Shirley Maclaine Would've Been Better Than Barbra Streisand As Fanny Brice In Funny Girl

She was Fanny Brice not Fionnula McBrice. Oy.

Was Lucy too busy? Or did Gary nix it?

R2, you mother-fucking anti-Semite. Fuck off.

I was too busy studying at Vassar, otherwise would have stepped in to save the day.

Op is a maroon...

Fanny Brice was a not pretty Jewish comedienne and singer. Among other reasons for not being right for the role, Shirley was never a good singer.

Shirley was the go to girl when Broadway shows were adapted into film

She took over for Anne Bancroft in Two For The Seesaw

She TWICE took over for Gwen Verdon (Can-Can & Sweet Charity)

She took over for Elizabeth Seal in Irma la Douce

With that track record, it would be natural that Shirley be Fanny Brice - a shortsighted move by Movie Studios to snub Shirley like that, as she was due the role.

[quote] Shirley was never a good singer.

That is what Marni Nixon is paid for.

Julie Andrews would have been better than either of them and she would have burned up the screen with Shariff as they did in Tamarind Seed.

And in '66-'67 Julie could have gotten any role she wanted.

She should have snagged Dolly too. But she instead made the two worst choices in cinema history: Star! and then Darling Lili sinking her brilliant career faster than the Titanic.

Only God in a moment of rare charity kept her out of B&B.

R10 Julie Andrews can't do comedy

Shirley Jones could sing and do comedy.

Maybe in a previous life...

R11 You're right. Dame Julie was phenomenon with beautiful diction. But she couldn't do comedy.

(You will note I 'm using past tense).

Fannie Brice behaved like WC Fields and looked like Ernest Borgnine.

That role belonged to Kathy Bates.

I see that R2 has disappeared.

But I'm conscious that Babs' movie career started at the top and everything after that got worse.

She was abled handled by the great William Wyler (a co-religionist) who was able to handle selfish prima donnas.

The other thing I notice is that 'Funny Girl' starts off a conventional movie but ends up in dramatic solo number against an abstract black background (which is exactly the same as how the great George Cukor (a co-religionist) ends 'A Star Is Born').

"Op is a maroon..."

OP, I expect you'll be knocked on your FANNY THRICE.

A young Linda Lavin could have done the roll justice. She had the kookie earthy personality early on in Alice. Lainie Kazan goes without saying. Renee Taylor as well.

I disagree about Streisand's movie career. Funny Girl the movie is a mess that has more to do with how great Streisand is than anything resembling Fanny Brice. Her directorial efforts were much deeper and more thought provoking films. It's nothing short of a crime that she doesn't have a Best Drector Oscar.

Shirley Maclaine can do "kooky" better than Babs, which she showed in "Two for the Seesaw" and "The Apartment".

That is where Babs is weak

Shirley MacLaine is such a ham of an actor, it's amazing that Stanley Kubrick never put her in one of his movies.

And in some ways she was in Funny Girl, only it's called Sweet Charity and was directed by Bob Fosse.

R19, how about her turn in WHATS UP DOC?

R21 Barbra HATED that film and was just phoning in a performance

No, but Shirley would have been better than Barbra in [italic]Hello, Dolly[/italic]. Dolly is supposed to be an older Irish widow, not a young Jewish woman.

Babs should have phoned in more performances. Doc is the last time in her career she was sensational in the way she looked and performed.

Completely natural with no self consciousness and no need to be important. She needed better Oscar bait material than the muck she started doing.

And by the way Charity is a sensational movie musical with the Rich Man's Frug being the best dance number Fosse ever put on film. And it was filmed in '68 just in time before the film ratings. Otherwise god knows what the dance hostesses would have been doing with their clients. Fosse was forced to keep out the R rated sordidness thank god. We don't have to see the women's smeared lipstick after giving blow jobs to the men or see the guys with their pants bulging while dancing with the women.

Actually, R8, Shirley took over for that classic French chanteuse, Lilo, in the Can-Can movie. A natural progression. Verdon played a supporting role in the Broadway show (and stole it from Lilo). Her role was taken on film by Sinatra's current "fiancée" Juliet Prowse.

Shirley was the other choice for The Unsinkable Molly Brown, but Debbie Reynolds campaigned hard for that one and won it. That casting would have made sense. Shirley was always a bit of a rough-and-tumble gal, and from Virginia so no doubt had some sense of what hillbillies are like. (Maybe...). Fanny? I really don't see that one. (Shirl's character's Jewishness in Two for the Seesaw becomes a casual aside, not really intrinsic to her performance, as it would need to be for Fanny Brice. I imagine the future Mrs. Brooks, Method devotee, and early Fanny candidate Anne Bancroft made more of the Jewishness in Two for the Seesaw when she became a Broadway star in that role). Dolly? At 35 or so, Shirley still would have been considered too young after Channing (who was only 43 when she originated it but of course read very matronly) and all the grand dames who followed Channing on the stage.

In London (and later in Vegas) Prowse played the lead in "Sweet Charity", which Shirley got to film. Show biz seems a pretty small world at times. The original cast recording from the London production is terrific.

Almost any actress with even a little talent to be a character and not herself would have been better than Babs in any movie she was in.

And Shirley did play a Jewish woman in Two for the Seesaw, but not Fanny Brice. They needed an ugly Jewish actress to play Fanny and for that end Babs was right for it.

Babs is not an ugly Jewish actress in any of her early films.

She fell off a cliff with Funny Lady and Star is Born.

Babs has been ugly since she was born, as shown in childhood pictures of her. Of course she was ugly in the first Funny Girl movie as she was in the stage production and as she was in I Can Get it For You Wholesale and as she was the second she first stepped on a stage. But even worse than her looks is that horrid, fingernails on a chalkboard speaking voice of hers, even worse than that Nanny woman. She can't act, never could, just like Madonna. But at least the one thing Babs has is a glorious singing voice. I can tolerate listening to her sing but not listening to her talk and I do find her hard to look at, always did.

Barbara Step-Father told her she was too ugly to have ice cream, he said that to her face.

I've would've been better than any of those other one-trick-pony broads. Unfortunately, they were worried about what the Southern audiences would think, so they chose that other singer instead.

Funny Girl was one of the last super successful roadshow musicals. Nobody had a problem with her anywhere except the people who had to deal with her in Hollywood which is why she won only half an Oscar.

Up to and including Doc she is wonderful to look at and any one of us would give his eye teeth just to have had one of her real life lovers. Except Elliot Gould.

Hollywood famous men weren't fucking her for her beauty. She was the latest shiny new toy and an odd one at that. They had to get their turn.

They were fucking her for her talent! Wouldn't you?

I don't believe people want to fuck a famous person for his or her talent. It's for their fame, especially if it's sudden and new. Ruth Gordon had talent, even if she wasn't married do you think men were lined up to fuck her?

Garson Kanin lined up to fuck her and he wasn't even straight.

OP, you forgot the third choice, ARE YOU INSANE?

R10, I know you're joking.

Shirley sings like a moose. Maybe Lainie Kazan could have dubbed her.

shirley was and is a narcissist, selfish, ego maniac who would kill someone if it would have gotten her ahead....

ever since i read her daughter's book i have loathes that woman. and she was never THAT talented. just relentless.

Shirley Maclaine had a better box office record than Barbra in 1963

Therefor Shirley should have played the part, strictly based on box office stats.

End of story

R24, what is this "sensational" bullshit? Do you not know any other adjective? Other than that, I agree with you 90%

R30, boo hoo, if that's the worst thing that happens to you as a child consider yourself lucky.

R32, the last part of your post is really dumb. Barbra didn't favor gays as lovers. And see R33.

True, Shirley was the go-to person for musicals being made into films for a long time. By 1967 that had changed, she was nearing 40 and out of date. Streisand became the go to person, hell, they even offered her Cabaret for chrissakes. Plus, Babs TV career (perhaps the best part of her career) in the 1960s was grooming her, testing her for movies.

R40, what does 1963 have to do with 1967-68?

As for Julie Andrews, film critic Richard Schickel wrote a comparison of Streisand in Funny Girl and Julie in Star! in Life magazine in 1968. The gist of is was how Streisand was capable of letting herself go in the role, how untrained and"free" she was. Where Julie was too studied, too controlled, too boring.

[quote] She was abled handled by the great William Wyler (a co-religionist) who was able to handle selfish prima donnas.

Actually, Streisand and Wyler were famous at the time for their huge blow-ups both on the set and off. He saw the character one way and she saw it another. But he was one Hollywood's most revered directors at the time and she was just a newcomer, no matter how talented. The studio nearly always sided with Wyler and she was smart enough to create drama but not enough actual trouble to endanger a future career.

Years later, Wyler famously said in an interview that Streisand should be given forgiveness for the trouble she caused during the shooting because it was the first film she had ever tried to direct a film.

"it was the first film she had ever tried to direct a film"

The quote was "this is the first time she's ever directed a movie."

And it wasn't years later, R42. That was DURING the filming.

Thanks for the corrections, r43. I was going to post to correct my awful grammar anyway. But my point stands they weren't exactly friendly during filming as had been posted earlier.

R41 here is Barbra box office track record in 1967 . . . . Which is why the role should of gone to Shirley as she had proven her box office appeal, hands down.

Shirley MacLaine has acting limitations (despite her track record) and sings like shit. Babs and Funny Girl were made for each other.

[quote] Shirley MacLaine has acting limitations (despite her track record) and sings like shit.

1) She proved her ability to play Fanny Brice after triumphing in similar roles like Sweet Charity, Two for the Seesaw, Irma La Douce and The Apartment.

2) In terms of singing, that is what Marni Nixon is paid for.

