Alan Bates

Tractors are gay?

What is gay about a tractor exactly?

I loved him in An Unmarried Woman. He and Jill Clayburgh were perfection together. Wasn't his caregiver Joanna Petit from The Group?

That intensely homoerotic nude wrestling scene with Oliver Reed in "Women In Love" was amazing.

He was definitely a hot actor. And older he became a hot bearded DILF.

How was Nijinsky? I've never seen it.

He is so great in BUTLEY (playing a gay character).

He's incredible in Alan Bennett's AN ENGLISHMAN ABROAD, directed by John Schlesinger. The true story of Coral Browne's meeting with gay spy Guy Burgess in Russia in the 50s. Bates plays Burgess brilliantly.

R6

'Nijinsky' was OK as a film. Alan Bates was fine but the skinny dweeb playing Nijinsky had the personality of a dishrag and there was a woman imposed in the movie was rather annoying.

I still want to know how is a tractor gay?

I wish his one Oscar-nominated performance, "The Fixer," were available--I love the novel and have never been able to find a way to see the film.

I liked this

I liked him in The Rose. Sorry, he doesn’t strike me as gay.

With the right equipment, it can also act as a plow, r10.

R11

That movie seemed to be important 4 decades ago.

But it seems rather boring to me now. And it seems faintly odd that the Jewish Frankenheimer hired all these Anglo actors to appear in what was essentially a Frankenheimer home movie.

IMHO

I agree with R4. Alan Bates was incredibly hot, and got hotter as he grew older.

I liked him in The King of Hearts.!i was so young and naive I had no idea he was gay (or what that even meant) and no idea the film was about mental Illness

Was it? Pardon me for my ignorance but I'm a straight woman who self- identifies here with much trepidation

Alpha male Oliver Reed was so secure in his masculinity not to have problems with doing the homoerotic firelit wrestling scene with the gay Alan Bates. I bet writer/producer Larry Kramer still JOs to it if he's still able to get it up..

In The Shout (1978) Alan Bates plays a mysterious traveler who enters lives of a married couple played by John Hurt and Susanna York. The film is mesmerizing and he is gorgeous and magnetic.

Thanks, R19. I was not familiar with that one.

....

Oh, ok, thank you R14.

Bates was Peter Wyndgare's live in lover at one time. Peter was the original George Michael. PW got caught in a sexual act in a bathroom in The UK.

Peter Wyngarde is perfectly cast as the "ghost" in THE INNOCENTS (61).

Was he English or Welsh?

One of my most cherished theatrical memories is seeing him and Eileen Atkins at the Promenade from the second row center like they were performing for me in a living room.

Stupid me as a boy would pass in front of the Morosco seeing the black and white photos of Butley but having no idea what the hell that was. Did the same thing with Home.

Can you imagine?

He was great in The Go Between.

Donald Spoto's biography of Bates, which goes into all his gay relationships, had the official backing and approval of his family, which is refreshing. Most of the gay Hollywood stars who have passed away almost always leave behind family who vociferously deny their true nature and seem to go to great lengths to conceal it.

There's a bit in the Spoto biography where he writes about Bates meeting Rock Hudson at a "men only" party in the Hollywood Hills. "There was, Alan said later, a strong mutual attraction between them," but as the party went on Bates became more and more inebriated. Rock offered to take him back to his hotel room, but when they got there Alan suddenly became violently sick.

[quote]Rock did the necessary tidying up, set out a bottle of water, ensured that Alan was feeling better, then quietly withdrew without so much as a farewell kiss. Some encounters do not turn out as the principals and the gossips expect.

BUTLEY is fascinating. Simon Gray never actually makes it clear whether or not Butley and Joey are in a physical relationship. The way they act around each other suggests that they're lovers. So much so that it seems absurd to come to any other conclusion. But there are bits in the play which suggest Butley isn't gay or bisexual at all.

There's a fairly recent interview with Bates on youtube where he talks about the play; and he keeps referring to Joey as Butley's "protege" rather than his boyfriend. According to Donald Spoto's biography of Bates, he always refused to discuss the character's sexuality and may have believed he wasn't gay at all.

How many gay characters did he play?

Butley, An Englishman Abroad, We Think the World of You, 102 Blvd Haussmann, that awful one with Sting... any others?

[quote]According to Donald Spoto's biography of Bates, he always refused to discuss the character's sexuality and may have believed he wasn't gay at all

He sure had a lot of intense sexual relationships with men. So that should have been a clue.

I think the Spoto biography goes on about the gay way too much. It's a flat book. Mostly facts. I'm re-reading it now - warms up a little when it talks about how one of his sons died in a public bathroom in Tokyo from a heroine overdose.

Googling 'Alan Bates gay' is what brought me to DL back in 2007 - never to leave.

Was he known as "young Master Bates" as a youth?

His role in An Unmarried Woman made him a heartthrob in America.

[quote]Was he English or Welsh?

Gurl, why?

[quote]I liked him in The Rose. Sorry, he doesn’t strike me as gay.

Who are you apologising to?

Why did OP choose that horrid photo of him in a cloth cap - looking gormless?

I can't find a clip of him in An Unmarried Woman, but here's the music from the last scene, "Erica leaves Saul."

How the fuck is a tractor gay?

Has anyone read DROPPED NAMES, Frank Langella's memoirs? One of the few people he's warm about is Bates, apparently.

I thought Bates was boyfriend of Olympic Champion John Curry?

Take a ride on my tractor, baby.

I don't know about totally gorgeous, the hat kind of helps.

OP, he's one of my favorite actors. I recently saw "Butley" on the big screen at the Quad and he was mesmerizing.

He was bi. I am friends with the last mistress he had in life, the one whom he left money to in his will.

The man was a sexual being through and through, but he wasn't just in our camp.

Because we are rode hard and put away hot.

Yes, I think many of us from the 60s and 70s fell in love with him beginning with The King of Hearts a wonderful anti-war film.

Then Women in Love he was great in that as well...the famous scene in addition to the wrestling scene was "the proper Way to eat a Fig in Society". In an interview soon after WIL, he was asked if he was gay and he denied it. Of course now we know at the very least he was bi sexual....the Canadian Olympic ices skater died in his arms.

He was a great actor and a major loss to the performing arts.

Bates

Reading his biography - he had major relationships with men and lived with several of them.

I think women were his side dish, not the other way round.

R39, OP was confused. The expression is, of course, as gay as a window

I thought Butley was a BIG BORE.

Too theatrical for a film.

All shot I one room.

I liked seeing his butt at the end of King of Hearts

[quote] I recently saw "Butley" on the big screen at the Quad

Another person who seems to think the world wide web consists of people in New York. I'm guessing The Quad is in New York.

King of Hearts was the very first film I saw shown by a film society in college, so it is close to my own heart.

I remember being struck by the beauty of both Alan Bates and Genevieve Bujold.

King Of Hearts is another unwatchable film that seems to being rated here for some bizarro reason.

^ r55, your sentence is barely comprehensible.

TRY, R56. It's not too hard to decipher.

I said "barely."

I love the little arrow, R56.

I wasn't sure if you knew the numerals, so I added a visual aid.

High-waisted look.

From Georgie Girl.

Fleeting full frontal following flop.

The backside.

Nice to see a man with a normal body on DL.

