Please explain non-binary to me.

No you don't just want to understand, if you did you'd go to one of the hundreds of halfway decent websites about this issue. This is trolling. Don't you have a job?

Narcissism.

I mean the meaning is pretty simple. Someone who doesn't identify as male or female.

Of course, some people have pretty strong opinions about that, especially on this board.

What I can’t figure out is when someone describes themselves as a ‘nonbinary lesbian’.

How can you be a lesbian if you’re not female?

Is it “not one of two”? Non= not. Binary= Composed of two things. So sex being defined as EITHER male or female becomes non-binary when one does not identify with one of the two choices traditionally given.

I don’t care for the term. There are certain terms or words that become “buzzy” and this is one I can’t stand.

The same kind of person who groused about androgyny in the 1970s gets upset about non-binary in the 2010s.

It means “I’m so special. Please give me the attention I’m desperately seeking”.

Avoid; do not engage.

[quote]How can you be a lesbian if you’re not female?

By whining and seeking attention until everyone has met your demand that you be identified as such.

When a man or woman loves a person of the same sex, they are considered Gay. When a man or woman feels uncomfortable in their own skin and everything is telling them they are not the gender they were born into, they are considered Trans. When a man or a woman cannot identify as either a man or a woman, that they wish to not be identified by gender at all, they are considered non-binary.

It's the libertarian of genders.

Attention-seeking.

[quote] How can you be a lesbian if you’re not female?

Except in the rare cases when someone is intersex, you're still biologically either male or female, regardless of the your gender identity. I suppose a nonbinary lesbian it is a female who identifies as nonbinary but is only attracted to women. Or whatever.

I'm fine with the trans thing for those who truly feel that their bodies don't reflect their gender. I have less patience for the nonbinary, which just seems silly and attention-seeking. Can't you pick one gender or the other and just not be the most traditionally gender-conforming person on the planet. In many ways, I don't conform to stereotypical women's attire and behavior, but I've never had the least issue identifying as a woman. In feel the same way about the more faddish trans people, e.g., bio males who present as typically male except maybe they sometimes don a dress and women's earrings. Can't you just be a guy in a dress? Insisting otherwise seems like little more than attention seeking and I'm guessing 20 years down the road, most of these people will have abandoned their trans identities and be living as ordinary "cis" men and women.

I think that's many of our problems, it can become about being gender conforming r12.

It's like you can't be a guy into femme dress or a girl into butch dress, if you do those things you have to change your gender. That's just reinforcing gender norms.

Thank you R12 for your thoughtful response. I'm not OP, but I have questions. I have a friend who has decided he is non-binary. He's coming to visit in two weeks, and I don't know what to expect. It is sometimes exhausting just talking on the phone. Every subject winds its way back to his nonsense. I blame the therapist he's been seeing for years. At any rate, I am not looking forward to 18 days of walking on eggshells.

My friend’s child, raised as a girl, was non-binary but got tired of explaining themself, so now they is taking male hormones. Looking forward to an update.

I'm guessing they'd all be versatile?

T/NB We Know Drama

Good luck R14, sounds like you're gonna need it.

R14 Dump them as a friend.

Seriously, if they bring you nothing but exasperation then disengage.

I had a fellow I wanted to get to know, and when I did I realized he always talked about himself, and pretty much circled back on the same three topics.

I got out and never regretted it.

GET OUT!

Does this help?

18 days? He’s visiting for 18 days? WTF?

[quote]My friend’s child, raised as a girl, was non-binary but got tired of explaining themself, so now they is taking male hormones.

They sounds ridiculous.

They has had three different names through this process, r22.

"My body doesn't reflect my gender"

So. Dumb.

Who is "binary"? Seriously, can you think of ONE person who has NEVER done anything that could be described as "gender nonconforming"? Even Arnold Schwarzenneger played a pregnant character in one of his films. Even Dolly Parton, arguably the most "feminine" woman alive, did what many consider to be a "masculine" thing when she built a business empire. Insisting that the vast majority of humans are "cis" or "binary"-- when in reality no one possibly COULD be, even if they wanted to-- is ludicrous.

R25–You write as if having an interest in baking makes a man non-binary. That is ludicrous.

"Look at me! LOOK AT ME!"

Essentially.

[quote] I have a friend who has decided he is non-binary. He's coming to visit in two weeks, and I don't know what to expect. It is sometimes exhausting just talking on the phone.

This is other thing that I find tiresome about the genderqueer. Besides the fact that they're often just reinforcing gender norms, they're BORING. Who wants to heard about every little nuance of someone's gender identity? I'm not even that interested in my own.

R25 Dolly Parton identifies as sapiogenderqueer-questioning-asexual. How dare you put her in your outdated binary box, you fossil?