Shirley murdered Sweet Charity, a box office flop. I'd hate to see what she would have done to Funny Girl. And she was too old for the role while Barbra, 8 years younger, was perfect for the role.

Some Funny Girl trivia: Early on during the Broadway show's creation, both Mary Martin and Ann Bancroft were cast to play Fanny but as the project changed they both left before they were actually signed. Carol Burnett also turned down the part.

Composer Jule Styne early on championed Streisand but she wasn't a name star at the time and didn't have much support. For awhile director/choreographer Jerome Robbins was involved and also supported her. Styne supported her back when she was only known as a New York cabaret performer but she eventually gained some fame for her supporting part as the secretary Miss Marmelstein in the Broadway show I Can Get It for You Wholesale, which helped her land the role.

Hollywood producer Ray Stark produced both the Broadway and film versions of Funny Girl. Stark was the son-in-law of Fanny Brice.

This is an exceptionally stupid thread.

OP's post is indeed stupid, r50, but some of the replies have been interesting.

Agreed, R50. Streisand was fantastic in Funny Girl...and What's Up, Doc for that matter. No one in their right mind would think it should be Shirley MacLaine.

A bit of additional Funny Girl trivia:

Garson Kanin was eventually signed to direct after Robbins left the project, but the results weren't satisfactory. Since his first choice Streisand had been cast, Jerry Robbins came back and took control and received a "production supervised by" or some such credit. Streisand was a sensation out of town and was instrumental in getting Robbins back. Kanin had wanted to cut "People."

At one point, David Merrick was involved as co-producer but dropped out. Stephen Sondheim was at one point approached about doing the lyrics, as he had done for Gypsy with Styne, but he declined for the same reason Carol Burnett gave when she passed on the show: they both said a Jewish performer needed to be cast as Fanny.

I find the choice of Shirley Maclaine and many of the other performers to play Fanny Brice over Barbra to be really bizarre. I really can't imagine any other performer from that time period who could have been better at playing that part. I like Shirley Maclaine just fine, but her background was primarily as a dancer: she's a barely adequate singer. And 'Funny Girl' doesn't require much dancing ability from its star, but definitely requires some vocal chops. Barbra was a sensation when the show opened on Broadway, and even though I was a kid, I seem to remember the movie playing at local theatres for over a year, since it was so beloved, and people kept returning to see it, again and again. There have been few movies debuts like that that I can remember, where the lead actress became an immediate star.

Shirley Maclaine was the top female musical star on film at the time. It is only natural for studio executives to demand she get the part.

The sensation troll again @R54. NOT in '67-68, R55. Sorry, Shirley.

"both Mary Martin and Ann Bancroft were cast to play Fanny "

Untrue. Neither were actually SIGNED to play the part, they were only considered, no matter what that dead Streisand loving hack James Spada said/wrote.

OP you’re wrong. Shirley only plays Shirley. Now, behave.

R56, Geez, you're a tedious cunt. The troll-accusers are worse than any actual trolls. I've only posted the one time on this thread. How many times, so far, have you?

[quote]Time raved, "Some stars merely brighten up a marquee; Barbra Streisand sets an entire theater ablaze. … Actress, songstress, dancer, comedienne, mimic, clown — she is the theater's new girl for all seasons."

[quote]In his column in the Daily News, Ed Sullivan wrote, "Barbra Streisand in 'Funny Girl' is the greatest thing to hit Broadway in too many seasons."

[quote]Writing in the New York Journal-American, society columnist Suzy Knickerbocker flatly said, "Barbra Streisand as Fanny Brice is the star of the decade."

[quote]Celebrities who attended the opening night party at the Rainbow Room also sang Streisand's praises. Lauren Bacall raved, "I absolutely saw the best thing I ever saw in my life in that girl. She can act. She can sing. She has an electric personality. Which is what makes a star."

[quote]Sophie Tucker, who was a peer of Brice's in the '20s and '30s, enthused, "She has everything that I will call a star. She is star material from now on. Nothing will stop Barbra Streisand."

R54

My source.

R58

The musical role Shirley SHOULD have played was Mama Rose in GYPSY. She might not have the pipes for that either (probably the only role she does have pipes for is Dolly), but I could see her in that role way more than I could see Barbra in it. She's a far better actress and can do quirky, kooky, sexy, heartbreaking, and psychotic.

R58 no one outside of New York knew who Barbra Streisand was. Middle America didn't know who she was.

Shirley with string of hit musicals under her belt, middle America knew who Shirley was,

Thus Shirley should have gotten the part

I do not see any of her so called “talent”. There’s many actresses who can sing and Streisand wasn’t even that good. Moreover, Funny Girl is a boring ridiculous movie that is virtually forgotten about now.

Julie Andrews as Fanny Brice and Dolly Levi! OH, MY SIDES!

It's the funniest notion after nitwit OP's ludicrous assertion.

R61. I'm not going to waste any more time arguing with your idiocy. Have a nice night.

Um, r61, middle America sure knew who Streisand was after Funny Girl, and really, that's all that matters.

Clearly, r62 is an anti-Streisand troll. Zzzzzzz.

r61, the very idea that most of Middle America at that time knew or cared about either Fanny Brice or the Broadway musical is another reason your post is too funny.

*or the Broadway musical FUNNY GIRL is another reason...

EVERYONE knew who Streisand was in 1968, R61. She was a star of records and high rated TV specials; her Broadway success had been documented on all of the weekly/monthly magazines and television. How old are you, twelve?

R58-R59, I can see by your source why you're always wrong.

Shirley MacLaine was never even considered for the role, OP, you silly old twat.

But Fanny Brice was never played by Barbra. Barbra was played by Barbra and it's the same for every other movie she ever made. There might have been road show versions of the play Funny Girl where someone actually played the character Fanny Brice, but it sure as shit wasn't done by Barbra.

BTW, I detest the spelling of the name Barbara that way. What a stupid thing to do.

Sorry but people in the midwest had no idea who Barbra was, except theatre queens. Shirley Maclaine they knew due to her strong box-office record.

What’s up with you sad old queens. Streisand was never really that talented, she had a halfway decent singing voice and that was about it. She was always an incredibly ugly and mediocre actress, who never wrote a song in her life. A real talen can write songs, read music and play an instrument.

This is the stupidest thread I have ever seen. EVER.

R56, you lying troll. You wrote:

[quote]The sensation troll again @[R54]. NOT in '67-68, [R55]. Sorry, Shirley.

[quote]"both Mary Martin and Ann Bancroft were cast to play Fanny "

[quote]Untrue. Neither were actually SIGNED to play the part, they were only considered, no matter what that dead Streisand loving hack James Spada said/wrote.

What I actually wrote at r49 was:

[quote] Some Funny Girl trivia: Early on during the Broadway show's creation, both Mary Martin and Ann Bancroft were cast to play Fanny but as the project changed they both left before they were actually signed. Carol Burnett also turned down the part.

I clearly stated that both were never signed but you omitted that part when you accused me. Die, darling, die. And I have no idea who r54 and r55 are or why you referred to them when replying to me.

I’ve seen drag queens during a fire island beauty pageant with more talent than Barbara Streisand.

A bit more trivia about Funny Girl: As I stated in my earlier posts at r49 and r53, Jerome Robbins was heavily involved in the show early on, both as director and supervising the musical staging. He left before the show began performances due to legitimate creative differences with the other creatives and producer Ray Stark. Garson Kanin took over as director.

But despite Streisand's sensational performance, the show still had significant problems during out-of-town tryouts and Robbins, supported by Streisand and Styne, came back to resume over all control of the production a few weeks before the New York premiere. Kanin retained the title of director but was no longer in charge.

Kanin wrote a lightly disguised roman à clef about his out-of-town experience with Funny Girl that he titled Smash. It wasn't a huge success but nonetheless sold well. When NBC decided to produce a series about the backstage adventures of a Broadway musical, they purchased the rights to that book, not because they used material from it, but because they wanted to secure the title to use without any threat from Kanin's estate.

Here is Shirley from her TV Special "Every Little Movement" anyone who watches cannot deny she be a great Fanny Brice

And more people are agreeing, Yesterday Shirley only had 25% now it has gone up to 27%! Come on guys, we can do it and overtake Babs in this poll!

A few interesting responses doesn't change the fact that this might be the most imbecilic Datalounge thread of all time.

I believe movie theater owners in the mid 60s when there weren't multiplexes and all the major city downtowns had important first run movie theaters knew Funny Girl was going to be a major roadshow release actually wanted Shirley MacLaine as they felt she was a name more likely to sell tickets.

Also MacLaine though no great shakes as a musical performer either as a dancer or singer gives great performances in both Some Came Running and The Apartment.

She also in some interview on youtube said Streisand won no major Oscars for Yentl (was that the year of Terms of Endearment?)because she treated too many people in Hollywood badly. Maybe she changed in her old age but she unnecessarily pissed a lot of people off.

A trained circus monkey would have been better than than Streisand, while also being more attractive.

Streisand also treated people badly on Broadway including Sydney Chaplin her original Nicky Arnstein. Lots of backstage stories - clearly her success went right to her head on her first starring role on Broadway. I can understand hating on Barbra as a person. However, Marilyn Michaels who played Fanny on the national tour of "Funny Girl" gave an interview about the part when they were contemplating a Broadway revival directed by Bartlett Sher starring Lauren Ambrose as Fanny. Michaels said that you need a performer who possesses a certain type of Jewish humor to play the role. Fanny Brice was a very JEWISH comedienne and that is what R2 meant. Her Jewishness was central to her persona. MacLaine just didn't have that at all and her singing was nowhere as good as Streisand in the sixties. It is a demanding score and yes the Fanny, not the dubber Marni Nixon, needs to sing those songs. They are central to the character. What MacLaine had/has more of than Streisand is warmth.