He was with figure skater John Curry at one point. I recently watched his "The Mayor of Casterbridge" on line. I'd seen Ciaran Hinds' rendition, also on line. With Hinds, I thought, there is no hope for you dude, you are just too much of a dimwitted, self-defeating asshole. With Bate, it was an absolutely heartwrenching father / daughter love story where the Mayor finds a connection with the only person who cares about him, his grown daughter whom he deserted when she was a baby. Only to find out - and keep from her - that she's not actually that daughter, but a child his wife had with another man after he'd left. Bates was everything. Pigheaded. Absolutely sure of himself when he shouldn't be. Dumb as a box of rocks. Cunning as a snake. Completely of his time and place. Charming even when he was being ludicrously self-defeating. I have to say Janet Maw, who played the daughter, also did a fantastic job and had a wonderful connection with Bates. He understood that part down to the ground and it's such a weird part - such an unsophisticated man who is his own worst enemy at all times. But damn, I spent every second hoping he'd come out ok in the end.

About his gayness - it was one of his female longtime friends or companions (not too sexual from what I could derive), who described being on a film set with him - someplace fantastic like Greece - and deciding to go off together to Crete for a couple of days. All that had transpired between them at that point was dancing a bit in a cafe with the rest of the crew, etc. So, she's all excited. And basically, they go to Crete, they stay in a little room and share a bed, he never makes a move and he never gives her the idea that she should make a move, but he doesn't say or explain anything, and a couple in an adjacent bedroom are loudly doing it, and Bates says something about the air conditioning and either turns it on or does something else to block the noise, and returns to sleep.

I guess it was the sixties or seventies. Why would he ask her to a weekend when of course she's thinking they're going to hook up? And when they don't, and are lying in the same bed, why didn't she say, "Dude, what is up? You're gay, is that it?" I find it so weird this happened and they never discussed it.

R62

It's Georgy not Georgie.

[quote] And when they don't, and are lying in the same bed, why didn't she say, "Dude, what is up? You're gay, is that it?" I find it so weird this happened and they never discussed it.

It was the 60s. They didn't have the word gay and a British man could be sent to prison for being "queer".

So he was a twat tease?

OK, fair point R69. So any idea what he was about with that whole charade?

[quote]About his gayness - it was one of his female longtime friends or companions (not too sexual from what I could derive), who described being on a film set with him - someplace fantastic like Greece

Zorba the Greek

"Teach me to dance - will you?"

Thank you, r68. Part of the reason I return to DL is to be put in my place when required.

I haven't seen Georgy Girl in decades. I remember going into it thinking it was a freewheeling hippy movie. It was not.

Only Charlotte Rampling is left now.

Fuck.

I never liked Georgy Girl.

or that awful song.

I may be creating a false memory, but I think my third-grade sang Georgy Girl in music class.

There are a lot of Alan Bates movies that I have not seen.

Has anyone watched Whistle Down the Wind? It's ranked #10 on this list and I'm curious after reading the synopsis.

For once, an OP premise that I can totally endorse!

[quote]Has anyone watched Whistle Down the Wind? It's ranked #10 on this list and I'm curious after reading the synopsis.

It's a sentimental children's film.

written by Hayley Mills's mother.

I'll probably pass then.

What about The Running Man? It's directed by Carol Reed and stars Laurence Harvey and Lee Remick.

Strangely, he reminds me of John Gavin in this gif.

But without the woodenness that mires down Gavin's hotness.

And here there's a touch of Javier Bardem.

Presented without comment.

[quote]Peter Wyngarde is perfectly cast as the "ghost" in THE INNOCENTS (61).

He's a prime example of a guy who is not classically beautiful but STILL radiates major sexual heat. Like Quint is described in "The Innocents", handsome and obscene fits Wyngarde perfectly. He looks like he would have a big dick and know how to use it..

He also had a very hot presence in "Burn Witch, Burn!"

I agree about the heat, and think that often does NOT involve "classically beautiful."

For some reason Bates is the kind of guy that when clean shaven doesn't do a thing for me but get some scruff on him and.....

UHNNNNH...fuck!

Princess Margaret was a huge cunt to him.....

Not heard his death was from AIDS which is implied in the link at R23, had heard he was a closet case, but what a tormented one! There seems to have been a duality to much of his existence, a long marriage to Victoria Ward and a keenness to present a masculine image while having significant and secret relationships with various effete men, actors Peter Wyngarde and Nickolas Grace and ice skater John Curry ( who died in his arms according to Wiki ). Also the death of his son is listed officially as from an asthma attack but recorded elsewhere as a heroin overdose in a public toilet in Tokyo. It also says at R23 that he abruptly ended a 10 year affair leaving a heartbroken Grace with a curt "It's been very nice to have known you. I'm sure I'll see you around in London." I saw them on stage together in a Simon Gray play in London, 'Life Support' in '97, so I guess they did.

I can't remember what happened in "Georgy Girl", except that frumpy Lynn Redgrave/Georgy gave him up to marry an old rich fossil played by James Mason. I think she did it partially to be able to keep the custody of the baby girl her gorgeous, heartless girlfriend (Charlotte Rampling) gave up, but being the wife of a rich man seemed like a good thing, too. She gave up the hot guy for the old geezer with money; I thought that was pretty stupid, really.

She married James Mason strictly so she could keep the baby Rampling threw away. It was clear throughout the film that she had no interest in Mason but lusted after Bates. In the end, motherhood won.

I am just realizing I have always thought Alan Bates and Oliver Reed were the same person : o

Motherhood over Alan Bate's dick? I still think that's pretty stupid.

So glad that Butley and An Englishman Abroad were mentioned within the first 10 replies. A while back I watched several of the American Film Theatre adaptations - for filmed theater, several of them were surprisingly good (also enjoyed Losey's Galileo and Frankenheimer's Iceman Cometh), but Butley was one of the best. Bates could be a great actor.

Princess Margaret Rose was a cunt to everyone she wasn't related to.

And to some that she was.

I love 'An Englishman Abroad' without reservation. Schlesinger, Bennett and Bates at their best.

So many scenes and lines stay with me. Bates as Guy Burgess speaks his great lines flawlessly, letting them out naturally in that beautiful lilt, with its easy hint of educated camp.

To a stolid female Russian clerk: "I can't be the first person to remark upon your pronounced resemblance to the late Ernest Bevin. It's extraordinary, you might have been sisters."

To Coral Browne, about 'Hamlet': "I like the look of Laertes. He goes well into tights. Looks like he's got a couple of King Edwards stuffed down there."

To Coral Browne, in and about his borderline squalid Russian flat: "I used to live in Jermyn Street. Tragic, you might think. Well, not really - Jermyn Street was a pig-sty too."

Hot in specs...

Look Back In Anger...

Gary Oldman and Bates in WE THINK THE WORLD OF YOU. Bates plays an upper class gay man and Oldman his bisexual lover. The cast also includes Liz Smith and Frances Barber.

[quote]Peter Wyngarde is perfectly cast as the "ghost" in THE INNOCENTS (61).

[quote]He's a prime example of a guy who is not classically beautiful but STILL radiates major sexual heat

My dear, so true - a man of his times.

and always a pocket square.

[quote]Gary Oldman and Bates in WE THINK THE WORLD OF YOU. Bates plays an upper class gay man and Oldman his bisexual lover. The cast also includes Liz Smith and Frances Barber.

another bore of a film.

He made so many bad ones.

He was better as a supporting actor. He couldn't carry a film. He wasn't a STAR.

This seems to be the only online interview.

He didn't do chat shows.

R103 He wasn't a star because he was a sensitive, accomplished actor who'd the ability to inhabit other peoples lives.

