"The Golden Palace" ("Golden Girls" Spin-off) - Will It Ever Be Released On DVD?

Dorothy checks in.

They finally showed Shady Pines in "The Golden Palace" I believe. It turned into a rich resort. Sofia checked in to run away from Dorothy who came to take her away from the hotel.

I believe the reason that Golden Palace has yet to be put on DVD has something to do with the distributing rights.

I wonder if Logo's deal included "Golden Palace" reruns.

Why was Bea Arthur excluded from Golden Palace?

She wasn't excluded. She decided to leave GG and that is why the Top Ten rated series was canceled, with the intention to continue on without her as GP.

Most likely it will be released on iTunes or Amazon or some other steaming site. DVDs are over.

Why did it end up on CBS?

Sophia also ended up becoming a regular on "Empty Nest" after GP was cancelled. She was back in Shady Pines but somehow managed to drop in at the Westons' in her old neighborhood all the time.

R8 because NBC didn't want it.

I had never seen it, so I was excited when after YEARS, Lifetime finally added the show to its schedule. But it turned out to be a bad show. Adding Don Cheadle, Cheech and that stupid kid threw everything off. And I remember Blanche and Sophia seemed to hate each other on this show for some reason. It was weird.

The writing was stronger than the Golden Girls, but the new ensemble just didn't work.

Bea Arthur was fairly miserable on the Golden Girls. According to Rue McClanahan, Bea was never happy with the ensemble nature of the Golden Girls after having been the star of her own show (Maude) in the 70s, it also rubbed her the wrong way that she was the last of the 4 actresses to win an Emmy. For whatever reason (I'm guessing money), Bea agreed to do a 6th and 7th season but refused to do anymore.

Originally there was some talking of replacing Dorothy with her sister Gloria - Diana Muldaur in a TV Legends interview stated that she was contacted about the part but turned it down. Rather then risk the quality of the show, it was decided to cancel it. Susan Harris (the creator of the Golden Girls) came up with the idea of a spin-off Golden Palace since Betty White, Rue and Estelle Getty wanted to keep doing the show. NBC wasn't interested so CBS picked up the show. The idea didn't work and while the ratings were decent, CBS cancelled the Golden Palace after one season.

[quote] The writing was stronger than the Golden Girls, but the new ensemble just didn't work.

The girls still got some good material, but it never meshed with the awkward attempts at dudebro-smalltalk between Chuy and Roland without the girls.

And Oliver was even worse than Seven from [italic]Married with Children[/italic], who came and went the same year (they were probably both told they were going to be the next Macaulay Culkin). That character only exists because of Michael Eisner's obsession with Oliver Twist.

If they can release all of [italic]Joanie Loves Chachi[/italic], there's room for this on DVD.

Stan and Miles each got one episode that resolved their fates, albeit unhappily.

How do they explain Dorothy's absence on GP?

[quote] How do they explain Dorothy's absence on GP?

She married me and moved to Atlanta, remember?

GP was terrible.

The writing was stronger? OK, as long as you're fine with a laughless comedy.

[quote]OK, as long as you're fine with a laughless comedy.

I have nothing against it.

Golden Palace writing was nowhere near the quality of the Golden Girls. The Golden Girls remains one of the funniest sitcoms in TV history and continues to have a timeless quality in terms of the humor. Golden Palace is long since forgotten by anyone who wasn't a die hard fan of the original show.

Yet I managed to run four years.

[quote] continues to have a timeless quality in terms of the humor

Oh yeah, in a world where everyone and their mother has a cell phone, nothing says "timeless" like MCI jokes.

[quote]Stan and Miles each got one episode that resolved their fates, albeit unhappily.

I remember Miles married Nanette Fabray in the hotel (which made zero sense) but what happened to Stan?

Stan got hit for back taxes over sales of the Zbornie, and being unable (or unwilling) to pay, he faked his death and skipped the country. Only Sophia ever saw him alive and knew the truth, and he said never to tell Dorothy.

"The Golden Girls" was broadcast on NBC beginning with the 1985-86 season. Its seventh and last was the 1991-92 season. Beatrice Arthur made the decision to leave "The Golden Girls" with conclusion of Season #07. NBC was in the mood to do some cleaning by getting rid of older-skewing series, which also included "Matlock" and "In the Heat of the Night." "Matlock," starring Andy Griffith, transferred to ABC. "In the Heat of the Night," based on the 1967 Oscar winner for best picture and starring Carroll O'Connor (who won a 1989 Emmy for the role that won Rod Steiger his Oscar), transferred to CBS. In the case of "The Golden Girls," the change to "Golden Palace" had to do with a change in environment. The move to Friday nights was not a help. While CBS used to win that night during the 1980s with the likes of "The Dukes of Hazzard," "Dallas," and "Falcon Crest," ABC had taken over by the end of the 1980s/early-1990s in leading the ratings night. So, CBS on Friday nights in 1992 was no longer No. 1. Along with "Golden Palace," Bob Newhart's "Bob," an underrated sitcom on which he starred as a comics book artist (playing his wife was Carlene Watkins; playing his daughter was Cynthia Stevenson), also ended up having failed. (It did get renewed for the 1993-94 season. Betty White, freed up from "The Golden Girls"/"Golden Palace," joined the second-season "Bob"; it was canceled by December 1993.) The only series I can think of from CBS, Friday nights, during the 1992-93 season, and which had anything of a lifespan, was "Picket Fences." That David E. Kelley creation, not a ratings hit, stunned many by winning the top three Emmys in drama (series, lead actor Tom Skerritt, lead actress Kathy Baker) for this freshman season. Perhaps the only silver lining in the "Golden Palace" cloud was that it gave us, among its cast, a very worthy future star (and 2004 Oscar nominee) Don Cheadle.

You could tell continuity queens got a hold of GP because we had to suffer through Blanche's son, Matthew, played by Bill Engvall.

Blanche had a convoluted number of children throughout GG, but whoever ran GP thought we needed to see Matthew or something.

We didn't.

The Girls got to promote GP on Vicki Lawrence's then-new talk show!

Rue is wearing one of Blanche's outfits from the final season of GG...

Wasn't another reason that Bea was reluctant to do Golden Palace was that she had already stared in the awful US version of Faulty Towers? I doubt she ever wanted to do a hotel themed sitcom after that. Though it should be noted that Betty White stared in another awful US version of Faulty Towers. There were three attempts at a US version.

[quote]She wasn't excluded. She decided to leave GG and that is why the Top Ten rated series was canceled, with the intention to continue on without her as GP.

Golden Girls was a top ten show for it's first six years. The sixth season was ranked #10 in yearly ratings. However in the 7th year the ratings tanked and it fell to #30 even having less ratings that "Empty Nest."

NBC was very interested in having the Golden Palace but the problem was money. The remaining cast wanted the same salaries they had on the Golden Girls, while NBC said, without Bea the show was a brand new show and the cast shouldn't expect to get paid as much as on a continuing series. So NBC would've picked the show up had Rue, Betty and Estelle agreed to a lower salary, but then CBS came in and agreed to meet the demands to the producers moved the show to CBS. As stated above, CBS was trying to make an "adult" comedy block to challenge the kid-oriented TGIF on ABC, so they put Golden Girls there and moved Designing Women as well.

The final season of "The Golden Girls" saw the show drop out of the top 20. CBS wasn't interested in a spin-off. They would only give "The Golden Palace" a mid-season 13 episode pick up. NBC guaranteed a full season 24 episode pick up, hence the move.

Estelle Getty enjoyed "The Golden Palace" more than "The Golden Girls" but couldn't remember her lines. She was in the beginning stages of the disease that would kill her.

Part of the reason for the Golden Girl's drop from the top 10 in that last season was because NBC decided to move the show from it's Saturday night 9 pm time slot to 8 pm instead. For whatever reason, people didn't follow the show to its new time and ultimately NBC did move the show back to 9 pm and the numbers stabilized slightly.

R31 You're right but you got the networks wrong. NBC only offered a 13 episode deal, while CBS was willing to order a full season.

R32 Yes in Rue's book she said that for some reason Estelle's stage fright disappeared, and she was able to remember her lines again. Rue theorized that it had something to do with Bea not being around. Marc Cherry has also said the GP set was far less tense than the GG set because Bea was very unhappy in the last couple of seasons and bringing everyone on the set down.

Why did Be a only appear very briefly in several episodes in Season 7?

I LOVE Season 7 the most but was always curious as to why Dorothy would disappear or only show up at the end on several eps.

If you watch any interviews with Bea, she's very grand so it's easy to see how people might have been intimidated by her.

Why was Bea such a miserable twat? It's funny how she lied about her military service because she had an STD. I wish someone threw the proof in her face.

[quote]it also rubbed her the wrong way that she was the last of the 4 actresses to win an Emmy

As I recall, Rue was the last of the 4 to win, not Bea. Betty won like the first 2 years I think, then Bea and Estelle (in supporting) won the year after that, and then Rue won. Not 100% sure without googling, but that's what I remember.

The last two seasons of GG were dreadful.

i think the golden girls ran out of steam after the 5th season.. season 6 had some ok episodes, season 7 was really bad.. I think they just ran out of ideas..I hated that the plot line of Dorothy going to remarry Stan and then all the episodes of Stan trying to win Dorothy back.. Golden palace was just a mess.. even in the bizarre world of the Golden Girls, it made no sense for Rose, Blanche , and Sophia to suddenly sell their house and buy a hotel.

Yeah what kind of loser buys a hotel

Don't forget, R39, that Blanche comes from money. And she, Rose and Sophia would have sold the house to partially pay for it. And she could easily have gotten Uncle Lucas to secure a loan. They went [italic]Mayberry RFD[/italic]/[italic]Archie Bunker's Place[/italic]/[italic]Three's A Crowd[/italic] route because they didn't want to do the [italic]Designing Women[/italic]/[italic]The Facts of Life[/italic]/[italic]The Office[/italic] route and take the blows in syndication.