BTW: many of the other Broadway Fannys were hugely successful - notably Mimi Hines who played it for a LONG time to raves. So it didn't need to be Barbra or bust.

Sorry I meant R1, R2 is offensive.

"Also MacLaine though no great shakes as a musical performer either as a dancer...."

Oh really, r79?

She was too ugly for ice cream and she was too ugly to play Fanny Brice.

The Broadway musical role was written specifically for Streisand by Jule Stein. So what's the deal with her reprising the role in the movie?

Disgust amongst yuh-selves!

(85 stupid fucking replies an none of you sad excuses for faggots could come up with this one?)

[quote] The Broadway musical role was written specifically for Streisand by Jule Stein. So what's the deal with her reprising the role in the movie?

Ask Carol Channing who was thrown under the bus by Barbra for Hello Dolly

It was a trolley, R87.

R11 "Pygmalion" which is what "My Fair Lady" was based on, is a comedy. So was "Victor/Victoria". But I don't see Julie Andrews playing a Jewish charactor -- she's a true shiksa. Even Julie's BFF Carol Burnett turned down Fanny Brice on Broadway saying that she could do different type of comedy, but she didn't "get" or think she could do Jewish.

Shirley MacLaine had a very weak singing voice, which made Gwen Verdon in "Damn Yankees" (when she did belt very well before the cigarettes started to affect her voice) seem like Brunhilde in comparison. MacLaine is absolutely lovely and charming opposite the adorable Tony Perkins in the film of "The Matchmaker", but she couldn't pull of Irene Molloy's songs in the musical; Perkins probably could have sung Cornelius well, and given a much less mannered and bizarre performance than Michael Crawford.

R76, you neglect to mention Streisand brought in her acting coach Allan Miller. It was a secret, Kanin didn't know Babs was being directed by someone else. Actually she is secretive about ANY coaching - acting, singing, friends who helped her with both and created her "look" were erased from her bio. She wanted everyone to think she did it all herself. I think she actually thinks she did it all herself, we'll have to see what she writes in her autobiography if it ever gets finished.

R71, I guess those people in the Midwest didn't know how to READ.

"She also in some interview on youtube said Streisand won no major Oscars for Yentl...because she treated too many people in Hollywood badly. Maybe she changed in her old age but she unnecessarily pissed a lot of people off."

R79, MacLaine said no such thing - they're friends.

All the Babs hate (r70/r71/r72/r75) is so sad. She's sitting in her Malibu compound of houses overlooking the ocean, and laughing at all you stupid queens, her Oscar for FUNNY GIRL nearby on a shelf.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!

And r77, shilling for this silly poll! OH MY SIDES, MARY!!!

Why a dumb post- that's all. Lord can DL be stupid.

Seems to ignore that Streisand's portrayal of Brice on Broadway was probably the most electric and accomplished performance by a new star, ever- and perhaps one of the greatest performance roles ever on Broadway. Duh-

Right, Marys--nobody screams "Jew" like Shirley MacLean Beaty (her real name). LMFAO!!!

Fanny Brice was a Jew, and quite an odd looking one, silly queens. Barbra was so perfect that a major revival has never gone forward--not since 1964 when she dominated in the role and then won an Oscar just a few years later.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

Are there jealous nameless anonymous queens trolling me on a gay gossip site? And what's today? Tuesday?

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

Listen I'm not making this up. Yes I saw it myself on youtube. MacLaine made the remark about Yentle not winning Oscars.

Also Streisand was not a slam dunk for the film which is why she signed that hated Stark 4 picture contract which I assume even Teddy Roosevelt knew she loathed. Her agent (maybe it was Marty?) said to her don't sign it if you are willing to lose the film.

She was not willing to lose the film. And yes many film owners wanted MacLaine for the film.

And when I made the crack about Andrews playing the role it was a fucking joke. Jesus Christ.

I guess in her first tv special she introduced Funny Girl to middle america,proofed she photograped well to hollywood,won an emmy(and a grammy for the soundtrack);while still doing the show on broadway.

She added another color special,schlepped to london to give europe a koscher blitz and had 150 00 people show up for her in central park concert.

That´s solid,no?

This is all true but still the film of Funny Girl for her was not in the bag.

Incredible as it may seem to us today Stark was being a major dick about giving it to her.

She could have called his bluff and we all know she's pretty fearless but she knew getting the film was not a sure thing.

R98 Greta Garbo wanted to come out of retirement and do the film version of Funny Girl.

R96, Stark wanted Streisand to sign a four movie deal precisely because he thought she's hit it big on the screen. This thinking was shared by the Academy of Motion Picture Arts and Sciences - they gave her a membership before her first film was released. Signing a several film deal was non an uncommon occurrence.

"many film owners wanted MacLaine for the film"

WTF? What are film owners?

Film theater owners wanted MacLaine for the film. This was a very different time for theater marketing. A huge film was treated like a Broadway show.

Streisand did not want to sign the several film deal. She made her own rules.

Stark played hard ball. You want Funny Girl? Then you owe me an additional 3 films. Streisand was very resentful but she was not going to risk losing the film. In other words she was not a shoo-in. As unbelievable as it seems.

After seeing My Fair Lady, I'm trying to imagine Lauren Ambrose playing Fanny Brice and that has to be the worst idea of all time. I can't believe that was dangerously close to happening. Lauren can barely portray Eliza's brash side, let alone play someone like Fanny Brice.

Your premise is absolutely ridiculous, OP. Carol Burnett knew you'd have to be jewish to play this role and she was right. Shirley McLaine would have been terrible in Funny Girl. First of all, she wouldn't have been able to sing the songs for shit. MacLaine singing People??? You're out of your fucking mind.

And had they not done that, r100, she wouldn't have won the Oscar!

"Streisand...She made her own rules."

LMFAO

Would Judy Holliday have been a contender for Fanny Brice on stage if she had been in good health? She would have been in her early 40s, which I think Fanny is when she is waiting for Nick to come back from prison. She certainly could play Jewish humor, had a nice singing voice, while not in the same league as Barbra's, but which served her well enough in her Styne vehicle "Bells Are Ringing" and had also co-starred with the show's Nicky Arnstein, Sydney Chaplin in that as well. Holliday would have made a great Dolly also, on stage or on screen. It's so sad that she died so young, as she was a great talent. Shirley MacLaine just would have been miscast as Fanny; while she trained as a dancer, she wasn't a star dancer, and her singing sounded wimpy basically. Her best talent was as an actress, but I don't think she'd make a good Fanny at all.

A young Patti could have done Fanny on stage in the 70s.

Fanny's a singing role, not a dancing one--Maclaine would be laughably wrong for it. I've never been a big Babs fan, but Fanny really is the part she was born to play.

That said, I actually think Carol Burnett would have been an interesting choice--she could belt. She could do a torch song and, obviously, she could do physical comedy. She also had the combination of gawky plainess mixed with a certain elegance that Brice had. I can see why she felt she was too much of a shiksa for it, but I think she had what the part required. Her voice was actually a little closer to Brice's than Streisand's is. Wish she'd tried it out at some point.

Has Lea Michele never been considered for a Funny Girl stage revival? Wasn't that the whole subtext of one of the many plot points towards the end of Glee?

Streisand in '67 thought she made her own rules. Which is why Wyler joked that she was directing Funny Girl. Also even before FG had its world premiere Matthau angrily told her during filming of HD to let the director direct.

At the end of shooting Dolly she asked producer Lehman for some of the antiques used. He said he couldn't give them to her as they belonged to the studio. She cut him and didn't talk to him for many years.

LMFAO

—Not in 1967 she didn't

r105, in 1964 when "Funny Gir"l was in tryouts and just about to open on Broadway, Streisand had at that point taken a dislike to Garson Kanin's direction and not too long after that she had him fired.

Yeah, even then, when she was 22, showed she had clout.

LMFAO.

Your poll's not looking too good in your favor, OP.

LOL.

Lea Michele sang (or rather really oversang) "Don't Rain on My Parade" on the Tonys some years ago in a rendition so pushy, fiendishly determined to steam roll that it went a bit pitchy, and over the top that made People feel like they didn't need People like Michele to do "Funny Girl".

R111, not in the movie industry.

[quote] Fanny's a singing role, not a dancing one--Maclaine would be laughably wrong for it

They could have revamped the role and emphasized the dancing aspect of Fanny, had Marni Nixon dub Shirley's singing and downplay the Jewish aspect of the character.

Problem solved, so now Shirley would be prefect for the part - which is what movie studios and theater owners wanted

FUNNY GIRL

Starring

Shirley Maclaine

[quote] Seems to ignore that Streisand's portrayal of Brice on Broadway was probably the most electric and accomplished performance by a new star, ever- and perhaps one of the greatest performance roles ever on Broadway

Yet Carol Channing BEAT Barbra for the Tony Award

Plus Julie Andrews had already made a huge splash on Broadway as a 21-year old star in "My Fair Lady" back in 1956.

This thread be stoopid.....

Surprised that no one has mentioned Eydie Gorme, who was supposedly considered for the role on Broadway. Allegedly she sunk her own chances by insisting that Steve Lawrence be cast as Nick Arnstein. Gorme definitely had the pipes to handle the score, and she was Jewish.

Thread be stoopid but it has prompted some interesting discussion.... BTW: The Fanny Brice/Nicky Arnstein story had been filmed before de-Jewished and with the names changed as "Rose of Washington Square" (1939) with Alice Faye and Tyrone Power as her no-good gambler husband who ends up in the klink. Per Wiki: "Brice sued 20th Century Fox for $750,000. The studio settled out of court for an undisclosed amount." Alice Faye as Ziegfeld Follies star Rose Sargent sings two songs that were associated with Brice "Rose of Washington Square" and "My Man" which was eventually used in the film of "Funny Girl". The Broadway producers wanted the show to end with "My Man" (an old Mistinguett number "Mon Homme" composed by Maurice Yvain for the Folies-Bergeres) but couldn't get the rights. So "The Music that Makes Me Dance" was the big 11:00 number instead. For the movie, the rights were cleared and the song went into the movie version. A remake of this movie could have starred Shirley MacLaine in the sixties.