I agree he wasn't classically good looking (with that thick neck) but he radiated a sex appeal at a time when the British were much, much better at sex on film than us.

He arrived at a good time in the pioneering sixties and he appeared in more gay roles than Peter Finch.

I believe that An Englishman Abroad was filmed in Edinburgh, "standing in" for St. Petersburg.

Thanks, R99. He must have been absolutely irresistible.

r104 You can see how much love and respect Frank Langella had for him.

[quote]Alpha male Oliver Reed was so secure in his masculinity not to have problems with doing the homoerotic firelit wrestling scene with the gay Alan Bates. I bet writer/producer Larry Kramer still JOs to it if he's still able to get it up..

Not true, Reed was scared Bates would "overshadow" him. I read two different interviews and he said he was relived to see they were both average . Before hand, they both got drunk before filming.

I saw him doing BUTLEY on stage and also HAMLET. He seemed to age very quickly. He and Lee Remick are a great couple in THE RUNNING MAN., and he is marvellous in A KIND OF LOVING in 1962, his first major success.

Wow, 109 posts and not a word about the movie where I fell in love with him..."Far From the Madding Crowd!"

Glasgow stood in for Moscow for AN ENGLISHMAN ABROAD.

Gurl, no.

Dundee.

R108 I read that Reed did a "quick Jodrell" before doing the nude scenes.

Later on I realised that a Jodrell was an English example of rhyming slang.

r92 Then you must've been REALLY confused during "Women in Love."

Great actor. Totally gorgeous. And, since we are into agrarian metaphors, bi as a silo.

R114 I used to get confused by Farley Granger and Stewart Granger.

And as for actresses ... well all women look alike, don't they?

The scruff does indeed suit him.

I always enjoy seeing Alan Bates and Robert Altman is one of my favorite directors, so Gosford Park should have been sweet heaven for me.

But it's one of my least favorite Altman films - and he did make some stinkers - which has always bothered me. I found it flat and detached from beginning to end.

Can anyone make a case for me giving Gosford Park a second chance? I'm totally game, but in need of inspiration.

I've only seen Gosford Park once (when it came out) and liked it quite a bit, but I don't know if I could say why now. Sometimes Altman's big ensemble pictures work and sometimes they don't. Others liked A Wedding and I found it completely grating - just way too many characters and actors and not enough compelling stuff for them to do. It starts to seem like Altman by numbers.

[quote]bi as a silo.

The young woman he slept with in Greece who said, despite her eagerness to sample Bates's dong, he showed absolutely no interest in having sex with her, may beg to differ

R118 Robert Altman is someone of no interest at all, IMHO. But 'Gosford Park' was a wonderful showcase for English actors written by Julian Fellowes.

What I find interesting is that Fellowes replicated Alan Bates' butler role in 'Gosford' with a replica actor playing replica valet named 'John BATES' in 'Downton. Abbey'.

This HAS to be an in-joke!

I tried watching Gosford Park but watching it was like trying to stay awake during a Downton Abbey episode.

R122 Gosford was a cool, fragmented version of Downton. Downton was a melodramatic, woman's version of Gosford.

GOSFORD PARK was filled with the gays: Bates, Derek Jacobi, Tom Hollander, Jeremy Northam - then Stephen Fry turns up and ruins the mood - but it is the bliueprint for DOWNTON ABBEY, complete wirh another withering countess role for Dame Maggie.

I saw Gosford Park in the theater and very much enjoyed it. Seemed quite rich and textured to me. And Northam!

Does anyone know why some people with full lips keep them that way, and others have their lips get thin? Bates had a luscious mouth and it became kind of severe looking. Genetics? Smoking?

r112 Englishman Abroad was shot in Glasgow substituting for Moscow. The scene with Coral Browne on the bridge is over the River Clyde and the flats where Burgess lived are known as Mossheights.

I'm sick of this thread now and of him.

He was pretty much the same in every thing he did and having read his biography - he was a rather depressing man who had depressing people around him or made them depressed.

The story of his very sick wife is horrible and what he allowed her to do to his sons.

All of his disappointed male and female lovers.

He was a mess.

I imagine you must be sick of it, especially after replying multiple times with negative comments.

Don t knock Downton Abbey. You Bravo watching uneducated kuh ween.

Love him

For Alan Bates fans in NYC, the Metrograph is showing "Women in Love" for the next several days.

He played more gay characters than any other mainstream actor. He did the five you mention R31 as well as 'Nijinski' and the two nude roles.

I ignore any gossip from that hideous, superstitions Catholic muck-raker named Donald Spoto R28 R32 who specialised in ludicrous lies. He is as repellent as that ghastly buck-toothed octogenarian poseur named Cyril Louis Goldbert who took the fanciful name of "Wyngarde" so I'm sorry that Alan Bates may have had a misalliance with them.

PS Dear OP you must be an Englishman to use such a colorful metaphor and R108 my English friend tells me that a "Jodrell" is rhyming slang for masturbation.

PPS By the way I believe that the very interesting, rapidly-ageing pygmy-actor Tom Hollander [R124] identifies as a heterosexual Thatcher-lover conservative.

[quote]Can anyone make a case for me giving Gosford Park a second chance?

Watch it on DVD with the commentary!

Who was the actor dumped from Gosford Park?

Was it Jude Law?

He had the main role and they had to bring in dumb-faced, mega-lips Ryan Philippe dribbling when he should have been learning his lines and emoting.

I loved Gosford Park in the main.

The focus on the Scottish maid, Mary, bugged me a little. I don't like that actress.

& Emily Watson was awful - doing her clitoris voice.

In fact, I hated the way the servant class were made out to be so superior and the artistos all buffoons and idiots.

All these years and I had no idea he was mostly gay.

I'm going to check out some of his movies now, with a fresh eye and new perspective, particularly his gay roles.

Well R135 if you hated the way the servant class were made out to be so superior and the artistos buffoons how did you feel about 'Downton'?

The script supervisor had a graph, time chart and stop watch to ensure each character had equal screen time and equal drama regardless of whether they were lovely or stupid.

[quote]Well [R135] if you hated the way the servant class were made out to be so superior and the artistos buffoons how did you feel about 'Downton'?

I turned it off after 5 minutes.

Alan Bates was a mess because he could be.

As someone already said he could use people and then toss them aside and then find others with their tongues hanging out waiting to be used as well.

Incredibly charismatic people are narcissists with no morals because they are not a requirement when dealing with others.

Oh was he like that, R139? Don't like that kind of person.

Well you might claim that he's a mess in his private life R139 but he was a gay(-ish) pioneer and he racked up 85 movies and never descended into B-grade U.S. junk.

I tried to watch Georgy Girl last night but gave up at the 30 minute mark, when James Mason said he used to think of Lynn Redgrave as a daughter but doesn't any more because he wants to fuck her. Ewww.

The whole film should have been centered on bitchy Meredith!

He makes me crazy!

R141 I agree with you. But he seems to personally have been someone to be avoided at all costs.

Unfortunately his children didn't have a say in the matter.