For all its faults it was still better than [italic]Amanda's[/italic]. And as for it's non-appearance on DVD, keep in mind it's Disney we're talking about. They still haven't finished [italic]DuckTales[/italic] or any of the animated shows of that era they started on DVD and just dropped. That very special Mayim Bialik diatribe against [italic]Frozen[/italic] is partly bitterness over how they won't release the rest of [italic]Blossom[/italic] on DVD; not like she'd get a dime in royalties anyway. And none of the other GG-connected shows are out either; [italic]Empty Nest[/italic] and [italic]Nurses[/italic] are nowheresville, man. They don't even want to release their old movies to stores anymore and they make you join their stupid club to get them, while completely stripping them of extras if they had any to begin with. And as for the decades and decades of [italic]Wonderful World of Disney[/italic], there's maybe a fraction of that available; some of it is out-of-print, and what is in print hasn't been remastered.

I agree with those who say the first 5 seasons were wonderful but the last two were just meh. You could tell that by that point that everyone involved (and I'm talking the writers here as well as the actors) had basically stopped caring and was just cashing a paycheck and it showed onscreen.

That said, I did think the last season produced two gems: the episode about the murder game (the detective keeps saying to Rose "Let me guess, St. Olaf") and the one about Dorothy becoming a sensation at Blanche's favorite tavern at Blanche's expense (I loved Bea's version of "What'll I Do"). Those two eps were wonderful and I can watch them again and again.

R37 No Bea was the last of the 4 women to win an Emmy. Betty won in 86, Rue won in 87, Estelle won best supporting actress in 88 and Bea won lead actress in 88. Rue said in her book that Betty winning the Emmy the first year did not sit well with Bea at all, and even when she won despite their shared history on Maude, Bea couldn't be happy for Rue either.

The first 5 seasons of Golden Girls are undoubtedly the best, with seasons 3, 4 and 5 being the strongest overall. Season 6 wasn't that bad there was some gems that year, but season 7 is mostly forgettable except for the murder mystery one, the one where Dorothy takes over the Rusty Anchor and of course the finale.

R34 Bea was in every episode in season 7 but yes there were a couple episodes where Dorothy's character was going away for the weekend or something like that and would be in the opening scenes of the episode. I think that was done to get the audience use to just the three other ladies without Dorothy since they knew they were going to do a spinoff.

"That tea is for my Mommy!"

"Cheese... must find the cheese..."

I LOVE Season 7!!!!!!!!!

Bea was sick of the show and wanted to leave, but stayed for the other actresses so the show could go on. Not sure how that makes her a "twat". Also, given that she left 300,000 dollars in her will for a shelter for gay youth, and had always donated to gay causes, it might be nice if gay people remembered that TOO.

Estelle always had trouble with her lines. It had nothing to do with Bea.

R43, thanks for correcting me on that. I really should have googled before posting!

[quote]Rue said in her book that Betty winning the Emmy the first year did not sit well with Bea at all, and even when she won despite their shared history on Maude, Bea couldn't be happy for Rue either.

Reminds me of the rumored rift that occurred between Jackie Gleason and Art Carney years after "The Honeymooners" when Gleason reportedly became very jealous after Carney won the Academy Award for Best Actor in 1974 for "Harry and Tonto." I think they may have come back together years later but he was said to be quite envious of Carney's win.

As others have stated, Betty and Rue both won before Bea.

Season 1: Betty White won Best Actress

Season 2: Rue McClanahan won Best Actress

Season 3: Bea Arthur won Best Actress & Estelle Getty won Best Supporting Actress

Also, Betty White and Estelle Getty were Emmy-nominated for each of the 7 seasons.

Interestingly, Estelle Getty was the only one to win a Golden Globe.

If Estelle Getty was having so many problems, why did she continue on with "Empty Nest" after GP was cancelled?

Is it true Bea had champagne delivered to the set the Monday after Stop! Or My Mom Will Shoot opened and bombed?

R48 Because she was asked to. Estelle had trouble remembering her lines and that was the extent of her problems. Estelle was truly loved by everyone involved with the GG and GP and her character was still hugely popular so they asked her to join Empty Nest. You can notice a difference in Estelle in Empty Nest though. She has a bit of a 'not always there' look on her face that is fairly common on the onset of dementia and Sophia really didn't have much to do either.

R34 I also think season 7 had very funny episodes. There are couple of episodes, where Bea is seen in the first and last scene, maybe they tried three other girls, how it works without Bea.

Bea thought they have had fantastic 5 seasons and all the story lines were told and wanted to leave. She thought the last two ones repeated what had already done.

R44 Blanche: -Dorothy, guess what I have under my robe? D: -That guy from circus? B: -No, my new swim suit. Would you like to see it? D: -Is it a 2-piece? B:-Yes. D:-No.

1. "Joanie Loves Chachi" is availble on DVD???? The full series???? There is no God.

2. The funniest GG ep is the two-parter from S4, "Sophia's Wedding"

R51 Yes you're right. Bea was tired and she felt the show had seen its glory days. Betty White once said that Bea had told her that they should leave when the audience still wants more. I agree with Bea on this, I think if the show had run another season or two it would have tarnished its legacy. Shows like Frasier, Friends, Will and Grace are prime examples of shows that should have ended earlier than they did.

Also "Seinfeld." All the hype about it being the greatest sitcom ever is total bullshit. The last 3 seasons (in my opinion) were horrible. And even Jason Alexander said in an on-camera interview that he thought it went about 2 seasons too long.

[quote] Estelle won best supporting actress in 88

Not a real Emmy.

[quote]Interestingly, Estelle Getty was the only one to win a Golden Globe.

fake award like the "participation trophy"

[quote]The last 3 seasons (in my opinion) were horrible

No, you're wrong.

[quote]Rue said in her book that Betty winning the Emmy the first year did not sit well with Bea at all, and even when she won despite their shared history on Maude, Bea couldn't be happy for Rue either.

[quote]Also, given that she left 300,000 dollars in her will for a shelter for gay youth, and had always donated to gay causes, it might be nice if gay people remembered that TOO.

So what? What about gay older people who really need help and not gay youth? When one is really selective about their charities you can see they are not very nice. Rue is lying.

I don't have to fall in line with the Gay Gestapo and "agree" that S6&7 of GG are "horrible". In fact, I also love the final two seasons of "Seinfeld" more than the rest of the series. The first 3 seasons are painful to watch, actually.

S7 of GG is gay camp in all of it finest glory! Rue was THIN finally, Bea had that ROCKING haircut...

"Different on outside, same on inside!" One of Rose's funniest lines ever!

On topic: I remember nothing about "Golden Palace" except for the depressing ends for Miles and Stan. I'd still buy it on DVD, though.

[quote]No, you're wrong.

No, my opinion. If you don't agree, that's your problem.

Bea's hairdo in season 7 defies description. Season 6 and 7 were inferior, though the murder mystery cruise is funny. I know I'm going to sound like the biggest GG queen, but the only tolerable episodes for me those last two seasons list Susan Harris as co-executive producer. I'm guessing she tweaked some pretty poor scripts.

Bea's 1991-1992 Season 7 hair always looked like Stevie Nicks' Early 1987 hair to me...

[quote]I'm guessing she tweaked some pretty poor scripts.

Hey! I was tired!

I agree with most GG season 7 sucked. It's hard to keep the quality going when actors stopped caring. Sophia had major issues in the last season. It was easy to tell that something was going on with her physically.

For me I enjoy Seasons 3 through 6 the best. Season six you could tell the show was starting to get tired but there was still a lot of really good episodes that year. I actually avoid the first season because the show was still finding itself and I actually find the early episodes have a 70s sitcom feel to them.

Season 7 wasn't dreadful like some people say but it mostly consists of forgettable episodes. R62 Yes Estelle started having 'vacant' expressions on her face a lot during the 7th season. I believe that's when her dementia really started to settle in.

This is slightly off-topic but since this is the only active Golden Girl thread at the moment--why did Stan almost always introduce himself to the others? He'd be at the door, they opened it and he says "Hi, it's Stan."

Sophia really had a small role on Empty Nest r48. She typically only had one or two scenes per episode. She was mainly there for windowdressing during Empty Nest's later years.

Sophia on Empty Nest is interesting. Why they had her go back to Shady Pines made zero sense. I don't think it's mentioned what happened to the hotel.

Add to that having Sid Melton and Bill Dana on one episode playing Sophia's roommates at Shady Pines.

I always thought it was a shame that Golden Palace didn't work better. I really think it could have worked without Bea. There are plenty of scenes in GG episodes in which Rue, Betty and/or Sophia work beautifully together. Unfortunately, I think putting them in a hotel and giving them jobs and overly busy plots was a complete mistake. It was never the (often, ridiculous) plots of Golden Girls that made it such fun, but rather the small moments in between, when the girls were simply conversing over cheesecake or hanging in the living room, telling stories and insulting each other and giving each other withering looks. It was all about that interaction and reaction. When the dynamic was no longer about how they played off of each other, but about stupid, pointless plotlines related to hotel business that no one gave a shit about, everything fell apart. They tried to make a (bad) farce out of what was essentially a modern day drawing room comedy.

Well said, R67, and very true.

R67 One of the problems of Golden Palace was the lack of the 'anchor' provided by Dorothy. In a way the Dorothy character was the sane character who kind of kept the show grounded in reality (as much reality as a sitcom can have). Personally I think the wiser decision would have been just to end it all so all the characters would have a proper ending.

[quote]Originally there was some talking of replacing Dorothy with her sister Gloria - Diana Muldaur in a TV Legends interview stated that she was contacted about the part but turned it down.

Their loss.

I agree R69. Aren't the 7 seasons of Golden Girls dvds selling well anyway? It seems like a no brainer.

They need to have a Golden Girls reunion to see what they all look like now. If Star Wars can drag out Carrie Fisher and Mark Hamill to huge success (billions of dollars), imagine what a Golden Girls reunion would bring in.

R72 Star Wars is a Golden Girls reunion.

tall shrill Chewbacca = Bea Arthur

short ugly Yoda = Estelle Getty

fake hair Leia = Betty White

always masked Boba Fett = Rue McClanahan a.k.a. vain Blanche who is afraid to show what she looks like now at her age.

R72 Are you serious? Betty White is the only one alive.

