Shelley Winters

All that I remember of her is that she was a hoot on the talk show circuit ... Merv, Johnny .... she was very entertaining

Great actress.. her performances in classic films like Lolita and A Place in the Sun really hold up. Willing to be unacttractive both physically and emotionally and strong talent and actual interest in acting. Really like her.

[quote]All that I remember of her is that she was a hoot on the talk show circuit ... Merv, Johnny .... she was very entertaining

She poured a glass of water over Oliver Reed's head, live on tv. (9:12 mark)

She was also the one that got the meme started that Mikey from Life cereal had died, when he hadn't.

The original Chrissy Metz!

Rosie O'Donnel would be great to play her.

Fabulous film!

Blowsy.

She was great in the Diary of Anne Frank. She obviously empathized very much with Mrs. van Daan.

Marlon Brando slept with everyone, male, female, whatever. Wish I had been around then!

I associate her mostly with Roseanne, but I did see Night of the Hunter because of my love of Tori Amos, and winters was good in it, in a good-acting-for-her-era kind of way.

Years ago, when AOL was a "thing" users had profiles so that you could read about someone before you chatted them up in a chatroom.

One guy that always had me laughing in the NYC M4M room had written in his profile, "When you said you had a swimmer's body, I didn't think you meant like Shelley Winters in The Poseidon Adventure."

I remember seeing her when I was a kid in "Wild In The Streets," where 16-year olds get the vote (sound familiar?) and put everybody over 30 in concentration camps. Shelley ends up barricading herself in her house with a shotgun, screaming out the window, "I'm young! I'm young!"

Shelley held court fairly regularly at the Silver Spoon in West Hollywood, always surrounded by older gay men. Some of them were rather territorial when younger gay men recognized her (most likely from "Roseanne") and approached the table, but Shelley was always pleased to be recognized. It meant a lot to her that younger people knew who she was, because it was pretty obvious that her legacy meant a lot to her. While most "trendy" gays preferred the French Market Place, the Silver Spoon was more "neighborhood" style, like the Yukon further down Santa Monica. As Shelley got older, she continued to go but was quieter and more introspective, and only had small numbers of gay friends around her.

Connie Ford was the poor man's Shelley.....

R14 I wasn't the poor man's anything!

Connie Stevens was the trashy rich man’s Connie Ford!

I just saw Blume in Love on TCM about a week ago and she had a great, funny scene with George Segal. She could really be fantastic in some of those character parts.

On the other hand, I don't think she did a good job in A Place in the Sun - just too whiny.

Connie Steven's hair in "Grease II" alone weighed twice as much as both Connie Ford AND Shelley Winters together!

I give her props for landing Gassman, he was a gorgeous specimen of a man.

[quote]On the other hand, I don't think she did a good job in A Place in the Sun - just too whiny.

She was terrible in I Am A Camera. Worse accent ever committed to film.

Shelley Winters was a poor man's Barbara Bel Geddes.

[quote]Shelley Winters seems to be forgotten in today's gay culture.

I don't like when we use the term "forgotten" about legit stars.

She had two Academy Awards, was in many classic films, and wrote a series of bestselling memoirs. She'll never be forgotten by people familiar with movies.

R22 Not as long as we have TCM and DVD! I have practically every film she ever owned , including her first major screen appearance in 1944 (the film version of the Broadway musical "Knickerbocker Holiday")!

[quote]I don't like when we use the term "forgotten" about legit stars. She had two Academy Awards, was in many classic films, and wrote a series of bestselling memoirs. She'll never be forgotten by people familiar with movies.

But let's be honest. She doesn't have the DataLounge street cred of a Vivian "I have sufficient" Vance.

[quote]r24 Let's be honest. She doesn't have the DataLounge street cred of a Vivian "I have sufficient" Vance.

But who does?

Those are heights the rest of us can merely DREAM of.

The lighter side of Shelley. (No cracks.....)

God Bless Mrs. Rosen.

"Next Stop, Greenwich Village"--the DEFINITIVE Jewish mother.....she was a pro and a survivor and we must, must salute her.