The daughter of Brice and Arnstein married Ray Stark - they basically remade "Rose of Washington Square" with the real names and Jewishness put back in. On the other hand a LOT was left out. Brice was a divorcee when she met Arnstein and he was her second husband - in "Funny Girl" it is like he is her first boyfriend and she is inexperience with men. Brice also immediately divorced him after he got out of jail in 1927. So the material in "Funny Girl" is heavily bowdlerized and cleaned up to make Fanny into a more romantic figure - ditto the shady Arnstein whose wife sued Brice for alienation of affection in a divorce case and had been in prison several times for long stints.

The truth is, no one has dared try to approach the musical since Streisand because no one wants to invite comparison to Streisand in the film. She was definitive. I agree, r113--Michele was awful in her overeagerness. Major fail.

So r115, MacLaine would have been perfect for the part--as long as she did;t try to sing and if Marni Nixon had dubbed her voice--LMFAO!!!

And by the way, r115 Fanny Brice wasn't known for her dancing. So "emphasizing the dancing"--well, LMFAO all over again!!!

Laugh your ass off all you want. Streisand was not guaranteed the film of Funny Girl and she knew it despite being a front runner.

Channing thought she had Hello Dolly in the bag.

Rex Harrison was 3rd choice for the film of My Fair Lady.

But r123, Streisand DID end up getting the part and it made her a huge star, so really, what's your point and who cares?

MacLaine was never in the running.

The bottom line is no one else had the singing range, the style, the Jewishness, the awkwardness, the chutzpah, the self-deprecating humor, and who could really summon up Brice like Streisand. Sorry haters, naysayers, could-have-beeners...Streisand had it, took it, made it er own, and became an ever bigger star--as in movie star.

Doris Day gets my vote.]

[quote]They could have revamped the role and emphasized the dancing aspect of Fanny, had Marni Nixon dub Shirley's singing and downplay the Jewish aspect of the character.

If they had just written a completely different musical, Shirley would have been perfect!

R20, I was generally don't care for her, but she was wonderful in "Some Came Running."

And if they'd just made Fanny Brice a proper speaking, but politely sassy, Protestant English lass--it would have had Julie Andrews' name written all over it!

My point is that Streisand was not guaranteed the role. Today people seem to think it was hers for the asking and it wasn't. And yes MacLaine was seen as a threat no matter how laughable it seems today.

Like Harrison in MFL and Preston in Music Man. No matter how iconic their performances and unimaginable the films seem without them they and we were lucky they got those roles on film.

Imagine if Channing had gotten Dolly and people said Streisand should have played it all you queens would have been scorching in your disbelief.

And if they'd taken out all the musical numbers completely--it would have been perfect for Natalie Wood! Or Jane Fonda! Or Elizabeth Taylor! Or...[insert name here]

But r130, if MacLaine was such a threat to Streisand at that time, wouldn't MacLaine have had to be at least considered for the role of Fanny Brice? She wasn't.

Katie Hepburn could have done WONDERS with the paht.

[quote]And if they'd taken out all the musical numbers completely--it would have been perfect for Natalie Wood! Or Jane Fonda! Or Elizabeth Taylor! Or...[insert name here]

Funny, the only time they’ve taken a Broadway musical and stripped all the songs out of it was for Shirley to Star in Irma la Douce

Right, you are, r134! Shirley MacLaine was given the starring role in IRMA LA DOUCE AFTER they removed all the musical numbers.

Yeah, MacLaine would have been perfect for Fanny Brice in FUNNY GIRL! Because FUNNY GIRL would have bee so much funnier without all that music!

MacLaine's name was being bandied about. And if Stark was playing hardball with Streisand and he was who did Babs think she could be replaced with? She hated that 4 picture deal and did not want to sign it. All she wanted was Funny Girl and could have told Stark to stuff the other 3 films up his rear if she knew already it was hers. Personally I think she should have called his bluff.

Her gift to Stark after she finished her fourth film with him(Funny Lady?) was a mirror on which she wrote Paid In Full.

To give OP and his poll his due, according to NotStarring.com Shirley MacLaine was indeed "the studio's top choice to play legendary comedienne and Ziegfeld star Fanny Brice." I consider this the "Julia Roberts" syndrome where an actress is hot and box office and is automatically the top choice for everything i.e. Elizabeth Taylor as Nellie Forbush in "South Pacific" --- WTF????

Frank Sinatra would have been awesome as Nicky Arnstein but Streisand didn't like him personally, so she nixed him. David Janssen was her choice - handsome, charming and low key television star who wouldn't have ever impinged on her limelight.

r136, MacLaine's name being bandied about town isn't the same as being offered the part or even being seriously in the running. There's no evidence of who they thought could possibly replace Babs because they knew they didn't have anyone really, on that level. As for the 4-part picture deal Stark made her sign before FUNNY GIRL (which is all true), it wasn't so bad--out of it came two of her biggest hits at the time. She was just being self-protective and defensive about being owned at all--even then.

[quote] And yes MacLaine was seen as a threat no matter how laughable it seems today.

That is because she was one of the TOP Female musical stars on film, higher on the food chain than Barbra at that point.

[quote] MacLaine's name being bandied about town isn't the same as being offered the part or even being seriously in the running

Movie studios wanted Shirley in the role, PERIOD

And so I guess what r139 and r140 are saying is that the colossal mistake that would have been casting Maclaine in the role was averted by Streisand rightfully winning out, despite stupid movie studios?

R141 Funny Girl should of been the story of Fanny Brice, not the Barbra Streisand Musical Hour

r142, you "should of" learned grammar when you were in the 6th grade.

As for FUNNY GIRL, it was a lot more the story of Fanny Brice with Babra Streisand than it would have been with hoofer Shirley Beaty MacLaine.

R143 60% of the Funny Girl script was cut, as the show was refashioned into the Barbra Streisand Show.

"Irma La Douce" wasn't the only musical to gut its songs; "Fanny" did so as well. These actually deserve remakes, since they have great scores, and "Fanny" still really holds up well on stage. Do they re-title "Fanny" in UK when it's done or referred to? "Fanny" means a lady's private parts over there.

And what parts of FUNNY GIRL were taken out that were so precious that it took away from the quality of the show? It's quite common (and was then especially) to tailor a property about a dead celebrity around the person playing her.

A Bonnie Franklin type was needed...

^How did that woman above ever have a television career?

R148, a better question was how did that woman ever have a show biz career. Well, I could see her as a nagging, smug agent.

R123, did you know Channing got an Oscar nomination for "Thoroughly Modern Millie" the movie that is thought to have made her box office poison. When she sang "Jazz Baby", you wanted to run for cover.

When I saw that movie on TV as a child, I thought she was mentally retarded.

Run for cover, r150, or just blow your brains out!

I think Connie Stevens would've been a good choice. She was cute and pretty, big TV star, could sing. Eydie Gorme could sing but had no acting experience.

Connie Stevens as Fanny Brice? How about Jayne Mansfield?

Carol was proof that anyone could make it in show biz. Maybe Jerry Herman demanded Lucy didn't do "That's How Young I Feel" after he heard Channing's version.

Judy Garland as Fanny. Or maybe Liza.

A very, very young...Betty Buckley.

I just can’t understand how this incredibly ugly and untalented woman ever became a star. I’m assuming she was given break after break by her fellow co-religionists who made sure she was successful.

I’m also assuming that her most virulent supporters are the same co-religionists who scream anti-semite when anybody dares to state the obvious.

What are you saying, r158? Co-religionists? I don't even know who your post is directed at. I assume Streisand but only because you mentioned anti-semite. Do co-religonists mean Jews to you?

Don't be ridiculous, R154, Jayne Mansfield couldn't sing. And she was also dead.

Not until September 1967, r160. Jayne and her tits could have been in the running in '66 or so.

Could have been renamed TITTY GIRL.

Jews - both producers and of the public - were the first ones to say "too Jewish" when obvious Jewish actors wanted jobs. Kind of like how gays in power didn't hire actors who were too obviously gay. "Co-religionists" were not necessarily Streisand's friends.

R159, put R158 on ignore and see what pops up. This is a very disturbed motherfucker.

How do you ignore, r163? I don't think I've ever done it. I want to see what you're referring to with r158.

Clint as Carol's love interest......

^Think of the children they could have had.

R164, go to the post and hit the ignore sign in the lower right. Then go up top and hit "Ignored" and the history of the ignored poster will pop up.

Ahh--you mean what I call the BLOCK button.

Yes, Connie Stevens would have been ideal as Fanny Brice. Why did no one think of her when the movie was being cast?

The stupidest DL thread in months, and yet it refuses to die.

R155

01:30 mark: [italic]"Anyone for popcorn?"[/italic]

Forshadowing...

^^ please add 'e'

Hey how about Barbara Cook as Fanny Brice?!!!

It would have been a great role for Marlo Thomas. Marlo and Omar would have made the screen sizzle.

Leslie Uggams would have been perfect, but in 1968 the public wasn't yet ready for a Black Fanny.

Lena Horne could have played it perfectly - and she could sing the hell out of those songs! Lena was nearing 50 but photographed decades younger. Sharif an Arab, she an (part) African American = perfect. The issues around how she could never make a heterosexual love scene believable nixed it.

It's a shame Lucy ruined her voice doing "Wildcat".