R74, that was the joke.

I always though Bea Arthur was someone who wasn't comfortable in their own skin. She always said that in interviews she wanted to be the blonde starlet in the white dress. It's clear that everyone who ever worked with her goes on about her talent (which is true she was a comedic genius) but people are odd when describing her personality. Rue always said Bea was 'eccentric,' Betty called Bea 'reclusive,' Susan Harris called Bea 'overly sensitive.' Christopher Lloyd (the producer not actor) who worked on the Golden Girls for a number years always said Bea's sour relationship with Betty was a result of jealousy. Bea also went on about how exhausting the Golden Girls was but really their schedule was 9 to 5 Monday to Thursday and Friday noon to 10 for taping. Bea was making 2.5 million a season on the show so I sure wouldn't be exhausted.

Speaking of Empty Nest, but does that show air anywhere? I don't recall it ever running in syndication although I am sure it did at one time.

I live in Canada and Empty Nest used to rerun most afternoons on CBC for most of the 90s. I use to see it on some American stations late at night during the late 90s early 2000s but I don't think it has been run anywhere since. Pretty much a forgotten show now.

Empty Nest was on the Hallmark Channel a few years ago. It had been years since I had seen it and my first reaction was, "THIS came from the same creative team as The Golden Girls?!"

Empty Nest was a decently funny show the first few seasons. I think it even beat GG in the ratings one season. It all fell apart when Kristy McNichol left and they introduced Marsha Warfield and increased Park Overall's screen time. And of course adding Getty was a desperate ploy. The whole dynamic changed and it became unwatchable.

[quote]It all fell apart when Kristy McNichol left

Totally spot on with this. Kristy and Dinah Manoff had such great chemistry playing off one another. Without Kristy, Manoff's character got on your nerves way too much. Kristy's character allowed one to see the Manoff character be put in her place. The dynamic between the sisters was precise and flawless.

Plus Kristy was very feminine and believable as a hot number in this show, unlike in "Family" and her movies where she came off as too butch. It is kind of sad to see the last episode where Kristy came back and looked like her illness had taken quite a toll on her physically. She looked drained and exhausted.

The loss of Kristy from this show hurt it terribly, and as good as Manoff was, she needed someone strong to play off of.

"A Cop! In a dress! Without a gun!"

More proof of the WONDERFULNESS of Season 7!!!!!!!!!!!!

Empty Nest airs several times a day on the LAFF channel (broadcast service.)

I loved Empty Nest for the first few years but how annoying was that Joe Izzuzo guy?

The Cheeseman: Don't make a move old lady!

Sophia: Nice way to talk to your mother, pussycat.

Estelle Getty was losing her memory even during the Golden Girls, so surprising the producers at Empty Nest would hire Estelle. Yes same producers, but still. Wouldn't it be more trouble than it would be worth as Estelle didn't really add anything to Empty Nest other than be a foil for Carol.

Estelle was seen as the "breakout" star of the GGs at the time. Not necessarily in that her character wound up taking over the show and was clearly the most popular of all the cast, but more that she was the only unknown one of the four and Sophia had all the wisecracks and so she appealed to a lot of people. I suspect her Q rating was through the roof, hence that abysmal feature she did with Stallone. She was thought of as everybody's favorite cranky grandma. In retrospect I think the character of Sophia has aged (pun intended) the worst in terms of watching it from a contemporary perspective as she seems the most "schticky" and her comedic gifts (timing, nuance, delivery) were the weakest of the four. But I clearly remember at the time, that even though, all the Girls were well received, Sophia definitely seemed to be a fan favorite. I think that's why she was brought on to Empty Nest, that, and she was the only real supporting character of the four (hence her continual nominations in that category as opposed to the other three). White, Mclanahan and Arthur wouldn't have wanted to play a character they had all won lead actress Emmy's for as a secondary character.

Yes R87 is right, Sophia was really the breakout character for the Golden Girls. I think Estelle was the only GG cast member to appear in all the Wit/Thomas productions of the 80s and 90s: Golden Girls, Nurses, Empty Nest and Blossom. R86 Estelle wasn't terrible with her lines, her real trouble was with those Sicily stories - she couldn't memorize them. I know at times they had to resort to cue cards which Bea was not happy about. Bea had some snarky things to say about Estelle in her interview with TV Legends. Bea basically implied that Estelle was really just an amateur trying to work with professionals. Rue has always said she thought Estelle was intimidated with Bea and that Estelle's memory problem suddenly vanished when Bea left and they did Golden Palace.

Estelle's addition to Empty Nest was a clear ploy to try and get viewers over to Empty Nest which was falling in the ratings. I find it painful to watch Estelle in those episodes because she seems medicated or somewhat out of it.

[quote]Bea had some snarky things to say about Estelle in her interview with TV Legends. Bea basically implied that Estelle was really just an amateur trying to work with professionals.

I've watched that interview a dozen times, and this is utter horse shit. Bea was not snarky about Estelle; she said nothing of the kind. On the contrary, it was obvious that she was quite fond of Estelle.

If there was anyone she was shady towards in that interview, it was Betty, about whom she said about 2 words, which had to be pulled out of her mouth by the interviewer.

After director/producer Terry Hughes (whom they referred to as the 5th GG) left the show during the 5th season, the show took a noticeable decline in quality. The pacing was off and the show began to feel sapped of energy. It didn't help that the writing/producing teams who ran the show (Terry Grossman/Kathy Spear & Mort Nathan/Barry Fanaro) left at the end of season 4. The new people who came on in the 5th season didn't totally get the show. The 5th season was ok, probably because Hughes was still around, but the 6th and 7th were painful.

R90 I wouldn't classify seasons 6 and 7 as painful. Yes the quality had declined and the show isn't as constantly funny as it had been but there were still a lot of funny moments. I would say the show got a bit more 'zany' in the later seasons and less grounded in reality.

And crueller, the characters were much crueller to each other, I think it worked out okay at the time because they had built up 5 years of audience trust so the meanness probably seemed less jarring, but watching the episodes out of order now, it's a bit harder to take (in the sense that you could imagine the characters liking each other).

I have heard it mentioned many times both on here and I think at least by Rue (maybe Betty and Bea, as well, can't remember) about Bea not liking Estelle's reading off cue cards, but then what are we to think about the whole Chronic Fatigue Episode where Bea is clearly reading off cards when giving the doctor what-for at the restaurant at the end of the episode...unless one of the symptoms of CFS is having your eyes continually wandering off to the same general area of the '4th wall'...

Re: the 6th and 7th seasons of GG: They're both still eminently watchable to me. Let's face it, this show was NEVER about the ridiculous plots, but always about the small, intimate day-to-day interactions between the women - their stories, their insults - in the kitchen, the living room, the lanai. There was still plenty of that to enjoy in the 6th and 7th season, even as the show started to comment on itself more and more (as sitcoms often do in their later seasons). It's the first (and to a lesser extent) second season I feel are far less watchable. To me, the show didn't really come into its own until the third season. As for Estelle, it's certainly true that she was the least skilled of these brilliant comedic actresses, but if there were an award for most improved, she would have won it. If you compare her fairly stilted season 1 and 2 performance with her seasons 5-7 performance, it's night and day. Her comedic timing, her delivery, her ability to play off the other women is dramatically better. It's a real treat to see how much she grew as a performer over the seasons.

Season 7 was perfection!

"I am Pussycat One! You are Pussycat Two!"

I thought Bea did pretty well in that television interview, but she was snarky a few times. I thought the Esther Rolle comments were in very poor taste given that Rolle gushed over Arthur when they were on the RuPaul show a few years prior and had called Bea a mentor. I also thought she was a little harsh in discussing Adrienne Barbeau.

From what I've heard, Bea had a heart of gold but could be very blunt and direct when it came to working together and assessing another actor.

It's no secret Bea was a big drinker. In an interview on youtube somewhere, Joan Rivers tells this story about trying to get Bea Arthur to do her late night talk show. Bea agreed to lunch with Joan and Bea's lunch consisted of a bottle of Vodka and three cigarettes.

R95 I think Bea's bluntness came from her shyness and introverted nature. People who are shy can often be very direct not because they intend to be mean but because they're just nervous around others.

What did Bea say about Rolle and Barbeau? Bea and Barbeau were on The View a couple of years before her death, and they seemed very friendly and cozy. Yes Bea was very shy. I think it was Betty who said that Bea was painfully shy and during the first season, Bea would literally latch on to Betty for dear life when they went to the commissary together. I assume this is before they were on the outs.

Blanche: It'll be on your head. Period. Rose: I can't believe she said that. Exclamation Point. Dorothy: Well, who's to say. Question mark. New paragraph. What the hell am I saying?

Sophia: Lifesaver, Pussycat? Dorothy: Ah, go to hell ma.

Dorothy: Your initials spell BED?

Blanche : Every man I know is watching this show. This live show. This live show about lesbian lovers of Miami. Rose: Wow! We could beat the Price is Right.

I would rather see the other Jaime Whooten/Marc Cherry one-season wonder, The 5 Mrs. Buchanans, released on DVD before Golden Palace. I thought when Desperate Housewives blew up, it would be released with a big "FROM THE PRODUCER OF DESPERATE HOUSEWIVES" on the cover to help move it. I loved that show. Unfortunately it got an awful Saturday night timeslot, but the chemistry between the leads were great.

Bea said she adored Adrienne, but felt she didn't really fit with the show. Although to be fair, Adrienne wrote in her book that she felt out of her league on the show (especially in the first year) as she was acting alongside more established actors who had done television prior (Maude was Adrienne's first TV spot). Bea thought Marcia Rodd who was in the pilot played the character better. I thought Rodd did a lousy job, and tried to be like a mini Bea, which didn't work. Bea and Adrienne remained good friends however up until her passing.

Bea said Esther was given the tagline "My name is Esther Rolle. I don't do windows and I don't do comedy" by one of the producers. Although Bea said she got better with Good Times, she felt Hermione was a better fit, because she could play comedy and understood the point of a sitcom.