Did they ever mention Nana Mary on the "Roseanne"/"Conners" re-boot and mention what happened to her? Two Oscar winners, playing mother and daughter!

Terrific in “Lolita”!

[quote]Terrific in “Lolita”!

Which is funny because in her auto-bio, she says she just couldn't bring herself to do the nude scene. A legitimate actress would bare her soul.

She just had way too much soul to bare, r33!

Please tell me she didn’t play a lezzie on Rosanne.

I love that Constance Ford vicious face slap.

There was a time when DL had a Mrs Rosen troll. I think he stopped when Shelley died.

I read her first autobiography ages ago. I don't remember any of it but do remember it as an enjoyable read.

Was the second one any good?

R35 No, Nana Mary was as straight and man crazy as they come, very Bohemian. Perhaps her character "experimented", like Shelley admittedly did, but she was predominantly hetero. In the dream sequence, it was Beverly who turned out to be lesbian, but they changed all that and made Jackie the lesbian. By the time the new series started, it was even more screwed up.

R36 Connie had been ready for that scene, and I don't think it was going to be as realistic as it was, but she became irritated with the spoiled Sandra Dee, late to the set while conducting an interview. Connie, already known for appearances on Broadway and a few movies (as well as starring in her own TV soap "Woman With a Past" where future "AW" daughter Victoria Wyndham's sister Felice Camargo played Connie's daughter) and other live TV shows, was under contract at Warner Brothers from 1959-1962. My favorite of her roles is "House of Women" where she dukes it out with "The Young & the Restless's" Jeanne Cooper. I'm surprised that Connie wasn't part of the cast of "The Chapman Report", made at Warners in 1962 with a huge female cast, including Shelley!

Constance Ford scared me.

R39 Are you Mary Matthews or Mary McKinnon?

There are rumors that Abe and I have departed. It ain't true.

I have one thing to say! Get Cleopatra Jones! (On video!)

The slap....

Shelley with an all-star cast, including the legendary Barbara Stanwyck and "Miss Peter Pan Collar" June Allyson.......

Did anyone ever see the TV version of "The Women" with Shelley as Crystal?

The part that really got her noticed (and started her transition to great supporting roles) was "A Place in the Sun," but I agree with Pauline Kael, who said that Winters is so annoying in the role that when she is drowned it's like euthanasia. But it DID get her noticed, and she went on from it to her really great roles. She was so perfectly cast in "Lolita" that I can hardly think of another occasion where a famous actress so perfectly fit a part from a famous novel. in many ways she almost steals the whole movie away from James Mason and Peter Sellers (no mean feat!).

No, it's understandable, r39.

Barbara Nichols, r38!

Shelley Winters picking up her second gold statue as Roseanne in "A Patch of Blue," 1965. Make a mental note of the title should you ever see it advertised for airing on cable. Wonderful, touching film holding the distinction of film history's very first interracial kiss.

It’s on TCM every now and then. Agree. Wonderful film.

Who's the driver in r6? I thought it was Alan Hale Jr but it wasn't.

She was a good actress. She was also gorgeous for about five minutes.

I love you R15 - you get to add a gold star to your gay card. That gif is fabulous. I love the movie "A Summer Place". Plus, Sandra Dee's delivery of "Merry Christmas Mother." after being slapped to the floor is perfect. Thank you, thank you, thank you.

I saw her in person on a NYC sidewalk when she was probably in her 60s. She had absolutely fantastic skin. Very blonde and peaches and cream. When she was younger she must have been a knock out. So I finally saw what all those guys saw in her. Unfortunately, her appeal doesn't really translate in films.

Yeah, not seeing gorgeous at all.

....

"I wonder if she had Scotty Bowers on speed dial?"

Women don't need pimps to get them dates, OP.

Why did eldergays obsess over female celebrities? I don't find women that interesting usually.

She was never gorgeous, but she was sexy and fun, and when she was young she had the soft curvy body that was in fashion. She was the kind of uninhibited gal straight men like to have fun with, I can believe she got man after man after man after man!