"You write as if having an interest in baking makes a man non-binary."

My point is that EVERYONE is nonbinary, R26. No man conforms 100% to masculine stereotypes. No woman conforms 100% to feminine stereotypes. So, how 'bout we just get rid of those stereotypes so that everyone can be free? No labels necessary.

If you're male, look at your nipples. Explain why nipples are on a man's body....

explain non binary - too much free time.

I’ve seen cis queer and cis hetero, too.

R14, a weekend > 18 days

R19, I would drop anyone who uses "circle back" unironically.

Peter Pan syndrome

R14 here. I appreciate all of your comments and advice. The more I think about the upcoming visit with my friend, the more anxious I feel. It's difficult for me to turn my back on a person, and I really want to be supportive. I am seriously trying to understand the need to put so much time into personal identity issues. My initial thoughts are that it may be an easy way to mask other socially unacceptable personality disorders. Over the course of the extremely lengthy visit, (18 days), I'm sure I will gain insight, as well as.weight from stress eating. I will let you know if I survive.

So, r30, we just do away with the false concept that anyone has a sexual identity? Brilliant.

Where did I say that, R37? Sexual orientation and "gender" are two different things. And no one "identifies" as straight OR gay. They just ARE straight or gay.

Sexual identity is male/female. Sexual orientation is straight/gay. So, people just ARE straight or gay, but no one is male or female? How does that work? How can I say I’m gay if I can’t say I’m male? Perhaps I’m just a straight woman (if women existed, of course).

Your error is confusing non-binary with non-conformity in terms of interests. That’s not what non-binary means. It does mean some women like sports and some men are interested in fashion. It means being unable to self-identify as male or female.

^does not mean

"So, people just ARE straight or gay, but no one is male or female?"

Again, where did I say no one is male or female? Some of us do not believe that being male or female has anything to do with which sex/gender stereotypes one identifies with or doesn't identify with. You just ARE male or female, and you just ARE straight, gay, or bi. It's not good, it's not bad, it just IS.

[quote]Again, where did I say no one is male or female?

When you said “EVERYONE is non-binary.”

R20 Someone thought they'd figure out if Pat was a man or woman, by asking "what will you wear to the event?" Pat replied "I'm going formal."

R40, how does a guy who likes fashion or a woman into sports become non-binary?

^they don’t.

It means a person is so special, so original, so unique that "they" have transcended gender altogether. How BRAVE!

It's just more bullshit.

NB BS

Looking between your legs tells if you're a male or female. Who created this Binary Bullshit?

It means you have an edgy purple or green streak in your hair.

Lol, r51.

it means not 2

Stereotype based identification is fucking idiotic.

Your genitals aren’t a stereotype, they’re a simple fact.

R36 I hope some of the personality disorders your friend is masking don't include Cannibalism. Hide the fava beans and the Chianti!

To be non-binary is like being Schrodinger's cat in the eponymous experiment: You're both male and female, until we take a look. As soon as we do (the "observation"), we determine which one you are. At this point, your state collapses to either male or female (binary).

It's all pixies, to me.

Who's the guy at R58's link? He gives me a woody.

For my whole life I have been nonbinary in the sense that I’ve never felt particularly male or female, just like a human being. I’m extremely gender nonconforming in my personality and interests, and people have told me for decades that I don’t match their gender expectations. If I could choose I would want to be seen as a human being, neither a man or a woman.

It just never occurred to me that I could order around other people and force them to change their behaviors and language because of my feelings.

This is the Nonbinary Pride Flag.

LEARN IT. USE IT.

I am TELLING YOU NOW so I don't have to tell you THEN.

[quote]Kye Rowan created the nonbinary pride flag, which has yellow, white, purple, and black horizontal stripes, in 2014. It is intended to represent nonbinary people who did not feel that the genderqueer flag represents them and be used alongside Roxie’s design. The yellow stripe represents people whose gender exists outside of the binary, the white stripe, people with many or all genders, the purple, people with genders considered a mix of male and female, and the black people who identify as not having a gender.

Moreover, DO NOT confuse the Nonbinary Pride Flag with the Genderqueer Pride Flag.

THEY ARE VERY DIFFERENT.

[quote]This flag was designed in 2011 by Marilyn Roxie, a genderqueer writer and advocate, and features a lavender, white, and chartreuse stripe. According to Roxie, the lavender stripe is a mix of blue and pink—colors traditionally associated with men and women—and represents androgyny as well as queer identities. The white stripe, like in the transgender pride flag, represent agender or gender neutral identities. The chartreuse stripe is the inverse of lavender and represents third gender identities and identities outside the gender binary.