[quote]I thought Bea did pretty well in that television interview, but she was snarky a few times. I thought the Esther Rolle comments were in very poor taste given that Rolle gushed over Arthur when they were on the RuPaul show a few years prior and had called Bea a mentor. I also thought she was a little harsh in discussing Adrienne Barbeau.

I wouldn't say snarky, but blunt. She said that Esther Rolle "didn't have a funny bone," which, while perhaps not the nicest way to put it, was pretty accurate. Rolle took herself *very* seriously. I don't remember what she said about Adrienne Barbeau. I'll have to watch it again. I don't think she was really trying to put anyone down (though, as I said before, when she was asked about Betty White, she seemed like she couldn't be less interested in talking about her), not even Lucille Ball - who she, like many Dataloungers, thought had no business being cast as Mame.

Now, if you want to talk real shade - in her TV Legends interview (which is also fascinating), Rue McClanahan essentially called Dabney Coleman (with whom she worked on a short-lived sitcom right after Maude) a horse's ass. And she bitched about Walter Mathau in the movie Out to Sea.

I actually liked Marcia Rodd's take on the Carol character. Yes, she wasn't nearly as attractive as Barbeau and could come off as abrasive to some, but I thought she really stood her ground with Arthur and Macy. She was a much stronger actress, and you could definitely buy her as Bea's daughter more than Barbeau. I always look forward to that episode of All in the Family. Was Rodd not chosen or was it her idea not to join the series? If it was the former, then I can suppose I can see the logic of needing to balance out Bea with someone softer and more feminine like Barbeau.

Those TV Legends interviews are a treasure trove. Rita Moreno did one, and she talks about the infamous "Empty Nest" backdoor pilot. Susan Harris was sick with CFS and the script, according to Moreno, was terrible and needed to be rewritten badly, but Harris was too ill. So poor Rita evidently knew it was a stinking pile of shit even when she was filming it.

The only bright moment in that awful Empty Nest pilot was Dorothy's brief exchange with the Joe Isuzu guy. I think he was called Oliver in the pilot. The rest of awful. Moreno and Dooley had zero chemistry. And don't get me started on the fugly daughter. And who thought multiple personalities could be mined for humor??

Rodd might have been canned. Doris Roberts was originally offered the role of Vivian (she was recommended by Bea) but Norman Lear felt she was too much like Arthur so she was let go and Rue was cast.

[quote]I had never seen it, so I was excited when after YEARS, Lifetime finally added the show to its schedule. But it turned out to be a bad show. Adding Don Cheadle, Cheech and that stupid kid threw everything off. And I remember Blanche and Sophia seemed to hate each other on this show for some reason. It was weird.

I didn't mind Don Cheadle. But Cheech and the kids were awful on the show.

I guess since GP was on CBS, there were no crossovers with "Empty Nest." Was it the only other W-T-H series still running? Was "Nurses" still on by then?

OMG, R107, I was just about to post a question asking if anyone else remembers "Nurses"! Talk about a blast from the past. Another show that virtually dropped off the planet after its cancellation.

By the way, has anyone ever asked Don Cheadle about his time on GP? Would he even admit to it now?

[quote] she adored Adrienne, but felt she didn't really fit with the show

Translation: Adrienne's tits were bigger. Women always compare tit size, like men compare penis size. But women can't hide their tits.

Okay, so, I know this is a GP thread, but I'd like to chime in on season 7 of the GG. I think there were some really great episodes that season. One of the best of the entire series, The Case of the Libertine Belle happens in season 7. So, many great lines in that one.

Season 7 also had "Lesbian Lovers of Miami," which was one of the funniest moments of the entire series. That entire scene was hilarious.

No matter how many times you write that, that episode was not any good and saying it is doesn't make it so.

Season 7 did have some gems like: "The Case of the Libertine Belle," "Room 7," "Goodbye, Mr. Gordon (that's the lesbian lovers one)," "Journey to the Center of Attention" and "One Flew Out of the Cuckoo's Nest." But overall the show had basically run its course by this point and Bea was right to leave when she did.

Nurses only produced 66 episodes which didn't lend it very well to syndication. Lifetime used to air reruns back in the late 90's but I haven't seen it since then.

I seem to remember that Nurses did very well in the beginning, and then it just vanished. I know Rue did a guest spot at least once, but were any of the other GGs ever on it?

R115, did she play Blanche or another character?

She guest-starred as Blanche, of course.

Rita Moreno talking about the "Empty Nest" pilot:

NBC did a "Hurricane" crossover with all three series (GG, EN, and Nurses); Aired 11/9/91. Estelle Getty appeared on EN; Dinah Manoff on GG; Betty White and Park Overall on "Nurses." The GG episode was "The Monkey Show," with the "Save the Lighthouse" telethon and "Dan and Morothy."

R113

You've named so many of my favorite episodes from the entire series run. Although, it's not the best season overall of the show. I don't think it's as terrible as people think. Sure, by that point the show had run it's course.

Okay, sorry, I know this is a GP thread. I never watched it when it originally aired. I remember it was briefly syndicated because I saw it on Lifetime at one point. I caught an episode, and the only one I vaguely remember is when Dorothy came for a visit. But, I couldn't tell you the specifics of it.

The Golden Girls just aren't the Golden Girls without all four members of the cast. It's not a surprise that the show flopped and isn't half as fondly remembered as it's counterpart.

[quote]I was just about to post a question asking if anyone else remembers "Nurses"! Talk about a blast from the past. Another show that virtually dropped off the planet after its cancellation.

I vaguely remember Nurses being rerun on Lifetime for awhile after the cancellation. My grandmother loved the male Hispanic nurse.

Thanks R118. Rita has aged beautifully

Nurses was a total mess.

It started out as a vehicle for Stephanie Hodge and Jeff Altman, but neither was good enough to carry a series, and the supporting cast wasn't good enough to help them.

In the second season David Rasche joined the cast and stole the show in every scene he was in. It was painfully clear the other cast memebers weren't funny and he proved it. They added Markus Flanagan in the second season to draw in the "hunk" element as a former EMT and now orderly.

Then they booted off Hodge and brought in Anderson and retooled it a bit to make it a vehicle for her, only Rasche still stole every scene and he was overbearing without a strong person to play off of.

GP did an anti-Confederate flag episode that seems especially timely considering the recent flare-up.

I only remember nurses because of all the press around the show when Loni Anderson joined.

Elizabeth Pena (the Mexican Kate Bush) was the Latina Nurse.

Markus Flanagan was HOT!!!!!!!!!

On GG, the god-awful "Mr. Terrific" episode gave off the vibe of back-door pilot. All the elements were there. I find that episode practically unwatchable. It's odd that Bob Dishy played Bea's prospective son-in-law in the Maude pilot, yet played her contemporary in the "Mr. Terrific" episode.

NONE of the worst episodes from the entire series came from Season 7.

Rose loses her job - horrid!

Rose "hooked" on pills - terrible!

The pregnant girl - god-awful!

Michael Jackson/Winning Lottery Ticket - brain-leeching!

Dorothy & Stan almost remarrying - a violation to the eyes!

"I want you to be there when I kill myself" - revolting!!!

Sophia's Black Boyfriend - cringe-inducing!

Fat Janet and the guy from Murphy Brown - unwatchable!!!!

Sophia slapping Blanche's cute grandson - unfunny whole episode!

Season 7 was FREE of unfunny moments!!!!!!! A CLASSIC SEASON!!!!

The Rose loses her job episode contains that cringeworthy moment when Dorothy finishes tweaking Rose's resume and says "now this is the resume of a hospital administrator." In what world was Rose qualified to be a hospital administrator?

[quote]It started out as a vehicle for Stephanie Hodge and Jeff Altman, but neither was good enough to carry a series, and the supporting cast wasn't good enough to help them.

Couldn't they have brought in Mie and Kie?

Which season is the "boxer who quotes Shakespeare" episode from? That one's a piece of shit.

I love the way they reused actors to play different parts. Wasn't that Cuban boxer / classical violinist also the same actor who played Enrique Mas, Rose's boss at the tv station?

Season seven was the weakest. There was some good jokes, but the characters were just downright nasty and hateful towards each other. There was little of the genuine warmth that the earlier seasons had. I'd take the Rita Moreno episode and Mr. Terrific over a lot of the ones from the last season.

If season seven was the first season of the show, you never would have bought the premise because none of them really seem to truly like or even respect each other at times. And you'd wind up wondering why they would want to live together in the first place.

[quote]In what world was Rose qualified to be a hospital administrator?

Apparently one in which hospitals also accept handwritten resumes in pencil.

Steven Avery

A Day in the Life of Sophia Petrillo is truly awful.

R136 is that the episode where Sophia is "conducting" a Dixie Land style band with a bunch of women wearing really cheap wigs?

Sorry 101 but Esther Rolle is the only actor on Maude who is bearable to watch in the first 2 seasons, and that includes Bea. To say that Esther has no sense of humor is ridiculous and the reason she got the Good Times spin-off is because she was so good on Maude. She could give Bea and the rest some advice about how to play comedy, which doesn't mean yelling to the rafters. Rue McClanahan is one of the worst culprits for doing this. She is really awful on Maude and it is interesting to see how better writing and direction could make her more tolerable in the Golden Girls.

In the episode, where Rose lost her job, the girls have the best kitchen talk about their sex lives and getting orgasms.

[quote]In the second season David Rasche joined the cast and stole the show in every scene he was in.

Wow. It's been ages I've seen the show as reruns, but I thought Rasche was in the cast from the start. Nurses was pleasant enough as comfort entertainment where you could eat snacks (or the infamous TV dinner) and not be grossed out like, say, American Horror Story.

I appeciate TV Land for trying to come up with new shows that have that kind of comfort 80s appeal (like Hot in Cleveland and Happily Divorced).

Yes, R 137

I don't think there was ever a show that was more vanilla, mushy pudding than Nurses, when I think about it now it makes me cringe, how unoffensive, safe and unfunny that show was. Empty Nest was almost as bad, but Dinah Manoff and Park Overall gave the show a little seasoning, but man...Nurses, was just the worst. And then the Ada Maris/Kip Gilman romantic thing they kept trying to make happen, ala Sam and Diane, felt so contrived and painful. I really feel like NBC should have promoted this show by saying: if you are afraid to leave your home, are terrified of the real world, if chewing your food is too violent and aggressive for you, than have we got the show for you: Nurses!

