Let talk home renovations

"Lose all hope all ye who enter here."

We also want to move a few walls around--nothing major, hopefully.

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[quote]We found a person who seems like a great contractor--recommended by our friends

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[quote]Hopefully construction will start by the end of the month.

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Hope you're moving out while all this is going on.

[quote]We also want to move a few walls around--nothing major, hopefully.

What do you consider major?

English grammar, apparently

[quoye]We're going to convert our fireplace from a wood one to a gas one.

I'd like to do exactly the opposite.

Hope you'll be posting pics, OP.

I had my master bath completely redone (down to the studs) in my 80's-era home. I shopped around for a contracting firm with a good reputation (although not a cheap one) and worked through their entire design process. Took about 3 months, but turned out very well. I was prepared for a lot of mess and disruption, as well as the unexpected glitches, so it wasn't terribly stressful. There were more punchlist fixes and warranty items after the job than I thought, but that was the advantage of picking a good firm with a good rep and warranty. I'm pleased.

3 months to re-do a bathroom? Good God!

Why don't do do the work yourself, OP? Do you dial your phone with a pencil?

I had my kitchen redone. It took longer than expected and I didn’t move out. The dust is crazy in a renovation—I highly recommend moving out

especially as OP is moving around walls.

The worst parts for me:

- the complete absence of transparency or logic in the pricing between contractors

- the frequent absence of correlation between price and quality and reliability

- the stunning and blatant absence of reliability in the contractor business which I have found is a truly unique and distinct phenomenon to this industry across trades and price levels

Best parts:

- the uniquely gay joy of home design

- shopping for the components myself as I am able to find similar/same quality pieces for as much as 80% less by spending time comparison shopping online. Amazing how many places get away charging 500% markups.

- the affirmation of my excellent taste by all straight visitors (gays will never not critique)

Good luck OP. Make sure your attorney reviews the contract.

Spell it “attornee” so the OP understands

A bunch of them OP

Last time I got smart.

Picked a high end contractor because a friend used them and convinced me they were cheaper in the long run because there would be nothing to fix, the job would be done right the first time.

They were great. They had an online project timeline and every day I'd get an update on what they were going to do that day and photos of it too.

I was talking to the owner--we were marveling that other contractors didn't take this approach too, that for the 15 minutes it took them to send the email and take the photos, they earned a world of goodwill, especially with the type of clientele they had where people expected project managers (and project management software) in work-related projects.

First, triple the time estimate the contractor gives you. Then expect three instances of calling your contractor to ask when the electrician is finally gonna finish the kitchen outlets so you can move your coffeemaker off of the table in the entranceway, or to ask why the weird plumber has to start the tile work in your master bath at 6 am or to find out when they’re going to pick up the tarps and buckets they left in the dining room even though the job ended three weeks ago. And maybe consider yourself lucky, because even the BEST contractors (like mine) pull this crap. That being said, you’ll likely enjoy the end results and be glad you got the work done.

It's very stressful, and we are 80% through a gut job.

The fireplace conversion to gas is amazing, and was the least of our construction (you may have to have the chimney lined... we did). We had the kitchen re-done (took down walls, made it huge), and it cost $250k. We did the upstairs 'master' and spent $50k. We had all of the hardwood floors re-done, and it's a fucking mess, but worth it in the end. Last is the basement (which thankfully was gutted already). OMG, remodels are sooooooo not fun but necessary if you plan to sell some day.

Took a chance on a brand new contracting business and thankfully had great luck. I was his first customer. He did the work for about 60% less then he charges now - all because I put up it taking forever (it seemed like anyway - 2 months) and left him a glowing Yelp review.

Tell us more about your kitchen, r20. Did you go with a custom build or one of the Euro high-end designer kitchens like Boffi or Bulthaup? What about appliances?

And then tell us how much you paid for your house and how that compares to how much others are currently selling for

My parents re-did their kitchen about 10 years ago. Their contractor was my mother's brother, who's made millions in the Florida construction boom of the last two decades. He and his crew worked dawn-to-dusk, with my parents (who are retired) busting their asses doing the clean-up and running any errands the builders needed for parts, etc. The kitchen looks great to this day, and my uncle gave my mother sweetheart prices, but it still cost a bundle, took 6 weeks, and caused a godawful mess while the work was going on.

Point? Even under the absolute best circumstances, renovation is a total pain in the ass.

Bump for r20.

My partner and I work on our house constantly it seems. There's always something to tweak or improve or paint.