Some quotes from people who actually knew him:

"He was an incorrigible romantic, always in love or on the edge of love." - Alan Bennett

"I just thought that, apart from being a really first-rate actor, he was the most delightful person." - Glenda Jackson

"He was the very best of best friends." - Simon Gray

"He had an extraordinary need to love people." - Felicity Kendal

"He had an instinct for truth and honesty." - Bryan Forbes

"He was a living lesson in acting, always remarkably restrained and subtle." - Hayley Mills

"He had the flame of life in him. He inspired love and admiration in so many people ... He had a sense of humour that was mischievous and wicked in a droll way. As an actor, he was a man of quite extraordinary range." - Harold Pinter

All very nice R145 but while he was delightfully pursuing his next love affair ( and keeping it iron clad closeted ) his children were living like street urchins and almost starved to death. He may have been a great actor and given Harold Pinter a few chuckles but he left a great deal to be desired as a human being.

r146 Really? Where did you read that? From what I've read it was Alan who looked after his children, before and after he took custody of them.

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

As a teen I adored him in Georgy Girl.

That film was what we'd all heard swinging London was like at the time and Bates was the epitome of the young Carrnaby Street lad.

[quote]That film was what we'd all heard swinging London was like at the time

Not really.

Two girls living in a dreary flat in Maida Vale. They never went near anywhere trendy and that awful song was popular with old ladies.

[quote]and Bates was the epitome of the young Carrnaby Street lad.

No, he was way too old. He wore a few silly hats, that's all.

Sensible people ignore any silly gossip from that hideous, superstitions Catholic muck-raker named Donald Spoto who specialised in second-hand ludicrous lies.

However low your opinion of him R151, Spoto's interviews with Bates's son were reprinted in the Daily Mail and whatever one may think of that dubious publication it has assiduous lawyers who scan everything it prints for fear of legal ramifications. The story of his life is well known to those who knew him and I can vouch for the Nickolas Grace appearances in the Spoto book as I know him personally and his relationship with Bates was as described.

You say you knew Nickolas Grace but did you know Cyril Louis Goldbert (who took the fanciful name of "Wyngarde") before he lapsed into dementia?

I would not trust that deceptive creature and the grotesque Spoto for a second.

No R153 but surprised Wyngarde is still alive, what has he been living on all these years since he was caught cottaging in unenlightened times and his 'Jason King' fame was rescinded?

We've seen Joan Collins' spawn clutching at fame this week.

I maintain that the late Alan Bates' spawn were clutching at American money when they allowed that American fool (Spoto) to use their name in publicising another of his well-funded, childish, muck-raking examples of second-hand scuttlebutt.

R152, did you know Bates?

I think that he must have been irresistible in the way that young Marlon Brando probably was.

I never really thought about it before, but this thread convinced me that Bates was definitely more attractive with a little facial scruff.

I didn't R152 but I think the appeal you describe is why he was able to get away with treating the people he was intimate with pretty shabbily , looks and charm afford privilege. As to his closeted nature, he was only a few years older than Ian McKellen and Derek Jacobi who have both had successful careers and been somewhat candid about their sexuality , especially after middle age, but then they were never film stars and certainly not matinee idols.

R158 meant as a response to R156

r148 It's a little bizarre to read that extract and come away with the notion that Alan was an awful human being in how he treated his children. He was a very successful actor who worked away and travelled a great deal, so he quite reasonably left the children's mother to look after them. The odd lifestyle they endured was obviously due to her and once Alan discovered how they'd been living he took sole custody of them both and raised them himself. At no point in the book are we ever told that their life with Alan was lacking in any way. And it's quite clear that they both loved and adored him.

[quote]I loved him in An Unmarried Woman. He and Jill Clayburgh were perfection together.

I didn't get that movie. I mean I would have been Mrs. Alan Bates so fast it would have made that guy's head spin.

As Proust in Alan Bennett's 102 BLVD HAUSSMANN...

With Lorna Luft in 1972...

I always thought he was hot.

R162, seeing that,image, I'm wondering how he might have been in the Bogarde role in Death in Venice.

Wasn't he short? They had to make sure he stood on higher ground for the camera with his ladies.

^ He was 1.8 metres or 5 foot 9 inches.

He probably got shorter in his latter years (he did get thicker)

R160 It's vague in the extreme to not know your own children are living in squalid and deprived circumstances until they are 12 and turn up at your door, however busy your diary is. Once he 'found out' his own sons' circumstances he did at least move them into a house next door with staff...the paternal warmth is overwhelming! I'm sure his sons were fond of him but his personal relationships sound awkward and arms' length at best, i.e ending a 10 year gay relationship with someone he made hide in the back of his car when driving together with a curt "I expect I'll see you around". He was sexy and managed a very successful career, he sounds fine if you weren't too close and didn't rely on him.

Great actor and he was really hot when he was young

[quote]I'm sure his sons were fond of him

They were quite clearly more than just "fond" of him. The vast majority of those who knew him well seem to have nothing but great love and affection for him. And his colleagues seemed to have the greatest respect for his talent as an actor. No one's saying he was perfect, but I think you're overstating his flaws.

He had a whole series of almost obligatory nude scenes at one point, much like later DL fave Richard Gere did. Bates showed at least backal nudity in "Georgy Girl", 'King of Hearts", "The Fixer", "Women in Love" (where he showed everything there), and probably in some other films as well.

I'm not really that invested R170 He was a good actor and a flawed person that's about it, I guess my interest was piqued by finding out he was such a closet case.

[quote]I guess my interest was piqued by finding out he was such a closet case.

Yes, it is interesting.

Sexy masculinecman. Short does not bother me, even tho I am 6 feet 3 inches. There is a very hot short guy in my building living with a girl. Worked out with him a few times in our gym. No pinning. But he is SO hot, great ass.

He did just about the greatest drunk scene on Broadway in his Tony-winning role in "Fortune's Fool" I've ever seen. The only thing close was Lucille Ball's drunk laughing/crying scene in "Yours, Mine and Ours". Bates did his live on stage 8x a week. He was brilliant.

His double performance in John Schlesinger's 1983 adaptation of SEPARATE TABLES is supposed to be superb. Alongside a gorgeous Julie Christie. I don't think it's ever been released on DVD. Another one I want to see is Lindsay Anderson's IN CELEBRATION.

Also Pinter's THE COLLECTION from 1976, in which Laurence Olivier and Malcolm McDowell play lovers. Bates also appeared with Olivier in THREE SISTERS and THE ENTERTAINER.

[quote]Also Pinter's THE COLLECTION from 1976, in which Laurence Olivier and Malcolm McDowell play lovers

That's on YouTube.

No comment.

'Separate Tables' is also on Youtube. It s presented as I wrote it and NOT as in that schlocky 1958 movie version.

I was Britain's favourite playwright for 20 years while Pinter R176 was favourite for three.

It was on Youtube R178 , but only briefly, you have to be quick off the mark to catch some of these old videos there. Seems churlish for copyright hounds to deprive us when the product is unavailable for purchase in any case. Bates almost plays another closet case in Separate Tables, the bogus major shamed when a local paper reports his conviction for importuning women in a cinema. Rattigan's original character had to be changed from a man cruising men in similar circumstances. I think there have been productions that reverted to the original since then. It's pretty obvious to those in the know but Aunt Edna had to be protected in the '50s.

^ Yes, Youtube is so annoying as it doesn't have a general search engine to find rare items. You have to search within the particular uploader's index to find them.

'The Deep Blue Sea' was another of Terence's covertly-gay plays from which Aunt Edna had to be protected.

Well, I wish someone would have protected me from "reality TV."

There's a version of the 1983 SEPARATE TABLES on dailymotion but oddly it's only an hour long. The film is 110 minutes long.

^ that TV version has a pretty young man named Brian Deacon in it.

[quote]I was Britain's favourite playwright for 20 years while Pinter [R176] was favourite for three.