[quote]A Day in the Life of Sophia Petrillo is truly awful

I avoid this episode all the time. Sophia conducting the band was awful and I also hated the cheap sad story of her volunteering at the hospital and the little boy with AIDS(but it wasn't stated directly).

[quote]In what world was Rose qualified to be a hospital administrator?

I will give that one a pass because it was the second episode produced. It was held over and aired out of order toward the end of the first season, so it seemed horribly out of place. But the writers were still getting the feel of the characters. Just like things in the pilot were out of place, I can laugh at this show and forget it's not realistic about Rose, but Rose wasn't really "Rose" as we knew her, when the episode was shot.

The scene in the GG episode where Rose talks the girls into having their heads frozen was one of the worst scenes of the series. I never thought they dressed appropriately for Miami either.

R145 like how Dorothy wore winter boats all the time?

The two part Class Reunion episode from Season 7 is one of the BEST!!!!

"Oh well, who cares?"

"You're Kim Fung Toi, the exchange student? You look... different..."

"Different on outside, same on inside!"

Remember when Lucy called Blanche a slut and Blanche called her a cunt. Oh she didn't say it but you know she was thinking it.

btw whose daughter was slutty Lucy? Neither Virginia nor Charmaine was married. Did Clayton and his ex-wife had a daughter before he came flaming out of the closet? And why Blanche's niece the same age as her grandson with the Brooklyn accent?

"Lucy! LUCY!!"

Another horrible early episode....

Bea sounds like she was a nasty old cunt.

What this thread needs is someone to express an opinion about whether the 7th season of GG was any good, and whether there were any good episodes in it. It seems an under-discussed topic.

For the record, I prefer the 7th season over the 1st season which is hard for me to get through.

Don't I get a shout-out from any of you bitches?!?!?!?

Wiping the blood away from our nosebleeds from being on so high a pedestal above all you inferior seasons.

This bitches hated each other

R151 Shut up Betty

Park Overall from Empty Nest gave an interview back in 2010 and had very unflattering things to say about Bea Arthur

That Park Overall interview is strange. None of her anecdotes make sense. The responses she recounts are all so random that they have no relationship to the set up. What does "bucking and fucking" have to do with Bea carrying a book? Why would Bea have answered like that? It's as if Park left out the middle of each anecdote.

r147 That's about as funny as a Hurricane a comin'.

The Myron Zuckerman joke was funny. Betty pretending to be Asian was trying too hard.

I can't sleep anymore! I'm just laying, waiting for the authorities to catch up with me. Every siren I hear, I know is coming for me. Every footstep outside my window belongs to that obsessive detective who won't rest until he tracks me down

- Blanche

"I'm not your teacher now. And Mr. Gonzales is dead..."

Season 7 - the BEST!!!!

r128, it was Fat Becky (not Fat Janet).

So, Rebecca got taller, super-stickthin, dyed her hair red, permed it, and had artificial insemination????

Janet was the mother of the very cute boy from "Just One Of The Guys" and "Parker Lewis Can't Lose"?

Janet's the one that Blanche was waiting for the phone call on the Very Depressing Mother's Day episode?

Park Overall is BSC always has been!

OP - I'm sorry that we've veered from your original post, but Golden Palace is probably best left in the cultural dustheap. But I am glad we have this thread to chat all things GG. I'd never seen this blooper reel before. The one at the end kills me - the way Betty just switches off "Rose" and turns on "Betty-Don't-Fuck-With-Me-Bea White" is priceless.

IMO Season 5 is the weakest season; that's when the new writers came in and felt they had something to prove, so they overloaded on the Very Special Episodes. Rick Copp and David A. Goodman left in mid-season, and that's when Cherry and Wooten came in and stabilized things a bit. That and the time crunch due to the increase in commercial time are probably why there are fewer "heart" moments in season 6 and 7.

[quote]IMO Season 5 is the weakest season; that's when the new writers came in and felt they had something to prove, so they overloaded on the Very Special Episodes.

I really disliked the very special HIV scare episode.

R144, the problem wasn't that she wasn't Rose as we grew to know her. It's that nothing in her past at all qualifies her to be a hospital administrator no matter how it's tweaked on her resume. Several years with the same employer can be said of almost anyone. Nor does have the educational requirements. That's the issue.

R169: That was the second episode produced but they held off actually airing it until March. It's never been one of my favorites.

Watching the episodes now, I just hate Sophia. She really just is a miserable old bitch. Whenever I see that episode where Dorothy breaks up with her new boyfriend because she feels bad for Sophia, and then Sophie leaves her to go out with her friends I always hope Dorothy punches that old clam right in the gash.

R170, dear, I believe you've missed the point.

R172: I missed nothing. What does it say about that episode that they waited until the show had been on the air six months and after the November and February sweeps to air it? It wasn't nearly as strong as the pilot or "Guess Who's Coming to the Wedding," the second aired, third produced episode.

Sorry Season 7 lovers but the Mother Load episode about Stan seeing a psychiatrist and supposedly needing Sophia's love to get over Dorothy, and Blanche dating Peter Graves who has mother issues is not very funny.

Also re Season 7, in the episode Where's Charlie?, the sight of Tim Thomerson in a dress is also unfunny.

The worst GG episodes are better than 99% of modern sitcoms and you know it.

Yes R175 I agree. Also it occurred to me that the writers used Phil's cross-dressing for many laughs over the series, but they never had to nerve to show us Phil in drag. Even when he was said to wear a teddy in his coffin, they never showed it. One has to wonder if the girls would have laughed at Phil as much as they laughed at Stevie in drag. Yes the joke was that Blanche's having Stevie wear her underwear is what led Stevie to discover his need to cross-drag, but even that is a stretch in believability.

The costume department couldn't find a masculine enough teddy.

Phil was never shown on-screen at all, in ot out of drag.

[quote]She really just is a miserable old bitch.

Hey-- cut me a break! I had a stroke!

[quote] Phil was never shown on-screen at all, in ot out of drag.

Barry Manilow could easily have passed for Bea Arthur's sister. And Estelle Getty already played his mom in the TV musical version of [italic]Copacabana[/italic].

Some things are funnier when left to the imagination. They never really showed St. Olaf, either.

The worst, most cringeworthy moment for me in the entire series is when Sophia breaks down after Phil's funeral (he was my baby). Estelle's performance was utterly embarrassing. Runner-up: season 7 (which I loathe with a passion) moonlight madness party episode, when Dorothy starts clapping and screams to the back balcony in the audience "I do believe...I do believe in sluts." WTF was that about?

Huh--I don't like the moonlight madness episodes but I love the "sluts" line. I don't know how old you are but it's a reference to the Peter Pan stage play where the audience is encouraged to clap to bring Tinkerbell back to life. "I do believe in fairies."

[quote]"I do believe in fairies."

No regular reader of Datalounge could ever doubt their existence.

I always thought it was weird that Dorothy almost always referred to Phil as "my brother Phil" whenever he was brought up in an episode. The girls would have known who the hell Phil was after a time.

Sounds like Park was the cunt:

[quote]I walked out to the parking lot one day, and Bea grabbed me by the arm, between my shoulder and elbow. She had a hold of me good. I mean, she's digging into me, and it's hurting! And she says, "What are you going to do about it, Park? What are you going to do?" And I said, "About what, Bea?" She says, "Kristy McNichol is trying to touch my vagina! What are you going to do?"

[quote]ENO: So what did you do?

[quote]Park: I didn't know what to do! I said, "Bea, I'll mention it." She was beside herself. What a homophobe.

[quote] And, I don't know if you can tell this one, but one day, she had this huge book in her hand. My mother was an English professor, so I've always been under the mistaken idea that other people read books, you know? So I skated up to her, and I said, "What're ya readin,' Bea?" I was reading something intellectual; I forget what. And she looked at me with that look and said, "Park, why don't you get your own library card and not keep borrowing mine'" and just walked off. I never will recover from that one!

They lived in Miami, yet their front door never had a lock on it. No wonder they had a break in within the first few episodes. And what was with the exclamation point on their front door etched into the wood? That always irritated me.

[quote]The worst GG episodes are better than 99% of modern sitcoms and you know it.

True, and this is why it always irritates me whenever they make those lists of the best shows in the history of television and "Golden Girls" is rarely higher than the 20s or 30s. In my opinion GG was every bit as funny as "Seinfeld" and ten times funnier than "Friends" would ever be, yet those two shows are always consistently in the top five of such lists. Such bullshit and based purely on hype, not reality.

Don't forget, R187, that the door had a peephole on exactly one episode because it was integral to the plot. It had never been there before or after that one episode.

The front door had a lock because they needed their key to open it from the outside. I guess sometimes it was left unlocked in the daytime by the girls if someone was home but then I can remember someone knocking at the door at a late hour, and it being opened without being unlocked.

R188, I agree with you. I think the reason the GG doesn't rate higher is primarily because it's not considered hip or edgy in the way Seinfeld or Friends are, but the reality of the situation is that it's an extremely well written and well performed show that was almost always funny. I remember speaking to the former artistic director of the Second City in Chicago about what good comedy the GGs were and he went on and on about the brilliance of the ladies comedic abilities, Bea's in particular.

Can someone please, please, please explain a certain exchange in the Barbara Thorndyke episode? When Dorothy and Barbara are having lunch in that pretentious restaurant, the waiter says to Dorothy "you get the icewater cometh," to which Dorothy, in a very suggestive manner, responds "a little of that goes a long way." What the hell is that supposed to mean? That has been irritating me for years. Is that supposed to be some literary reference? Please help me finally figure that out.

R192, I took it as Dorothy saying turning literary references and titles into menu options was cute to a point, but after a while of that it just becomes pretentious and, well, irritating. So "a little of that goes a long way" was her way of saying enough already with the literary puns.

R188: [italic]Friends[/italic] was just [italic]Full House[/italic] with grown-ups in it.

What's the worst season of GG?

I'm not a big fan of season one.