Does anyone know if they ever considered Mary Tyler Moore?

As noted, Connie Stevens WAS the obvious choice.

At the same time, almost perbaps a bit TOO predictable.

I think Liza would have been a good choice. She certainly had the vocal chops and her looks were unusual as were Fanny's. She could have passed for Jewish. At least then we would have actually scene a movie about Brice, not Babs.

Connie Stevens was such an obvious choice it would have been banal. It was better that they casted against type.

Dear God, r179 thinks that a movie version of Funny Girl starring Liza Minnelli would not have been about her!

Oh, my sides!

Liza would have given the role some much needed PIZZAZZ.

Yeah, you need to Bob Fosse the shit out of the story of a Ziegfeld girl.

Said no one ever (except on this stupid thread).

[quote]Hey how about Barbara Cook as Fanny Brice?!!!

Barbara Cook did star in a summer stock production of "Funny Girl."

Brice

If they had reedited it and called it Georgia! it would have won Best Picture.

Streisand

^^The spitting image of Connie Stevens!^^

WHAT, NO CHER???

This undeniably stupid thread has actually turned out to be reasonably entertaining.

Maclaine

Cher IS Fanny Brice!

OP has to be the "that's what Marni Nixon was paid for" twat.

Wasn’t Sweet Charity a BIG bomb?

Hands down, it's

MISS JOEY HEATHERTON

"Sweet Charity" was a bomb but is now considered underrated, by some people, anyway.

Did Marni Nixon have a 'belt'? Then Deborah Kerr or Audrey Hepburn could have played Fanny.

Off course Audrey might have been blown right off that tugboat.

As the brassy little upstart shnook from Brooklyn who could belt out showstopper after showstopper, Elizabeth Taylor could have made it work. In hindsight, it's surprising she wasn't used.

Even Elizabeth would have been better as Mame.

Had Marilyn lived, there would have been no other contenders for Fanny Brice.

Babs' interpretation doesn't quite capture that essential quality of tender, childlike driftiness...where a lost soul without direction is so dependent on others.

Mitzi

^^ Not to mention Monroe was Jewish, something Barbra couldn't convey.

Liza would have sung the shit out of People.

Liza can't do ballads, you nitwit R203.

Yes, "singing the shit" out of the song "People" would be exactly the delicacy you'd be looking for such in a plaintive ballad.

r203=clueless.

And there's a whole lotta shit in People!

As show tunes go, r206, it's on a pretty high end, taking into account lyrics and music.

"Don't tell me not live, just sit and putter.... life's candy and sun's a ball of butter" ...c'mon it was perfect for Liza...imagine it sung with a hat and tights.

[quote]r206 And there's a whole lotta shit in People!

[italic]"People...people who need bathrooms..."

"Ooh life is juicy, juicy and you'll see..." Ok maybe she would have had a hard time with that part of the lyric.

And at least with Liza they could have put back "The Music That Makes Me Dance" and made a real showstopper out of it.

Yes, r211, because "Don't Rain On My Parade" wasn't enough of a showstopper.

Very stupid thread

"....makes me DANCE" would have been a cue for the chorus boys to come out.

Notice how this treat devolved (if even possible) from "Shirley MacLaine would have been better than Streisand in FUNNY GIRL" to MacLaine "could have done the part if they changed it from a musical to a straight-up bio pic," which means that MacLaine would not even have been doing FUNNY GIRL the musical Streisand did.

Or maybe Liza or Connie Stevens could have done it.

LMFAO!!!

*Notice how this thread devolved

And if Liza had done it, Joe Eula's movie poster would have been fabulous.

TODAY is Connie Stevens' 80th birthday :)

Do you think, even at age 80, that Connie is still bitter about losing the movie of "Funny Girl"?

I've always felt that Barbra Streisand would have made a much better "Cricket" on "Hawaiian Eye" than Connie Stevens.

The only obvious alternate choice would have been Madeline Kahn!

Madeline Kahn was a virtual unknown in the mid-60s and was also wrong for the part.

All this energy speculating who else could have done it when the best person did it all along.

Stupid, stupid thread.

An amazingly stupid thread, with over 220 responses. So far.

220 responses so far and no one mentions Aliza Kashi?

Where was Bette Midler during all of this?

[quote]220 responses so far and no one mentions Aliza Kashi?

Hello, people!!!

[quote]Where was Bette Midler during all of this?

Working as a replacement for one of the daughters in the original production of "FIddler on the Roof."

I may be wrong, but I think maybe Bette replaced Connie Stevens in the role.

Shirley MacLaine would make a shity Fanny Brice, but she would have been better as Dolly Levi than Miss Streisand.

This musical was a dog.

Both the lead characters were amoral and unappealing.

The plot just ended half way through with NO resolution at all— because an intelligent audience member just knew the marriage was a disaster.

Molly Picon was robbed!

Okay, make fun. But Little Miss Alice Faye was in "Rose of Washington Square," based on Fanny's life. She even sang "My Man " and was sued by Fanny. And Ty Power was "Nicky"!

She's not a mortgagee. She's the mortgagor.

I have only two words for you all: "Debbie" "Reynolds"

Had it not been such an unfairly racially charged time, Miss Ross would have got it.

^ There's no way that con-man Julius Arnstein would touch that skinny black creature

Even though Sinatra was thought too old for the role and I guess they didn't like each other and Stark wouldn't pay for him the mind boggles at how vocally glorious he and Streisand would have been together.

You are Woman, Sadie, I Want to Be Seen With You, and I'm sure Styne would have written another number for him chucking the Schvan schtick.

A great lost opportunity.

They at least should have done a Broadway duet album together in the 60s and not the karaoke shit they were doing late in a life but an in studio with musicians Nelson Riddle production.

This is the most stupid datalounge thread ever. Why isn't this a Broadway chorus boys present hole thread? Or a thread about a flop musical that closed 47 years ago remembered only by few eldergays in nursing homes throughout the NY tristate and Ft Lauderdale areas.

That's a fabulous idea R238 but Sinatra would have wanted the title changed to "Funny Guy & Girl". How about Jack Jones?

I think when Streisand was first coming up she was interviewed by different people, and she didn't tow the usual party line about favorite singers and name Sinatra. She said she preferred Johnny Mathis. I don't think she necessarily dissed Sinatra, but back then, due to Sinatra's reputation (the good and bad parts), a new big singer usually mentioned liking Sinatra to get in good with him or at least avoid getting on his bad side.

it's a shame Andy Williams was busy with his TV show.

Streisand did one of her duets with Sinatra years later. Any time I heard them speak about the other it was always with appreciation for each other as singers. Beyond that, I never heard about any dislike between the two of them.

[quote] Streisand did one of her duets with Sinatra years later.

Then why did they record their parts SEPARATELY

Ive never seen FG on stage. Does the second act drag as horribly on stage as it does on film?

[quote]I think when Streisand was first coming up she was interviewed by different people, and she didn't tow the usual party line

Oh, dear.

r244, she did both her duets albums with a lot of people separately, not just Sinatra.

R247 Barbra duets album she sang FACE TO FACE with her duet partner.

I've never heard that song, r248.....

[quote]Even though Sinatra was thought too old for the role and I guess they didn't like each other and Stark wouldn't pay for him the mind boggles at how vocally glorious he and Streisand would have been together.

Yes, it would have been a thrill to hear their voices blend on that soaring ballad "You Are Woman, I Am Man."

Sinatra would not have done well, to say the least, with "100 take" Wyler.

I think Mr. Johnnie Ray would have been absolutely divine as Nick!

Maybe they could have gotten Sydney Chaplin to repeat his stage performance as Nick in the film if he procured his Dad Charlie to play Ziegfeld? But no auto-tone back then... (but he still starred in 3 Jule Styne shows!)

R252, I would love to hear HIM sing "My Man."

R253 not after Barbra brought Sydney up on charges of harassment at an Actor Equity Trial

I guess not after their affair had ended badly. On what grounds did she bring him up on charges?

Shirley tries too hard. Comes across as desperate in all of her movies.

[quote] I guess not after their affair had ended badly. On what grounds did she bring him up on charges?

Barbra had her own #MeToo episode, and as the star of her own show!

"Shirley...desperate"

R257, it worked in "Some Came Running."

I'm waiting for the next thread: Shirley MacLaine should have played Bess instead of Dorothy Dandridge.

Why of why did we never get Shirley as Peter Pan?

I have no idea, r261. I mean....we had Miss Veronica Lake!

r248, I know some of her duets were not recorded in the same room with the other singer. Maybe not all but some.

I realize she's 80 now, but is it too late for Connie Stevens to play Mama Rose? Connie has daughters who are in show business and would understand that role like few others ever have.

Shirley had one good role - Aurora Greenway in TERMS OF ENDEARMENT. She would have destroyed FUNNY GIRL with her mugging and overtly studied kookiness...no, she should NOT have been cast as Fanny Brice. Barbra was the right actress for the right role.

IMO, portraying Fanny Brice was Streisand's signature role. She'd played her on Broadway for 3,4 yrs before the film. MacLaine was also in her mid-30s by then and IMO, a little too old.

R266, oh no. Streisand did not play Fanny for 3 or 4 years. She only played the role for 9 months.

Mimi Hines played it for a few years though. Maybe she should have done the film?

This rumination has been fun, though we all know that Babs was perfection.

[quote]Shirley had one good role - Aurora Greenway in TERMS OF ENDEARMENT. She would have destroyed FUNNY GIRL with her mugging and overtly studied kookiness...no, she should NOT have been cast as Fanny Brice. Barbra was the right actress for the right role.

We're not still seriously trying to establish this point, are we? After 268 posts? This was an idiot thread to begin with, and the only thing that made it tolerable was the parody posts.