I can also believe she spent her later years surrounded by eldergays, because straight men don't settle down with the uninhibited ones.

[quote]On the other hand, I don't think she did a good job in A Place in the Sun - just too whiny.

The movie was overrated.

Well, she certainly made Clift's character much more sympathetic, r17. Dewy-eyed Sylvia Sidney made the character heartbreaking in An American Tragedy.

The fact that Winters was so unappealing changed the story, made the murder seem almost sympathetic. Too much so for my tastes, "A Place In The Sun" was so sticky and romantic that it made it seem like killing her was perfectly understandable, not the brutal murder it was. It made the story seemed more of a doomed romance, in which a brutal murder was nothing but a plot device keeping the lovers apart.

Not one of my favorite films.

The novel gives so much socio-economic context for Clyde's conflicted psycho-drama that he is quite sympathetic there too, almost a victim of forces beyond his control.

I’ve never been able to figure out if it was Winters’s character who was annoying in “A Place in the Sun” or if it is her performance. Either way, the Sylvia Sidney character in “An American Tragedy” was more appealing, and her character’s denouement much sadder.

I read in a biography of Montgomery Clift that he’d hoped that his friend Betsy Blair might be cast in “A Place in the Sun”, believing that she had a wistful quality that Winters lacked. But George Stevens was very impressed with Winters and cast her.

I love this Liz Smith story about being assigned as a young journalistto write a feature on Shelley:

For one of her first jobs as a writer, Smith says she was assigned to follow Shelley Winters as she went Christmas shopping. As it turns out, the two-time Academy Award winner was a big fan of the five-finger discount: "Every store we stepped into, Shelley would take these expensive things and head for the door," Smith reveals. "The shops were horrified, but they were afraid to ask her to pay."

Shelley told this story during a talk show interview in the 80s or 90s. I wish I could remember more details, since I’m sure there’s a YouTube video somewhere. I may have few embellished a bit, but here’s the gist of what I remember…

Shelley was invited to a benefit to raise money for the Actors Studio, the school where she had thrived as a method actress in the 1950s. Shelley was a major star at the time, with lots of movies and Oscar nominations, and her attendance at the benefit as a past graduate was a big deal. When she arrived, she went to a table to “sign in” and get her credentials and her itinerary. The table was manned by volunteers - past and present students from the Studio - and everyone at the table recognized her.

The older man who greeted her was handsome and sexy, and Shelley - older and heavier - immediately went into her flirtatious blonde bombshell act that had served her so well in the past.

“Shelley, so nice to see you!” the older man said as he looked for her press packet. Obviously, he knew her. Shelley reported that he looked familiar and assumed he was someone who had been in one of her acting classes. She didn’t want to seem aloof, but she could not place him. “So nice to see you too!” she replied extending her hand. He stood and shook her hand but seemed a bit annoyed and perplexed. It was as if he had expected bigger greeting, perhaps a hug and a kiss, not this formal handshake. Shelley continued “When was the last time we saw each other. I can’t quite remember. It seems like ages…”

The older man smiled and replied “Shelley, it’s me…Tony”.

“Tony, of course!” Shelley replied, although she had no idea who he was.

Again, the man smiled, this time with a bit of a sigh and a hint of irritation”. “Yes, Tony…. TONY… Tony Franciosa, YOUR EX-HUSBAND!!!!”

When Shelley finished telling the story during the TV interview, the host and the audience burst into such spontaneous laughter that Shelley looked at them and said sincerely “What…he looked different!”

[quote] She was never gorgeous, but she was sexy and fun, and when she was young she had the soft curvy body that was in fashion. She was the kind of uninhibited gal straight men like to have fun with, I can believe she got man after man after man after man!

Absolutely.

Anthony Franciosa, one of Shelley's ex-husbands...

Marlon Brando slept with ANYTHING. He is nasty.

I thought Shelley was awful in "Night of the Hunter" and annoying in "A Place in the Sun." Both times she ended up underwater. Good.

You will keep a CIVIL TONGUE in your head when discussing DL ROYALTY!