"I've just had the most delightful conversation with Rose and Madge."

Barbara, dear, I just picked up your new novel, "So Green the Hills in Jacksonville", and I must say it's quite a good read. Much better than your previous work, "Hearts Afire in Fort Myers."

I liked the references to Sophia's farting. "Hey, you can't smell that from the hall".

Blanche: Did you hear that sound? Sophia: Yeah and a long as I'm in my own bed I'll do what I want.

Dorothy: If I closed my eyes I could swear that I was in Ecuador. Sophia: Sorry, that was me.

For you, R198:

A lot of the plot lines in the final seasons were truly absurd but at that point the characters were so solid that those seasons had some of the funniest lines of the entire series. I prefer watching season 7 to season one as the characters were not yet as clearly defined and often seem to behave in ways that contradict their personalities and histories in latter seasons.

Some of the worst contradictions happened under the original writing/producing staff. In season 4, Rose admits she never graduated high school, so she goes to the night school class Dorothy's teaching. Yet in season 2, she said she said she belonged to an agricultural college sorority called the Alpha Yams.

She also said that she was valedictorian of her class.

Yeah, I don't think there were any continuity people on the writing staff back then. So, I was a child of the 80s/early 90s and I may have missed some shows that aired in that period. Am I wrong in thinking that Golden Girls might have been the most sexually frank sitcom of its time? I can't think of another sitcom from that period that discussed sex so openly and regularly as GG. Same thing for flatulence, now that you mention it. LOL.

[quote]Friends was just Full House with grown-ups in it.

Friends was a Seinfeld rip-off as was "Ellen," and "Drew Carey."

[quote]She also said that she was valedictorian of her class.

She was named valedictorian then quit high school before graduation. You find out BEFORE you graduate. So that's easily explain.

[quote]she belonged to an agricultural college sorority called the Alpha Yams.

You don't have to graduate high school to go to college.

She didn't quit high school-she got mono and missed graduation and the integration of major league baseball.

Disney doesn't want to release it because they don't bother with anything they can't guarantee at least a minimum of 20% profit margins on. Yet they let Shout! Factory have that Margaret Cho sitcom.

I have it on good authority that this will quite possibly be released on dvd sometime in the future.

Before or after they get around to my movie?

Why couldn't Murray Guttman go to the Mortimer Club? It's hard to believe that in the mid-80s, there were clubs and restaurants in Miami Beach that didn't allow Jewish people. I get a giggle when Dorothy doesn't know if Murray is Jewish. Murray Guttman is a very Jewish name.

R209 I have no idea.

When Sofia married Max and the girls walked in on them in bed and Sofia said that "afterglow" was going on, do you think that Max really ate out Sofia's smelly old snatch?

r208

You just can't get Song O' the South in the USA. It was released elsewhere. Just buy it overseas and have it shipped stateside.

That's not the same as a legitimate Blu-ray release and you know it, R212.

But the pregnant girl episode had Merle, the convict.

r213

Ah yes it is. I don't know about BluRay but the DVD version was released outside of the USA. It's commercially available and is an official release.

R215: Anyone calling it an official DVD release is a bootlegger. The VHS tapes from which they were bootlegged were legitimate, however, and they were released in every country except the United States. Japan and Hong Kong even got laserdiscs! Trust me, when Disney changes its mind, the whole world's going to know about it.

The question is whether or not the only season of [italic]Golden Palace[/italic] will be out first. I'm surprised it's still not out when the studios that own [italic]Mayberry RFD[/italic] and [italic]Archie Bunker's Place[/italic] could bother to drag them out for DVD.

Wrong retard

The film has been released on video in its entirety in various European, Latin American, and Asian countries—in the UK it was released on PAL VHS tape in 1982 and again in 1991, and in Japan it appeared on NTSC VHS, Beta, laserdisc and DVD.

Under Japanese copyright law it is now in the public domain.

Jesus Christ you can BUY the DVD in Japan.

r217

Is correct. Too many times people think the US is the ONLY market. For instance, Sheena Easton's "No Sound But A Heart" was released in Japan but shelved everywhere else. It eventually was released in the USA. But it was never "not released." It WAS an OFFICIAL release in Japan.

Just because Disney doesn't officially release something in the US doesn't mean they don't license other entities to do so elsewhere.

But r-216 is obviously too stupid to realize the US is NOT the world.

R217 and R218 are the illiterate retards who project their own stupidity and illiteracy onto others. The film's official overseas video releases were all pre-DVD, and any DVD release is a bootleg made from one of those earlier releases. Go back and actually read R216, moron; nothing in there is contradicting the fact that there were official releases, just pointing out that none of them were in the US. And even if you saw a DVD for sale in Japan, that doesn't mean Disney actually made it. Bootlegs are common in East Asia, and Disney films are among the most pirated titles.

[quote]It eventually was released in the USA.

You are incorrect. It hasn't been rereleased in movie theaters since 1986—I know because that's where I first saw the film—and it has never been released to any format in this country in any official release by The Walt Disney Company. I, for one, will not support the company until there is a legitimate Blu-ray release in the United States, and it's not like they need my money anyway. If that means I never see another new Disney film again, so be it.

R198/199 they were hit and miss with me but my favorite was in the Pope's Ring episode (count me in as another very pro season 7):

Sophia the pope's here! All my life I've been waiting for this moment, Ok, then, I won't disturb you.

It may never be released - but it might escape.

I always like the episode where Blanche decided to get vaginal rejuvenation surgery because Fleet Week in Miami was coming up, and Sophia said to her "well, this will be the first year the Navy won't be able to park the battleship in your cunt."

Why in the hell was Phils funeral in Miami with none of there many kids in attendance? Sophia referenced 10 children in one episode. Wouldn't at least one kid show up at their fathers funeral.

R223, and pay them union scale?

What was the top/bottom dynamic with Doug and Clayton? I firmly believe that Clayton was the top in the relationship. Sure, Doug was more masculine and butch, but those types are the biggest pillow biters, in my experience.

I don't know. Clayton looks like a bossy bottom to me.

Rose: I just found out that I'm the most boring person alive. Sophia: Did something happen to Regis Philbin?

LOLOLOLOLOL!!!!

Although you can hear the "writer's room" in those lines, I kinda love all the digs at other tv shows and personalities. I'm too young to get all the references, but the digs at Designing Women, Roseanne etc. were fun.

"What is this? 'Designing Women'?!"

They had Sophia deliver a disparaging zinger about Valerie Harper right after that debacle with her 80s sitcom. I remember Rue sort of half-laughing, while looking at the floor and slightly shaking her head sideways (almost out of embarrassment?). Must've been weird for Betty too, given her history with MTM Show and that she and Val were costars for a season.

Do you think Rose let Jean eat her out? They were all alone for a few hours.

I bet Jean ate Rose's snatch, and then Rose swore Jean to secrecy.

R227 is 67 years old and suffers from sleep apnea.

R230 weirder still that VH narrated Estelle's intimate portrait. That means they were at least pretty good friends.

They're total sound-alikes too.

I'm sorry, but I LOVE Barbara Thorndike!!!! I just want to BE her!!!! Well, without the anti-semitic country club thing.

One of my favorite lines in the episode from her character: "I know if I had a problem, I'd want to confide in someone like me."

YES!!! How can you NOT want to be a stuck-up cunt bitch like that??? I love it!

"The parking is free and they serve a good breakfast!"

They have free parking yet they discriminate against Jews?

Interview with Stan Zimmerman. A writer on season one of the Golden Girls. He was in the glass closet with his writing partner during his time on the show. He's got a lot of great stories about the girls. It's worth a listen.

Thanks for the podcast tip, R237!

R238

No problem. They also unterviewed Lynn Greene, the actress turned writer who portrayed younger Dorothy in flashback episodes. She also has great stories of the girls as well. And, offers insight into Bea and Betty's relationship.

Those queens have an entire podcast dedicated to The Golden Girls? That is possibly the gayest thing ever.

R240

Yes, an entire podcast. A gay man and a straight woman. They update it weekly and are currently on season three.

Happy 94th, Betty White! Let's see how many more of your co-stars you can outlive...

R168, I disagree. I was never a big fan of Roses's St. Olaf stories. They always seemed too contrived and too stupid to me, mostly comedy writers throwing shit at the wall and seeing what sticks. That episode has the one St. Olaf story that made me laugh my ass off.

"Turns out, they weren't Druid Priests at ALL"

But, R243, I'd argue you're kinda missing the point. The St. Olaf stories, like just about all the best parts of Golden Girls, are not so much about the stories themselves as much as the reactions of the other actresses. It's the way that Dorothy, Blanche and Sophia react that makes the moments work.

Saw The Pope's Ring episode yesterday. Stupid, stupid, stupid. Sophia ends up in possession of the Pope's ring and is on the shitter when he visited the hospital? Ridiculous. The show had fallen s far by then.

R245: Have you seen how bad [italic]The Simpsons[/italic] got once it jumped the shark. Nothing compares to that show's fall from grace, including this.

R237 Thanks for this link! I listened to this and the Lyn Green one and there was interesting information about the ladies in both. Based on what they and others like Marc Cherry and Christopher Lloyd have said I don't think Bea actually hated Betty White I think she resented her. Lyn Greene said 'I think the world is easier for the pretty blonde girl and that's hard a pill to swallow for those of us who aren't."

R247

No problem. I'm glad you enjoyed their podcast. They've done two live shows in the past. I attended the most recent one. They served homemade cheesecake.

I love hearing the personal stories of those that worked with them. For me, Estelle and Bea sound like sweethearts. Bea not so much. And, didn't get much of an impression with Rue.

Agree with R244.

Am I the only one who was unimpressed by Lyn Greene as the young Dorothy in Sophia's flashback scenes? I thought she had a ballpark resemblance to Beatrice Arthur but gestured more than Bea did, which was annoying, Bea liked the hand-to-the-forehead gesture but she wasn't THAT mannered.

I always thought she was amazing as the young Dorothy.

Loved Lyn Greene as young Dorothy -- I've always thought it was fantastic casting.