Semi tolerable, at best.

R238, Streisand HATED Sinatra, just like numerous other singers that never went on the record. It wasn't his music, just him - he was a pompous asshole.

I've been thinking about the fabulous guitar playing chanteuse Caterina Valente in the role. Look her up she's awesome. I don't care if she's French-Italian.

The 1960s version of a classic:

Mimi......

Mo' Mimi.....

Marlene tried....

I´m a strudel on a plate full of onion-rolls

r198

Got my note, liebchen?

She doesn't mention Eddie or Larry among the great men. I guess they're under etc.

So did Mimi play it in 3 different Broadway theaters? How long did it run with her?

Maybe if Streisand didn't do the movie the show would have had quite a few revivals. I mean along with Gypsy it's one of Styne's best scores.

R271 I agree, Caterina Valenti would have made a great Fanny Brice, but I think Astrud Gilberto probably would have given us the definitive portrayal.

R277, according to this interview Mimi played Fanny at the Wintergarden, the Broadway and the Majestic.

According to IBDB, Hines was in the show from Dec 27, 1965 to July 1, 1967

Why wasn't Claudine Longet considered for the movie of "Funny Girl"? She was at the peak of her singing career in 1967. True, she would have whispered the entire score, but that's what recording studio amplification is for.

Claudine Longet would have been wonderful...she would have killed in the role.

She was holding out for a re-make of Annie Get Your Gun, r280.

A year and a half on Broadway without Streisand is boffo. The show had legs.

Not after the movie came out, r283.

I guess Claudine Longet was too old to play Squeaky Fromme or Sara Jane Moore by the time "Assassins" was staged.

Thanks, R9. That made my monitor crack.

^^ god DAMMIT!

I meant r90

[quote] I guess those people in the Midwest didn't know how to READ.

Years later they would vote for Trump - that says it all

r265 I disagree. MacLaine was excellent in a number of roles--her Fran Kubelik in The Apartment was touching and could easily have won her the Oscar if Taylor hadn't almost died (though the other nominees were excellent--Kerr's last nomination, for The Sundowners, Garson a creditable Eleanor Roosevelt, and Mercouri doing that Mercouri thing in Never on Sunday). same with Some Came Running--Ginny borders on imbecility, but MacLaine makes you like her (also a tough year--NO ONE was gonna take it away from Susan Hayward, not even Roz Russell as Auntie Mame or Taylor as Maggie the Cat). I'm not a fan of Irma La Douce and The Turning Point now just seems soapy. I didn't like her in Sweet Charity--that was her at her kooky tweets. that film only comes to love fe when Chita and Paula are there. I do think her Aurora was a layered performance and she was able to move from menopausal sex comedy to maternal tragedy convincingly. The sequel was awful and by the time she did Steel Fagnolias, her character had become calcified. I often wondered what TOE would have been like with Jennifer Jones. Putting aside The Towering Inferno, Jones had been away so long--she might have been able to find some inner darkness to play, given how her relationship with her daughter by Selznick went. She might have had a more difficult time with the comedy.

"Steel Fagnolias," R299?

[quote]no one outside of New York knew who Barbra Streisand was. Middle America didn't know who she was.

By the time Funny Girl began filming, Streisand was well known by Middle America.

The Gary Moore Show, Ed Sullivan, Jack Parr, Judy Garland. What's My Line? etc... she had appeared on all of them. And this was when Prime Time TV had tens of millions of viewers.

"People" was a top-ten hit in 1964 and stayed 19 weeks on the charts. An incredible feat during the year of the Beatles.

Her albums sold well. She was a staple on "adult" AM along with Sinatra, Tony Bennett, Peggy Lee etc.

By 1967 she had appeared on her TV specials... the shows starred her and only her. The won every award and the critics raved.

It was a time when every home subscribed to popular magazines: Life, Look etc... and Streisand had appeared on the cover of most of them.

She was very well known.

R291 you just listed an audience that consists of Theater Queens

R292 Do you know anything about American life during the 1960s?

1964

1966

1966

1965

1964

Anna Kashfi would have made a spectacular Fanny. She was baklava on a plate of halvah, perhaps, but her secret Irish ways would have found the universal quality in Fanny.

And Marlon Brando could have played Nick, though they had divorced by then. And he was gay anyway, right? As gay as Jack Pumpkinhead Of Oz, who would have made a splendid Eddie.

Funny Girl should have been filmed by the UN.

Judy Garland and Fanny Brice once appeared in the same movie. Judy should have played Fanny!

Sorry, forgot the link. The movie was "Everybody Sing."

r300 Only if the retitled it "Funny Corpse."

I'm still waiting for Barbra to complete the "Funny Girl" movie trilogy with "Funny Crone."

At Barbra AFI induction she said she would be up for Funny Grandma

After her acquittal, Claudine Longet was offered a lot of money to lead a national tour of Chicago but she turned it down.

This is not a joke. The offer was made and rejected several times.

She's a crazy and untalented bitch.

Miss....Marilyn....Michaels!!!

R278, Caterina was more seasoned. Astrid only knew how to sing English phonetically, she couldn't actually SPEAK the language.

I don't want to be rude but I reckon Maclaine was a skinny broad who hung out with gangsters and unfortunately became a muse for Billy Wilder when he lost his talent in 1960.

We all know Babs' only real competition for the role of Fanny was Florence Henderson.

Ultimately, the producers felt she just had too much "wessonality".

The lp of Song of Norway is pretty bad has anybody seen it?

Yes The Apartment was Billy Wilder's last great film but I like Kiss Me Stupid as well. Irma was a big hit but boy is it lousy.

Everything else was unwatchable. His talent evaporated comparatively young. Same with Cukor.

I wonder how this happens.

[quote]Caterina was more seasoned. Astrid only knew how to sing English phonetically, she couldn't actually SPEAK the language.

So what? Astrud Gilberto could have been dubbed. They do it all the time in foreign films. It's no big deal.

She would have given the score a swanky "he-looks-straight-ahead-not-at-me" Bossa Nova beat and that alone would have made up for any acting deficiencies.

Perfect casting would have been Astrud Gilberto and Sergio Franchi (or perhaps Nino Tempo).

*She would have given the score a swanky "he-looks-straight-ahead-not-at-me" Bossa Nova beat and that alone would have made up for any acting deficiencies.

Caterina Valenti was no Dana Valery.

Dana Valery was no Lana Cantrell

They also felt that Miss Shirley Jones had too much Vaselinity, r310.

Lana Cantrell was no Piccola Pupa.

Piccola would have done Roller Skate Rag on a skateboard, r318........

Speaking of Shirley, how about Shirley Bassey? She was hot stuff in the UK and Goldfinger was a hit all over in '64. She could handle the musical score of Funny Girl easily. New Yorkers love Brits (and Welsh)...I see a missed opportunity.

You're a fool!! Shirley was not vulnerable. She is more Gwen Verdon than Barbra! Barbra was and is immortal in her portrayal of Fanny Brice, one of the greatest performances of any era in any medium. You don't agree? You be a fool!!!

Which Shirley?

If Shirley MacLaine had played Fanny Brice on film there would be no climate change and no need to panic.

Barbra has changed the course of human destiny.

Nonsense. Babs playing Fanny averted WW3

Piccola Pupa was no Alice Playten.

Alice Playten was no Donna Butterworth.

R312, I LOVE Kiss Me Stupid! It's clever, funny, touching, antic, wise about relationships. As I was a mere tyke when it came out, I didn't see it till much later. I remember what a fuss it stirred up for its "naughtiness," though. How times have changed.

As for Wilder losing his touch, maybe he just ran out of things to say. He had a 20-year run of utter brilliance. Also, in about 1950, he no longer had Charles Brackett as co-author of his scripts. He started working with I. A. L. Diamond. Wilder and Hitchcock are two of my favorites.

But, thank God, Miss Cantrell WAS Miss Cantrell!!!

It wouldn't be until Shenendoah that Miss Donna Theodore would gain Broadway Icon status, but it should have been Funny Girl that rocketed her to it.

R328, lesbians need not apply for this job.

R328 That clip is so dykey...I love the way the set evokes a hardware store.

Kelly Garrett got robbed. She should have done Funny Girl so she wouldn't have to get fired from Mack and Mabel. Did you know her manager was also her boyfriend. Roger Ailes!!!

Kelly Garrett was no Donna Loren.

That's because only Donna Loren was Donna Loren, r333.

My mom went to school with Donna Zucker and she had a big schnozz like Marlo Thomas before her three nose jobs.

Donna Loren was no Joanie Sommers.

Joanie Somers was no Helen Schneider.

But Helen Schneider WAS Norma Desmond!

R281

Would skiing be involved in said project ?

R339, Skiing, or at least death on a mountain, would definitely have been involved if Claudine Longet had starred in the movie of "Mame."

Marilyn Hassett from MY SIDE OF THE MOUNTAIN should have had a bigger career.

FUNNY GIRL would have given it to her.

Wow, Mimi was wonderful. I didn't know she could sing like that.

R340, I think it would be spelled "Maim."

Helen Schneider has the non-career she deserves....

Surely this is blasphemy.

R344, Helen Schneider is actually quite big in Germany. She was part of that final cabaret chanteuse group, i.e. Theodore, Garrett, Jane Olivor, etc. She was also a runner-up for Evita on Broadway, which she also played in Germany.

Alice Faye, with her deep, rich, lush voice, is my favorite Fanny. Of course, she was nothing like the original Fanny, But then again, neither was Barbra and I don't even like the original Fanny anyway.

And my favorite versions of My Man are those of Mistinguett , Alice Fay and Piaf. Barbra had a great instrument but can you say "affectations"?