Shelley’s “Tonight Show” clash with Oliver Reed is legendary, but her later appearance with Annie Potts was also hilarious (aided immeasurably by Carson’s priceless deadpan). YouTube used to have the clip by itself, but now it looks like the have the whole episode only.

There is an anecdote about Shelley auditioning for George Cukor for A Double Life. She was late and got a lift from Lou Costello to Universal Studios. Cukor said of the girls who auditioned Shelley was not the best actress and her lateness might have also put him off but he cast her because when she acted she broke your heart.

[quote]"I wonder if she had Scotty Bowers on speed dial?" Women don't need pimps to get them dates, OP.

Tell it to Katharine Hepburn, who visited Scotty's gas station daily.

She's captivating in every scene. She was the best part of Blume In Love, for example, which I watched because it came highly recommended. Shelley and Kris Kristofferson were superb.

Shelley on Lucy

Shelley is so forgotten OP that there are currently two threads on her running simultaneously on the DL.

She was a great story teller but I think parts of it were exaggerated, especially I think she guilded the lilly with the marilyn monroe connection. Marilyn was a loner and except when married, she lived by herself. Im skeptical they were roommates, but Ive seen photos and maybe a u tube where they saw each other at a function and were for sure friends to a degree.

She had a certain sultry sexiness I thought in the 50 s, slightly slutty which would probably be attractive to straight guys/

Always makes me laugh.

Becaue she’s fat

[quote]She was a great story teller but I think parts of it were exaggerated,

I think so too. She talks about having two auditions just days apart. She didn't want to do the one movie, so she says she gained weight. She went to the audition and they thought she was too fat. She then spent the weekend(?) in a steam room and lost all the weight so that she could look good for the movie she did want. She makes it sound like she put lots of weight and then quickly took it off in just a few days.

Shelley to Neil Simon:"Neil, I think your best play is 'Same Time, Next Year.'"

Neil: "Shelley, I didn't write it."

Shelley: "Why not?"

My favorite quote on Winters came from some anonymous Datalounger, many years ago:

"She went through a FIELD of prime cock in her day!".

Considering her character on Roseanne would be 110 at this point, I don't think they really have to address it. Estelle Parsons is still kicking on the show (and is giving pretty much the same performance as 25 years ago, which is amazing in itself), and DJ named his daughter Mary. I think a picture of Shelley is on the mantle.

[quote]Shelley Winters seems to be forgotten in today's gay culture.

What exactly did she do for gays that she should be remembered???

She wrote that her phone rang and she picked it up only to discover Lauren Bacall on the other end asking Shelly where her husband, Tony Franciosa, was as they had plans to meet for dinner. Winters was aghast and called Lauren on seeing her husband so openly. After a pause, Lauren replied: "Shelley, if Tony doesn't care about your marriage, why should I?" and hung up.

Apparently, Lauren liked that Italian cannoli feel in her hand.

I have always been utterly charmed that she gave her Oscar for Diary of Anne Frank to the Anne Frank House.

her niece apparently recently played Mrs. Van Daan

[quote]Marilyn was a loner and except when married, she lived by herself.

Um, no she didn't. Aside from rooming with Shelley;

Had two roommates during two stays at the Studio Club.

Lived with agent/lover Johnny Hyde in his BH Palm Avenue home 1949-50 while keeping a studio at the Beverly Carlton for "apprearances."

She roomed with her acting coach Natasha Lytess at a minimum of three locations during their friendship from 1948-1951 (2 on Harper in WeHo and one on Crescent in BH),

She also lived with Millton and Amy Greene in their Connecticut home for many months as well as during the filming of Bus Stop in Los Angeles.

appearances.

Oh dear, myself.

Shelley Winters on The Tonight Show with Joan Rivers guest-hosting.

Norman Mailer comes on to plug a book.

Hilarity ensues.

Lauren Bacall was a real cunt

She was always a hoot, but she was a really great, committed actress as well. She'd go for it and wasn't afraid of being unlikable or ugly if the role required it.

She was a naturally uninhabited person, which made her a good actress. She could really throw herself into it, for better or worse.