It was interesting to hear that it could be difficult to work with Estelle, even though she was a lovely person, because she couldn't remember her lines. Guest actors are scared of being fired, so they're very conscious to get everything right on the first, maybe second, take, but Estelle would require up to 10 takes to get it right, and even though her co-stars may have done much better on the first or second take, the show would be limited to using the only take where Estelle got through her lines without fumbling.

[quote]Yeah, I don't think there were any continuity people on the writing staff back then. So, I was a child of the 80s/early 90s and I may have missed some shows that aired in that period. Am I wrong in thinking that Golden Girls might have been the most sexually frank sitcom of its time? I can't think of another sitcom from that period that discussed sex so openly and regularly as GG. Same thing for flatulence, now that you mention it. LOL.

GG wasn't the only sitcom in the 80s/90s to have continuity errors. Some of the ABC sitcoms had a lot of continuity errors.

R252

It was said to hear that about Estelle. The early stages of alzheimer but at the time no one realized it. Which I find a bit curious because they did that episode of a man Sophia met on the boardwalk having that disease. I'm not sure if that was before or after Greene's episodes on the show.

She said that Estelle was pretty good fairly early on into taping a scene. She'd generally have it down. It was the long term of having to do a scene over and over again that Estelle would start to lose it and become forgetful. While the more seasoned cast members were consistent regardless of how many takes they did. Estelle sounded like a sweetheart though and a fantastic ally to the community.

I also thought Greene was terrific as the young Dorothy and I recall my mother and grandmother would comment how uncanny her imitation of Bea was. In retrospect, however I can see that Greene might have 'overdone' some of the Arthur gestures, but that might have been to draw attention to them, so that the audience became very aware of Greene's mimicry, and as such became impressed with how much she 'got' Bea down, especially when you'd go back to watching Bea for the rest of the episode and you were now hyper aware of those very same Arthur mannerisms, that Green had been hitting so hard in her flashback scenes.

Lyn Green's imitation of Bea Arthur was uncanny. She was totally believable as the young Dorothy.

Lyn (a/k/a Lynnie) Greene is a producer now. Her credits include "Boss" and "Masters of Sex."

I really liked Lyn Greene's podcast! She gave some great insight into working with the ladies (except Rue). Her reading of the whole Bea/Betty thing is totally accurate with what most people involved with the show have said. It was not some big nasty feud but rather opposite personalities and a tinge of jealous on Bea's part towards Betty.

Do any Canadians on this board remember Bea Arthur's years as the spokesperson for Shoppers Drug Mart?

[quote]Lyn Greene said 'I think the world is easier for the pretty blonde girl and that's hard a pill to swallow for those of us who aren't."

Bitch.

remeber when Dreyfus knocked up some bitch and had their bastards over at GG?

R134 is possibly the funniest post I've ever read.

The Rusty Anchor was a real sausage-fest.

You said it, Bess!

Here you go, R261.

Check out 02:46

[quote] It was said to hear that about Estelle.

Oh dear

The pilot was well-written and LOL funny, but it was a mess in terms editing and continuity. You can tell that some key scenes were reshot later on (probably to de-emphasize Coco and make Sophia more prominent) because Blanche has two completely different hairstyles. Also, when Blanche introduces Harry to Sophia, she mentions that Sophia's house just burned down. There's no way Blanche could've know this, since Sophia arrived just moments earlier in the same scene and told only Dorothy and Rose about the Shady Pines fire. Bad continuity error.

Has there been any talk of releasing Golden Girls on Blu-Ray? That might be when they'd consider releasing Palace along with the other seasons.

R267 The Golden Girls, as with most 80s sitcoms, was shot on tape not on film which makes a blu-ray upgrade impossible. In order for shows to be upgraded from SD to HD they had to either be shot on 35mm film, or on HD video tape. Since HD video tapes didn't exists in the 80s can't do it with the GGs.

How come none if the 3 ladies won a Golden Globe?

I don't think this show would look good on Blu-Ray. Every Blu-Ray I've seen of a video master has been underwhelming and looks the same as it would on a standard DVD. I'm surprised they never released The Golden Palace at all though. You'd think they could at least put it up on one of those streaming sites.

I thought Sophia was a bullying old bastard.

GP didn’t work because Dorothy wasn’t in it. She was the center of the action. I love GG and I would love to love GP but it isn’t as good because one of the girls is away. Only the episode where Bea is guest starring has old magic. It’s the only one I watch every now and then.

R272 Also, there was nary any chemistry betwixt the male characters and the remaining girls, and the constant customers/extras felt like an intrusion; on GG, there were many episodes with just the four girls and no one else. Not to mention that the hotel was no substitute for the original house/kitchen, which, in its own way, was the fifth character. In short, adding new, regular characters and a new setting really shook things up.

R134 I always assumed she retyped it.

R136 I rather enjoy that episode, but only the main plot with Dorothy, Rose, and Blanche lounging around on a wet, rainy day, eating junk food and regaling each other with anecdotes. It always looked so comfy and I wish I was there with them.

[quote]Watching the episodes now, I just hate Sophia. She really just is a miserable old bitch.

R171 She was just a mean, old lady like the paperboy said.

R49 Stop! Or My Mom Will Shoot wasn't a bomb. It debuted at #2 in its opening weekend and grossed $70 million during its theatrical run ($130 million today). Granted, it got poor reviews from critics, but it was well-received by audiences and did well on home video.

[quote]Wasn't another reason that Bea was reluctant to do Golden Palace was that she had already stared in the awful US version of Faulty Towers?

R29 the decision to do Golden Palace was because Bea didn't want to continue with Golden Girls anymore. Had she remained, GG would've had an 8th season and there would have been no GP.

I've only seen 3 episodes of Golden Palace. The pilot and both episodes where Dorothy returns. The new rendition of the theme song was terrible. I also hated how when Dorothy returned they spent most of those episodes arguing about Sophia or looking for her. Though I will admit that Dorothy's first scene where she argues with the lousy cab driver and gets even with the customer who wanted free pie were classic.

Susan Harris is in her 80's now, I hope she can one day explain what happened to the hotel, why Sophia went back to Shady Pines and most importantly what became of Dorothy, Rose and Blanche who would all be in their early 90's today if all 3 of them were still alive.

On an unrelated note I once read an article about how the bedsheets on Blanche's bed were custom made for the show, that the pattern used was very popular at the time and that the producer would take them home after the taping of every show (even sleeping on them) so that they wouldn't get stolen.

[quote]Bea Arthur was fairly miserable on the Golden Girls. According to Rue McClanahan, Bea was never happy with the ensemble nature of the Golden Girls after having been the star of her own show (Maude) in the 70s, it also rubbed her the wrong way that she was the last of the 4 actresses to win an Emmy.

Another thing to keep in mind is that Bea's mother, with whom she was very close, died just one month after GG premiered.

[quote]Estelle was seen as the "breakout" star of the GGs at the time.

R87 Estelle was also the only one of the four to have a bit of a film career during the show's 7-year run. MASK, MANNEQUIN, and STOP! OR MY MOM WILL SHOOT all did very well at the box office.

[quote]I'm surprised it's still not out when the studios that own Mayberry RFD and Archie Bunker's Place could bother to drag them out for DVD.

Mayberry RFD ran for three seasons (78 episodes) and was still highly-rated (it was #15 in its final season) when it was cancelled as part of CBS's infamous "rural purge."

Archie Bunker's Place ran for four seasons (97 episodes) and was ranked #22 in its final season.

Golden Palace ran for one season (24 episodes) and was ranked #57.

Apples and oranges.

Bea shouldn't have turned down The Little Mermaid. She was the first choice to voice Ursula, with Divine being the inspiration for Ursula's physical look. I wonder if she ever regretted it? Imagine having that film on your resumee!

They should have brought Debbie Reynolds back.

[quote]Why was Bea Arthur excluded from Golden Palace?

'Cause she took shits on Betty White's dressing room floor.

Didn't Estelle need to work in order to keep her medical insurance by the actors' guild? I think that's why she showed up at Empty Nest. She needed the insurance and the money.

Golden Palace was a bit too preachy and basically all storylines were set up with the premise of the hotel being one step away from foreclosure. That's why they needed to host Mile's wedding and put Rose through all the humiliation and sadness.

And I got this sense that the station wanted to go more youthful in general. Why they picked Golden Palace in the first place is a mystery to me. They had one episode with a spring break theme and Chuy wanting to break some cooking dish record like a giant sandwich or tortilla.

Didn't Estelle need to work in order to keep her medical insurance by the actors' guild? I think that's why she showed up at Empty Nest. She needed the insurance and the money.

Golden Palace was a bit too preachy and basically all storylines were set up with the premise of the hotel being one step away from foreclosure. That's why they needed to host Mile's wedding and put Rose through all the humiliation and sadness.

And I got this sense that the station wanted to go more youthful in general. Why they picked Golden Palace in the first place is a mystery to me. They had one episode with a spring break theme and Chuy wanting to break some cooking dish record like a giant sandwich or tortilla.

I have no patience for fools who think Season 6 and 7 were awful.

Season 6:

"Blanche Delivers" The one where Rebecca has her baby.

"Wham, Bam, Thank You, Mammy!" The one with Ruby Dee as Blanche's "Mammy" (Dumb but funny)

"Zborn Again" Dorothy and Stan start fooling around again. Includes the funniest line in GG history: Rose muttering "hypersexual bitch" to Blanche as she exits the kitchen

"Mrs. George Devereaux" George returns (but not really) and Sonny Bono and Lyle Waggoner fight over Dorothy (Also dumb but funny)

"Girls Just Wanna Have Fun... Before They Die" Blanche gives bad advice including to Sophia who has improbable sex with Ceser Romero

"Ebbtide's Revenge" Phil dies. Maudlin at times but very funny lines

"Sister of the Bride" Clayton announces he is marrying

"Witness" Miles returns. The Cheeseman episode but also the episode where Blanche discovers she is a Yankee

"Henny Penny — Straight, No Chaser" Yes....the infamous Henny Penny episode

Yes, there are also some DUMB Season 6 episodes...especially the Don Ameche is Rose's dad one and a couple others but the good ones make up for the occasional turd.