Please! EVERYONE knows that Julie Budd should have been cast in the FUNNY GIRL film.

Julie Budd. The total package.

Eat your heart out, Babs.

Julie Budd's career peaked when she did telethons.

Lainie Kazan was Barbra's understudy or standby during the original run of Funny Girl. She only got to go on once and got a single orchestra rehearsal. At one point, the conductor rapped his stand and said "No No No! Barbra does it like this." and hummed a few of bars.

Long, prolonged, icy silence as Lainie stares the little boy down.

"I'M,,,,, NOT..... BARBRA."

Roslyn Kind is Fanny,

And Lainie wonders why she has been reduced to stealing chickens.

[quote]r351 Long, prolonged, icy silence as Lainie stares the little boy down.

[quote]"I'M,,,,, NOT..... BARBRA."

Fran Jeffries would have been a fabulous choice for Fanny Brice.

Fran Jeffries was no Lisa Kirk

I saw Carol Lawrence do the role in stock. Harve Presnell played Nick Arnstein

They definitely should not have done the movie.

They should not have even done it in stock.

Miss Budd auditioned for Evita wearing a Chanel suit.......

Team Vicki......

Vicki Lewis is no Vikki Carr.

Vikki Carr is no Vicky Frederick.

Vicki Carr is no Sally Durant Plummer.....

^^Well, bless her heart. She certainly tried.^^

Shirley MacLaine has always had a face like the map of Ireland. The only way she could have played Fanny Brice is if she was Irish, which was never the case. However, Barbra Streisand has always had a face like a anti-Jewish nazi propaganda poster.

Vicki Frederick is no Little Vicki Valentine!

Maclaine looks like Siobhan McKenna.

Sally Durant Plummer is no Tammy Grimes Plummer.....

[quote]However, Barbra Streisand has always had a face like a anti-Jewish nazi propaganda poster.

Wow. There are some truly hateful people on this thread.

Miss Maye desperately wanted the role of Fanny....and Daisy Clover....and Sally Bowles....

R351, Lainie went on TWICE, not ONCE. That is, twice in the same day.

R370 and they were auditioning her replacement (Lainie's) in-between the matinee and evening performances as Barbra demanded Lainie be fired after her evening performance

Seriously, this thread has me thinking: Julie Newmar Julie Newmar Julie Newmar

Merman in the play

Julie Newmar in the movie

R371, Lainie gave notice after the performance before insecure Streisand could make her demands. Poor Barbra, so scared someone could be better than her.

Bitch stole some tchotchkes from my dressing room.

R373 then why did the hold auditions that day for Lainie replacement as Barbra understudy BEFORE her evening performance?

and don't say Lainie gave notice after the matinee, they can arrange auditions that fast on a one hours notice

Missy Julie be perfect, r372!

Source/link, R375? Or were you the one who auditioned?

R377 I believe it was Lainie former husband (Peter Daniels) who told James Spada in his Barbra Striesand bio, that Barbra was furious over Lainie stunt and called Ray Stark demanding that Lainie be fired. And he was there that day when they held auditions between Lainie matinee and evening performance

Lainie replacement Linda Gerrard had to agree to a clause in her contract, that forbade her to notify the press if she had to go for Barbra in Funny Girl.

Why not Elke Sommer?

Linda Gerard on her favorite memory understudying Barbra in Funny Girl

“One day she was really late showing up to do “Funny Girl”. I was standing back stage. I was wearing these big black sun glasses. She loved them, so I gave them to her. That night when the show was over, she told me not to leave. She said I have something for you. She gave me this gorgeous black jump suit. We were both in our 20s. We were babies. We didn’t have this animosity or anything that she had toward me or me toward her. She was the biggest star in the world, and that was fine with me.”

Linda Gerard (Lainie replacement) confirms Barbra had Laine fired and the "no notifying the media" in her contract

Well what happened with Funny Girl — I was with William Morris, and the pianist for Funny Girl was a guy named Peter Daniels. Peter Daniels was my accompanist. He was also Barbra Streisand’s accompanist and Lainie Kazan’s. He worked for all three of us and when Funny Girl opened, I went to opening night with my husband at the time, and I remember nudging him and saying, “It’s going to be me up there someday.” I knew that role was written for me.

What happened subsequently is, Barbara got sick one night, and Lainie Kazan was her understudy, which meant that Lainie was in the show playing the part of Vera, but when Barbara got sick she took over the role. When she took over the role she called every publicity hound in New York City and got her name and her face everywhere in New York, and Barbara was pissed. Barbara was so upset that Lainie was fired.

Now, Peter Daniels who worked for Lainie and Barbara and me said, "Linda you’ve got to get in there and audition, because they’re going to love you. You can do the role and they will have you as standby.” The difference between a standby and an understudy is an understudy has a speaking role in the show, and goes on for the star. But a standby only goes on for the star if the star is sick.

We set up an audition and I go to the Winter Garden Theatre and I sing for Ray Stark and Julie Stein and Barbara and all these people and they loved me. They’d have me come back and then come back again. These are call-backs, and then come back and read for the role, and they had me read the railroad scene where she goes to bed with Nicky Arnstein. William Morris calls me and says, "You’ve got it, and they want you to standby and you have rehearsals starting next week,” and blah-blah-blah and I’m like, "Oh my god, this is so exciting." They did a lot of publicity about me in my hometown, which I saved all that stuff like, "Local Girl Begins…” and that kind of stuff.

So I get to know Barbara very well. We were both in our 20s. I mean we were babies. She and I got to be friends and she knew that I was not going to be any kind of threat to her at all, because I’m this kid from Trenton, New Jersey. My background is cabaret and I’m not looking for anything. This was a really good job and I know that I’ll only go on for her if she’s sick. Everybody said, “She’ll never be sick, you’ll never go on.” I went, “Okay, that’s cool.” I was making $400 a week and in those days that was a lot of money to just sit backstage and wait for her to be sick.

Then Labor Day weekend of 1965 I get a call from Barbara. She’s going to Philadelphia to see Elliott Gould, her husband at the time who was opening a show called Drat! The Cat! So I would be going on for the matinee and the evening performance that weekend. I get a call then from the stage manager. I’ve got to come in and rehearse because you have to rehearse with the chorus, because I have a lot of lift. They lift you and I have never rehearsed any of the lifts.

I had rehearsed all the scenes with all the people but never the lifts and never the dances and never with the full orchestra, just with a pianist. So they had me come in right away. “Get in here right away.” I tried on costumes. I’d never tried on any of the costumes. I had to wear Barbara’s costumes. Luckily we were the same size. She was this big in those days, so was I. They had me come in and everybody is going, “Oh my god, Linda is going on. Oh my god, Linda is going on,” and it happened so fast that I had no time to get nervous. I only had time to call my parents and say, “Get your asses into New York because I'm going on tonight for the biggest star on Broadway.”

The first thing that happens is — we rehearsed everything, the costumes are fine, everything is fine — and Tom Stone who was the Stage Manager gets on stage and says, “Ladies and gentlemen, at this performance the role of Fanny Brice will be played by Linda Gerard.” And the entire audience goes, "Ooh!” Because they paid money to see Barbara. I do the show and it was okay. I wasn’t wonderful but I knew I was going to go on that night too. A lot of people left because they wanted their money back. They wanted to see Barbara and that was cool. I understood that and so now that the evening show comes and I go on again, this time I’m full of piss and vinegar. This time I’m ready for this audience. And I got a standing ovation at the end of the show.

In my contract, I was not allowed to alert the media that I was going on. I could not let anybody know I went on until much, much later. That was cool. Barbara took off a couple of other nights but then she left the show December 31st of ‘65. She went on to a London Company and Mimi Hines came in to the show. Now I was promised, I thought, that I would get to do the show.

You would think, right?

You would think. So Ray Star came to me and he said, “Here’s what we can do, you can stay on as standby to Mimi, or we’ll give you the National Company.” The first National Company going out on the road, which was for a year. Well, I have children.

Right.

I don’t want to leave New York. They raised my salary and I stayed on as Mimi's standby, but she was not able to do eight shows a week. So I did all the matinees. Again, nobody knew. It wasn’t until the people got to the theatre that they knew Linda Gerard was going on for the matinee. So I did matinee Wednesday and Saturday for Mimi, but she did all the night shows.

Then I stayed with the show for another two years. By then I was making really good money and I was able to work other jobs. I left and I got offered to do a Road Company of Funny Girl. That was like six months on the road with a pretty good cast. I said, “I’ll take it.”

Cool, R380-382. One lesbian replaced another. Notice Linda Gerard didn't have the appeal or star quality that Lainie had, hence no threat to insecure Babs.

[quote]Linda Gerard didn't have the appeal or star quality that Lainie had, hence no threat to insecure Babs.

How differently their lives turned out

Linda Gerard spent the latter part of her life having fun hosting Sissy Bingo at the Ace Hotel in Palm Springs.

R384 and R385 owe each other Cokes.

IBDB lists understudy for Mimi as a certain Miss Barbara Minkus.....

One of the things I heard about Barbra was to do with her and Elliot Gould when they were still together. Apparently, the marriage had been in trouble for quite a while due to Elliot’s cheating. However, behind the scenes Elliot was a really debauched guy. He liked to force Streisand to pass wind in his face while also giving him Cleveland steamrollers. Eventually Barbra tired of such treatment and decided to end the marriage.

But it just goes to show, you never really know what goes on behind celebrities closed doors.

Ha ha, R388. The reality was that Streisand was cheating on Gould in year one of their marriage on...Elliott was addicted to gambling - with her money.

If Barbara Eden had starred as Fanny Brice, she wouldn't have had to share her Oscar with anyone.

What is about chorus routines of that era that makes them the zenith of queeny?

Eve Plumb IS Funny Girl.

