laverne & Shirley.

In one of her interviews, I think for the TV Hall of Fame or something, Penny was asked if she had plastic surgery in the past few years. By this point she was in her late 60s. She gave the interviewer one of those WTF looks, and said "What?! I'm gonna do that NOW??!!"

Penny even has the letter L on her tombstone.

That Archive of American television is great. I actually just went on there and they have a search feature where you can not only find the interviews with a given personality (quite obviously), but if they’ve ever even been mentioned, they’ll come up in a search and it will go right to the minute mark where it starts. Basically it’s a television version of an encyclopedia , very impressive.

Hey, I want to say THANK YOU to the poster who posted all those pages from the book...I really enjoyed them!

And, FUCK YOU to the stupid cuntwaffle at R304 who had to shit all over them for posting the book excerpts..if you're not interested in those posts, scroll the fuck on by, asshole! No one forcing you to be here.

It's shitheads like you who scare away good posters.

Dumbass.

Take a 'lude, dude.

Yes, thank you to the poster who included the passages from her book. I read it years ago and enjoyed revisiting it. She definitely had a ghostwriter but you could still hear her voice and personality coming through.

I will chime in with my appreciation of the posting of the excerpts. I remember reading this book when it first came out and my memory of it was that it wasn't terribly entertaining and I didn't really enjoy it. But I started to read the excerpts last night and they were wonderful, and it's making me want to revisit the book, because clearly I'm thinking of something else.

Anyone bitching about the excerpts are dead to the Andy Warhol Diaries series of posts.

There were a whole series of threads devoted to excerpts of celeb bios.

The thread with Bette Davis's daughters' whiny book was funny. God, what an ungrateful cunt that daughter was.

Whoops, "daughter's." There was only one.

No! You can't make me!

Bette David had TWO daughters: the ghastly B. D. and Margo. Margo was adopted. She was also mentally challenged. She was a million times preferable to the horrid B. D.

BD was such a horrible cunt, Bette gave her everything and supported her and her useless husband for many years.

What's in the bitch comes out in the pup...

I really wish she had done an audio for this I want to hear it in her voice.

Love the excerpts! I found myself reading them in her voice - which is a little funny because I think that I have only seen her in Hocus Pocus!

I remember enjoying "Awakenings", but then later thinking of it as schlocky Oscar bait. I guess I'll have to watch it again.

I do remember Ruth Nelson as DeNiro's mother was excellent.

Ruth Nelson should have received an Oscar nomination for Supporting Actress that year. It was a glorious little performance.

[quote] Bette Davis had TWO daughters: the ghastly B. D. and Margo. Margo was adopted. She was also mentally challenged. She was a million times preferable to the horrid B. D.

Oh FANK you for fixeding my family twee!

R339 Penny did record an unabridged audiobook that’s still available. After I listened to it, I subsequently listened to it again whenever I needed help falling asleep. Not because it was boring, but because Penny’s deadpan delivery lulled me to sleep.

I had never come across her book and finished it today thanks to this thread. It was interestingly candid not only in that she talks about having an abortion, but also a miscarriage during the filming of Big, neither time being sure of the father. It is very, who knows, could’ve been several people, and she moves on.

This is a long interview w/Rosie O'Donnell, but she does say that there will be a "reboot" of ALOTO. Sounds like she's definitely "game" to do it, haha. Anyway, she does some really good impressions / impersonations of Penny Marshall. (She got the voice down-pat.)

I liked the interviewer and checked out his YT channel, but the rest of his videos looked meh to me, Real Housewives, etc.

[quote] This is a long interview w/Rosie O'Donnell, but she does say that there will be a "reboot" of ALOTO.

A "reboot" of THAT movie? I'll believe that when I see it.

It might be a TV show.

It already was a tv show and it was putrid.

All those vagines, how could it be anything but, r349?

In the last 10 years of her life she spent some time institutionalized for depression. She never filmed a movie after that.

R319: He didn't create "She's the Sherriff", he tried to keep it from being complete dogshit.

So why did she stop directing? Her last feature film as a director was "Riding in Cars with Boys" (2001). Yeah, I understand if flopped, but plenty of other directors coast from flop to flop. Was it her decision? Or did her lack of membership in the Boys' Network mean that the industry dropped her as soon as she faltered?

Never forget that that's how it works. If you're part of a socially privileged group or an insider network, your mistakes are forgiven and you keep your job, but if you're gay or something... then maybe you'll be able to get away with one mistake, maybe not. Definitely not two or three, not like the guys in the Old Boy Network.

R352 Whatever, he failed miserably.

He saw that once Suzanne Sommers got what she wanted that it became dogshit and he left after the first season. It was a syndicated sitcom--it wasn't going to be Chaucer.

R344 damn I have to get my hands on that!

R349 didn't the TV show have a monkey on it or some sort of other asshattery

[quote]It already was a tv show and it was putrid.

Thus the term re-boot.

Shut up, R304. We like when he does this.

r353 did you read r351? She was probably uninsurable.

She also didn't have great projects lined up. We know that because her projects didnt end up getting made with other directors when she couldn't get it going. She did start off CINDERELLA MAN and BEWITCHED but she also had a studio financed production company with multiple employees who would set up projects and deals.

Great suggestion, R344! Listening to it now. :)

[quote]So why did she stop directing?

One reason, she got sick, she was diagnosed with lung cancer that had metastasized to her brain, had radiation and chemotherapy, and was in remission. Then developed diabetes.

The diabeetus

The audiobook is great. Marshall's delivery is very good, like a conversation. And it's hilarious. I know I'm going to miss it once I finish it.

It's amazing to me that given ALL of the people she knew in Hollywood, she didn't get that Oscar nomination for Big or even Awakenings. It really is a male-dominated industry, especially back then.

^^ It's not so surprising that a woman didn't get a nomination for director.

someone mentioned penny and garry sharing a ghostwriter. very likely considering how they worked.

on a big book like this, someone like penny can spend up to a month with a ghost writer, talking about her life in recorded interview sessions. the ghost writer also pulls all of their interviews and either reads them all or if there's too much material, focuses on bigger stuff. If the celebrity puts in the work the process really captures their voice and persona because its mostly their words.

Just finished the book. I definitely recommend it.

No, she was not institutionalized for depression. Depression was one of the things she didn't have time for. As for why she stopped directing, part of the reason was 9/11 had happened, so she headed back to live in NY for a few years (though still bicoastal) and became a charity activist and board member for many different causes. She got a lot out of giving back. Then, she had to deal with brain and lung cancer, which she was able keep in remission until heart disease and the beetus finally did her in at age 75.

What a great broad. I wish she was still around.

R367 I think Rob Reiner may have checked himself in for depression at some point. Maybe there lied tne confusion.

I think we can thank OP for not including excerpts from the making of...Renaissance Man.

But honestly, was there anybody Penny Marshall DIDN'T know? Agree with R367, wish she was still around. Wish I'd known her.

Mark Wahlberg hailed Penny Marshall ‘one of a kind’