Season 7:

"The Case of the Libertine Belle" A beloved classic

"Beauty and the Beast" Two good plots: Nurse DeFarge and Blanche enters her granddaughter in beauty pageants

"The Monkey Show" The famous 2 part hurricane show with Dena Dietrich as Gloria

"Room 7" The girls travel to Blanche's childhood home that is being torn down

"Goodbye, Mr. Gordon" Dorothy's old teacher takes advantage of her and Rose "outs" Dorothy & Blanche as lesbians on a talk show

"Journey to the Center of Attention" The beloved Rusty Anchor episode

"Home Again, Rose: Part 1 & 2" Rose has a heart attack. Some very funny lines at the class reunion (though I will totally admit the scenes with Rose's bitch daughter are annoying) Still, the episode with the dream sequence of them being frozen heads.

"One Flew Out of the Cuckoo's Nest" The last show. Corny but sweet.

And, yes, Season 7 has some turds, especially the AWFUL 2 part "A Midwinter Night's Dream" probably the dumbest/dullest GG episode.

I agree with R288 & R289. I love the final seasons just as much of the early and middle seasons. The cast is magic.

This was Golden Girls mashed up with Fawlty Towers. The only episodes with a 'Basil', the character central to the latter show's success, were when Dorothy came back and had to pitch in and help run the hotel. Those seem to be the two episodes most fondly remembered. It would have been great if Bea had done Golden Palace, because she would have been key to it's success. On the other hand, would it have been at all believable for Dorothy to spend all her money buying a hotel? Rose, Sophia and Blanche make sense, but Dorothy wanting to buy a hotel is as ridiculous as say Jerry, Elaine, and George, or Murphy Brown, or Roseanne & Dan Conner. Dorothy would never have been interested.

I didn't like the Bea guest appearance, because they tried to shoe-horn some tag line she supposedly was known for which she never uttered on Golden Girls. Though I did like Rose smacking her with a rolled up newspaper and Dorothy whining afterwards.

I always loved TGG but there were some things that always bothered me. The offspring of the ladies never seemed to be the same actors and were somewhat 'off' in the timeline, age-wise. We never saw Dorothy's brother and they always made it a joke about his cross-dressing. We didn't need to see him in female garb but it might have been nice for him to show up a few times. And finally, Dorothy's marriage. Absurd. All done in one quick episode and buh-bye Bea. They should have had that courtship throughout the season, ending with the finale episode being the wedding. Stan and Miles endings. WTF.

Morothy's marriage was fine, old people do fast courtships because they die real fast

[quote]Didn't Estelle need to work in order to keep her medical insurance by the actors' guild? I think that's why she showed up at Empty Nest. She needed the insurance and the money.

Between her "Golden Girls" and "Golden Palace" money (not to mention the movie income) and Medicare, she should not have had any insurance or money issues.

Instead of killing Phil off, they should have cast Dom DeLuise as Phil in a spinoff with Brenda Vaccaro that took place in their crowded, chaotic house in Newark. There'd be at least five kids, ages 8 to 28. Then add Phil's poker buddies, his neighbors, co-workers, etc. Plenty of opportunities for good supporting characters.

The backdoor pilot would have been an episode of the Golden Girls in which Dorothy and Sophia visit Newark to attend the wedding of Phil and Angela's eldest daughter. The main plotline of the episode would be whether or not Phil will wear a gown or a tux to the wedding. In the other storyline, Dorothy picks up on the fact that her niece's fiance is a prick, and by the end of the episode she's caused the wedding to be canceled. The niece dumps the prick, thanks Aunt Dorothy. Episode ends with Phil suddenly descending the stairs, showing off the beautiful gown he was going to wear, and everyone thinks it's great.

The first real episode of the spinoff would be all about Angela's obnoxious mother, played by Sylvia Miles, having to move in with them.

R295 not to mention that Estelle also did a fitness video for aged people in the early '90s that was pretty successful. My grandmother and her pals bought it, as well as Angela Lansbury's.

Estelle was a drunken gambler. Her money wouldn't last long.

The biggest mistake was that they moved into a hotel. The show would have survived if they stayed in the house and brought in a fourth lead to replace Bea. Adding other characters to an already successful team was doomed from the beginning.

By then the original format (the gals being room-mates) felt stale and played out. Introducing a new player would not have helped, because the stories would've been the same and drawn unnecessary comparisons to the episodes with Bea still in them.

I believe that's why Golden Palace didn't introduce a new older women to the cast and picked guys and a kid instead to freshen it up.

They should have bought a motel instead of a big hotel. They could have kept Cheech but made him manager, then cast a 20-something housekeeper, and a 20-something hunk caretaker/pool cleaner.

[quote]The biggest mistake was that they moved into a hotel. The show would have survived if they stayed in the house and brought in a fourth lead to replace Bea.

You couldn't replace Bea Arthur. Spinning it off made more sense.

But really, the show should have just wrapped up at season seven. There was nowhere else to go with the characters by that point, they had pretty much turned into cartoons. And they could have had a proper finale that would have brought real closure to the series. Just having Dorothy marry and leave everyone else betrayed the entire point of the series, that they would stay together like a family. And the whole thing felt forced and rushed.

If they were gonna close out with a wedding, they should have had them all marry. Rose and Miles obviously (which made the most sense out of all of them). Blanche and Ken Howards character (talk about a great storyline completely abandoned for no good reason) and had Max come back for Sophia.

And put Dorothy in a decent wedding dress instead of that monstrosity.

r300

And that worked so well 🙄

Bump! Just watching Golden Palace now for the very first time. Whoo-weee, it really stinks!

Why didn't all the girls move into Hollingsworth Manor with Dorothy? I'm sure Hollingsworth Manor was a huge old estate and could have accommodated everyone just fine. No one would ever have had to worry about money or jobs ever again. Retirement and mint juleps on the veranda for everyone.

I mean, my God, it's part of Blanche's childhood. Dorothy was marrying Blanche's dad's BROTHER, which makes Dorothy now her AUNT. Which only deepens the theme that they are all a family.

So if it's true that they all were living paycheck-to-paycheck for years, then why on Earth would Dorothy abandon her "family" of "angel-sisters" and especially her elderly mother (whom she constantly, and I mean constantly, worried about)? In reality they just would have all moved to Atlanta. Period. End of.

And now frankly I'm totally agitated thinking about how stupid and needlessly tragic the ending of GG was....and how INSANELY stupid and annoying GP was, both as a concept and in the execution

Y'all I found a little gem in Episode 8 of The Golden Palace: Jack Black is the cab driver that comes to the hotel to drop off Sophia's purse that she left in his cab when he took her to Shady Pines! He looks like a little baby. So so young. No "Jack Black" personality. Just a bit part. He enters at 11 mins 15 seconds.

R304 A spinoff featuring the girls living the good life in a plantation/mansion in The South wouldn't make for a good story. It's the polar opposite of what the original show was about.

Wasn't Hollingsworth Manor torn down?

R307: No. that was Grammie Hollingsworth's place. It had the balcony where the boys would serenade 10 year old Blanche:

I see London, I see France. I see Blanche's...underpants.

Such beautiful poetry.

Hollingswoth Manor was where Blanche had to disappoint a slew of boys after Big Daddy tore down the tree house.

I thought Big Daddy said he had to sell the family home at some point

R310 He did to finance his failed singing career.

[quote] That's why they needed to host Mile's wedding

Oh, Dear.

i don't like Rose on Golden Palace.

R313 I don't like "Palace" Rose, either! The writers tried to make her more fierce. I assume it's supposed to show growth? A character arc? She's getting thicker skin? But it just feels like a big bummer.

Of course, the whole show is a big ole bummer. It's very depressing to me. I can't quite put my finger on why. It just seems stressful, depressing and lonely, and grimy at the Golden Palace.

In order to make the premise believable, they had to change the characters to fit it--which is exactly why the premise was such a mistake. The characters were so established after seven years, yet suddenly to be believable as someone successfully running housekeeping in a hotel, Rose couldn't be as dumb as she'd been all those years, so she got a personality transplant.

Similarly, I remember one of Rue's interviews (maybe the TV Academy ones?) where she points out one of the reasons GP didn't work is that Blanche had never shown any interest in business before, and yet suddenly she's the one running the business side of the hotel. It didn't make sense. Without Dorothy as the strong, smart one, the other characters (well, Rose and Blanche anyway; Sophia pretty much remained a secondary character) had to become more grounded, which betrayed who they'd been.

Geez, this show was lousy, Miles cheating on Rose with another woman, and if that wasn't bad enough, he had to come back in another episode to marry the other woman in Rose's own hotel, while Rose watched crying from the kitchen. Who the hell thought that was a good idea? It was depressing as hell.

The entire GP series is on YouTube. I watched the entire thing. It was basically Golden Girls at a hotel with Don Cheadle replacing Bea Arthur and Blanche not being as slutty.

Everything that R302 said!

R317 I agree. Everything R302 said. " Just having Dorothy marry and leave everyone else betrayed the entire point of the series, that they would stay together like a family." Yeah! So lame.

I don't think this has been posted, so if anyone hasn't seen it, Don Cheadle did an interview with the AV Club a few months ago, discussing his past roles, and there's a section on The Golden Palace that's an interesting read.

He has lovely things to say about Betty, Rue, and Estelle, but to pull a quote from the article, this was certainly interesting:

AVC: When Bea Arthur came in to guest-star, did it feel like royalty was visiting?

DC: Um... [Long pause.] I don’t want to tell tales out of school, but it felt like several things. [Laughs.] Advertisement

AVC: I’ll leave it to your discretion as far as which tales you want to tell.

DC: She was a bit notorious. It was definitely la diva de gran. [Laughs.] Yeah, it was definitely a different energy when Bea was on the set.

R320 how does he mean?

That's all he says about Bea. He does have particularly nice things to say about Betty, which is always nice to hear.

Found the part of Rue's interview where she talks about it. Starts around 6:00

R320 Damn! Bea really was a cunt, wasn’t she? It’s like as soon as her name is mentioned, whomever is being interviewed just freezes up and begins sweating and shitting.