Arguable, Sir Terence, but in any event I ended up with The Nobel. In addition, I had the pleasure of directing the subject of this thread in the film of 'Butley.'

There's a torrent of SEPARATE TABLES online but frustratingly it looks like only 98.2% of it is being seeded. I assume it's still watchable, but there'll be about 2-3 minutes missing.

But Harold R184, you created a sensation which lasted 3 years but then you retired to do movie scripts (which are much less demanding) and then you retired even future into a strange two-faced existence being a champion for the underprivileged whilst married to a posh aristocrat who wrote bodice-rippers.

R184, but dear Hal (if I may), we know that you were awarded That Prize because of your politics. And have you ever bothered to look up the names of the jury for that? A slew of Swedish nonentities. (After that Dylan person won for his mumblings, I simply had to ascertain the identities of the deluded fools.)

And I had Ivor Novello!

And Harold R184, your friend Howard Jacobsen tells me that the key to understanding your sensational (but short-lived) plays is to mentally insert one quiet word into your famous ‘Pinteresque pregnant pauses’. That quiet word is ‘jew’.

And your first wife, the lovely Vivien, told me that her replacement, the minor aristocrat has particularly UN-lovely ankles which resembles milk bottles!

[quote] that TV version has a pretty young man named Brian Deacon in it.

He was married to DL fave, Rula Lenska

Terence, Terry, Tel. A conservative view of my output will show a career of substantial work from about 1958 to 1978, with much more in addition either side of those years. Then there was also poetry and directing.

I was pleased with the major revival of No Man's Land last year on both tides of the pond, and on screen. It's not impossible you might be noticed again one day. Incidentally, I wonder if you might identify with the character of Hirst, so wonderfully played by Sir Patrick Stewart. He is, you recall, a rich alcoholic upper-class litterateur, looked after by two tough younger men. It's the sort of play you might have tried, had you dared.

Anyway, let's not quarrel. To quote DL: "Girls, girls! You're both significant UK playwrights!" It's true though that I have a theatre named after me.

I seem to recall watching The Collector and Malcolm McDowell and Alan Bates are so gay-acting that you can't believe the plot that either ever had sex with a woman.

The director of IN CELEBRATION, Lindsay Anderson, is interesting. He was gay and I don't think he ever hid it, but I'm sure I read that he was conflicted about it (maybe a Catholic) and was basically celibate, only ever falling in love with straight men who couldn't love him back. I think Malcolm McDowell (who he made several films with) said that he was in love with him and he was fine with that as he respected Lindsay so much, but he got the sense that falling in love with straight men was a pattern of his or something.

Why such long faces r189?

R113 "quick Jodrell" = rhyming slang for "wank"

R24, R85, R89, R101, R132, R153, R154; Well it seems the ghastly and 'obscene' Cyril Goldbert creature is still alive.

Glimpsed at 7.54 in this advertising clip from last year.

Back in circa 1970 - there was a commercial on TV in England.

Showed a guy getting out of his Bentley convertible and the voiceover said - 'PETER WYNGARDE SMELLS... GREAT!"

A MAN of his TIMES

^ that creature is one of the more pathetic of thousand James Bond copycats which infested the 1960s and inspired me.

R192, I think Gavin Lambert was a friend and wrote a bio of him. Or mentioned him a lot in a memoir.

R198 No dreary get your facts right. Jason King was originally on Department S which was an interesting take on The Avengers(The British series not the dopey Marvel comic) not Bond. Jason King was ten thousand times more flamboyant than Paul Lynde was ! Yes Peter Wyngarde was married and fucked women (he fucked more guys for sure)BUT Alan Bates was arguably the love of his life.

^ Cyril Goldbert was arguably NOT the love of Alan Bates' life.

'The Avengers' was a blatant knock-off of the Bond films: Emma Peel was a blatant, vinyl-clad reproduction of Pussy Galore.

R201 Dreary, The Avengers started in 1961 BEFORE Bond's first film. Bond was a ripoff of The French novel series OSS 117 . Fleming took the initials of the French writer(Jean Bruce) and concocted James Bond from that. .You really need to do your homework.

Don't tell me Joanna Pettet was the love of his life. I love that woman(Bates stayed with her until she died) but Wyngarde's top to Bates' bottom was like a gay Olivier and Leigh.

^ Bates was a Bottom ? !

I was in love with Alan Bates from the moment I first set eyes in him. I found him perfect in every way.

There is a biography of his life called "Otherwise Engaged: The Life of Alan Bates". Quite well-done and interesting. Available on Amazon.

Wyngarde was nasty and Alan really didn't love him. Jo Pettet was a rescue case. Alan saved her from her "dealer down the trailer park" situation and she tried to trick him into marriage "who wouldn't be lady Bates" mode. He was wonderful

"Bates stayed with her [Pettet] until she died."

She's alive.

Joanna Pettet has quite a life story.

Terence Stamp AND Alan Bates?

I loved her in The Group! But not as much as Candice Bergen's character.

Of course she is alive, I bet she still lives in his house, supported by the family. She demanded also a 50 000 £ pay off for her silence

R208 Peter, is that you?

Haha no I am not Peter. Dreadful man. They were never as close as in his mind. Delusional

Looks like John Krasinski in OP’s pic.

R206 Pettet the woman may be alive but Pettet the star died in 1969.

Exactly [R212]

I trust everyone on DL!

I trust everyone on DL (except for those paranoiacs who insist DL is being infiltrated by the KGB)

[quote]Of course she is alive, I bet she still lives in his house, supported by the family. She demanded also a 50 000 £ pay off for her silence

Her silence about what?

R216 I'm guessing her silence about the fact that former stars often live haunted, sordid lives. Bates was able to get high-quality supporting roles until his death but I'm guessing Pettet looks like a shrivelled-up rag.

And I'm guessing that ludicrous drama queen (PW) was being an utter nuisance feeding lies and gossip to American muck-rakers.

Jo sad story...came from broken family, beautiful girl, started acting on broadway, in a play with Alan and Gene Hackman, fell for Alan, had her big break in The group, became white hot in hollywood for a while. Best friends with Sharon Tate. Narrowly escaped the killing only to be held hostage in south america. Married major abuser and serial cheater Alex Cord. Robbed her of every penny she had. Their son ODedd. She went from being presented to the Queen to supporting gig in Knots Landing, then worse, and finally retired, to the trailer park where old platonic flame Alan Bates ( he of the disastrous entourage) found her before the fbi did ( drug deal) and brought her back to London... Where he lived to regret it-with her

She quit working after going to act in a Roger Corman-cheap action film and ended up being held a political hostage in the Philippines!

She really was lovely.

Joanna Pettet gets a glowing write-up here.

I'd rather be in Knots Landing than meet the fucking Queen.

I'd rather watch Knots Landing than meet her.

^ I can't agree. I thought she was an ordinary skinny woman trying to be another Sixties Sexpot.

And she must have been frankly stupid to chase Bates who was an obvious man-lover.

[R216] Her silence about Alan's incredibly young and gorgeous love interest. Alan was very private and hated the press. By the way wyngarde last saw Alan circa 1966 ( and once on his death bed- to apologize). Everything else he says is BS

I disagree, r221. I think she was strikingly lovely and appeared very sharp on the screen.

She'd had a hard road to hoe. Maybe she was drawn to Bates for something beyond sex. It happens.

Is HB a lesbian, Trust Me?

Who is HB?