There's no way we're paying contractors to fuck around in our house when we're a couple of big guys perfectly capable to do the work ourselves. Electricity is something we don't mess with, but everything else we've learned to handle

[quote]we're a couple of big guys

in which way big?

[quote]we're a couple of big guys

beards?

Hey R22, went with custom cabinetry throughout the kitchen, but since the house is an old tudor the cabinetry is more traditional (sort of off-white). The floors are a light porcelain, the refrigerator/freezer are both stainless steel sub zero (they are built-in but each is its own 36" unit). The range is a 42" wolf stove (gas) with 6 burners plus a fry plate. Also did the pot filler because the designer said it's a good add (I was indifferent). Also did some dark gray glass chandeliers and paid through the roof for cordless cellular window treatments that open from the top or bottom. Did radiant heating in the floor... so awesome. It was very stressful and walls came down etc., but absolutely love it.

Oh, sorry the built-in coffee maker (Miele) is also a huge plus!!!

That’s serious cash R29. Hopefully you don’t need to get your cash back anytime soon.

The cordless cellular window treatments are ridiculously expensive. I searched for anything cheaper and eventually did find a standard size - about 1.5 inches too narrow - that is manual for a very good price on sale at Lowes.

One bedroom apt in 80 year old building. I'm too "old" to do big work now, and have enough $ to hire contractors. I had the bathroom redone - taken down to the studs - 10 years ago. It was well done and what I complained about was nothing like when I did the small kitchen this year. Bathroom team took 4 weeks, exactly what they scheduled. Kitchen was a nightmare with different people coming in to do various work. Painter/plasterer had an attitude and did shitty work that had to be redone...project took 10 fucking weeks to complete.

Hiring the right contractor is tricky. The best one (bathroom) was a team that worked for a big company. Second one (kitchen) was with a guy who handed the work off to various people he hired. The floor buckled after the counters and custom cabinets were installed. Contractor put dents in the new floor with the plumber when they pulled out the range to connect the gas. BOTH were very expensive. I will never do these kind of renovations again.

Agree R32, the contractor is key to all of it. Thankfully we used a contractor that was actually on-site every day and micro-managed his staff-- small company, but in NYC it's not easy to find, and he is truly amazing. LOVE him!

What amount is too much for improvement (as a percentage of current home value)? What I really don’t want is to “over improve” the place, making it harder to sell and recoup the investment.

Get estimates of cost and time, double them, then prepare to be disappointed.

Great choices, r29/r30. I hope you enjoy the kitchen for many years to come.

I've thought about re-doing my kitchen and choosing those beautiful Wolf and Sub-Zero appliances, but I'm also drawn to the European sizing of Miele and Gaggenau/Bosh. What pushed you toward selecting the Wolf range?

[quote] We also want to move a few walls around--nothing major, hopefully.

This is one of the funniest things I’ve read on DL in months.

Can anyone explain to me why one would want to convert a working wood-burning fireplace to a cheap common gas 'fireplace'?

I did a reno from basement to top floor in my house built in the 1920s. Painted the whole house to freshen it up. I also redid the hardwood floors throughout the main floor and top floor. Added a 3/4 bath in the basement, tucked it, repainted the floor. Main floor was a minor kitchen reno. Put in all new appliances, painted the existing cabinets, added under- and over-cabinet lighting, and new lights.

Upstairs in the bedrooms was just paint, some new furniture and wall art. Totally redid the my bathroom on the 2nd floor because it was on the small side for a main bathroom. Did custom glass shower, marble floors and wall tiles about halfway up the wall, new tub and toilet, glass tile in the shower, new lighting, and added a pocket door to give more space. I added some sconces to the master bedroom that required an electrician, and some other new lighting. I also did faux wood blinds throughout most of the house. Also added dual zone heating and cooling as it was an older home and dreadfully hot upstairs during the summer. the HVAC needed to be replaced anyway as it was older and not efficient. Did some paint and new ceiling fan on the 3- season porch and put some furniture out there. Redid the back porch and stairs. Also refaced the fireplace with granite.

Overall, it was a pain but worth it. The first contractor bailed. I got the second, and luckily final one based on a recommendation from my designer. He had a good reputation and he and his crew showed up on time and did their work. There were glitches, which I expected. I figured I'd go over budget and I did. Everyone warned me it'd be up to 30% over budget. I think it was close to that but just under.