Vikki Carr WAS Vicki Eydie.

Was Vicky Lawrence too young at the time to do it?

R394, no but Carol Burnett wasn't. "Can we turn up the lights?"

[italic] Warning: Person who just got here, hasn't read the thread and is annoyingly responding to R2 in the middle of whatever you're talking about now at r395. [/italic]

R2 is bigoted garbage, obviously, but also really dumb in other ways.

You may certainly prefer Maclaine or anyone you like in the role but to claim Streisand made it on anything but her immense talent is just stupid and deliberately perverse. You don't even have to like her singing to know that she has a great voice. As an actress she is limited but Fanny Brice was made for her and she was great in the role. You may still prefer someone else but your point is not to discuss this performer or that one, you're just bigoted scum.

On a more positive note, I had R2 on ignore already and I had to read his post through R4 or 5.

R396 How can you respond to R2?

R2 doesn't exist.

"Funny Girl" would have been the perfect vehicle for Raquel Welch after "One Million Years B.C."

If you can't imagine her in the role, click to 2:10 in the video.

This clip also makes a persuasive argument for Raquel, r398. Here you can see how the flapper era is perfect for her boyish figure!

I can admit this here and nowhere else. I've seen the DVD of FG more times in my collection than any other after seeing it multiple times in the movie theater since it came to the suburbs when I was a boy.

After fabulous reviews of the blu ray I got that and if you are a fan of this movie you must get it because it's a big improvement, quite beautiful.

My only gripe with it is the scene selection is a mess as if the person who designed it didn't even bother to watch the film to see that they should go before and after musical numbers.

Like the old DVD you can't even start with the film itself. You must listen to the overture which during the roadshow engagement was supposed to settle people into their seats before the lights dimmed and the curtains opened on the Columbia logo. Then the next scene is Fanny preparing to go out to the Keeney audition.

R399 And something like the dance number at R398 would have made an interesting dream sequence.

Shirl can STILL do it!!!

[quote]Shirl can STILL do it!!!

Yep, she can still open the trunk of her Toyota.

Say what you will about Barbra, but this gayling latched on to her and it changed my life so much for the better.

R403 At least store security isn't following me to the parking lot, Lainie.

Hello Mimi!

Clearly Raquel was robbed. There's no two ways about it.

Just imagine Miss Walker doing the Swan number!

What I really like is the idea of Babs sitting on her big, new, burgundy velvet couch, in her big, new, all burgundy velvet music room, while Ray Stark explains that the studio's decided to go with Connie Stevens for the film version.

Would she even be able to form words?

Streisand is the last person who I thought should play Fanny...I really thought that was just a very weird choice.

Time has proven you right.

It had Elsa Martinelli written all over it.

The real choice to play Fanny Brice should have been Fyvush Finkel. He had the talent to make the role his own, and even dressed in drag he would have made a far more attractive Fanny than Barbra.

The man could sing, dance and had superb comedic timing. It really is one of the great might-have-beens in movie making history.

I believe he lost the part because he wouldn't "play ball" with Ray Stark.

[italic]You've got to climb Mt. Everest to reach the Valley of the Dolls...

Colleen Dewhurst had the lanky quality, and innate gaiety, Fanny calls for.

They were fools to not include Mrs. Cohen at the Beach.

R412, wasn't Fyvush Finkel named by simple minded closet case Robert Taylor before HUAC? He was then blacklisted and couldn't work in Mr Taylor's westerns. Funny Girl was out of the question.

R411 ANY excuse for an Elsa pic is fine with me. Stunning, and with a gorgeous bod and voice (unlike some, Miss ET). She didn't have blue eyes as shown in the pic.

R402 I suppose it's rather sad and pathetic seeing geriatrics doing everyday things.

(But I think it extra sad seeing people clutching their coffee-guzzling cups the way the previous generation would clutch on to their cigarettes.)

I assume she's still estranged from Sachi but she has two grandkids from her. Does she ever see them. Liza said her greatest regret was not having children but Shirley's seems to be having one.

[quote] r418 I think it extra sad seeing people clutching their coffee-guzzling cups the way the previous generation would clutch on to their cigarettes

R410 is hilarious. And pathetic.

What's pathetic about it? Obviously the role of Fanny doesn't call for a stereotypical [italic]shiksa[/italic] goddess like Streisand.

But Stark rolled the dice and went for talent....and it payed off.

"Funny Girl" would have been a great comeback role for Betty Hutton and audiences would have been lining up to see her again.

THIS is talent:

And to complement Betty Hutton, I would have cast Dick Shawn in the role of Nicky Arnstein.

R423 THAT is St. Vitus Dance.

Let us never forget.....

Barbara Harris would have been better than Barbra Streisand in the movie version of "On a Clear Day"!

Warren would have been worse than Omar Sharif.

[quote] So what's the deal with her reprising the role in the movie?

Because NO ONE in middle America knew who Barbra was

Nobody knew who Barbra was

Carol Burnett wouldn't have been able to attempt the Jewish-kookie characterization and acting voice, I believe, but IMO I think she would have killed the role with her melancholy and misfit comedic '60s persona had she been offered the role.

Plus in hindsight, although Barbra did translate well to her lead performance in the show's filmed version, ironically I think she was photographed and came across on the screen as attractive from the very first scene -- not goofy and kooky like the real young Fanny Brice character being portrayed.

Maclaine not only had the failure of "Sweet Charity". She'd also had "John Goldfarb, Please Come Home" (a huge financial and critical flop), "What a Way to Go" (profitable but panned by the critics), and Gambit which wasn't a big winner.

The role called for a Heeb not a shiksa.

I’ve never understood and have been eternally pissed off that my superior version, shot WAY before Bab’s was, will never be released.

Billy Porter would have made the best Fanny Brice.

The film role was originally offered to Lucille Ball, who would have absolutely killed in it. (Imagine her doing "the spider" when she saw Nicky Arnstein had arranged for a bed in the restaurant's private dining room.) But she decided she wanted to do the "Lucy in London" TV special instead, so that was that.

Nobody ever bothers to actually portray Fanny Brice.

Hmm. I can’t seem to find my Shirley MacLaine records. Nor anybody else’s.

Yes, Colleen Dewhurst as Fanny Brice in the film version of FUNNY GIRL would’ve been perfect! /s

[quote]Liza said her greatest regret was not having children

Those children are very happy they weren't born to a nutty alcoholic drug addict.

Shirley is great but Funny Girl kinda sucks. You need a world class talent to sing and sell those songs to make it remotely work.

Alice Faye's My Man made me think. Barbra's My My thrills me. Buy only Diana Ross makes me cry. This os SO good.

Ugh sorry for the typos. I swear I must've had a stroke.

Seriously what do you guys think of La Ross' version of My Man there at R443? I think its pretty wonderful. Bold of her to leave in "he beats me."

[quote]Bold of her to leave in "he beats me."

Why?

[quote]Alice Faye's My Man made me think. Barbra's My My thrills me. Buy only Diana Ross makes me cry. This os SO good.

Anyone who says Diana Ross wasn't much of a singer should listen to that.

[quote]Shirley is great but Funny Girl kinda sucks. You need a world class talent to sing and sell those songs to make it remotely work.

Two words:

Debbie

Reynolds

R448: Too perky. Truly too schiksa.

Funny Girl was Barbra's screen debut and everyone was wondering if she could do it on the Big Screen. Stage stars most often do not translate to movies. Most critics thought she more than satisfied that goal, like this one:

From the bitchy Rex Reed:

People are always asking me to define star quality. In Funny Girl, Irene Sharaff has draped her in enough fur and diamonds to put Dior out of business, but the only thing you see is Streisand. Gene Callahan has surrounded her with wall to wall mirrors, ivory staircases, velvet walls, marble statues...but the only thing you watch is Streisand. Never at any time in this film does anything else catch your eye. That's star quality. Through some mysterious biological magic, she has turned into an orchard harvest of ripening womanhood - warm, moving, soft, sensual and mature.

So, NO Shirley MacLaine would not have been better in the role of Fanny Brice in Funny Girl.

(I got the above review from a 1970 books of Rex Reed reviews called Big Screen Little Screen)

Ok R449

Annette

Funicello

Barbra appeared on Judy's show right before she started filming Funny Girl and nobody really knew who she was yet. This was when a jealous as FUCK Ethel Merman crashed the taping. Merman's all "what a lovely young woman, she's The New Belter!" but on the inside Merman was going FUCKYOUFUCKYOUFUCKYOU because she knew Barbra was about to take the world by storm while Merman's star was fading.

Like a BIG stick of buttah!

R452 You don't know what you're talking about.

Merman did not crash the set. The scene was staged

This episode was filmed a few months before Funny Girl the musical debuted on B'way. The film was 1968.

In 1963 Merman's star was hardly fading. She had been offered "Hello Dolly" that year but chose not to do it after her run in Gypsy.

Darling, R452, Babs had two hit albums and a couple of Grammys, LOTS of people knew who she was. Judy treated her lik a STAR on her show.

R454 YOU don't know what you're talking about. Merman was jealous as fuck.

Funny how idiots like R452 don’t know that the FILM of Funny Girl was five years an after Streisand became a mega star on the stage in Funny Girl.

R456 = born in 1999

R452 is so dumb he actually believed Ethel Merman crashed the set of The Judy Garland Show and they all just improvised singing "There's No Business Like Show Business" together.

LOL.

I'm the Greatest Star

R447 Right? Such a unique voice. And, as I suggested, she made me cry. The only other time I recall crying from a song was Judy's The Man That Got Away.

R452 Barbra was very uncomfortable with the Merman segment. She hated There's No Business Like Show Business, and didn't know the words. You can tell she's actually making fun of it there.