Who is HB [R224] ? [R223] you are right, there was love between them, they had both lost a child also, and Alan Bates was completely and absolutely devastating. Irresistible really. But it was not LOVE. And at that point she was very, very scary. Like Batshit scary

HB has been mentioned on this thread, but I guess you're not who I thought you might be.

There's a pic of Pettet at a premiere with Bates in 2003. She looked fine, apart from what looked like a shiny synthetic wig atop her head.

[R228] yes I know the photo, that was her best look for a night out. Crazy wig and fab hollywood makeup et voila...she had been a STAR! and she could still turn it on. Quite beautiful too, but the next day... Poor Jo, I loved her despite

You rang, r228?

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

Is that her in r231? It doesn't look like her to me.

[quote]Where he lived to regret it-with her

Why?

yeah, that's her - look at her face and her nose.

[R223] She understood that he would marry her.!!! She was very high strung, she hated London and when Alan met his well...that young person, she went beserk. In a Fatal Attraction sort of way. The woman in the other pic is Hangarad Rees, british actresss who dated Alan in the 90's

No, that is actress Angharad Rees in r231. She died not so long ago.

The photo is from the Daily Fail and does not even include a caption.

Rees was wonderful in the first Poldark. She died not too long ago.

Can someone post a picture of Alan Bates' male lover? Thanks

Considering how paranoid Bates was about being found out as gay his hiding in plain site performance in Women in Love is all the more remarkable.

I can't imagine an actor today gay or straight doing such a role in a mainstream film.

But it was the 70s.

[238] no you won't find that. X was from a well-to-do continental family italian or french or both, just starting a modelling/acting career, very naive,absolutely stunning and wildly in love. Jo tried to banX from the london clinic when Alan was dying. She threatened to call the press. X was so hurt, disappeared from the scene after the funeral

R39 The late Peter Finch did two very big gay roles (Wilde and Bloody Sunday).

I think Bates did 4 or 5.

No one like Finch or Bates now.

R238 I think it's safe to assume that an attractive, successful star like Bates would have had a succession of lovers and partners.

Hiding in plain 'sight.' I hate when I do stuff like that.

But to do a couple of frontal scenes as well and one is nude wrestling with another man?

I can't even imagine anyone doing that today.

And being that it is done by the light of a fireplace things could be very artfully concealed in shadow but Russell and his actors unlike today were fuck that bullshit.

"I ignore any gossip from that hideous, superstitions Catholic muck-raker named Donald Spoto."

So do I. He's a hack who grinds out celebrity biographies like nobody's business. And they're frequently full of shit. He also plays favorites with his subjects; some of them he hates and some of them he worships. He's written not one, but THREE books about Alfred Hitchcock, who he positively loathes for some reason. His opinion of Hitchcock is that his movies weren't that great and he was a sexual deviate. On the other hand his biography of Marilyn Monroe slops over with admiration for her and despite all the evidence to the contrary he insists she was NOT a drug addict (she was addicted to sleeping pills) , NOT promiscuous (she would fuck practically anybody) and NOT terribly unprofessional (she would show up hours late and couldn't remember her lines). Spoto sucks, both literally and figuratively.

Are you American? It's not rare for actors across the pond to disrobe and/or play gay roles. Full frontal nudity is not uncommon. Tom Hardy got his little dick out a few years ago.

Has Eleanor Bron ever written an autobiography?

She lived during an amazing period of British cultural life and knew so many fascinating people.

R218, she didn't come from a broken family. Her father died in the war. And she wasn't held hostage in South America, it was the Phillipines where she was doiing her last film.

I read the spoto book about Alan.Half of it is plain made up. Horse shit [R245]

She looks like Patricia Hodge. Hardly a great beauty.

.......

sorry, stinky linky

.........

I read that Bates biography. I don't remember it as being particularly juicy or eventful. The tidbit that stuck in my mind was that Bates apparently referred to hot young men as "venison".

[R248] Could have been the Philippines, my bad. But I am pretty sure she had a stepfather she was not happy about. Met her much later in life anyway

So Joanna Pettet is the Susan Richardson of England?

Pettets's one child died of a heroin overdose at 26 in 1995. His father was officially Alex Cord but may have been Terence Stamp. In photos, he has a very delicate face and is very blond.

Joanna Pettet was TV's Sweetheart in England?

I don't think I have ever heard Joanna Pettet speaking in her own accent.

I seem to remember her playing villains. Here she is opposite Tab Hunter, dubbed in French, on Charlie's Angels.

Oh, the places that Alan Bates leads...

I think she is canadian in fact but she held a British passport also, either by birth or lineage. Alan only married once but had tons of lovers. He was achingly handsome and fabulously charming and generous. Every body wanted him

I thought Susan was crazy talking about when she did a film and was kidnapped in some foreign country so if the same thing happened to Joanna P maybe it was true.

Joanna Pettet's kidnapping is at least listed in her Wikipedia page.

No such detail for Susan Richardson's legendary (on DL) ordeal in North Korea.

Well, we all know now that Hollywood is a sick place so who knows what Susan Richardson went through.

Alan was extremely talented, devoted to his work, amazingly versatile and fearless. He didn't care for the hollywood thing and didn't feel he owed the press anything. Stardom is publicity. He never played that game. Plus he was very shy and secretive. Sometimes he just wouldn't say how many sugar he had with his coffee. Much less who he was sleeping with. But his choices of roles speak volumes. Integrity and honesty. He truly was marvelous and adored- to the extent of harassment.He collected weirdos like Mia collects children.wanted to save them. Dangerous game

I am totally with Pauline Kael that An Unmarried Woman fell apart at the end when Jill didn't go off with Alan.

[quote]Can someone post a picture of Alan Bates' male lover? Thanks

which one? there were so many!

when I read his biography, I was googling away.

[quote]Has Eleanor Bron ever written an autobiography? She lived during an amazing period of British cultural life and knew so many fascinating people.

she's written silly books about journeys on her bicycle, stuff like that.

I, as a biography addict, have read them all.

In fact I used to live near her in London and see her on her bicycle a lot.

[quote]He collected weirdos like Mia collects children.wanted to save them. Dangerous game

Boy - the woman he married sure was one - if you believe what's in the Spoto book.

I hope this link works, it's one of my favorite pics of Joanna Pettet, who I adore:

has this been mentioned?

[quote]In 1968, Pettet married the American actor Alex Cord and gave birth to a son 3 and 1/2 months later. The boy, Damien Zach was given the last name "Cord", however,[bold] his biological father was British actor Terence Stamp.[/bold]She and Cord were divorced in 1989 after 21 years of marriage. She has not remarried.

Alan's wife was not a weirdo. She was mentally ill. They adored each other in the beginning and wanted to have children more than anything. But untreated mental led to domestic hell. He never wanted to divorce her.Loved her till the end. She had another man a french aristocrat. He was straying. But he was mostly trying to save the children.Ultimately couldn't. Tragedy of his life

[quote]Alan's wife was not a weirdo. She was mentally ill.

Aren't they the same thing?

No no. Major mental illness is different from just being a selfish annoying little cunt who try hysterically to upgrade a near one-night-stand status to great-love-of-a-movie-star quality. See taylor/wyngarde/Grace kind of obnoxious. Alan was so kind and patient. " see u around in london " was the cruelest thing he would say when some random cunt he was trying to rescue would express their annoyance at Alan's children

Joanna Pettet played Mata Bond in Casino Royale.

She emerges from the spectacle at about 1:30.

"Joanna Pettet IS James Bond" at about 0:49.