R94 -- You mean by your comment, I take it, that no one lived inside of her? That would indeed make her a good actress.

loved her as Ma Barker. (Parker?) on Batman.

She was a riot as the evil lesbian agent in SOB. I remember her in the boudoir with a feather boa, picking feathers out of her mouth like pubic hairs...

[quote]R95 You mean by your comment, I take it, that no one lived inside of her?

Goddamn it, I meant [bold] uninhibited [/bold]!

And you [italic]goddamn well[/italic] KNOW IT!

(signed) r94

I love her. And she has the most perfect overbite. Love Shelley!

At a certain point in her later career, she just played the same part over and over again (there was a mean variant and a kind variant, but it was the same performance). But she was so great in both "The Night of the Hunter" as the foolish, abused wife of the serial killer, and in "Lolita" as the bourgeois culture vulture desperate for love.

[quote]r101 At a certain point in her later career, she just played the same part over and over again

That’s partially because Hollywood mostly wrote pushy harridan roles for older actresses back then.

I never liked her. She used to chew up the scenery in every single thing she appeared in, in which she was always exactly the same - but she's a gay fave, so she gets away with everything.

She’s not forgotten, but I think she would be talked about more if she was beautiful. She was sort of attractive in the first two years of her career, but her looks went downhill fast and she was never considered sexy by anyone.

Actually, R104, she was considered sexy by the horde of primo straight men she fucked in real life.

But yeah, somehow, her real-life sexiness didn't translate to the screen! I mean, in a lot of roles she seemed like the sort of fun gal anyone would like to have a beer with, but sexy? No, not really, and not because she wasn't beautiful. Sexiness is more about connecting to other people on a sexual level than looks, and she didn't really project that as an actress.

R105 Yes, I know. Many hot straight clearly found her sexy. I obviously meant the public’s perception of her, her screen image was never sexy, that’s one of the reasons why I think she’s not discussed very often in gay culture. She was always the plain shrew that men dumped for women like Elizabeth Taylor. Nobody had ever said they wanted to look like Shelly Winters. Obviously you don’t have to be beautiful or have perfect features to be sexy, she obviously possessed a sexy quality in person that appealed to many men, and she was probably fun and down to earth. I know that some men say that many beautiful women can be duds because they expect to be worshiped, that can be a huge turn off.

Did Shelley's pussy stink?

[quote]I have always been utterly charmed that she gave her Oscar for Diary of Anne Frank to the Anne Frank House.

Unfortunately, Otto Frank had to practically pry it out of Shelley's hands. And Shelley has admitted this. When she got the nomination, she went around bragging that if she won, she would donate the Oscar. When she actually got that little gold man in her hands, she didn't want to give him up. She admits that it took her MONTHS before she flew to Amsterdam to hand it over.

One of the hilarious bits in her book was when she took a trip to Europe. She bought some expensive cheese to bring back to the US. When they got to US customs, they made her give up the cheese because you're not supposed to bring food in. She wrote in her book that some border control man in Queens was enjoying her expensive cheese.

She had a brief period as a red hot mama. I think that gave her a sexual confidence that was attractive. There's a better photo than this in which she's dressed as a showgirl in fishnet stockings, but I can't find it now.

Apparently Jane Campion found Shelley very difficult to work with on The Portrait of a Lady.

Always a cool gal. Very talented.

R110 Very true. Watch the 'making of' documentary on the Portrait of a Lady DVD or Blu Ray.

Still, I've adored Shelley since The Poseidon Adventure and over the years have seen most of her films. I watched Next Stop Greenwich Village again last night for the first time in decades and she was so great in that. I true legend.

On the Next Stop DVD commentary Paul Mazursky talks about Shelley.

The thing about "A Place in the Sun"...

Those freakin' close-ups of Monty and Liz. They take your breath away! (Mare-eeee) Their beauty and the way they were shot, I think I must have gotten the vapors the first time I saw them (and every repeat view afterwards.)

It's what movies were meant to do.

Mario Cantone did a pretty accurate impersonation of Shelley Winters. And his Julia Child is hilarious.