As others have noted, getting a good, reliable contractor is key. That is easier said than done. If the contractor is good, they usually have good subcontractors. I also worked with a designer to help me with paint, wall art, etc. She was great and just charged an hourly fee. She was worth it as she tied everything together. I had worked with another designer who was all about what she wanted. I canned her. The one who worked out really listened to me and picked out things I would like. Sold my house for a profit, got my money back and made a nice profit.

I'm about wrapping up a restorovation of a 1950's midcentury modern purchased last November and I'm contracting it myself, so it's taken 5x longer than it would have had I had a crew come in but is coming in at costs about 70% less as well.

Includes: All new electrical All new plumbing Re-skim coating the plaster to get rid of "stucco" texture (this has been the worst part/taken the longest) Gutted kitchen with porcelain floors and Jenn-Air appliances (still working out final cabinet details but will be walnut slabs). New roof for back of house to slightly pitch the flat portion to match the front (insurance requirement). New master bath vanity/dressing room. New HVAC ducting.

Honestly, I'd rather have built a new house at this point. We were so careful to preserve the trim/woodwork/plaster that it's taken twice as long and cost way more to work around and repair and match things than it would have to rip out and start new. I'm a masochist for originality and it's a cute house with a ton of character (think slightly more traditional styled house from "A Single Man").

I had a bathroom done that took about 3 weeks and ran $16000. Like those damn hgtv shows,they found all sorts of problems once they did demo. I originally was getting a tiled shower installed but ended up with a whole new bathroom. That wasnt so bad,but getting hardwood floors installed was a frigging nightmare that never seemed to end! It was supposed to take a week,and took 6. The installers were a shady crew who never showed up on time and called out a lot. I finally freaked out on them and told them "I want you motherfuckers OUT of my house this instant" and called their corporate office and got another crew who did an excellent job . Even though it was a nightmare,I did get a very nice discount and my floors are lovely. I will never remodel anything ever again.

I’m surprised your bathroom only took three weeks R41, that’s kind of amazing.

About the fireplace conversion: My master bedroom has a small fireplace that's cozy with a stacked stone front. I would occasionally light a fire but hated the mess (carrying ashes thru the house, logs, smoke and smell) Converted to gas and it's hassle free, the logs are totally realistic these days and I've put it on a thermostat to keep the bedroom at 70. It's so much more user friendly.

I had 2 bathrooms done - gutted to studs and redone - in less than 2 weeks for under $3,000. One of my most joyful and fulfilling adventures. Found the right immigrant guy who did everything himself. I know people who paid $30,000 for one bathroom. It’s ridiculous how much contractors charge. They make a better living than most Americans.

Just move. It's easier.

[quote] Converted to gas and it's hassle free.

In the process of converting my fireplace to gas too. Looking forward to having a fire with the press of a button

Covering wood to gas?? Tacky tacky tacky. Nothing like a good fire. Worth the hassle.

[quote] What pushed you toward selecting the Wolf range?

Honestly? Every other house in the neighborhood had one. I barely cook, but it will help resale

[quote] The fireplace conversion to gas is amazing, and was the least of our construction (you may have to have the chimney lined... we did)

I know I have to get the chinney cleaned for a conversion but what's the point of relining it?

[quote] Can anyone explain to me why one would want to convert a working wood-burning fireplace to a cheap common gas 'fireplace'?

The smoke from a wood burning fireplace starts coming into the house at the fire gets weaker. You have to keep buying logs and feeding it to the fireplace, There's lots of ash cleanup.

Gas fireplaces (with a blower) allow the fire to start and stop without any cleanup

I"m currently having skylights put in as well as 5 new wall windows (I like light!). Also having some in-ceiling light put in. The whole thing is taking a month longer than expected because of delays in the the lights coming in.

Looks good so far though.

I like my contractor because he explains everything in great detail so I know exactly how and why things are happening the way they are

Good to see the love for real fireplaces here. I get the convenience and cleanliness of gas. But the atmosphere of a real wood burning fire is the whole point. And in reality, you only use it occasionally, so the look is equally important. I have a classic, stone fireplace and it’s the reason I bought the house. Architecturally beautiful.

Relining is required to prevent gas from seeping into the rooms upstairs or the roof. Brick or stone can let gases leak out before it ventilates outside.

What are the thoughts on using shiplap to cover wallpaper in a bedroom? Or should I paint over it?

Don’t be lazy - scrape it. Not that hard. Definitely don’t use shiplap - that’s more work than scraping wallpaper.