That was her great moment. She was sensational and almost stole the show from a cast of luminaries. She had a great voice too. One of her best assets. She really had quality. Unlike...Do I read " Nick Grace's relationship was as described in the book"? According to... Said Nick Grace I presume! Please!" Grace" is spelt l-e-e-c-h. What a joke. Not so funny in the end when that disgusting little freak was welcoming the press in the lobby of the lndon clinic. Alan knew

^ Ah, 'Trust me I know', you speak with authority.

I must re-read your contributions R276 R249 R205 R240 again.

R167 Are there any about her acting career and the people she worked with?

I would be thrilled if I had a sighting of her. Though living in the states it's pretty unlikely.

[quote]^ Ah, 'Trust me I know', you speak with authority.

he's marvelous, isn't he?

You r welcome y'all. BTW not that I was in their bedroom but Jo Pettet refered to Terence Stamp aka Terry in a " good ol' terry, not getting any younger" way that was so opposite to the crippling grief and the agony she was obviously feeling towards Alex Cord, the father of her lost son that I can only discard the idea that Stamp was the father as ludicrous. Interestingly, while Alan Bates was even more handsome and impressive IRL ( gorgeous man he was) Stamp, although fascinating on screen, is an epic case of " camera loves him". Short dry little fellow with 0 charisma off sreen. He could deliver the mail without u looking twice. But great looking on film.

[quote]—Trust me I know

not really. I saw Stamp in real life, in middle age, many times and he was very striking looking.

NOT a tremendous personality - true.

Did I mention that Alan was a riot? Hysterically funny, he made people around him happy, he had a glow, wonderful personality, intoxicating really. And Jo herself was a very funny woman. They were great fun to be around ddespite all the tragedies. And in that respect they were a wonderful duo. Good friends. But Alan was the caregiver, not the contrary. And boy she needed to be given care, loose gun that she was.

As a little gayling in the 1970s, I saw the nude wrestling scene between Oliver Reed and Alan Bates on HBO. I was transfixed. Both were gorgeous, but Bates with his beard really attracted me. He had that rugged handsomeness that still appeals to me to this day. Wonderful actor, but like most actors, fucked up in his personal life. Sad.

But you weren't sad aroud him coz...well ..Natalie Wood said some along the line " 1 night with Warren is worth a lifetime with any other ".. That applied to Alan in a BIG way. He was...otherwordly...

Incognito- "Said everyone who was a member between 1955 and 2003"

Alan as Gabriel Oak in "Far from the Madding Crowd." Never got over him Never will.

Were any of Alan's lovers DL hot?

The one I saw was fitness model hot R287.

Was the 1st male cover of Vogue and the 1st full-frontal male A-lister

john curry, skater, died of aids at 44

nickolas grace, the effete anthony blanche, from brideshead revisited

They were very good friends. Not lovers anymore for years when he died, but he did die in Alan's arms. When Alan was your friend you could count on him for the rest of your life. No matter how shitty you were

R291, Yes that would be him..Great Love of Him and "Lady Bates" contestant

Joanne Pettit was a friend of Sharon Tate's. She was over at Sharon's for lunch on the day Sharon got murdered by the Manson family. Supposedly Sharon asked to come by later, and she declined, thus saving herself from a horrible fate. She was also friends with Janice Wylie, who was knifed to death in what came to be known as "The Career Girls Murder." Strange that she was friends with two flamboyant blondes who were murdered by being stabbed to death.

Jo attracts trouble like honey attracts bees. She is also a very hard woman and she knows it. I asked her how she could sell drugs when her son had died from it, did she not think of other young lives that would be damaged? we had long openhearted conversations at night in Alan 's garden as she would puff away ( joint). She casually answered, the money is easy, and if I didn't, somebody else would

^. I do wish you Pettet lovers would create your particular Pettet thread.

We have to come here to adore an important sexy man and not delve into the unpleasant pedestrian aspects of his day-to-day existence.

Exactly R296. But we need to stop that "Pettet was his caregiver" BS and really understand the depth of Alan Bates's heart, his tenderness, his strenght even in ill health, his loyalty and tolerance towards his friends in need, who had been less lucky than himself

Be that as it may, dear R297, I do hope this memorial to him won't be besmirched.

Besmirched R298? His whole life has been besmirched already by Donald Spoto, with the help of his family and "friends" who lived off his generosity, the long parade of the common leeches who came day after day at the London clinic asking for money and legal papers to be signed. Did you read the thread ? Do you think I will let strangers say these horrible nasty things when he was the kindest Man on hearth? That is what I thought when he died that nasty christmas day " there is no more kindness in the world"

R299 That D.S. person you mentioned (and I refuse to name them) is the very worst of American muck-rakers. Their schoolgirl gossip has created a permanent dirty footnote in the honourable career of Bates' mentor Olivier.

Well...Olivier was not really Alan's mentor. Alan loved Vivien and was friends with Joan Plowright, and he did several movies with Olivier, but didn't like him and would object to the term.. He even turned down " Sleuth" because he didn't want to work with Olivier again, and didn't for many years. He adored Peter Finch, James Mason, john schlesinger, but thought Olivier demanding and unpleasant

Didn't Oliver say on his retirement that he would pass the National over to Finney, Hopkins or Bates but NOT to the oleaginous Hall or some other bureaucrat?

Wasn't Olivier fired? i don't think he retired.

Olivier liked him obviously but not many people liked Olivier, who would perhaps, without the benefits of Vivien social skills, not have had the same stature

R303 Olivier may have been fired from the Old Vic in the mid 40s but the National was a bureaucratic nightmare with multiple auditoria in a new, unpleasant building besieged by bean-counters. And unfortunately illness came upon him.

R304 Nonsense. Olivier was the focus of jealousy and envy for over 35 years while poor Vivien became a liability after 20.

.....

..Jonthan Kent, who directed Bates at the Almeida, once said: "He has an air of mystery. There's an impenetrable heart to him."

R307 oh thank you. Its very accurate. He was so mysterious and yet so warm sexy and funny.Every body wanted access to the secret depth of his heart. You could hold his body but access to this hidden gem was denied. For all but one I suspect . His amazing tenderness and superior understanding of human nature were shimmering under the surface, exasperingly out of reach.

Sorry my android is exasperating too lol

I forgot he was in Gosford Park. There were so many in that great cast.

R305 Not at all, she was the queen of the theatre, very few new she was ill. She was the dazzling lady Oivier, and she comanded attention and respect. Her secretary Rosemary Geddes became Alan's after her death. I could tell you but I am going to bed now. Enough for now

I, for one, have loved the rabbit hole that this thread went down with Joanna Pettet. For fuck’s sake, it even drew Susan Richardson in.

This shit is what makes DL unique. It just doesn’t exist elsewhere.

So much to love. Even the signature.

Eyes on the prize.

Fuck.

R313, very nice. He had such a beautiful mouth, but his lips got so thin and parched.. Was he a smoker? Any more info from the poster who,knew the bf Gavin Somebody?

When I went to London for the only time in my life, it might have been Jan '77, there had been so little new building that the city still had a very wonderfully atmospheric beautiful sooty Dickensian air about it. Therefore when I visited the National I was appalled by the concrete community college design of this dermatological growth along the Thames near the heart of the city.

Reading Blakemore's account of this period and then the Hall Diaries many years later I had no idea it had just opened and all the intrigue which had just taken place. It seems that from these accounts Olivier was slowly but surely pushed out and Hall with a genius for Machiavellian charm, maneuvering and jockeying for power far surpassing his talents as a director for the stage was able to consolidate his power.

The National is a good example of the ugly Brutalism.

There was so much of him to enjoy.he was so large and warm..never forgot

It's hard to reconcile the portrait of a guy who was essentially elusive but also so loving and lovable. The former would do serious damage to, if not altogether cancel out, the latter for me.

R320 I see your point.That is why he was disrespected by so many who loved him madly and yet couldn't fully grasp him. But in this mysterious space lied the source of his spirituality and his artistic inspiration.He couldn't give himself fully no matter how hard he tried.but with this limitation he was the most loving man and loyal friend

How could you not?

No Alan was not a smoker.His lips were full and soft until the end. He smelled like violet, had the most beautiful soft feet, huge calves, big thick cock. He was fantastic in bed, the best. A great giver and a great cook.super fun and unpretentious. Adorable man through and through

You don't have to pretend the guy was perfect on every level. He had enough going for him.

I am just sharing my memories

Thanks for your memories.

R132 News just in. One hour ago.

I guess more secrets will be revealed soon.

Tiny irony given R327's news that the thread next to 'Alan Bates' on my thread list is 'Are Glory Holes Really A Thing?' Mr Wyngarde could have told us all a tale or two.

M.Wyngarde was a abuser and a nasty manipulator who pushed Alan to the edge of depression until he finally escape around the time of Zorba the greek. Young Alan was very shy, afraid of his impulses, overwhelmed by his success, both as a man and an actor, and at first, felt safe in a monogamous relationship that turned very badly. But in a way it kept him off the street cruising and possible scandal "a la Gielgud". So despite the continuous abuse and put down, he carried on a long time. Homosexuality was a crime then. Exceptionnaly for Alan. P.W. was never forgiven and never a friend.

^ what kind of abuse? Physical? Emotional?

Emotional

Wyngarde sounds like a piece of work. Did he date any other actors?

Speaking of which....Peter Wyngarde is dead. Maybe our gossiping killed him!

Is a tractor gay because it’s always taking loads?

Did I get it right?

bump

The Quad in NYC is showing some of Alan's movies this week.

It often pushes them too.

I'd like to see him in the film "A Day In The Death of Joe Egg", based on the play of the same name. It's about a married couple with a severely disabled daughter. He and Janet Suzman are said to be very good in it.

I wouldn't cross the street to see any of those - except for THIS, which I'd love to see on the big screen with a New York audience.

[quote]I'd like to see him in the film "A Day In The Death of Joe Egg", based on the play of the same name. It's about a married couple with a severely disabled daughter. He and Janet Suzman are said to be very good in it.

I got the DVD. I gave up after 20 minutes.

There's a theater version of "Joe Egg" on YouTube starring Eddie Izzard and Victoria Hamilton, which wasn't very good. Izzard actually broke character during the production; it was a mess. I saw a clip of the film with Alan Bates and it looked much more interesting. If I had the DVD I'd watch it.

R340 please send r341 your DVD.

I wonder if there'll be a Peter Wyngarde biopic. Who should play PW and AB? I hope David Walliams isn't cast as Wyngarde.

^ a Wyngarde/Bates movie would be awesome

[quote]I wonder if there'll be a Peter Wyngarde biopic. Who should play PW and AB? I hope David Walliams isn't cast as Wyngarde.

People don't know enough about it.

Quad Cinema has been playing a retrospective of his films over the past week. Still a couple more days left, I think. I caught "The Go-Between" and "Women in Love," both of which I had never seen. The costumes in "Women in Love" were spectacular, and the wrestling scene did not disappoint.

I liked "The Go-Between," it was very hypnotic, but I wish it had gone a bit further and pumped it up a bit more. The description of the novel on Wikipedia indicates that they there are some things lightly suggested in the movie that are explicitly stated in the novel, which I think would have helped, though I guess who am I to question Harold Pinter.

Link to Quad Cinema:

Sorry, one more post. At the end of the retrospective, they are opening a longer engagement of a restoration of "King of Hearts." Anyone here seen that one?

[quote]Sorry, one more post. At the end of the retrospective, they are opening a longer engagement of a restoration of "King of Hearts." Anyone here seen that one?

Yes, I hated it.

In the 70s King of Hearts was a huge cult film.

I never got the love for it.

I like the music.

I saw King of Hearts in college when film societies were showing cult films every weekend. (I guess that phenomenon has long since died a digital death since those wondrous weekends thirty-plus years ago.)

I liked it. Alan Bates and Genevieve Bujold are stunningly beautiful, and the question of individual sanity against the backdrop of an arguably insane wider society seems just as relevant now as it would have in the Vietnam War era.

I saw "King of Hearts" at Quad Cinema, and I really loved it! I can see why some find it treacly, but I didn't. It had a very singular sense of humor that kept it from descending to schmaltz. It's certainly of its time, but I don't think that's a bad thing.

It reminded me a bit of Jean Genet's "The Balcony," in that both are partly about how costumes determine our societal roles.

Anyone else seen IN CELEBRATION, which is a filmed version of the play with a young Brian Cox and James Bolan.

Alan Bates basically plays my father in it, and my father looked like Alan Bates as well.

From "Tea with the Dames":

Eileen Atkins:“I think actors who play Antony always feel it’s Cleopatra’s play because it’s a better part. At least that’s what Alan Bates told me.”

Maggie Smith:“That’s because he wanted to play Cleopatra.”

A dance with Kenneth Haigh on stage in "Look Back in Anger".

Maggie Smith:“That’s because he wanted to play Cleopatra.”

Oh no she di-in't!!!!!!

All those 60's and 70's British actors were hot.

"All those 60's and 70's British actors were hot."

Well, not ALL of them. Bates was, though.

I’ve changed my mind on the ‘who would you want from history’ thread. Alan Bates has to be one of the most beautiful men ever.

R354 Yes, I saw "In Celebration". It reminded me of Eugene O'Neill's "Long Day's Journey Into Night", with three sons instead of two, and an industrial background instead of a theatrical one. Sad movie.

Is Jeremy Northam really gay, as an early post purports? He’s hot.

He is unfortunately not, R362.

R363 is wrong, he's gay

Is he, R364? I’ve never heard that from anyone, and I work in the theatre in London.

He never sucked my cock though...

Dirk Bogarde, Sean Connery, Malcolm McDowell, Oliver Reed, Alan Bates, Tom Courtenay,Alfred Lynch. Hot British actors from the 50's - 70's.

Tom Courtenay is a great actor but I never thought of him as hot.

Growing up on my family's farm, I knew I had something in common with the tractors

A Voyage Round My Father

Laurence Olivier, Alan Bates, Elizabeth Sellars and Jane Asher in the 1984 television version of John Mortimer's autobiographical play.

I love this thread. I first saw Bates in The Rose and then a few years later shrieked with glee in a local vhs video store when I saw a copy of The Wicked Lady with Bates and Faye Dunaway. It didn't disappoint and has become a favorite guilty pleasure over the years.

I LOVED Joanne Petit in The Group. Would love to know more about her rescue by Bates. And the poster TRUST ME I KNOW is fascinating. The way he described Bates was so real - I've known someone like that.

I'm watching BUTLEY right now. It's weird that even Roger Ebert dismissed that the Butley character was gay - just asexual. Bitch please the whole first long scene is Butley throwing a jealous hissy fit because his boy toy has a new guy. Alan Bates is delicious in it.